From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 01:24:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA31803 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:24:57 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA31799 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:24:57 +0100 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id BAA27402; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:24:56 +0100 (MET) Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:24:56 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200003190024.BAA27402@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: so sorry Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 01:28:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA31860 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:28:54 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA31856 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:28:54 +0100 Received: from kalman.et.tudelft.nl by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id BAA27430; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:28:53 +0100 (MET) From: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) Received: (from erik@localhost) by kalman.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id BAA04712 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:28:53 +0100 Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:28:53 +0100 Message-Id: <200003190028.BAA04712@kalman.et.tudelft.nl> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk test again -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 01:30:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA31899 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:30:19 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA31895 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:30:19 +0100 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id BAA27440; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:30:17 +0100 (MET) Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:30:17 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200003190030.BAA27440@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Hmm, it seems to work Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The archive seems to work. Good.  Erik -- "God. Root. What is difference?" -- Pitr in "User Friendly" by Illiad -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 11:46:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00141 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:46:04 +0100 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00137 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:46:02 +0100 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:42:41 +0100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Hmm, it seems to work Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [argh, dat moest dus naar de list] >The archive seems to work. Good. You think so ? JDB -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 11:52:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00175 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:52:41 +0100 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00171 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:52:39 +0100 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:49:17 +0100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: This should do the trick Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk s/archive2pl/archive2.pl/ JD 'duh' B. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 19 11:53:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00195 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:53:55 +0100 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00190 for ; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:53:54 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 11:50:33 +0100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: This should do the trick Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 11:49 +0100 19-03-2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: >s/archive2pl/archive2.pl/ ... and don't forget newaliases JD 'double duh' B. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 20 20:58:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA04174 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:58:38 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA04165; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:58:24 +0100 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:57:22 +0100 To: pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, linux-arm@vger.rutgers.edu From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, We've released all the CAD files required for building the LART under an Open Hardware-ish license. All files can be found at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl . The LART is a small yet powerful embedded computer capable of running Linux, built around an Intel SA-1100 StrongARM processor. Its performance is around 250 MIPS while consuming less than 1 Watt of power. In a standard configuration it holds 32MB DRAM and 4MB Flash ROM, which is sufficient for a Linux kernel and a sizeable ramdisk image. No computer is an island. We have designed I/O boards for LART, offering audio I/O, IDE (can you say MP3man ?), Ethernet, PS2, IrDA, USB, video out, telco and touchscreen interface. More boards are in various stages of development, including video in, GPS and inertial navigation. We intend to release all these PCB designs under the same open license. On this site you can also get BLOB, our BootLoader Object; and a recipe for building a Linux kernel and a crosscompiler toolchain. There's also a majordomo list discussing the ins and outs of SA-based embedded computing in general and LARTish stuff in specific; the address is lart@lart.tudelft.nl, see http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/ how to get there from here. Note: we don't sell the stuff, we just try to give back to the community. You could see us as a fabless PCB design group ;-) If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask. Sincerely, Jan-Derk Bakker. -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 20 23:28:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA05522 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:28:54 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA05518 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:28:54 +0100 Received: from dgf.uchile.cl (dgf.uchile.cl [146.83.8.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRQ000MSRS1DB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:28:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from castellatus.dgf.uchile.cl (castellatus [146.83.8.190]) by dgf.uchile.cl (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA24955 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:21:10 -0400 (CST) Received: from dgf.uchile.cl (dial-tnt1-88.chilesat.net [200.31.53.88]) by castellatus.dgf.uchile.cl (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA28500 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:21:06 -0400 (CST) Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:37:53 -0500 From: Pablo Bleyer Kocik Subject: Re: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38D6B651.3E09399B@dgf.uchile.cl> Organization: Departamento de =?iso-8859-1?Q?Geof=EDsica?=, Universidad de Chile MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > Hi all, > > We've released all the CAD files required for building the LART under an > Open Hardware-ish license. All files can be found at > http://www.lart.tudelft.nl . > (...) > There's also a majordomo list discussing the ins and outs of SA-based > embedded computing in general and LARTish stuff in specific; the address is > lart@lart.tudelft.nl, see http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/ how to get there > from here. Wonderful! It's nice to see how well this project has evolved. Congratulations! -- Pablo Bleyer Kocik |"And all this science I don't understand pbleyer | It's just my job five days a week @dgf.uchile.cl | A rocket man, a rocket man..." - Elton John from sys import*;from string import*;a=argv;[s,p,q]=filter(lambda x:x[:1]!= '-',a);d='-d'in a;e,n=atol(p,16),atol(q,16);l=(len(q)+1)/2;o,inb=l-d,l-1+d while s:s=stdin.read(inb);s and map(stdout.write,map(lambda i,b=pow(reduce( lambda x,y:(x<<8L)+y,map(ord,s)),e,n):chr(b>>8*i&255),range(o-1,-1,-1))) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 00:02:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA05872 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:02:29 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA05868 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:02:28 +0100 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:00:49 +0100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] >>No computer is an island. We have designed I/O boards for LART, offering >>audio I/O, IDE (can you say MP3man ?), Ethernet, PS2, IrDA, USB, video out, >>telco and touchscreen interface. More boards are in various stages of > >Tell me more about he telco interface.. The telco interface is based on the Philips UCB1200 and an external SLIC (analog thingy to interface to the telephone line; I'm looking at the Siemens DAA2000 Optical SLIC). The UCB1200 and an appropriate kernel driver should be able to offer the same functionality as a WinModem in a pc (ie basically a sound port that happens to talk to a phone line). I intend to do two things with the telco interface: - wait for the linmodem code to mature, and do a port so that the telco interface can be used as a fax/data modem. - do some voice/DTMF stuff, so I can use a LART as as a call logger or an answering machine with caller-dependant message. If you want more detals just ask. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 00:31:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA06042 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:31:42 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA06038 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:31:41 +0100 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRQ00284UOROF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 00:31:40 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail4.magma.ca (mail4.magma.ca [206.191.0.222]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA27424 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:24:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail4.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA12206 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:24:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:26:19 -0500 From: T Sullivan Subject: New LART Website !!! To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38D6B39B.A660A150@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Congratulations Guys !! It's great to see that the new LART website is on the air... Go forth and prosper... Best Regards Terry ------------------------ Urbus Networks Ottawa, Ontario K1S 2V4 613.237.0193 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 10:45:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA08734 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:45:48 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA08729; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:45:42 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01JN9X1W8WPK9FMOCF@ITS.TUDelft.NL> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:44:54 +0100 To: "Richard A. Smith" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc to lart@lart.tudelft.nl] >>I intend to do two things with the telco interface: >>- wait for the linmodem code to mature, and do a port so that the telco >>interface can be used as a fax/data modem. >>- do some voice/DTMF stuff, so I can use a LART as as a call logger or an >>answering machine with caller-dependant message. >> >>If you want more detals just ask. > >Well actually I am more interested in the design and how it works for >you. Have you heard of Astrisk? It's a project to develope a PBX >running on linux. Right now it only supports 2 or 3 pieces of >hardware and none of them in my price range fit my needs. So I have >been looking at building my own but I am still undecided on what type >of hardware to use. > >Since this would be the first piece of telco stuff I have ever done I >am trying to get as much info as I can. Where can I find the data >sheet for the UCB1200 and and the SLIC use used? http://www.semiconductors.com/pip/UCB1200_2 http://www.infineon.com/us/opto/daa/content.html >What I want to make is a system with about 4 or 5 incomming line >interfaces and about 10 extensions. You'll need some extra codecs then. I believe http://www.national.com had special phone line interface chips; it's been a while since I investigated building PABXen so that may have changed. Nowadays it may be easier and cheaper to just hook up a couple of SLICs to some cheap audio codecs. >I haven't checked the status of linmodems in a while do they have a >alpha driver for this chipset? linmodems are pretty much chipset independent; the majority of the code is required to do the telephony signal processing stuff. You might want to subscribe to the LART list; I'm going to design a seperate PCB for the DAA2000; these may be useful for you even if you don't use the LART computing element. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 11:03:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08861 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 11:03:42 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08856; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 11:03:41 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38D73833.4F48D9FD@compulan.de> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 11:02:46 +0100 To: Michael Renzmann From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: PCMCIA and video Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc to lart-list] >Great job! I just looked at the site. You wrote, that pcmcia-Interfaces >will be available in the future. Does this mean "erm, well, maybe >somethimes in the next two years" or is it more like "in the not so far >future, maybe summer this year"? The latter. PCMCIA on StrongARM is quite simple (a matter of some buffers and a PLD to control the lot). We want to experiment with existing wireless links such as WaveLan. I intended to have the PCB ready for my last board run, but time was too short. Expect rev 1 around May. > And how about that video-in-board? Similar story. The experimental platform that LART is a part of needs video in/out (and compression and transmission and...). I haven't yet decided whether I'll use the Philips or AD video in chips yet, though. Video should be proto around June - July. JDB -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 15:08:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA10086 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:08:44 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10082 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:08:44 +0100 Received: from ice.ar51.net (ice.ar51.net [208.225.80.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRR00FQWZAI7X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:08:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from server01.asi (akron-80-186.ar51.net [208.225.80.186]) by ice.ar51.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27577; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:07:51 -0500 Received: by SERVER01 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:07:57 -0500 Content-return: allowed Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:07:55 -0500 From: Jeff Sutherland Subject: SA-1111 Audio Recording questions. To: "ARM on Linux Mailing List (E-mail)" , "SA1100 Linux mailing list (E-mail)" , "'lart@lart.tudelft.nl'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk We have been experiencing problems with the SA1111 audio recording functions. Has anyone else seen this, or better yet, figured out a workaround? Using latest Assabet with Niponset board, I have been able to isolate the problem to the SADRCS register in the SAC section of the SA-1111 chip. The SA-1111 SADRSA (receive buffer A pointer) SADRCA (receive buffer A count) SADRSB(receive buffer B pointer) and SADRCB(receive buffer B count) registers are first properly initialized. I know that these are correct because when I get DONEA flag the A buffer is filled in with the data I would expect. Also, when I get the DONEB flag the data in the B buffer is filled in with the data I would expect. The problem is that the ping pong nature for the receiver is either broken or I'm missing something. I am listing six test sets with my results. I would like you to give me your feed back on possible work arounds. The following are six of the several tests I have run on the SADRCS register (Note: the SADTCS register operates as I would expect and I do have playback working, via DMA & interrupts from the memory on the Assabet board). TEST 1 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 11 to SADRCS - Set STARTA flag Read 9 from SADRCS - Read DONEA flag set Write 9 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEA flag Read 1 from SADRCS - Dma enabled. Write 11 to SADRCS - Set STARTA flag Read 81 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEA, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. TEST 2 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 51 to SADRCS - Set STARTA/STARTB flags Read 89 from SADRCS - Read DONEA flag set, BIU set Write 89 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEA flag Read 81 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEB, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. TEST 3 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 41 to SADRCS - Set STARTB flag Read 21 from SADRCS - Read DONEB flag set Write 21 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEB flag Read 1 from SADRCS - Dma enabled. Write 11 to SADRCS - Set STARTA flag Read 81 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEA, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. TEST 4 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 51 to SADRCS - Set STARTA/STARTB flags Read 89 from SADRCS - Read DONEA flag set, BIU set Write C9 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEA flag, set the STARTB flag Read C1 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEB, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. TEST 5 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 51 to SADRCS - Set STARTA/STARTB flags Read 89 from SADRCS - Read DONEA flag set, BIU set> Write 99 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEA flag, set STARTA Read 91 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEA, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. TEST 6 ------ Write 0 to SADRCS - disable receive DMA controller Write 1 to SADRCS - Enable DMA (note: only doing this in polled mode for these tests) Write 41 to SADRCS - Set STARTB flag Read 21 from SADRCS - Read DONEB flag set Write 21 to SADRCS - Clear the DONEB flag Read 1 from SADRCS - Dma enabled. Write 41 to SADRCS - Set STARTB flag Read 81 from SADRCS - BIU Set, No DONEB, Dead at this point can set either STARTA/B and never get any more DONE flags. It appears that the transition between buffers is broken, if the BIU bit gets set we're done and no further activity happens on that record channel. Thanks, Wayne G. Peters Accelent Systems Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 15:22:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA10260 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:22:29 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10255; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:22:19 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:21:53 +0100 To: Jeff Sutherland From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: SA-1111 Audio Recording questions. Cc: "ARM on Linux Mailing List (E-mail)" , "SA1100 Linux mailing list (E-mail)" , "'lart@lart.tudelft.nl'" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 15:07 +0100 21-03-2000, Jeff Sutherland wrote: >We have been experiencing problems with the SA1111 audio recording >functions. Has anyone else seen this, or better yet, figured out a >workaround? > Using latest Assabet with Niponset board, I have been able to >isolate the problem to the SADRCS register in the SAC section of the SA-1111 >chip. There was a thread on the newsgroup comp.sys.arm on this subject quite recently; you may want to check http://www.deja.com/ for it. JDB. -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 16:41:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA10582 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:41:40 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA10578 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:41:39 +0100 Received: from mena.arkansasusa.com (ns4.arkansasusa.com [12.14.232.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS00KZQ3LEP8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:41:39 +0100 (MET) Received: from BITWORKS.COM ([12.14.238.107]) by mena.arkansasusa.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-57470U2500L250S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:43:06 -0600 Received: from richard.bitworks.com [192.168.0.6] by BITWORKS.COM [127.0.0.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP3.R) for ; Tue, 22 Mar 1994 09:57:45 -0600 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:55:45 -0600 From: "Richard A. Smith" Subject: Re: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Reply-to: "Richard A. Smith" Message-id: <0FRS00KZR3LEP8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: PMMail 98 Professional (2.01.1600) For Windows 95 (4.0.1111) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:44:54 +0100, J.D. Bakker wrote: >[cc to lart@lart.tudelft.nl] Ok.. since you insist. *grin* > >http://www.semiconductors.com/pip/UCB1200_2 Hmmm don't think this is what I need. Is lart going to use the touchscreen interface? We do a lot with touchscreens here. >http://www.infineon.com/us/opto/daa/content.html This is more along the lines of what I need. Although I would like to find somthing like this with the audio codec built in. >You'll need some extra codecs then. I believe http://www.national.com had >special phone line interface chips; it's been a while since I investigated Thanks I will check out national. >building PABXen so that may have changed. Nowadays it may be easier and >cheaper to just hook up a couple of SLICs to some cheap audio codecs. Thats an interesting idea. >You might want to subscribe to the LART list; I'm going to design a >seperate PCB for the DAA2000; these may be useful for you even if you don't >use the LART computing element. I may do that.. Yeesh my mailing list load is starting to get large. Do you do most of the design by youself or do you collaborate with the list? Perhaps your upcomming PCB with DAA200 could be structured such that adding additional DAAs would be easy? What kind of price are we talking for a base LART? -- Richard A. Smith Bitworks, Inc. rsmith@bitworks.com 501.846.5777 Sr. Design Engineer http://www.bitworks.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 18:08:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA10864 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:08:37 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA10860 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:08:37 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS0071G7LZCO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:08:36 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA15535; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 12:01:30 -0500 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 12:01:30 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: PCMCIA and video In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Michael Renzmann , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 21 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > The latter. PCMCIA on StrongARM is quite simple (a matter of some buffers > and a PLD to control the lot). We want to experiment with existing wireless > links such as WaveLan. I intended to have the PCB ready for my last board > run, but time was too short. Expect rev 1 around May. we use wavelans around here too, but i thought the driver was a compilible wrapper to a binary only lib that actually runs the card: is there a version for the SA ? and congrats and getting the site up...we are currently feeling the joy of component acquisition after having gotten quotes from stuffers and pcb makers. weeeeeeeee. rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 19:49:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11100 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:49:50 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11096 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:49:49 +0100 Received: from ramone.wwonline.com (ramone.wwonline.com [209.82.60.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS00B7ACAYAA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:49:48 +0100 (MET) Received: from wwonline.com (dave@wrench.wwonline.com [209.82.62.59]) by ramone.wwonline.com (8.8.5/8.7.2) with ESMTP id NAA23404 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 13:43:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 13:41:30 -0500 From: David Emmerson Subject: LART hardware distribution version 0.95 (March 20, 2000) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38D7C25A.1D534CFB@wwonline.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.5-15 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Jan-Derk, You mention in the LARTdist-README that http://www.4pcb.com can provide a quote for this motherboard. Do you know if anyone has sent the Gerber files to them? Has 4pcb already manufactured prototypes of this board? If so, has there been any contact with them regarding the possibility of 'batching' board orders - i.e. collect orders until there are 10 or 15, and then manufacturing a batch of them and sending them out? Thanks, Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 20:45:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA11290 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 20:45:20 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA11285; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 20:45:17 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <0FRS00KZR3LEP8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 20:42:00 +0100 To: "Richard A. Smith" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Announce: LART hardware distribution released. Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >>You might want to subscribe to the LART list; I'm going to design a >>seperate PCB for the DAA2000; these may be useful for you even if you don't >>use the LART computing element. > >I may do that.. Yeesh my mailing list load is starting to get large. I don't expect the lart-list to get very high volume -- not the 200-300 mails that linux-kernel produces daily :-p >Do you do most of the design by youself or do you collaborate with >the list? Hey, the list is less than 24 hours old ;-). I intend to cooperate with the list (releasing plans early and often) and collaborating with everyone who has the time and interest. >Perhaps your upcomming PCB with DAA200 could be structured such that >adding additional DAAs would be easy? My current plan is to make the DAA2000 board as small as possible, allowing the user to use more in tandem (or stacked or whatever). >What kind of price are we talking for a base LART? Depends on volume. My prototypes were around US$800, a larger run may bring that down to around $200. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 21:07:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA11360 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:07:33 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11355; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:07:30 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:04:44 +0100 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PCMCIA and video Cc: Michael Renzmann , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 18:01 +0100 21-03-2000, rob wrote: >On Tue, 21 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: >> The latter. PCMCIA on StrongARM is quite simple (a matter of some buffers >> and a PLD to control the lot). We want to experiment with existing wireless >> links such as WaveLan. I intended to have the PCB ready for my last board >> run, but time was too short. Expect rev 1 around May. > > we use wavelans around here too, but i thought the driver was a >compilible wrapper to a binary only lib that actually runs the card: is >there a version for the SA ? Are you sure ? In my current tree (2.2.12) drivers/net/wavelan.c looks pretty standalone source to me. Can anyone who actually uses these cards confirm/deny any of this ? > and congrats and getting the site up...we are currently feeling >the joy of component acquisition after having gotten quotes from stuffers >and pcb makers. weeeeeeeee. Cool ;-) Doesn't GeorgiaTech have in-house stuffers though ? Oh BTW: anyone who is building the LART (or contemplatign to do so) will probably find that the power supply parts (MAX1626/1627) are in pretty short supply. Try asking a Maxim rep for samples, they are pretty quick with those (here at least). It's pretty odd that you'll get free samples in one week, while you have to wait a *long* time if you want to pay for them. JDB. [who is contemplating doing a rev 4 with other power supply parts. Suggestions anyone ?] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 21:18:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA11386 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:18:18 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11381; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:17:56 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38D7C25A.1D534CFB@wwonline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:16:16 +0100 To: David Emmerson , rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART hardware distribution version 0.95 (March 20, 2000) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 19:41 +0100 21-03-2000, David Emmerson wrote: >You mention in the LARTdist-README that http://www.4pcb.com can provide >a quote for this motherboard. Do you know if anyone has sent the Gerber >files to them? Not me; I don't know of anyone else. Rob, where are you planning to do your PCBs? > Has 4pcb already manufactured prototypes of this board? >If so, has there been any contact with them regarding the possibility of >'batching' board orders - i.e. collect orders until there are 10 or 15, >and then manufacturing a batch of them and sending them out? Sounds like a good idea. Alternatively, there may be a way for us to sell blank PCBs in small quantities; I'm looking into that. I plan to do a large run in a month or so (when I finally get all components together), and I could probably run an extra 10-20 blanks The best plan is probably to ask 4pcb as well, as the cost of shipping small quantities of PCBs from us (Europe) to you (America) may very well negate the advantage of riding along on a large batch. Let's see which path is least expensive. JDB. -- "There is a style of design I call "wishful thinking engineering." It starts with something like "pigs can fly if you feed them enough beans" and develops utopian plans such as like having everyone commute to work riding on personal pigs, and along the way ignores minor details such as the consequent rain of the non-gaseous byproducts." (Vernon Schryver in n.a.n-a.e) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 21:59:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA11533 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:59:02 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11529 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:59:01 +0100 Received: from ee.iitm.ernet.in ([202.141.26.181]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS00G2DIA8OU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:59:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (ee96162@localhost) by ee.iitm.ernet.in (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA05741; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 02:23:11 +0530 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 02:23:11 +0530 (IST) From: Lavu Sridhar Subject: ARM processors To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I am developing a board using StrongARM processors. We want the board to have the following features: 32MByte DRAM, 4MByte ROM, TV Video / Display Port, Ethernet Port, Serial Ports: RS232 port, two PS/2 ports. What microprocessor based on ARM core processot is best suited for this application? Though the StrongARM Micoroprocessor supports most of the features it does not support Ethernet directly. Similarly Samsung's ARM Microcontroller NetARM does not support Display. We are undergarduate students and have no prior experience with any of the ARM processors, so we would be grateful if you could help us in this matter and advise us about experiences with variuos ARM derivatives. -Lavu Sridhar -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 21 23:59:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA12028 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 23:59:43 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA12024 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 23:59:42 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS00LA2NV152@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 23:59:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17081; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 17:50:45 -0500 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 17:50:45 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: PCMCIA and video In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Michael Renzmann , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 21 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > Are you sure ? In my current tree (2.2.12) drivers/net/wavelan.c looks > pretty standalone source to me. > Can anyone who actually uses these cards confirm/deny any of this ? oh i guess the question is *which* wavelan. there are apparently several. we use the 11mbit lucent 802.11 "silver" cards. the module for it is called wavelan2_cs or something (it isn't in kernels). apparently several different cards were called wavelan. which one do you plan to use ? > Cool ;-) Doesn't GeorgiaTech have in-house stuffers though ? you'd think so.... just out of curiosity, is anyone from over there planning to attend ISWC (i think that's the name of it). > Oh BTW: anyone who is building the LART (or contemplatign to do so) will > probably find that the power supply parts (MAX1626/1627) are in pretty > short supply. Try asking a Maxim rep for samples, they are pretty quick > with those (here at least). It's pretty odd that you'll get free samples in > one week, while you have to wait a *long* time if you want to pay for them. > [who is contemplating doing a rev 4 with other power supply parts. > Suggestions anyone ?] yeah on their site, the lead time is quite high. max parts always seemed to be the standard for power supply stuff. what are the requirements for the LART in terms of current and voltage. what about using some of the more generic max parts that are adjustable (609 i think)? in jameco, they have a 78S40 switching regulator (1.5amp 1.25-40v) no clue what it looks like (i'm using a 386 whose harddrive i had to beat on repeatedly to get to boot as a terminal). we figured that if we got desperate enough, we would leave the parts unstuffed, and at least for testing rig something up (and we'll use lots of duct tape). rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 00:17:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12137 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 00:17:46 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12133 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 00:17:45 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRS00LLQOPJF2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 00:17:45 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA17128; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:01:50 -0500 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:01:50 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: LART hardware distribution version 0.95 (March 20, 2000) In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: David Emmerson , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk SOn Tue, 21 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 19:41 +0100 21-03-2000, David Emmerson wrote: > >You mention in the LARTdist-README that http://www.4pcb.com can provide > >a quote for this motherboard. Do you know if anyone has sent the Gerber > >files to them? > > Not me; I don't know of anyone else. Rob, where are you planning to do your > PCBs? we are going through H&L electronics, which is local to us. some of the other folks at tech use this firm to do boards. the quote we got ended up being pretty trivial (i don't have it in front of me): (all prices USD) 455 NRE and between 60 and 80 per board (maybe less) dependeing on quantity (this was for 3-6). (of course they haven't seen the gerber so that may change, but then again i'm guessing because i don't have the fax in front of me, so ...). once we get one of these guys working we might be able to start churning them out a bit more for people out there (or perhaps in collaboration with a company). can't say for sure yet, we are still in the middle of things, but if there is demand possibly maybe. rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 03:04:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA12740 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 03:04:32 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA12736 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 03:04:32 +0100 Received: from server1.siscom.net (server1.siscom.net [209.251.2.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FRS00278WFJUP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 03:04:31 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 45034 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Mar 2000 02:02:58 +0000 Received: from ppp144.c5300-1.day-oh.siscom.net (HELO siscom.net) ([209.251.9.144]) (envelope-sender ) by server1.siscom.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 02:02:58 +0000 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 21:01:13 -0800 From: Brian Kraack Subject: LART hardware manufacturing ... To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: David Emmerson , rob , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: bkraack@siscom.net Message-id: <38D85399.90EE377C@siscom.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I and a friend were also thinking of building these (basically cause I really want one) or possibly doing our own from scratch ... we know some guys who are distributors for a lot of the various parts, and rough estimate of cost for parts/building is about 250-350 at qty 100. (very rough estimate). we were thinking of doing up a 'large' batch of em (100 or so to start) if there was interest in doing so - that's about the number you have to do to get the costs down per unit. That's a pretty big investment though (for me anyway), and we don't want to get stuck with a ton of extras ... A lot of you are talking about putting them together yourselves - is that something you want to do for fun, or would you be willing to shell out for these if we made them. how many would you all want; costwise, what's fair, what's too high, etc. My original idea was to just get all the pieces together to sell as a kit (PCB included), but I've been told that it requires a very competent solderer to work this small (I'm a software weenie), so now I've graduated to building finished units and selling them with bundled software (and perhaps even add on modules down the road), etc. -- if you are interested, some feedback would be appreciated /Brian J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 19:41 +0100 21-03-2000, David Emmerson wrote: > >You mention in the LARTdist-README that http://www.4pcb.com can provide > >a quote for this motherboard. Do you know if anyone has sent the Gerber > >files to them? > > Not me; I don't know of anyone else. Rob, where are you planning to do your > PCBs? > > > Has 4pcb already manufactured prototypes of this board? > >If so, has there been any contact with them regarding the possibility of > >'batching' board orders - i.e. collect orders until there are 10 or 15, > >and then manufacturing a batch of them and sending them out? > > Sounds like a good idea. Alternatively, there may be a way for us to sell > blank PCBs in small quantities; I'm looking into that. I plan to do a large > run in a month or so (when I finally get all components together), and I > could probably run an extra 10-20 blanks > > The best plan is probably to ask 4pcb as well, as the cost of shipping > small quantities of PCBs from us (Europe) to you (America) may very well > negate the advantage of riding along on a large batch. Let's see which path > is least expensive. > > JDB. > > -- > "There is a style of design I call "wishful thinking engineering." It starts > with something like "pigs can fly if you feed them enough beans" and develops > utopian plans such as like having everyone commute to work riding on personal > pigs, and along the way ignores minor details such as the consequent rain of > the non-gaseous byproducts." > > (Vernon Schryver in n.a.n-a.e) > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 05:14:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA13081 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:14:32 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA13077 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:14:31 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRT004IB2G0JE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:14:31 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA19096; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 23:07:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 23:07:23 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: LART hardware mfr && qestions In-reply-to: <38D85399.90EE377C@siscom.net> To: Brian Kraack Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , David Emmerson , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk J.D. what fpga are you using ? i'm designing a board for a display driver around a altera part, and was looking for any designs that were out there. On Tue, 21 Mar 2000, Brian Kraack wrote: > That's a pretty big investment though (for me anyway), and we don't want > to get stuck with a ton of extras ... can you say wearable cluster computing? > A lot of you are talking about putting them > together yourselves - is that something you want to do for fun, > or would you be > willing to shell out for these if we made them. how many would you all want; > costwise, what's fair, what's too high, etc. i've got a reasonable budget, but i'll likely have them done locally and as quickly as possible. rob -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 10:04:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14106 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:04:35 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14101; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:04:33 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:59:16 +0100 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PCMCIA and video Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >On Tue, 21 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: >oh i guess the question is *which* wavelan. Yesss....that may well be an issue. > there are apparently several. >we use the 11mbit lucent 802.11 "silver" cards. the module for it is >called wavelan2_cs or something (it isn't in kernels). apparently several >different cards were called wavelan. which one do you plan to use ? I'm currently looking at the (old) 2Mbit version, as that is what we have lying around. >> Cool ;-) Doesn't GeorgiaTech have in-house stuffers though ? > > you'd think so.... > just out of curiosity, is anyone from over there planning to >attend ISWC (i think that's the name of it). ISWC ? Wotzat ? > what are the requirements for >the LART in terms of current and voltage. The LART has two power supply rails: one at 3v3 and one at either 2v0 or 1v5 (depending on which SA-1100 you use). Running on maximum (full speed decoding of H.263 compressed video), neither draws more than 200-250mA. > what about using some of the >more generic max parts that are adjustable (609 i think)? in jameco, >they have a 78S40 switching regulator (1.5amp 1.25-40v) no clue what >it looks like (i'm using a 386 whose harddrive i had to beat on repeatedly >to get to boot as a terminal). we figured that if we got desperate >enough, we would leave the parts unstuffed, and at least for testing rig >something up That's possible; if you don't mount any of the PSU parts, you could feed in the required voltages at one of the inductor pins (the large coils on the edge of the PCBs, see l'art gallery. Make sure that the supplies are *very* stable; half a Volt of undershoot and your board hangs; half a Volt the other way and your chips are fried :-( > (and we'll use lots of duct tape). ;) You know the old saying: "Duct tape is like the Force: it has a light side and a dark side, and it holds the universe together". JDB. -- "A satisfied customer ? We ought to have him stuffed !" -- Basil Fawlty -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 10:13:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14149 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:13:59 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14144; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:13:56 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:06:03 +0100 To: Nicolas Pitre From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Ramdisks (was Re: Kernel Module) Cc: Arm Linux Mailing List , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >(I really need to create an updated ramdisk image)... We have some; including all-ELF ones with busybox, and one that is set up to do NFS over PPP using one of the serial links. Will put them up on the LART pages shortly. JD 'another notch on the TODO list' B. -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 10:19:34 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14183 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:34 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14179 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:34 +0100 Received: from royal2.eicnet.de (royal2.eicnet.de [62.144.196.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRT00D1XGKL5F@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:33 +0100 (MET) Received: from iserv.compu.lan (root@ppp-36.regio.net [192.135.7.164]) by royal2.eicnet.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA30577; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:09:58 +0100 Received: from compulan.de ([192.168.1.210]) by iserv.compu.lan (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA03906; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:06:41 +0100 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:13:38 +0100 From: Michael Renzmann Subject: Re: PCMCIA and video To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: rob , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38D88EC2.F41814CE@compulan.de> Organization: CompuLAN Europe GmbH MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW0322h (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: de,en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi. > > we use wavelans around here too, but i thought the driver was > > a compilible wrapper to a binary only lib that actually runs the > > card: is there a version for the SA ? > Are you sure ? In my current tree (2.2.12) drivers/net/wavelan.c looks > pretty standalone source to me. > Can anyone who actually uses these cards confirm/deny any of this ? There are two drivers available for WaveLAN cards. One comes directly from Lucent and is distributed as "binary only" loadable module for x86-based PCs. The other one is a completly open sourced GPL-driver. This driver is part of the PCMCIA package. The driver found in the kernel could possibly be a third driver (I´m not sure about that), but IIRC this one does not support the up-to-date 11MBit/s versions of WaveLAN cards. They just work with the 8MBit cards that are not delivered anymore. I hope this could clear things up a bit. BTW: A nice page on any kind of wireless lan cards and Linux is this one: http://www.hpl.hp.com/personal/Jean_Tourrilhes/Linux/ Bye, Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 17:56:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17045 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:56:35 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17041 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:56:34 +0100 Received: from ice.ar51.net (ice.ar51.net [208.225.80.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU0088D1Q9FK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:56:34 +0100 (MET) Received: from server01.asi (akron-80-155.ar51.net [208.225.80.155]) by ice.ar51.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07198 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 11:53:19 -0500 Received: by SERVER01 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 11:53:27 -0500 Content-return: allowed Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 11:53:20 -0500 From: Jeff Sutherland Subject: Technical: kernel startup internals... To: "LART Mailing List (E-mail)" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I've been inching forward steadily with this SA1110 port, but I've got some wierdness following decompression of the kernel on startup. Seems the startup code in head.S wants to jump into the kernel at c0008000, which was the entry point coming from BLOB. I haven't yet found any documents on the web that go into the technicalities of bringing up a kernel. I thought there was a 'Porting-HOWTO' somewhere but I can't seem to locate it these days. I might even need some linker script or makefile tweaks (??) as _load_addr and _start (in head.S) are assigned at link time. This is starting to get ugly. I got bit by a SA1110 config register bug yesterday that took the better part of a day to chase down. Regards, //Jeff -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 18:51:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA17314 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:51:38 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA17310 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:51:37 +0100 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU00ACO49ZNZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:51:37 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 12:46:11 -0500 (EST) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Technical: kernel startup internals... In-reply-to: To: Jeff Sutherland Cc: "LART Mailing List (E-mail)" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 22 Mar 2000, Jeff Sutherland wrote: > I've been inching forward steadily with this SA1110 port, but I've got some > wierdness following decompression of the kernel on startup. Seems the > startup code in head.S wants to jump into the kernel at c0008000, which was > the entry point coming from BLOB. I haven't yet found any documents on the > web that go into the technicalities of bringing up a kernel. I thought > there was a 'Porting-HOWTO' somewhere but I can't seem to locate it these > days. There are none. And if there were some they would probably be obsolete anyway. Unfortunately for those dark corners the only reliable doc is the source. The compressed kernel stub and the real kernel itself can be run at the same address. The code from linux/arch/arm/compressed/head.S takes care of getting itself out of the way and copying the uncompressed kernel at the right place. > I might even need some linker script or makefile tweaks (??) as > _load_addr and _start (in head.S) are assigned at link time. This is > starting to get ugly. You shouldn't have to mess with that. If you want special setup like uncompressing the kernel directly out of flash then only some variables need to be changed in linux/arch/arm/compressed/Makefile. > I got bit by a SA1110 config register bug yesterday > that took the better part of a day to chase down. Which one? Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 22 22:07:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA18126 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:07:09 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA18122 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:07:09 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU00GP6DBVUS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:07:08 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA26030; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 15:59:49 -0500 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 15:59:49 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: ISWC In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > just out of curiosity, is anyone from over there planning to > >attend ISWC (i think that's the name of it). > > ISWC ? Wotzat ? the international symposium on wearable computers which will be held in atlanta this time around see http://iswc.gatech.edu/ for information. > > what are the requirements for > >the LART in terms of current and voltage. > > The LART has two power supply rails: one at 3v3 and one at either 2v0 or > 1v5 (depending on which SA-1100 you use). Running on maximum (full speed > decoding of H.263 compressed video), neither draws more than 200-250mA. > ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 03:54:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA19657 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:54:14 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA19653 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:54:13 +0100 Received: from iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br (iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br [143.107.235.38]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU003MITEA2K@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:54:13 +0100 (MET) Received: from iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br (really [143.107.235.244]) by iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br via in.smtpd with esmtp (ident celso using rfc1413) id (Debian Smail3.2.0.102) for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 21:52:26 -0300 (EST) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:52:00 -0300 From: celso Subject: Problems to make Blob To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38D986D0.C5276384@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br> Organization: usp MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Congratulation for your work . It's amazing and greatful !!!! I've had problems to make Blob bootloader : $./configure loading cache ./config.cache checking for a BSD compatible install... (cached) /usr/bin/install -c checking whether build environment is sane... yes checking whether make sets ${MAKE}... (cached) yes checking for working aclocal... found checking for working autoconf... found checking for working automake... found checking for working autoheader... found checking for working makeinfo... found checking whether to enable maintainer-specific portions of Makefiles... no checking host system type... i686-pc-linux-gnu checking for gcc... (cached) gcc checking whether the C compiler (gcc ) works... yes checking whether the C compiler (gcc ) is a cross-compiler... no checking whether we are using GNU C... (cached) yes checking whether gcc accepts -g... (cached) yes checking for arm-linux-objcopy... (cached) arm-linux-objcopy checking for a BSD compatible install... /usr/bin/install -c checking whether ln -s works... (cached) yes checking for inline... (cached) inline checking for C flags to get more warnings... -Wall creating ./config.status creating Makefile creating include/Makefile creating src/Makefile creating tools/Makefile creating include/config.h include/config.h is unchanged Configuration ------------------------------------------------------------------------ C compiler gcc !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! see that line .Is it ok ?????gcc???? C flags -O2 -I/usr/src/linux/include -Wall -nostdinc -mcpu=strongarm110 -mapcs-32 -fomit-frame-pointer -fPIC Linker flags -static -nostdlib Objcopy tool arm-linux-objcopy Objcopy flags -O binary -R .note -R .comment -S Run-time debug information no I tryed to make and : $make Making all in tools make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/tools' make[1]: Nothing to be done for `all'. make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/tools' Making all in include make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/include' make[1]: Nothing to be done for `all'. make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/include' Making all in src make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/src' gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I../include -I../include -I../include -O2 -I/usr/src/linux/include -Wall -nostdinc -mcpu=strongarm110 -mapcs-32 -fomit-frame-pointer -fPIC -c start.S /tmp/cc174h8i.s: Assembler messages: /tmp/cc174h8i.s:56: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b reset' /tmp/cc174h8i.s:57: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b undefined_instruction' /tmp/cc174h8i.s:58: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b software_interrupt' /tmp/cc174h8i.s:59: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b abort_prefetch' and more and more errors ... what did happen ??? **** arm-linux-"tools" run fine ... -- Celso Providelo cprov@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br Linux user #166906-96936 LAMI-Laboratories of Microprocessors Department of Electrical Engineering University of Sao Paulo (USP - Sao Carlos) by marilia.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br Linux machine #73597 ___ __________ =| A |= __ __ |O o _____ | =| V |= | || | |o *|/\/\/|| =| R |===|=%||%=|=|o *|_____|| =|___|= |__||__| |__________| -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 04:06:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA19717 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:06:52 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA19713 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:06:52 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU00467TZF03@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:06:52 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA27796; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 21:59:38 -0500 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 21:59:37 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: Problems to make Blob In-reply-to: <38D986D0.C5276384@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br> To: celso Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk are you cross compiling ? it looks like you are using the wrong version of 'gas', (ie the one for i386). but that's just a guess. rob On Wed, 22 Mar 2000, celso wrote: > Configuration > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > C compiler gcc !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! see that line .Is it > ok ?????gcc???? > C flags -O2 -I/usr/src/linux/include -Wall -nostdinc > -mcpu=strongarm110 -mapcs-32 -fomit-frame-pointer -fPIC > Linker flags -static -nostdlib > Objcopy tool arm-linux-objcopy > Objcopy flags -O binary -R .note -R .comment -S > Run-time debug information no > > I tryed to make and : > > $make > Making all in tools > make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/tools' > make[1]: Nothing to be done for `all'. > make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/tools' > Making all in include > make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/include' > make[1]: Nothing to be done for `all'. > make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/include' > Making all in src > make[1]: Entering directory `/home/celso/Lart/src/blob-1.0.5/src' > gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I../include -I../include -I../include -O2 > -I/usr/src/linux/include -Wall -nostdinc -mcpu=strongarm110 -mapcs-32 > -fomit-frame-pointer -fPIC -c start.S > /tmp/cc174h8i.s: Assembler messages: > /tmp/cc174h8i.s:56: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b reset' > /tmp/cc174h8i.s:57: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b > undefined_instruction' > /tmp/cc174h8i.s:58: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b > software_interrupt' > /tmp/cc174h8i.s:59: Error: no such 386 instruction: `b abort_prefetch' > > and more and more errors ... what did happen ??? > > **** arm-linux-"tools" run fine ... > -- > Celso Providelo > cprov@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br > Linux user #166906-96936 > LAMI-Laboratories of Microprocessors > Department of Electrical Engineering > University of Sao Paulo (USP - Sao Carlos) > by marilia.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br > Linux machine #73597 > ___ __________ > =| A |= __ __ |O o _____ | > =| V |= | || | |o *|/\/\/|| > =| R |===|=%||%=|=|o *|_____|| > =|___|= |__||__| |__________| > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 04:53:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA19845 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:53:13 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA19841 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:53:13 +0100 Received: from mail.eskimo.com (mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU004M3W4M03@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:53:13 +0100 (MET) Received: from eskimo.com (jim@oak-ts1-h1-48-186.ispmodems.net [209.162.48.186]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA05312 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:50:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:56:24 -0800 From: Jim Richardson Subject: (no subject) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38D995E8.F3D07180@eskimo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk subscribe lart -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 05:26:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA19934 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:26:07 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA19930 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:26:05 +0100 Received: from peterpan.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br (peterpan.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br [143.107.235.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU0056EXN91A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:26:05 +0100 (MET) Received: from sel.eesc.sc.usp.br (debonzi@JULY [143.107.235.246]) by peterpan.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA06596 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 01:20:42 -0300 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 01:25:19 +0000 From: Daniel Henrique Debonzi Subject: Path To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38D9727F.EC228920@sel.eesc.sc.usp.br> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: pt-BR, en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, How can I apply the patch-2.2.13-rmk2 patch in a kernel-source-2.2.13? Thanks!! -- Daniel Henrique Debonzi Linux user number 166903 Department of Electrical Engineering University of Sao Paulo (USP) Microprocessor Laboratory (LAMI-SEL) ___ __________ =| A |= __ __ |O o _____ | =| V |= | || | |o *|/\/\/|| =| R |===|=%||%=|=|o *|_____|| =|===|= |__||__| |__________| -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 05:41:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA19992 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:41:38 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA19988 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:41:38 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRU005CRYDD1A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:41:37 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28761; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:34:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:34:25 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: Path In-reply-to: <38D9727F.EC228920@sel.eesc.sc.usp.br> To: Daniel Henrique Debonzi Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Daniel Henrique Debonzi wrote: > Hi, > How can I apply the patch-2.2.13-rmk2 patch in a kernel-source-2.2.13? > Thanks!! > -- the usual procedure is something like patch -p0 < patch-2.2.13-rmk2 you have to do it with the appropriate -p[some number usually one or zero], and in the right directory. (i've never applied that patch so i dunno which ones though). patch is pretty smart about stuff and will complain if it doesn't find what it's looking for. probably you need to be in the linux directory . do 'man patch' for more info. rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 09:17:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA20797 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:17:56 +0100 Received: from pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl (pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl [130.161.158.204]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA20792 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:17:56 +0100 Received: from localhost (pouwelse@localhost) by pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA02356; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:17:47 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:17:47 +0100 (MET) From: Johan Pouwelse X-Sender: pouwelse@pgsultra To: rob cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: ISWC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > > just out of curiosity, is anyone from over there planning to > > ISWC ? Wotzat ? > the international symposium on wearable computers > which will be held in atlanta this time around > see http://iswc.gatech.edu/ for information. The paper deadline for ISWC is set at 16 May. I'm a researcher working with the LART at Delft university and I'll try to get an ISWC paper out on our LART voltage and frequency scaling implementation/measurements, together with an analysis of wireless link trade-offs. I attended the last two ISWC's and I think people would appreciate the LART stuff... > > > what are the requirements for > > >the LART in terms of current and voltage. > > The LART has two power supply rails: one at 3v3 and one at either 2v0 or > > 1v5 (depending on which SA-1100 you use). Running on maximum (full speed > > decoding of H.263 compressed video), neither draws more than 200-250mA. I've measured the power consumption of the LART while running the SA1100 at 0.8 V (59MHz) - 1.7 V(251MHz) and decoding H.263 compressed video streams. A paper with *all* the details will be linked to the LART pages in one month. This paper is already finished, but awaits program committee approval. Johan Pouwelse -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 09:51:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA20923 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:51:46 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA20919 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:51:45 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRV00DCB9WQA8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:51:45 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA30222; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:42:56 -0500 Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:42:56 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: ISWC In-reply-to: To: Johan Pouwelse Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, thad@cc.gatech.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk very cool! rob On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Johan Pouwelse wrote: > > > > just out of curiosity, is anyone from over there planning to > > > ISWC ? Wotzat ? > > the international symposium on wearable computers > > which will be held in atlanta this time around > > see http://iswc.gatech.edu/ for information. > > The paper deadline for ISWC is set at 16 May. I'm a researcher working > with the LART at Delft university and I'll try to get an ISWC paper out on > our LART voltage and frequency scaling implementation/measurements, > together with an analysis of wireless link trade-offs. I attended the last > two ISWC's and I think people would appreciate the LART stuff... > > > > > what are the requirements for > > > >the LART in terms of current and voltage. > > > The LART has two power supply rails: one at 3v3 and one at either 2v0 or > > > 1v5 (depending on which SA-1100 you use). Running on maximum (full speed > > > decoding of H.263 compressed video), neither draws more than 200-250mA. > > I've measured the power consumption of the LART while running the SA1100 > at 0.8 V (59MHz) - 1.7 V(251MHz) and decoding H.263 compressed video > streams. A paper with *all* the details will be linked to the LART pages > in one month. This paper is already finished, but awaits program committee > approval. > > > Johan Pouwelse > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 09:55:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA20957 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:55:50 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA20951 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:55:49 +0100 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id JAA28210; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:55:44 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:55:44 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200003230855.JAA28210@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: cprov@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Problems to make Blob In-Reply-To: <38D986D0.C5276384@iris.sel.eesc.sc.usp.br> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:52:00 -0300, celso wrote: > Congratulation for your work . It's amazing and greatful !!!! > I've had problems to make Blob bootloader : > > > $./configure > loading cache ./config.cache > checking for a BSD compatible install... (cached) /usr/bin/install -c > checking whether build environment is sane... yes > checking whether make sets ${MAKE}... (cached) yes > checking for working aclocal... found > checking for working autoconf... found > checking for working automake... found > checking for working autoheader... found > checking for working makeinfo... found > checking whether to enable maintainer-specific portions of Makefiles... > no > checking host system type... i686-pc-linux-gnu You're using an i686 host... > checking for gcc... (cached) gcc > checking whether the C compiler (gcc ) works... yes > checking whether the C compiler (gcc ) is a cross-compiler... no .. so you should be using a cross compiler. From the README file in the BLOB distribution: - setenv CC /path/to/cross/gcc - setenv OBJCOPY /path/to/cross/objcopy - Run "./configure --with-linux-prefix=/path/to/armlinux/source arm-lart-linux-gnu" - Run "make" Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 11:04:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA21245 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:04:02 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA21241 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:04:01 +0100 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f116.hotmail.com [216.32.181.116]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FRV00IASDAPWO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:04:01 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 25892 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:03:50 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.37 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 02:03:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:03:50 +0200 (EET) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: LAN and WLAN To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000323100350.25891.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.37] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk We are planning to start to develop a general purpose ARM based board with LAN and WLAN support. Also we see a need for the hardware based compressing. We know we are not alone with this subject and this LART project sounds like it's very close to it. We've understood that some of you is developing LAN support for the LART. Is it so and what is the status? And how about wireless networking (based on pcmcia/pc-card)? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 12:21:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA21507 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:21:03 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA21503 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:21:02 +0100 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA29190; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:20:56 +0100 (MET) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:20:56 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200003231120.MAA29190@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: LAN and WLAN In-Reply-To: <20000323100350.25891.qmail@hotmail.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:03:50 +0200 (EET), Mika Lauronen wrote: > We are planning to start to develop a general purpose ARM based board > with LAN and WLAN support. Also we see a need for the hardware based > compressing. > > We know we are not alone with this subject and this LART project sounds like > it's very close to it. > > We've understood that some of you is developing LAN support for the > LART. Is it so and what is the status? The first two prototypes of the Kitchen Sink Board arrived yesterday. JDB did some first tests (as in: "no, it's not a 0 Ohm resistor"). I can't say when we start writing the first driver, but it will be Real Soon Now [tm]. The single ethernet PCB isn't yet assembled, so the ethernet driver will come a bit later. > And how about wireless networking (based on pcmcia/pc-card)? We have some old (2 Mbit) wavelan pcmcia cards, and we have plans to port the driver to LART (but we have so many plans ;-). Erik -- unix soit qui mal y pense -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 12:33:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA21556 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:33:28 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA21552 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:33:27 +0100 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRV0022YHFOG2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:33:27 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA32455; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 06:19:03 -0500 Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 06:19:03 -0500 (EST) From: rob Subject: Re: LAN and WLAN In-reply-to: <200003231120.MAA29190@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > We have some old (2 Mbit) wavelan pcmcia cards, and we have plans to port > the driver to LART (but we have so many plans ;-). i know the feeling...all we *really* need is a machine to slow down time around us, then we could get some real work done. :D ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 17:51:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22619 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:51:19 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA22614; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:51:13 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:50:32 +0100 To: James Bredijk From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: ARM vs PPC Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] > I read on the LART pages that you were leaning towards the PPC >until you "saw the light". Was this a technical, or perhaps, a >spiritual light? ;-) After reading about the LART project (I was >impressed) I thought you would be able to provide an intelligent >opinion (or comparison) of the two. > > Why did you choose the ARM over the PPC? Was it the available tools >or dev boards? Was it the available Linux distributions? Was it the >acronym? As a Mac owner (and ex-developer) I originally leaned toward the PPC. I knew the instruction set, the architecture and I felt confident that the tweaks that were necessary to get Linux running were well within my reach. I chose the IBM PPC403GCX embedded processor, read the CPU manual till I knew it by heart. I even found a supplier. Then I found the SA-1100. It is almost the same price as the IBM part with *much* higher integration. The raw speed is over two times that of the embedded PPC, at a smaller power consumption. After a fashion, I even came to like ARM assembly better than PPC assembly. In retrospect the processing power was the most important decision changer. Even the new PPC405GP has not much more oomph, at almost twice the power consumption. And it comes only in BGA, which is a bitch for prototyping and small runs. Note that I still believe that embedded PPCs have their place in the Grand Scheme Of Things. If you need PCI, on-chip Ethernet or other esoteric stuff (I'm always amazed with the Motorola devices), PPC may be the way to go. On the other hand, if you're building a wearable platform with high MIPS/Watt and still enough power for, say, speech recognition, the StrongARM is the chip for you. Does that answer your question ? JDB. [who'll admit to being a sucker for a good acronym ;-)] -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 20:26:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA23276 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:26:16 +0100 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA23271; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:26:12 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:26:05 +0100 To: "Modi, Al" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Building Blob Cc: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to Erik Mouw, the blob maintainer. Erik, maybe we should document some of this stuff, like in a PORTING file ?] >I down loaded the 'blob-1.0.5.tar.gz' from your web site. Exploding the >file 'blob-1.0.5.tar.gz' provided me with source,include,build file etc.. >and readme file. Read me file under section Building Blob, specifies the >prerequisites needed to build the blob. I wanted to build the blob on >Linux system with cross compiler tools for arm, program the blob image in >to a flash on the 'Intel Sa-1100 brutus' board and let Brutus board boot >using blob. >Q.1 Can this be done ? Cross-compiling it should work; this is how we use blob. I don't know whether it will work on Brutus (but I don't have any reason to believe it won't). >Q.2 Do you have any document on LART memory map layout ? LART has four 8MB memory blocks, divided over DRAM banks 0 and 1: 0xC0000000-0xC07FFFFF 0xC1000000-0xC17FFFFF 0xC8000000-0xC87FFFFF 0xC9000000-0xC97FFFFF The current blob makes some assumptions: - only banks 0 and 1 are active (fixable in src/start.S) - the area from 0xC0000000 contains RAM at least up to 0xC0400000. To do actual work; this block must at least extend to (0xC0400000 + sizeof(ramdisk)). - the kernel and the ramdisk live in Chip Select 0 area. Oh and the entire internal/external flash distinction is pretty LART-centric as well. >Q.3 What are the things I need to accomplish this ? See above. >Q.4 What area of blob code would need change to run blob on the 'Intel >Brutus Board'. You'd probablu have to rewrite the flash programming code in src/flash.c (if you want blob to write a kernel/ramdisk to flash), and maybe change the memory parameters in src/start.S. >I have a Linux system and I have installed Cross compiler tools for arms >on my Linux box, I am not sure about what versions of binutils and gcc, I >have. How can I find out the version of this tools on my Linux box. binutils: arm-linux-objcopy -V gcc: arm-linux-gcc -v HTH, JDB. [who doesn't have access to a Brutus, so can't check the details easily] -- If you think the problem is bad now, just wait until we've solved it. -- Arthur Kasspe -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 23 20:56:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA23391 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:56:30 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA23387 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:56:29 +0100 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f146.hotmail.com [216.32.181.146]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FRW008FE4Q4LI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:56:29 +0100 (MET) Received: (qmail 24233 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:56:17 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.28 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:56:17 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 21:56:17 +0200 (EET) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: Re: LAN and WLAN To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000323195617.24232.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.28] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ok. Do you have any idea when this KSB will be in "beta state" and ready to try? >From: Erik Mouw >To: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com >CC: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Subject: Re: LAN and WLAN >Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:20:56 +0100 (MET) > >On Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:03:50 +0200 (EET), Mika Lauronen wrote: > > We are planning to start to develop a general purpose ARM based board > > with LAN and WLAN support. Also we see a need for the hardware based > > compressing. > > > > We know we are not alone with this subject and this LART project sounds >like > > it's very close to it. > > > > We've understood that some of you is developing LAN support for the > > LART. Is it so and what is the status? > >The first two prototypes of the Kitchen Sink Board arrived yesterday. JDB >did some first tests (as in: "no, it's not a 0 Ohm resistor"). I can't say >when we start writing the first driver, but it will be Real Soon Now [tm]. >The single ethernet PCB isn't yet assembled, so the ethernet driver will >come a bit later. > > > And how about wireless networking (based on pcmcia/pc-card)? > >We have some old (2 Mbit) wavelan pcmcia cards, and we have plans to port >the driver to LART (but we have so many plans ;-). > > >Erik > >-- >unix soit qui mal y pense > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 24 00:40:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01536 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 00:40:01 +0100 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01531; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 00:39:55 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000323195617.24232.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 00:39:43 +0100 To: Mika Lauronen From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LAN and WLAN Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Ok. Do you have any idea when this KSB will be in "beta state" >and ready to try? Once I'm convinced that the major features of the KSB are OK (or at least trivially patchable) I'll release a hardware distribution, just like for LART. If all's well, I expect this to be around the end of next week. Don't worry; LARTlist will be first to know. JDB [who defines 'major features' as sound out, UCB1200, IDE and Ethernet i/f] -- "...which gives the server a futuristic, serverish, 'Don't touch me, or I will put a printer up your ass!', kind of look." (Nir Soffer in ASR) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 24 15:23:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA03597 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 15:23:14 +0100 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA03592; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 15:23:09 +0100 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 15:23:04 +0100 To: "Modi, Al" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Building Blob Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Jan-Derk, thank you for answering my questions on building blob. I have >following additional questions on hardware organization of LART. Is there a >document that I can down load to get additional information on LART >hardware >configuration ? The best (and only) docs are the schematics; see http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/plint/ >>LART has four 8MB memory blocks, divided over DRAM banks 0 and 1: >>0xC0000000-0xC07FFFFF - This is Bank 0 >>0xC1000000-0xC17FFFFF - This is Bank 1 >>0xC8000000-0xC87FFFFF >>0xC9000000-0xC97FFFFF No, 0xC0000000-0xC07FFFFF and 0xC1000000-0xC17FFFFF are bank 0, and 0xC8000000-0xC87FFFFF and 0xC9000000-0xC97FFFFF are bank 1. See the SA-1100 Technocal Reference Manual at http://developer.intel.com/ for the SA memory map. >>The current blob makes some assumptions: >>- only banks 0 and 1 are active (fixable in src/start.S) >>- the area from 0xC0000000 contains RAM at least up to 0xC0400000. To do >>actual work; this block must at least extend to (0xC0400000 + >>sizeof(ramdisk)). >>- the kernel and the ramdisk live in Chip Select 0 area. >Q.1 This means the size of the unzipped kernel + unzipped ramdisk must be >less than 8MB. Is this correct ? No; The kernel has its own magic to unzip itself and the ramdisk; ATM i am happily running with a kernel just shy of 1MB and an 8MB ramdisk. >Q.2 What if the size of the unzipped kernel and ramdiks is > 8MB. Does it >mean that you can not run this configuration on the LART hardware ? You >must reduce the size 0f kernel + ramdisk < 8MB. See above. The current flash parts are 4MB total, so: sizeof(compressed kernel) + sizeof(compressed ramdisk) + sizeof(blob) < 4MB. >Q.3 How is memory organized on the LART board ? Is memory in each bank is >organized 32 bit wide or 16 bit wide ? All on-board memory is 32 bit wide; external (boot-)memory is 16 bit wide. >Q.4 Is SA-1100 run in ARM mode (32 bit mode) or Thumb mode (16 bit mode) ? The SA-1100 doesn't support Thumb. >Q.5 Is memory configured in little endian or big endian format ? Memory _accesses_ are little endian, as this is what the kernel is most comfortable with. The LART doesn't care either way, you could run it in big endian mode. >Q.6 Can LART support 16MB of memory in Bank 0 and Bank 1 ? That is the current configuration; 32 MB evenly divided over banks 0 and 1. JDB. -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 24 18:17:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA04482 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:17:07 +0100 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA04478 for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:17:06 +0100 Received: from gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.85]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FRX00I6WS0H73@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:17:06 +0100 (MET) Received: from earthlink.net (sdn-ar-001riprovP194.dialsprint.net [206.133.176.106]) by gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA04674 for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 09:15:13 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 12:20:38 -0500 From: "Samuel E. Riffle" Subject: Linux hardware design refrence updates To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: sriffle@ieee.org Message-id: <38DBA3E5.DA169FB5@earthlink.net> Organization: tSSRG MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,es Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk subscribe lart sriffle@ieee.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Mar 25 15:10:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA06980 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:27 +0100 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA06976 for ; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:27 +0100 Received: from kalman.et.tudelft.nl by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id PAA11856; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:26 +0100 (MET) Received: (from erik@localhost) by kalman.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id PAA30514 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:26 +0100 Message-Id: <200003251410.PAA30514@kalman.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Announce: blob-1.0.6 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:26 +0100 (CET) From: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL39 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just released blob-1.0.6, the latest and greatest version of the LART bootloader. What's new w.r.t blob-1.0.5: * Changed the license: booting an OS is no longer considered a derived work * Added and documented Johan's (highly experimental) clock scaling code * Minor changes in the documentation Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 26 10:01:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA08550 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:01:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA08546 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:01:10 +0200 Received: from field.videotron.net (field.videotron.net [205.151.222.108]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS0009QQRLYB6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:01:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from hotmail.com ([24.200.14.94]) by field.videotron.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8) with ESMTP id <0FS0001TQRAPIW@field.videotron.net> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 02:54:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 02:58:43 -0500 From: Agarwal Subject: More info To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38DDC332.842153B2@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi guys, First, let me say: wow. This product is very impressive, because it is almost all I was searching for. I was in the process of finding a good compagny to design such a board for a commercial product that I want to build and I then heard of the LART. Like I already said, wow :) I'll talk more about the product I want to develop later... Now, if possible, I would like some info about the board. When the mainboard is connected to the KSB, is it still possible to connect other add-on boards to the mainboard, or it is just possible to connect one at a time? If it's possible to connect more than one board, I would probably have 3: the KSB, a GPS header and an FM receiver. Sounds possible? (beside the fact that the last 2 boards are not even in development yet :)) Simon Labrecque -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 26 10:34:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA08625 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:34:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA08621 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:34:07 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f281.hotmail.com [216.32.180.135]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS000AEGT4UFP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 10:34:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 509 invoked by uid 0); Sun, 26 Mar 2000 08:33:55 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.17 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 00:33:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 11:33:55 +0100 (EEST) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: Re: Announce: blob-1.0.6 To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000326083355.508.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.17] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, What does it mean, if the licence is "derived work"? >From: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) >To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Subject: Announce: blob-1.0.6 >Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:10:26 +0100 (CET) > >Hi all, > >I just released blob-1.0.6, the latest and greatest version of the LART >bootloader. What's new w.r.t blob-1.0.5: > >* Changed the license: booting an OS is no longer considered a derived > work >* Added and documented Johan's (highly experimental) clock scaling code >* Minor changes in the documentation > > >Erik > >-- >J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department >of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, >Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The >Netherlands >Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl >WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 26 13:51:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA08785 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 13:51:18 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA08781 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 13:51:17 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA15378; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 13:51:13 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 13:51:13 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003261151.NAA15378@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Announce: blob-1.0.6 In-Reply-To: <20000326083355.508.qmail@hotmail.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 11:33:55 +0100 (EEST), Mika Lauronen wrote: > What does it mean, if the licence is "derived work"? > >>From: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) >>* Changed the license: booting an OS is no longer considered a derived >> work I don't think the CVS log entry made clear what I meant. I'll explain. The problem that might arise is that the GPL (under which BLOB is released) considers everything that uses the Program (BLOB) as a derived work. That would mean that you would only be able to boot GPL'ed operating systems, like Linux or Hurd. The slightly modified license allows you to boot any operating system, because we think that booting operating systems (or whatever you want to start) can be considered as normal use for a bootloader. Here is the exact text I added to the COPYING file: NOTE: This copyright does NOT cover operating systems or programs booted or started by BLOB. This is considered normal use for a boot loader, and does NOT fall under the heading of "derived work". Erik Mouw You will notice that this is inspired by the Linux kernel license, which contains the same phrase w.r.t. binaries. Erik -- "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Mar 26 14:14:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA08892 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 14:14:36 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA08888 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 14:14:35 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id OAA15448; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 14:14:34 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 14:14:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003261214.OAA15448@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: blob patches Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I know that some of you guys out there have been hacking on blob to get it to work on several other SA1100 and SA1110 based systems. It would be nice if blob contained support for all other SA11x0 based boards, so I'd like to integrate your patches into the next release (1.0.7). If you made a patch for blob, could you send it to me privately? Erik -- "God. Root. What is difference?" -- Pitr in "User Friendly" by Illiad -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 07:23:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA09840 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 07:23:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA09836 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 07:23:19 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS2004WMEYUW0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 07:23:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id PAA2587919; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 15:25:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 15:25:01 -0800 From: Greg Fountain Subject: LART Mainboard PC Board Fab & Assembly To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38DE9C4D.59B232F5@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------693F213E147931C69425F1CD" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------693F213E147931C69425F1CD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In the next two weeks or so I'm planning to place an order to fabricate a TBD number of LART mainboards based upon the Schematics and Gerber files which have been posted on the LART website. In addition, since the design uses relatively fine pitch Surface Mount components these boards will not be the type which can be assembled easily by hand. I will probably have a commercial shop here in Silicon Valley do my assembly. I would be interested obtaining feedback on what the potential demand might be before I release the Gerbers to the PCB fab. I don't want to order too many boards if the demand is very limited. Not to mention the fact that my wife might (will?) get upset at carrying the cost for all the unused boards and parts. To be honest I'm more of a hardware type than a true embedded LINUX hacker ... I would prefer to work with a Kernel zealot here in California (Or the western US) that could help with the software/firmware side of the debugging process. If that's not practical I can ship one or two ot the prototype development boards to a partner in a more distant location. Any volunteers? My own thinking on this subject is to produce a small number first (<6). Once the design has been independently validated the risk associated with producing a larger number boards (for those who might have an interest) will be greatly reduced. For example, looking at the photos on the website it looks like the X1 and X2 crystal footprints might have been reversed. I happen to use OrCAD anyone have any opinions on what would be the preferred CAD environment (Protel maybe)? Greg Menlo Park, California USA --------------693F213E147931C69425F1CD Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------693F213E147931C69425F1CD-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 08:35:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10246 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:35:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10242 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:35:18 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS20092EIAQE7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:35:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:29:38 +1000 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:29:38 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Announce: blob-1.0.6 In-reply-to: <200003261151.NAA15378@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Erik Mouw Cc: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sun, 26 Mar 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 11:33:55 +0100 (EEST), Mika Lauronen wrote: > > What does it mean, if the licence is "derived work"? > > > >>From: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) > >>* Changed the license: booting an OS is no longer considered a derived > >> work > > I don't think the CVS log entry made clear what I meant. I'll explain. > > The problem that might arise is that the GPL (under which BLOB is > released) considers everything that uses the Program (BLOB) as a derived > work. That would mean that you would only be able to boot GPL'ed operating > systems, like Linux or Hurd. I doubt thats the case. I'm sure GPL only covers code 'linked' in with the GPL'd code. As such any OS booted isn't linked into BLOB. Cheers Adam > > The slightly modified license allows you to boot any operating system, > because we think that booting operating systems (or whatever you want to > start) can be considered as normal use for a bootloader. > > Here is the exact text I added to the COPYING file: > > NOTE: This copyright does NOT cover operating systems or programs > booted or started by BLOB. This is considered normal use for a boot > loader, and does NOT fall under the heading of "derived work". > > Erik Mouw > > You will notice that this is inspired by the Linux kernel license, which > contains the same phrase w.r.t. binaries. > > > Erik > > -- > "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is > legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." > -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 10:07:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA10400 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:07:13 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA10395; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:07:09 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38DE9C4D.59B232F5@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:01:24 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART Mainboard PC Board Fab & Assembly Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >To be honest I'm more of a hardware type than a true embedded LINUX >hacker ... I would prefer to work with a Kernel zealot here in >California (Or the western US) that could help with the >software/firmware side of the debugging process. If that's not practical >I can ship one or two ot the prototype development boards to a partner >in a more distant location. Any volunteers? What exactly do you expect to have to debug on the software/firmware side ? >My own thinking on this subject is to produce a small number first (<6). >Once the design has been independently validated the risk associated >with producing a larger number boards (for those who might have an >interest) will be greatly reduced. For example, looking at the photos on >the website it looks like the X1 and X2 crystal footprints might have >been reversed. The photos are of Rev 1 PCBs; all (three) bugs in those have been fixed in the Rev 3 PCBs (which are the ones in the hardware distro). The Gerbers in the hardware distribution are the ones I used myself for a proto run; those have no (known) errors. >I happen to use OrCAD anyone have any opinions on what would be the >preferred CAD environment (Protel maybe)? The current LART design is in EDWin (an obscure Win16-based package). I'm not too sure if there's a workable way to export to OrCAD/Protel/whatever. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 10:16:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA10428 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:16:28 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA10423; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:16:25 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38DDC332.842153B2@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:10:43 +0200 To: Agarwal From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: More info Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 09:58 +0200 26-03-2000, Agarwal wrote: >Hi guys, > > First, let me say: wow. This product is very impressive, because it >is almost all I was searching for. I was in the process of finding a >good compagny to design such a board for a commercial product that I >want to build and I then heard of the LART. Like I already said, wow :) >I'll talk more about the product I want to develop later... Thanks ! > Now, if possible, I would like some info about the board. When the >mainboard is connected to the KSB, is it still possible to connect other >add-on boards to the mainboard, or it is just possible to connect one at >a time? The LART has two data connectors: a high speed one (full address space, 32 bit) and a low speed one (reduced address space, 16 bit). It's possible to connect two boards (piggy-backed) to the high speed bus, and one to the low speed bus. I'll put some purty pictures on the website shortly (ie when I find some time to make them). > If it's possible to connect more than one board, I would >probably have 3: the KSB, a GPS header and an FM receiver. Sounds >possible? (beside the fact that the last 2 boards are not even in >development yet :)) Most GPS kit that I know of uses one serial link (or two, including NMEA-0183), either at RS232 or TTL voltage levels. That can easily be accommodated; I don't know any digital FM receiver chipsets so I can't comment there (although I suppose it can be hooked up to the high speed bus). JDB. -- If you think the problem is bad now, just wait until we've solved it. -- Arthur Kasspe -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 13:08:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA10788 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:08:29 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA10784 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:08:28 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA20244; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:08:12 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:08:12 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003271108.NAA20244@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: awiggins@cse.unsw.edu.au Cc: mastersoftoy@hotmail.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Announce: blob-1.0.6 In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:29:38 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > On Sun, 26 Mar 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> The problem that might arise is that the GPL (under which BLOB is >> released) considers everything that uses the Program (BLOB) as a derived >> work. That would mean that you would only be able to boot GPL'ed operating >> systems, like Linux or Hurd. > > I doubt thats the case. I'm sure GPL only covers code 'linked' in > with the GPL'd code. As such any OS booted isn't linked into BLOB. Hmm, maybe you're right, I'm not a lawyer. I felt that it was better to tell explicitly that booting an OS is seen as a normal way of operation, just like using Linux syscalls is considered normal operation. Linus decided to modify the GPL for the kernel because the concept "linked" is very vague. The problem might become more clear if we want to support the SA1100 sleep mode, for which you need explicit support from the bootloader. In that case we are prepared and allow "linking" with the OS. Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 13:13:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA10805 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:13:11 +0200 Received: from pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl (pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl [130.161.158.204]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA10801 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:13:10 +0200 Received: from localhost (pouwelse@localhost) by pgsultra.pds.twi.tudelft.nl (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA03678; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:12:41 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:12:41 +0200 (MET DST) From: Johan Pouwelse X-Sender: pouwelse@pgsultra To: "Richard A. Smith" cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Subject: touchscreens In-Reply-To: <0FRS00KZR3LEP8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Hmmm don't think this is what I need. Is lart going to use the > touchscreen interface? We do a lot with touchscreens here. We are also interested in touchscreens. The UCB1200 we use on the KSB has a "four wire resistive touchscreen interface circuit supporting position, plate, and pressure resistance measurements". I'm looking into the possibility of adding handwriting recognition to the LART together with another university (http://hwr.nici.kun.nl/) We would like to have a 320*240 touchscreen display and connect it to the UCB1200. We prefer a color version if the power consumption is not above 5 W. The touchscreen must be small, cost is no issue. What touchscreen would you advise ? (I found http://www.salt.com.tw/p4.htm as possible supplier) Johan Pouwelse -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 13:51:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA10895 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:51:08 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA10891; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:51:06 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <0FRS00KZR3LEP8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:44:53 +0200 To: Johan Pouwelse From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: LCDs and touchscreens Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >What touchscreen would you advise ? >(I found http://www.salt.com.tw/p4.htm as possible supplier) http://www.datamodul.de/ and http://www.datamodul.com/ are a bit closer to home, and may also carry touch screen stuff. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 14:12:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10953 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:12:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10949 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:12:17 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f274.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.149]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS200AE8XWFP2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:12:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 72259 invoked by uid 0); Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:12:04 +0000 Received: from 24.200.14.94 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 04:12:04 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 04:12:04 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: More info To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000327121204.72258.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I read on the mailing list that there is currently a GPS board in development; that would mean that this one is being developed with the low connector, since it obviously needs a display? For the FM receiver, I think the easiest way would be to develop a low-connection board for it, right? Would it be possible to have the GPS header and the FM receiver on the same low-connection board? Thanks in advance. Simon Labrecque > >Hi guys, > > > > First, let me say: wow. This product is very impressive, because it > >is almost all I was searching for. I was in the process of finding a > >good compagny to design such a board for a commercial product that I > >want to build and I then heard of the LART. Like I already said, wow :) > >I'll talk more about the product I want to develop later... > >Thanks ! > > > Now, if possible, I would like some info about the board. When the > >mainboard is connected to the KSB, is it still possible to connect other > >add-on boards to the mainboard, or it is just possible to connect one at > >a time? > >The LART has two data connectors: a high speed one (full address space, 32 >bit) and a low speed one (reduced address space, 16 bit). It's possible to >connect two boards (piggy-backed) to the high speed bus, and one to the low >speed bus. I'll put some purty pictures on the website shortly (ie when I >find some time to make them). > > > If it's possible to connect more than one board, I would > >probably have 3: the KSB, a GPS header and an FM receiver. Sounds > >possible? (beside the fact that the last 2 boards are not even in > >development yet :)) > >Most GPS kit that I know of uses one serial link (or two, including >NMEA-0183), either at RS232 or TTL voltage levels. That can easily be >accommodated; I don't know any digital FM receiver chipsets so I can't >comment there (although I suppose it can be hooked up to the high speed >bus). > >JDB. > >-- >If you think the problem is bad now, just wait until we've solved it. > -- Arthur Kasspe > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 14:20:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10978 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:20:46 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10974 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:20:45 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id OAA20729; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:19:20 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:19:20 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003271219.OAA20729@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: B8502004@mail.ntust.edu.tw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: blob loader In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:44:23 +0800 (CST), Chester wrote: [Cc-ed to the LART list, there are more people out there porting blob to sa1110 platforms] >> Erm, you can't use Angel and blob together. Blob assumes that it is loaded >> at (physical) address 0x00000000. My guess is that you're trying to start >> blob from Angel, and that's not possible. You can remove Angel completely >> and use blob instead, or you can modify the blob link script so it starts >> at a different address. > > I didn't use angel and blob together. I got two pair of flash. > one is brust angel and other is blob. OK. I was just trying to rule out possible errors. > (I hate my poor english) > I means,when i use angelboot loader to test my sa-1110 board. > It only response "Angel debug monirot" when using angelboot loader. > And when i use blob to test my sa-1110 board,it doesn't have anything > when i reset sa-1110 board. Right, you have to do some hardcore debugging now. I think you have to change the CPU and/or DRAM setup. Edit start.S, go to line 71 (just after the label "old_blink_led") and add the line: b skip_proc_init Now go to line 106 (right after "Do port setup the paranoid way"), and add the line: skip_proc_init: In this way you'll jump over initialization code and initialize the serial port immediately. Blob will crash at a later point, but it should first print "Consider yourself LARTed". If this works, you can be sure that the problem is in the CPU or DRAM setup. I can't help you with that, you have to change it for your board. Erik -- Computers run on faith, not electrons. -- T.N. Thompson -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 19:26:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11582 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:26:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11578 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:26:32 +0200 Received: from easter.axysdesign.com ([198.172.73.114]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS3007C3CG7J5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:26:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from axysdesign.com (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by easter.axysdesign.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4F601D780C; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:25:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:25:54 -0800 From: Bill Sidhipong Subject: Re: LART Mainboard PC Board Fab & Assembly To: greg.fountain@telvex.com Cc: Lart Mail Server Message-id: <38DF99A2.5965BB8D@axysdesign.com> Organization: AXYS Design, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.15pre14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38DE9C4D.59B232F5@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Greg Fountain wrote: > I would be interested obtaining feedback on what the potential demand > might be before I release the Gerbers to the PCB fab. I don't want to For me this depends on the price. I was going to do what you propose myself but considering I am not really in this business I didn't know where to begin =:) If the unit price can be kept low (approx. $300 or so) I would like to order two units. Perhaps three =:) > To be honest I'm more of a hardware type than a true embedded LINUX > hacker ... I would prefer to work with a Kernel zealot here in > California (Or the western US) that could help with the > software/firmware side of the debugging process. If that's not practical > I can ship one or two ot the prototype development boards to a partner > in a more distant location. Any volunteers? I need to use the LART in home automation project (nothing to do with the company I work for - they are EDA, not smart homes ;) which will involve writing some userland applications and some kernelspace drivers for D/A converter, sensors, etc. Is this what you have in mind? I have zero ARM experience so this is news to me too :) -- Bill Sidhipong AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Mar 27 20:17:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA11706 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:17:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA11702 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:17:20 +0200 Received: from mena.arkansasusa.com (ns4.arkansasusa.com [12.14.232.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS300A2FEST7O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:17:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from BITWORKS.COM ([12.14.238.88]) by mena.arkansasusa.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-57470U2500L250S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:18:43 -0600 Received: from richard.bitworks.com [192.168.0.6] by BITWORKS.COM [127.0.0.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP3.R) for ; Mon, 28 Mar 1994 12:30:55 -0600 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:32:15 -0600 From: "Richard A. Smith" Subject: Re: touchscreens To: Johan Pouwelse Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Reply-to: "Richard A. Smith" Message-id: <0FS300A2GESU7O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: PMMail 98 Professional (2.01.1600) For Windows 95 (4.0.1111) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:12:41 +0200 (MET DST), Johan Pouwelse wrote: >The UCB1200 we use on the KSB has a "four wire resistive touchscreen >interface circuit supporting position, plate, and pressure resistance >measurements". Hmmm... I wonder what "plate measurement" is. Curious that they say the chipset can do pressure measurements they must be doing something different than the std 4 xsistor interface. I was under the understanding that you needed a 5 wire to do pressure sensing. >I'm looking into the possibility of adding handwriting recognition to the >LART together with another university (http://hwr.nici.kun.nl/) Very Cool. >We would like to have a 320*240 touchscreen display and connect it to the >UCB1200. Well an analog touuchscreen has an infinite resolution so I guess you mean the LCD. We actually purchase our LCD and touchscreens seperate and attach them to the LCD ourselves. We use a small bead of silicone around the edge of the touchscreen to bond it to the LCD. Make it lots eaiser later if you have to remove the touchscreen. > We prefer a color version if the power consumption is not above 5 W. >The touchscreen must be small, cost is no issue. I know you can get monochrome displays that will meet your needs. They make displays that require no backlight. Color on ther other hand may be difficult. All the color displays we use are TFT and they require lots of juice. (Thats why laptop batteries don't last more than 2 hours) >What touchscreen would you advise ? >(I found http://www.salt.com.tw/p4.htm as possible supplier) There are lots of suppliers that make touchscreens that will fit on a 320x240. We buy Danapro (http://www.dynapro.com) via one of our distributors. Our part number is 95638. I think its the Flex on glass on the website. However, since you aren't in the us most of my resources won't help you much. Most of them we have found just by doing searching for "touchscreen" on the internet. However Salt is a new one. I may have to have them give me quote. Operational wise all 4 wire touchscreens are basically created equal. You just have to figure out which wires energize which planes and adjust your software accordingly. (The UCB1200 must have some settings to control this) Most of the difference comes in the physicals. The size of the area around the active area varies as does the location of the connection tail and weither or not the tail comes with a berg connector or not. A berg connector will plug up to a 4x1 .100" header. You will have to find one that fits the LCD you select. Once you find an LCD you like you will have to get all its mechanicals and match a touchscreen to it. Request a sample and check. Note: lots of touchscreens use silver ink as the "wire" in the connection tail. If you crease, kink, fold, spindle, or otherwise mutilate that tail then you will crack the ink and either throw the calibration way off or render the touchscreen useless. -- Richard A. Smith Bitworks, Inc. rsmith@bitworks.com 501.846.5777 Sr. Design Engineer http://www.bitworks.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 28 00:19:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12479 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:19:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12475 for ; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:19:30 +0200 Received: from easter.axysdesign.com ([198.172.73.114]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS300J1PQ0FSU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:19:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from axysdesign.com (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by easter.axysdesign.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF63F1D7806; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:13:28 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:13:28 -0800 From: Bill Sidhipong Subject: Re: LART Mainboard PC Board Fab & Assembly To: Mike Ingle Cc: Lart Mail Server Message-id: <38DFDD08.B9D6A35B@axysdesign.com> Organization: AXYS Design, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.15pre14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38DE9C4D.59B232F5@ix.netcom.com> <4.2.0.58.20000327121201.00b122b0@email.ancore.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mike Ingle wrote: > > I am also interested in fabbing a few boards. I have in mind to add an > altera 6016 FPGA and some SRAM either to the main board, or via one of the > interface connectors. I am located if the SF bay area. I would like to > share the NRE w/ someone, and can generate the necessary layouts if there > is a common hardware feature set we would like to add. Besides the > FPGA/SRAM, I also need a some DACs. Why not make this on the expansion board of some sort? I'd love to have the following: o D/A and A/D converters, 8-16 bit resolution. o General purpose I/O lines isolated from the CPU o Servo/stepper motor controllers (I could pick this up separately as a serial-based unit so it's not a high-priority item for me). What do you think? -- Bill Sidhipong AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 28 12:57:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA13790 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:57:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA13786 for ; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:57:47 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f192.hotmail.com [216.32.181.192]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS4000GMP49G5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:57:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 21298 invoked by uid 0); Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:57:35 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.30 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 02:57:34 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:57:34 +0100 (EEST) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: LARTware pcmcia? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000328105735.21297.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.30] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Anybody going to develop pcmcia for the LART mainboard? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 28 13:16:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA13821 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:16:21 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13816; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:16:18 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000328105735.21297.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:16:11 +0200 To: Mika Lauronen From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LARTware pcmcia? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 14:57 +0200 28-03-2000, Mika Lauronen wrote: >Anybody going to develop pcmcia for the LART >mainboard? That would be me ;-) I have a two-slot PCMCIA adapter on the drawing board. No hot swap capability (ie change cards with power off) and no dynamic switching between 3v3 and 5v, but fully functional otherwise. The hard parts (address and data buses) are almost routed; I expect to have a finished design by the end of the week. JDB. -- "Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot." -- Arne Damvin in asr -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Mar 28 14:22:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA13970 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 14:22:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA13966 for ; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 14:22:46 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f62.hotmail.com [216.32.181.62]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS4007FST1WHZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 14:22:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 75818 invoked by uid 0); Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:22:34 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.10 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 04:22:33 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 15:22:33 +0100 (EEST) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: Re: LARTware pcmcia? To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000328122234.75817.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.10] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk That is the latest missing part of LART for us... Now it is possible to use ethernet cards, modems, WLAN cards etc. with the lart (ok, there must be correct and working drivers;) and that gives HUGE number of applications to use the board with ;) >From: "J.D. Bakker" >To: Mika Lauronen >CC: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Subject: Re: LARTware pcmcia? >Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:16:11 +0200 > >At 14:57 +0200 28-03-2000, Mika Lauronen wrote: > >Anybody going to develop pcmcia for the LART > >mainboard? > >That would be me ;-) > >I have a two-slot PCMCIA adapter on the drawing board. No hot swap >capability (ie change cards with power off) and no dynamic switching >between 3v3 and 5v, but fully functional otherwise. The hard parts (address >and data buses) are almost routed; I expect to have a finished design by >the end of the week. > >JDB. > >-- >"Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press >any key to reboot." > -- Arne Damvin in asr > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 03:53:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA16002 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:53:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA15998 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:53:24 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law-f24.hotmail.com [209.185.131.87]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS5000CEUKZET@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:53:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 61116 invoked by uid 0); Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:53:12 +0000 Received: from 164.164.56.2 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:53:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:53:12 -0800 (PST) From: chaman bagga Subject: usb keyboard/mouse To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000329015312.61115.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [164.164.56.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I don't know if this is the right question to ask (since my knowledge about usb is limited)... from sa1100 docs, the usb is supposed to be a slave port for transferring data from the pc, so if the pc is not connected to the usb port, will the sa1100 usb port still be able to take data from the keyboard/mouse??? Please CC: reply to me, i'm not subscribed to this list. Regards, Chaman Bagga. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 11:20:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA16831 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:20:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA16827 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:20:07 +0200 Received: from navigator.sw.com.sg (navigator.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.131]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS600G05F91WM@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:20:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from exchruhydro.sw.com.sg (exchruhydro.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.3]) by navigator.sw.com.sg (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA01319 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:04:30 +0400 (MSD) Received: by exchruhydro.sw.com.sg with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:00:04 +0400 Received: from cyber (cyber.int.sw.ru [195.16.40.122]) by exchruhydro.sw.com.sg with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id HZ8D9L7Q; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:00:00 +0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:00:13 +0400 From: Gennady Kurtsman Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse To: chaman bagga , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <003b01bf995d$32124690$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk SA1100 integrated USB controller isn't intended to work as *host* or *hub*. So, it isn't able to get data from USB *devices*, such as keyboard and mouse. Intel recommends to use companion chip. Moreover, it looks like SA1100 USB interface doesn't work correctly in *device* mode too. I struggled with it desperately within 1 month. Intel's support service couldn't advise me anything constructive. Does anybody have a positive experience with SA1100 USB ? Best regards, Gennadiy Kurtsman. -----Original Message----- From: chaman bagga To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Date: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 5:55 AM Subject: usb keyboard/mouse > > >I don't know if this is the right question to ask (since my knowledge about >usb is limited)... from sa1100 docs, the usb is supposed to be a slave port >for transferring data from the pc, so if the pc is not connected to the usb >port, will the sa1100 usb port still be able to take data from the >keyboard/mouse??? > >Please CC: reply to me, i'm not subscribed to this list. > >Regards, >Chaman Bagga. > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 12:01:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA16919 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:01:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA16915 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:01:57 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law-f135.hotmail.com [209.185.131.198]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS600JMOH78KF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:01:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 99030 invoked by uid 0); Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:01:45 +0000 Received: from 164.164.56.2 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:01:45 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:01:45 -0800 (PST) From: chaman bagga Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000329100145.99029.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [164.164.56.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk That implies SA1100 cannot read directly from keyboard/mouse. Only when it is connected to PC's host usb port, the data can be transferred first to PC which can then transfer it to SA1100 USB port.. am I right? Regards, Chaman Bagga. >From: "Gennadiy M. Kurtsman" >To: "chaman bagga" , >Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse >Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:00:13 +0400 > >SA1100 integrated USB controller isn't intended to work as *host* or *hub*. >So, it isn't able to get data from USB *devices*, such as keyboard and >mouse. Intel recommends to use companion chip. Moreover, it looks like >SA1100 USB interface doesn't work correctly in *device* mode too. I >struggled with it desperately within 1 month. Intel's support service >couldn't advise me anything constructive. Does anybody have a positive >experience with SA1100 USB ? >Best regards, >Gennadiy Kurtsman. > >-----Original Message----- >From: chaman bagga >To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Date: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 5:55 AM >Subject: usb keyboard/mouse > > > > > > > >I don't know if this is the right question to ask (since my knowledge >about > >usb is limited)... from sa1100 docs, the usb is supposed to be a slave >port > >for transferring data from the pc, so if the pc is not connected to the >usb > >port, will the sa1100 usb port still be able to take data from the > >keyboard/mouse??? > > > >Please CC: reply to me, i'm not subscribed to this list. > > > >Regards, > >Chaman Bagga. > > > >______________________________________________________ > >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > >-- > >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 12:46:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA17024 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:46:44 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA17019; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:46:41 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000329100145.99029.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:46:32 +0200 To: chaman bagga From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 12:01 +0200 29-03-2000, chaman bagga wrote: >That implies SA1100 cannot read directly from keyboard/mouse. Only when it >is connected to PC's host usb port, the data can be transferred first to PC >which can then transfer it to SA1100 USB port.. am I right? Almost. An additional problem is that the USB client in the SA gets upset if it isn't the only client (see the errata). The only configuration that works (if I read the docs right) is: PC<--->USB hub<--->SA-1100 No more, no less. So also no mice. On the other hand, the KSB has PS/2 connectors, so if you want keyboard/mouse; you can connect them thriugh the KSB. JDB [figuring out why the audio DAC on the KSB produces nothing but static] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 12:47:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA17039 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:47:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA17035 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:47:23 +0200 Received: from navigator.sw.com.sg (navigator.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.131]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS6000ORJ9U28@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:47:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from exchruhydro.sw.com.sg (exchruhydro.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.3]) by navigator.sw.com.sg (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA02508 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:31:16 +0400 (MSD) Received: by exchruhydro.sw.com.sg with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:26:50 +0400 Received: from CYBER ([195.16.40.122]) by exchruhydro.sw.com.sg with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id HZ8D9MFC; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:26:45 +0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:26:54 +0400 From: Gennady Kurtsman Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse To: chaman bagga , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <005401bf9969$50a6aea0$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This configuration is workable but you need in special PC software driver, retranslating keyboard/mouse data to SA1100. GK. -----Original Message----- From: chaman bagga To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Date: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 2:04 PM Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse > >That implies SA1100 cannot read directly from keyboard/mouse. Only when it >is connected to PC's host usb port, the data can be transferred first to PC >which can then transfer it to SA1100 USB port.. am I right? > >Regards, >Chaman Bagga. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 17:03:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17598 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:03:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17594 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:03:56 +0200 Received: from inuit.authentica-security.com (inuit.authentica-security.com [208.249.150.210]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS600L0SV6J8E@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:03:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nome.authentica.com by inuit.authentica-security.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:03:55 +0000 (UT) Received: from iceberg (iceberg.authentica.com [192.168.85.148]) by nome.authentica.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id KAA06493 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:01:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:00:13 -0500 From: "C. Wegrzyn" Subject: SA1100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <008d01bf998f$94667960$9455a8c0@authentica.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <003b01bf995d$32124690$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I've heard from a VC friend of mine that the SA is being phased out. Intel supposedly bought it to kill it. Does anyone know anything about this gossip? I'm trying to determine if I should venture into using the LART but don't want to waste my time. Chuck Wegrzyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gennady Kurtsman" To: "chaman bagga" ; Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 4:00 AM Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse > SA1100 integrated USB controller isn't intended to work as *host* or *hub*. > So, it isn't able to get data from USB *devices*, such as keyboard and > mouse. Intel recommends to use companion chip. Moreover, it looks like > SA1100 USB interface doesn't work correctly in *device* mode too. I > struggled with it desperately within 1 month. Intel's support service > couldn't advise me anything constructive. Does anybody have a positive > experience with SA1100 USB ? > Best regards, > Gennadiy Kurtsman. > > -----Original Message----- > From: chaman bagga > To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Date: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 5:55 AM > Subject: usb keyboard/mouse > > > > > > > >I don't know if this is the right question to ask (since my knowledge about > >usb is limited)... from sa1100 docs, the usb is supposed to be a slave port > >for transferring data from the pc, so if the pc is not connected to the usb > >port, will the sa1100 usb port still be able to take data from the > >keyboard/mouse??? > > > >Please CC: reply to me, i'm not subscribed to this list. > > > >Regards, > >Chaman Bagga. > > > >______________________________________________________ > >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > >-- > >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 17:40:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA17647 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:40:39 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA17642 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:40:37 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id RAA07016; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:40:25 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:40:25 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003291540.RAA07016@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: wegrzyn@garbagedump.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: SA1100 In-Reply-To: <008d01bf998f$94667960$9455a8c0@authentica.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:00:13 -0500, C. Wegrzyn wrote: > I've heard from a VC friend of mine that the SA is being phased out. Intel > supposedly bought it to kill it. Does anyone know anything about this > gossip? I'm trying to determine if I should venture into using the LART but > don't want to waste my time. Hmm, I think this is just plain FUD. After Intel bought the SA-1100 from Digital semiconductors they released the SA-1110 (an SA-1100 with SDRAM interface and some silicon errors fixed), and the IXP-1200, which is an SA1 core with some network stuff glued to it. They're currently developing the SA2 core which is planned to run at 600MHz while still having low power requirements. LART itself isn't tied to a certain CPU, it is very well possible to use other CPUs as well (hey: a Transmeta Crusoe ;-). The LART FAQ answers some of these issues in the "LART vs. PLEB" page: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq-lart-vs-pleb.php3 Erik -- "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 21:58:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18394 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:58:41 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18390 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:58:39 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS700BTK8TQYA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:58:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail3.magma.ca (mail3.magma.ca [206.191.0.221]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA23834 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:51:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail3.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA19958 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:51:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:53:42 -0500 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38E25F45.F57F67D3@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <005401bf9969$50a6aea0$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk For what its worth Intel has an AppNote "USB Client Device Validation for the SA-1100" that can be had from http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/applnots/278244.htm Best Regards Terrance -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 22:30:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA18563 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:30:49 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA18559 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:30:49 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA08711; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:30:48 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:30:48 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003292030.WAA08711@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: KSB pictures avaiable Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just made some pictures of the Kitchen Sink Board (flatbed scanners are so nice ;-). They're available at l'Art gallery: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/gallery.php3#ksb Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 22:56:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA18657 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:56:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA18653 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:56:49 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f22.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS700FDPBINE1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:56:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 59850 invoked by uid 0); Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:56:36 +0000 Received: from 24.201.77.13 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:56:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:56:36 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000329205636.59849.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [24.201.77.13] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I read on the mailing list that there is currently a GPS board in development; that would mean that this one is being developed with the low connector, since it obviously needs a display? I would be highly interested in that one. I would also need an FM receiver. I think the best (but not the less costy :)) way would be to develop a low-connection board for it, right? Would it be possible to have the GPS header and the FM receiver on the same low-connection board? Thanks in advance. Simon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 23:05:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18698 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:05:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18694 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:05:52 +0200 Received: from email.ancore.com (host13.ancore.com [204.118.176.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS700G2DBXQ6Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:05:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from webbis (webbis.ancore.com [204.118.176.42]) by email.ancore.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id G10N19HG; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:02:40 -0800 Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:55:58 -0800 From: Mike Ingle Subject: PCB quote from US X-Sender: mikei@email.ancore.com To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk LOW PRICE GUARANTEE   = ;  Quote Number: 156432
Quote Date: 3/28/00
Part Number: ancoreSA Revision: 3
To Preview Order, click on unit price
<= th width=3D84>3-daysame-day
PROTOTYPE Price Matrix - unit price
Qty5-day4-day2-day1-day
2$343.50$493.50$768.50$968.50$1,268.50n/a
10$81.70$111.70$166.70$206.70$266.70n/a
Prototype assumptions/specs: 6 Layers, 0.062 "FR4, Dimensions: 4" x 2.75", Plating: SMOBC, Cu Weight: 1 oz., Trace width/space: 0.006, Smallest hole size: 0.012", Gold Fingers:None, SMDs-top:650, SMDs-bottom: 350, SMD Pitch: 0.015", Sides to solder mask: 2 with LPI, Sides to legend: 1, CNC Rout points: 4, Tab Route: No, Scoring: No.
Prototype Tolerances: Drill +/- .005", rout +/- .010", mask +/- .006". All holes plated through.
Test NRE =3D $299.75 (adds 1 day to delivery)
To Preview Order, click on unit price
2-week3-daysame-day
PRODUCTION Price Matrix - unit price
Qty5-week1-week4-day2-day1-day
25$38.26$52.80$65.04$76.13$107.12$147.29n/an/a
100$14.99$20.69$25.49$29.84$41.98$57.72n/an/a
200$11.12$15.34$18.90$22.12$31.12$42.79n/an/a
NRE =3D $325.00 Test NRE =3D $299.75
Production Board Specs: 6 Layers, 0.062" FR4, Dimensions: 4" x 2.75", Plating: SMOBC, Cu Weight: 1 oz., Trace width/space: 0.006, Smallest hole size: 0.012", Gold Fingers:None, SMDs-top:650, SMDs-bottom: 350, SMD Pitch: 0.015", Sides to solder mask: 2 with LPI, Sides to legend: 1, CNC Route points: 4, Tab Route: No, Scoring: No
Production Tolerances: +/- 0.005"
Terms and Conditions
=B7       Orders placed today are considered day 0 and must be received by 3pm MST.
=B7       Same day orders must be received by 9am & please call us at: 1-800-289-1724 to confirm receipt of order.
=B7       1st Order payment terms are CREDIT CARD or COD. We accept Visa, MasterCard, and AmericanExpress.
=B7       This quote excludes specifications for: controlled dielectric/impedence, inner layers exceeding 1 oz Cu, blind/buried vias, countersinks/bores, plated slots/edges, and any color of mask/legend other than green/white. Please call us.

AC Home | Customer Options | Quote | Quote Recall | Order Status | Modify Customer Data
Questions, Problems or Feedback - send E-mail to rhuston@4pcb.com



-- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 23:44:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18882 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:44:48 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18877; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:44:43 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000329205636.59849.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:44:11 +0200 To: Simon Labrecque From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [Is this a deja vu, or did we already have this discussion ?] At 22:56 +0200 29-03-2000, Simon Labrecque wrote: > I read on the mailing list that there is currently a GPS board in >development; Not quite a board, I want to use a GPS module (like http://www.chapmantech.com/OEM). As it connects thru RS232, you could even connect it to a bare LART. > that would mean that this one is being developed with the low >connector, since it obviously needs a display? I would be highly interested >in that one. I can image applications (such as route logging) that don't require a display. > I would also need an FM receiver. I think the best (but not the less >costy :)) way would be to develop a low-connection board for it, right? Depends, what FM receiver chipset did you have in mind ? >Would it be possible to have the GPS header and the FM receiver on the same >low-connection board? Thanks in advance. GPS needn't have anything to do with the low speed bus, see above. JDB. -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Mar 29 23:53:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18930 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:53:30 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18926 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:53:30 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA09037; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:53:20 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:53:20 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003292153.XAA09037@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mhuang@livetoy.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Debugging blob In-Reply-To: <38E261B9.A1194FD@livetoy.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk (CC-ed to the LART mailinglist because there are other people porting blob to Brutus as well) On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:04:09 -0500, Mark Huang wrote: > I wrote a simple Linux boot loader for my Brutus-like board a long time > ago and have been using it ever since, but I'm getting to the point > where I need to add some more functionality to it. I'm wondering how you > went about debugging blob in the early stages. Right now, I have no > other way to do it besides editing my assembly code, burning it onto the > EEPROM with a programmer, and rebooting, which takes about half an hour. We currently use the procedure described in the README file in the blob distribution (external Flash board). Writing the binary to the internal Flash memory takes about two minutes, so once we got beyond the point that there was evidence that the LART worked at all, debugging was quite easy. We still want to go for a JTAG Flash programmer, so it is will be much easier for others to bootstrap an empty LART. > Is there a way to compile the boot loader as a regular Linux program, > download it to a running Linux session, and have it take over the system > as if it had been run from 0x00000000? I've tried compiling it as ELF32 > and running it, but all it seems to do is corrupt random registers and > crash the Linux session. If I compile it as binary, burn it to EEPROM at > 0x00000000, and reboot, the code runs fine. I can't think of an easy way to compile it as a regular Linux program. The intermediate ELF file looks like a real ELF binary, but it isn't. Even if it was, you couldn't use it, because blob assumes that the MMU is switched off and tries to write to registers which aren't mapped in its memory space. I don't say it's impossible to overcome those problems, but it won't be easy. However, Jim Kasper (jim@blazie.com) found an inventive way to play with blob: write blob to flash, boot the SA-1100 board, tell it to download a kernel, and download a slightly modified version of blob. Type "boot", and blob will jump to the freshly downloaded version in RAM. Play with it until you get bored, reset the board and you're back at the blob in flash. You'll have to modify src/ld-script in such a way that the compiler will put the start address at a different place. I gave Jim two versions of the ld-script which he could try, but I'm not sure which one he used: SECTIONS { . = 0xc0400000; /* KERNEL_RAM_BASE or wherever you want it */ .text : { *(.text) } . = ALIGN(4) .rodata : { *(.rodata) } . = ALIGN(4); .data : { *(.data) } . = ALIGN(4); .got : { *(.got) } } Or: SECTIONS { .text 0xc0400000: { *(.text) } . = ALIGN(4); .rodata : { *(.rodata) } . = ALIGN(4); .data : { *(.data) } . = ALIGN(4); .got : { *(.got) } } I didn't try it; if it doesn't work, you'll find more information in the GNU ld info files. > Anyway, I've taken a look at the blob code and am pretty impressed with > the functionality. Depending on how things go with my boot loader, > I might start hacking on it and submi patches back to you if I find bugs > or add something cool. That would be nice. Here is my blob wish list (which is currently also my To Do list) in no particular order: - Auto memory size determination (and tell the kernel about the results) - Give the command line to the kernel - Memory tester - Ethernet support (boot from bootp+tftp) - Write the flash we're currently running from (make all code real PIC) - Memory settings calculation utility I suggest to join the LART mailinglist because there are other people working on blob. Have a look at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/ for details. (Marc is currently working on the mailing list pages, so if you can't find the majordomo details come back half an hour later or so). Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 00:19:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA19019 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:19:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA19015 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:19:44 +0200 Received: from easter.axysdesign.com ([198.172.73.114]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS700HPYFCVR3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:19:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from axysdesign.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by easter.axysdesign.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07AD71D780F; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:17:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:17:54 -0800 From: Bill Sidhipong Subject: Re: PCB quote from US To: Mike Ingle Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38E28112.D29861D2@axysdesign.com> Organization: AXYS Design, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.15pre14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mike Ingle wrote: > - unit price > Qty 5-week 2-week 1-week 4-day 3-day > 25 $38.26 $52.80 $65.04 $76.13 $107.12 > 100 $14.99 $20.69 $25.49 $29.84 $41.98 > 200 $11.12 $15.34 $18.90 $22.12 $31.12 I like 200/{2,5}-week price :) Now, how much are the component cost and assembly going to add to this total? If we can get enough people interested, we could pull this off. -- Bill Sidhipong AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 01:09:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA19298 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:09:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA19294 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:09:17 +0200 Received: from mail.eink.com (mail.eink.com [140.239.80.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS700JQGHNGVO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:09:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.eink.com by mail.eink.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 23:16:03 +0000 (UT) Received: from eink.com (CAD2 [192.168.29.67]) by mail_server.eink.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id GTS0L6ZA; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:06:55 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:06:43 -0500 From: Holly Gates Subject: Re: PCB quote from US To: Bill Sidhipong Cc: Mike Ingle , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38E28C83.95A0D201@eink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> <38E28112.D29861D2@axysdesign.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Holy crap, 200 boards is a lot. Even the 25 and 100 prices are really cheap though. I had the LART board quoted at my favorite board house, Sierra Proto Express, and they came in significantly higher on a 2 week turn. I can't say I have been incredibly impressed with Advanced Circuits quality, but if the boards come netlist tested and don't have any serious issues the cheap price is attractive. -Holly Gates Bill Sidhipong wrote: > > Mike Ingle wrote: > > > - unit price > > Qty 5-week 2-week 1-week 4-day 3-day > > 25 $38.26 $52.80 $65.04 $76.13 $107.12 > > 100 $14.99 $20.69 $25.49 $29.84 $41.98 > > 200 $11.12 $15.34 $18.90 $22.12 $31.12 > > I like 200/{2,5}-week price :) Now, how much are the component cost and > assembly going to add to this total? If we can get enough people > interested, we could pull this off. > > -- > Bill Sidhipong > AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 > One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 > Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 02:41:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19354 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 02:41:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA19350 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 02:41:52 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS700M10LXOXN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 02:41:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:34:24 +1000 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:34:24 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: PCB quote from US In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Mike Ingle Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Can people refrain for HTML only email as I (and I'm sure many others) use text only email clients. Cheers Adam P.S. A JTAG Programmer is on the way, I'm setting it up to worth on multiple platforms with either a AVR micro hanging off a serial port or some sort of minimal hardware hanging off a parallel port. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 03:44:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA19526 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:44:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA19522 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:43:59 +0200 Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS7000CLOT5DC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:43:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.10.0/8.9.3) with ESMTP id e2U1c2H24090; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:38:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:39:46 +0000 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: Re: PCB quote from US To: Bill Sidhipong Cc: LART Mailling list Message-id: <38E207A2.CB54A70@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13-7mdk i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> <38E28112.D29861D2@axysdesign.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm interested, but I'd like to purchase assembled boards... does anyone know how much parts & assembly would cost ? Hugues Belanger Tel: 905.973.9400 Bill Sidhipong wrote: > Mike Ingle wrote: > > > - unit price > > Qty 5-week 2-week 1-week 4-day 3-day > > 25 $38.26 $52.80 $65.04 $76.13 $107.12 > > 100 $14.99 $20.69 $25.49 $29.84 $41.98 > > 200 $11.12 $15.34 $18.90 $22.12 $31.12 > > I like 200/{2,5}-week price :) Now, how much are the component cost and > assembly going to add to this total? If we can get enough people > interested, we could pull this off. > > -- > Bill Sidhipong > AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 > One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 > Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 04:13:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA19576 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:13:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA19572 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:13:24 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f214.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.214]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS700125Q6B5W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:13:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 51495 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 02:13:12 +0000 Received: from 24.200.14.94 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:13:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:13:12 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330021312.51494.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >[Is this a deja vu, or did we already have this discussion ?] Partly. I posted a follow-up to the mail you posted, but it never got answered... sorry about all that. Let me tell you about the project I'm in. We want to make a car multimedia system; same size as a standard radio (the standard is called EuroDin, I think), but with the same capabilities as a PDA and some more features: mp3 decoding (of course :)) with visual, FM receiver, web browsing, email, music organisation (playlists, hotlists...), limited voice recognition (for starting an application, starting a playlist...), visualisation of the music... A ~6in colour LCD wil be included, too. The KSB offers almost all I need. However, FM and the GPS receiver lacks. As I want the customers to chose if they want them (that is, maybe the custommers won't need or want the FM receiver or GPS header), they need to be kind of 'plug-in'. One thing I want to say, just to make it clear, is that I don't want the actual GPS in the player; just the header, that is, the interface that talks to the actual GPS. But if some can connects direclty thru RS232, like you said, that's gonna be perfect, since no additional hardware will need to be designed. I currently have no chip for the FM receiver in mind; I just know what I want it to support: full RDS and RBDS capability. I was in the process of finding a company to design a StrongARM board with all those specs for me when I heard of the LART. If I could use it, it would sure save a lot of money :) Full credit would be given to it, and to the guys behind it, of course. So, all this stuff sounds possible? Simon >Not quite a board, I want to use a GPS module (like >http://www.chapmantech.com/OEM). As it connects thru RS232, you >could even >connect it to a bare LART. > > that would mean that this one is being developed with the low > >connector, since it obviously needs a display? I would be highly >interested > >in that one. > >I can image applications (such as route logging) that don't require a >display. > > > I would also need an FM receiver. I think the best (but not the less > >costy :)) way would be to develop a low-connection board for it, right? > >Depends, what FM receiver chipset did you have in mind ? > > >Would it be possible to have the GPS header and the FM receiver on the >same > >low-connection board? Thanks in advance. > >GPS needn't have anything to do with the low speed bus, see above. > >JDB. > >-- >They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may >be slow, but he'll eventually get them. > -- Matthew Lammers in ASR > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 04:36:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA19619 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:36:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA19615 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:36:52 +0200 Received: from email.ancore.com (host13.ancore.com [204.118.176.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS7000OER9FLG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:36:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from sweety (adsl-63-193-113-118.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.193.113.118]) by email.ancore.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id G10N19MY; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:33:42 -0800 Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:34:12 -0800 From: Mike Ingle work Subject: Re: PCB quote from US To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <00ab01bf99f0$b70370c0$7671c13f@local.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <4.2.0.58.20000329125407.00a3c3c0@email.ancore.com> <38E28112.D29861D2@axysdesign.com> <38E207A2.CB54A70@cgocable.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Greg Fountain is looking into this according to previous post. In fact I only posted the advanced circuits quote for his/ or any one elses interest. I also would prefer to buy assembled boards/kit, although I will assemble my own if need be. Mike PS my apology regarding the quote in HTML, I simply copied it from their web site quickly. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hugues Belanger To: Bill Sidhipong Cc: LART Mailling list Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 5:39 AM Subject: Re: PCB quote from US > I'm interested, but I'd like to purchase assembled boards... does anyone know > how much parts & assembly would cost ? > > Hugues Belanger > > Tel: 905.973.9400 > > > Bill Sidhipong wrote: > > > Mike Ingle wrote: > > > > > - unit price > > > Qty 5-week 2-week 1-week 4-day 3-day > > > 25 $38.26 $52.80 $65.04 $76.13 $107.12 > > > 100 $14.99 $20.69 $25.49 $29.84 $41.98 > > > 200 $11.12 $15.34 $18.90 $22.12 $31.12 > > > > I like 200/{2,5}-week price :) Now, how much are the component cost and > > assembly going to add to this total? If we can get enough people > > interested, we could pull this off. > > > > -- > > Bill Sidhipong > > AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 7539663 > > One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 7539661 > > Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: bs@axysdesign.com > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 04:46:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA19635 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:46:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA19631 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:46:52 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS700154RQ3LF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:46:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id VAA15868 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:46:50 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:46:49 -0500 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff In-reply-to: "Your message of Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:13:12 PST." <20000330021312.51494.qmail@hotmail.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200003300246.VAA15868@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Simon, > Let me tell you about the project I'm in. We want to make a car multimedia > system; same size as a standard radio (the standard is called EuroDin, I > think), but with the same capabilities as a PDA and some more features: mp3 > decoding (of course :)) with visual, FM receiver, web browsing, email, music > organisation (playlists, hotlists...), limited voice recognition (for > starting an application, starting a playlist...), visualisation of the > music... A ~6in colour LCD wil be included, too. This sounds a lot like the empeg-car: http://www.empeg.com/ It is also StrongARM-based, which is actually how I came to be interested in LART. (I am currently experimenting with some GPS and CDPD support for the empeg.) > So, all this stuff sounds possible? Not only should it be possible, I'd be very interested either to help you or to watch your progress. However, I admit I am not much of a hardware person. LART interests me because I might be able to learn something about real hardware details, at least perhaps as a possible pet project. On the other hand, I have written a fixed-point implementation of an MPEG audio (MP3) decoder from scratch which runs brilliantly on the SA-1100. Do you have a web site or mailing list for your project? Cheers, -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 06:40:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA20288 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:40:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA20284 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:40:00 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f180.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS7003K5WYM4J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:39:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 97877 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:39:48 +0000 Received: from 24.200.14.94 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330043948.97876.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >This sounds a lot like the empeg-car: > > http://www.empeg.com/ > Yes, I know. The Empeg is a GREAT product. I remember reading the web page of Hugo about his car mp3 player; I've been working (or thinking :)) of a commercial player like that from that day (but don't we all do? :)) >(I am currently experimenting with some GPS and CDPD support for the >empeg.) That sounds cool. Could I have more details? >Not only should it be possible, I'd be very interested either to help >you >or >to watch your progress. Be sure that I'll remember that one :) Hehe. I'll probably try to put up some sort of web page for my project; I just don't know when. The more rapidly the better of course :) Until that time, i'll try to keep you in touch. > >However, I admit I am not much of a hardware person. LART interests >me >because >I might be able to learn something about real hardware details, at >least >perhaps as a possible pet project. I'm more of a software type myself, too. I never even thought about designing such a board as the LART; I was going to make a company design it for me when I found it. I'm glad I did, I'm just so sure that it could be used for my project! >On the other hand, I have written a fixed-point implementation of an >MPEG >audio (MP3) decoder from scratch which runs brilliantly on the >SA-1100. My software currently use XAudio (www.xaudio.com) as it supports the ARM natively; however, i still had no chance of testing my code on an ARM processor, so I don't know yet how good it performs. >Do you have a web site or mailing list for your project? Not for now, like I said. Hope I will soon :) Simon P.S.: Could someone tell me what I'm doing wrong when replying messages? When I reply the message is not indexed to the thread, it creates a new one... I just hit reply then change the email address for the LART mailing list address. What's wrong? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 06:42:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA20303 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:42:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA20299 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:42:56 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f316.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.191]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS7003LYX3J4J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:42:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 72561 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:42:44 +0000 Received: from 24.200.14.94 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:42:44 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:42:44 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330044244.72560.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Salut Simon, Bien le boujour Hugues :) >I have a friend who as been interested in producing the same thing, >he has >been involve with local engineers in design a mp3 codec chip. >I forworded >this e-mail to him I'm sure you will hear from him That's very cool :) Be sure that I really appreciate it. >Au revoir... À la prochaine :) Simon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 06:45:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA20318 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:45:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA20314 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:45:07 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f269.hotmail.com [216.32.180.227]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS70030IX76NT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:45:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 43457 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 04:44:55 +0000 Received: from 195.197.15.62 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:44:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:44:55 +0100 (EEST) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: Re: PCB quote from US To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330044455.43456.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.15.62] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk We are interested in too. Greg, what is the situation? Mika >From: Mike Ingle work >To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Subject: Re: PCB quote from US >Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:34:12 -0800 > >Greg Fountain is looking into this according to previous post. In fact I >only posted the advanced circuits quote for his/ or any one elses interest. >I also would prefer to buy assembled boards/kit, although I will assemble >my >own if need be. > >Mike >PS my apology regarding the quote in HTML, I simply copied it from their >web site quickly. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Hugues Belanger >To: Bill Sidhipong >Cc: LART Mailling list >Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 5:39 AM >Subject: Re: PCB quote from US > > > > I'm interested, but I'd like to purchase assembled boards... does anyone >know > > how much parts & assembly would cost ? > > > > Hugues Belanger > > > > Tel: 905.973.9400 > > > > > > Bill Sidhipong wrote: > > > > > Mike Ingle wrote: > > > > > > > - unit price > > > > Qty 5-week 2-week 1-week 4-day 3-day > > > > 25 $38.26 $52.80 $65.04 $76.13 $107.12 > > > > 100 $14.99 $20.69 $25.49 $29.84 $41.98 > > > > 200 $11.12 $15.34 $18.90 $22.12 $31.12 > > > > > > I like 200/{2,5}-week price :) Now, how much are the component cost >and > > > assembly going to add to this total? If we can get enough people > > > interested, we could pull this off. > > > > > > -- > > > Bill Sidhipong > > > AXYS Design Automation, Inc. Telephone: +1 949 >7539663 > > > One Technology Drive Fax: +1 949 >7539661 > > > Building i-807, Irvine CA 92618 mailto: >bs@axysdesign.com > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 07:02:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA20356 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:02:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA20352 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:02:15 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law-f310.hotmail.com [209.185.131.14]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS70033EXZQT7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:02:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 74240 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 05:02:03 +0000 Received: from 164.164.56.2 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:02:03 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:02:03 -0800 (PST) From: chaman bagga Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330050203.74239.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [164.164.56.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Thanks for all the replies that I have got. From the discussion it appears that the keyboard and mouse connectors on the usb line. Wouldn't it be better to use the serial ports of SA1100 to connect a standard so called AT keyboard and a PS2 mouse? Any pointers to existing circuits? (Eg. http://www.beyondlogic.org/ ) Regards, Chaman. >From: "Gennadiy M. Kurtsman" >To: "chaman bagga" , >Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse >Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:26:54 +0400 > >This configuration is workable but you need in special PC software driver, >retranslating keyboard/mouse data to SA1100. >GK. > >-----Original Message----- >From: chaman bagga >To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl >Date: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 2:04 PM >Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse > > > > > >That implies SA1100 cannot read directly from keyboard/mouse. Only when >it > >is connected to PC's host usb port, the data can be transferred first to >PC > >which can then transfer it to SA1100 USB port.. am I right? > > > >Regards, > >Chaman Bagga. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 07:10:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA20380 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:10:36 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA20376 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:10:35 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA05165; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:10:32 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200003300510.HAA05165@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: agarwal_@hotmail.com (Simon Labrecque) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:10:32 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: <20000330043948.97876.qmail@hotmail.com> from "Simon Labrecque" at Mar 29, 2000 08:39:48 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Simon, > P.S.: Could someone tell me what I'm doing wrong when replying messages? > When I reply the message is not indexed to the thread, it creates a new > one... I just hit reply then change the email address for the LART mailing > list address. What's wrong? Is there maybe an option to do a group reply? As it is, there are no In-Reply-To or References headers in your posts. And trust me, I've looked for them: I just finished the code for the mailing list pages on www.lart.tudelft.nl. This is a typical header for one of your posts: Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330043948.97876.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Ah, maybe that explains something :) The other posts originating from hotmail start a new thread as well. It will probably work in the next version... -- Marc e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? __ __^__ __________ | \ +---/ \---+ (==========) |____\___________ +---\_____/---+ // >____)| | \__ \ \______//___ >/ |________| \ [ _____\ |____________________\ \_______/ Roger, go at throttle up CHR$(32), the final frontier ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 07:27:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA20464 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:27:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA20460 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:27:28 +0200 Received: from falla.videotron.net (falla.videotron.net [205.151.222.106]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS7003F2Z5SR2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:27:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from agmaincpu ([24.200.14.94]) by falla.videotron.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8) with SMTP id <0FS70046MYUH50@falla.videotron.net> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:20:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:24:56 -0500 From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000801bf9a08$4dc168c0$5e0ec818@videotron.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: MULTIPART/ALTERNATIVE; BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_gcwxnvI2HtLfMTojTGs9Vg)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_gcwxnvI2HtLfMTojTGs9Vg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Ok. I'll 'try' :) to use my normal mail account when I'm home, as I'm = sure having a new thread for each post I make is really annoying for = everybody. I make public excuses for that, guys. Simon Is there maybe an option to do a group reply? As it is, there are no In-Reply-To or References headers in your posts. And trust me, I've = looked for them: I just finished the code for the mailing list pages on www.lart.tudelft.nl. This is a typical header for one of your posts: Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330043948.97876.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=3Dflowed X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Ah, maybe that explains something :) The other posts originating = from hotmail start a new thread as well. It will probably work in the next version... --Boundary_(ID_gcwxnvI2HtLfMTojTGs9Vg) Content-type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
 
Ok. I'll 'try' :) to use my normal mail = account=20 when I'm home, as I'm sure having a new thread for each post I make is = really=20 annoying for everybody. I make public excuses for that, = guys.
 
Simon
 
  Is there maybe an option to do = a group=20 reply? As it is, there are no
In-Reply-To or References headers in = your=20 posts. And trust me, I've looked
for them: I just finished the code = for the=20 mailing list pages on
www.lart.tudelft.nl. This is a = typical=20 header for one of your posts:
 
Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 -0800 = (PST)
From: Simon Labrecque <agarwal_@hotmail.com>
Subj= ect:=20 Re: GPS and other stuff
To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl
Message-= id:=20 <20000330043948.978= 76.qmail@hotmail.com>
MIME-version:=20 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; format=3Dflowed
X-Originating-IP:=20 [24.200.14.94]
Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl=
Precedence:=20 bulk
 
>=20 ______________________________________________________
> Get = Your=20 Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
 
  Ah, maybe that explains = something :) The=20 other posts originating from
hotmail start a new thread as well. It = will=20 probably work in the = next
version...
--Boundary_(ID_gcwxnvI2HtLfMTojTGs9Vg)-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 07:58:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA20560 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:58:24 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA20556 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:58:23 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA05364; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:58:22 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200003300558.HAA05364@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: orb2000@videotron.ca (Simon Labrecque) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:58:22 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: <000801bf9a08$4dc168c0$5e0ec818@videotron.ca> from "Simon Labrecque" at Mar 30, 2000 12:24:56 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Simon, > Ok. I'll 'try' :) to use my normal mail account when I'm home, as I'm = > sure having a new thread for each post I make is really annoying for = > everybody. I make public excuses for that, guys. [snip pages of multipart M$-html] Please do... it's getting worse by the minute :) -- Marc e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? __ __^__ __________ | \ +---/ \---+ (==========) |____\___________ +---\_____/---+ // >____)| | \__ \ \______//___ >/ |________| \ [ _____\ |____________________\ \_______/ Roger, go at throttle up CHR$(32), the final frontier ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 08:41:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA20649 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:41:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA20645 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:41:14 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS80061W2KO2R@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:41:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id BAA16525 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:39:11 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:39:09 -0500 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff In-reply-to: "Your message of Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:39:48 PST." <20000330043948.97876.qmail@hotmail.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200003300639.BAA16525@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Yes, I know. The Empeg is a GREAT product. I remember reading the web page > of Hugo about his car mp3 player; I've been working (or thinking :)) of a > commercial player like that from that day (but don't we all do? :)) It is a great product. Hugo et al. have done an exceptional job. >> (I am currently experimenting with some GPS and CDPD support for the >> empeg.) > > That sounds cool. Could I have more details? I'm using a combined GPS/CDPD unit with a serial interface; it speaks PPP. The GPS data is obtained via simple UDP exchange. http://www.airlink.com/info/pin_mkt.html It's very nice, but not cheap; the retail price is $925 including GPS antenna, power cord, and mounting bracket. However, if interested I can obtain units at a discount. > Be sure that I'll remember that one :) Hehe. I'll probably try to put up > some sort of web page for my project; I just don't know when. The more > rapidly the better of course :) Until that time, i'll try to keep you in > touch. Great, thanks much. > My software currently use XAudio (www.xaudio.com) as it supports the ARM > natively; however, i still had no chance of testing my code on an ARM > processor, so I don't know yet how good it performs. FWIW, the empeg is also using Xaudio. If you prefer, you're welcome to use my code; it's released under GPL. The Layer III decoding is presently slower than Xaudio's decoder, but there are specific optimizations I haven't completed yet. Layer II decoding is presently *faster* than Xaudio (and both layers share the same CPU-intensive subband synthesis routine...) Cheers, -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 10:29:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA20854 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:29:19 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA20850 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:29:18 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA11552; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:29:15 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:29:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003300829.KAA11552@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: agarwal_@hotmail.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff In-Reply-To: <20000330044244.72560.qmail@hotmail.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:42:44 -0800 (PST), Simon Labrecque wrote: >>I have a friend who as been interested in producing the same thing, >he has >>been involve with local engineers in design a mp3 codec chip. >I forworded >>this e-mail to him I'm sure you will hear from him > > That's very cool :) Be sure that I really appreciate it. It's certainly very cool, but I'm a bit confused: what is meant by the word "codec"? In the strict sense it means "encoder plus decoder", but quite often people just mean "decoder". If it is just a decoder: Nicolas Pitre released a fixed point version of splay[1] that runs at about 4% CPU time on a Netwinder. The gain of using an mp3 decoder chip is very little compared to the software solution. If it is also an encoder, I can see that there is something to win, although I think the SA-1100 is fast enough to do at least layer 2 compression. Don't underestimate the SA-1100 speed! To give an example of the SA-1100 speed: We have done H.263 video decoding at 15 frames per second without optimizing the decoder. As this is a memory intensive process, a lot of speed can be gained by keeping the data cache hot. Another example: A carefully implemented (read: hand coded) DFT implementation running on a 220MHz SA-1100 is almost as fast as a 60MHz Shark DSP (correct me if I'm wrong, JDB). Erik [1] Get it at ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ -- "people are still using Win98? Wow... VMS i could understand, but WinXX - that's just so passe..." -- Paul Jakma on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 10:56:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA20958 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:56:30 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA20954 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:56:29 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA11648; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:45:58 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:45:58 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003300845.KAA11648@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: chamanbagga@hotmail.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: usb keyboard/mouse In-Reply-To: <20000330050203.74239.qmail@hotmail.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:02:03 -0800 (PST), chaman bagga wrote: > Thanks for all the replies that I have got. >>From the discussion it appears that the keyboard and mouse connectors on the > usb line. > Wouldn't it be better to use the serial ports of SA1100 to connect a > standard so called AT keyboard and a PS2 mouse? I think you misunderstood. It is not possible to connect USB keyboards and mouses directly to the SA-1100 simply because it is a USB client and not a USB master. The trick with a PC USB master forwarding all keyboard and mouse data to the SA-1100 also fails because of the silicon errors in the SA-1100. However, the KSB has an AT keyboard and PS/2 mouse interface implemented in one of the Lattice CPLDs, have a look at page 2 of the KSB schematics. For even more evidence that the connectors really exist ;-), have look at the KSB picture: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/gallery/ksb-back.jpg There is no need to use a serial port for keyboard/mouse, although you're free to do so. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 17:08:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22076 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:08:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA22072 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:08:03 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f67.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.67]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FS800J1WQ1DVY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:08:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 80527 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:41:10 +0000 Received: from 206.167.109.2 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:41:10 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:41:10 -0800 (PST) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000330144110.80526.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [206.167.109.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [Mass reply, since I'm not home and don't want to create 39 threads again :)] Marc: >Hi Simon, >>Ok. I'll 'try' :) to use my normal mail account when I'm home, as >>I'm = >>sure having a new thread for each post I make is really annoying >>for = >>everybody. I make public excuses for that, guys. > [snip pages of multipart M$-html] > > Please do... it's getting worse by the minute :) Yeah I know... I've sent this one using Outlook, but it was set with HTML and MIME. It's now set to plain text. It should *finally* be alright. I promise :) Rob: >I'm using a combined GPS/CDPD unit with a serial interface; it speaks >PPP. >The GPS data is obtained via simple UDP exchange. > http://www.airlink.com/info/pin_mkt.html >It's very nice, but not cheap; the retail price is $925 including GPS > >antenna, power cord, and mounting bracket. However, if interested I >can >obtain units at a discount. This thing is sure nice! However, I would like to make the internet connection of my project thru a cellular phone that directly supports it; I think those communicate with RS232 too. Is there some *cheap* GPS that connects thru RS232 beside that one? (Just to know if it would be a good way to procede for connecting a GPS to my project). >FWIW, the empeg is also using Xaudio. Yes, it does. >If you prefer, you're welcome to use my code; it's released under >GPL. The >Layer III decoding is presently slower than Xaudio's decoder, but >there >are specific optimizations I haven't completed yet. Layer II >decoding is >presently *faster* than Xaudio (and both layers share the >same >CPU-intensive subband synthesis routine...) I'll sure look into it once I get my testing board. Erik: >>I have a friend who as been interested in producing the same thing, >>he >>has >>been involve with local engineers in design a mp3 codec chip. >I >> >>forworded >>this e-mail to him I'm sure you will hear from him >>>That's very cool :) Be sure that I really appreciate it. >It's certainly very cool, but I'm a bit confused: what is meant by >word >"codec"? In the strict sense it means "encoder plus decoder", >but quite >often people just mean "decoder". >If it is just a decoder: Nicolas Pitre released a fixed point version >of >splay[1] that runs at about 4% CPU time on a Netwinder. The gain >of using >an mp3 decoder chip is very little compared to the software >solution. I agree with you. After thinking about it: I don't want an mp3 decoder chip, since I want to be able to easily add new standards as they arrive (ie: MP4?). That would not be possible if the decoding is done in hardware. The performance you mention about splay is very impressive. Does someone knows how good the XAudio lib performs under an ARM? >If it is also an encoder, I can see that there is something to win, >although I think the SA-1100 is fast enough to do at least layer 2 >compression. Don't underestimate the SA-1100 speed! Same argument as above here. Anyways, since the easiest way of transferring files (mp3) to my project would be to connect it to a PC (any opinions here guys?), the compression should be done there. Please be sure that I don't underestimate the SA-1100; however, I've not had a chance to test one by now. I hope it will change soon :) >To give an example of the SA-1100 speed: We have done H.263 video >decoding >at 15 frames per second without optimizing the decoder. As this is a >memory intensive process, a lot of speed can be gained by keeping the >data >cache hot. >Another example: A carefully implemented (read: hand coded) DFT >implementation running on a 220MHz SA-1100 is almost as fast as a >60MHz >Shark DSP (correct me if I'm wrong, JDB). Very impressive. I like hearing about applications and performances of this processor :) Thanks for for the help! Simon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 18:24:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA22245 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 18:24:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA22241 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 18:24:00 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS8002I2TJZW0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 18:24:00 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:15:09 -0500 (EST) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: GPS and other stuff In-reply-to: <200003300639.BAA16525@deimos.mars.org> To: Rob Leslie Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Rob Leslie wrote: > FWIW, the empeg is also using Xaudio. > > If you prefer, you're welcome to use my code; it's released under GPL. The > Layer III decoding is presently slower than Xaudio's decoder, but there are > specific optimizations I haven't completed yet. Layer II decoding is presently > *faster* than Xaudio (and both layers share the same CPU-intensive subband > synthesis routine...) Where is your code? I hacked splay about a year ago for fixed point math support. Layer III is also slower than xaudio, but carefully listening to xaudio quality seemed like if they were cheating a little on channel balancing. Maybe we could share our work? Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 19:04:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22356 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:04:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22352 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:04:24 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS8004KKVFAL5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:04:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id MAA18541 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 12:00:05 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 12:00:04 -0500 From: Rob Leslie Subject: MPEG audio decoding In-reply-to: "Your message of Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:15:09 EST." To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200003301700.MAA18541@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> If you prefer, you're welcome to use my code; it's released under GPL. The >> Layer III decoding is presently slower than Xaudio's decoder, but there are >> specific optimizations I haven't completed yet. Layer II decoding is >> presently *faster* than Xaudio (and both layers share the same >> CPU-intensive subband synthesis routine...) > > Where is your code? http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ > I hacked splay about a year ago for fixed point math support. Layer III > is also slower than xaudio, but carefully listening to xaudio quality > seemed like if they were cheating a little on channel balancing. > Maybe we could share our work? I'd be interested in this. I looked for fixed-point implementations before I started this project but couldn't find any that suited my needs. (I didn't know about splay -- nice work.) I don't know about "channel balancing" but I did discover that the Xaudio decoder has a problem decoding bitstreams encoded with both M/S and intensity joint stereo. The effect of this is a rapidly fading-in/out sound on the right channel with certain bitstreams. Apparently Xaudio is not alone; many decoders (and encoders) handle M/S + intensity inconsistently. Even the ISO reference source goes against the standard, which may be how so many implementations came to have this problem. I suspect it will be possible to make my code run at least as fast as the Xaudio decoder for all layers on the StrongARM. At the moment it definitely requires less memory. -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 19:53:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA22668 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:53:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22664 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:53:13 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS8006FNXONUC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:53:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.104) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:43:37 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:36:35 -0800 From: Derek Lassen Subject: GPS cheaper X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000330091357.00ae2900@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I just joined this list, so I am not sure if you want boards or pods. Time Line Inc.. has the Rockwell Jupiter GPS board for $69. See http://www.digisys.net/timeline/arrival.html (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 20:20:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA22765 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:20:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA22761 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:20:37 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS8007DLYYAX8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:20:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id KAA601901 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:15:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:15:30 -0800 From: Greg Fountain Subject: PC Board Gerbers & FAB To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38E399C2.F54B1FF@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------943C514B4804ADC933914624" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------943C514B4804ADC933914624 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I plugged the Rev 3 Mainboard Gerber Files into my viewer here and came up with a few things that I would like someone else to double check. In particular those layers that are marked with the "Need Second Opinion" Please let me know, I don't want to send the files out for FAB if there are labeling or incorrect polarity problems. Nothing worse than getting your boards back and finding there is an open or dead short on the power and ground planes because you inverted a layer by accident. Assumption: To avoid the possibility of confusing the PC Board fabricator, all Gerber file should be of the same polarity (either + or -) Requiring a mix of the two increases the chances of a PC Board fab shop mistake on one of the layers. Layers were reviewed using GC-Prevew V8.1.2 Gerber files below were produced from the LARTdist-0_95.tar distribution ===================================== File Name ;My own personal comments l1_mask.gbr ;Top layer solder mask ;Looks like about a 0.002" setback from pad edge ;Should be OK l1_neg.gbr ;Looks strange ! :Neg Image of Core power plane?? ;Need a second opinion !!! l1_pos.gbr ;Looks Good (normal Positive Image) ;Top layer Pads and Traces ;Xtal foot prints mistake was corrected l1_silk.gbr ;Top side of board silk screen ;Looks Good l2_neg.gbr ;3.3 Volt Power Plane? ;Contains thermal relief pads ;Need Positive of this if the ;entire set is to be positive images? ;Need a second opinion !!! l2_pos.gbr ;3.3 Volt Power Plane? ;Note NO THERMAL RELIEFS ;Need Second opinion !!! l3_neg.gbr ;Solid sheet of copper ;No Pads or Traces ;Need Second opinion !!! l3_pos.gbr ;Layer 3 signal lines ;Positive Image ;Looks good l4_neg.gbr ;negative image of Core Power Plane? ;Need second opinion !!! l4_pos.gbr ;Positive image of layer 4 inner traces ;Looks good l5_neg.gbr ;Negative image of system ground plane ;Layer 5 label visible ;Contains thermal relief's on ground pins ;Should this be a + image if we want ;The same image polarity (+) on the entire set? ;Need second opinion !!! l5_pos.gbr ;Negative of 3.3 V Ground Plane with no ;Thermal reliefs? ; need second opinion? l6_silk.gbr ; Bottom side side solder mask ;Looks good l6_neg.gbr ;Negative of ARM core power Plane??? ;Need second opinion !!! l6_pos.gbr ;Positive image of the traces and pads on ;the bottom side of the board ;Looks good l6_silk.gbr ;Positive image of the bottom side silk screen ;Looks Good ======================================== Greg Fountain Menlo Park, California USA --------------943C514B4804ADC933914624 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------943C514B4804ADC933914624-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 20:48:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA22868 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:48:58 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA22862; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:48:54 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E399C2.F54B1FF@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:48:28 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PC Board Gerbers & FAB Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Assumption: >To avoid the possibility of confusing the PC Board fabricator, all >Gerber file should be of the same polarity (either + or -) Requiring a >mix of the two increases the chances of a PC Board fab shop mistake on >one of the layers. Nope. One layer can be constructed from multiple Gerber files. The general cases are one Gerber (regular) or two Gerbers, one negative and one positive. Traditionally the pos + neg Gerbers were combined photographically, these days it's done electronically. There is the possibility in extended Gerber (RS274X) to combine both positive and negative into one file, though. All copper layers in LART are composed by overlaying l[x]_pos.gbr and l[x]_neg.gbr. >===================================== >File Name ;My own personal comments > >l1_mask.gbr ;Top layer solder mask > ;Looks like about a 0.002" setback from pad edge > ;Should be OK > >l1_neg.gbr ;Looks strange ! > :Neg Image of Core power plane?? > ;Need a second opinion !!! See above. >l2_neg.gbr ;3.3 Volt Power Plane? > ;Contains thermal relief pads > ;Need Positive of this if the > ;entire set is to be positive images? > ;Need a second opinion !!! > >l2_pos.gbr ;3.3 Volt Power Plane? > ;Note NO THERMAL RELIEFS Not for vias, no. >l5_neg.gbr ;Negative image of system ground plane > ;Layer 5 label visible > ;Contains thermal relief's on ground pins > ;Should this be a + image if we want > ;The same image polarity (+) on the entire set? There's no reason to have the same polarity in the entire set. Here's a suggested preview procedure: - load all Gerbers into gcprevue - mark all Gerbers that have 'neg' in the name as negative - view all combos l[x]_pos.gbr and l[x]_neg.gbr as an overlay, with 'pos' on top - iff this doesn't match the image in l[x].ps, panic. As I said in the README, it is wise to print all .ps files and send them to the board house as a way of saying 'this is how I want them'. JDB [happily running two LARTs generated from the .gbr files in the archive] -- Remember, when you pull his pin, Mr. Hand Grenade stops being your friend. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Mar 30 20:59:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA22944 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:59:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA22940 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:59:37 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS9009810RBU0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:59:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id H98Y7JWK; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:50:19 -0800 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:57:12 -0800 From: Varek Subject: Prefab boards To: LART list Message-id: <38E3A388.B23DDCCA@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Most lists I've been on like you introduce yourself so - hello, my name is Varek. I only just found this project a couple of weeks ago and find it very interesting, but from a SW perspective. In other words I'm interested in pre-fabbed boards if they are available - specifically the MB and the KSB. The level of my interest will, of course, depend on the final price. Anyone have any figures (even rough) for this yet? Can anyone tell me (or estimate) what the cost of the parts list is (in $US)? Thanx much and keep up the good work! Also, great pics on the site. I'd love to see more! Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 01:31:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA24605 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:31:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA24601 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:31:46 +0200 Received: from fermi.eeel.nist.gov (fermi.eeel.nist.gov [129.6.185.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS900KGBDCX1R@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:31:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from mclay@localhost) by fermi.eeel.nist.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA07980; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:33:29 -0500 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 20:33:26 -0500 (EST) From: Michael McLay Subject: collaboration proposal In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Lart Mail Server Cc: DieterBergman@ipc.org, RKorchak@mep.nist.gov, Dino Ditta Message-id: <14564.102.26787.240089@fermi.eeel.nist.gov> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: VM 6.71 under 21.1 (patch 3) "Acadia" XEmacs Lucid Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <38E399C2.F54B1FF@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Proposal for a Short Production Run of LART Assemblies The IPC (http://www.ipc.org/) has developed GenCAM as a replacement for gerber, drill files, netlists, assembly drawings, etc. A GenCAM file can hold the complete description of a PCB/PCA as well as panels, fixtures, and test configurations. The core document of the GenCAM standard is IPC-2511. Th 198 page specification is available at http://www.gencam.org/cdrom2000/standards/ipc2511_1.5.9.pdf. The IPC-2511 is just one block in the IPC 2500 series. Another standard will define a virtual factory protocol for communications between OEMs and EMSs. A goal of the GenCAM standards is to reduce the one-time engineering costs of setting up for the manufacture of boards and assemblies. This is precisely the NRE cost problem faced by the LART community. Another goal of GenCAM is to lower the costs and the risks associated with engineering change orders. LART faces these problem as well. Different daughter boards will be used in future production runs, parts will be changed out, and revised designs of the main board will occur. The IPC Data Transfer Solutions committee is ready to start testing the file formats and protocols. The committee has plans for developing a demonstration board for GenCAM. The LART design and user requirements could fill this role. LART is a good choice because the size is relatively small and has relatively inexpensive parts. The GenCAM file supports the representation of multi-board assemblies and test fixturing so including daughter boards in a design file could be used to demonstrate panel definitions. Having identified LART as a good test vehicle the next step is to determine if there is an interest in a collaborative arrangement between potential purchaser of LART assemblies. Please let me know if you would be interested in participating in this virtual prototyping experiment. The trick to making this project work will be in coordinating the testing activities of the ICM project with the production needs of LART "customers". The ICM project would manage the production of the assemblies and LART users would get the assemblies (We would need to work out the details, but I assume the assemblies would be made available at cost of the materials from the manufacturers.) The ICM project and IPC will help arrange for the production as part of the testing process for the protocols. Some thought will have to be given to minimizing the delays as we work out the bugs in the process. The first test would be designed to demonstrate the use of the GenCAM file format. A batch of LART assemblies would be produced by converting the LART design files to the GenCAM file format. J.D. Bakker writes: > The current LART design is in EDWin (an obscure Win16-based package). I'm > not too sure if there's a workable way to export to OrCAD/Protel/whatever. > > JDB. Are the EDWin files available. The CAMCAD converter from Router Solutions (http://www.rsi-inc.com/) may be able to transfer the design to the GenCAM format. There are many details that would have to be worked out. Before committing to the project we need to determine if it is likely to produce the desired results. please let me know if you think this project is worth pursuing. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 01:49:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA24651 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:49:11 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA24647 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:49:10 +0200 Received: from mail.nulec.com.au ([203.102.220.26]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS900KBCE5WRK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 01:49:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by MAIL with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:46:51 +1000 Content-return: allowed Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:46:47 +1000 From: Robert Barnes Subject: RE: collaboration proposal To: "'Michael McLay'" Cc: "Lart Mail Server (E-mail)" Message-id: <1072F1A27E99D3119747005004B9A3803EDF38@MAIL> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Michael, I am prepared to commit to 3 LART boards or boards to the value of $USD900 (whichever is cheapest). I would also commit to an equal number of Kitchen Sink Boards if available. Regards, Rob Barnes -----Original Message----- From: Michael McLay [mailto:mclay@nist.gov] Sent: Friday, 31 March 2000 11:33 To: J.D. Bakker Cc: Lart Mail Server; DieterBergman@ipc.org; RKorchak@mep.nist.gov; Dino Ditta Subject: collaboration proposal Proposal for a Short Production Run of LART Assemblies [snipped] -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 02:13:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA24764 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 02:13:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA24760 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 02:13:23 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FS900L24FA9OD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 02:13:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id QAA722556 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:08:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:08:04 -0800 From: Greg Fountain Subject: [Fwd: PC Board Gerbers & FAB] To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38E3EC64.F63FE506@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------8C0710297E16E3D832FDD70E" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------8C0710297E16E3D832FDD70E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --------------8C0710297E16E3D832FDD70E Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 Message-ID: <38E3EB30.11A69517@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:02:57 -0800 From: Greg Fountain Reply-To: greg.fountain@telvex.com Organization: Telvex X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PC Board Gerbers & FAB References: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------B68D56B6DCBD5FDD6AD752CC" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B68D56B6DCBD5FDD6AD752CC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit J.D. I merged the gerber layers as you suggested and they look much better. I didn't have a postscript printer handy to dump the images on so I had not actually viewed the *.ps files prior to my earlier e-mail. I was wondering what is the advantage of using multiple files to produce a single layer of copper? Just off the top of my head it would seem that a single file per layer would be a lot simpler. If it's of value to anyone I've converted all the postscript Gerber files to PDFs (so that they may now be viewed with a web browser). Let me know if their is any interest in getting copies in Adobe PDF format. Looking at the mainboard bottom side Photograph I didn't happen to see any copper pour area under the StrongARM processor. Was this added in Rev 3. or am I reading the layer or photo incorrectly? Have you noticed how close some of the pad & trace clearances are to the copper pour areas? (Layers 1 & 6) If you take a close look at C10 and C1 on the bottom side for example the via to pour clearance is only about 0.003" and T3's connecting via has a pad to copper pour clearance of about 0.001" Do you think this might cause problems if the boards exhibits any degree of incomplete etching during fabrication? It would appear that the board was either hand routed or used in conjunction with a grid based router ... is this correct? Greg "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > >Assumption: > >To avoid the possibility of confusing the PC Board fabricator, all > >Gerber file should be of the same polarity (either + or -) Requiring a > >mix of the two increases the chances of a PC Board fab shop mistake on > >one of the layers. > > Nope. > > One layer can be constructed from multiple Gerber files. The general cases > are one Gerber (regular) or two Gerbers, one negative and one positive. > Traditionally the pos + neg Gerbers were combined photographically, these > days it's done electronically. There is the possibility in extended Gerber > (RS274X) to combine both positive and negative into one file, though. --------------B68D56B6DCBD5FDD6AD752CC Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------B68D56B6DCBD5FDD6AD752CC-- --------------8C0710297E16E3D832FDD70E Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------8C0710297E16E3D832FDD70E-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 03:09:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24905 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 03:09:55 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA24900; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 03:09:51 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E3EC64.F63FE506@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 03:09:24 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PC Board Gerbers & FAB Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Greg, >I was wondering what is the advantage of using multiple files to produce a >single layer of copper? Just off the top of my head it would seem that a >single >file per layer would be a lot simpler. That's true, but it so happens that my CAD tools produces two files. I'm contemplating merging the two files into one RS274X file; OTOH that may introduce errors, and I *know* that the two-file approach works. In other words: I prefer a clumsy method over one that might cause bugs. >If it's of value to anyone I've converted all the postscript Gerber files to >PDFs (so that they may now be viewed with a web browser). Let me know if their >is any interest in getting copies in Adobe PDF format. Creating one big PDF is om my list, as is adding correct PostScript headers to the PS files so that Illustrator stops complaining about them. >Looking at the mainboard bottom side Photograph I didn't happen to see any >copper pour area under the StrongARM processor. Was this added in Rev 3. or am >I reading the layer or photo incorrectly? You're reading the (Rev1) photo just fine, the copper pour was added for the Rev3 PCB (to shield the audio section on the KSB). > Have you noticed how close some of >the pad & trace clearances are to the copper pour areas? (Layers 1 & 6) >If you >take a close look at C10 and C1 on the bottom side for example the via to pour >clearance is only about 0.003" and T3's connecting via has a pad to copper >pour >clearance of about 0.001" Do you think this might cause problems if the >boards >exhibits any degree of incomplete etching during fabrication? That's OK; those traces/vias are on the same potential (GND) as the copper pour. As the copper pour is a redundant ground plane it doesn't matter electrically. So actually the clearance should be reduced to zero; I'm trying to teach my Gerber parser about this (without adding unwanted shorts, obviously). >It would appear that the board was either hand routed or used in conjunction >with a grid based router ... is this correct? Yes; every single trace on the LART is hand-routed (using a .3mm grid for maximum density in the buses). Actually routing and placing happened at the same time; I used back annotations a lot to optimize trace lengths. That explains the funky address bus connections to the Flash, btw. I hope this clarifies matters; you know where to find me if it doensn't ;-) JD 'bedtime' B. -- "There is a style of design I call "wishful thinking engineering." It starts with something like "pigs can fly if you feed them enough beans" and develops utopian plans such as like having everyone commute to work riding on personal pigs, and along the way ignores minor details such as the consequent rain of the non-gaseous byproducts." (Vernon Schryver in n.a.n-a.e) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 11:04:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25902 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:04:00 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25898 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:03:59 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:02:07 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: KSB audio working ! Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, Just a short status update: I've finally made the audio DAC on the Kitchen Sink Board produce something other than static or silence. It appears that just following the data sheet isn't enough; you must use the serial interface and explicitly switch it to I2C mode. After the weekend I'll get started on the IDE interface (which should be a breeze, right Nicolas ?) JD 'happy happy joy joy' B. -- Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 12:15:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26078 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:15:46 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26073 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:15:46 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA19508; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:15:45 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:15:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200003311015.MAA19508@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: KSB audio working ! In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:02:07 +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote: > Just a short status update: I've finally made the audio DAC on the Kitchen > Sink Board produce something other than static or silence. It appears that > just following the data sheet isn't enough; you must use the serial > interface and explicitly switch it to I2C mode. Cool! Is this still from the CPLD, or from the CPU? > After the weekend I'll get started on the IDE interface (which should be a > breeze, right Nicolas ?) Hey, I also want something to do! ;-) > -- > Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers. I'll bring my spare amplifier, do you have a spare pair of very loud speakers? Erik PS: JDB and I will share the last room, so we can make lots of noise without disturbing the others ;-) -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 12:51:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26174 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:51:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26170 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:51:06 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSA0002P8T47J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:51:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA00939 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 18:51:59 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA04699 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 18:44:35 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 18:45:14 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: subscribe To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38E481BA.2E307589@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk subscribe -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Mar 31 17:05:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26862 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:05:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26858 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:05:39 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSA00J0UKLCYG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:05:39 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 09:57:41 -0500 (EST) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: KSB audio working ! In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 31 Mar 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > Hi all, > > Just a short status update: I've finally made the audio DAC on the Kitchen > Sink Board produce something other than static or silence. It appears that > just following the data sheet isn't enough; you must use the serial > interface and explicitly switch it to I2C mode. Great! Has the Itsy driver been of some help? > After the weekend I'll get started on the IDE interface (which should be a > breeze, right Nicolas ?) I would say a click! :-) In theory, all you have to do is modify linux/include/asm/arch/ide.h. However I never tested IDE in 2.3.x kernels because the toys^H^H^H^Hhardware I currently have access to doesn't do IDE. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 1 20:56:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA30004 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 20:56:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA30000 for ; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 20:56:04 +0200 Received: from snail.ecs.umass.edu (snail.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.94]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSC00C26PXFNI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 20:56:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from odo.ecs.umass.edu (odo.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.174]) by snail.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA27811 for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 13:41:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (from mcrichto@localhost) by odo.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id NAA06297 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 13:41:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 13:41:03 -0500 From: Mark Crichton Subject: PCB info and other stuff To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: crichton@gimp.org Message-id: <20000401134103.B5319@odo.ecs.umass.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello, I was wondering if anyone has gotten farther in trying to get some PCBs mass produced and/or actually producing some complete LARTs. Also, I was wondering about adding TV capability to a LART. Has anyone got more experience with it? (I was looking at using some of Thompson Electronics ICs to do the work, but they seem to be powergrubbing little monsters. :( ) Lastly, looking at the pdf schematic for the LART, I was wodnering if the part number for the DRAM chips should be uPD4265165 and not uPD4264165. Thanks, Mark Crichton -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 1 23:59:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA30246 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 23:59:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA30242 for ; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 23:59:35 +0200 Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSC00FFMYFAUT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 23:59:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.10.0/8.9.3) with ESMTP id e31Ll2r27171 for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 16:47:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 09:48:39 +0000 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: What cna it do Now..! To: LART Mailling list Message-id: <38E5C5F6.2E0D2080@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13-7mdk i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Gents, I guess I should introduce myself, My name is Hugues (French name not misspell) I'm a Network Engineer from Toronto Canada... I'm really impress with to LART WOW what a bunch of smart people ... Bravo....!!! Ok. Enough sucking up... I'm more then interested in what you guys are doing I'd like to use this board as a base for my business... I've been working hard over the last month designing two product lines and I think that the LART has the potential to fit the bill for both projects.... But I'm going to be a little pushy, when do you think that the board will be usable for production system ? I need to know when the networking components will be useable ? Thanks Hugues -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 2 01:06:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA30626 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 01:06:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA30622 for ; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 01:06:15 +0200 Received: from lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com (ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSD00H0G1IELJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 01:06:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from utdallas.edu ([24.0.101.72]) by lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <20000401230347.VLPB18422.lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com@utdallas.edu> for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 15:03:47 -0800 Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 17:00:18 -0600 From: Bob Davis Subject: ISSI DRAM Parts To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <38E67F82.3040904@utdallas.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; N; Win98; en-US; m14) Netscape6/6.0b1 X-Accept-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl id BAA30623 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Under the LART.dist-README file it states that TSOP-II EDO DRAM chips are needed. I went to the issi web site and found that they offer 25,35,50, and 60 ns ram chips.  The manufacturer that i am using for the parts offers all versions at the same price.  Is there any preference of chips here?  Are there any that will not work? Thanks, Bob -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 2 03:32:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA30936 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 03:32:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA30932 for ; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 03:32:35 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSD00IJQ8A9PI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 03:32:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id UAA27092 for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 20:28:56 -0500 Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 20:28:55 -0500 From: Rob Leslie Subject: MPEG audio decoding In-reply-to: "Your message of Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:41:10 PST." <20000330144110.80526.qmail@hotmail.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004020128.UAA27092@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: >> If it is just a decoder: Nicolas Pitre released a fixed point version of >> splay that runs at about 4% CPU time on a Netwinder. The gain of using >> an mp3 decoder chip is very little compared to the software solution. Simon Labrecque replied: > I agree with you. After thinking about it: I don't want an mp3 decoder chip, > since I want to be able to easily add new standards as they arrive (ie: > MP4?). That would not be possible if the decoding is done in hardware. > > The performance you mention about splay is very impressive. Does someone > knows how good the XAudio lib performs under an ARM? I generated some statistics for the decoders I'm aware that will run under ARM. None of these are quite as impressive as 4% on the Netwinder, but I'm assuming this is a factor of the CPU (maybe Erik could elaborate?) The following shows the amount of CPU time required to decode the various MPEG audio layers as a percentage of audio real-time. The measurements were taken with some test bitstreams each longer than 4 minutes. CPU: StrongARM 1100 220MHz OS: Linux 2.2.14-rmk5-np17-empeg22 Layer Layer Layer decoder version I II III ---------------------------------------------------------------- [1] Xaudio 1.3.1 21% 25% 24% [2] MAD 0.10.0b 23% 22% 37% [3] splay-fixpoint 0.81 41% 36% 43% [1] http://www.xaudio.com/ (commercial) [2] http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ (GPL) [3] ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ (GPL/LGPL) As I mentioned, MAD's Layer III isn't fully optimized yet, and I am actively working on it. It should be possible to approximate or exceed Xaudio's performance on machines without an FPU. -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 2 05:41:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA31043 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 05:41:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA31039 for ; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 05:41:02 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSD00K08E8CPB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 05:41:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id TAA1036360 for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 19:35:57 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 19:35:57 -0800 From: Greg Fountain Subject: LART PC Board Build To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38E6C01D.246D1220@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------17256B0C7D66093A0E911F3A" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------17256B0C7D66093A0E911F3A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This Monday I'm planning on releasing a set of LART Mainboard Gerbers to one of the local PC Board fab shops here in Silicon Valley. In order to hold down costs I've requested a 3 week turn around on the PC Boards. (Also because I'll be on travel for for about 10 days and wouldn't be able to use them right away anyhow.) A portion of the boards I'm going to use myself for building a few populated prototypes. Step one will to to see if the Fab shop builds them correctly (+ and - Gerbers get merged properly etc) . If the boards look good (without any manufacturing mistakes) I can offer a limited number (@ approx $50 US each) to those that want to try and build their own from scratch. The components for the assembled version have yet to be ordered. I'm going to attempt to complete the Bill Of Materials (BOM) before I leave, but can't guarantee it. I know there is an interest in obtaining assembled versions of the LART. But I want to limit the initial build of assembled units to a relatively small number (about a dozen or so ) until I get things to work OK (mostly because their could be mistakes or delays in the build process ... distributors don't have parts in stock, ship the wrong ones, parts installed backwards or I accidentally order a wrong component etc. ... the normal stuff that shouldn't happen but does) Greg Fountain Menlo Park, California USA --------------17256B0C7D66093A0E911F3A Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------17256B0C7D66093A0E911F3A-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 2 19:59:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA31914 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:59:42 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA31910 for ; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:59:41 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id TAA29340; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:59:38 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:59:38 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004021759.TAA29340@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: rob@mars.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: MPEG audio decoding In-Reply-To: <200004020128.UAA27092@deimos.mars.org> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 01 Apr 2000 20:28:55 -0500, Rob Leslie wrote: > Erik Mouw wrote: >>> If it is just a decoder: Nicolas Pitre released a fixed point version of >>> splay that runs at about 4% CPU time on a Netwinder. The gain of using >>> an mp3 decoder chip is very little compared to the software solution. > > Simon Labrecque replied: >> The performance you mention about splay is very impressive. Does someone >> knows how good the XAudio lib performs under an ARM? > > I generated some statistics for the decoders I'm aware that will run under > ARM. None of these are quite as impressive as 4% on the Netwinder, but I'm > assuming this is a factor of the CPU (maybe Erik could elaborate?) First of all, here are some statistics from a Netwinder: splay-fixpoint-0.81 compiled with "gcc-2.95.2 -O3 -mcpu=strongarm110": erik@netwinder:~/mp3 >/usr/bin/time ~/splay test.mp3 13.04user 4.12system 4:54.02elapsed 5%CPU (0avgtext+0avgdata 0maxresident)k 0inputs+0outputs (183major+212minor)pagefaults 0swaps splay-fixpoint-0.81 compiled with "gcc-2.8.1 -O2": erik@netwinder:~/mp3 >/usr/bin/time ~/splay test.mp3 24.77user 4.42system 4:54.16elapsed 9%CPU (0avgtext+0avgdata 0maxresident)k 0inputs+0outputs (514major+232minor)pagefaults 0swaps Xaudio 1.3.1: erik@netwinder:~/mp3 >/usr/bin/time ~/xaudio test.mp3 XAUDIO: stream type = MPEG 1, layer III, 128 kbps, 44100 hz, joint-stereo 41.01user 4.10system 4:53.00elapsed 15%CPU (0avgtext+0avgdata 0maxresident)k 0inputs+0outputs (123major+22minor)pagefaults 0swaps MAD 0.10.0b compiled with "gcc-2.95.2 -O3 -funroll-loops -mcpu=strongarm110": erik@netwinder:~/mp3 >/usr/bin/time ~/madplay test.mp3 MPEG Audio Decoder version 0.10.0 (beta) - Copyright (C) 2000 Robert Leslie test.mp3: 11213 frames decoded (4:52.9) 63.82user 4.07system 4:53.34elapsed 23%CPU (0avgtext+0avgdata 0maxresident)k 0inputs+0outputs (1194major+17minor)pagefaults 0swaps The MP3 file test.mp3 is Paul Simon's "Graceland", a 4 minutes 53 seconds Layer III file. The Netwinder has a 280MHz SA110 CPU. I am not able to repeat the 4% CPU time with this particular MP3 file, but 5% for splay is pretty impressive, too. However, a couple of weeks ago someone on the debian-arm mailing list was also able to get 4% CPU time, so it seems quite a normal figure. Splay is very sensitive to compiler optimizations: compiled with gcc-2.8.1, the performance drops to 9% CPU time. I think the difference is in the files filter.cc and filter_2.cc, which Nicolas heavily optimized (right Nico?). These two files use a lot of DSP like operations, and the gcc-2.95.2 optimizer just simply does a better job on that. The main differences between the SA110 and the SA1100 are the size of the data cache (16K vs. 8K) and the clock speed (280MHz vs. 220MHz). Those differences can be seen in the performance of Xaudio and MAD, which are both 1.6 times as fast on the Netwinder. The performance of splay is 8.6 times better on the Netwinder, which is quite large to explain. It might be that splay thrashes the data cache on the SA1100, but I think the main difference is in the compiler. Could you recompile splay with "-O3 -mcpu=strongarm110" and test it again on your SA1100 platform? (I can supply a statically linked binary if necessary). Erik PS: I know there is someone working on a fixed point StrongARM version of mpg123, I just can't remember who it was... -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 2 23:26:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA32227 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 23:26:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA32223 for ; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 23:26:22 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSE00E42RJWPV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 2 Apr 2000 23:26:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id RAA08270 for ; Sun, 02 Apr 2000 17:22:51 -0400 Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 17:22:48 -0400 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: MPEG audio decoding In-reply-to: "Your message of Sun, 02 Apr 2000 19:59:38 +0200." <200004021759.TAA29340@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004022122.RAA08270@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Thanks, Erik, for the extra data. Unfortunately even compiling splay with gcc 2.95.2 "-O3 -mcpu=strongarm110" I can't get anywhere near on the SA1100 to the ratio of timings you're seeing. I had compiled with "-O2 -mcpu=strongarm110 -fomit-frame-pointer -fno-strength-reduce" before, and the difference comes out to be less than a second of user time. If you can send me a statically linked binary, I'd be happy to try with that. > PS: I know there is someone working on a fixed point StrongARM version of > mpg123, I just can't remember who it was... I found an ARM version of mpg123 optimized by Simon Burge for NetBSD; the CPU numbers I get on the SA1100 are: Layer Layer Layer decoder version I II III ---------------------------------------------------------------- mpg123-arm32 0.59r [1] 27%[2] 32% [1] failed to decode bitstream [2] outputs silence which puts it between Xaudio (24%) and MAD (37%) for Layer III. -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 02:29:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00205 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:29:53 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00194; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:29:45 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000401134103.B5319@odo.ecs.umass.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:18:14 +0200 To: crichton@gimp.org From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PCB info and other stuff Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Also, I was wondering about adding TV capability to a LART. Has anyone >got more experience with it? (I was looking at using some of Thompson >Electronics ICs to do the work, but they seem to be powergrubbing little >monsters. :( ) TV in or TV out ? I'm working on component video out; the (AD) chipset I'm looking at can also output composite PAL/NTSC/SECAM. After that it's just SCART or a modulator. Video in is also on my list, albeit a bit further down. >Lastly, looking at the pdf schematic for the LART, I was wodnering if the >part number for the DRAM chips should be uPD4265165 and not uPD4264165. Ah yes; that's a pretty important piece of information. I'll correct the schematics ASAP. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 02:29:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00202 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:29:52 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00196; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:29:48 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E67F82.3040904@utdallas.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:29:19 +0200 To: Bob Davis From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: ISSI DRAM Parts Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 01:00 +0200 02-04-2000, Bob Davis wrote: >Under the LART.dist-README file it states that TSOP-II EDO DRAM chips >are needed. I went to the issi web site and found that they offer >25,35,50, and 60 ns ram chips. What ? 25ns EDO DRAM chips ? Where ? Gimme ! ;-) > The manufacturer that i am using for the >parts offers all versions at the same price. Is there any preference of >chips here? Are there any that will not work? Chips that will work match *all* of these criteria: - 64Mbit in 4Mx16 configuration - 50-pin TSOP-II package - EDO or (rare) FPM configuration - 3v3 supply voltage - 4k refresh (12 row addresses, 10 column addresses) Chips that will *not* work include: - SDRAM chips - SOJ or BGA package - 8k refresh - 5v supply voltage I'd suggest everyone to check with me before buying DRAM parts. JDB. -- "Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot." -- Arne Damvin in asr -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 02:38:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00238 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:38:44 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00232; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:38:40 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E6C01D.246D1220@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:38:20 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >This Monday I'm planning on releasing a set of LART Mainboard Gerbers to >one of the local PC Board fab shops here in Silicon Valley. I applaud this; it's great to see LARTs built all over, but: BIG FAT WARNING: The Maxim MAX1626/1627 (used in the power supply) have *very* long lead times right now (in the order of 16 weeks). I'm doing a LART rev 4 with Linear parts somewhere this week. If you're confident that you can get a hold of the Maxim parts then by all means, go ahead with the Rev 3. I know of one list member that has a small stockpile of these and may be convinced to part with some (hi Adam ;-)). JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 02:46:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00265 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:46:58 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00259; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:46:51 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E5C5F6.2E0D2080@cgocable.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:46:31 +0200 To: Hugues Belanger From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: What cna it do Now..! Cc: LART Mailling list Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >But I'm going to be a little pushy, when do you think that the board >will be usable for production system ? I need to know when the >networking components will be useable ? I have a demo at the end of next week; I hope to show working Ethernet there. Dunno if I will manage; I have the PCBs, but they need stuffing and debugging. JDB [and I seem to need sleep] -- "A satisfied customer ? We ought to have him stuffed !" -- Basil Fawlty -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 02:49:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00281 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:49:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00277 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:49:16 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSF00HMN0XDW6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:49:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07810; Sun, 02 Apr 2000 20:48:17 -0400 Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 20:48:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: MPEG audio decoding In-reply-to: <200004021759.TAA29340@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: Erik Mouw Cc: rob@mars.org, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl id CAA00278 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sun, 2 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > First of all, here are some statistics from a Netwinder: Wow! I didn't know that splay performed so well on a Netwinder! :-) I always tested it on à SA1100. > Splay is very sensitive to compiler optimizations: compiled with > gcc-2.8.1, the performance drops to 9% CPU time. I think the difference is > in the files filter.cc and filter_2.cc, which Nicolas heavily optimized > (right Nico?). Well... The original author did. His goal was to play MP3 files real-time on his Pentium 60MHz. I made the fixed point support and audited the performance of the fixed point implementation and generated assembly, but not much about the general algorithm. > The main differences between the SA110 and the SA1100 are the size of the > data cache (16K vs. 8K) and the clock speed (280MHz vs. 220MHz). Those > differences can be seen in the performance of Xaudio and MAD, which are > both 1.6 times as fast on the Netwinder. The performance of splay is 8.6 > times better on the Netwinder, which is quite large to explain. It might > be that splay thrashes the data cache on the SA1100, Most probably. One of the optimisation not related to fixed point stuff that I made was about instruction cache footprint. While it performed a little less on a PC, I gained few percent on the SA1100. But I think splay is effectively trashing data cache on the SA1100, especially for layer III. I can't explain its performance difference with the Netwinder otherwise. I just compared madplay against splay on my Pentium 233MHz, and here are the results: madplay: 25.25user 1.03system 1:18.10elapsed 33%CPU splay: 22.94user 1.21system 1:18.14elapsed 30%CPU So I guess splay is not so bad after all. > PS: I know there is someone working on a fixed point StrongARM version of > mpg123, I just can't remember who it was... mpg123 isn't really GPL though. It may make a difference if you care. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 03:04:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00319 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:04:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00312 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:04:02 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSF00I7E1MLHA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:04:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:01:29 +1000 Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:01:29 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: greg.fountain@telvex.com, Lart Mail Server Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > >This Monday I'm planning on releasing a set of LART Mainboard Gerbers to > >one of the local PC Board fab shops here in Silicon Valley. > > I applaud this; it's great to see LARTs built all over, but: > > BIG FAT WARNING: The Maxim MAX1626/1627 (used in the power supply) have > *very* long lead times right now (in the order of 16 weeks). I'm doing a > LART rev 4 with Linear parts somewhere this week. > > If you're confident that you can get a hold of the Maxim parts then by all > means, go ahead with the Rev 3. I know of one list member that has a small > stockpile of these and may be convinced to part with some (hi Adam ;-)). I only have about 50 which I need for future projects and our own production run of PLEB hardware. I am willing to part with half to a full dozen for a good cause but I doubt that will help. Best to wait for one using linear parts. BTW JDB what parts you going to use? Cheers Adam, soon to have ethernet. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 03:08:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00339 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:08:52 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00334; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:08:43 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:08:38 +0200 To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Best to wait for one >using linear parts. BTW JDB what parts you going to use? Depends on (a) availability and (b) whether I choose for maximum efficiency or minimum cost. I'll know about (a) tomorrow, and in (b) I tend to go with efficiency. > Cheers Adam, soon to have ethernet. Which chip ? JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 03:13:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00360 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:13:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00356 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:13:53 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSF00IEI232E5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:13:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id SAA1117636; Sun, 02 Apr 2000 18:08:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 18:08:46 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build To: "J.D. Bakker" , Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38E7EF1E.A6E5E825@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------3FB5DEB315CBE264CBD5799E" X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------3FB5DEB315CBE264CBD5799E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for the warning J.D. I'll summit my request for engineering samples today If I get really desperate I can always drive down the road to their plant and sit on the front steps till I get some parts. In my case I would like to stick with DC-DC switchers since I'm interested in minimizing power consumption. The fewer Joules wasted the better. A more readily available part from MAXIM, MICREL or Linear Technology might be worth while to look at as a fall back solution. Another option is to move the Power Supply off board. Greg "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > >This Monday I'm planning on releasing a set of LART Mainboard Gerbers to > >one of the local PC Board fab shops here in Silicon Valley. > > I applaud this; it's great to see LARTs built all over, but: > > BIG FAT WARNING: The Maxim MAX1626/1627 (used in the power supply) have > *very* long lead times right now (in the order of 16 weeks). I'm doing a > LART rev 4 with Linear parts somewhere this week. > > If you're confident that you can get a hold of the Maxim parts then by all > means, go ahead with the Rev 3. I know of one list member that has a small > stockpile of these and may be convinced to part with some (hi Adam ;-)). > > JDB. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' --------------3FB5DEB315CBE264CBD5799E Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------3FB5DEB315CBE264CBD5799E-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 03:16:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00381 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:16:27 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00373 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:16:26 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSF00IDB27ADV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:16:25 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:16:02 +1000 Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:16:01 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Lart Mail Server Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > Best to wait for one > >using linear parts. BTW JDB what parts you going to use? > > Depends on (a) availability and (b) whether I choose for maximum efficiency > or minimum cost. I'll know about (a) tomorrow, and in (b) I tend to go with > efficiency. :) In the future I'm going for cost in small quantities ;) > > > Cheers Adam, soon to have ethernet. > > Which chip ? Not sure think it was the crystals. Daves doing it, once its routed I'll make that and the memory card CAD files avaliable under something like the LART licence. I'm holding out on the CPU board till I get time to fix it's mistakes. Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 03:28:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00404 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:28:19 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00398; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:28:15 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E7EF1E.A6E5E825@ix.netcom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 03:28:05 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART PC Board Build Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >If I get really desperate I can always drive down the road to their plant and >sit on the front steps till I get some parts. Hey, I wish I had that option ;-) >In my case I would like to stick with DC-DC switchers since I'm interested in >minimizing power consumption. The fewer Joules wasted the better. Very true. I see there may be some confusion, when I wrote >> I'm doing a >> LART rev 4 with Linear parts somewhere this week. I meant Linear Technology switchers, not a 'linear' power supply. LART should be usable in mobile/wearable computing, and in my book that means that a linear supply would be out of the question (although the Itsy boys seem to disagree...). JDB. -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 05:57:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA00621 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 05:57:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA00617 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 05:57:53 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSF00KJQ9OG6O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 05:57:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id UAA1113896; Sun, 02 Apr 2000 20:52:14 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 20:52:13 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: Learn about FPGA programming To: Damien Miller Cc: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38E8156D.A10FEB32@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_p9QRiKuTlrYDyT7ep2YpJA)" X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_p9QRiKuTlrYDyT7ep2YpJA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Damien, > > My goal is to a) learn about FPGA programming and b) develop a > hardware crypto module. Have you taken a look at the Xilinx Corp. CoolRunner series of parts (Technically they are CPLD's)? http://www.xilinx.com/products/xpla3.htm They have very low power consumption <100µA in standby mode. (Very useful for LART type applications) The FPGA design tools are free. The parts are relatively cheap And there is a new low cost evaluation board for about $99 USD. Insight Electronics ( http://www.insight-electronics.com/ ) Part No. DS-XPLA3-PAK Greg --Boundary_(ID_p9QRiKuTlrYDyT7ep2YpJA) Content-type: text/x-vcard; name=sv_calif.vcf; charset=us-ascii Content-description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-disposition: attachment; filename=sv_calif.vcf Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --Boundary_(ID_p9QRiKuTlrYDyT7ep2YpJA)-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 08:21:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA00818 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 08:21:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA00814 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 08:21:21 +0200 Received: from sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU (sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU [149.171.96.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSF00M1PGBGZX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 08:21:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from alpha400.ee.unsw.edu.au (alpha400.ee.unsw.EDU.AU [149.171.36.48]) by sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU (8.8.8/8.8.8 Kenso-Central-NO-SPAM) with ESMTP id QAA01902 for ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:08:36 +1000 (EST) Received: from localhost (u2189659@localhost) by alpha400.ee.unsw.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA02459 for ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:56:25 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:56:25 +1000 (EST) From: Ken Chiu Kun Wu Subject: Tips on implementing Parallel port To: Lart Mail Server Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi guys, It may sounds weir (is it?) why I like to implement parallel port on a SA1100 base board (LART, PLEB, etc). At the moment, I have a parallel port CMOS camera (uses VV6300 chip sensor from www.vvl.co.uk). Currently the camera has a driver (module) support on my Linux Pentium Box. So my initial plan is to port the driver to the StrongARM platform. However since SA1100 doesn't have parallel port, that means I need to use the GPIO that's offered. Anyone experience in this area? e.g. emulating Parallel port using GPIO.... where should I begin.. links to some useful information will be much appreciated.. Thanks :) Cheers Ken ----------------------------------------------- Ken Wu (Electrical/Biomedical Eng. UNSW Sydney) E-Mail: kenwu@ieee.org kenchiu.wu@au.unisys.com Homepage: www.progsoc.uts.edu.au/~kckwu Mobile: 0410 668 349 ICQ number: 1074203 ----------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 09:50:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00972 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:50:09 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00967; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:50:00 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E8156D.A10FEB32@ix.netcom.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:48:50 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Learn about FPGA programming Cc: Damien Miller , Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 05:52 +0200 03-04-2000, Greg Fountain wrote: >Damien, > >> >> My goal is to a) learn about FPGA programming and b) develop a >> hardware crypto module. > >Have you taken a look at the Xilinx Corp. CoolRunner series of parts >(Technically they are CPLD's)? http://www.xilinx.com/products/xpla3.htm Yes, but they're a bit small for hardware crypto engines. I'd go with the Xilinx Virtex chips instead. >They have very low power consumption <100µA in standby mode. (Very >useful for LART type applications) That's true, but do you know a supplier (preferably one that will ship to Europe) that has them in stock ? All European suppliers are still a bit uncertain becaude of the Philips->Xilinx transition, and even AvnetMarshall doesn't seem to know when they will start selling them. JDB. [who has a Virtex board on the hi-speed bus on his Things To Do-list] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 10:46:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01091 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:46:10 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01087 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:46:09 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA02422; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:46:00 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:46:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004030846.KAA02422@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: u2189659@ee.unsw.edu.au Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Tips on implementing Parallel port In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:56:25 +1000 (EST), Ken Chiu Kun Wu wrote: > It may sounds weir (is it?) why I like to implement > parallel port on a SA1100 base board (LART, PLEB, etc). > At the moment, I have a parallel port CMOS camera (uses VV6300 chip > sensor from www.vvl.co.uk). Currently the camera has a driver (module) > support on my Linux Pentium Box. So my initial plan is to port > the driver to the StrongARM platform. However since SA1100 > doesn't have parallel port, that means I need to use the GPIO > that's offered. Anyone experience in this area? e.g. emulating > Parallel port using GPIO.... where should I begin.. links to > some useful information will be much appreciated.. Thanks :) It's not too difficult, we have done it before with a 2x16 character LCD. My guess is that the PC driver uses the parallel port as a GPIO port, so porting should be easy: change every inb/outb into the appropriate apropriate GPIO instruction and it should work. There is one minor caveat: the SA1100 GPIOs are extremely fast compared to the PC parallel port. The easy way to overcome this problem is by makeing liberate use of udelay() between two signal transitions. No, this is not a clean way because you're sleeping in kernel mode, but it works. The correct way is to use a task queue, but that's a bit more difficult. On the hardware side there might be another problem: the SA1100 is a 3.3V device, while the PC parallel port uses 5V levels. Find out in your camera's manual if it will work with 3.3V logic. If not, you have to use some line drivers to convert the logic levels (ask Adam ;-)). Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 15:55:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA01864 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 15:55:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA01858 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 15:55:45 +0200 Received: from server1.siscom.net (server1.siscom.net [209.251.2.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSG007NL1CVIS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 15:55:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 34292 invoked from network); Mon, 03 Apr 2000 13:51:41 +0000 Received: from ppp206.c5300-2.day-oh.siscom.net (HELO siscom.net) ([209.251.10.206]) (envelope-sender ) by server1.siscom.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 13:51:41 +0000 Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 09:51:12 -0700 From: Brian Kraack Subject: Re: Learn about FPGA programming To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: greg.fountain@telvex.com, Damien Miller , Lart Mail Server Reply-to: bkraack@siscom.net Message-id: <38E8CBFF.F7AFD659@siscom.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk One of my ex-coworker buddys, who was going to be getting us all the parts for our boards (back when we were thinking of doing a build run) works for a Xilinx distributor ... I don't know how international sales/regulatory stuff works for that kind of thing, but I might be able to help someone in that area if it's needed. (I'm in Dayton, Ohio, USA) /Brian J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 05:52 +0200 03-04-2000, Greg Fountain wrote: > >Damien, > > > >> > >> My goal is to a) learn about FPGA programming and b) develop a > >> hardware crypto module. > > > >Have you taken a look at the Xilinx Corp. CoolRunner series of parts > >(Technically they are CPLD's)? http://www.xilinx.com/products/xpla3.htm > > Yes, but they're a bit small for hardware crypto engines. I'd go with the > Xilinx Virtex chips instead. > > >They have very low power consumption <100µA in standby mode. (Very > >useful for LART type applications) > > That's true, but do you know a supplier (preferably one that will ship to > Europe) that has them in stock ? All European suppliers are still a bit > uncertain becaude of the Philips->Xilinx transition, and even AvnetMarshall > doesn't seem to know when they will start selling them. > > JDB. > [who has a Virtex board on the hi-speed bus on his Things To Do-list] > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 17:22:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA02050 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:22:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA02046 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:22:09 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f178.hotmail.com [216.32.181.178]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSG00F2M5CSC0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:22:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 50077 invoked by uid 0); Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:21:44 +0000 Received: from 195.197.88.70 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 08:21:44 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 18:21:44 +0100 (EEST) From: Mika Lauronen Subject: SA-1110 To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000403152144.50076.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [195.197.88.70] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here the local distributors try to turn me to use newer SA-1110 because SA-1100 is old fashioned ;)... Maybe they want to sell SA-1110 because of the availability ;) Anyway, what do you think is it a big job convert the LART to use 1110 the newer one? Rgsd Mika ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 17:58:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA02211 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:58:11 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA02207 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:58:10 +0200 Received: from ice.ar51.net (ice.ar51.net [208.225.80.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSG00H4H70WLQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:58:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from server01.asi (akron-80-173.ar51.net [208.225.80.173]) by ice.ar51.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA10544; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:35:32 -0400 Received: by SERVER01 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:35:16 -0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:35:03 -0400 From: Jeff Sutherland Subject: RE: SA-1110 To: "'Mika Lauronen'" , "LART Mailing List (E-mail)" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here the local distributors try to turn me to use newer SA-1110 because SA-1100 is old fashioned ;)... Maybe they want to sell SA-1110 because of the availability ;) Anyway, what do you think is it a big job convert the LART to use 1110 the newer one? Rgsd Mika The Intel rep is also telling one of our customers not to design with the 1100, go with the SA-1110 instead. *Supposedly* from a software standpoint it shouldn't be a big issue, unless you move to using SDRAMs which require some code at boot time to get running properly. Getting past setting up the MMU in arch/arm/kernel/head-armv.S has been problematic for me, however, using 2.3.99-pre1 :( //Jeff -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 18:54:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA02397 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 18:54:02 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA02392; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 18:53:58 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000403152144.50076.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 18:52:26 +0200 To: Mika Lauronen From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: SA-1110 Cc: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 19:21 +0200 03-04-2000, Mika Lauronen wrote: >Here the local distributors try to turn me to >use newer SA-1110 because SA-1100 is old fashioned ;)... >Maybe they want to sell SA-1110 because of the >availability ;) Anyway, what do you think is it a >big job convert the LART to use 1110 the newer one? ATM I have three reasons not to do a redesign from SA-1100 to SA-1110: 1) For most purposes the SA-1100 is perfectly OK. I expect Intel to ship the chip for at least two more years. 2) Around here the SA-1110 is not yet available. I've ordered some samples in December; still waiting for them. 3) The SA-1110 only comes in Ball Grid Array (BGA) package. That sucks rocks through straw if you're doing small runs. The third one is the biggest for me. BGA may be fine for runs of >10k boards, but all PCB assembers that I know shudder when I mention doing BGA in proto runs. And I don't blame them. That being said, once I have the samples lying on my desk and I don't have anything else to do, I may have a crack at it. JDB. -- "NT admins? These guys couldn't admin a calculator without toll-free phone support." -Siggi B in the Scary Devil Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 20:12:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA02599 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:12:08 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA02595 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:12:06 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id UAA05887; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:12:04 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:12:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004031812.UAA05887@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Subject: Announce: LART ramdisk page Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, We just made a page with RAM disks on the LART site (see signature for URL). There are currently two ramdisks available: the modified Itsy ramdisk, and a glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk. The latter is not yet tested, but we all know about Eric Raymond's "release early, release often" mantra... Erik -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 20:34:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA02810 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:34:44 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA02803; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:34:41 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000403002649.A17499@odo.ecs.umass.edu> References: ; from bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl on Mon, Apr 03, 2000 at 02:18:14AM +0200 <20000401134103.B5319@odo.ecs.umass.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:29:19 +0200 To: Mark Crichton From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: PCB info and other stuff Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 06:26 +0200 03-04-2000, Mark Crichton wrote: >* J.D. Bakker (bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl) [000402 20:29]: >> >> Video in is also on my list, albeit a bit further down. >> > >That's what I'm going for. A nice little portable TV would be cool. ;) >The only downside I've found is that the ST chips I want to use (based >on the STV2118B) are 12V monsters. The Brooktree chips are also nice (one of >the nicest NTSC/SECAM/PAL decoders IMHO to work with), but they require a >PCI bus. They probably also gobble the juice. Analog Devices (http://www.analog.com/) has some nice chips, like the ADV7185. You may want to check them out. >I've also was thinking about trying to get the LART to do some form of >audio encoding realtime. My MiniDisc recorder is too big to smuggle into >concerts... ;) Multichannel harddisk recording is on my list as well. So little time... >Also, the 2 crystals on the LART, what's their freq perchance? Are they >documented in the StrongARM reference manual? It's in the manual; one is a 32.768KHz crystal for timekeeping; the other one is 3.6864MHz for all other frequencies (CPU core, serial ports...). JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 20:34:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA02813 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:34:45 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA02805; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:34:42 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38E84E4D.BF16E317@utdallas.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:34:26 +0200 To: Bob Davis From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: ISSI DRAM Parts Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 09:54 +0200 03-04-2000, Bob Davis wrote: >Ahh, silly me. I was looking at 4M (256Kx16) DRAM parts not 64M (4Mx16) >I don't know what I was thinking. Late night I guess. You may have some trouble fitting Linux into the 2M that that yields ;) > Anyways, how >does ISSI IS41LV16400 64M 50ns DRAM sound? Would that work? That should work as far as I can tell, yes. > Also >Micron MT4LC4M16R6 same specs. I sure hope so, I have 500 of those in a sealed box to be mounted on my next LART-run ;-) > Or, I could just ask you what you >used... What DRAM did you use? (c= The NEC upD4265165G5-A60. JDB. -- "Windows is the one true OS. MS invented the GUI. MS invented the 32 bit OS. MS is open and standard. MS loves you. We have always been at war with Oceania." -- Tracy Reed -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 20:45:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA02913 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:45:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA02909 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:45:00 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSG0015YELV4C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 20:44:59 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 14:37:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-reply-to: <200004031812.UAA05887@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > Hi all, > > We just made a page with RAM disks on the LART site (see signature for > URL). There are currently two ramdisks available: the modified Itsy > ramdisk, and a glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk. Damn! I was just about to announce that I produced a glibc-2.1.2 ramdisk too! I finished it an hour ago. I wanted to test it tonight before announcing it... :-) So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many networking tools. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 22:42:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA03185 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:42:54 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA03181 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:42:54 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA06481; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:42:51 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:42:51 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004032042.WAA06481@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Subject: Re: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 14:37:08 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> We just made a page with RAM disks on the LART site (see signature for >> URL). There are currently two ramdisks available: the modified Itsy >> ramdisk, and a glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk. > > Damn! I was just about to announce that I produced a glibc-2.1.2 ramdisk > too! I finished it an hour ago. I wanted to test it tonight before > announcing it... :-) You can still be the first with a _working_ ramdisk, because my glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk doesn't work yet. I think I made a minor mistake with a (busybox) init script, because I get dropped on an interesting "init-2.03 #" prompt that turns out to be bash. > So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow > too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many > networking tools. No, mine is a lot smaller thanks to busybox and tinylogin. Bash is currently the biggest part, and I plan to replace it with ash. I also have to add z-modem and insmod, now you're speaking of it... Erik -- "people are still using Win98? Wow... VMS i could understand, but WinXX - that's just so passe..." -- Paul Jakma on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 22:59:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA03243 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:59:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA03239 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:59:53 +0200 Received: from crl.dec.com (crl.dec.com [192.58.206.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSG0069JKXMFX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:59:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from crlwebmail.crl.dec.com (crlwebmail.crl.dec.com [16.11.0.2]) by crl.dec.com (8.8.8/RWD-1.2) with ESMTP id QAA03053; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:54:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: by crlwebmail.crl.dec.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:58:47 -0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:55:16 -0400 From: George France Subject: RE: Announce: LART ramdisk page To: "'Erik Mouw'" , nico@cam.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I am working on one, as well. :-)) --George George France, france@crl.dec.com Cambridge Research Laboratory, Compaq Computer Corporation One Kendall Square, Building 700 MS: CRL Cambridge, MA 02139 USA -----Original Message----- From: Erik Mouw [mailto:J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 4:43 PM To: nico@CAM.ORG Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl; sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Subject: Re: Announce: LART ramdisk page On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 14:37:08 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> We just made a page with RAM disks on the LART site (see signature for >> URL). There are currently two ramdisks available: the modified Itsy >> ramdisk, and a glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk. > > Damn! I was just about to announce that I produced a glibc-2.1.2 ramdisk > too! I finished it an hour ago. I wanted to test it tonight before > announcing it... :-) You can still be the first with a _working_ ramdisk, because my glibc-2.1.2 based ramdisk doesn't work yet. I think I made a minor mistake with a (busybox) init script, because I get dropped on an interesting "init-2.03 #" prompt that turns out to be bash. > So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow > too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many > networking tools. No, mine is a lot smaller thanks to busybox and tinylogin. Bash is currently the biggest part, and I plan to replace it with ash. I also have to add z-modem and insmod, now you're speaking of it... Erik -- "people are still using Win98? Wow... VMS i could understand, but WinXX - that's just so passe..." -- Paul Jakma on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 23:12:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA03304 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:12:02 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA03300 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:12:02 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA06639; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:11:52 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:11:52 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004032111.XAA06639@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: france@crl.dec.com Cc: nico@cam.org, lart@lart.tudelft.nl, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Subject: RE: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:55:16 -0400, George France wrote: > I am working on one, as well. :-)) Oh, cool! So that makes three: - my ramdisk is (eh, will be) small - Nico's ramdisk is full featured and RedHat-ish - Your ramdisk is ...? ;-)) Anyway, this will solve the problem that people can't get a ramdisk for their board. Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 3 23:24:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA03373 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:24:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA03369 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:24:54 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSG006R6M0EFX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:24:53 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 17:17:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-reply-to: <200004032042.WAA06481@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow > > too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many > > networking tools. > > No, mine is a lot smaller thanks to busybox and tinylogin. Do you think I don't have those? :-) I just preserved the regular init since I don't like busybox's init much. > Bash is > currently the biggest part, and I plan to replace it with ash. I don't. My bash is about 340k where ash is 110k, but bash's touch anf feel is better to me. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 02:35:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA04133 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 02:35:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA04127 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 02:35:41 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSG00D9EUZDFT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 02:35:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 10:31:12 +1000 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 10:31:12 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: SA-1110 In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Mika Lauronen , J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Since I tend to be a little braindead when it comes to these things I will be doing a SA-1110 board as soon as I get some time (read june/july). Dave who I work with has commercially interested partners who want SA-1110 based hardware so I'll be getting offshots of sa-1110 chips as well as SDRAM making life much easier for me. The BGA may still prove a challange but the schools invested about 70,000 is PCB prototyping equipment so we expect to move to BGAs a lot more... Cheers Adam On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 19:21 +0200 03-04-2000, Mika Lauronen wrote: > >Here the local distributors try to turn me to > >use newer SA-1110 because SA-1100 is old fashioned ;)... > >Maybe they want to sell SA-1110 because of the > >availability ;) Anyway, what do you think is it a > >big job convert the LART to use 1110 the newer one? > > ATM I have three reasons not to do a redesign from SA-1100 to SA-1110: > > 1) For most purposes the SA-1100 is perfectly OK. I expect Intel to ship > the chip for at least two more years. > 2) Around here the SA-1110 is not yet available. I've ordered some samples > in December; still waiting for them. > 3) The SA-1110 only comes in Ball Grid Array (BGA) package. That sucks > rocks through straw if you're doing small runs. > > The third one is the biggest for me. BGA may be fine for runs of >10k > boards, but all PCB assembers that I know shudder when I mention doing BGA > in proto runs. And I don't blame them. > > That being said, once I have the samples lying on my desk and I don't have > anything else to do, I may have a crack at it. > > JDB. > > -- > "NT admins? These guys couldn't admin a calculator without toll-free > phone support." -Siggi B in the Scary Devil Monastery > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 04:47:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA04494 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 04:47:44 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA04490 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 04:47:44 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH00F9213JD2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 04:47:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.115) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 03 Apr 2000 19:31:35 -0700 Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:19:38 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: RE: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-reply-to: <200004032111.XAA06639@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000403154145.00adb3a0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk To go with RAM disk, how about a flash farm? Two devices, both from Hitachi (I am sure others make similar stuff): The controller: an HN29W256H02TE-1 and up to 32 memory devices (eg HN29W25611). Thirty three chips and you have a gigabyte that looks like IDE. ~80 mA during access, ~1.8 mA during standby. ~ 8 MB / Sec I/O. I haven't built one (yet) so I don't know if these specs are true... Which reminds me. Does / will LART have any facilities for measuring its own power consumption? Possibly at least a shunt or two and a high precision ADC? I suggest that one could do an etch cut and fly over a couple of wires when one is experimenting. So four shunts and a four channel S/H and mux and ADC. One for the processor, one for board overhead, one for total input power, and one with the mentioned experimental jumper pads. (s) Derek At 11:11 PM 4/3/00 +0200, you wrote: >On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 16:55:16 -0400, George France wrote: > > I am working on one, as well. :-)) > >Oh, cool! So that makes three: > >- my ramdisk is (eh, will be) small >- Nico's ramdisk is full featured and RedHat-ish >- Your ramdisk is ...? ;-)) > >Anyway, this will solve the problem that people can't get a ramdisk for >their board. > > >Erik > >-- >There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the >croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy > > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 07:03:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA04734 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 07:03:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA04730 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 07:03:03 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH00GM47D1PT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 07:03:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 00:51:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: New ELF ramdisk In-reply-to: To: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Nicolas Pitre wrote: > So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow > too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many > networking tools. So, it's available and pretty much working. The file can be retrieved from: ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ramdisk_img.gz The big features are: - glibc-2.1.2 - bash-1.14.7 - busybox-0.43 (most of it, but not all) - Red Hat style sysv initscripts (just drop Titan-VI RPMs...) - insmod/rmmod/lsmod - ifconfig/route/ping/traceroute/arp/netstat - telnet/ftp/inetd/in.telnetd - rz/sz - ae (text editor) - etc... The compressed file is 1.49 MB. There is approx 1.8 MB free on the filesystem. There should not be any problem running dynamically linked programs anymore. Tested on ADS ThinClient, but should work on anything else with a SA110 core too. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 10:49:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05386 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:49:01 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05381; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:48:58 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.20000403154145.00adb3a0@mail.clubnet.net> References: <200004032111.XAA06639@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:45:42 +0200 To: Derek Lassen From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: RE: Announce: LART ramdisk page Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 01:19 +0200 04-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: >To go with RAM disk, how about a flash farm? >Two devices, both from Hitachi (I am sure others make similar stuff): > The controller: an HN29W256H02TE-1 and up to 32 memory devices (eg >HN29W25611). > Thirty three chips and you have a gigabyte that looks like IDE. > >~80 mA during access, ~1.8 mA during standby. > > >~ 8 MB / Sec I/O. > >I haven't built one (yet) so I don't know if these specs are true... I would be surprised if you could do 8M/sec writing to those devices; a casual glance suggests it may be below 1M/sec. It's probably better to buy a solution like this pre-packaged (ie in a PCMCIA card), as that has the benefit of economy of scale. >Which reminds me. Does / will LART have any facilities for measuring its >own power consumption? Possibly at least a shunt or two and a high >precision ADC? Rev3 (the one in the hardware distribution) has 10mOhm shunts in Vin, Vcore and Vio; we've used these to do Johan's dynamic power measurements (albeit with external multimeters). There are plans for an ADC board though. JDB. [whose tasks for today include figuring out whether those shunts can be replaced by PCB traces] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 10:51:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05402 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:51:11 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05398 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:51:10 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA09186; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:49:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:49:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004040849.KAA09186@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: New ELF ramdisk In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 00:51:54 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Nicolas Pitre wrote: > >> So, if all is well, I'll have a new ramdisk image available by tomorrow >> too, stuffed with Red Hat style sysv initscripts, z-modem and many >> networking tools. > > So, it's available and pretty much working. The file can be retrieved > from: > > ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ramdisk_img.gz Ehm, maybe you should rename it because there is also a file ramdisk-img.gz in the same directory. [snip] > Tested on ADS ThinClient, but should work on anything else with a > SA110 core too. I just tested it on a LART and it works. One question: how did you make the file /etc/ld.so.cache? I can't find a proper ldconfig to generate it. I have the impression that I only miss that file to get it working (it alreay works with statically linked binaries). Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 11:42:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05589 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 11:42:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05581 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 11:42:15 +0200 Received: from mail.ivm.net (mail.ivm.net [62.204.1.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH008EVKAFDQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 11:42:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from KOMSERVER.dsa-ac.de (mail.dsa-ac.de [195.78.187.1]) by mail.ivm.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA16505; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 11:34:26 +0200 Received: from PCHO.dsa-ac.de (PCHO.dsa-ac.de [172.29.25.6]) by KOMSERVER.dsa-ac.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA31199; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 11:34:37 +0200 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 11:33:54 +0100 From: Andreas Hofer Subject: RE: Announce: LART ramdisk page In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" X-To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004040934.LAA31199@KOMSERVER.dsa-ac.de> Organization: DSA GmbH MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <4.2.0.58.20000403154145.00adb3a0@mail.clubnet.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > At 01:19 +0200 04-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > >To go with RAM disk, how about a flash farm? > >Two devices, both from Hitachi (I am sure others make similar stuff): > > The controller: an HN29W256H02TE-1 and up to 32 memory devices (eg > >HN29W25611). > > Thirty three chips and you have a gigabyte that looks like IDE. > > > >~80 mA during access, ~1.8 mA during standby. > > > > > >~ 8 MB / Sec I/O. > > > >I haven't built one (yet) so I don't know if these specs are true... > > I would be surprised if you could do 8M/sec writing to those devices; a > casual glance suggests it may be below 1M/sec. It's probably better to buy > a solution like this pre-packaged (ie in a PCMCIA card), as that has the > benefit of economy of scale. I don't know of any DRAM based true IDE PCMCIA card, since I have been investigated this for some time. Could you tell me who makes these beasts? > > >Which reminds me. Does / will LART have any facilities for measuring its > >own power consumption? Possibly at least a shunt or two and a high > >precision ADC? > > Rev3 (the one in the hardware distribution) has 10mOhm shunts in Vin, Vcore > and Vio; we've used these to do Johan's dynamic power measurements (albeit > with external multimeters). There are plans for an ADC board though. > > JDB. > [whose tasks for today include figuring out whether those shunts can be > replaced by PCB traces] > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > --- DSA - Daten- und Systemtechnik GmbH Andreas Hofer Pascalstrasse 28 52076 Aachen- Oberforstbach Tel. : 0 24 08 - 94 92 43 FAX : 0 24 08 - 94 92 92 EMAIL: Andreas.Hofer@dsa-ac.de --- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 14:46:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA06129 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 14:46:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA06125 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 14:46:13 +0200 Received: from mailboy.huawei.com.cn ([202.96.135.134]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH00LOOSSVEX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 14:46:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from w15060 ([10.11.33.88]) by mailboy.huawei.com.cn (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA3210 for ; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:27:08 +0800 Date: Tue, 01 Sep 1998 20:33:41 +0800 From: Jun Wu Subject: assembly To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <001901bdd5a4$c096c0e0$58210b0a@w15060.huawei.com.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 Content-type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Dear All! I'm new to LART. I notice the assembly for LART is different from ARM assembly(armasm). Where can I get any documents or manuals regarding it? Best regards Jun Wu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 15:21:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA06196 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 15:21:29 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA06192 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 15:21:28 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id PAA11053; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 15:20:34 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 15:20:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004041320.PAA11053@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: junw@sz.huawei.com.cn Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: assembly In-Reply-To: <001901bdd5a4$c096c0e0$58210b0a@w15060.huawei.com.cn> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 01 Sep 1998 20:33:41 +0800, Jun Wu wrote: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Please set the date of your computer to a proper value. This confuses my mailer (and also myself)... > I'm new to LART. Welcome! > I notice the assembly for LART is different from ARM assembly(armasm). > > Where can I get any documents or manuals regarding it? That's because all LART software is compiled with the standard gcc compiler tool chain, and not with the ARM SDT. As far as I know, the GNU assembler uses a 4.2 BSD assembler derived syntax. It is described in the "as" manual which is most probably installed on your Linux system as an info file. Use an info reader like Emacs, XEmacs, info, or tkinfo. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 16:07:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06278 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:07:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06274 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:07:06 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH005JAWJL9H@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:07:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA15662; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 15:59:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 15:59:34 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: Great news for BGA equipped boards To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, "PLEB-HW-list (E-mail)" Message-id: <000301bf9e3e$02bd8900$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all I just talked to the production manager of the company that produces our electronics. He says he have tried BGA in small (10-20) runs with good results. He can't guarantee 100% yield but don't expect any problems either. He also have them X-rayed to ensure good connection. The only prerequisite is that the pads must be NiAu plated (not hot air leveled SnPb) or have a similar _flat_ surface. If you want I can set up a connection or you can contact them directly at GPV/Elbau A/S Lyngsoevej 8 DK-9600 Aars DENMARK Tel. +45 (72) 19 14 00 Fax. +45 (72) 19 14 01 Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 16:23:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06351 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:23:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06347 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:23:59 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSH006OCXA67E@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:23:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA10622; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 10:21:47 -0400 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 10:21:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: New ELF ramdisk In-reply-to: <200004040849.KAA09186@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: Erik Mouw Cc: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 4 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > So, it's available and pretty much working. The file can be retrieved > > from: > > > > ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ramdisk_img.gz > > Ehm, maybe you should rename it because there is also a file > ramdisk-img.gz in the same directory. Huh.. right. The old one has been renamed ramdisk_img.old.gz > One question: how did you make the file /etc/ld.so.cache? I can't find a > proper ldconfig to generate it. I have the impression that I only miss > that file to get it working (it alreay works with statically linked > binaries). This is not mandatory. It worked even without ld.so.cache before, as long as you have correct symlinks. I used ldconfig just because I didn't want to create all symlinks by hand. I used ldconfig from Titan-VI. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 18:45:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06675 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 18:45:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06671 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 18:45:13 +0200 Received: from skylla.rus.uni-stuttgart.DE (skylla.rus.uni-stuttgart.de [141.58.231.9]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSI00GAT3VDFP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 18:45:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gw-21.wh.uni-stuttgart.de [129.69.166.242]) by skylla.rus.uni-stuttgart.DE (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01411 for ; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 18:32:34 +0200 (MET DST erikyyy@erikyyy.de) Received: from erik by localhost with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 12cWFm-0004S7-00; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 18:32:34 +0200 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 18:32:34 +0200 From: Erik Thiele Subject: self assembling robots To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000404183234.A17111@vulcain.yyydom> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk what would it need to build a robot capable of reproducing itself? i think about starting easy, so the robot for example doesn't solder it's PCB, but there are 10 PCB's on stock and it just has to put the PCB and other parts together and turn the power on. later the complexity of the resources (servos,pcbs,batteries) can be reduced and the complexity of the robot intelligence must be improved so that it can also reconstruct itself from the less complex parts. when just using a PCB (i consider something more primitive than a LART but a unix would be of great help to do useful development) and servos and the legs of bent wires, you can already construct interesting robots. but i guess a bit more complexity is needed to make them navigate, and they must be able to stick together another robot by picking up resources and putting them together. is this still pioneer work or has it already been done? URL? cu erik -- Name: Erik Thiele \\\\ Email: erikyyy@erikyyy.de o `QQ'_ IRC: erikyyy / __8 WWW: http://www.erikyyy.de/ ' ` -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 20:11:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06803 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:11:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06799 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:11:29 +0200 Received: from lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com (ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSI00JNE7V41H@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:11:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from utdallas.edu ([24.0.101.72]) by lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <20000404180901.XDPI18422.lh2.rdc1.tx.home.com@utdallas.edu> for ; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 11:09:01 -0700 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 13:10:05 -0500 From: Bob Davis Subject: Things to look forward to... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38EA2FFD.D20D493A@utdallas.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.3.99-pre3 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Dont know if this is completely relavent but it could be something to look forward to in a LART v2 or v3.... http://www.theregister.co.uk/000404-000007.html Bob Davis -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 20:35:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06847 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:35:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06843 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:35:22 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSI00JFW8YXR3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:35:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.142]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 12:37:22 -0600 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 12:31:08 -0600 From: Doug Subject: Re: self assembling robots To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00040412315701.02669@localhost.localdomain> Organization: AllBoot.Com MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik, this is pioneering work. A guy named Von Neuman talked about the same thing though, his idea was more wild. His machines were supposed to assemble themselves out of raw material. They are called Von Newman robots. If I remember right he came up with the idea around 1947! Take a look at his work, he did some interesting stuff in information and game theory. regards Doug On Tue, 04 Apr 2000, you wrote: > what would it need to build a robot capable of reproducing itself? > i think about starting easy, so the robot for example doesn't solder > it's PCB, but there are 10 PCB's on stock and it just has to > put the PCB and other parts together and turn the power on. > > later the complexity of the resources (servos,pcbs,batteries) > can be reduced and the complexity of the robot intelligence must > be improved so that it can also reconstruct itself from the less > complex parts. > > when just using a PCB (i consider something more primitive than > a LART but a unix would be of great help to do useful development) > and servos and the legs of bent wires, you can already construct > interesting robots. > but i guess a bit more complexity is needed to make them navigate, > and they must be able to stick together another robot by picking up > resources and putting them together. > > is this still pioneer work or has it already been done? > > URL? > > cu > erik > > -- > Name: Erik Thiele \\\\ > Email: erikyyy@erikyyy.de o `QQ'_ > IRC: erikyyy / __8 > WWW: http://www.erikyyy.de/ ' ` > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- Douglas Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 ------------------------------------------------------- -- Douglas Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 22:20:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07245 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 22:20:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07241 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 22:20:28 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSI0017QDU1FH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 22:20:27 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 16:12:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: self assembling robots In-reply-to: <20000404183234.A17111@vulcain.yyydom> To: Erik Thiele Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 4 Apr 2000, Erik Thiele wrote: > what would it need to build a robot capable of reproducing itself? Wow! Real soon that'll become a virus!!! Bill Joy wrote about his view on that subject. Really worth reading. http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/8.04/joy_pr.html Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 4 23:08:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07412 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 23:08:27 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07408 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 23:08:26 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA13465; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 23:08:11 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 23:08:11 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004042108.XAA13465@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: erikyyy@erikyyy.de, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: self assembling robots In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 16:12:29 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Tue, 4 Apr 2000, Erik Thiele wrote: > >> what would it need to build a robot capable of reproducing itself? > > Wow! Real soon that'll become a virus!!! Aaargh! Noooooooo! That would mean LARTs everywhere you look! Although in my opinion everybody should have its own LART, this is too much for me! Erik ;-)) I think I'm gonna use JDB's "pigs can fly" signature for this message: -- "There is a style of design I call "wishful thinking engineering." It starts with something like "pigs can fly if you feed them enough beans" and develops utopian plans such as like having everyone commute to work riding on personal pigs, and along the way ignores minor details such as the consequent rain of the non-gaseous byproducts." (Vernon Schryver in n.a.n-a.e) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 00:32:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA07661 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 00:32:14 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA07657 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 00:32:13 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id AAA13741; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 00:30:48 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 00:30:48 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004042230.AAA13741@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: New ELF ramdisk In-Reply-To: <200004040849.KAA09186@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:49:50 +0200 (MET DST), Erik Mouw wrote: > On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 00:51:54 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: >> Tested on ADS ThinClient, but should work on anything else with a >> SA110 core too. > > I just tested it on a LART and it works. I hate to followup my own posts, but I'd like you to know that it also works with a Netwinder, though it needs "some" extra work: Unzip ramdisk and mount it on a Linux box using the loop device, NFS export that directory, put it in the dhcpd.conf file, put up a tftp directory with a proper Netwinder kernel, start Netwinder, wait for bootprompt, enter "boot diskless", Netwinder boots and NFS mounts the ramdisk, wait for the "login:" prompt. Easy, eh? ;-) Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 02:32:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA08029 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 02:32:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA08025 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 02:32:14 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSI008KVPFPFF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 02:32:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10862; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:30:52 -0400 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:30:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: New ELF ramdisk In-reply-to: <200004042230.AAA13741@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: Erik Mouw Cc: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 5 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:49:50 +0200 (MET DST), Erik Mouw wrote: > > On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 00:51:54 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > >> Tested on ADS ThinClient, but should work on anything else with a > >> SA110 core too. > > > > I just tested it on a LART and it works. > > I hate to followup my own posts, but I'd like you to know that it also > works with a Netwinder... Cool! :-) I should say that it also work on an EBSA285! :-) Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 07:28:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA08476 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 07:28:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA08472 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 07:28:16 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSJ00CJU371VH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 07:28:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From mozart With LocalMail ; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 15:23:29 +1000 Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 15:23:28 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Assebet JTAG In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@mozart.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, "utility account for group.pleb " , sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com Cc: "Chagas, Jason" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ok can someone explain something to me. I just got an Assebet (SA-1110 evaluation board) and it has a PC parallel port to SA-1100 JTAG. The board doesn't appear to do any voltage translation for the JTAG_CLK and JTAG_TMS signals. Are they using 5volts from the PC for these signals (which is out of the chips max 3.6volt signal spec AFAIK) or am I missing something here? Anyone with a assebet tried using the parallel port JTAGing? Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 09:48:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08743 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:48:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08739 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:48:11 +0200 Received: from royal2.eicnet.de (royal2.eicnet.de [62.144.196.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSJ00IH59OB73@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:48:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from iserv.compu.lan (root@ppp-30.regio.net [192.135.7.158]) by royal2.eicnet.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA22878; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 09:46:25 +0200 Received: from compulan.de ([192.168.1.210]) by iserv.compu.lan (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA29778; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 09:32:56 +0200 Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 09:36:50 +0200 From: Michael Renzmann Subject: Re: self assembling robots To: Erik Thiele Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38EAED12.847526B0@compulan.de> Organization: CompuLAN Europe GmbH MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW0322h (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: de,en References: <20000404183234.A17111@vulcain.yyydom> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Erik. > what would it need to build a robot capable of reproducing itself? > i think about starting easy, so the robot for example doesn't solder > it's PCB, but there are 10 PCB's on stock and it just has to > put the PCB and other parts together and turn the power on. [...] > is this still pioneer work or has it already been done? I think there are some efforts going on in this sector, but I´m not quite sure. I suppose you speak german, so maybe you want to take a look at http://privat.schlund.de/r/roboland, which is one of my homepages that deals with robotics. I was quite busy in the last months, since about one and a half year I couldn´t find some time to work further on the page, and my interest in robotics decreased a bit in the meanwhile. But there is a link index that will possibly a help for you when starting to look around in the web for robotics resources. > cu > erik Bye, Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 13:49:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09226 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:49:45 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09222 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:49:44 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA16960; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:49:32 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:49:32 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004051149.NAA16960@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: awiggins@cse.unsw.edu.au Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, jason.chagas@intel.com Subject: Re: Assebet JTAG In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 05 Apr 2000 15:23:28 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > Ok can someone explain something to me. I just got an Assebet > (SA-1110 evaluation board) and it has a PC parallel port to SA-1100 JTAG. > The board doesn't appear to do any voltage translation for the JTAG_CLK > and JTAG_TMS signals. Are they using 5volts from the PC for these signals > (which is out of the chips max 3.6volt signal spec AFAIK) or am I missing > something here? > Anyone with a assebet tried using the parallel port JTAGing? Depends on the parallel port specs. If it uses the classic TTL scheme with a pull-up resistor, the maximum level is indeed not 5V. In that way it is a relatively safe hack (though still a hack) to connect it directly to the SA-1110 JTAG port, though it depends a bit on the overvoltage protection circuit in the SA-1110 JTAG port. It is also possible that there are some line drivers in the connection cable and that it is completely safe to connect the SA-1110 to the parallel port (sorry, we didn't got an Assabet, so I can't really help you on that ;-). Erik -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 13:51:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09242 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:51:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09238 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:51:32 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSJ00EUSKXU1J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 13:51:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA09484 for ; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 19:31:47 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA18469 for ; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 19:24:18 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 19:25:00 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: blob-1.0.6, and kernel address To: lart Message-id: <38EB228C.B797F41F@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I need to change the bootloader to suite our hardware. In main.h, there are defines of RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET and KERNEL_BLOCK_OFFSET? what are they used for? I am confused by their usage in main.c Is the kernel image has to be loaded into 0xc0008000? Can I load the bootloader itself to 0xC0000000 and run from RAM, so that I can write the kernel and ramdisk to flash? Thanks -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 5 23:52:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10757 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:52:59 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10751 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:52:57 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA19582; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:52:52 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:52:52 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004052152.XAA19582@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: blob-1.0.6, and kernel address In-Reply-To: <38EB228C.B797F41F@krdl.org.sg> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 05 Apr 2000 19:25:00 +0800, zhu qun ying wrote: > In main.h, there are defines of RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET and > KERNEL_BLOCK_OFFSET? what are they used for? I am confused by their > usage in main.c RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET and KERNEL_BLOCK_OFFSET are the address are offsets with respect to the start of the internal Flash. I can imagine the idea of an offset sounds a bit strange, so I'll explain: The LART has its internal (or main) Flash normally mapped at address 0x00000000 (all addresses I'm talking about are physical addresses). In that case, INT_FLASH_BASE is defined as CS0_BASE (see file flash.h). If we want to program the internal Flash, we plug a pre-programmed external Flash board on the LART. A single jumper on that board controls whether the external Flash will be mapped at 0x00000000 or at 0x08000000. If the external Flash is mapped at 0x00000000, the internal Flash will be mapped at 0x08000000. The trick is that the internal Flash is 32 bit wide, while the external bit wide. This can be easily detected by the StrongARM, and INT_FLASH_BASE will be defined as CS1_BASE. > Is the kernel image has to be loaded into 0xc0008000? Can I load the > bootloader itself to 0xC0000000 and run from RAM, so that I can write > the kernel and ramdisk to flash? The kernel will be loaded at KERNEL_RAM_BASE (also defined in main.h), the ramdisk at RAMDISK_RAM_BASE. You can run a second bootloader from RAM, but not at the same address as the kernel (or ramdisk) starts, because the download routines also store a downloaded kernel at KERNEL_RAM_BASE so you will overwrite the boot loader. As a ramdisk can be 3Mbyte at a maximum, choose an address beyond that range, so RAMDISK_RAM_BASE + 4Mbyte is a safe bet (if you have memory living at that range). You can't download the same boot loader to RAM, because it won't work due to some non-PIC code. Make a special boot loader to run in RAM. Have a look at the mailing list archive to see how to change the ld-script: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/list.php3#body?sd=1&sm=3&sy=2000&ed=30&em=4&ey=2000&sort=t&inl=&mid=200003292153.XAA09037%40duteinh.et.tudelft.nl Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 03:25:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA11519 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 03:25:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA11515 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 03:25:32 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSK0081XMMHUJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 03:25:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA31822 for ; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 09:24:43 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA24725 for ; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 09:17:15 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 09:17:56 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: blob-1.0.6, and kernel address To: lart Message-id: <38EBE5C4.8943F0D5@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004052152.XAA19582@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET and KERNEL_BLOCK_OFFSET are the address are offsets > with respect to the start of the internal Flash. I can imagine the idea of > an offset sounds a bit strange, so I'll explain: > > The LART has its internal (or main) Flash normally mapped at address > 0x00000000 (all addresses I'm talking about are physical addresses). In > that case, INT_FLASH_BASE is defined as CS0_BASE (see file flash.h). > > If we want to program the internal Flash, we plug a pre-programmed > external Flash board on the LART. A single jumper on that board controls > whether the external Flash will be mapped at 0x00000000 or at 0x08000000. > If the external Flash is mapped at 0x00000000, the internal Flash will be > mapped at 0x08000000. The trick is that the internal Flash is 32 bit wide, > while the external bit wide. This can be easily detected by the StrongARM, > and INT_FLASH_BASE will be defined as CS1_BASE. I understand it is the offset address, but as I recall, LART has only 4Mb flush, and RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET is defined as 0x00400000, it is already at the end of 4Mb flush. That is why I am confusing. In main.c (LINE 235), the only places that used it is: buflen = status->blockSize - RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET; As I understand status->blockSize is passed in from start.S. What's the alis_loop code doing, I traced one loop and cofused. > The kernel will be loaded at KERNEL_RAM_BASE (also defined in main.h), the > ramdisk at RAMDISK_RAM_BASE. Is that fixed for the kernel? could it be loaded to 0xc0000000? or the kernel need the memory region. > > You can't download the same boot loader to RAM, because it won't work due > to some non-PIC code. Make a special boot loader to run in RAM. Have a > look at the mailing list archive to see how to change the ld-script: Which part are the non-PIC code? Just curoius to know. What's the effort to make it relocatble? -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 04:51:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA11676 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 04:51:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA11672 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 04:51:44 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSK009NPQM34W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 04:51:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 12:45:32 +1000 Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 12:45:26 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Assebet JTAG In-reply-to: <200004051149.NAA16960@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au, sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, jason.chagas@intel.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk It seems they are using 100ohm resistors in series with the signals going into the assebet. This was hidden in the parallel port plug of the cable. Cheers Adma On Wed, 5 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > Depends on the parallel port specs. If it uses the classic TTL scheme with > a pull-up resistor, the maximum level is indeed not 5V. In that way it is > a relatively safe hack (though still a hack) to connect it directly to the > SA-1110 JTAG port, though it depends a bit on the overvoltage protection > circuit in the SA-1110 JTAG port. It is also possible that there are some > line drivers in the connection cable and that it is completely safe to > connect the SA-1110 to the parallel port (sorry, we didn't got an > Assabet, so I can't really help you on that ;-). > > > Erik > > -- > LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. > http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ > > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 21:15:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16729 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:15:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16725 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:15:20 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSM00HIR05IK3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:15:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.132]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 13:17:23 -0600 Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 13:09:35 -0600 From: Doug Subject: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00040613115100.06572@localhost.localdomain> Organization: AllBoot.Com MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Darn, this sounds a lot like the LART motherboard. Does one of you work for ADS? http://linuxdevices.com/cgi-bin/news_view.cgi?newsid=NS7736362772 -- Douglas Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 21:40:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16818 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:40:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16814 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:40:01 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSM00IIA1ANLT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:40:01 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 15:32:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-reply-to: <00040613115100.06572@localhost.localdomain> To: Doug Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Doug wrote: > Darn, this sounds a lot like the LART motherboard. Does one of you work for ADS? I do. Well, sort of, in exchange for hardware. I ported Linux to the ThinClient. This support figured in my SA1100 patch for quite some time now and even pretty little pieces of it already reached linux-2.3.99-pre4-pre. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 22:58:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16996 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 22:58:55 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16992 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 22:58:55 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA25431; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 22:58:51 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 22:58:51 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004062058.WAA25431@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-Reply-To: <00040613115100.06572@localhost.localdomain> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 06 Apr 2000 13:09:35 -0600, Doug wrote: > Darn, this sounds a lot like the LART motherboard. Does one of you work for > ADS? www.flatpanels.com sounds familiar. IIRC, there are a couple of them subscribed to the sa1100-linux mailing list. It's more a combination of a LART motherboard and a KSB. The picture of the board is a bit unclear. Although the press release talks about an SA1110, there is a SA1100 on the board (SA1110 comes in BGA only). I think they used a UCB 1200 for the "audio codec" and touchpad interface. I can't see which ethernet chip they used, but I think it's a Crystal 8900. The board is definitively bigger than 4 x 6 inches: the LART is that size, and this board is simply bigger. Anyway, just like PLEB, this board was made with slightly different design goal in mind, but with the same CPU. LART is minimal and uses the KSB for extra features, this board was meant for user interfaces. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 23:20:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA17102 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:20:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA17098 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:20:50 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSM00MGS5YIIH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:20:49 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 17:12:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-reply-to: <200004062058.WAA25431@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > It's more a combination of a LART motherboard and a KSB. The picture of > the board is a bit unclear. Although the press release talks about an > SA1110, there is a SA1100 on the board (SA1110 comes in BGA only). I think They have both. Probably fasing out SA1100's. > they used a UCB 1200 for the "audio codec" and touchpad interface. I can't > see which ethernet chip they used, but I think it's a Crystal 8900. The It's a SMC 91C94. > board is definitively bigger than 4 x 6 inches: the LART is that size, and > this board is simply bigger. I have one on my desk at home. I can measure it for you if you want. > Anyway, just like PLEB, this board was made with slightly different design > goal in mind, but with the same CPU. LART is minimal and uses the KSB for > extra features, this board was meant for user interfaces. And it existed long time ago... but it only ran Win CE until recently. Let's make Linux run on everything, from mainframes to toasters!! Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 6 23:49:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA17172 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:49:59 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA17168 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:49:59 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA25651; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:49:53 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 23:49:53 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004062149.XAA25651@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 06 Apr 2000 17:12:48 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> they used a UCB 1200 for the "audio codec" and touchpad interface. I can't >> see which ethernet chip they used, but I think it's a Crystal 8900. The > > It's a SMC 91C94. Ah, OK. That's the chip from the SMC 9000 series ethernet card. >> board is definitively bigger than 4 x 6 inches: the LART is that size, and >> this board is simply bigger. > > I have one on my desk at home. I can measure it for you if you want. They had to do a redesign for the SA1110 anyway, so maybe the new version is smaller. Can you measure it? I'll see if I can find something with Stonehenge Units, so I can measure the exact dimensions of the LART in inches. > Let's make Linux run on everything, from mainframes to toasters!! I'm trying to get a VAX 6000, it would be nice to run Linux on that piece of big iron ;-). Erik -- unix soit qui mal y pense -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 7 04:03:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA17720 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:03:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA17716 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:03:00 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSM005GEJ0MJV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:03:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA22352; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 22:00:56 -0400 Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 22:00:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-reply-to: <200004062149.XAA25651@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: Erik Mouw Cc: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk 6X8.5 15X22 On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Thu, 06 Apr 2000 17:12:48 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > > On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > I have one on my desk at home. I can measure it for you if you want. > > They had to do a redesign for the SA1110 anyway, so maybe the new version > is smaller. Can you measure it? I'll see if I can find something with > Stonehenge Units, so I can measure the exact dimensions of the LART in > inches. The one I have is SA1100 based. It is 6 x 8.5 inch, or 15 x 22 cm. > > Let's make Linux run on everything, from mainframes to toasters!! > > I'm trying to get a VAX 6000, it would be nice to run Linux on that piece > of big iron ;-). One of my friend is looking for a PDP-11... :-) Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 7 04:17:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA17742 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:17:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA17738 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:17:53 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSM0063WJPRJU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 04:17:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.124]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 20:19:58 -0600 Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 20:13:01 -0600 From: Doug Subject: Re: Applied Data Systems (ADS) has unveiled this;........... StrongARM SBC targets Linux-based embedded GUIs In-reply-to: To: Nicolas Pitre , Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00040620143301.00945@localhost.localdomain> Organization: AllBoot.Com MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Did you see the price for a finished board? $500.00 in small quantities. For a lot of purposes, this price point would make a lot of applications impossible to market. On Thu, 06 Apr 2000, Nicolas Pitre wrote: > 6X8.5 > 15X22 > > On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > On Thu, 06 Apr 2000 17:12:48 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > > > On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > > I have one on my desk at home. I can measure it for you if you want. > > > > They had to do a redesign for the SA1110 anyway, so maybe the new version > > is smaller. Can you measure it? I'll see if I can find something with > > Stonehenge Units, so I can measure the exact dimensions of the LART in > > inches. > > The one I have is SA1100 based. It is 6 x 8.5 inch, or 15 x 22 cm. > > > > Let's make Linux run on everything, from mainframes to toasters!! > > > > I'm trying to get a VAX 6000, it would be nice to run Linux on that piece > > of big iron ;-). > > One of my friend is looking for a PDP-11... :-) > > > Nicolas -- Douglas Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 7 10:41:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA18375 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 10:41:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18371 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 10:41:23 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSN00FY91GW2H@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 10:41:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA28260 for ; Fri, 07 Apr 2000 16:42:41 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA29825 for ; Fri, 07 Apr 2000 16:35:12 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 07 Apr 2000 16:35:52 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: how the kernel knows where to look for ramdisk? To: lart Message-id: <38ED9DE8.B46D2248@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have the board similar to LART but different in some way (memory layout and flash layout). I managed to get the kernel booted, and stoped at the point of ramdisk initilized. How do I change the default ramsize? How could the kernel knows where to look for the ramdisk? What are the kernel files that I need to change? Thanks -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 7 11:42:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA18591 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 11:42:06 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA18586; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 11:42:02 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38ED9DE8.B46D2248@krdl.org.sg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 11:40:02 +0200 To: zhu qun ying From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: how the kernel knows where to look for ramdisk? Cc: lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 10:35 +0200 07-04-2000, zhu qun ying wrote: >I have the board similar to LART but different in some way (memory layout and >flash layout). I managed to get the kernel booted, and stoped at the point of >ramdisk initilized. How do I change the default ramsize? How could the kernel >knows where to look for the ramdisk? What are the kernel files that I need to >change? function setup_arch, in arch/arm/kernel/setup.c HTH, JDB. -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 9 03:52:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22255 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 03:52:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22251 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 03:52:34 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSQ00CN87VFS7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 03:52:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA12773 for ; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 09:57:22 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA26984 for ; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 09:49:49 +0800 (SGT) Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 09:50:34 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: blob booting and ramdisk To: lart Message-id: <38EFE1EA.1A873B7F@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I compiled kernel 2.3.99-pre3-rmk1-np2. downloaded to ram with no problem. The problem comes when I try to boot the kernel, I am ended up as the boot message attached below. I am using Nicolas' new ramdisk. I suspect the problem is because of my hardware is different from LART, but I need someone to point me to the right starting point. The hardware board I am using also has 32 MB RAM, but they are not continues, 16 MB is at address 0xc0000000 and another 16 MB at 0xD0000000. while enable blob's debug information, the c_main() is passed in with 0xd0000000 and 0x1000000. Is the ramdisk size predefined in the kernel? Where are the related files? I am confused by the alias detection code in start.S, what is it use for? detecting memory size of starting address? In c_main(), there is a line to calculate buffer length: bufLen = status->blockSize - RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET While RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET is defined as 0x00400000. As Erik said it is the address offset with respect to the start of the internal Flash. But LART is designed with 4 M flash only, how can the RAMDISK_BLOCK_OFFSET at offset 0x00400000? Thanks ========== boot message ========= Starting kernel ... Uncompressing Linux................................ done, booting the kernel. Linux version 2.3.99-pre3-rmk1-np2 (qyzhu@edge2) (gcc version 2.95.2 19991024 (release)) #22 Fri Apr 7 22:24:57 SGT 2000 Architecture: SA1100-based On node 0 totalpages: 69632 zone(0): 69632 pages. zone(1): 0 pages. zone(2): 0 pages. Calibrating delay loop... 207.67 BogoMIPS Memory: 16MB 16MB = 32MB total Memory: 26752KB available (849K code, 419K data, 4K init) Buffer-cache hash table entries: 1024 (order: 0, 4096 bytes) Page-cache hash table entries: 8192 (order: 3, 32768 bytes) POSIX conformance testing by UNIFIX Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.3 Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039 NET4: Linux TCP/IP 1.0 for NET4.0 IP Protocols: ICMP, UDP, TCP IP: routing cache hash table of 512 buckets, 4Kbytes TCP: Hash tables configured (established 2048 bind 2048) Starting kswapd v1.6 SA1100 serial driver version 4.27 with no serial options enabled ttyS00 at 0xf8050000 (irq = 17) is a SA1100 UART ttyS01 at 0xf8010000 (irq = 15) is a SA1100 UART pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured RAMDISK driver initialized: 16 RAM disks of 8192K size 1024 blocksize ====================================================================== -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 9 19:37:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA23169 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:37:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA23165 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:37:51 +0200 Received: from localhost.localdomain (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSR0022GFN06E@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:37:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (IDENT:hbelange@webster [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA02388 for ; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 00:37:22 -0400 Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 00:37:21 -0400 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: LART PC Board Build To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F00901.5E9A2D15@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Good Morning All I'm interested in getting my hand on a couple of LART & KSB does anyone out there want to sale me some ? I'm also curious to hear about everyones current success/failure with this hardware. I.e. Does anyone use it for anything specific yet ? or is it still to soon for mass production ? Hugues Belanger -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 9 19:54:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA23187 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:54:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA23183 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:53:57 +0200 Received: from snail.ecs.umass.edu (snail.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.94]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSR0028RGD96E@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:53:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from odo.ecs.umass.edu (odo.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.174]) by snail.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA14562 for ; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 13:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mcrichto@localhost) by odo.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id NAA23704 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 13:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 13:38:32 -0400 From: Mark Crichton Subject: Memory subsystem of LART board To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: crichton@gimp.org Message-id: <20000409133832.A23633@odo.ecs.umass.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello, Can someone help a neophyte in electronics with something about the LART schematic. Looking at it, I've noticed that the memory does not get the A0 or A1 pins from the CPU. Is there a reason for this, or should I re-read the FM for the SA1100 ;) Thanks, Mark -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 10 00:35:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA23568 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 00:35:07 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA23563; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 00:35:00 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000409133832.A23633@odo.ecs.umass.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 00:33:09 +0200 To: crichton@gimp.org From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Memory subsystem of LART board Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 19:38 +0200 09-04-2000, Mark Crichton wrote: >Looking at it, I've noticed that the memory does not get the A0 or A1 pins >from the CPU. Is there a reason for this, or should I re-read the FM for >the SA1100 ;) The flash is 32-bit wide; the address bus addresses bytes. As flash reads/writes are always aligned to a four-byte boundary, A1 and A0 are always zero. I'm sure the 400-page FM has this info somewhere ;-) JDB. -- In protocol design, perfection has been reached not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- RFC 1925, "Fundamental Truths of Networking" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 10 01:36:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23802 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 01:36:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23798 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 01:36:55 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSR009HCW9EMR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 01:36:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 09:32:45 +1000 Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 09:32:45 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Memory subsystem of LART board In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: crichton@gimp.org, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 19:38 +0200 09-04-2000, Mark Crichton wrote: > >Looking at it, I've noticed that the memory does not get the A0 or A1 pins > >from the CPU. Is there a reason for this, or should I re-read the FM for > >the SA1100 ;) > > The flash is 32-bit wide; the address bus addresses bytes. As flash > reads/writes are always aligned to a four-byte boundary, A1 and A0 are > always zero. Hmm let me see I made that mistake ;) Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 10 03:43:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA23928 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 03:43:16 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA23923; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 03:43:07 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 03:38:03 +0200 To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Memory subsystem of LART board Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 01:32 +0200 10-04-2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: >On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: >> The flash is 32-bit wide; the address bus addresses bytes. As flash >> reads/writes are always aligned to a four-byte boundary, A1 and A0 are >> always zero. > > Hmm let me see I made that mistake ;) And I didn't catch it when I reviewed the miniPLEB design ? Shame on me ;-) JDB. -- "Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot." -- Arne Damvin in asr -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 11 00:06:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA26386 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 00:06:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA26382 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 00:06:15 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FST00GDDMQDKU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 00:06:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id PAA694030 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 15:01:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 15:01:08 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Programming LART Flash for the first time To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38F24F24.401522B1@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------B569159D40057E737AB7A503" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B569159D40057E737AB7A503 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, The text segment below was extracted from the file "Readme" in the blob-1.0.6 distribution. As you can see there is a reference to a "PCI 7200 (???) digital I/O card with a Linux driver" I am assuming this card is used to place boot code in the Intel DT28F160F3B FLASH memory so that it can be programmed AFTER board has been assembled. QUESTIONS: 1.) Is the PCI 7200 (???) card a standard commercial product? 2.) If so, who is the manufacturer? 3.) What is the correct part number to reference? 4.) What is it's approximate cost? 5.) Where can we obtain the Linux Driver's for the card? 6.) Is there any reason why the Mainboard boot code segment can't be reprogrammed multiple times using the PCI card above? (In case you make mistakes or you would like to use the board to run a small RTOS kernel.) On a related subject, I placed an order for a group of LART PC Boards last week. The board fabricator is promising a 24 April delivery date. This order is just for the bare PC Boards not the assembled units. I'll post the results of this prototype run right after I've had a chance to check the PC boards to see if they were fabricated correctly. Greg Fountain Menlo Park, California ** Installing ********************************************** ------------- Use whatever tool you need to download the blob image (src/blob) at address 0x00000000 of your SA-1100 target. The LART project currently uses the following wisdom to install blob: Required hardware & software: - The LART itself with 4 Mbyte flash memory - An external 128 kbyte flash board - A PCI 7200 (???) digital I/O card with a Linux driver - A flash burn program for this I/O card The external flash board is connected to the PCI 7200 card and blob is written into the flash memory using the flash burn program. The external flash board is connected to the LART low speed interface. The external flash chip is mapped at address 0x00000000, and the internal flash is remapped at 0x08000000. As soon as the LART boots, the external flash is copied to the first 128 kbyte of the internal flash. The next time the LART is started without external flash board, it starts from its internal flash which now contains the just downloaded blob. ********************************************************** --------------B569159D40057E737AB7A503 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------B569159D40057E737AB7A503-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 11 05:29:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA27085 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 05:29:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA27081 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 05:29:49 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSU00M1C1PLRY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 05:29:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA12564 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:36:05 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA07656 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:28:30 +0800 (SGT) Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 11:29:13 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: blob booting and ramdisk To: lart Message-id: <38F29C09.8A38E4DC@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <38EFE1EA.1A873B7F@krdl.org.sg> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I solved my problems. It is because of one line of code that cause the kernel to wait for the timeout, and I thought the kernel is dead. And I believe everyone using the 2.3.99-pre3-rmk1-np2 kernel for a LART like hardware will have this problem. In file drivers/block/ll_rw_blk.c, the macro FLOPPY_BOOT_DISABLE is defined for __i386__ and __arm__. For my hardware has no floppy controller at all, so the code at line 1043 (possiblly not the exact number for I had change a little of it), outb_p(0xc, 0x3f2) casued the kernel wait for quite a long time. Just commented the line or undef FLOPPY_BOOT_DISABLE will solved the problem. Have fun! -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 11 13:17:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA27944 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:17:42 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA27939; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:17:36 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F29C09.8A38E4DC@krdl.org.sg> References: <38EFE1EA.1A873B7F@krdl.org.sg> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:16:44 +0200 To: zhu qun ying From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: blob booting and ramdisk Cc: lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 05:29 +0200 11-04-2000, zhu qun ying wrote: >Hi, > >I solved my problems. It is because of one line of code that cause the kernel >to wait for the timeout, and I thought the kernel is dead. > >And I believe everyone using the 2.3.99-pre3-rmk1-np2 kernel for a LART like >hardware will have this problem. In file drivers/block/ll_rw_blk.c, the macro >FLOPPY_BOOT_DISABLE is defined for __i386__ and __arm__. >For my hardware has no floppy controller at all, so the code at line 1043 >(possiblly not the exact number for I had change a little of it), outb_p(0xc, >0x3f2) casued the kernel wait for quite a long time. Just commented the line >or undef FLOPPY_BOOT_DISABLE will solved the problem. Good spotting. What happens is probably this: your hardware doesn't connect nPWAIT on the StrongARM. This pin floats to ground (active); when you do the outb_p the processor waits until (a) nPWAIT goes high, (b) the processor is restarted or (c) hell freezes over; whichever happens first. I'll see if I can add a weak pull-up to LART Rev 4 to avoid hangs like this one. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 11 20:24:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA28756 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:24:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA28752 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:24:42 +0200 Received: from navigator.sw.com.sg (navigator.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.131]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSV002BP754BV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:24:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from exchruhydro.sw.com.sg (exchruhydro.sw.com.sg [195.16.40.3]) by navigator.sw.com.sg (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA05787 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 21:56:38 +0400 (MSD) Received: from cyber (cyber.int.sw.ru [195.16.40.122]) by exchruhydro.sw.com.sg with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 2WRT0SX9; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 21:52:08 +0400 Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 21:51:56 +0400 From: "Gennadiy M. Kurtsman" Subject: Linux debugger ? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <001201bfa3de$a0ffa940$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello everybody, have you an experience of Linux application debugging on StrongARM-based boards? Is there gdb or other debuggers? Some time ago I read ARM-Linux GDB document at http://www.netwinder.org/ . I downloaded gdb package. It looks like gdb works on remote PC communicating with Angel debugger (or JTAG ICE) on ARM board. I don't understand how can I debug Linux application in this environment. Unfortunately now I can not load netwinder's site and ask author directly. Any hint about ARM-Linux debuggers will be greatly appreciated. Gennadiy. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 11 20:59:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA28838 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:59:59 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA28834 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:59:58 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id UAA20118; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:59:54 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 20:59:54 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004111859.UAA20118@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: krtsmn@sw.ru Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Linux debugger ? In-Reply-To: <001201bfa3de$a0ffa940$7a2810c3@cyber.sw.ru> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 21:51:56 +0400, Gennadiy M. Kurtsman wrote: > have you an experience of Linux application debugging on StrongARM-based > boards? Is there gdb or other debuggers? Some time ago I read ARM-Linux GDB > document at http://www.netwinder.org/ . I downloaded gdb package. It looks > like gdb works on remote PC communicating with Angel debugger (or JTAG ICE) > on ARM board. I don't understand how can I debug Linux application in this > environment. Unfortunately now I can not load netwinder's site and ask > author directly. Any hint about ARM-Linux debuggers will be greatly > appreciated. I don't have experience with gdb on ARM, partly because I hardly use debuggers (lots of assert()s and some printf()s will do the same), and if use them at all, I only want to get a backtrace from the core file. But anyway, AFAIK the latest native gdb from netwinder.org works on a StrongARM: it works on the Netwinder, so it should work on everything else. If you want more information, check out the the linux-arm mailing list archives because it has been discussed quite recently (a link is available on the "Documentation" page on the LART site). About the netwinder.org network problems: some people seem to have problems to reach netwinder.org at all, others only have DNS problems. Check out if you can connect to them using the IP address: 207.245.35.202. Both www.netwinder.org and ftp.netwinder.org map to this IP address. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 12 01:49:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA29684 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 01:49:54 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA29680; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 01:49:46 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F24F24.401522B1@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 01:49:17 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Programming LART Flash for the first time Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Greg, The LART has two ways of getting data into the main flash: external (bootstrap) Flash and JTAG. If you pull nBOOT_EXT on J3 low, the LART will boot from a 16-bit wide external memory device connected to the low speed bus (J2-J4). When I had to bring the first LARTs online I built a Flash card and a Flash programmer, which unfortunately depend on a chip Intel no longer manufactures (the PA28F200) and a high-speed PCI digital interface card (the PCI-7200) which I happened to have lying around. This was a quick hack just to get the thing working. A cleaner way is to use JTAG. JTAG is a serial test interface which allows you to enable a test mode on a chip in which you can read all inputs and control all outputs. Adam has this working (for PLEB); he's now designing a generic JTAG programming tool. I am hacking at a LART-specific piece of software which allows you to use the PC parallel port with a $2 buffer chip to program the main flash devices thru JTAG. Eventually I intend to merge my code with Adam. So if you're rolling your own LARTs, you have three options: - wait for either Adam or me to finish a parallel port JTAG programmer (cheapest) - if you have (access to) an EPROM/Flash programmer, you can design/solder/wirewrap your own external bootmem. It's no rocket science; it'll take you an afternoon worst-case. - if you have an assembled LART and want it to work *now*, just holler and I'll FedEx one of my spare bootmem boards. The Flash on the Intel mainboard has at least 10,000 erase cycles so yes you can program it over and over again. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 12 03:14:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA29820 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 03:14:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA29814 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 03:14:53 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FSV00F4NQ4PFJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 03:14:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:10:34 +1000 Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:10:34 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Programming LART Flash for the first time In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: greg.fountain@telvex.com, Lart Mail Server Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > Hi Greg, > > The LART has two ways of getting data into the main flash: external > (bootstrap) Flash and JTAG. > > A cleaner way is to use JTAG. JTAG is a serial test interface which allows > you to enable a test mode on a chip in which you can read all inputs and > control all outputs. Adam has this working (for PLEB); he's now designing a > generic JTAG programming tool. I am hacking at a LART-specific piece of > software which allows you to use the PC parallel port with a $2 buffer chip > to program the main flash devices thru JTAG. Eventually I intend to merge > my code with Adam. Surly $2 is more expensive then the series resistor technique of the ASSEBET JTAG - PC Parallel Port Cable. As JDB said though my generic JTAG will work with a PC parallel port once its done ;) Chers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 12 05:22:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA30064 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:22:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA30060 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:22:37 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSV00H5FW1M91@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:22:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA24847; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:28:35 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA17732; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:21:01 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:21:44 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: respawing too fast? To: lart , arm Message-id: <38F3EBC8.F90B85C2@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I have the system up and running on a SA1100 board similar to LART, but I have this error message every now and then: INIT: Id "1" respawing too fast: disabled for 5 minutes INIT: Id "2" respawing too fast: disabled for 5 minutes and my ps listing: PID TTY TIME CMD 1 0,0 00:00:03 init 2 0,0 00:00:00 kswapd 3 0,0 00:00:00 kflushd 4 0,0 00:00:00 kupdate 34 0,0 00:00:00 syslogd 50 0,0 00:00:00 inetd 56 4,64 00:00:00 bash 152 4,64 00:00:00 ps I am wondering what is the cause of this message? I am not sure who starts kswapd, kflushed and kupdate? Are they started by kernel? Since the system is running on a diskless hardware, swaping is not necessary, how could I disable them? -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 12 05:37:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA30103 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:37:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA30099 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:37:07 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSV00H9UWPT9K@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:37:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA02331; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 23:36:54 -0400 Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 23:36:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: respawing too fast? In-reply-to: <38F3EBC8.F90B85C2@krdl.org.sg> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: zhu qun ying Cc: lart , arm Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 12 Apr 2000, zhu qun ying wrote: > Hi all, > > I have the system up and running on a SA1100 board similar to LART, but I have > this error message every now and then: > > INIT: Id "1" respawing too fast: disabled for 5 minutes > INIT: Id "2" respawing too fast: disabled for 5 minutes In the ramdisk image, look in etc/inittab for some "getty" on tty1 and tty2. Comment out those two lines. > I am not sure who starts kswapd, kflushed and kupdate? Are they started by > kernel? Yes. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 09:58:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00833 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:58:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00829 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:58:28 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSY0007R3HDK7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:58:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA17896 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:01:19 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA14733 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:53:43 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:54:23 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: GPIOs for StrongARM 1100 To: lart Message-id: <38F57D2F.AA1C8921@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I just want to confirm the usage of GPIO pins in the hardware of LART, besides the 2 pins for serial communications, does any other pin is used by Linux? I am going to implement a parallel interface by GPIO pins, I want to make usre no other pins is used. Even for the alternative serial pins, I need them to be used for other purposes, so any other part of the kernel will make use of the 2 pins? I disable the usage of these 2 pins in the kernel and did not get into trouble so far. Thanks. -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 16:17:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01542 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:17:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01538 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:17:35 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSY0052SL18WD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:17:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id HAA1161764 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 07:12:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 07:12:26 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: J1 Connector on LART To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38F5D5CA.A1CC15CC@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------CC220E6CFB31FBB2D5AB43AD" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------CC220E6CFB31FBB2D5AB43AD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was wondering if it might be possible to get the Manufacture and Part Number for the Surface Mount J1 connector on the top side of the LART Mainboard. Greg Fountain Menlo Park, California USA --------------CC220E6CFB31FBB2D5AB43AD Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------CC220E6CFB31FBB2D5AB43AD-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 16:29:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01592 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:29:56 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01587; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:29:52 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F5D5CA.A1CC15CC@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:29:41 +0200 To: greg.fountain@telvex.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: J1 Connector on LART Cc: Lart Mail Server Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 16:12 +0200 13-04-2000, Greg Fountain wrote: >I was wondering if it might be possible to get the Manufacture and Part >Number for the Surface Mount J1 connector on the top side of the LART >Mainboard. It's a FCI (formerly Berg) 61082-101000. See http://catalog.fciconnect.com/fci/red/partnumber/..\datasheet\datasheet.asp?Prod uctNumber=61082-101009 for the datasheet. Farnell Europe carries it, for about US$3 in qty one. HTH, JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 22:22:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02333 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:22:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02329 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:22:14 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSZ0021L1X04L@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:22:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id NAA1228649 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 13:17:09 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 13:17:08 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: eCos for LART To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38F62B44.67F2C743@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------13EB4941FF3DEFF5A147A2FB" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------13EB4941FF3DEFF5A147A2FB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was wondering if anyone has taken a serious look at what it would take to do an eCos port for the LART Greg --------------13EB4941FF3DEFF5A147A2FB Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------13EB4941FF3DEFF5A147A2FB-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 22:27:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02353 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:27:26 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02349 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:27:26 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA04581; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:27:12 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:27:12 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004132027.WAA04581@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: greg.fountain@telvex.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: eCos for LART In-Reply-To: <38F62B44.67F2C743@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 13 Apr 2000 13:17:08 -0700, Greg Fountain wrote: > I was wondering if anyone has taken a serious look at what it would take > to do an eCos port for the LART Not that I am aware of. I had a short look after eCos was released, but not more than that. It shouldn't be impossible though, given the experience Cygnus has on embedded platforms. #include Erik -- Real Programmers consider "what you see is what you get" to be just as bad a concept in Text Editors as it is in women. No, the Real Programmer wants a "you asked for it, you got it" text editor -- complicated, cryptic, powerful, unforgiving, dangerous. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 13 22:33:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02381 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:33:47 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02377 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:33:47 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA04611; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:33:41 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:33:41 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004132033.WAA04611@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: GPIOs for StrongARM 1100 In-Reply-To: <38F57D2F.AA1C8921@krdl.org.sg> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:54:23 +0800, zhu qun ying wrote: > I just want to confirm the usage of GPIO pins in the hardware of LART, besides > the 2 pins for serial communications, does any other pin is used by Linux? I > am going to implement a parallel interface by GPIO pins, I want to make usre > no other pins is used. Even for the alternative serial pins, I need them to be > used for other purposes, so any other part of the kernel will make use of the > 2 pins? I disable the usage of these 2 pins in the kernel and did not get into > trouble so far. It all depends on the hardware. If you attach an LCD and enable the LCD driver, the LCD GPIOs are reserved for the LCD (surprise, surprise ;-). If the KSB is connected to the LART and the correct drivers are loaded, a couple of GPIOs are reserved for the KSB devices. The kernel won't see that you changed the assignment of the GPIO pins. AFAIK, the SA1100 manual says (for almost all devices) that devices won't get any I/O if they don't map the I/O pins onto the GPIO pins. Erik -- Yes, it works sometimes. If you need something that "works sometimes" use Windows! -- Victor Khimenko on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 01:04:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02869 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 01:04:13 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02865 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 01:04:11 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSZ007CT9EY9G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 01:04:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail3.magma.ca (mail3.magma.ca [206.191.0.221]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA22567 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 18:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from terus.envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail3.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA04496 for ; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 18:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 18:51:29 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: eCos for LART To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38F64F71.BC84C77D@terus.envmtl.com> Organization: Terus Environmental Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38F62B44.67F2C743@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Greg, As I mentioned to you in our previous email awhile ago now, we've been working with eCos using 1.2.1 and some locally hacked cross-platform tools, but as your no doubt aware Cygnus has recently released (end of March) eCos 1.3.1 which now has explicit support for Intel's EBSA285 eval brd. which is based on the SA-110 so the HAL is basically in place now. The high degree of configurability throughout the OS makes it really flexible and a good fit for what we're working on anyway and in addition to Cygnus's efforts with EL/IX in the embedded Linux community and the fact that they have already integrated the ARMulator into GDB as a simulator - virtually instanteous GDB downloads (while you wait for your LARTs to come off the production line... :-) Certainly, a LART bsp would seem a very good idea. However I should point out that while there are two versions of eCos 1.3.1 toolset (Linux & NT), Cygnus appears to have placed more initial emphasis on the NT platform with a GUI based config tool not available under Linux. Also the NT version is leveraged off of their Cygwin product for development tools. Anyway, as we speak Cygnus is apparently only hours away from releasing the latest tools needed by the NT version of eCos 1.3.1. Also with the 1.3.1 release is a TCP/IP beta stack from the OpenBSD codebase which is attracting some attention to smooth out a few rough edges... otherwise what were you thinking of in terms of boot loaders, etc (e.g. is merging GDB support into Blob a worthy cause ?) Terry Greg Fountain wrote: > I was wondering if anyone has taken a serious look at what it would take > to do an eCos port for the LART > > Greg -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 17:59:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09563 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:29 +0200 Received: from mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (root@mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl [130.161.34.250]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09542 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:27 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id EAA07870 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:30:57 +0200 (METDST) Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA32635 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:30:57 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004140230.EAA32635@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Consider yourself slashdotted! To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:30:57 +0200 (MEST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Congratulations everyone! It appears we have made it to Slashdot, http://www.slashdot.org/ with a snippet from the LART FAQ: Build Your Own StrongARM Linux Computer Posted by timothy on Thursday April 13, @07:31PM from the hide-it-in-your-TI-calulator's-case dept. krp writes: "From the LART FAQ page: 'The LART is a small yet powerful embedded [ image of a nut ] computer capable of running Linux. Its performance is around 250 MIPS while consuming less than 1 Watt of power. In a standard configuration it holds 32MB DRAM and 4MB Flash ROM, which is sufficient for a Linux kernel and a sizeable ramdisk image.' Full schematics and CAD files for the main board, kitchen sink board, the boot loader (BLOB) and patches for the Linux kernel are available for download as well as various software tools. This tiny machine could be ideal for embedded / portable / wearable applications -- there are some pictures (including a LART running off a small batttery!) in l'ART gallery. " ( Read More... | 28 of 68 comments ) ...it also appears the server is having a lot of trouble keeping up with the number of requests while I'm writing this (Thu Apr 13 22:10:29 EST 2000 == Fri Apr 14 04:10:58 MEST 2000 - well, almost). People have even spotted the intended pun in the name of the device: Doh! Wrong acronym! (Score:2, Funny) by skip277 (skippy@columbus.rr.com) on Thursday April 13, @07:40PM EST (#9) (User Info) http://home.columbus.rr.com/skippy And here I thought a LART was a Luser Attitude Readjustment Tool. Doh! Skippy "False modesty is the refuge of the incompetent." - The Stainless Steel Rat But there are some people out there who can see through the diplomatic wording: Re:Doh! Wrong acronym! (Score:1) by stercus on Thursday April 13, @07:46PM EST (#21) (User Info) That's what we officially call it anyway; as with all four-letter acronyms, it is just possible that LART is overloaded. they want to IMPLY the regular meaning of LART, but not REALLY call it that si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes Ok, so we're famous now. What next? World domination? -- Marc e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? __ __^__ __________ | \ +---/ \---+ (==========) |____\___________ +---\_____/---+ // >____)| | \__ \ \______//___ >/ |________| \ [ _____\ |____________________\ \_______/ Roger, go at throttle up CHR$(32), the final frontier ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 17:58:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09123 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:58:37 +0200 Received: from mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (root@mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl [130.161.34.250]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09093 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:58:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id KAA14844 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:18:56 +0200 (METDST) Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSZ00L0BZ3HUX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:18:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA30339; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:15:52 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA29121; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:08:15 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:08:58 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: need advice on parallel port implementation To: lart , arm Message-id: <38F6D21A.675368EE@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_wRVBnU9/3J4oXiPR+gU/6A)" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_wRVBnU9/3J4oXiPR+gU/6A) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Hi all, I have a rough implementation of parallel port using GPIO pins. I have not finished the whole implementation yet, but I need some advice and help for I am quit new to the kernel programming. There are few points that I am not clear and hope someone in the net will have the answer. The hardware board I am using is quite similar to LART. 1. How much do I need to take care of the signaling? For example, in parport_arm_write_data(), do I need to code the whole write cycle signaling or the upper layer will do it through the control functions. (If I correctly understand what the control functions do.) How much control is needed at this level? 2. To register the port, I need to pass base address, irq, dma information to parport_register_port(). I am confusing on which base address I should use, I definitely can't pick one address randomly? Do I need IRQ? If needed, how is going to be realized in StrongARM? DMA? Could I use it? Or ignore it for simplify the job. I attached one copy of my code for your review and advice. -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com --Boundary_(ID_wRVBnU9/3J4oXiPR+gU/6A) Content-type: application/x-unknown-content-type-cfile; name=parport_arm.c Content-disposition: inline; filename=parport_arm.c Content-transfer-encoding: base64 LyogTG93LWxldmVsIHBhcmFsbGVsIHBvcnQgcm91dGluZXMgZm9yIFN0cm9uZ0FSTSBTQTEx MDANCiAqIA0KICogQXV0aG9yOiBaaHUgUXVuIFlpbmcgPHF5emh1QGtyZGwub3JnLnNnPg0K ICoNCiAqIENvcHlyaWdodCAoQykgMjAwMA0KICoNCiAqIGRpc3RyaWJ1dGVkIHVuZGVyIHRl cm1zIG9mIEdQTA0KICogdXNlIEdQSU8gcGlucyBmb3IgcGFyYWxsZWwgaW50ZXJmYWNlIA0K ICovDQoNCi8qIEZvciBteSBib2FyZCwgdGhlIHBpbiBsYXlvdXQgaXMgYXMgZm9sbG93cw0K ICoNCiAqIEdQSU8zOgljb250cm9sIGJ1ZmZlciBkaXJlY3Rpb24gY29udHJvbCAoMSBmb3J3 YXJkIGFsd2F5cykNCiAqIEdQSU8yOglkYXRhIGJ1ZmZlciBkaXJlY3Rpb24gY29udHJvbCAo MSBmb3J3YXJkLCAwIHJldmVyc2UpDQogKiBHUElPMToJT3V0cHV0IEVuYWJsZQ0KICoNCiAq IERhdGEgcGluczoJCQlJbnB1dC9PdXB1dA0KICoNCiAqIEdQSU83LTQ6CUQwLUQ0CQlJL08N CiAqIEdQSU8xMS04OglENS1EOAkJSS9PDQogKg0KICogQ29udHJvbCBwaW5zOg0KICoNCiAq IEdQSU8xNToJbkFjawkJSQ0KICogR1BJTzE0OglCdXN5CQlJDQogKiBHUElPMTM6CVBFcnJv cgkJSQ0KICogR1BJTzEyOglTZWxlY3QJCUkNCiAqIEdQSU8xODoJbkZhdWx0CQlJDQogKg0K ICogR1BJTzA6CW5TdHJvYmUJCU8NCiAqIEdQSU8xOToJbkF1dG9GZAkJTw0KICogR1BJTzE3 OglGUF9pbml0CQlPDQogKiBHUElPMTY6CW5TZWxlY3RuCU8NCiAqDQogKi8NCg0KI2luY2x1 ZGUgPGxpbnV4L21vZHVsZS5oPg0KI2luY2x1ZGUgPGxpbnV4L2luaXQuaD4NCiNpbmNsdWRl IDxsaW51eC9wYXJwb3J0Lmg+DQojaW5jbHVkZSA8bGludXgvZGVsYXkuaD4NCiNpbmNsdWRl IDxsaW51eC90eXBlLmg+DQoNCiNpbmNsdWRlIDxhc20vc2V0dXAuaD4NCiNpbmNsdWRlIDxh c20vaXJxLmg+DQoNCiNpbmNsdWRlIDxhc20vYXJjaC9oYXJkd2FyZS5oPgkvLyBJTyBhZGRy ZXNzIGZvciBBUk0NCg0KI2lmZGVmIERFQlVHDQogICAgI2RlZmluZSBkcHJpbnRrCXByaW50 aw0KI2Vsc2UNCiAgICAjZGVmaW5lIGRwcmludGsoc3R1ZmYuLi4pCS8vIGdjYyBleHRlbnRp b24NCiNlbmRpZg0KDQovLyBmb3IgY29udHJvbCAgDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9TVFJPQkUJR1BJ T19HUElPMA0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fQVVUT0ZECUdQSU9fR1BJTzE5DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9J TklUCUdQSU9fR1BJTzE3DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1ROCUdQSU9fR1BJTzE2DQoNCiNk ZWZpbmUgQVJNX1NUUk9CRV9OCTANCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0FVVE9GRF9OCTE5DQojZGVmaW5l IEFSTV9JTklUX04JMTcNCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX1NFTEVDVE5fTgkxNg0KDQovLyBmb3Igc3Rh dHVzDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9QQVBFUk9VVAlHUElPX0dQSU8xMw0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fU0VM RUNUCUdQSU9fR1BJTzEyDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9BQ0sJCUdQSU9fR1BJTzE1DQojZGVmaW5l IEFSTV9CVVNZCUdQSU9fR1BJTzE0DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9FUlJPUglHUElPX0dQSU8xOA0K DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9QQVBFUk9VVF9OCTEzDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1RfTgkxMg0K I2RlZmluZSBBUk1fQUNLX04JMTUNCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0JVU1lfTgkxNA0KI2RlZmluZSBB Uk1fRVJST1JfTgkxOA0KDQojZGVmaW5lIFNVQ0NFU1MJCTANCg0Kc3RhdGljIHN0cnVjdCBw YXJwb3J0ICp0aGlzX3BvcnQgPSBOVUxMOw0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1f d3JpdGVfZGF0YShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBkYXRhKQ0Kew0K ICAgIGludCBpOw0KICAgIGRwcmludGsoIndyaXRlX2RhdGEgJWRcbiIsIGRhdGEpOw0KDQog ICAgLy8gbG93ZXIgNCBiaXRzDQogICAgZm9yIChpID0gMDsgaSA8IDQ7ICsraSkgew0KICAg IAlpZiAoKGRhdGEgPj4gaSkgJiAweDEpCQkvLyBhIDENCgkgICAgR1BTUiA9IDB4MSA8PCAo NyAtIGkpOwkvLyBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbiBkZXBlbmRlbnQsIHRha2UgY2FyZQ0KCWVsc2UJ CQkJLy8gYSAwDQoJICAgIEdQQ1IgPSAweDEgPDwgKDcgLSBpKTsNCiAgICB9DQoNCiAgICAv LyB1cHBlciA0IGJpdHMNCiAgICBmb3IgKGkgPSA0OyBpIDwgODsgKytpKSB7DQogICAgCWlm ICgoZGF0YSA+PiBpKSAmIDB4MSkJCS8vIGEgMQ0KCSAgICBHUFNSID0gMHgxIDw8ICgxNSAt IGkpOw0KCWVsc2UJCQkJLy8gYSAwDQoJICAgIEdQQ1IgPSAweDEgPDwgKDE1IC0gaSk7DQog ICAgfQ0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcg0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fcmVhZF9kYXRh KHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwKQ0Kew0KICAgIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXIgZGF0YSA9IDA7DQog ICAgdV9pbnQzMl90IHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGE7DQoNCiAgICBkcHJpbnRrKCJyZWFkIGRhdGFc biIpOw0KICAgIC8vIHJlYWQgYmFjayBkYXRhDQogICAgcmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YSA9IEdQTFI7 DQogICAgDQogICAgLy8gbG93ZXIgNCBiaXRzDQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodWNoYXIpICgocmVn aXN0ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQSU9fR1BJTzcpID4+IDcpOwkvLyBiaXQgMA0KICAgIGRhdGEgfD0g KHVjaGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQSU82KSA+PiA1KTsJLy8gYml0IDEN CiAgICBkYXRhIHw9ICh1Y2hhcikgKChyZWdpc3Rlcl9kYXRhICYgR1BJT19HUElPNSkgPj4g Myk7CS8vIGJpdCAyDQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodWNoYXIpICgocmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQ SU9fR1BJTzQpID4+IDEpOwkvLyBiaXQgMw0KDQogICAgLy8gdXBwZXIgNCBiaXRzDQogICAg ZGF0YSB8PSAodWNoYXIpICgocmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQSU9fR1BJTzExKSA+PiA3KTsJ Ly8gYml0IDQNCiAgICBkYXRhIHw9ICh1Y2hhcikgKChyZWdpc3Rlcl9kYXRhICYgR1BJT19H UElPMTApID4+IDUpOwkvLyBiaXQgNQ0KICAgIGRhdGEgfD0gKHVjYWhyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVy X2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQSU85KSAgPj4gMyk7CS8vIGJpdCA2DQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodWNo YXIpICgocmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQSU9fR1BJTzgpICA+PiAxKTsJLy8gYml0IDcNCg0K ICAgIHJldHVybiBkYXRhOw0KfQ0KDQovLyB3cml0ZSBjb250cm9sIHNpZ25hbCwgaWYgd2hh dCBJIHVuZGVyc3RhbmQgaXMgY29ycmVjdA0KLy8gZG8gaSBuZWVkIHRvIHRha2UgY2FyZSBv ZiB0aW1pbmcgaGVyZT8/DQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fd3JpdGVfY29udHJv bChzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBjb250cm9sKQ0Kew0KICAgIGRw cmludGsoIndyaXRlIGNvbnRyb2wgMHglMDJ4XG4iLCBjb250cm9sKTsNCiAgICANCiAgICBp ZiAoY29udHJvbCAmIFBBUlBPUlRfQ09OVFJPTF9TVFJPQkUpDQogICAgCUdQU1IgPSAweDEg PDwgQVJNX1NUUk9CRV9OOw0KICAgIGVsc2UNCiAgICAJR1BDUiA9IDB4MSA8PCBBUk1fU1RS T0JFX047DQoNCiAgICBpZiAoY29udHJvbCAmIFBBUlBPUlRfQ09OVFJPTF9BVVRPRkQpDQog ICAgCUdQU1IgPSAweDEgPDwgQVJNX0FVVE9GRF9OOw0KICAgIGVsc2UNCiAgICAJR1BDUiA9 IDB4MSA8PCBBUk1fQVVUT0ZEX047DQoNCiAgICBpZiAoY29udHJvbCAmIFBBUlBPUlRfQ09O VFJPTF9JTklUKQ0KICAgICAgICBHUFNSID0gMHgxIDw8IEFSTV9JTklUX047DQogICAgZWxz ZQ0KICAgIAlHUENSID0gMHgxIDw8IEFSTV9JTklUX047DQoNCiAgICBpZiAoY29udHJvbCAm IFBBUlBPUlRfQ09OVFJPTF9TRUxFQ1QpDQogICAgCUdQU1IgPSAweDEgPDwgQVJNX1NFTEVD VE5fTjsNCiAgICBlbHNlDQogICAgCUdQQ1IgPSAweDEgPDwgQVJNX1NFTEVDVE5fTjsNCgkN Cn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXINCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfY29udHJvbChz dHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCiAgICB1X2ludDMyX3QgaW50IHJlZ19kYXRhID0gR1BM UjsNCiAgICB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyIGN0cmxfZGF0YSA9IDA7DQoNCiAgICBkcHJpbnRrKCJy ZWFkIGNvbnRyb2xcbiIpOw0KICAgIGN0cmxfZGF0YSB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikNCiAg ICAJCSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9TVFJPQkUpID4+IEFSTV9TVFJPQkVfTikNCgkJICA8 PCBQQVJQT1JUX0NPTlRST0xfU1RST0JFKTsNCiAgICBjdHJsX2RhdGEgfD0gKHVuc2lnbmVk IGNoYXIpDQogICAgCQkgKCgocmVnX2RhdGEgJiBBUk1fQVVUT0ZEKSA+PiBBUk1fQVVUT0ZE X04pDQoJCSAgPDwgUEFSUE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX0FVVE9GRCk7DQogICAgY3RybF9kYXRhIHw9 ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyKQ0KICAgIAkJICgoKHJlZ19kYXRhICYgQVJNX0lOSVQpID4+IEFS TV9JTklUX04pDQoJCSAgPDwgUEFSUE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX0lOSVQpOw0KICAgIGN0cmxfZGF0 YSB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikNCiAgICAJCSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1RO KSA+PiBBUk1fU0VMRUNUTikNCgkJICA8PCBQQVJQT1JUX0NPTlRST0xfU0VMRUNUKTsNCn0N Cg0Kc3RhdGljIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXINCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2Zyb2JfY29udHJvbChzdHJ1 Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBtYXNrLCB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyIHZhbCkN CnsNCiAgICB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyIG9sZCA9IHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfY29udHJvbChw KTsNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3dyaXRlX2NvbnRyb2wocCwgKG9sZCAmIH5tYXNrKSBe IHZhbCk7DQogICAgcmV0dXJuIG9sZDsNCn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXINCnBh cnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfc3RhdHVzKHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwKQ0Kew0KICAgIHVuc2ln bmVkIGNoYXIgc3RhdHVzID0gMDsNCiAgICB1X2ludDMyX3QJcmVnX2RhdGEgPSBHUExSOw0K DQogICAgc3RhdHVzIHw9ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyKSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9FUlJP UikgPj4gQVJNX0VSUk9SX04pDQogICAgCQkJICAgICAgIDw8IFBBUlBPUlRfU1RBVFVTX0VS Uk9SKTsNCg0KICAgIHN0YXR1cyB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikgKCgocmVnX2RhdGEgJiBB Uk1fQlVTWSkgPj4gQVJNX0JVU1NZX04pDQogICAgCQkJICAgICAgIDw8IFBBUlBPUlRfU1RB VFVTX0JVU1kpOw0KCQkJICAgICAgIA0KICAgIHN0YXR1cyB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikg KCgocmVnX2RhdGEgJiBBUk1fQUNLKSA+PiBBUk1fQUNLX04pDQogICAgCQkJICAgICAgIDw8 IFBBUlBPUlRfU1RBVFVTX0FDSyk7DQoJCQkgICAgICAgDQogICAgc3RhdHVzIHw9ICh1bnNp Z25lZCBjaGFyKSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1QpID4+IEFSTV9TRUxFQ1RfTikN CiAgICAJCQkgICAgICAgPDwgUEFSUE9SVF9TVEFUVVNfU0VMRUNUKTsNCgkJCSAgICAgICAN CiAgICBzdGF0dXMgfD0gKHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXIpICgoKHJlZ19kYXRhICYgQVJNX1BBUEVS T1VUKSA+PiBBUk1fUEFQRVJPVVRfTikNCiAgICAJCQkgICAgICAgPDwgUEFSUE9SVF9TVEFU VVNfUEFQRVJPVVQpOw0KDQogICAgcmV0dXJuIHN0YXR1czsNCn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQN CnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2VuYWJsZV9pcnEoc3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnQgKnApDQp7DQoJLy8gbm90 IGltcGxlbWVudGVkDQp9DQoNCnN0YXRpYyB2b2lkDQpwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9kaXNhYmxlX2ly cShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCgkvLyBub3QgaW1wbGVtZW50ZWQNCn0NCg0KLy8g Y2hhbmdlIGRpcmVjdGlvbiwgYnV0IGhvdyBhYm91dCB0aGUgc2lnbmFsaW5nPz8NCnN0YXRp YyB2b2lkDQpwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9mb3J3YXJkKHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwKQ0Kew0KCS8v IG5vdCBpbXBsZW1uZXRlZA0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fcmV2ZXJz ZShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCgkvLyBub3QgaW1wbGVtZW50ZWQNCn0NCg0Kc3Rh dGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2luaXRfc3RhdGUoc3RydWN0IHBhcmRldmljZSAqZGV2 LCBzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydF9zdGF0ICpzKQ0Kew0KCS8vIG5vdCBpbXBsZW1lbnRlZCAgICAN Cn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3NhdmVfc3RhdGUoc3RydWN0IHBhcnBv cnQgKnAsIHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0X3N0YXQgKnMpDQp7DQoJLy8gbm90IGltcGxlbWVudGVk DQp9DQoNCnN0YXRpYyB2b2lkDQpwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9pbmNfdXNlX2NvdW50KHZvaWQpDQp7 DQogICAgTU9EX0lOQ19VU0VfQ09VTlQ7DQp9DQoNCnN0YXRpYyB2b2lkDQpwYXJwb3J0X2Fy bV9kZWNfdXNlX2NvdW50KHZvaWQpDQp7DQogICAgTU9EX0RFQ19VU0VfQ09VTlQ7DQp9DQoN CnN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0X29wZXJhdGlvbnMgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fb3BzID0NCnsNCiAgICBw YXJwb3J0X2FybV93cml0ZV9kYXRhLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfZGF0YSwNCg0K DQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fd3JpdGVfY29udHJvbCwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9yZWFk X2NvbnRyb2wsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZnJvYl9jb250cm9sLA0KDQogICAgcGFycG9y dF9hcm1fcmVhZF9zdGF0dXMsDQoNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9lbmFibGVfaXJxLA0KICAg IHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2Rpc2FibGVfaXJxLA0KICAgIA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2RhdGFf Zm9yd2FyZCwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9kYXRhX3JldmVyc2UsDQoNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0 X2FybV9pbml0X3N0YXRlLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3NhdmVfc3RhdGUsDQogICAgcGFy cG9ydF9hcm1fcmVzb3RyZV9zdGF0ZSwNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2luY191c2VfY291 bnQsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZGVjX3VzZV9jb3VudCwNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfaWVl ZTEyODRfZXBwX3dyaXRlX2RhdGEsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9pZWVlMTI4NF9lcHBfcmVhZF9k YXRhLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfaWVlZTEyODRfZXBwX3dyaXRlX2FkZHIsDQogICAgcGFycG9y dF9pZWVlMTI4NF9lcHBfcmVhZF9hZGRyLA0KDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9pZWVlMTI4NF9lY3Bf d3JpdGVfZGF0YSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2llZWUxMjg0X2VjcF9yZWFkX2RhdGEsDQogICAg cGFycG9ydF9pZWVlMTI4NF9lY3Bfd3JpdGVfYWRkciwNCiAgICANCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2ll ZWUxMjg0X3dyaXRlX2NvbXBhdCwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2llZWUxMjg0X3JlYWRfbmliYmxl LA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfaWVlZTEyODRfcmVhZF9ieXRlDQp9Ow0KDQpNT0RVTEVfQVVUSE9S KCJaaHUgUXVuIFlpbmcgIHF5emh1QGtyZGwub3JnLnNnIik7DQpNT0RVTEVfREVTQ1JJUFRJ T04oInBhcmFsbGVsIHBvcnQgZm9yIFNyb25nQVJtIFNBMTEwMFxuIik7DQoNCi8vIG1vZHVs ZSBjb2RlDQppbnQNCmluaXRfbW9kdWxlKHZvaWQpDQp7DQogICAgc3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnQg KnA7DQovKiAgbmVlZCBtb3JlIGluZm9ybWF0aW9uIC4uLiAgIA0KICAgIHAgPSBwYXJwb3J0 X3JlZ2lzdGVyX3BvcnQoYmFzZV9hZGRyZXNzLAkvLyB3aGF0IGFkZHJlc3M/DQogICAgCQkJ ICAgICAgSVJRLAkJLy8gaXJxPw0KCQkJICAgICAgUEFQT1JUX0RNQV9OT0UsCS8vIE5PIERN QSwgY291bGQgSSB1c2UgRE1BPw0KCQkJICAgICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fb3BzKTsNCg0KICAg IGlmICghcCkNCiAgICAJcmV0dXJuIDE7DQoNCiAgICB0aGlzX3BvcnQgPSBwOw0KDQogICAg cGFycG9ydF9wcm9jX3JlZ2lzdGVyKHApOw0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYW5ub3VuY2VfcG9ydChw KTsNCiAgICAgDQogICAgZHByaW50aygicGFycG9ydF9hcm0gbW9kdWxlIGxvYWRlZFxuIik7 DQogICAgcmV0dXJuIFNVQ0NFU1M7DQoqLw0KfQ0KDQp2b2lkDQpjbGVhbnVwX21vZHVsZSh2 b2lkKQ0Kew0KICAgIGRwcmludGsoInBhcnBvcnRfYXJtIG1vZHVsZSByZW1vdmVkXG4iKTsN CiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X3Byb2NfdW5yZWdpc3Rlcih0aGlzX3BvcnQpOw0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRf dW5yZWdpc3Rlcl9wb3J0KHRoaXNfcG9ydCk7DQp9DQoNCg== --Boundary_(ID_wRVBnU9/3J4oXiPR+gU/6A)-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 17:59:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09708 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:57 +0200 Received: from mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (root@mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl [130.161.34.250]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09685 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id EAA07515 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:06:42 +0200 (METDST) Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSZ00A1MHV5X3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:06:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA04294; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:04:44 -0400 Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:04:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: How to make small glibc2 for ramdisk usage In-reply-to: <38F670F6.6EE7985A@krdl.org.sg> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: zhu qun ying Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000, zhu qun ying wrote: > Hi, > > I am trying to make my own ramdisk, and I need your advice. As you are using > glibc 2.1.2, how do you make the library small enough to fit into the ramdisk. > I mean normally when you compile a full set of glibc2, it may take more than > 3MB. Just 'strip' it. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 17:59:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA09714 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:58 +0200 Received: from mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (root@mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl [130.161.34.250]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA09688 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by mailhst2.its.tudelft.nl (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id DAA06806 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 03:15:53 +0200 (METDST) Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FSZ00992FIEJ7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 03:15:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA16271; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 09:21:22 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA00610; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 09:13:45 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 09:14:30 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: How to make small glibc2 for ramdisk usage To: Nicolas Pitre , lart Message-id: <38F670F6.6EE7985A@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I am trying to make my own ramdisk, and I need your advice. As you are using glibc 2.1.2, how do you make the library small enough to fit into the ramdisk. I mean normally when you compile a full set of glibc2, it may take more than 3MB. Thanks -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 18:18:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11116 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:18:43 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11076; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:18:24 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200004140140.LAA29985@minbar.b5.nu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:09:36 +0200 To: Raoul Endres From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: lart midi? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] >I'm extremely interesed in the lart for use with midi to sync up >midi instruments with audio and to crontrol lighting equipment (strobes etc) >with a live audio input. >Any hope of someone looking into this - all it would take is a couple of >midi ports (one in, one out?). I haven't got a clue about hardware design, >so I'm hopeing someone may be interested :) The SA-1100 has three serial ports that can be configured for RS232 operation. As MIDI is nothing more than RS232 with odd voltage levels at an odd clock; I expect this to be easily doable. Don't have the time for it myself tho. Any takers ? JD 'slashdotted' B. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, official C3 agency. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 18:22:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11334 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:22:09 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11330 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:22:07 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id SAA10648; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:22:05 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:22:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004141622.SAA10648@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Consider yourself slashdotted! In-Reply-To: <200004140230.EAA32635@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 04:30:57 +0200 (MEST), Marc Joosen wrote: > Congratulations everyone! > > It appears we have made it to Slashdot, http://www.slashdot.org/ with a > snippet from the LART FAQ: Yeah, we found out the hard way... [snip] > ...it also appears the server is having a lot of trouble keeping up with the > number of requests while I'm writing this (Thu Apr 13 22:10:29 EST 2000 == That's correct. We didn't expect it, so Apache wasn't really tuned for this load. The system load was 130 this morning, but after some tuning the server keeps up very well and the load hovers at about 0.5. FYI: we currently have 15107 hits from unique hosts. > Fri Apr 14 04:10:58 MEST 2000 - well, almost). People have even spotted the > intended pun in the name of the device: [snip] > Ok, so we're famous now. What next? World domination? Sssssh! You fool! You're not supposed to talk about our secret pact with Linus... Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 18:23:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11430 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:23:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11426 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:23:29 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT00080DLJ3WP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:23:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.82]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA16879 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:46:50 +0530 (IST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:51:20 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: how does lart compare to itsy? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <005d01bfa62d$78e0c9c0$521e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk hi.. i'm new to this list and lart :) i have looked at lart's features. but i still can't help but ask this question: how does the lart compare to compaq's itsy? itsy also uses a strongarm cpu. it aims to incorporate speech recognition, etc. i understand that compaq's itsy switches off cpu, etc. when the palmheld is idle, and only keeps the display alive... i dunno if this is very convinient for implementing games where a constant framerate is needed even when no user input is available like in demo playbacks. - muks __ __ _ _ __ __ _/ .\__/ .\__/ Mukund Iyer 91.040.7059751 .\__/ .\__/ .\_ .\__/ .\__/ .\_ muks@hd2.dot.net.in _/ .\__/ .\__/ _/ \__/ \__/ http://conic.cx muks/irc.linux \__/ \__/ \_ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 18:36:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA12397 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:36:40 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA12393 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:36:39 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id SAA10744; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:36:26 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:36:26 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004141636.SAA10744@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: muks@hd2.dot.net.in Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: how does lart compare to itsy? In-Reply-To: <005d01bfa62d$78e0c9c0$521e36ca@muks> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:51:20 +0530, Mukund Iyer wrote: > hi.. i'm new to this list and lart :) Welcome, consider yourself LARTed! :-) > i have looked at lart's features. but i still > can't help but ask this question: > > how does the lart compare to compaq's itsy? > itsy also uses a strongarm cpu. it aims to > incorporate speech recognition, etc. It's just as LART vs. PLEB: the Itsy has other design goals, so that's why it is different from the LART. And of course LART has a different license; the Itsy design files are not free. > i understand that compaq's itsy switches off > cpu, etc. when the palmheld is idle, and > only keeps the display alive... i dunno if this > is very convinient for implementing games where > a constant framerate is needed even when no user > input is available like in demo playbacks. We do not yet switch off the CPU, because we need support in the kernel and the bootloader for that, and time is short... On the other hand: one of our current prototypes has clock and voltage scaling, and that's also quite a battery saver. We'll make more information available as soon as Johan's paper is accepted (Johan?). Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 19:39:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA16577 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:39:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA16572 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:39:51 +0200 Received: from ethereal (resnet-21-203.dorm.utexas.edu [129.116.21.203]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000B4ZP2E1M@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:39:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nolan by ethereal with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 12gA4L-00052F-00 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:39:49 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:39:49 -0500 From: Nolan Darilek Subject: Possible use for LART? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello. I'm a Slashdotee; just saw the article and thought that this may be helpful for a pet project of mine which I've been toying with but didn't have the experience to work on. Would LART work well for this? First, I have little EE-ish experience. My experience consists primarily of software development, and very little with electronics. So, some of these questions will probably be non-LART-specific. If these types of questions aren't appropriate for this list, or are annoying for those of you who are doing serious work :), please direct me to any other resources which may help. I hung out in a few hardware-related newsgroups which claimed to discuss topics of this sort, but after the 100th question which (according to the old FAQ) was off-topic, I bolted. :) I want to design a MP3 player with specifications which are somewhat similar to the design at http://www.pjbox.com. Specifically, I'd like to support 4.8 gigs of storage space. There are some issues about that design that I don't like, however. It uses USB, and they don't sound very interested in supporting Linux (or at least, they didn't when I checked a few months ago.) Instead, I'd like to use an ethernet link, since I have a spare port. If I could simply hook up the MP3 player to the spare port, FTP songs into it and unplug it when I'm done, that'd be great. I'd also like to support output to headphones and a stereo system. My research seems to indicate that the headphone connection is non-amplified while the audio out for the stereo is, but is that accurate? I noticed that the Kitchen Sink board has audio out support; is this what I would need? How difficult is it to strip the USB and PS2 support from the board, since I really don't need that for this design? And, can the audio support be used with existing software products such as mpg123? Does it mimic an OSS/ALSA device? I'm also curious about the onboard storage. I noticed that Pricewatch sells 4.8 gig notebook drives. Naturally, the embedded software would need to be written so that it loads lots of the track into memory to minimize disk access, but how difficult would it be to connect a notebook drive to the KSB? Also, I'm not intensely interested in building the hardware for the system, since I don't have the necessary tools available. I'm more interested in the software aspects of the system -- modifying an FTP server to move MP3's based on ID3 tags, getting an MP3 player to work, writing a frontend which connects the assorted pieces together, etc. Are there any businesses which, if sent the specifications and money, can build the hardware? I noticed the link to http://www.4pcb.com in the README; are these folks able to do this? Thanks. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 20:20:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA18952 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:20:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA18948 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:20:16 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000CBRQXQ2V@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:20:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 26YGC4RW; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:10:54 -0700 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:17:49 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F760CD.D057697@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Nolan Darilek wrote: > I want to design a MP3 player with specifications which are somewhat > similar to the design at http://www.pjbox.com. Specifically, I'd like > to support 4.8 gigs of storage space. > Also, I'm not intensely interested in building the hardware for the > system, since I don't have the necessary tools available. I'm more > interested in the software aspects of the system -- modifying an FTP > server to move MP3's based on ID3 tags, getting an MP3 player to work, > writing a frontend which connects the assorted pieces together, > etc. Are there any businesses which, if sent the specifications and > money, can build the hardware? I noticed the link to > http://www.4pcb.com in the README; are these folks able to do this? Your not alone. This is exactly why I'm interested in the LART as well, although not with FTP. I think this is just one of the many embeded applications for which the LART is very well suited and have just been waiting for fully assembled MBs and KSBs to be offered somewhere... To the designers: Bravo! And keep up the good work. I hope GNU/GPL HW license changes the embeded product market. There are potentially thousands of uses for this powerful little board. Also, I'd love to see a picture of the MB and KSB all connected up. How thick are the two of them when connected? Again, thanx much... Varek Boettcher -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 20:31:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA19758 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:31:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA19753 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:31:56 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000BPCRH1EV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:31:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.139]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA19102; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:55:02 +0530 (IST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:59:31 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? To: Nolan Darilek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >There are some issues about that design that I don't like, however. It >uses USB, and they don't sound very interested in supporting Linux (or >at least, they didn't when I checked a few months ago.) Instead, I'd >like to use an ethernet link, since I have a spare port. If I could >simply hook up the MP3 player to the spare port, FTP songs into it and >unplug it when I'm done, that'd be great. why are you against USB? most new systems people buy/assemble contain USB support, whereas for eth, people may have to add support with a card. you know how this'll matter with my home pc :-) you want to ftp songs into the system? that would be ok i guess.. have a play directory (instead of a playlist)... >I'd also like to support output to headphones and a stereo system. My >research seems to indicate that the headphone connection is >non-amplified while the audio out for the stereo is, but is that >accurate? I noticed that the Kitchen Sink board has audio out support; >is this what I would need? How difficult is it to strip the USB and >PS2 support from the board, since I really don't need that for this >design? And, can the audio support be used with existing software >products such as mpg123? Does it mimic an OSS/ALSA device? dunno about this... but more than yes, it could be no. i guess that kitchen sink board is in its infancy. so most drivers would be RAW. i was thinking on the same lines too when i was going through compaq itsy... write a program to play MP3s on it.. i am new to the strongarm cpu.. won't be able to hand code optimized assembly right away :) it's nice that the kitchen sink board has audio support.. but i sometimes wonder if having *everything* is necessary.. i mean, why kitchen-sink? :-) another thing.. if lart needs a GUI, you should look at DinX at http://dinx.sourceforge.net/ could be a cup of tea. getting gtk apps to run would need gtk ported. i read somewhere that gtk needs only it's underlying gdk to be ported. the rest just builds on it.. i dunno :) send me a board and i'll try writing. LOL. BTW, is there a SOFTWARE TODO LIST???? let's get writing for lart! hey, did anyone talk about a video mpeg player? what? a handheld vcd player? hmm.. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 20:37:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA20004 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:37:26 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA19999 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:37:24 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000CP5RQA2V@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:37:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA13642 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:37:04 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:37:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: ksb board dimentions? In-reply-to: <38F64F71.BC84C77D@terus.envmtl.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk could someone please supply size info for the ksb board and possibly a .jpg/.gif of someone holding it for size comparison and scaling. an image of what a lart connected to a ksb looks like would be good also. these images would be good additions for the galary. Thanks, Eric -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:08:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21778 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:08:31 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21772 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:08:29 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id VAA11441; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:08:24 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:08:24 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004141908.VAA11441@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: ksb board dimentions? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:37:03 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > could someone please supply size info for the ksb board and possibly a > .jpg/.gif of someone holding it for size comparison and scaling. an image > of what a lart connected to a ksb looks like would be good also. these > images would be good additions for the galary. The KSB has the same dimensions as the LART main board: 10 x 7 cm (that is 4 x 3 inches in Stonehenge Units). l'Art gallery has a picture of a hand, so you can compare the size. I don't have a digital photo camera ready right now, so I can't make pictures of a LART+KSB combo. Erik -- "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:12:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21960 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:12:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21954 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:12:48 +0200 Received: from kate.norstanconsulting.com (email.norstanconsulting.com [204.73.79.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000DHXTDA8I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:12:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by KATE with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <243WF7SS>; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:08:18 -0500 Content-return: allowed Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:08:17 -0500 From: "Linder, Daniel G." Subject: RE: Possible use for LART? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello! Someone wrote: >I'd also like to support output to headphones and a stereo system. My >research seems to indicate that the headphone connection is >non-amplified while the audio out for the stereo is, but is that >accurate? I am pretty sure that standard headphone connections are amplified, and the output that goes to console stereos is non-amplified. Is this how the LART is wired? Dan -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:16:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA22185 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:16:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA22180 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:16:16 +0200 Received: from unusual.itslinux.org (HSE-Kitchener-ppp84972.sympatico.ca [216.209.98.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000DLATIT8I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:16:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from lethal@localhost) by unusual.itslinux.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA02483; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:15:17 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:15:16 -0500 From: Paul Mundt Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: ; from nolan_d@bigfoot.com on Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 12:39:49PM -0500 To: Nolan Darilek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000414151516.A1357@chaoticdreams.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.1.8i References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 12:39:49PM -0500, Nolan Darilek wrote: > There are some issues about that design that I don't like, however. It > uses USB, and they don't sound very interested in supporting Linux (or > at least, they didn't when I checked a few months ago.) Instead, I'd > like to use an ethernet link, since I have a spare port. If I could > simply hook up the MP3 player to the spare port, FTP songs into it and > unplug it when I'm done, that'd be great. > What would be the need for a seperate ethernet link? You can already do IP over USB and you can pickup a dozen some odd usb ethernet adapters if you are really set on ethernet. -- Paul Mundt Unusual Enterprises http://unusual.itslinux.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:24:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA22634 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:24:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA22630 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:24:38 +0200 Received: from snail.ecs.umass.edu (snail.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.94]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000E05TX08R@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:24:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from odo.ecs.umass.edu (odo.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.174]) by snail.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA25642; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:09:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mcrichto@localhost) by odo.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id PAA16060; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:09:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:09:35 -0400 From: Mark Crichton Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks>; from muks@hd2.dot.net.in on Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 11:59:31PM +0530 To: Mukund Iyer Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: crichton@gimp.org Message-id: <20000414150935.A15713@odo.ecs.umass.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Quoting Mukund Iyer (muks@hd2.dot.net.in): > > another thing.. if lart needs a GUI, you should look at DinX > at http://dinx.sourceforge.net/ could be a cup of tea. > getting gtk apps to run would need gtk ported. > i read somewhere that gtk needs only it's underlying gdk to > be ported. the rest just builds on it.. i dunno :) Why? That would be PAINFUL! ;) Especially when we got something "easier". ;) However, you should know that X does run on an Itsy. Thanks to a lot of work by Keith Packard, there is a really tiny X server buried in XFree 4.0 (the kdriver). I saw Jim's Itsy running X quite well @ LE '99. (It was very cool to see xclock running... ;) ) The only "big" thing I've run into while playing with Linux on my CE device is that gtk is "chubby". However, with a good theme engine, it might get better. Now size wise, that's still an ongoing debate on the gtk-lists... Does anyone have some prelim design specs for an LCD/touchscreen for the LART? I know what needs to be hammered on in the X code... ;) Mark (and as soon as I can find some good/cheap/Linux (pick 2) PCB layout/schematic capture, I might have my NTSC/PAL decoder for the LART... ;) Any suggestions?) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:31:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA23043 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:31:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA23039 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:31:28 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000EDKU741Z@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:31:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA13853; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:31:33 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:31:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: ksb board dimentions? In-reply-to: <200004141908.VAA11441@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk forgot to ask... How much power do they consume when combined? Also how hard would it be to graft both into say a 10 x 14 cm (4 x 6 stonehenge units) single board. here's the idea - slap a 10 x 14 lcd touch-panel on the front and a Gig of flash ram (via ide) on the back... linux based palm computer that will make other platforms flee as they win ce. Eric On Fri, 14 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:37:03 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > could someone please supply size info for the ksb board and possibly a > > .jpg/.gif of someone holding it for size comparison and scaling. an image > > of what a lart connected to a ksb looks like would be good also. these > > images would be good additions for the galary. > > The KSB has the same dimensions as the LART main board: 10 x 7 cm (that is > 4 x 3 inches in Stonehenge Units). l'Art gallery has a picture of a hand, > so you can compare the size. I don't have a digital photo camera ready > right now, so I can't make pictures of a LART+KSB combo. > > > Erik > > -- > "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is > legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." > -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq > > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 21:35:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA23259 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:35:21 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA23255 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:35:20 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id VAA11569; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:35:18 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:35:18 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004141935.VAA11569@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nolan_d@bigfoot.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:39:49 -0500, Nolan Darilek wrote: > Hello. I'm a Slashdotee; just saw the article and thought that this > may be helpful for a pet project of mine which I've been toying with > but didn't have the experience to work on. Would LART work well for > this? FYI: 17101 unique hosts due to the Slashdot effect uptil now ;-) > I want to design a MP3 player with specifications which are somewhat > similar to the design at http://www.pjbox.com. Specifically, I'd like > to support 4.8 gigs of storage space. Sounds like LART + KSB + IDE. > There are some issues about that design that I don't like, however. It > uses USB, and they don't sound very interested in supporting Linux (or > at least, they didn't when I checked a few months ago.) Instead, I'd > like to use an ethernet link, since I have a spare port. If I could > simply hook up the MP3 player to the spare port, FTP songs into it and > unplug it when I'm done, that'd be great. Both are possible with the LART+KSB combo, although the SA-1100 USB implementation has some silicon bugs: you can use it if it is the only USB device. Also note that it is USB client only, the SA-1100 can't act as a USB root. > I'd also like to support output to headphones and a stereo system. My > research seems to indicate that the headphone connection is > non-amplified while the audio out for the stereo is, but is that > accurate? I noticed that the Kitchen Sink board has audio out support; > is this what I would need? How difficult is it to strip the USB and > PS2 support from the board, since I really don't need that for this > design? And, can the audio support be used with existing software > products such as mpg123? Does it mimic an OSS/ALSA device? Stripping the USB and PS/2 is as simple as not mounting the connectors and leaving out one driver chip. I'm planning to write a OSS/ALSA compatible audio device, but it will be limited: output only, and at a fixed sample rate. The rate can be fixed at 44.1KHz or 48KHz, depending on the crystal for the DAC. > I'm also curious about the onboard storage. I noticed that Pricewatch > sells 4.8 gig notebook drives. Naturally, the embedded software would > need to be written so that it loads lots of the track into memory to > minimize disk access, but how difficult would it be to connect a > notebook drive to the KSB? Not difficult. We currently have a Toshiba notebook disk for which we're going to write a driver. It can't be too difficult, according to Nicolas Pitre. > Also, I'm not intensely interested in building the hardware for the > system, since I don't have the necessary tools available. I'm more > interested in the software aspects of the system -- modifying an FTP > server to move MP3's based on ID3 tags, getting an MP3 player to work, > writing a frontend which connects the assorted pieces together, One of the most important things to be modified is the MP3 player itself. All MP3 players I know read the MP3 file while they're playing. Not a big problem for a desktop machine, but for a handheld MP3 player, it would mean that the disk has to spin while playing an MP3. The MP3 player needs to be modified in such a way that it caches one or more MP3 files and allows the OS to spin down the disk. > etc. Are there any businesses which, if sent the specifications and > money, can build the hardware? I noticed the link to > http://www.4pcb.com in the README; are these folks able to do this? No, they only make PCBs AFAIK. There are a couple of people on this list who're planning to build some LARTs, I'm sure they will inform the list when they're ready. Stay tuned. Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:05:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA24869 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:05:53 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA24865 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:05:53 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA11672; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:05:43 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:05:43 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142005.WAA11672@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: crichton@gimp.org Cc: muks@hd2.dot.net.in, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: <20000414150935.A15713@odo.ecs.umass.edu> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:09:35 -0400, Mark Crichton wrote: > > Quoting Mukund Iyer (muks@hd2.dot.net.in): >> >> another thing.. if lart needs a GUI, you should look at DinX >> at http://dinx.sourceforge.net/ could be a cup of tea. >> getting gtk apps to run would need gtk ported. >> i read somewhere that gtk needs only it's underlying gdk to >> be ported. the rest just builds on it.. i dunno :) > > Why? That would be PAINFUL! ;) Especially when we got something "easier". ;) Actually, there were some messages about porting GTK+ to MicroWindows/NanoX on the gtk-devel mailing list a week ago. Owen Taylor (GTK+) had a lot of comments on NanoX, but Greg Haerr (NanoX) took it quite well and asked Owen to try an alpha port of GTK+ to NanoX (dunno if he meant it as a Linus Torvalds-like "show me the code"). The thread more or less died out, but the bottom line was that it was a good idea. > However, you should know that X does run on an Itsy. Thanks to a lot of > work by Keith Packard, there is a really tiny X server buried in XFree 4.0 > (the kdriver). I saw Jim's Itsy running X quite well @ LE '99. (It was very > cool to see xclock running... ;) ) I agree, it's cool to run X on a handheld, but sometimes you really don't need the complete client-server support, especially because an X server has quite a large memory footprint. In that case, things like NanoX with GTK+ can be quite nice. > The only "big" thing I've run into while playing with Linux on my CE device > is that gtk is "chubby". However, with a good theme engine, it might get > better. Now size wise, that's still an ongoing debate on the gtk-lists... I think the big question is: how well does GTK+ scale to a small grey level LCD? M$ Windows looks awful on such a screen, I hope we can change GTK+ in such a way that it looks good. > Does anyone have some prelim design specs for an LCD/touchscreen for the LART? > I know what needs to be hammered on in the X code... ;) Johan wants to buy an LCD/touchscreen, but he hasn't yet decided which one. The LART itself is ready for it: the SA-1100 has LCD output, and the UCB 1200 on the KSB has a touchscreen interface (for which I have to write a driver). Erik -- The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy about Microsoft products: It is very easy to be blinded to the essential uselessness of them by the sense of achievement you get from getting them to work at all. In other words---and this is the rock-solid principle on which the whole of the Corporation's Galaxywide success is founded---their fundamental design flaws are completely hidden by their superficial design flaws. -- Anonymous; based on Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:14:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA25297 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:14:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA25290 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:14:12 +0200 Received: from ethereal (resnet-21-203.dorm.utexas.edu [129.116.21.203]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000F40W7MKQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:14:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nolan by ethereal with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 12gCFG-0005FS-00; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:59:14 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:59:14 -0500 From: Nolan Darilek Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> To: muks@hd2.dot.net.in Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: References: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Mukund" == Mukund Iyer writes: Mukund> why are you against USB? most new systems people Mukund> buy/assemble contain USB support, whereas for eth, people Mukund> may have to add support with a card. you know how this'll Mukund> matter with my home pc :-) I'm not against USB at all. The box which I built last year has it and, though I haven't had the opportunity to use it, it sounds great. I am against writing specialized software to spit data over a link using a product-specific protocol, when something like FTP would work nicely. (Of course, I doubt FTP support could be used in an actual retail product without modifying the server to not support downloading. *shrug*) Since this is for my own use though, I thought that ethernet would be better. :) Mukund> you want to ftp songs into the system? that would be ok i Mukund> guess.. have a play directory (instead of a playlist)... Exactly. And a modified server which would, upon completion of an upload, move the file into an Artist/Album/Title.mp3 structure, or place it in an Unsorted directory, or let you make play "directories" and "lists" which behave a bit differently. Mukund> i was thinking on the same lines too when i was going Mukund> through compaq itsy... write a program to play MP3s on Mukund> it.. i am new to the strongarm cpu.. won't be able to Mukund> hand code optimized assembly right away :) Hmm, and this is another question of mine (excuse my newbiishness :). Since the board runs Linux, why would you need to code in assembly? Is it only used to increase speed in critical areas? Or, could something like mpg123 simply be cross compiled? The idea which I wanted to use for the structure involved a small root partition on the large notebook drive. This would be used to store /usr, /lib, /etc and other useful directories. The remainder of the disk space would be used to store MP3's. In this manner, a majority of the software could be easily upgraded to add new features and such. My concern with this is boot time: I wouldn't be running much beyond a FTP server and a frontend which ran an MP3 player and organized all functions into a menu structure. Is this a bad idea, though? Since I'm considering gigs of storage, I can afford to create a small, 32 meg installation of Linux with very limited functionality, but should I instead try to cram everything onto a few megs of flash? Mukund> another thing.. if lart needs a GUI, you should look at Mukund> DinX at http://dinx.sourceforge.net/ could be a cup of Mukund> tea. getting gtk apps to run would need gtk ported. i Mukund> read somewhere that gtk needs only it's underlying gdk to Mukund> be ported. the rest just builds on it.. i dunno :) send me Mukund> a board and i'll try writing. LOL. Heh, I was just thinking of text-based with ncurses. :) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:22:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA25654 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA25650 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:02 +0200 From: david.belius@chello.se Received: from smtp2.chello.se (smtp2.chello.se [193.150.195.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000FA0WKPAD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chello.se ([193.150.216.55]) by smtp2.chello.se (InterMail vK.4.02.00.00 201-232-116 license 70acae3d5ac8b27d1dfb8564bfbfa8a7) with ESMTP id <20000414200835.SWSZ27496.smtp2@chello.se> for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:08:35 +0200 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:08:23 +0200 Subject: price... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F77AB6.B182CE65@chello.se> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk What would it cost to build a lart? /David -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:22:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA25677 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA25670 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:13 +0200 Received: from mail2.netcologne.de (mail2.netcologne.de [194.8.194.103]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000EFGWL0ZI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from colin.anarcho.net (dial-194-8-209-41.netcologne.de [194.8.209.41]) by mail2.netcologne.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA05021; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:09:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from baer@localhost) by colin.anarcho.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA01361; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:10:24 +0200 X-URL: Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:10:24 +0200 From: Thomas Renard X-Face: 43Gd&$n()k_953x*S*S$KvhoZ5HRR+\?HpR1~dG@&6B[/EKmoE.5mYc3v#`Ahf[{ekw}SL9 g|pT#VQ8a.~3xURG\j?G@roW>lq*V323P[~3fZu6.~DxATbN&IGSABZ*aQ*:1XPF-i[m"h.z&S[k3J a[.Rfdjk9(?uQ$CQ=-& Subject: Re: lart midi? In-reply-to: "J.D. Bakker"'s message of "Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:09:36 +0200" To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Raoul Endres , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: Organization: The Anarcho Net MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Gnus/5.070099 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.99) XEmacs/21.1 (Canyonlands) Lines: 33 References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk * J D Bakker writes: > [cc-ed to the LART list] >> I'm extremely interesed in the lart for use with midi to sync up >> midi instruments with audio and to crontrol lighting equipment >> (strobes etc) with a live audio input. >> Any hope of someone looking into this - all it would take is a >> couple of midi ports (one in, one out?). I haven't got a clue about >> hardware design, so I'm hopeing someone may be interested :) > The SA-1100 has three serial ports that can be configured for RS232 > operation. As MIDI is nothing more than RS232 with odd voltage > levels at an odd clock; I expect this to be easily doable. Don't > have the time for it myself tho. Any takers ? Just a little question of an old MIDI-programmer: Which Baudrates can this RS232 manage? MIDI needs 31,25 kBit/s - this cannot be realized by a standard RS232 divider! For the hardware: http://www.midi.org/about-midi/abtmidi.htm > JD 'slashdotted' B. > -- Jan-Derk Bakker, official C3 agency. Thomas -- Thomas Renard Ich glaub, Atomstrom Thomas.Renard@smail.uni-koeln.de ist gelb -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:22:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA25707 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA25703 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:38 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000FDTWLNB5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:22:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([203.197.21.19]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA04676; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:45:56 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:50:26 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? To: Nolan Darilek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <001a01bfa64e$e0583400$1315c5cb@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Nolan Darilek: >Hmm, and this is another question of mine (excuse my newbiishness >:). Since the board runs Linux, why would you need to code in >assembly? Is it only used to increase speed in critical areas? Or, >could something like mpg123 simply be cross compiled? > exactly for increasing speed in critical areas. mpg123 *can* be simply cross compiled, but a lot of performance can be gained by rewriting those critical sections in optimized assembly. btw, coding or not coding in assembly has nothing to do with linux. >The idea which I wanted to use for the structure involved a small root >partition on the large notebook drive. This would be used to store >/usr, /lib, /etc and other useful directories. The remainder of the >disk space would be used to store MP3's. In this manner, a majority of >the software could be easily upgraded to add new features and such. My >concern with this is boot time: I wouldn't be running much beyond a >FTP server and a frontend which ran an MP3 player and organized all >functions into a menu structure. Is this a bad idea, though? Since I'm >considering gigs of storage, I can afford to create a small, 32 meg >installation of Linux with very limited functionality, but should I >instead try to cram everything onto a few megs of flash? > it depends on what you're trying to build. if you are going to be putting a harddisk, you could put everything on the hard disk and leave a boot loader in ROM. but if you want to store your songs in RAM or nonvolatile RAM with no hdd (like most MP3 players do nowadays), you would have to put your software in the flash. i guess lart's flash has enough for a decent MP3 player.. you might be able to add in a couple of custom skins too :) > >Heh, I was just thinking of text-based with ncurses. :) > HEY! then what happens to my smart 3d opengl visualization plugin?? of course, we need a GUI. and opengl too :) am i kidding? they did port it to palm! - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:32:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA26256 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:32:04 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA26252 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:32:03 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA11795; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:31:57 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:31:57 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142031.WAA11795@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nolan_d@bigfoot.com Cc: muks@hd2.dot.net.in, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:59:14 -0500, Nolan Darilek wrote: >>>>>> "Mukund" == Mukund Iyer writes: > Mukund> i was thinking on the same lines too when i was going > Mukund> through compaq itsy... write a program to play MP3s on > Mukund> it.. i am new to the strongarm cpu.. won't be able to > Mukund> hand code optimized assembly right away :) > > Hmm, and this is another question of mine (excuse my newbiishness > :). Since the board runs Linux, why would you need to code in > assembly? Is it only used to increase speed in critical areas? Or, > could something like mpg123 simply be cross compiled? Correct. Gcc-2.95.2 generates very good code for the SA-1100 processor. Have a look at the "MPEG audio decoding" thread in the mailing list archive. > The idea which I wanted to use for the structure involved a small root > partition on the large notebook drive. This would be used to store > /usr, /lib, /etc and other useful directories. The remainder of the > disk space would be used to store MP3's. In this manner, a majority of > the software could be easily upgraded to add new features and such. My > concern with this is boot time: I wouldn't be running much beyond a > FTP server and a frontend which ran an MP3 player and organized all > functions into a menu structure. Is this a bad idea, though? Since I'm > considering gigs of storage, I can afford to create a small, 32 meg > installation of Linux with very limited functionality, but should I > instead try to cram everything onto a few megs of flash? You'd better put the root partition in a RAM disk. As I already said in this thread: spinning a disk eats batteries. Erik -- "[Microsoft] ... guarantees 99.8% NT uptime for certain hard-/software. That's exactly the 3 minutes daily that my NT server needs to reboot." -- ZDnet editorial -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:38:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA26539 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:38:07 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA26535 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:38:06 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA11811; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:38:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:38:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142038.WAA11811@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: ksb board dimentions? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:31:32 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > forgot to ask... How much power do they consume when combined? Also how I haven't measured it yet. > hard would it be to graft both into say a 10 x 14 cm (4 x 6 stonehenge > units) single board. here's the idea - slap a 10 x 14 lcd touch-panel on > the front and a Gig of flash ram (via ide) on the back... linux based > palm computer that will make other platforms flee as they win ce. It's quite hard, because you'd need a board redesign. No, you can't use flatcable between the LART and the KSB, simply because 1mm flatcable doesn't exist. OTOH, you can mount a LART+KSB next to a 2.5" IDE disk and put them behind a LCD panel. Same size, less engineering effort. Erik -- Apr 14 22:37:58 linux kernel: lp0 printer error Apr 14 22:37:58 linux kernel: lp0 on fire -- Linux kernel log -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:42:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA26729 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:42:24 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA26725 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:42:23 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA11827; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:42:11 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:42:11 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142042.WAA11827@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: david.belius@chello.se Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: price... In-Reply-To: <38F77AB6.B182CE65@chello.se> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:08:23 +0200, david.belius@chello.se wrote: > What would it cost to build a lart? The LART distribution README file (LARTdist-README) at the main board page (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/plint/ ) has a not-yet-complete Bill of Materials. Our prototypes were about 500 to 600 euro each, but a run of 100 will approximately be 200 to 300 euro. Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:44:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA26840 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:44:26 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA26836 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:44:25 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000FM9XLYKQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:44:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([203.197.21.19]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA02184 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:07:46 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:12:16 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: arm instruction set?? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002a01bfa651$ecb96cc0$1315c5cb@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk oh yes.. i'm new to the arm family. i downloaded intel's manuals for SA-1100 and SA-1110, but there is no instruction set in them. the text says: "The SA-1100 implements the ARM (TM) V4 architecture as defined in the ARM Architecture Reference, 28-July-1995, with previously noted options and additions." where can i download an electronic version? - muks __ __ _ _ __ __ _/ .\__/ .\__/ Mukund Iyer 91.040.7059751 .\__/ .\__/ .\_ .\__/ .\__/ .\_ muks@hd2.dot.net.in _/ .\__/ .\__/ _/ \__/ \__/ http://conic.cx muks/irc.linux \__/ \__/ \_ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:49:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27138 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:49:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27131 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:49:13 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000FOIXTYAD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:49:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([203.197.21.19]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA13022; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:11:11 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:15:42 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: lart midi? To: Thomas Renard Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002f01bfa652$67193ea0$1315c5cb@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Just a little question of an old MIDI-programmer: Which Baudrates can >this RS232 manage? > >MIDI needs 31,25 kBit/s - this cannot be realized by a standard RS232 >divider! > The SA-1100 has 2 serial ports. One for USB and the other for SDLC and UART. The UART port can manage 56.24 bps to 230.4 Kbps according to the manual. - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 22:53:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27343 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:53:37 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27339 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:53:36 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA11885; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:52:04 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:52:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142052.WAA11885@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: Thomas.Renard@smail.uni-koeln.de Cc: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl, endres@b5.nu, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: lart midi? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:10:24 +0200, Thomas Renard wrote: > Just a little question of an old MIDI-programmer: Which Baudrates can > this RS232 manage? All standard baudrates upto 230k4, but ... > MIDI needs 31,25 kBit/s - this cannot be realized by a standard RS232 > divider! .. you can connect an external clock to the serial port, and in that case 31,25 kBit/s is very easy to do. Erik PS: My Roland digital piano has a serial port that runs at 38k4 and speaks MIDI, so I suppose there are more MIDI devices that can do this trick. -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:11:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA28131 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:11:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28127 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:11:28 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000GA1YV2TH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:11:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id QAA32167; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:07:04 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:07:04 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: arm instruction set?? In-reply-to: <002a01bfa651$ecb96cc0$1315c5cb@muks> To: Mukund Iyer Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004142107.QAA32167@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mukund Iyer asked... > oh yes.. i'm new to the arm family. > i downloaded intel's manuals for SA-1100 and SA-1110, > but there is no instruction set in them. > > where can i download an electronic version? I'm not aware of an Intel specific document, but you can get the instruction set from the ARM pages. The instructions are documented in... http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/ARM7vC.pdf The quick reference card is at... http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/QRC-0001D.pdf The ARM MMUs are covered in... http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/DDI0150A_920T_TRM.pdf -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:14:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA28249 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:14:07 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28237; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:13:59 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000414150935.A15713@odo.ecs.umass.edu> References: <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks>; from muks@hd2.dot.net.in on Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 11:59:31PM +0530 <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:13:38 +0200 To: crichton@gimp.org From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? Cc: Mukund Iyer , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Does anyone have some prelim design specs for an LCD/touchscreen for the LART? >I know what needs to be hammered on in the X code... ;) The SA-1100 connects to just about any LCD: passive/active, mono/color, up to 1024x1024. I personally connected the LART to a mono passive display (in l'art gallery) and a color active display. As for the touch screen, the UCB1200 has an universal 4-wire analog interface. The data sheets are well worth the read. >(and as soon as I can find some good/cheap/Linux (pick 2) PCB layout/schematic As I use sucky and Windows right now, I'd settle for good and Linux. Any suggestions ? >capture, I might have my NTSC/PAL decoder for the LART... ;) Ah, that's on my todo list as well. JDB [who thinks those AD video chips are quite nice] -- Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:23:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA28739 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:23:10 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28731; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:23:05 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:19:49 +0200 To: "Linder, Daniel G." From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: RE: Possible use for LART? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >I am pretty sure that standard headphone connections are amplified, and the >output that goes to console stereos is non-amplified. Is this how the LART >is wired? Yes. The line output comes straight from the output filter; the headphone connector comes, well, from the headphone amp. Audio purists note that the line output thus has (marginally) less noise and distortion. JDB. -- If you think the problem is bad now, just wait until we've solved it. -- Arthur Kasspe -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:28:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA28965 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:28:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28955 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:28:34 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT000HDRZNB9U@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:28:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA14398; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:29:21 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: price... In-reply-to: <200004142042.WAA11827@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: david.belius@chello.se, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk for those that want to know how much this would be in their own currency I've found www.euro.fee.be/currency_converter.htm. as of today multiplyb by .9549 to get U$D. On Fri, 14 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:08:23 +0200, david.belius@chello.se wrote: > > What would it cost to build a lart? > > The LART distribution README file (LARTdist-README) at the main board page > (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/plint/ ) has a not-yet-complete Bill > of Materials. Our prototypes were about 500 to 600 euro each, but a run of > 100 will approximately be 200 to 300 euro. > > > Erik > > -- > A towel has immense psychological value. > -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:33:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29221 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:33:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29216 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:33:02 +0200 Received: from phnxpop4.phnx.uswest.net (phnxpop4.phnx.uswest.net [206.80.192.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT000GLJZV0HH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:33:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 20031 invoked by alias); Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:30:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 20016 invoked by uid 0); Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:30:36 +0000 Received: from bdslppp188.phnx.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.217.188) by phnxpop4.phnx.uswest.net with SMTP; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:30:36 +0000 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:29:52 -0700 From: Kevin Brown Subject: New to list To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F78DD0.6724C11A@uswest.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Delivered-to: fixup-lart@lart.tudelft.nl@fixme X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I found this project through Slashdot yesterday and since my dad is trying to get a hold of a StrongARM from Intel I thought I'd check it out. One of the things I'm interested in is doing a kinda portable digital music player with an LCD. I noticed in the gallery that with an add-on the Lart could be connected to one. So, anyone have any pointers on where I could look to do this with the Lart? -- "Intel giveth and Microsoft Taketh Away" - Gordon Moore -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:40:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29589 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:40:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29576 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:40:50 +0200 Received: from email.ancore.com (host13.ancore.com [204.118.176.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100GOE080JB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:40:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from sweety (adsl-63-193-113-118.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.193.113.118]) by email.ancore.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id G10NF15A; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:37:17 -0700 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:39:43 -0700 From: Mike Ingle work Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <001001bfa659$f326ce10$7671c13f@local.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: "2000 at 11:59:31PM +0530" <002801bfa63f$6281fde0$8b1e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > As I use sucky and Windows right now, I'd settle for good and Linux. Any > suggestions ? > I use PROTEL on Windows NT for sch capture and pcb layout. If I couldn't run NT I would look at EAGLE in Germany. Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:44:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29797 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:44:58 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29791 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:44:56 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA12051; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:44:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:44:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142144.XAA12051@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: jim@federated.com Cc: muks@hd2.dot.net.in, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: arm instruction set?? In-Reply-To: <200004142107.QAA32167@core.federated.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:07:04 -0500 (CDT), Jim Studt wrote: > Mukund Iyer asked... >> oh yes.. i'm new to the arm family. >> i downloaded intel's manuals for SA-1100 and SA-1110, >> but there is no instruction set in them. >> >> where can i download an electronic version? > > I'm not aware of an Intel specific document, but you can get the > instruction set from the ARM pages. > > The instructions are documented in... > http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/ARM7vC.pdf > The quick reference card is at... > http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/QRC-0001D.pdf > > The ARM MMUs are covered in... > http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/DDI0150A_920T_TRM.pdf Thanks Jim. JDB once gave me those documents, but I didn't know they could be downloaded from the ARM site. I just updated the "LART Documentation" page: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/doc.php3 . Erik [:wq] -- Real Programmers consider "what you see is what you get" to be just as bad a concept in Text Editors as it is in women. No, the Real Programmer wants a "you asked for it, you got it" text editor -- complicated, cryptic, powerful, unforgiving, dangerous. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:49:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA30061 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:49:52 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA30057 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:49:51 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA12062; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:49:47 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:49:47 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142149.XAA12062@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: david.belius@chello.se, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: price... In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:29:21 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > for those that want to know how much this would be in their own currency > I've found www.euro.fee.be/currency_converter.htm. as of today multiplyb > by .9549 to get U$D. Oops, sorry. I just cut-and-pasted this reply to a previous question from a earopean user, not realizing that the USD is a bit more internationally known. For simple use 1 USD == 1 euro. Erik -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in alt.sysadmin.recovery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:50:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA30106 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:50:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA30102 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:50:58 +0200 Received: from snail.ecs.umass.edu (snail.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.94]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100GQU0OWHH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:50:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from odo.ecs.umass.edu (odo.ecs.umass.edu [128.119.91.174]) by snail.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA02274; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:10:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mcrichto@localhost) by odo.ecs.umass.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id RAA21210; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:05:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:05:20 -0400 From: Mark Crichton Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <200004142005.WAA11672@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl>; from J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl on Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 10:05:43PM +0200 To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000414170520.A20918@odo.ecs.umass.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <20000414150935.A15713@odo.ecs.umass.edu> <200004142005.WAA11672@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk * Erik Mouw (J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl) [000414 16:05]: > Actually, there were some messages about porting GTK+ to > MicroWindows/NanoX on the gtk-devel mailing list a week ago. Owen Taylor Expect the port in a week. The code is "there" but Pablo (IIRC) hasn't released it yet. And Greg took Owen's critisims of NanoX very well (there was some really bad namespace pollution issues, for starters). Some of that code is in the most recent beta release. > I agree, it's cool to run X on a handheld, but sometimes you really don't > need the complete client-server support, especially because an X server > has quite a large memory footprint. In that case, things like NanoX with > GTK+ can be quite nice. NanoX is also client/server. ;) However, the kdriver IIRC is "X with lipo- suction" + many extensions removed (Anyone use XIE? Didn't think so. ;) ) I'll have a look into the code/what gets built, but I think it's lighterweight than your normal X bin that sits around. > > I think the big question is: how well does GTK+ scale to a small grey > level LCD? M$ Windows looks awful on such a screen, I hope we can change > GTK+ in such a way that it looks good. Yea. Writing a specific theme engine might help (look at ThinIce for an example of what I'm mumbling about). However, 1.4 looks like it's gonna be One Large Beast :| And gtk+ is already in that Ugly Motif-like Grey. ;) > Johan wants to buy an LCD/touchscreen, but he hasn't yet decided which > one. The LART itself is ready for it: the SA-1100 has LCD output, and the > UCB 1200 on the KSB has a touchscreen interface (for which I have to write > a driver). Hmmm, guess I'll dig out my SA-1100 notes. I'll be more than happy to write the fbdev for the sucka. ;) (of course, I dont have a board...but if you want to ship me one. :) :) :) ) I'll take a look at the gtk thing. Since the uWindows people would also care about such things... Mark -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 14 23:58:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA30495 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:58:54 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA30490 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:58:53 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA12106; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:58:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:58:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142158.XAA12106@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mcrichto@ecs.umass.edu Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: <20000414170520.A20918@odo.ecs.umass.edu> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:05:20 -0400, Mark Crichton wrote: > * Erik Mouw (J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl) [000414 16:05]: >> Actually, there were some messages about porting GTK+ to >> MicroWindows/NanoX on the gtk-devel mailing list a week ago. Owen Taylor > > Expect the port in a week. The code is "there" but Pablo (IIRC) hasn't > released it yet. Wow! > Hmmm, guess I'll dig out my SA-1100 notes. I'll be more than happy to write > the fbdev for the sucka. ;) (of course, I dont have a board...but if you want > to ship me one. :) :) :) ) I don't want to spoil your party, but the fbdev already works. Have a look at l'Art gallery. The fbdev stuff in the kernel just needs a large cleanup. Erik -- unix soit qui mal y pense -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 00:15:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA31248 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:15:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA31243 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:15:54 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100J0H1T60W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:15:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id RAA03366; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:12:10 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:12:10 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <20000414170520.A20918@odo.ecs.umass.edu> To: Mark Crichton Cc: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004142212.RAA03366@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mark wrote... > Hmmm, guess I'll dig out my SA-1100 notes. I'll be more than happy to write > the fbdev for the sucka. ;) (of course, I dont have a board...but if you want > to ship me one. :) :) :) ) 2.3.99-pre5 contains linux/drivers/video/sa1100fb.c Looks like one Eric A. Thomas is on it. It needs work with palettes and resoultions (if its comments are to be believed). -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 00:20:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA31452 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:20:39 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA31448 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:20:38 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:20:09 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: ANNOUNCE: Ethernet card schematics released Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, For those who hadn't noticed yet, I've put up the schematics for the single Ethernet interface. I'll try to post the quad Ethernet schematics after the weekend. JDB. -- I may be obsessive-compulsive, but it's NOT a disorder ! -- Paul S. Sawyer in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 00:34:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32014 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:34:10 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32010 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:34:09 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id AAA12220; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:34:05 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:34:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004142234.AAA12220@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: jim@federated.com Cc: mcrichto@ecs.umass.edu, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: <200004142212.RAA03366@core.federated.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:12:10 -0500 (CDT), Jim Studt wrote: > Mark wrote... >> Hmmm, guess I'll dig out my SA-1100 notes. I'll be more than happy to write >> the fbdev for the sucka. ;) (of course, I dont have a board...but if you want >> to ship me one. :) :) :) ) > > 2.3.99-pre5 contains linux/drivers/video/sa1100fb.c Yes, that's the one from Nicolas Pitre's sa1100 tree, which is merged into Russel King's arm tree, which is merged into Linus' tree. > Looks like one Eric A. Thomas is on it. It needs work with palettes and > resoultions (if its comments are to be believed). I don't know his email address, the code needs some work, but I don't know if he's currently working on it. JDB already made it a bit more useable, because there were some errors in the palette code. Working from a video coding groups helps in such cases ... ;-) Erik -- "It said Windows 95 or better, so in theory Linux should run it." -- GeorgeH on /. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 00:49:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32597 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:49:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32593 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:49:02 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (oe7.law4.hotmail.com [216.33.148.111]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT100JQ13DO0W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:49:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 63089 invoked by uid 65534); Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:48:39 +0000 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:45:42 -0400 From: Crazy Diamond Subject: blop / OpenBoot? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000414224839.63088.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0080_01BFA641.A32BB960" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Originating-IP: [24.6.103.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0080_01BFA641.A32BB960 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Is Blob OpenBoot(tm)-compliant? Why not just use Grub or another such = boot-loader? ------=_NextPart_000_0080_01BFA641.A32BB960 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Is Blob OpenBoot(tm)-compliant?  Why not just = use Grub or=20 another such boot-loader?
------=_NextPart_000_0080_01BFA641.A32BB960-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 01:20:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA01070 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:20:06 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA01066 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:20:04 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:19:28 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> Looks like one Eric A. Thomas is on it. It needs work with palettes and >> resoultions (if its comments are to be believed). > >I don't know his email address, the code needs some work, but I don't know >if he's currently working on it. I haven't seen him active on either linux-arm or sa1100-linux for well over a year. ISTR he designed it to suit his needs, and left it when it worked for him. If someone is looking for a small software project then I would suggest modularizing the SA-1100 fbdev. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 01:54:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02283 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:54:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02274 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:54:30 +0200 Received: from socket.house ([208.243.144.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100KFG6ESCN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:54:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by newsnipple.com via sendmail from stdin id (Debian Smail3.2.0.102) for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:03:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:03:41 -0700 From: Adam Haberlach Subject: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I just joined this list after it was posted to Slashdot. I'm a Computer Engineering major who ended up working in software and I would like to do some real hardware hacking. Is there anyone in the bay area putting together a group purchase of boards? I have not specced anything out yet, but I assume that higher quantities bring the price down a bit. I'd like to build one just for kicks, possibly to make a router or two. Also--does anyone know where I can get information on the Gerber file format? I was thinking of writing a Viewer (or CAD program, if I get really motivated and have 30 hour days all of the sudden) for BeOS. -- Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 02:23:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA03038 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:23:11 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA03034 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:23:10 +0200 Received: from idealab.com (mx2.idealab.com [206.132.100.54]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT100L6G7QJ88@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:23:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 32213 invoked by alias); Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:19:07 +0000 Received: (qmail 32144 invoked from network); Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:19:05 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Clifford) (10.3.40.142) by corleone.idealab.com with SMTP; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:19:05 +0000 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:18:11 -0700 From: "Joel R. Kehle" Subject: RE: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? In-reply-to: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> To: Adam Haberlach , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm looking into sourcing parts right now. I would need interest for about 50 units to make this workable. Cheers, Joel Kehle -----Original Message----- From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On Behalf Of Adam Haberlach Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 5:04 PM To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? I just joined this list after it was posted to Slashdot. I'm a Computer Engineering major who ended up working in software and I would like to do some real hardware hacking. Is there anyone in the bay area putting together a group purchase of boards? I have not specced anything out yet, but I assume that higher quantities bring the price down a bit. I'd like to build one just for kicks, possibly to make a router or two. Also--does anyone know where I can get information on the Gerber file format? I was thinking of writing a Viewer (or CAD program, if I get really motivated and have 30 hour days all of the sudden) for BeOS. -- Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 02:39:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA03462 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:39:09 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA03455; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:39:06 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:37:10 +0200 To: Adam Haberlach From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Gerber (was Re: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping?) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Also--does anyone know where I can get information on the >Gerber file format? I was thinking of writing a Viewer (or >CAD program, if I get really motivated and have 30 hour days all >of the sudden) for BeOS. http://www.apcircuits.com/html/technical.html http://www.artwork.com:80/gerber/274x/rs274x.htm Oh and do release the engine under GPL so others can do a Linux port X-) JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 02:41:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA03539 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:41:49 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA03534; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:41:46 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200004142332.e3ENWHn02377@mail.med.upenn.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 02:40:57 +0200 To: Michael Urashka From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART parts Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] >Is there a page listing where to get the components for putting together >a LART-like machine? Nothing other than the README for the hardware distro (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/plint/LARTdist-README). JDB [I'd give you my own contacts, but those only operate within The Netherlands] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 03:24:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA04490 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:24:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA04485 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:24:55 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT100LO1ALF2I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:24:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:20:38 +1000 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:20:38 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <001001bfa659$f326ce10$7671c13f@local.net> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Mike Ingle work Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000, Mike Ingle work wrote: > > As I use sucky and Windows right now, I'd settle for good and Linux. Any > > suggestions ? > > > > I use PROTEL on Windows NT for sch capture and pcb layout. If I couldn't > run NT I would look at EAGLE in Germany. Eagle is supposed to be good and fairly cheap for educational registration. They have a crippleware demo. Really those software developers on the list should consider helping out with the gEDA project in particular gPCB which needs a lot of work and could do with extra developers. See the links on the PLEB web page (http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pleb) which is linked from the LART pages. Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 03:38:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA04771 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:38:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA04767 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:38:52 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100M7WB8R73@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:38:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id VAA31093 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:36:16 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:36:15 -0400 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: "Your message of Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:35:18 +0200." <200004141935.VAA11569@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004150136.VAA31093@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > One of the most important things to be modified is the MP3 player itself. > All MP3 players I know read the MP3 file while they're playing. Not a big > problem for a desktop machine, but for a handheld MP3 player, it would > mean that the disk has to spin while playing an MP3. The MP3 player needs > to be modified in such a way that it caches one or more MP3 files and > allows the OS to spin down the disk. Indeed you would probably not want to use one of the stock player front-ends as-is; it makes sense to custom-build something out of one of the decoding libraries. Speaking for my own decoder/player (MAD), the decoding library is designed in such a way that the input file can simply be mmap()'d into memory... `madplay' will do this whenever possible but doesn't go any further. With a little thought you can come up with an effective mechanism to ensure the input streams are cached in memory. I believe the Xaudio SDK is similarly flexible. Btw, I had been meaning to report back timings for the static binary version of `splay' Erik provided me that is optimized for and runs so well on the SA-110 Netwinder. They look slightly--but not dramatically--better than the version I used before. I'm still fascinated by splay's performance on the Netwinder, and surprised it doesn't carry over at all to the SA-1100. I'll throw down all the numbers again for completeness. These are all the MPEG audio decoders I'm aware that can run in real-time without an FPU: CPU: StrongARM 1100 220MHz [same as LART] OS: Linux 2.2.14-rmk5-np17-empeg22 RAM: 8MB 60ns FPM Layer Layer Layer decoder version I II III license ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ splay-for-sa110 0.81 39% 36% 41% GPL/LGPL splay-fixpoint [1] 0.81 41% 36% 43% GPL/LGPL mpg123-arm32 [2] 0.59r [3] 27%[4] 32% non-commercial Xaudio [5] 1.3.1 21% 25% 24% commercial MAD [6] 0.10.0b 23% 22% 37%[7] GPL [1] ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ [2] ftp://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/packages/pkgsrc/audio/mpg123/README.html [3] failed to decode bitstream [4] outputs silence [5] http://www.xaudio.com/ [6] http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ [7] not optimized yet These numbers represent decoding CPU time as a percentage of real audio playing time. I calculated them as follows: time splay -d - $file > /dev/null time mpg123 -s $file > /dev/null time xaudio -output=raw:- $file > /dev/null time madplay -o raw:- $file > /dev/null I then divided the total CPU seconds by total playing time seconds. The same test bitstream was used across decoders for each layer, and all bitstreams were longer than four minutes playing time, 44.1kHz stereo. Cheers, -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 03:44:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA04847 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:44:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA04843 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:44:34 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100MB1BI773@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:44:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id SAA1451857; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:39:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:39:22 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? To: Adam Haberlach Cc: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38F7C849.24A12447@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------6B6C34EE3E2F20F315A16A17" X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------6B6C34EE3E2F20F315A16A17 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Adam, I'm expecting a group LART Mainboards back from the board fabricator on 24th of this month (April). Theses are the bare PC boards not the assembled units. Where in the Bay Area are you located? Greg Fountain, Menlo Park, California Adam Haberlach wrote: > I just joined this list after it was posted to Slashdot. > I'm a Computer Engineering major who ended up working in software > and I would like to do some real hardware hacking. > > Is there anyone in the bay area putting together a group > purchase of boards? I have not specced anything out yet, but I > assume that higher quantities bring the price down a bit. I'd > like to build one just for kicks, possibly to make a router or > two. > > Also--does anyone know where I can get information on the > Gerber file format? I was thinking of writing a Viewer (or > CAD program, if I get really motivated and have 30 hour days all > of the sudden) for BeOS. --------------6B6C34EE3E2F20F315A16A17 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------6B6C34EE3E2F20F315A16A17-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 04:48:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA06061 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 04:48:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA06057 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 04:48:28 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT100M9XEEIWU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 04:48:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([203.197.21.101]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA25673; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:11:44 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:16:14 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? To: Erik Mouw , nolan_d@bigfoot.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <009f01bfa684$c4fbe680$6515c5cb@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >One of the most important things to be modified is the MP3 player itself. >All MP3 players I know read the MP3 file while they're playing. Not a big >problem for a desktop machine, but for a handheld MP3 player, it would >mean that the disk has to spin while playing an MP3. The MP3 player needs >to be modified in such a way that it caches one or more MP3 files and >allows the OS to spin down the disk. > i guess reading while playing should be alright if there's no hdd. i guess a ramdisk would be used. one question, since i don't have a lart here: is glibc ported to the lart? it sure sounds a stupid question, but i'm curious. has the glibc been ported along with GCC? do i have functions such as socket(), printf(), sin(), cos(), etc. available for use? cause i'll need fread() for one to read those MP3s.. and would i be able to use it as a shared library? hmm.. stupid question :) - muks btw: is an (strong)ARM simulator available for x86 somewhere? would make my life a lot easier right now :) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 05:30:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA07075 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 05:30:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA07071 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 05:30:27 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT1000EBGEP8X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 05:30:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id WAA23417; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:27:26 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:27:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-reply-to: <009f01bfa684$c4fbe680$6515c5cb@muks> To: Mukund Iyer Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004150327.WAA23417@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk muks asks... > btw: is an (strong)ARM simulator available for x86 somewhere? > would make my life a lot easier right now :) There is an arm simulator buried inside gdb if you build it correctly. I'm not sure its useful for 32bit arms. It may be only 26bit and only user mode or somesuch, but then I haven't looked at it in three years of more. If it would be helpful for developers, I can move a Debian potato strongarm machine outside my firewalls and make it available for building, application testing, and such. It won't be any good for testing the low level drivers but it might make it easier to create the software and images. (32M ram, 4G disk, 275MHz SA-110 rev3) And yes, glibc is ported to ARM linux. 95% of Debian is ported. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 07:39:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA11204 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 07:39:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA11200 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 07:39:55 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT1001OMMEG9K@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 07:39:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id WAA1446576; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:34:48 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:34:48 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? To: Kevin Huotari Cc: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <38F7FF78.CB21949A@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------20C223E40C91A69E750C728D" X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> <4.1.20000414215609.00c004b0@pop.mindspring.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------20C223E40C91A69E750C728D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, YES, I did order extra boards! It looks like the bare PC boards will run about $45 each. I'm still working on pricing the BOM for the assembled version. $$$ and delivery will be a function of parts availability (some could take quite a while to get and as you might guess the more you pay the faster the delivery), assembly turnaround schedule, build quantity, tooling setup costs, etc. I'm also eagerly waiting to hear how things develop with Adam's and JD's Flash programmer efforts. I'll keep you up to date as thing progress (FYI: I'll be on travel all next week so if you send a follow up e-mail and I don't answer it for a while you'll know why.) Greg Kevin Huotari wrote: > Hi Greg, I'm new to the list and may have missed a call for participation > in your board purchase. I'm in L.A. (that's Los Angeles), but still rather > nearby. Did you make a few extra, and if you did, are you selling them? I'd > like to get in on the purchase, if possible. Let me know what the cost is. > I'm also interested in your assembly plans. kh > > At 06:39 PM 4/14/00 -0700, you wrote: > >I'm expecting a group LART Mainboards back from the board fabricator on > >24th of this month (April). Theses are the bare PC boards not the > >assembled units. --------------20C223E40C91A69E750C728D Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------20C223E40C91A69E750C728D-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 09:15:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12409 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:15:44 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA12405 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:15:43 +0200 Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com (tungsten.btinternet.com [194.73.73.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT10032CQU6F2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:15:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [62.6.88.245] (helo=silmaril.co.uk) by tungsten.btinternet.com with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12gMdO-0001bQ-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:04:51 +0100 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:08:11 +0000 From: Gav Reid Subject: New to List To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F8236B.B7A09462@silmaril.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0smp i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi , I am new to this list so I thought I had better intoduce myself : I am Gav I work for Agilent Technologies and my Self and am looking for a good hardware platform to build some nice toys with (toys being mp3 players etc) - Which I think I have found , Well done -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 09:19:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12457 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:19:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA12453 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:19:15 +0200 Received: from tantalum (tantalum.btinternet.com [194.73.73.80]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT10034FR01F2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 09:19:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [62.6.88.245] (helo=silmaril.co.uk) by tantalum with esmtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12gMah-0002JY-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:02:03 +0100 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:05:16 +0000 From: Gav Reid Subject: Re: LART parts To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F822BC.6C6C1170@silmaril.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0smp i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk is there anyone in uk/europe taking orders for complete(or kit) lart MB ? if so I will have 2 nad 2 KSB's when ready Gav -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 11:31:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA13718 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:31:02 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA13695; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:29:54 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <001001bfa659$f326ce10$7671c13f@local.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:24:01 +0200 To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Open Source CAD tools Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Really those software >developers on the list should consider helping out with the gEDA project >in particular gPCB which needs a lot of work and could do with extra >developers. See the links on the PLEB web page >(http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~pleb) which is linked from the LART pages. Strongly seconded. I would *love* to be able to share the object files of the LART and related designs; currently there's no 'open' way to have collaboration on a project like this. So if any developers out there are looking for a cool project, check out http://www.geda.seul.org/ . JDB [who'll re-evaluate gEDA soonish -- it's been over six months] -- LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files. http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 11:35:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA13768 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:35:15 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA13764 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:34:55 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id LAA13699; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:34:42 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:34:42 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004150934.LAA13699@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: sydbarrett74@hotmail.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: blop / OpenBoot? In-Reply-To: <20000414224839.63088.qmail@hotmail.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:45:42 -0400, Crazy Diamond wrote: > Is Blob OpenBoot(tm)-compliant? Why not just use Grub or another such > boot-loader? No, it's not OpenBoot compliant. We (= JDB and myself) wrote blob simply because we wanted to get things done. And we both love the KISS principle. Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 11:44:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA13840 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:04 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA13836; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:02 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F7C180.5C3B1963@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:38:44 +0200 To: Jeff Davies From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Congrats to the team Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] >This is an excellent project, and many thanks for contributing it to the >public domain (it is pd >isn't it?). It has an open license (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/LICENSE); it's not PD. >The two obvious uses are Palm Pilot type device (the 'linot'??) whynot >linot?? >and Diamond Rio type device (the Riot?)...... > >Another set of ideas are: > >1. Slot in RAM+CPU cards for a PC type multiprocessor. >Imagine a PC size box, you open the lid and slot in another LART into >you desktop beowulf. Oh but I do have plans in that direction; why else do you think we'd be building 100 of them :) >2. Network switch/hub. >3. Open printer design. >4. open CADCAM machine design. Including CNC drilling of PCB boards. >5. Use in radio controlling of model aircraft. >6. Robot control. There's plenty I/O capacity for that, yes. >PS. I squeezed down Slackware into about a floppy size image, put onto >Compact Flash, and plugged into PC104 AMD 486, sending data using UDP >packets to a host over a wireless LAN. >Do you plan a PCMCIA socket, or perhaps wireless lan chipset >onboard.!!!?? I've a PCMCIA interface that will be sent to the PCB shop next week. Will post it to the site as soon as I find some time. >This was to measure body movement metrics. Your system is lighter, >MUCH lighter on battery power, and smaller. Have you a 16 bit ADC, and >easy way to add MUX.... I'm working on a design for an A/D - D/A interface to the GP pins of the LCD interface. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 11:44:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA13860 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:30 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA13856 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:29 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id LAA13758; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:16 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:44:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004150944.LAA13758@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: muks@hd2.dot.net.in Cc: nolan_d@bigfoot.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: <009f01bfa684$c4fbe680$6515c5cb@muks> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:16:14 +0530, Mukund Iyer wrote: > one question, since i don't have a lart here: > > is glibc ported to the lart? it sure sounds a stupid question, > but i'm curious. has the glibc been ported along with GCC? > do i have functions such as socket(), printf(), sin(), cos(), etc. > available for use? cause i'll need fread() for one to read those MP3s.. > and would i be able to use it as a shared library? Glibc has been ported to ArmLinux, so it also runs on the LART. Same for gcc, so all your favourite software can be ported to ArmLinux. Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 11:46:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA13895 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:46:39 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA13891 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:46:38 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id LAA13771; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:46:25 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:46:25 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004150946.LAA13771@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: muks@hd2.dot.net.in Cc: nolan_d@bigfoot.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Possible use for LART? In-Reply-To: <009f01bfa684$c4fbe680$6515c5cb@muks> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:16:14 +0530, Mukund Iyer wrote: > btw: is an (strong)ARM simulator available for x86 somewhere? > would make my life a lot easier right now :) Oops! Forgot to answer this question. Yes, there seems to be a complete ARM simulator in the latest gdb snapshots. I haven't tried it yet, though. Erik %-) -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 15:03:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15079 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:03:37 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA15075 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:03:37 +0200 Received: from web3206.mail.yahoo.com (web3206.mail.yahoo.com [204.71.202.203]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT2008EC6XYIR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:03:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [216.252.186.226] by web3206.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 05:59:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 05:59:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Ghazan Haider Subject: How do you soldier the strongarm? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000415125925.17223.qmail@web3206.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I have several chips with me including Am386 strongarms and PICs but I can only soldier DIP/DIL ICs. I can photo-etch pretty finely detailed PCBs with laser printer but QFTP etc packages have legs too tiny to individually soldier. Someone please tell me how can u do that on a low budget (cant buy a robotic IC placer). If there are good sites (coundnt find something on jameco) which detail such processes or sell (cheap enough for an undergrad) such tools, reference would be appreciated. Thakn You en avance. Ghazan Haider THC __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 15:10:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15123 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:10:39 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA15119; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:10:37 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F86585.8E1A6BA9@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:07:29 +0200 To: Jeff Davies From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Congrats to the team Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to LART] >Have you seen the www.opencores.org site? >Any plans to maybe put a OR1K processor on a board later on? I would if I had cheap access to a foundry. Maybe there will be an FPGA board for LART later that's large enough tho. >They've got Ether, VGA, Float unit, EIDE, PCI 32/64. Firewire, UART, ATM, >USB cores on their site. No they don't. Try following some of their links and look at the status. I do like the opencores concept, but apart from the processor most cores are in the "wouldn't it be nice"-stage. JDB. -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 16:27:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA15599 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:27:41 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA15595 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:27:41 +0200 Received: from toad.mindrot.org (toad.mindrot.org [203.36.198.110]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT200AC1AU0GZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:27:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mothra.mindrot.org (mothra.mindrot.org [203.44.118.225]) by toad.mindrot.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACAA627592; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:27:29 +1000 (EST) Received: by mothra.mindrot.org (Postfix, from userid 500) id 0863727446; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:27:28 +1000 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mothra.mindrot.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06D9E17927; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:27:28 +1000 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:27:27 +1000 (EST) From: Damien Miller Subject: Re: Congrats to the team In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Paranoia: just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 15 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > [cc-ed to LART] > > >Have you seen the www.opencores.org site? > >Any plans to maybe put a OR1K processor on a board later on? > > I would if I had cheap access to a foundry. Maybe there will be an FPGA > board for LART later that's large enough tho. I want this so I can run http://www.free-ip.com/DES/ on it :) -d -- | "Bombay is 250ms from New York in the new world order" - Alan Cox | Damien Miller - http://www.mindrot.org/ | Email: djm@mindrot.org (home) -or- djm@ibs.com.au (work) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 15 21:45:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA17629 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:45:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA17625 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:45:14 +0200 Received: from omta01.mta.everyone.net (sitemail.everyone.net [216.200.145.35]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT200FLBPJC5B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:45:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from sitemail.everyone.net (reports.everyone.net [216.200.145.62]) by omta01.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91BF61879; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:30:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by sitemail.everyone.net (Postfix, from userid 60001) id BC5E4E0B0; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:30:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:30:34 -0800 (PST) From: Lachlan Audas Subject: Re: How do you soldier the strongarm? To: Ghazan Haider , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: laudas@firstlinux.net Message-id: <20000415193034.BC5E4E0B0@sitemail.everyone.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 4.104 (Entity 4.117) Content-type: text/plain Content-disposition: inline X-Originating-Ip: [209.253.72.25] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Ghazan, This is what works for me with good result's. It works on PCB'S with-out solder mask. And should work ok on board's with solder mask. (Save's on solder mask if you getting proto's done ! ) It works well on chips down to 0.02" (20mil) lead spacing. Have not tryed it on 0.015 chips as I have no boards using chips lead spacing that small. The bigest problem is placing the chip's, for that you need good eye's and 2x magmifer lamp or better. Next is keeping the chip is place while you trying to solder it, for that use "TAC.N.PLACE" it's made by "Ambriod Company" I get that from my local kit/hobby store. You first paint on a coating of "TAC.N.PLACE" where you wont place the chip. (also works well for chip cap/res parts too) Dont make it too think or too thin. (you will have to play with this a bit to get the right) Allow to dry, (dry's clear) Next place the chip and solder 2 or 3 pin's of the IC. (opsit side's of the chip of corse !! ) for that you need good soldering iron with a fine tip. Don't worry if you get a short, to the near-by pin's. (what dont worry you say !!! ) Yup the following tricks take care of the short's. Next remove the "RAC.N.PLACE" with Acetone and brush. Take care no to bend any pine's. Now you need Multicore's "MULTIFIX 450-01 rework flux" this stuff make's solding QFP ic's as easy as falling of a log. It's also important that YOU DONT'T use... I repeat DON'T use a find tip, to solder the leads. The a tip to use is .1" round and with 45 deg cut. for a flat surface. Check my bad art work below :) / / / / \ _/ / / / / <- solder tip / / Chip / / __________ /_ _/ XXXXXXXXXX\ -----------\______ <- chips lead's ___________________________________ ----------------------------------- ^ PCB ^ This tip allow's you to solder more than one pin at the time. Apply the bead of MULTIFX 450 around the the QFP IC, over the leads. Now go around with the soldering tip in this bead (note you only need a 500 deg's temp for all of this solding 600-700 temp is just to hot) This will allow the the rework flux to run under the chip and around the pin's. Now aply a small amout of solder to the tip of the iron, and aply the tip to the chip leads. And work along the chip. Dont drag the tip acrose the lead's as this will bend the leads. Just up down action as you move along. The rework flux helps keep the the solder from shorting out the leads. If you get a short, clean the tip (real clean) and apply the lead's where the short is, the tip will remove some of the solder. removing the short. You may need to repeat the above step if you have a lot of solder in the short. Now clean the rework flux off, and check it all. As away's try on some test chips and board's first. to get this right. Hope this helps. Oh excuse my spelling and english. Lachlan. --- Ghazan Haider > wrote: >Hi, I have several chips with me including Am386 >strongarms and PICs but I can only soldier DIP/DIL >ICs. I can photo-etch pretty finely detailed PCBs with >laser printer but QFTP etc packages have legs too tiny >to individually soldier. Someone please tell me how >can u do that on a low budget (cant buy a robotic IC >placer). If there are good sites (coundnt find >something on jameco) which detail such processes or >sell (cheap enough for an undergrad) such tools, >reference would be appreciated. Thakn You en avance. >Ghazan Haider >THC > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. >http://invites.yahoo.com >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 _____________________________________________________________ Want a new web-based email account ? ---> http://www.firstlinux.net -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 00:12:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA18661 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:12:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA18657 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:12:28 +0200 Received: from omta01.mta.everyone.net (sitemail.everyone.net [216.200.145.35]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT200HEPWCQFH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:12:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from sitemail.everyone.net (reports.everyone.net [216.200.145.62]) by omta01.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D8451886; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:57:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by sitemail.everyone.net (Postfix, from userid 60001) id E0E02608F; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:57:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:57:45 -0800 (PST) From: Lachlan Audas Subject: 100 meg ethernet To: laudas@firstlinux.net, Ghazan Haider , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: laudas@firstlinux.net Message-id: <20000415215745.E0E02608F@sitemail.everyone.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 4.104 (Entity 4.117) Content-type: text/plain Content-disposition: inline X-Originating-Ip: [209.253.72.10] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi every one, Is there in plans for doing a 100 meg ethernet ? Lachlan Audas. _____________________________________________________________ Access the world's best search engines instantly at... http://web.firstlinux.net -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 00:21:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA18743 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:21:20 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA18738; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:21:16 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000415215745.E0E02608F@sitemail.everyone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:21:08 +0200 To: laudas@firstlinux.net From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: 100 meg ethernet Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Is there in plans for doing a 100 meg ethernet ? No shortage of plans; we just lack a supplier for non-PCI 100B-T chips. JDB. -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 01:48:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA19444 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:48:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA19440 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:48:00 +0200 Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT300IPU0RYQC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:47:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.vt.edu (gkar.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.40]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA16801 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:45:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gemorga2 ([198.82.100.74]) by gkar.cc.vt.edu (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.05.24.18.28.p7) with ESMTP id <0FT300DTS0OLGU@gkar.cc.vt.edu> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:45:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:45:57 -0400 From: George Morgan Subject: Re: 100 meg ethernet In-reply-to: To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38F8C6F5.16469.CEC850@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <20000415215745.E0E02608F@sitemail.everyone.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Your best bet for 100 mbit ethernet right now is a pcmcia adapter... I looked around a bit and was very surprised when I saw the cirrus logic spec sheet for the current chip. There isn't a large market for that kind of chip so there aren't many available (only found that one) > >Is there in plans for doing a 100 meg ethernet ? > > No shortage of plans; we just lack a supplier for non-PCI 100B-T chips. > > JDB. > > -- > They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may > be slow, but he'll eventually get them. > -- Matthew Lammers in ASR > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 George Morgan Virginia Tech Electrical Engineering Class of 2000! (Graduating in 2001, Co-op) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 05:10:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA20499 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:10:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA20495 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:10:09 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT300L02A4TKH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:10:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:08:18 +1000 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:08:17 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: How do you soldier the strongarm? In-reply-to: <20000415125925.17223.qmail@web3206.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Ghazan Haider Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The SA-1100 can be easily soldered by hand using a micro-wave tip which is a mini reflowing tip, some flux and some fine wire solder. Anyone with SMD soldering experience can put an SA-1100 down with the right tip and a good temp controled station. Cheers Adam On Sat, 15 Apr 2000, Ghazan Haider wrote: > Hi, I have several chips with me including Am386 > strongarms and PICs but I can only soldier DIP/DIL > ICs. I can photo-etch pretty finely detailed PCBs with > laser printer but QFTP etc packages have legs too tiny > to individually soldier. Someone please tell me how > can u do that on a low budget (cant buy a robotic IC > placer). If there are good sites (coundnt find > something on jameco) which detail such processes or > sell (cheap enough for an undergrad) such tools, > reference would be appreciated. Thakn You en avance. > Ghazan Haider > THC > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. > http://invites.yahoo.com > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 14:08:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA22328 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:08:40 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA22323; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:08:38 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38F8C6F5.16469.CEC850@localhost> References: <20000415215745.E0E02608F@sitemail.everyone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:08:21 +0200 To: George Morgan From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: 100 meg ethernet Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 01:45 +0200 16-04-2000, George Morgan wrote: >Your best bet for 100 mbit ethernet right now is a pcmcia adapter... Yes and no. While a (non-Cardbus) 100B-T PCMCIA card will work, it is going to be dog slow (as most of them consist of the equivalent of a PCI NIC and a PCI-ISA bridge). There are some 100Mbit chips with 'regular' interfaces, like the LAN91C100FD by SMC, but I haven't yet found a supplier that will sell them in small quantities. Mind you I haven't had the time to look too hard either. > I looked around a bit and was very surprised when I saw the cirrus >logic spec sheet for the current chip. There isn't a large market for >that kind of chip so there aren't many available (only found that one) Actually there's quite a large market: embedded devices. For those 10Mbit is plenty, and quite some suppliers (Intel, National, SMC come to mind) have revamped versions of their old ISA chips. The Crystal one we use (after a recommendation by Alan Cox) is particularly nice in that it has an on chip packet buffer. JDB. -- In protocol design, perfection has been reached not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- RFC 1925, "Fundamental Truths of Networking" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 18:22:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA23160 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:22:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA23156 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:22:18 +0200 Received: from mailhub2.shef.ac.uk (mailhub2.shef.ac.uk [143.167.2.154]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT4007L0AT5OS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:22:17 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ra212032.shef.ac.uk ([143.167.212.32] helo=el1iw) by mailhub2.shef.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.02 #2) id 12grZu-0006Sr-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:07:18 +0100 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:05:27 +0100 From: Ian Wraith Subject: Getting hold of SA-1100's X-Sender: el1iw@ridingwood.shef.ac.uk To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3.0.5.32.20000416170527.0085b540@ridingwood.shef.ac.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello I am trying to price up the parts for a LART. So I looked on the Intel web site for British distributers of the SA-1100 and a couple are listed. However neither will answer the phone or my e mail enquiries. So can anyone suggest a good supplier of these IC's in the EU ? Or could you tell me how much these cost if bought in small quantites ? Thanks for your time. Regards Ian Wraith i.wraith@sheffield.ac.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 20:24:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA23739 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:24:38 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA23735 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:24:37 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:23:25 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Getting hold of SA-1100's Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Hello > I am trying to price up the parts for a LART. So I looked on the Intel >web site for British distributers of the SA-1100 and a couple are listed. >However neither will answer the phone or my e mail enquiries. So can anyone >suggest a good supplier of these IC's in the EU ? Suppliers don't call you back. Ever. At least not for the measly $50k that I was throwing around. In my experience none of the distributors is properly set up for e-mail enquiries yet. Surprised me a bit to find that out. Keep calling them. Call them the day after they promised they would call you back. Stick with one rep (ie the same guy). Sad but true. Try the US distributors listed at http://developer.intel.com/design/disti/ ; they are usually better set up to deal with small quantity orders. Have a creditcard handy. I get my parts through Memec (http://www.memec.com/). > Or could you tell me how >much these cost if bought in small quantites ? Between US$50 and US$100, depending upon the part speed, quantity, distributor and the phase of the moon. JDB. -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 22:26:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA24369 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:26:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA24363 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:26:02 +0200 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk (mail4.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.211]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400DKGM3EMI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:26:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-132.california.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.56.132] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12gvUa-00021e-00; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:18:05 +0100 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:20:49 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: Congrats to the team To: Damien Miller Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FA20A1.A3B40DED@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Damien Miller wrote: > On Sat, 15 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > > [cc-ed to LART] > > > > >Have you seen the www.opencores.org site? > > >Any plans to maybe put a OR1K processor on a board later on? > > > > I would if I had cheap access to a foundry. Maybe there will be an FPGA > > board for LART later that's large enough tho. > > I want this so I can run http://www.free-ip.com/DES/ on it :) tee hee ... naughty boy Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 16 23:41:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA24712 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:41:37 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA24708 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:41:36 +0200 Received: from mail.rdc1.bc.home.com (ha1.rdc1.bc.wave.home.com [24.2.10.66]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400FHUPLBZJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:41:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cs80153-a.gvdt1.bc.wave.home.com ([24.64.212.131]) by mail.rdc1.bc.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.07 201-229-111-110) with SMTP id <20000416213900.GWSE14199.mail.rdc1.bc.home.com@cs80153-a.gvdt1.bc.wave.home.com> for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:39:00 -0700 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:43:03 -0700 From: Scott Ritchie Subject: New to List X-Sender: s.ritchie@netmail.home.com To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <2.2.32.20000416214303.0088a944@netmail.home.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all I was wondering if there was anybody in the Victoria/Vancouver, BC or Seattle area building Larts or would like to? Scott -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 00:29:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA25002 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:29:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA24998 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:29:42 +0200 Received: from mail.rdc1.bc.home.com (ha1.rdc1.bc.wave.home.com [24.2.10.66]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400GD1RTGST@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:29:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cs80153-a.gvdt1.bc.wave.home.com ([24.64.212.131]) by mail.rdc1.bc.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.07 201-229-111-110) with SMTP id <20000416222713.GYLW14199.mail.rdc1.bc.home.com@cs80153-a.gvdt1.bc.wave.home.com> for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:27:13 -0700 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:31:17 -0700 From: Scott Ritchie Subject: Re: New to List X-Sender: s.ritchie@netmail.home.com To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hugues I haven't sourced anything yet, I think I'll start with finding a company to produce the boards. As for my own plans. I've been drooling over the prospect of a wareable for sometime. The MIT wareable page has been really helpful, but they tend to use the PC104 with Intel chips. Until I saw LART on /. , I was waiting for someone to product a board with a Crusoe chip. Scott At 06:07 AM 4/16/00 -0400, you wrote: >Hi I'm in Ontario and I'm also looking for someone to built a bunch of >these puppies, let me know if you find anyone... > >I'm curious what are you planning to use these for ? >I'm trying to assemble a group of people for a little project of my >own.... > > >Scott Ritchie wrote: > >> Hi all >> I was wondering if there was anybody in the Victoria/Vancouver, BC or >> Seattle area building Larts or would like to? >> Scott >> >> -- >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >> the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >> Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 00:47:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA25068 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:47:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA25064 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:47:11 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400GO3SMKST@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:47:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA07531 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:43:14 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA18657 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:44:15 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:44:15 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: StrongARM reviews ? X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was wondering if there are any sites with reviews about the StrongARM (what it can and cannot do). Because I heard that the strongARM don't have a good FPU so you couldn't play games/mp3s on them. Would like to find benchmarks and such information on them if possible. Sorry for the repost, I had a lot of trouble trying to setup procmail to send everything from this mailing-list to a seperate mail file. If anyone is already doing this, would you mind telling me which rules you are using ? Cause there doesn't seem to be a unique thing that's always in every email sent to the list. Thanks David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 01:24:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA25406 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:24:41 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA25402 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:24:40 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400I4DUD3M6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:24:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.54]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:27:06 -0600 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:03:31 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: a small proposal In-reply-to: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> To: Scott Ritchie , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few percentage points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a 30% profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from the board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to get. (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and cost effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message archive, regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to handle this? Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( http://www.paypal.com ) regards Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Scott Ritchie wrote: > Hugues > I haven't sourced anything yet, I think I'll start with finding a company > to produce the boards. > As for my own plans. I've been drooling over the prospect of a wareable for > sometime. The MIT wareable page has been really helpful, but they tend to > use the PC104 with Intel chips. Until I saw LART on /. , I was waiting for > someone to product a board with a Crusoe chip. > Scott > > > At 06:07 AM 4/16/00 -0400, you wrote: > >Hi I'm in Ontario and I'm also looking for someone to built a bunch of > >these puppies, let me know if you find anyone... > > > >I'm curious what are you planning to use these for ? > >I'm trying to assemble a group of people for a little project of my > >own.... > > > > > >Scott Ritchie wrote: > > > >> Hi all > >> I was wondering if there was anybody in the Victoria/Vancouver, BC or > >> Seattle area building Larts or would like to? > >> Scott > >> > >> -- > >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > >> the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > >> Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 01:28:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA25424 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:28:58 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA25420 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:28:57 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:26:54 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: StrongARM reviews ? Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >I was wondering if there are any sites with reviews about the StrongARM >(what it can and cannot do). Because I heard that the strongARM don't >have a good FPU so you couldn't play games/mp3s on them. Would like to >find benchmarks and such information on them if possible. What kind of benchmarks are you looking for ? Depending on the task, it runs at a similar speed as a Pentiun 180 - 230 (at 10%-20% of the power usage). In some areas handtuning can be a big help; especially with problem sets that may just fit into the cache if coded right. Note that this isn't a board you'd use for a desktop, and mobile/wearable displays tend to have lower resolution. I know that the Itsy boys had Doom running; we keep bugging Johan to do a Quake port 8) >Sorry for the repost, I had a lot of trouble trying to setup procmail to >send everything from this mailing-list to a seperate mail file. If anyone >is already doing this, would you mind telling me which rules you are using >? Cause there doesn't seem to be a unique thing that's always in every >email sent to the list. As with most all majordomo lists, the Sender: header is always owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl . That's what I use for a filter; hasn't failed me yet. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 01:45:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA25529 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:45:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA25525 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:45:51 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400IMZVCD56@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:45:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA07592 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 19:45:44 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA18890 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 19:46:49 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:46:49 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Could canadian be in there too ? ;-) David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few percentage > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a 30% > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from the > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to get. > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and cost > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message archive, > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to > handle this? > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > http://www.paypal.com ) > regards > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > > > > > > On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Scott Ritchie wrote: > > Hugues > > I haven't sourced anything yet, I think I'll start with finding a company > > to produce the boards. > > As for my own plans. I've been drooling over the prospect of a wareable for > > sometime. The MIT wareable page has been really helpful, but they tend to > > use the PC104 with Intel chips. Until I saw LART on /. , I was waiting for > > someone to product a board with a Crusoe chip. > > Scott > > > > > > At 06:07 AM 4/16/00 -0400, you wrote: > > >Hi I'm in Ontario and I'm also looking for someone to built a bunch of > > >these puppies, let me know if you find anyone... > > > > > >I'm curious what are you planning to use these for ? > > >I'm trying to assemble a group of people for a little project of my > > >own.... > > > > > > > > >Scott Ritchie wrote: > > > > > >> Hi all > > >> I was wondering if there was anybody in the Victoria/Vancouver, BC or > > >> Seattle area building Larts or would like to? > > >> Scott > > >> > > >> -- > > >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > >> the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > >> Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 01:46:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA25536 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:46:17 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA25531; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:46:11 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:44:02 +0200 To: dogman@bitterroot.net From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: Scott Ritchie , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... >For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the >production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There >already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. >I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few >percentage >points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm >mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card >from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks lead time). We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet combo. Note that shipping to the US will drive up small qty pricing. I have absolutely no problem with (and possibly even a preference for) one party collecting orders and getting one big NL->US shipment of PCBs. An even more viable business model occurs if that party were to buy the 'difficult' parts (CPU, Flash, DRAM) and maybe sell partly mounted kits. If you're going for economy of scale it may be worth going that extra mile. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 02:07:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25663 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:07:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25659 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:07:27 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400IHJWCDM6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:07:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA12751 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:03:14 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:03:13 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: BOOOOOM To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk J.D., do you all have the list of parts you ordered? we're mainly interested in little things like sizes of resistors and caps and what not, and making sure everything is accounted for. we'll also be willing to share the part numbers and all for those in the US to order from newark and arrow. thanks, rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 02:13:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25710 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:27 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25703 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:27 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400J8WWMD11@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.54]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:15:53 -0600 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:59:34 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" , dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: Scott Ritchie , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041618091603.08671@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk JD Baker, I don't have any "enterprising dreams"....................................................... I just need a card or two, and am here in the hinterlands where it's difficult to get this kind of prototyping done, so I wouldn't be the guy to make a small fortune (???) on the production. I was just hoping that this proposal could expidite the cards being made, and to find a way to get the guy's expenses covered. Sure I'd be willing to spend a little on shipping if it could drop the price of either a finished MotherBoard or a unstuffed motherboard with the parts necessary to finish it. It will be a tedious job to solder in a bunch of SMD parts, so I was hoping for a stuffed board. The prices you are quoting are even better then I thought. Email me when you are ready to ship. regards Doug Moreen On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... > > >For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > >production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > >already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > >I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > >percentage > >points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > >mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > >from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. > > Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 > costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks > lead time). > > We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > combo. > > Note that shipping to the US will drive up small qty pricing. I have > absolutely no problem with (and possibly even a preference for) one party > collecting orders and getting one big NL->US shipment of PCBs. An even more > viable business model occurs if that party were to buy the 'difficult' > parts (CPU, Flash, DRAM) and maybe sell partly mounted kits. > > If you're going for economy of scale it may be worth going that extra mile. > > JDB. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 02:13:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25727 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25723 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:46 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400J92WMX11@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:13:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.67] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AE634DC20296; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:21:55 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:24:48 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? Cc: Lart Mail Server Message-id: <38F7EF10.FAB56B4A@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> <38F7C849.24A12447@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk If you're willing to sell a very few of them, please let me know too if you don't mind. I figure about five would do for experimental purposes for myself - though I'd settle for less. Now I need to gather all the rest of the bits and pieces... :) Thanks, Mike Greg Fountain wrote: > I'm expecting a group LART Mainboards back from the board fabricator on > 24th of this month (April). Theses are the bare PC boards not the > assembled units. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 02:31:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25828 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:31:13 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25824 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:31:12 +0200 Received: from mrs-1.smartworld.net (mrs-1-fix.smartworld.net [216.70.64.24]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400J0HXFWJV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:31:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from linux.de (IDENT:phil@1Cust8.tnt14.krk1.da.uu.net [63.26.25.8]) by mrs-1.smartworld.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA46423 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:25:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 15:22:37 +0200 From: Philipp Knirsch Subject: ANNOUNCE: Gerber RS-247D/X viewer in Java To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <3946359D.9444E37D@linux.de> Organization: Freelance IT professional MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.5-15 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi folks. As i was pretty bored on Saturday and had nothing better to do (and my EigerMan hadn't arrived yet), i i'd sit down and hack togehter something. The viewer is only for the Gerber RS-247X/D format with printing and image export included. The whole thing is written in Java, so platform independance is practially guaranteed. The code itself has 2 parts, one being the main application which only acts as an interface to the virtual plotter (as i called it), which simulates to some degree the behaviour of a real world plotter (in a state machine). The output has to be a Java Graphics context, like a Frame or a PrintJob or an off- screen image, so export to other graphic formats shouldn't be a big problem. Ah yes, one thing: The code is pre alpha 0.1, so don't expect too much yet. For one apertures aren't handled yet correctly, so neither line thickness nor flashes work correctly. Also the extended commands are not yet parsed much, so it's mainly a RS-247D viewer up to now and things like magnification have to be adjusted by hand. I'll try to fix that in the future releases as best as i can. My personal todo list has the correct handling of apertures on top, at least simple ones (not the ones with parameters), then more parsing of the extended commands and logically always bug fixes and/or corrections to the drawing behaviour. So it doesn't work 100% yet, but following the guideline of ESR i went after the motto: 'Release early, release often' principle. Most of the small examples are already partially and from a geometry standpoint correctly drawn (at least i hope so ;), haven't had the nerve to try out bigger ones yet. I'll put it up today on my homepage and you can download it here: http://www.wizards.de/phil/java/rs247x.html Have fun, Read ya, Phil PS: Some of the examples given on the 'official' PDF docu are invalid according to the same spec they gave a couple of pages earlier or display not what they say it would display (e.g. the arrow. Try to follow the path yourself, you'll see the error in the end of the area fill list), which is pretty bad. Nonetheless the stuff works fairly good and none of the mistakes are really major or would hint to a completely other interpretation of the specs. PPS: Don't send me 10000 examples or wishes yet! I first want to get the code to at least behave the way it should. After that i'll be happy to extend it more and more, but i want to have a stable base version first. PPPS: Last but not least (yeah, i know, i could have written all that in the upper text, but i was to lazy ;): The code is released under GPL, so feel free to copy and modify it as you wish. PPPPS: Ha, one last thing: I am currently in Seattle and only have my very small and little Libretto CT50 to do the whole development, so editing, compiling and testing takes some time, despite the fact that i am already using the IBM JDK 1.18 and the jikes Java compiler (which is a darn fast beast!). I am also here to do 'normal' work during the week, so i'll mainly get to work on this thing on the weekends, so don't expect any major releases until next weekend. -- _________ _______ _____ ___ _ \__________/ \________/ \______/ \____/ \__/ \/\| Philipp Knirsch Unix, Database, Internet and Java consulting, programming and design. phone: +49 7121 907033 mobil: +49 179 2922425 email: phil@linux.de www: http://www.wizards.de/phil Motd: Never run a changing system... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 02:42:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25881 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:42:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25877 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:42:10 +0200 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT400J3QXY9JV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:42:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from pc4s07a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.231.197] helo=rentbert) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12gzb7-0000Vi-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:41:05 +0100 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:34:49 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: I want to live in the usa =/ To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <008b01bfa805$99f471a0$08fefea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0081_01BFA80D.1F10D020" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0081_01BFA80D.1F10D020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am in the EU and am like many people having problems pricing the parts = etc So does any on also in the eu specifically the UK have = prices/distributers for the hard to find stuff(a uk user will know what = is hard to find=3D). Thanks in advance P.S Great Project Guys, Well Done have a pat on the Back from me=3D) -RG ------=_NextPart_000_0081_01BFA80D.1F10D020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I am in the EU and am like many people having = problems pricing=20 the parts etc So does any on also in the eu specifically the UK have=20 prices/distributers for the hard to find stuff(a uk user will know what = is hard=20 to find=3D).
 
Thanks in advance
 
P.S
Great Project Guys, Well Done have a pat on the Back = from=20 me=3D)
 
-RG
------=_NextPart_000_0081_01BFA80D.1F10D020-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:25:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26577 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:25:58 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26572; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:25:54 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="============_-1256184141==_============" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:25:48 +0200 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: BOOOOOM Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk --============_-1256184141==_============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:03 +0200 17-04-2000, rob wrote: >J.D., > do you all have the list of parts you ordered? Just when I get out of bed to eat some yoghurt you come and ask me for a BOM. Oh well, even less sleep then. Hope you're happy ;-) BOM attached. JD 'sleepless in ... well ... Amstelveen' B. --============_-1256184141==_============ Content-Type: text/plain; name="LART_bom.txt"; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="LART_bom.txt" Bill of Materials for LART rev 3. This BOM has tab-separated fields. Components Description Qty Farnell Europe catalog number Comments "C1-C49,C53,C54,C60" Decoupling capacitor; 100n 16V 0805 52 317-676 "C50,C51" AVR TPSD476K016R0150 47u 16V low-ESR tantalum capacitor 2 570-400 C55-C59 AVR TPSD157K006R0125 150u 6V3 low-ESR tantalum capacitor 5 570-333 C61 Capacitor 330p 16V 0805 1 499-183 D1 Siemens LST676 Hyper Red LED 1 515-632 D2-D4 IRF 30BQ040 3A Schottky Power Diode 3 506-758 J1 FCI (formerly Berg) 61082-101000 100pin 0.8mm pitch SMD socket 1 973-336 J2-J4 Harwin M22-6124022 40pin 2mm pitch double row socket 3 672-439 J5 Molex 53261-1090 10pin 1.27mm PCB header 1 889-416 JTAG 8 pin 0.1in 90 degrees single row pin header 1 512-163 POWER 4 pin 0.1in 90 degrees single row pin header 1 512-163 RESET 2 pin 0.1in 90 degrees single row pin header 1 512-163 RS232 6 pin 0.1in 90 degrees double row pin header 1 512-175 "L1,L2" Siemens B82111-E-C22 22uH 3A Axial Inductor 2 608-671 "R1,R2" Resistor 1k 0805 2 911-239 R11 Resistor 18k 0805 1% 1 911-380 See schematics for values of R10 and R11 if Vcore of U1 is not 2V R3-R5 Resistor 0R068 1206 1% 3 156-243 R6-R8 Resistor 0R01 1206 1% 3 156-188 "R9,R10,R12,R13" Resistor 33k 0805 1% 4 911-410 "T1,T2" Fairchild NDH834P Power P-MOS FET 2 932-577 T3 Fairchild FDV301N N-MOS FET 1 995-848 U1 Intel SA-1100 processor in LQFP package 1 - U2-U3 Intel DT28F160F3B Fast Boot Block Flash memory 2 - U4-U7 NEC uPD465165 64Mbit 4Mx16 EDO DRAM 4 - "Other mfgr types possible (ISSI, Micron,Ö)" U8 74LVC157D 3V3 Quad 2-in Mux in SO package 1 111-934 U9 Maxim MAX811SEUS Microprocessor Supervisory Circuit 1 787-619 U10 Maxim MAX3223ECAP RS232 Transceiver 1 - U11 Maxim MAX1626 DC-DC Controller 1 - U12 Maxim MAX1627 DC-DC Controller 1 - X1 3.6864MHz Xtal in HC49/4H package 1 221-557 X2 32.768KHz Xtal in Watch package 1 103-868 --============_-1256184141==_============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" -- "... I've seen Sun monitors on fire off the side of the multimedia lab. I've seen NTU lights glitter in the dark near the Mail Gate. All these things will be lost in time, like the root partition last week. Time... to die...". - Peter Gutmann in the scary devil monastery --============_-1256184141==_============-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:32:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26661 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:32:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26657 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:32:13 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500K9M31NI2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:32:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.68.157]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA21535 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 07:55:32 +0530 (IST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 07:59:57 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: everybody needs a lart here... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004201bfa814$d3220e60$9d4436ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk i guess this is a serious thing. can atleast someone tell me what i can do to write lart software? ok, i can use the cross compiler, but how can i test whether the binaries actually run as intended? will the gdb simulator help here? how can i test the kitchen sink with the gdb sim? no.. i need one of 'em larts.. and if i write an MP3 player, what are my input and output options? how do i use the display? how do i handle input? cmon, i don't want to do stdin/stdout! :) i wanna port quake! btw, i'm really serious about getting a lart myself. i live in india. now, ain't that far worse than the rest? NO WAY! i'm going to get one. - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:37:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26725 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:37:59 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26720; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:37:54 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <003a01bfa814$254bcc40$9d4436ca@muks> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:37:38 +0200 To: Mukund Iyer From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: StrongARM reviews ? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [cc-ed to the LART list] >you say the itsy boys had doom running... >i have read little about the itsy, but one of the things i read >was that if there was no input activity, the rest of the itsy >would actually shutdown and keep only the display unit alive. >how would a game which needs a constant refresh run something like >doom? Hmm, I find it hard to imagine that you'd play a game of Doom with no input activity :) Seriously, I expect the shutdown behaviour is switchable. >i am interested in doing that quake port. but i need to know about >programming for the display and sound, apart from the input unit. >how much work has been done here? what kind of kitchen sink drivers >are available? There is a pretty OK frame buffer driver (fbdev) for the SA-1100 in the kernel; this takes one hour tops to customize for a specific LCD. As for the KSB audio; this will be standard /dev/dsp; with the exception that it's strictly 16bit stereo 44k1 (or 48k, depending on which crystal you mount on the KSB). JDB [who can't wait to play Marathon on LART, now Bungie have released the source] -- "A satisfied customer ? We ought to have him stuffed !" -- Basil Fawlty -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:38:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26744 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:38:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26740 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:38:50 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500KCD3CPI2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:38:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from comanchetx.com [63.64.123.18] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A83F5E50218; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:34:39 -0500 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:35:43 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: mike@mjv.com Message-id: <38FA787F.BA68DB14@comanchetx.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <00041618091603.08671@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'll settle for the pcb and a bag of parts (or a few of them depending on how the price goes) - a friend of mine used to do soldering of the same type of chips and surface-mounts for nokia, so I at least have someone to look over my shoulder... I'm interested in the whole shabang - LART, KSB and Eth... Mike Doug Moreen wrote: > > JD Baker, > > I don't have any "enterprising > dreams"....................................................... > I just need a card or two, and am here in the hinterlands where it's difficult > to get this kind of prototyping done, so I wouldn't be the guy to make a small > fortune (???) on the production. I was just hoping that this proposal could > expidite the cards being made, and to find a way to get the guy's expenses > covered. > > Sure I'd be willing to spend a little on shipping if it could drop the price of > either a finished MotherBoard or a unstuffed motherboard with the parts > necessary to finish it. It will be a tedious job to solder in a bunch of SMD > parts, so I was hoping for a stuffed board. The prices you are quoting are even > better then I thought. Email me when you are ready to ship. > regards > Doug Moreen > > On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... > > > > >For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > > >production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > > >already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > > >I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > > >percentage > > >points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > > >mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > > >from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. > > > > Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 > > costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks > > lead time). > > > > We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > combo. > > > > Note that shipping to the US will drive up small qty pricing. I have > > absolutely no problem with (and possibly even a preference for) one party > > collecting orders and getting one big NL->US shipment of PCBs. An even more > > viable business model occurs if that party were to buy the 'difficult' > > parts (CPU, Flash, DRAM) and maybe sell partly mounted kits. > > > > If you're going for economy of scale it may be worth going that extra mile. > > > > JDB. > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > -- > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:46:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26812 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:46:21 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26808 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:46:20 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:46:07 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: [off-topic] Any ornithologists out there ? Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, Why is it that those sodding birds out here decide that 4:40AM is a perfectly acceptable time to start chattering ? It's still *dark* ! GO TO SLEEP already ! JDB. [whaddaya mean off-topic ? I'm the smeggin' listadmin, I get to decide what's off-topic or not!] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:51:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26884 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26880 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:16 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500KJO3XEEH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.18] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB504203DE; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:47:44 -0500 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:49:19 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FA7BAF.DD1E8845@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Put me down as a participant. Quantity will depend on price... Mike Doug Moreen wrote: > > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few percentage > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a 30% > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from the > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to get. > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and cost > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message archive, > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to > handle this? > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > http://www.paypal.com ) > regards > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 04:55:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26945 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:55:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26941 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:55:58 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500KLE458EH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:55:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA13710; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:45:01 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:45:01 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: Re: BOOOOOM In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > Just when I get out of bed to eat some yoghurt you come and ask me for a > BOM. Oh well, even less sleep then. Hope you're happy ;-) > that's what you get for eating yoghurt! 'we put the hurt in yogurt' rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 06:09:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA27421 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:09:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA27417 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:09:42 +0200 Received: from l98uppx1.hewitt.com (l98uppx1.hewitt.com [4.17.250.5]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500LNY7K5FU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:09:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from noaccess@localhost) by l98uppx1.hewitt.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA20208 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:40 -0500 (CDT) Received: from lintng1.hewitt.com(10.20.68.64) by l98upfw32 via smap (V2.1+anti-relay+anti-spam) id xma020190; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:36 -0500 Received: by lintng1.hewitt.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.6 (890.1 7-16-1999)) id 862568C4.0016AAEC ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:35 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:08:59 +0800 From: Anita Yu Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <862568C4.0016AACD.00@lintng1.hewitt.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: HEWITT ASSOCIATES NA X-Authentication-warning: l98upfw32.hewitt.com: noaccess set sender to using -f Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm interested in a few boards as well. Please count me in! I'm currently stationed in Hong Kong, so shipping will be more hefty for me, although I'm quite willing to pay for it. On a side note, I'm thinking that maybe it will be cheaper to produce the boards in Asia, since so many companies have set up shop around here. I'll check around for prices... From: Michael Vanecek on 04/17/2000 10:35 AM Please respond to mike@mjv.com To: cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Client: Subject: Re: a small proposal I'll settle for the pcb and a bag of parts (or a few of them depending on how the price goes) - a friend of mine used to do soldering of the same type of chips and surface-mounts for nokia, so I at least have someone to look over my shoulder... I'm interested in the whole shabang - LART, KSB and Eth... Mike Doug Moreen wrote: > > JD Baker, > > I don't have any "enterprising > dreams"....................................................... > I just need a card or two, and am here in the hinterlands where it's difficult > to get this kind of prototyping done, so I wouldn't be the guy to make a small > fortune (???) on the production. I was just hoping that this proposal could > expidite the cards being made, and to find a way to get the guy's expenses > covered. > > Sure I'd be willing to spend a little on shipping if it could drop the price of > either a finished MotherBoard or a unstuffed motherboard with the parts > necessary to finish it. It will be a tedious job to solder in a bunch of SMD > parts, so I was hoping for a stuffed board. The prices you are quoting are even > better then I thought. Email me when you are ready to ship. > regards > Doug Moreen > > On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... > > > > >For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > > >production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > > >already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > > >I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > > >percentage > > >points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > > >mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > > >from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. > > > > Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 > > costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks > > lead time). > > > > We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > combo. > > > > Note that shipping to the US will drive up small qty pricing. I have > > absolutely no problem with (and possibly even a preference for) one party > > collecting orders and getting one big NL->US shipment of PCBs. An even more > > viable business model occurs if that party were to buy the 'difficult' > > parts (CPU, Flash, DRAM) and maybe sell partly mounted kits. > > > > If you're going for economy of scale it may be worth going that extra mile. > > > > JDB. > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > -- > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 06:58:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA27690 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:58:44 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA27686 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:58:44 +0200 Received: from sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU (sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU [149.171.96.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500MER9TRCI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:58:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from alpha400.ee.unsw.edu.au (alpha400.ee.unsw.EDU.AU [149.171.36.48]) by sam.comms.unsw.EDU.AU (8.8.8/8.8.8 Kenso-Central-NO-SPAM) with ESMTP id OAA04131; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:47:07 +1000 (EST) Received: from localhost (u2189659@localhost) by alpha400.ee.unsw.edu.au (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA07176; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:46:45 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:46:45 +1000 (EST) From: Ken Chiu Kun Wu Subject: Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:ff To: Lart Mail Server Cc: pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, Help! I've got this error after I loaded both Kernel and Ramdisk and "boot kernel". The kernel image is based on 2.3.35 and the boot loader is blob-1.0.5 Also the ramdisk is "ramdisk-lart-videolink" from LART. I've no idea what's going :( well the only difference can only be my kernel... so i must've done something wrong there.. To compile kernel image successfully I had to select No for "Frame buffer" and virtual console. I also replaced mm-sa1100.c with the one for PLEB (since my board is PLEB). Cheers Ken ---error--- zone(1): 0 pages. zone(2): 0 pages. On node 1 totalpages: 00001000 zone(0): 4096 pages. zone(1): 0 pages. zone(2): 0 pages. Calibrating delay loop... 194.15 BogoMIPS Memory: 16MB 16MB = 32MB total Memory: 31168KB available (598K code, 400K data, 8K init) Buffer-cache hash table entries: 1024 (order: 0, 4096 bytes) Page-cache hash table entries: 8192 (order: 3, 32768 bytes) POSIX conformance testing by UNIFIX Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.3 Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039 Starting kswapd v1.6 SA1100 serial driver version 4.27 with no serial options enabled ttyS00 at 0xf8050000 (irq = 17) is a SA1100 UART ttyS01 at 0xf8010000 (irq = 15) is a SA1100 UART pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured RAMDISK driver initialized: 16 RAM disks of 4096K size 1024 blocksize NetWinder Floating Point Emulator V0.95 (c) 1998-1999 Rebel.com VFS: Cannot open root device 00:ff Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:ff ------- Cheers Ken ----------------------------------------------- Ken Wu (Electrical/Biomedical Eng. UNSW Sydney) E-Mail: kenwu@ieee.org kenchiu.wu@au.unisys.com Homepage: www.progsoc.uts.edu.au/~kckwu Mobile: 0410 668 349 ICQ number: 1074203 ----------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 09:37:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA28527 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:37:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA28523 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:37:04 +0200 Received: from mrs-2.smartworld.net (mrs-2-fix.smartworld.net [216.70.64.26]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT5004DVH5Q0N@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:37:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from linux.de (IDENT:phil@1Cust157.tnt14.krk1.da.uu.net [63.26.25.157]) by mrs-2.smartworld.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id DAA89115 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 03:31:47 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:33:28 +0200 From: Philipp Knirsch Subject: FIX: Gerber RS-274D/X viewer in Java To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <38FA3FB8.19BDA2FC@linux.de> Organization: Freelance IT professional MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.5-15 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi folks. Ah well, shit happens. I have packed the wrong version and have found some rather stupid little bugs in the first version i uploaded. So if you've already tried to download it, do it again. The following fixes have been done: - Typos where i used 247 instead of 274 - Start script now calls correct class - Start script uses now jre instead of java for runtime only installations - Included the PNM image output routine (forgot to put it in) - Added the magnification choice - Changed all filenames to 247 as well So give it a shot now. Have fun, Read ya, Phil PS: OK, i am the PS man. Just a little side not: I haven't noticed until it was too late that my Libretto was living in the future. Changed back my date, so emails should now have the correct date. Sorry for that inconvenience. -- _________ _______ _____ ___ _ \__________/ \________/ \______/ \____/ \__/ \/\| Philipp Knirsch Unix, Database, Internet and Java consulting, programming and design. phone: +49 7121 907033 mobil: +49 179 2922425 email: phil@linux.de www: http://www.wizards.de/phil Motd: Never run a changing system... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 10:12:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28828 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:12:42 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28824 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:12:41 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA20946; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:12:38 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:12:38 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004170812.KAA20946@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: david@fish.ecks.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: StrongARM reviews ? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:44:15 +0000 (GMT), David Poisson wrote: > I was wondering if there are any sites with reviews about the StrongARM > (what it can and cannot do). Because I heard that the strongARM don't > have a good FPU so you couldn't play games/mp3s on them. Would like to > find benchmarks and such information on them if possible. The StrongARM doesn't have a FPU at all. The StrongARM isn't a desktop CPU, it's an embedded CPU. MP3 files can be played with ~20% CPU time, have a look at the "MPEG audio decoding" thread in the mailing list archive. > Sorry for the repost, I had a lot of trouble trying to setup procmail to > send everything from this mailing-list to a seperate mail file. If anyone > is already doing this, would you mind telling me which rules you are using > ? Cause there doesn't seem to be a unique thing that's always in every > email sent to the list. It's a majordomo list, so there is a "Sender" header. Here's part of my .procmailrc: # LART mailing list :0: * ^Sender:\ owner-lart@lart\.tudelft\.nl $HOME/Mail/lart The "Sender" is unique; it never failed for linux-kernel (300 msg a day) to me. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2785859 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 10:20:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28916 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:20:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28912 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:20:45 +0200 Received: from hitron.co.kr ([203.251.147.1]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT5006OFJ6IVK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:20:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wksong (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hitron.co.kr (8.9.1a-H1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA26675 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:56:47 +0900 (KST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:07:44 +0900 From: Song Weon-Kook Subject: boot loader? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <003101bfa844$035c8220$670aa8c0@hitron.co.kr> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002E_01BFA88F.727ABFA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BFA88F.727ABFA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkNCg0KUGxlYXNlIGxldCBtZSBrbm93IHRoZSByZWxhdGlvbnMgYmV0d2VlbiBib290IGxvYWRl ciBhbmQgbGludXgga2VybmVsLg0KDQpUaGFua3lvdQ0K ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BFA88F.727ABFA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PCFET0NUWVBFIEhUTUwgUFVCTElDICItLy9XM0MvL0RURCBIVE1MIDQuMCBUcmFuc2l0aW9uYWwv L0VOIj4NCjxIVE1MPjxIRUFEPg0KPE1FVEEgY29udGVudD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PWtz X2NfNTYwMS0xOTg3IiBodHRwLWVxdWl2PUNvbnRlbnQtVHlwZT4NCjxNRVRBIGNvbnRlbnQ9Ik1T SFRNTCA1LjAwLjI2MTQuMzUwMCIgbmFtZT1HRU5FUkFUT1I+DQo8U1RZTEU+PC9TVFlMRT4NCjwv SEVBRD4NCjxCT0RZIGJnQ29sb3I9I2ZmZmZmZj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0yPkhpPC9GT05U PjwvRElWPg0KPERJVj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0yPlBsZWFzZSBsZXQg bWUga25vdyB0aGUgcmVsYXRpb25zIGJldHdlZW4gYm9vdCBsb2FkZXIgYW5kIGxpbnV4IA0Ka2Vy bmVsLjwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+Jm5ic3A7PC9ESVY+DQo8RElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj5U aGFua3lvdTwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj48L0JPRFk+PC9IVE1MPg0K ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BFA88F.727ABFA0-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 10:39:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA29112 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:39:02 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA29096; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:38:48 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <003101bfa844$035c8220$670aa8c0@hitron.co.kr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:37:37 +0200 To: Song Weon-Kook From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: boot loader? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 10:07 +0200 17-04-2000, Song Weon-Kook wrote: > Hi Please let me know the relations between boot loader and linux >kernel. Thankyou Erm... the boot loader loads the linux kernel ? JDB [could you be more specific ?] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 10:48:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA29190 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:48:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA29186 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:48:44 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT5009I2KH7QL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:48:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12h799-000JeY-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:44:43 +0100 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:45:43 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Boot Rom? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FACF37.7A196918@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all. I'm new to the list, but couldn't find the answer in the archive, so:- How does the original image get into the Boot ROMs? I've just come off a project where I had to build a jtag flash programmer to bring a SA1100 board up from bare- while I don't have the rights to that code, it shouldn't take too long to build something similar- it just took an Altera 10K30 hung off the printer port of a PC, + piped the FPGA code, followed by the boot code, to LPT1- should be usable by most OSen. A 200K image took about 15 seconds, so not unbearably slow... Also, for the UK LARTers, I may be able to track down some SA1100s, _BUT_ odds on, they're the ones with the nadgered IRDA implementation. Any interest? Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 11:04:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA29376 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:04:31 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA29369; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:04:20 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FACF37.7A196918@steves-house.org.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:02:03 +0200 To: Steve Wiseman From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Boot Rom? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 10:45 +0200 17-04-2000, Steve Wiseman wrote: >Hi all. > I'm new to the list, but couldn't find the answer in the archive, >so:- We had a discussion about this last week; check the archives around April 10 for "Programming LART Flash for the first time". Here's the Reader's Digest version: >How does the original image get into the Boot ROMs? I've just come off >a project where I had to build a jtag flash programmer to bring a >SA1100 board up from bare- while I don't have the rights to that code, >it shouldn't take too long to build something similar- it just took an >Altera 10K30 hung off the printer port of a PC, + piped the FPGA code, >followed by the boot code, to LPT1- should be usable by most OSen. A >200K image took about 15 seconds, so not unbearably slow... We want to go JTAG, but even simpler than that: by bit banging over the parallel port. You only need a driver (or some resistors if like Intel you don't care about the 5V->3V3 transition), and some software. Intel has some code for their SA-1110 board which I'm trying to adapt for LART. Granted it's slower than an FPGA data pump would be, but it does the job. And you would only need it for the boot loader. If you still happen to have access to one of those SA-1100 based boards you'd be the ideal JTAG software co-developer 8-) JDB. -- Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 15:17:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA30744 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:17:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA30740 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:17:12 +0200 Received: from trurl.warmage.com (juror01.lis.net.au [203.35.83.40]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500A21WWI33@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:17:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (jmayo@localhost) by trurl.warmage.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA00478; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:14:45 +1000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:14:45 +1000 (EST) From: Joshua Matthew Mayo Subject: Re: Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:ff In-reply-to: X-Sender: jmayo@trurl.warmage.com To: Ken Chiu Kun Wu Cc: Lart Mail Server , pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: trurl.warmage.com: jmayo owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ken Chiu Kun Wu wrote: > Hi all, > Help! I've got this error after I loaded both Kernel and Ramdisk > and "boot kernel". The kernel image is based on 2.3.35 and the boot > loader is blob-1.0.5 Also the ramdisk is "ramdisk-lart-videolink" > from LART. I've no idea what's going :( well the only difference can only > be my kernel... so i must've done something wrong there.. [snip] > ---error--- [snip] > RAMDISK driver initialized: 16 RAM disks of 4096K size 1024 blocksize > NetWinder Floating Point Emulator V0.95 (c) 1998-1999 Rebel.com > VFS: Cannot open root device 00:ff > Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:ff > ------- Ok. I'll admit to not having any direct experience with the SA boards, but I recognise this error. :) I believe the Linux kernel interprets device 00:ff as being for an NFS mounted root filesystem. You don't have any network drivers compiled in, so it has no way to try to mount an NFS directory. You need to set the root filesystem to whatever device contains your ramdisk image, using `rdev` after the kernel is compiled. --- Tell me if you got 20 emails saying the same thing. :) I haven't got any list responses yet, but I have a history of announcing the obvious to the world. :) -Josh Mayo. (Everything with a Grin :) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 15:18:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA30757 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:18:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA30753 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:18:05 +0200 Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500A51WY333@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:18:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hBKo-000Idp-0V for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:13:02 +0100 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:47:19 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: UK nadgered SA1100s, was Boot Rom? In-reply-to: <38FACF37.7A196918@steves-house.org.uk> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <38FACF37.7A196918@steves-house.org.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <38FACF37.7A196918@steves-house.org.uk>, Steve Wiseman writes >Hi all. > I'm new to the list, but couldn't find the answer in the archive, >so:- >How does the original image get into the Boot ROMs? I've just come off >a project where I had to build a jtag flash programmer to bring a >SA1100 board up from bare- while I don't have the rights to that code, >it shouldn't take too long to build something similar- it just took an >Altera 10K30 hung off the printer port of a PC, + piped the FPGA code, >followed by the boot code, to LPT1- should be usable by most OSen. A >200K image took about 15 seconds, so not unbearably slow... > >Also, for the UK LARTers, I may be able to track down some SA1100s, >_BUT_ odds on, they're the ones with the nadgered IRDA implementation. >Any interest? > >Steve Almost certainly depending on price and maybe somewhere between 2 and 5 if they are available. Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 16:35:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA31217 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:35:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA31213 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:35:27 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600FCD0J1QP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:35:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id JAA13929; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:31:34 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:31:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: StrongARM reviews ? - some numbers In-reply-to: To: David Poisson Cc: lart Message-id: <200004171431.JAA13929@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > I was wondering if there are any sites with reviews about the StrongARM > (what it can and cannot do). Because I heard that the strongARM don't > have a good FPU so you couldn't play games/mp3s on them. Would like to > find benchmarks and such information on them if possible. I suspect generic benchmarks of the strongarm will be of limited use. You would be best off to simply run your expensive code and see how it works. Our Strongarm based product is a fairly large and complicated system, but I know 90% of the cpu time is in a certain 40 line function. Thats the only one I ever need to benchmark. I have a set of micro benchmarks and macro benchmarks which I hesitate to post. The problem is that there is a gaping disconnect between the micro benchmarks (small, specific tasks) and the macro benchmarks (whole programs). I have a StrongARM 110 machine set up on the internet and will give an account to anyone who wishes it for benchmarking or development. Just e-mail. Its running Debian linux. Ok, enough hesitation, here are the numbers. I guess I have to say that since they correlate so poorly you shouldn't use them for anything. I'll show a Netwinder strongarm 110 266MHz against an Intergraph PentiumPro 200MHz. The SA110 memory subsytem and the SA1100 probably differ wildly, perhaps their internal instruction timing as well. This is VERY rough data to use for LART performance estimation. The tables of numbers following are how many times per second the given task was performed. The two macro benchmarks included are groffing the ls man page and gzipping the LGPL, the rest are micro benchmarks that should be reasonably self explanatory. PentiumPro 200 crypt001 70.424 100 crypt() dummy 3090806.906 an empty function float001 33.899 1000 10 element dot products getuid 583.383 1000 getuid() calls groff001 2.096 groff ls-man gzip001 28.281 gzip LGPL-2.1 memcpy001 69.278 memcpy 1MB, aligned memcpy002 69.053 memcpy 1MB, not aligned memcpy003 306.108 1024 memcpy 1kB, aligned memset001 70.023 memset 1MB strcpy001 41.956 strcpy 1MB, aligned strcpy002 92.666 1024 strcpy 1k, aligned yield 408.633 1000 yield() calls StrongARM 266 crypt001 19.517 100 crypt() dummy 603965.108 an empty function float001 4.477 1000 10 element dot products getuid 1959.180 1000 getuid() calls groff001 0.370 groff ls-man gzip001 9.873 gzip LGPL-2.1 memcpy001 61.561 memcpy 1MB, aligned memcpy002 56.621 memcpy 1MB, not aligned memcpy003 116.567 1024 memcpy 1kB, aligned memset001 115.634 memset 1MB strcpy001 31.923 strcpy 1MB, aligned strcpy002 44.099 1024 strcpy 1k, aligned yield 932.031 1000 yield() calls (The `dummy' test is all the timer function overhead wrapped around the test call. The StrongARM timer functions are quite a bit more complicated than the intel ones. Intel is just grabbing the cycle counter, the SA110 is computing based off of the count and phase of two 266MHz counters that wrap at slightly different counts.) You'll note that the StrongARM beats the PP200 handily for small system calls, is quite close for non-cached memory access and string handling, quite slower for cached memory access and c code (gzip), dreadfully slower for c++ code (groff) and just plain sad for floating point (using a FP emulator). (Bad me: The distinction between C and C++ code speeds is not supported by this set of results. I have other results that support that which I have not published here. I theorize that the number of branches and jumps is greater in C++ and that hurts the strongarm.) (Note to extrapolators: a PIII 400MHz is about twice as fast at everything as a PP200. A little more so on memory.) -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 17:26:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA31523 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:26:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA31519 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:26:04 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600JD72VBBG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:26:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.68.212]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA07549 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:49:19 +0530 (IST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:53:42 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: porting questions... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002201bfa880$eb1586c0$d44436ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk i was wondering how i'd get all that C float code in quake ported to the StrongARM... is netwinder an FPU emulator - for the strongarm? i have no strongarm here... so i'm not running armlinux... i dunno.. didn't even try patching linux with the ARM patches. #1> i think there is? a provision for an external FPU...? #2> doesn't intel make any co-processor(fpu) for it? - muks ps: i have some issues with the quake port. [pps: henceforth quake means quake 1.. no not that lart won't run q3 ever :)]. #1> since a lot of float code is in quake, i was a concerned about float capabilities.. since there is an FPU emulator, i can let it take care of most of the float code and only optimize in the right places.. ??? #2> video: i port quake to framebuffer, that's all? what resolution/bpp? #3> input handling: where/how do i get my input? keyboard? moose? joisteek? #4> sound: guess i'll put in null sound driver for now till oss. #5> net: what are the network interface capabilites? can you put the lart on an TCP/IP network yet? or should i put in the null driver? #6> where am i (sorry, read that "where are you") gonna put that quake P-A-K file on the lart? - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 17:32:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA31573 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:32:41 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA31569 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:32:40 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FT60014W36F91@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:32:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.87] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AE22D510238; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:30:42 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:32:05 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the listserv. Any way to fix that? Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) I figure maybe lart.org if it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) Mike -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: a small proposal Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:41:09 EDT From: LeoSusanto@aol.com To: mike@mjv.com let me in too. but where is your location? i am at southern CA leo In a message dated 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time, mike@mjv.com writes: << Subj: Re: a small proposal Date: 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time From: mike@mjv.com (Michael Vanecek) Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Put me down as a participant. Quantity will depend on price... Mike Doug Moreen wrote: > > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few percentage > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a 30% > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from the > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to get. > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and cost > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message archive, > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to > handle this? > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > http://www.paypal.com ) > regards > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- Return-Path: Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.1]) by air-yg01.mail.aol.com (v70.20) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:20 2000 Received: from thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (thorgal.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.91]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v71.10) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:00 -0400 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26884 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26880 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:16 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT500KJO3XEEH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.18] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB504203DE; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:47:44 -0500 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:49:19 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FA7BAF.DD1E8845@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 17:49:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA31660 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:49:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA31656 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:49:52 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600KHA3Z2EK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:49:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.70]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:52:18 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:46:28 -0600 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] To: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I've thought about it and the job needs to be done, so I guess I'm your chump. regards Doug Moreen ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Vanecek To: Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 9:32 AM Subject: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] > I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the > listserv. Any way to fix that? > > Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together > to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's > club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send > funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently > volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if > he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) I figure maybe lart.org if > it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can > be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) > > Mike > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: a small proposal > Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:41:09 EDT > From: LeoSusanto@aol.com > To: mike@mjv.com > > let me in too. but where is your location? i am at southern CA > > leo > In a message dated 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > mike@mjv.com > writes: > > << Subj: Re: a small proposal > Date: 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time > From: mike@mjv.com (Michael Vanecek) > Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl > To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl > > Put me down as a participant. Quantity will depend on price... > > Mike > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle > the > > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards > made > up. > > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > percentage > > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless > I'm > > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single > card > > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a > 30% > > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from > the > > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to > get. > > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and > cost > > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message > archive, > > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort > of org > to > > handle this? > > > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > > http://www.paypal.com ) > > regards > > Doug Moreen > > dogman@bitterroot.net > > AllBoot.Com > > http://www.allboot.com > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- > Return-Path: > Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com > [172.18.147.1]) > by air-yg01.mail.aol.com (v70.20) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:20 > 2000 > Received: from thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (thorgal.et.tudelft.nl > [130.161.40.91]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v71.10) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr > 2000 > 23:07:00 -0400 > Received: (from majordomo@localhost) > by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26884 > for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:17 +0200 > Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) > by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26880 > for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:16 +0200 > Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) > by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) > with ESMTP id <0FT500KJO3XEEH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for > lart@lart.tudelft.nl; > Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:15 +0200 (MET DST) > Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.18] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP > (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB504203DE; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:47:44 -0500 > Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:49:19 -0500 > From: Michael Vanecek > Subject: Re: a small proposal > To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Message-id: <38FA7BAF.DD1E8845@mjv.com> > MIME-version: 1.0 > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) > Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit > X-Accept-Language: en > References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> > <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> > Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Precedence: bulk > > >> > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 17:55:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA31690 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:55:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA31686 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:55:31 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600L4R48HJ0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:55:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.45] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A2F917CA0238; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:51:21 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:52:37 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: StrongARM reviews ? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB3345.F6EE3ACF@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Any chance of porting SDL over to StrongARM? They already have Mac and PC (Linux, Win32 and I think BeOS) ports. It'd be cool to have a little handheld Mealstrom player... :) > >i am interested in doing that quake port. but i need to know about > >programming for the display and sound, apart from the input unit. > >how much work has been done here? what kind of kitchen sink drivers > >are available? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:02:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA31746 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:02:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA31742 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:02:52 +0200 Received: from smtpe.casema.net (smtpe.casema.net [195.96.96.172]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT600L7L4KRUE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:02:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 24141 invoked from network); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:02:10 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gatekeeper2.slim) (212.64.37.79) by smtpe.casema.net with SMTP; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:02:10 +0000 Received: from inter.nl.net (paragon.slim [192.168.100.26]) by gatekeeper2.slim (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA04828; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:01:28 +0200 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:09:12 +0200 From: Jurgen Kramer Subject: Re: a small proposal To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB3728.C8721235@inter.nl.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > >combo. Where can we sign up for one board or more? Greetings, Jurgen -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:27:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA31907 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA31903 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:29 +0200 Received: from web3205.mail.yahoo.com (web3205.mail.yahoo.com [204.71.202.202]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT600M5A5PRVT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [216.252.186.226] by web3205.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:23:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:23:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Ghazan Haider Subject: Whats so special about LART? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the excitement about lart and i dont know why. Ive been aiming to produce the absolutely cheapest machines with LCD screens that can run win95 and linux.... LART doesnt even seem x86 compatible (is it?). OR maybe its very cheap to produce... is it cheaper than iopener and with better benchmarks??? Can it run DOOM? :) And if its not x86 compatible what compatible is it beside a linux kernel? -Ghazan Haider __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:27:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA31913 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA31909 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:52 +0200 Received: from dgf.uchile.cl (dgf.uchile.cl [146.83.8.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600M5Y5Q7VT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:27:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from castellatus.dgf.uchile.cl (castellatus [146.83.8.190]) by dgf.uchile.cl (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA02948 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:11:51 -0400 (CST) Received: from dgf.uchile.cl (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by castellatus.dgf.uchile.cl (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA29970 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:11:36 -0400 (CST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:11:36 -0400 From: Pablo Bleyer Kocik Subject: Re: a small proposal To: LART Message-id: <38FB37B8.8ABC8BCE@dgf.uchile.cl> Organization: Universidad de Chile MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... > > Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 > costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks > lead time). > > We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > combo. > > Note that shipping to the US will drive up small qty pricing. I have > absolutely no problem with (and possibly even a preference for) one party > collecting orders and getting one big NL->US shipment of PCBs. An even more > viable business model occurs if that party were to buy the 'difficult' > parts (CPU, Flash, DRAM) and maybe sell partly mounted kits. > > If you're going for economy of scale it may be worth going that extra mile. > > JDB. Now this is surprising. We are designing here (Chile) a SBC very similar to the LART (though it uses an Hitachi SuperH and has other components integrated in the main board). The cost for a 10cm x 10cm PCB is around US$20 in small quantities (4, indeed). The quality of the PCBs is excellent (they use CNC to build them). Gee... I guess living in an undeveloped country has some benefits... Cheers! -- Pablo Bleyer Kocik (pbleyer@dgf.uchile.cl) || "Todo lo que nace de mi smail: Moneda 973, of 336, Santiago || es la transformacion Santiago de Chile || de mi mismo"- J. Rulfo Chile -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:28:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA31938 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:28:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA31934 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:28:47 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600M4R5RXZ1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:28:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.25] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB4932AA0238; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:26:49 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:28:08 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] To: Doug Moreen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Well, looks like the lart domains are taken (.com, .net & .org). Ideas? I think lartcooperative.com may be a little wordy. :) Additionally, we'll probably want to form a legal body with a rep for dealing with the parts distributors and manufacturers. And then there's the banking and keeping track of funds. Logistics out the yinyang. But if we want to get good prices for use little geeks, I don't see any other way. Why spend days calling parts houses trying to track down this and that only to get raped because we're only buying a couple rather than bulk? I've always dreamed of being able to tinker with this stuff and maybe produce something neat like good ol' Woz did - having reliable and access to the componets at a fair price will really free up time and worry for other portions of the project like software, case design, etc... I know a few of the list members are doing this already (I'm still hoping to snag one of those pcb's from Mr. Fountain) - we could all team up and do it collectively... Anyone have any experience in putting together a cooperative? Doug Moreen wrote: > > I've thought about it and the job needs to be done, so I guess I'm your > chump. > regards > Doug Moreen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Michael Vanecek > To: > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 9:32 AM > Subject: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] > > > I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the > > listserv. Any way to fix that? > > > > Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together > > to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's > > club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send > > funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently > > volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if > > he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) I figure maybe lart.org if > > it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can > > be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) > > > > Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:55:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA32102 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:55:28 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA32062; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:55:11 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FB37B8.8ABC8BCE@dgf.uchile.cl> References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:53:09 +0200 To: Pablo Bleyer Kocik From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: LART Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 18:11 +0200 17-04-2000, Pablo Bleyer Kocik wrote: >> We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra >> blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet >> combo. > > Now this is surprising. We are designing here (Chile) a SBC very >similar to the LART (though it uses an Hitachi SuperH and has other >components integrated in the main board). The cost for a 10cm x 10cm PCB >is around US$20 in small quantities (4, indeed). The quality of the PCBs >is excellent (they use CNC to build them). Are those six-layer PCBs with 0.15mm (six mil) trace width/clearance and 0.3 mm (12 mil) smallest hole diameter ? If yes then I want the address of your PCB fab house :) JDB. -- "Windows is the one true OS. MS invented the GUI. MS invented the 32 bit OS. MS is open and standard. MS loves you. We have always been at war with Oceania." -- Tracy Reed -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 18:59:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA32127 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:59:59 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA32123 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:59:59 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA16923; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:59:55 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004171659.SAA16923@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: LAR submission 2000041704 To: msim@web.fairfax.com.au Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:59:55 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Michael, [cc-ed to the LART list] > $lar[2000041704] = array( > 'name' => "Michael Sim", > 'mail' => "msim@web.fairfax.com.au", > 'type' => "idea", > 'stat' => "concept", > 'desc' => "Lart-IDE", > 'text' => "figuring out some way to rig a IDE controller to the > LART, i don't know if it's much effort but still, > "wouldn't it be nice". incidentally im looking at > building a lart, my girlfriend is gonna kill me if it costs > too much :|, but damn it'd be worth dying for!", > 'link' => array(), > 'clog' => array() > ); (So this is how these entries are stored. Isn't that worth a patent, like Amazon's one-click technology? ;) You might be interested to know that this has been a major issue since the first ideas of a LART bubbled up in JDB's head. The kitchen sink board (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/ksb/ ) is currently being tested. It has an IDE interface, as well audio, video, keyboard and mouse connectors. So you see, currently there's no need to die for any part of the LART :) Other people on the mailinglist may also want to check out the ideas in the LART Application Repository, since most of them only need some good developers (yes, and that hardware... patience please). I could also post the submissions to the mailinglist - think of it as spoonfeeding 8) -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:10:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32246 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:10:21 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32241; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:10:19 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FB3728.C8721235@inter.nl.net> References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:59:54 +0200 To: Jurgen Kramer From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 18:09 +0200 17-04-2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: >> >> >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra >> >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet >> >combo. > >Where can we sign up for one board or more? Right here on the list. I'll post an announce once we get that far; expect it to happen in 4-5 weeks. I suggest you start chasing after parts by then. Don't kid yourself: getting the important bits will easily take you longer than that. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:10:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32259 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:10:27 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32247; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:10:21 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <002201bfa880$eb1586c0$d44436ca@muks> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:09:16 +0200 To: Mukund Iyer From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: porting questions... Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 17:23 +0200 17-04-2000, Mukund Iyer wrote: >i was wondering how i'd get all that C float code in >quake ported to the StrongARM... is netwinder an FPU >emulator - for the strongarm? >i have no strongarm here... so i'm not running armlinux... >i dunno.. didn't even try patching linux with the ARM >patches. > >#1> i think there is? a provision for an external FPU...? In general ARM yes, on the SA-1 archtecture no. >#2> doesn't intel make any co-processor(fpu) for it? No. If you're a true hardware diehard you can hang an FPGA on the SA bus and program it as a FPU, but I would suggest against that. We're talking many man-years if you go that route. >#1> since a lot of float code is in quake, i was a concerned >about float capabilities.. since there is an FPU emulator, >i can let it take care of most of the float code and only >optimize in the right places.. ??? That's one way of going about it. You may also check how hard it is to rewrite the FP code to use fixed point. The nice thing is that you can test that on a regular i386 machine. >#2> video: i port quake to framebuffer, that's all? what resolution/bpp? Start with 320x240 @ 8/16bpp ; it's easy to find good LCDs in that range. >#3> input handling: where/how do i get my input? keyboard? moose? joisteek? The KSB has PS/2 connections; you could use those. I guess this is not your main problem tho. >#4> sound: guess i'll put in null sound driver for now till oss. OK; you can also just send data to /dev/dsp. >#5> net: what are the network interface capabilites? can you put >the lart on an TCP/IP network yet? or should i put in the null driver? It runs Linux, so it can have TCP. >#6> where am i (sorry, read that "where are you") gonna put that >quake P-A-K file on the lart? Hard disk or flash. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:23:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32351 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:23:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32347 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:23:42 +0200 Received: from oahu.axysdesign.com ([198.172.73.114]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60016Q8BGU1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:23:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from axysdesign.com (easter.axysdesign.com [192.168.3.17]) by oahu.axysdesign.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BB17B482; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:16:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:16:59 -0700 From: Bill Sidhipong Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? To: Ghazan Haider Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB470B.4EE7B8BF@axysdesign.com> Organization: AXYS Design, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.15pre14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ghazan Haider wrote: > > Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the > excitement about lart and i dont know why. Ive been > aiming to produce the absolutely cheapest machines > with LCD screens that can run win95 and linux.... Okay, keep this perspective in mind for later. > LART doesnt even seem x86 compatible (is it?). No, it is based on ARM processor. > OR maybe its very cheap to produce... Depends on the quantity. > is it cheaper than iopener and with better benchmarks 1) The I-Opener's cost to you is nowhere near the cost you could hope to build it yourself. It has been estimated that each unit costs Netpliance anywhere from $300-$500 to build in quantity of 30,000 units. 2) The I-Opener may be cheaper for you *now*, but that doesn't mean it'll always be cheap forever. Netpliance will go back to $199 pricing soon, and you will also be required to agree to ToS. Did this stop me from buying a few I-Openers? No :) > And if its not x86 compatible what compatible is it > beside a linux kernel? From that perspective, you do not want the LART, nor can you benefit from it if one were to materialize on your front door ... The LART as it appears has many benefits that will be apparent once you look at it from another angle. Hints: cooperation, open design, complete feature set, reasonably powerful CPU, plenty of memory, small, very low power consumption. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:28:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32413 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:28:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32409 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:28:19 +0200 Received: from wcug.wwu.edu (sloth.wcug.wwu.edu [140.160.164.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT6001FV8J5IL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:28:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 26478 invoked by uid 1002); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:26:42 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:26:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamie Heilman Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? In-reply-to: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: jamie@sloth To: Ghazan Haider Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Jamie Heilman Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ghazan Haider wrote: >Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the excitement about lart and >i dont know why. There are a lot of reasons, I'll tell you one of them, then let you go research the rest. 1W power consumption. Think about that. That fancy-pants graphics card in your PC you're using probalby eats about 50W all by itself. Anyone want to hazzard a guess as to how long you could keep a LART alive on a 1400VA UPS in the event of a power failure? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:38:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32552 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:38:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32548 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:38:46 +0200 Received: from server1.siscom.net (server1.siscom.net [209.251.2.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT6001I990KME@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:38:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 337 invoked from network); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:34:57 +0000 Received: from ppp9.c5300-1.day-oh.siscom.net (HELO siscom.net) ([209.251.9.9]) (envelope-sender ) by server1.siscom.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:34:57 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:33:37 -0700 From: Brian Kraack Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] To: Michael Vanecek Cc: Doug Moreen , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: bkraack@siscom.net Message-id: <38FB7520.DFCBC83@siscom.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have a buddy who is a salesman at a xylynx distributor in Dayton, OH (US). So if this something happens here, maybe I can help out somehow. /Brian Michael Vanecek wrote: > Well, looks like the lart domains are taken (.com, .net & .org). Ideas? > I think lartcooperative.com may be a little wordy. :) Additionally, > we'll probably want to form a legal body with a rep for dealing with the > parts distributors and manufacturers. And then there's the banking and > keeping track of funds. Logistics out the yinyang. But if we want to get > good prices for use little geeks, I don't see any other way. Why spend > days calling parts houses trying to track down this and that only to get > raped because we're only buying a couple rather than bulk? I've always > dreamed of being able to tinker with this stuff and maybe produce > something neat like good ol' Woz did - having reliable and access to the > componets at a fair price will really free up time and worry for other > portions of the project like software, case design, etc... I know a few > of the list members are doing this already (I'm still hoping to snag one > of those pcb's from Mr. Fountain) - we could all team up and do it > collectively... Anyone have any experience in putting together a > cooperative? > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > > I've thought about it and the job needs to be done, so I guess I'm your > > chump. > > regards > > Doug Moreen > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Michael Vanecek > > To: > > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 9:32 AM > > Subject: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] > > > > > I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the > > > listserv. Any way to fix that? > > > > > > Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together > > > to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's > > > club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send > > > funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently > > > volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if > > > he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) I figure maybe lart.org if > > > it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can > > > be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) > > > > > > Mike > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:42:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32604 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:42:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32600 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:42:35 +0200 Received: from smtpe.casema.net (smtpe.casema.net [195.96.96.172]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT60021T96YUM@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:42:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 14766 invoked from network); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:40:11 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gatekeeper2.slim) (212.64.37.79) by smtpe.casema.net with SMTP; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:40:11 +0000 Received: from inter.nl.net (paragon.slim [192.168.100.26]) by gatekeeper2.slim (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA04853; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:39:29 +0200 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:47:13 +0200 From: Jurgen Kramer Subject: Re: a small proposal To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB4E21.A4B8F413@inter.nl.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > >Right here on the list. I'll post an announce once we get that far; expect > >it to happen in 4-5 weeks. > > >I suggest you start chasing after parts by then. Don't kid yourself: > >getting the important bits will easily take you longer than that. So no complete boards? Although I like to play with hardware in this case I'd rather start fiddling with Linux itself... Jurgen -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 19:45:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA32627 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:45:43 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA32623 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:45:42 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id TAA25231; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:45:26 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:45:26 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004171745.TAA25231@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: jamie@wcug.wwu.edu Cc: ghazanhaider@yahoo.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:26:42 -0700 (PDT), Jamie Heilman wrote: > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ghazan Haider wrote: >>Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the excitement about lart and >>i dont know why. > > There are a lot of reasons, I'll tell you one of them, then let you go > research the rest. 1W power consumption. Think about that. That > fancy-pants graphics card in your PC you're using probalby eats about 50W > all by itself. Anyone want to hazzard a guess as to how long you could > keep a LART alive on a 1400VA UPS in the event of a power failure? I can do, bu I'll have to assume you meant 1400 VAh: A LART in idle mode draws 42mA at 9V, so: 1400VAh / ( 9V * 42 mA ) = 3703.7 hours = 154.3 days The UPS doesn't have an efficiency of 100 percent, and the LART will not allways be idle, so we cut that figure in half, which still leaves us with 77 days computing pleasure ;-) FYI: an idle LART will run about 40 hours on a single 4.5V battery. Erik -- "people are still using Win98? Wow... VMS i could understand, but WinXX - that's just so passe..." -- Paul Jakma on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:04:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA32748 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:04:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA32744 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:04:53 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60032LA83NV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:04:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id NAA31004; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:01:19 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:01:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? In-reply-to: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> To: Ghazan Haider Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004171801.NAA31004@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the > excitement about lart and i dont know why. Ive been > aiming to produce the absolutely cheapest machines > with LCD screens that can run win95 and linux.... LART > doesnt even seem x86 compatible (is it?). OR maybe its > very cheap to produce... is it cheaper than iopener > and with better benchmarks??? Can it run DOOM? :) > And if its not x86 compatible what compatible is it > beside a linux kernel? `Special' is a subjective term. I'll tell you why I think it is special. When producing appliance type hardware in less than mass volume the design cost is significant. Add in the risk that the design will need an unknown debugging period and now you have an expensive platform that may or may not be ready in a timely manner. LART changes the risk and design expense. If many people successfully build LARTs and they work reliably then the design is validated and it becomes a known good baseline for a designer to customize into a finished device. The OSS community as shown that many people contributing and sharing their experience can produce top quality work. It takes a few seeds to start the process. LART? Now for your application, I suspect you will not like ARM processors. They are not x86s. They can play DOOM. They will not run win9x. I think there is a WinCE kit for them if that is your cup of tea. They are close to the i-opener for raw performance, depends what you are doing. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:09:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00045 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:09:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00041 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:09:08 +0200 Received: from libertyweb.liberty.ca ([207.236.111.122]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6003EKAF699@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:09:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from laptop - 207.236.111.121 by libertyweb.liberty.ca with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1774.114.11); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:16:59 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:04:42 -0400 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002801bfa897$781f2ba0$981410ac@home.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm interested, but is there anyone interested in buy assembled boards ? I'm working on getting a friend of the family to built some for me, but he won't do it unless I get can buy a couple of hundreds... I'm getting the bill of material and I'll be shopping soon, I was wondering if someone had done this before and is willing to help me ....? That would seed up the process... Hugues Belanger > 905.973.9400 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jurgen Kramer > To: J.D. Bakker > Cc: > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 12:09 PM > Subject: Re: a small proposal > > > > > > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell > extra > > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > > >combo. > > > > Where can we sign up for one board or more? > > > > Greetings, > > > > Jurgen > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:15:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00155 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:15:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00151 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:15:45 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6003D6AQ7IY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:15:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.70]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:18:11 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:14:39 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] In-reply-to: <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: Brian Kraack , Jurgen Kramer , David Poisson , Anita Yu Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041712122201.11476@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Michael and other people in the US (and Canada) who want inexpensive LART parts; so far I count eight people who are interested Co-ops? Well, not since the wild and wooly days of the late sixtys and early seventys, which I mostly missed due to the US Army and a fairly long stint overseas as a contract engineer. The big trick is to get it set-up as a non-profit, though non-profit status, isn't the easiest thing for an organization to achieve. Even if the organization isn't officially a non-profit, the goals of the organization are not to make a profit anyway, so we shouldn't get hit with taxes for that reason. The realities off getting parts in general, when you are just ordering a few parts means that you are paying the highest possible prices. For example go to the electronics store, Radio Shack, that has displaced most of the small electronics retailers in the US. The prices there are many times the prices, that manufactures pay for the same parts. This is a bit too high of prices for most of us to pay. So maybe a longer term goal should be to not limit us to just the LART components, though this would be an excellent starting point. There is a LARGE pent-up demand for the LART parts, so this org would get a great jump start right away. Other suggestions for this org's name: lart_us.org lartpart.org co_part.org other names are welcome, so do suggest any ideas for domain names that you have. We would also need; 1.) a web-site to handle the parts database, request for new entries into the database, orders, membership sign-up. 2.) a organization charter, (this I have been involved in. A quick answer is to take a look at similar organizations charters and steal text freely) 3.)some kind of banking arraignment 4.)officers, director, treasurer, ect..... 5.)some central warehousing/shipping point (this could be just about anywhere in the US with as easy as parcel shipping is these days.) 6.)some other geeks to help with the schlepping of Gerber files etc back and forth to the board shops. (these people need to be in a major metro area, which I'm not, to get access to high quality, cheap manufacturing) 7.)geeks that are willing to test finished boards for functionality, so we can be sure the manufactures making a quality part, before committing to a large order. additions to the list are welcome. It does seem like the folks in NL are going to be ready with some boards in a few week, that will be bare boards for ~$60.00. How does this sound to everybody here? Or should we also see if there is a FAB shop that can do the board stuffing at a reasonable price. regards Doug Moreen On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, you wrote: > Well, looks like the lart domains are taken (.com, .net & .org). Ideas? > I think lartcooperative.com may be a little wordy. :) Additionally, > we'll probably want to form a legal body with a rep for dealing with the > parts distributors and manufacturers. And then there's the banking and > keeping track of funds. Logistics out the yinyang. But if we want to get > good prices for use little geeks, I don't see any other way. Why spend > days calling parts houses trying to track down this and that only to get > raped because we're only buying a couple rather than bulk? I've always > dreamed of being able to tinker with this stuff and maybe produce > something neat like good ol' Woz did - having reliable and access to the > componets at a fair price will really free up time and worry for other > portions of the project like software, case design, etc... I know a few > of the list members are doing this already (I'm still hoping to snag one > of those pcb's from Mr. Fountain) - we could all team up and do it > collectively... Anyone have any experience in putting together a > cooperative? > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > > I've thought about it and the job needs to be done, so I guess I'm your > > chump. > > regards > > Doug Moreen > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Michael Vanecek > > To: > > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 9:32 AM > > Subject: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] > > > > > I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the > > > listserv. Any way to fix that? > > > > > > Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together > > > to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's > > > club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send > > > funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently > > > volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if > > > he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) I figure maybe lart.org if > > > it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can > > > be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) > > > > > > Mike -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:25:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00225 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:25:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00220 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:25:31 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60043CB6HGD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:25:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.70]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:28:00 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:19:59 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <002801bfa897$781f2ba0$981410ac@home.net> To: Hugues Belanger Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041712221103.11476@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <002801bfa897$781f2ba0$981410ac@home.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Board buyers, add your name to this list and return it to me Brian Kraack , Jurgen Kramer , David Poisson , Anita Yu , James , Earl Baugh,, Michael Vanecek Hugues Belanger Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:25:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00229 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:25:37 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00214 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:24:41 +0200 Received: from idealab.com (mx2.idealab.com [206.132.100.54]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT60041HB50GD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:24:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 3120 invoked by alias); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:20:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 3087 invoked from network); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:20:34 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Clifford) (10.3.40.142) by simpurio.idealab.com with SMTP; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:20:34 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:18:49 -0700 From: "Joel R. Kehle" Subject: RE: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? In-reply-to: <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Folks, I only got commitments for about 10 boards which isn't the volume I was hoping for. Sorry 'bout that. :-( --Joel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:30:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00289 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:30:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00284 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:30:05 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600482BE2GD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:30:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.134]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA05879 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:53:21 +0530 (IST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:57:43 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <001b01bfa89a$a0baf460$861e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >At 18:09 +0200 17-04-2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: >>> >>> >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra >>> >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet >>> >combo. >> >>Where can we sign up for one board or more? > >Right here on the list. I'll post an announce once we get that far; expect >it to happen in 4-5 weeks. > >I suggest you start chasing after parts by then. Don't kid yourself: >getting the important bits will easily take you longer than that. > guess we could go IPO after that :) btw, there are a lot of questions being asked about co-ordination in forming teams to build the lart... this is good. i can't talk about mass production for the community (non-developers).. the lart is probably still in it's early stages.. one thing is simple.. if we all have a single production source, it becomes cheaper to produce the lart. i don't think i'll be able to afford one in any case. $60 for the KSB PCB did you say? that's over 2500 bucks in indian rupees. a lot of money. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 20:34:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00320 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:34:59 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00316 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:34:58 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id UAA25484; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:34:56 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:34:56 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004171834.UAA25484@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: More KSB pictures available Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just made two pictures of a KSB+LART combo. They're a bit low quality because I used an SGI O2 video camera (couldn't find a Sony Mavica). You can find them in l'Art gallery. Erik -- Real Programmers consider "what you see is what you get" to be just as bad a concept in Text Editors as it is in women. No, the Real Programmer wants a "you asked for it, you got it" text editor -- complicated, cryptic, powerful, unforgiving, dangerous. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 21:04:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA00556 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:04:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA00552 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:04:41 +0200 Received: from mail.chilesat.net (mail2.chilesat.net [200.31.43.52]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6004KZCZQKQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:04:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from embedded.cl (200.31.59.202) by mail.chilesat.net (NPlex 4.0.068) id 38F792860000D9FA for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:51:16 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:09:46 -0400 From: Pablo Bleyer Kocik Subject: Re: a small proposal To: LART Message-id: <38FB617A.E4EB4F0@embedded.cl> Organization: embedded^cl - http://www.embedded.cl MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > Are those six-layer PCBs with 0.15mm (six mil) trace width/clearance and > 0.3 mm (12 mil) smallest hole diameter ? If yes then I want the address of > your PCB fab house :) > > JDB. > Nope, three layers only. But the track width and interspacing is very much the same (actually, the same -- don't know how much spacing there is, for example, between the StrongARM pins but I think it has to be near the same as the SH TQFP pins -- 0.1mm pin width and 0.5mm interspacing, so our tracks are 0.15mm width). When I went to quote the PCB I was almost convinced that we were going to end buying the boards in the USA -- I thought, what the hell, let's try it here. When the lady that attended me told me the price for 4 the prototype boards ($37.500 chilean pesos, like 80 US dollars), I asked her if that was the price of _one_ board because I was really surprised. But I was wrong, the price was really for the 4 boards. She showed me a sample of their work and, as I told you, the quality was excellent. As I looked amazed, she told me that, yes, buying them outside the country was much more expensive. They bought a CNC for them last year (they build UPSs) and this year they started outsourcing. By the way, they have the PCBs ready in three days. If someone from this list lives in Chile (grrr... I really doubt that ;^/ ), the name of the company is "Buron & Buron", they have an entry in the yellow pages. They have a web page (http://www.buron.cl) and an email address, but they don't seem to check it often (I had to go personally there to quote my board because they didn't answer the email I sent them). We will be ordering the parts for our SBC in the following weeks and, as soon as all of them arrive, we will order the board construction in the next days. So when our prototype SBCs are ready, I'll tell you if the "cheap stuff was worth it" ;^) Peace! -- Pablo Bleyer Kocik | pbleyer |"Rintrah roars & shakes his fires in the burdend air; @embedded.cl | Hungry clouds swag on the deep" — William Blake -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 21:25:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA00724 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:25:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA00720 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:25:20 +0200 Received: from smtprch1.nortel.com (smtprch1.nortelnetworks.com [192.135.215.14]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6006CQDY6BA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:25:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zcard015.ca.nortel.com (actually zcard015) by smtprch1.nortel.com; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:11:04 -0500 Received: from zcard00e.ca.nortel.com ([47.130.0.90]) by zcard015.ca.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id H6NPJSNY; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:11:00 -0400 Received: from americasm10.nt.com (wcars0mj.ca.nortel.com [47.209.18.90]) by zcard00e.ca.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 1YXBG30S; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:10:58 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:10:57 -0400 From: Behan Webster Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, Brian Kraack , Jurgen Kramer , David Poisson , Anita Yu , Malcolm Latorre , Richard Cook , Grant Likely Message-id: <38FB61C1.69225B3@americasm10.nt.com> Organization: Nortel Networks MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> <00041712122201.11476@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > > Michael and other people in the US (and Canada) who want inexpensive LART parts; > so far I count eight people who are interested Add four more people (in Canada) to that list. Myself and 3 of my friends would be insterested in a few boards. We have several applications that the lart would be good for (embedded wall terminal, whole house stereo server, automatic kiln control, remote control of digital test equipment, and of course the ubiquitous mp3 player). 8) I can imagine the 4 of us together being interested in 6-12 LART+KSB+Ethernet boards (or more if the price is right). This is a fabulous project. Keep up the great work! Behan Webster -- Behan Webster (613) 763-2381 home: mailto:behanw@pobox.com mailto:behanw@nortelnetworks.com http://www.pobox.com/~behanw/ My opinions, not Nortel's. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 21:35:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA00800 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:35:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA00796 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:35:15 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6005R5EEPVB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:35:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail6.magma.ca (mail6 [206.191.0.248]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA09931 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:20:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail6.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA01047 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:20:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:22:29 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FB6474.FC18CA5C@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Jim Studt wrote: > LART changes the risk and design expense. I would *strongly* second this !!! > If many people successfully > build LARTs and they work reliably then the design is validated and it > > becomes a known good baseline for a designer to customize into a > finished device. > > The OSS community as shown that many people contributing and sharing > their experience can produce top quality work. It takes a few seeds > to start the process. LART? I would also add that another of Jim's seeds here is the need for a common suite of tools with which to exchange ideas, manage concept development and realize hardware and software. In fact, I am simply reiterating a point made earlier on this list by Adam Wiggins (on Fri 15 Apr 2000 11:20:38 +1000 EST) when he suggested people interested in developing Open Source hardware like LART or PLEB also consider contributing to tools development like the gEDA project (http://www.geda.seul.org/). I would only add one observation to this, which is that unlike Open Source Software where the effective costs of reproduction and distribution approaches zero - Open Source Hardware development has very real reproduction & distribution costs which will never approach zero... Terry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 21:54:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA00957 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:54:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA00953 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:54:45 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6007C4FB7K1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:54:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.33] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB0A5E9A0218; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:50:34 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:52:04 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Co-Op stuff [was Re: I think this was meant to go here] To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB6B64.3E593E23@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> <00041712122201.11476@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'd be willing to fund a year on a basic account with http://he.net/ I have four accounts with them and no complaints - they're Linux based, have php3 and mysql capabilities and everything a normal Linux account would have. I suspect someone else may have a cheaper solution - if so pipe up, if not let me know and we'll get to the domain name choosing part of this endeavor... > 1.) a web-site to handle the parts database, request for new > entries into the database, orders, membership sign-up. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 21:55:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA00972 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:55:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA00968 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:55:16 +0200 Received: from ethereal (resnet-21-203.dorm.utexas.edu [129.116.21.203]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60078WFC3WF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:55:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nolan by ethereal with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 12hHOp-0007kk-00 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:41:35 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:41:35 -0500 From: Nolan Darilek Subject: More newbie questions To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I've begun toying with the software aspects of the MP3 player which I'd like to build. I downloaded the ramdisk image and mounted it on a loopback device. In order to support my design however, I'll need to add some additional functionality to the vanilla ramdisk. I'll need inetd, an FTP server (A while back someone recommended just using TFTP, but I may just write one with very basic functionality), ncurses and an MP3 player. It looks like there are 2 megs remaining, but I may need to double the ramdisk size. Is the ramdisk added to the system's flash, or is it loaded into the onboard 32 megs of RAM? Or both? Or neither? :) I'm a bit confused about what purpose the flash and onboard RAM serves in an embedded device. If I want to cross compile libraries and code, what do I need to do? Are there Debian packages of ARM cross compilers, or should I just download gcc and roll my own? How difficult is it to keep the cross compilers in separate environments, so that ARM versions of my favorite libraries aren't intermingled with my real libraries? Is it somehow possible to test ramdisk images before sending them to the board? Would something like http://user-mode-linux.sourceforge.net be useful here? And this is something else which, though it is newbie-ish, has confused me for quite some time. :) Once the boards are built and connected, how and where can cases be purchased? Since embedded designs differ radically, how exactly can one design a case which holds all of the components and provides a convenient interface to the software? Or are there pre-made designs which work well? Thanks. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:01:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01009 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:01:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01005 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:01:07 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6007JBFLTMF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:01:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 26YG1CS2; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:51:44 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:58:38 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB6CEE.359E9DF0@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: <002801bfa897$781f2ba0$981410ac@home.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hugues Belanger wrote: > > I'm interested, but is there anyone interested in buy assembled boards ? > > I'm working on getting a friend of the family to built some for me, but he > won't do it unless I get can buy a couple of hundreds... > > I'm getting the bill of material and I'll be shopping soon, I was wondering > if someone had done this before and is willing to help me ....? That would > seed up the process... I'd prefer to buy assembled boards myself. I was an electronics technologist in a previous life but have been a SW guy for the last 10 years or so. Last time I was soldering parts they still had pins coming out the other side of the board (remember SIPs and DIPs ladies and gentlemen?). I doubt I'd have much luck trying to do SMC. I know this has been asked but I'm looking for clarification. What is the price estimate for FULLY ASSEMBLED LART and KSB boards? I've seen many numbers fly around for the last few days but I suspect they were for bare boards only. This question is within the context of being able to get enough people interested to qualify for a bulk price. Varek (in the Victoria, BC area since someone was asking) varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:11:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01080 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01076 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:09 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60082OG2JUT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 26YG1C5B; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:01:46 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:08:40 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: More KSB pictures available Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB6F48.156F6706@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: <200004171834.UAA25484@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > > Hi all, > > I just made two pictures of a KSB+LART combo. They're a bit low quality > because I used an SGI O2 video camera (couldn't find a Sony Mavica). You > can find them in l'Art gallery. > > Erik > Erik, Thank you for those pictures. They are quite helpful. I wonder (hat in hand) if you could do me a favour sometime... Could you measure the thickness of that combo? I mean putting someting flat on the the highest component on the top board and then measure to the bench. I'm trying to work out preliminary (read napkin sketch) case concepts and component (battery?) placement for a product idea. Knowing the thickness of the LART/KSB combo would help me a lot. I know you're a busy guy and are probably getting requests all the time. If it's too much trouble don't worry about it but I'd bet I'm not the only one that would be interested. Thank you very much Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:11:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01095 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01091 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:42 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT6007KPG3GWF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:11:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.73]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:14:10 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:53:42 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are the people who have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. please correct this list if incorrect. add your name if missing, remove in not interested. Also, let me know what your preferences are for 1.) finished vs. bare boards. 2.) quantity wanted 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? so far we have 27 boards requested It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. name and email quantity stuffed? Brian Kraack , 1 ? Jurgen Kramer , 1 ? David Poisson , 1 ? Anita Yu , 3 ? James , 1 ? Earl Baugh,, 5 ? Michael Vanecek 1 no Christopher Seline 1 ? Rob Leslie 1 ? Donald Vukovic 1 yes Chris Curtis 1 ? Behan Webster 6 ? Adam Haberlach 1 ? Nick Gully 1 ? Simon Labrecque Agarwal 1 ? Michael Pollina Ephibian 1 yes regards Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:20:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01152 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:20:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01148 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:20:03 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT60094CGHC7D@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:20:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.125]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA06014; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:43:05 +0530 (IST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:47:20 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: Co-Op stuff [was Re: I think this was meant to go here] To: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <024d01bfa8a9$fa6c3c80$861e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Michael wrote: >I'd be willing to fund a year on a basic account with http://he.net/ I >have four accounts with them and no complaints - they're Linux based, >have php3 and mysql capabilities and everything a normal Linux account >would have. I suspect someone else may have a cheaper solution - if so >pipe up, if not let me know and we'll get to the domain name choosing >part of this endeavor... > this is good michael... but have people here considered asking sourceforge.net about this? if it's an open non-profit cause, they would be ready to help. actually i was going to ask lart's primary developers if they'd be interested to move over to sourceforge.net. they are more equipped to handle project maintanence and peak loads (remember slashdot day?).. they provide PHP, shell accounts, MySQL, anonymous FTP space, CVS, 100 MB webspace, primary domain hosting, forums, bug trackers, and a host of other project development and maintanence features - all free of cost. no issues. the admins are very friendly and helpful too. this is information. the decision is upto you :) - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:32:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01233 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:32:11 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01229 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:32:10 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA26028; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:32:04 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:32:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004172032.WAA26028@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nolan_d@bigfoot.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: More newbie questions In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:41:35 -0500, Nolan Darilek wrote: > I downloaded the ramdisk image and mounted it on a loopback device. In > order to support my design however, I'll need to add some additional > functionality to the vanilla ramdisk. I'll need inetd, an FTP server (A > while back someone recommended just using TFTP, but I may just write > one with very basic functionality), ncurses and an MP3 player. It If you want some more functionality, get Nicolas Pitre's ramdisk at ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/ . > looks like there are 2 megs remaining, but I may need to double the > ramdisk size. Is the ramdisk added to the system's flash, or is it > loaded into the onboard 32 megs of RAM? Or both? Or neither? :) I'm a > bit confused about what purpose the flash and onboard RAM serves in an > embedded device. The ramdisk is compressed and burned into the flash. The bootloader copies the ramdisk to a specific position in RAM. The linux kernel knows about this address, looks for the ramdisk, decompresses it, and uses it as root device. > If I want to cross compile libraries and code, what do I need to do? > Are there Debian packages of ARM cross compilers, or should I just > download gcc and roll my own? How difficult is it to keep the cross > compilers in separate environments, so that ARM versions of my > favorite libraries aren't intermingled with my real libraries? You just need a cross compiler. You can build one yourself, or get mine from the LART site (build on my Debian 2.1 box at home ;-). It's a tarball that should be installed in /data/lart, so it doesn't interfere with the native tools. I don't know if there are cross compiler debs available (Jim Studt is more into that, Jim?), but IIRC, there are RPMs available at www.netwinder.org which you can install with alien. Building a cross compiler isn't too difficult if you follow Chris Rutter's guidelines closely (see link on LART site), and it gives you a nice insight in the inner workings of gcc. > Is it somehow possible to test ramdisk images before sending them to > the board? Would something like http://user-mode-linux.sourceforge.net > be useful here? I don't know. If it is somehow possible to simulate an ARM system: yes. > And this is something else which, though it is newbie-ish, has > confused me for quite some time. :) Once the boards are built and > connected, how and where can cases be purchased? Since embedded > designs differ radically, how exactly can one design a case which > holds all of the components and provides a convenient interface to the > software? Or are there pre-made designs which work well? I'm not aware of pre-made designs. Maybe the standard (well, standard in Europe) "half euro" PCB boxes will fit, because the LART PCB is half the size of a standard euro PCB. We didn't try it yet. Silly plan n+1 is to find an industrial design student to make us a nice case. ;-) Erik -- Yes, it works sometimes. If you need something that "works sometimes" use Windows! -- Victor Khimenko on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:40:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01263 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:40:25 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01259 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:40:24 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA26073; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:40:20 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:40:20 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004172040.WAA26073@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: varek@saltspring.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: More KSB pictures available In-Reply-To: <38FB6F48.156F6706@saltspring.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:08:40 -0700, Varek wrote: > Thank you for those pictures. They are quite helpful. I wonder (hat in > hand) if you could do me a favour sometime... Could you measure the > thickness of that combo? I mean putting someting flat on the the > highest component on the top board and then measure to the bench. I'm > trying to work out preliminary (read napkin sketch) case concepts and > component (battery?) placement for a product idea. Knowing the > thickness of the LART/KSB combo would help me a lot. The total thickness is 2.1 mm which is about (fires up bc) .83 inch. > I know you're a busy guy and are probably getting requests all the > time. If it's too much trouble don't worry about it but I'd bet I'm not > the only one that would be interested. I do get requests, but the nice thing about it is that I don't longer have to feel guilty if I fullfil one, because as of today I started working full time as a software engineer on the LART. (Now you all know ;-) Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 22:50:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA01336 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:50:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA01332 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:50:46 +0200 Received: from smtprtp1.ntcom.nortel.net (smtprtp1.ntcom.nortel.net [137.118.22.14]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600A6AHWKJP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:50:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zcard015.ca.nortel.com (actually zcard015) by smtprtp1.ntcom.nortel.net; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:34:30 -0400 Received: from zcard00e.ca.nortel.com ([47.130.0.90]) by zcard015.ca.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id H6NPJS55; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:34:30 -0400 Received: from americasm10.nt.com (wcars0mj.ca.nortel.com [47.209.18.90]) by zcard00e.ca.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id 1YXBGPW6; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:34:27 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:34:26 -0400 From: Behan Webster Subject: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: Hugues Belanger , lart@lart.tudelft.nl, Malcolm Latorre , Richard Cook , Grant Likely Message-id: <38FB7552.A0E539FB@americasm10.nt.com> Organization: Nortel Networks MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <002801bfa897$781f2ba0$981410ac@home.net> <00041712221103.11476@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > > Board buyers, add your name to this list and return it to me > > Brian Kraack , > Jurgen Kramer , > David Poisson , > Anita Yu , > James , > Earl Baugh,, > Michael Vanecek > Hugues Belanger Behan Webster For LART+KSB+Ethernet Behan Webster -- Behan Webster (613) 763-2381 home: mailto:behanw@pobox.com mailto:behanw@nortelnetworks.com http://www.pobox.com/~behanw/ http://spectrumibl/~behanw/ My opinions, not Nortel's. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 23:23:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01529 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:23:26 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01525 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:23:25 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA26263; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:23:22 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:23:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004172123.XAA26263@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Cc: varek@saltspring.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: More KSB pictures available In-Reply-To: <200004172040.WAA26073@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:40:20 +0200 (MET DST), Erik Mouw wrote: > The total thickness is 2.1 mm which is about (fires up bc) .83 inch. Doh! I mean 21 mm (or 2.1 cm). Sorry. Erik -- unix soit qui mal y pense -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 23:25:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01552 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:25:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01548 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:25:20 +0200 From: LeoSusanto@aol.com Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.6]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600AQQJI6JP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:25:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LeoSusanto@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id 1.b1.3260e94 (15547) for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:20:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:20:20 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk shouldn;t we inclulde quantity too? Leo Johan Susanto quantity:10 In a message dated Mon, 17 Apr 2000 2:48:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Doug Moreen writes: > Board buyers, add your name to this list and return it to me > > Brian Kraack , > Jurgen Kramer , > David Poisson , > Anita Yu , > James , > Earl Baugh,, > Michael Vanecek > Hugues Belanger > > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 23:32:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01597 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:32:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01593 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:32:45 +0200 Received: from phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net (phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net [206.80.192.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT600CHDJUI0N@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:32:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 28176 invoked by alias); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:23:38 +0000 Received: (qmail 20415 invoked by uid 0); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:19:48 +0000 Received: from bdslppp188.phnx.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.217.188) by phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net with SMTP; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:19:48 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:19:05 -0700 From: Kevin Brown Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB7FC9.6236051E@uswest.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Delivered-to: fixup-lart@lart.tudelft.nl@fixme X-Accept-Language: en References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <38FB3728.C8721235@inter.nl.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I would also be interested in one. > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > >combo. -- "Intel giveth and Microsoft Taketh Away" - Gordon Moore -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 23:43:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01667 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:43:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01663 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:43:00 +0200 Received: from phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net (phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net [206.80.192.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT600C1IKBIW6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:43:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 23692 invoked by alias); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:36:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 14072 invoked by uid 0); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:31:22 +0000 Received: from bdslppp188.phnx.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.217.188) by phnxpop2.phnx.uswest.net with SMTP; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:31:21 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:30:38 -0700 From: Kevin Brown Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FB827E.D7F02F7E@uswest.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Delivered-to: fixup-lart@lart.tudelft.nl@fixme X-Accept-Language: en References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are the people who > have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. > please correct this list if incorrect. > add your name if missing, remove in not interested. > Also, let me know what your preferences are for > 1.) finished vs. bare boards. > 2.) quantity wanted > 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? > > so far we have 27 boards requested > It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it > worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. > > > name and email quantity stuffed? > > Brian Kraack , 1 ? > Jurgen Kramer , 1 ? > David Poisson , 1 ? > Anita Yu , 3 ? > James , 1 ? > Earl Baugh,, 5 ? > Michael Vanecek 1 no > Christopher Seline 1 ? > Rob Leslie 1 ? > Donald Vukovic 1 yes > Chris Curtis 1 ? > Behan Webster 6 ? > Adam Haberlach 1 ? > Nick Gully 1 ? > Simon Labrecque Agarwal 1 ? > Michael Pollina Ephibian 1 yes Add Kevin Brown 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built -- "Intel giveth and Microsoft Taketh Away" - Gordon Moore -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 17 23:57:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA01731 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:57:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA01727 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:57:35 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600C9YKXYW6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:57:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id QAA15022; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:53:34 -0500 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:53:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: More newbie questions In-reply-to: <200004172032.WAA26028@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: nolan_d@bigfoot.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004172153.QAA15022@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > You just need a cross compiler. You can build one yourself, or get mine > from the LART site (build on my Debian 2.1 box at home ;-). It's a tarball > that should be installed in /data/lart, so it doesn't interfere with the > native tools. I don't know if there are cross compiler debs available (Jim > Studt is more into that, Jim?), but IIRC, there are RPMs available at > www.netwinder.org which you can install with alien. Stock Debian does not have packages for all (any?) of the cross compilers. Remember you will need cross linkers and crossed libraries if you plan to cross code in the traditional application style. I will again offer free accounts on a SA110 machine to any developer that wants it. Just send me e-mail requesting one. Then you get to use gdb and you can `chroot' to your image and test much of your image before beginning the code-burn-test-weep cycle. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 00:05:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01850 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:05:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01846 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:05:14 +0200 Received: from h0020afd37295.ne.mediaone.net (h0020afd37295.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.53.21]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600D0OLCOVF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:05:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from lorelei (dhcp102 [10.0.0.102]) by h0020afd37295.ne.mediaone.net (8.10.0.Beta10/8.10.0.Beta6) with ESMTP id e3HM6OJ00526; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:06:24 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:05:43 -0400 From: Dana Basken Subject: Re: a small proposal To: Kevin Brown Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004c01bfa8b9$133f60c0$6600000a@avaloninteractive.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> <38FB827E.D7F02F7E@uswest.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Add Dana Basken 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built From: "Kevin Brown" > > to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are the people who > > have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. > > please correct this list if incorrect. > > add your name if missing, remove in not interested. > > Also, let me know what your preferences are for > > 1.) finished vs. bare boards. > > 2.) quantity wanted > > 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? > > > > so far we have 27 boards requested > > It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it > > worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. > > > > name and email quantity stuffed? > > > > Brian Kraack , 1 ? > > Jurgen Kramer , 1 ? > > David Poisson , 1 ? > > Anita Yu , 3 ? > > James , 1 ? > > Earl Baugh,, 5 ? > > Michael Vanecek 1 no > > Christopher Seline 1 ? > > Rob Leslie 1 ? > > Donald Vukovic 1 yes > > Chris Curtis 1 ? > > Behan Webster 6 ? > > Adam Haberlach 1 ? > > Nick Gully 1 ? > > Simon Labrecque Agarwal 1 ? > > Michael Pollina Ephibian 1 yes > Add > Kevin Brown 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 00:12:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01890 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:12:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01886 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:12:04 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600D5ALO3VF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:12:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.118) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:55:32 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:55:56 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Board commitments X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000417142538.00b0e550@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I, and I am sure a great many others, will want a board set, as soon as they are real. I have a TFT LCD panel and a touch screen sitting here waiting for a LART, KSB, and Ethernet I hope those considering putting together a coop will not get disgruntled until after an announcement is made. BTW, my intent is to develop a wireless modem. (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 00:16:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01939 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:16:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01935 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:16:01 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600E0WLUN97@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:16:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.221]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id DAA09024 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:39:19 +0530 (IST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:43:41 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: lartquake-0.01 ready! To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002a01bfa8ba$313985a0$dd1e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk i have finished a NULL-quake build :-) no video, no audio, no cdrom, no nothing. everything else intact. i have removed the null network plug and included bsd networking support. [as asked by JDB :)] the binary is ready. i'm mailing this to the developers so that they can verify this. [i'll release the source code as soon as i tidy it - a couple of days?] this binary RUNS through the whole process: game engine, software render, demo playback, everything. but no input. the thing runs the DEMOS in the PAK in a loop till it dies. the only output is the >>console messages on stdout like "you picked up 50 bullets", etc. which you see while the demos are running. this actually means the demos run. game engine is running. software render is taking place. TIMEDEMOS can be done. i have included timedemos from my x86 using the same sources and optimization for comparision. btw, is -O2 ok with the cross compiler? don't say this is a no-good release :-) [i'll hide my face] i'll atleast know quake works on the lart! the demo needs the PAK file in the ID1 directory (remember playing good o' quake??).. it won't run without it. the PAK file is fairly large.. i don't think you can afford to put it in flash. i can't say though. tell me and i'll send the binary across. some clean up and i'll send the code along with working fbdev, (net and sound too?). my order of TODO is this: #1> fbdev vid_ port #2> net_bsd network support (this *should be* fairly out-of-the-box) #3> OSS snd_ port (little little fixing here) #4> code optimization in ARM asm (somebody will have to help!) and others as they come. QUESTIONS: >The KSB has PS/2 connections; you could use those. I guess this is not your >main problem tho. > how do i use these connections? ioctl? i've not worked with ps2 connections before.. how do i handle them? >>#4> sound: guess i'll put in null sound driver for now till oss. > >OK; you can also just send data to /dev/dsp. yup.. i'll fix this in order. > >>#5> net: what are the network interface capabilites? can you put >>the lart on an TCP/IP network yet? or should i put in the null driver? > >It runs Linux, so it can have TCP. > >>#6> where am i (sorry, read that "where are you") gonna put that >>quake P-A-K file on the lart? > >Hard disk or flash. > by "where", i meant.. would you put it in a filesystem? can i use standard fopen/fread on the "id1/pak0.pak" file? is (will there be) a working ext2 or similar filesystem on the lart? i dunno about flash.. cause that PAK file is HUGE! -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 01:01:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02178 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:01:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02174 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:01:25 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600F26NYBEG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:01:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E7997490F; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:59:50 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:59:49 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <004c01bfa8b9$133f60c0$6600000a@avaloninteractive.com> To: Dana Basken Cc: Kevin Brown , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Dana Basken wrote: > Dana Basken 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built > > > Brian Kraack , 1 ? > > > Jurgen Kramer , 1 ? > > > David Poisson , 1 ? > > > Anita Yu , 3 ? > > > James , 1 ? > > > Earl Baugh,, 5 ? > > > Michael Vanecek 1 no > > > Christopher Seline 1 ? > > > Rob Leslie 1 ? > > > Donald Vukovic 1 yes > > > Chris Curtis 1 ? > > > Behan Webster 6 ? > > > Adam Haberlach 1 ? > > > Nick Gully 1 ? > > > Simon Labrecque Agarwal 1 ? > > > Michael Pollina Ephibian 1 yes > > Add > > Kevin Brown 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built Kira Brown (no relation) 1 off LART+KSB+Ether built please :-) k. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 01:29:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02454 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:29:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02450 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:29:03 +0200 Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600FLIP8DEG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:29:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.10.0/8.9.3) with ESMTP id e3HNGQr04783; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:16:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 07:18:10 -0400 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: Re: BOOOOOM To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FAF2F2.536EF28B@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm sending the main board gerber to a board manufacturer for pricing info. I'd also like to get $$$ for the KSB and Ether board, but I can't seem to be able to located the gerber and the bill of material for those board ...! Can someone send the m to me please... Hugues "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > At 02:03 +0200 17-04-2000, rob wrote: > >J.D., > > do you all have the list of parts you ordered? > > Just when I get out of bed to eat some yoghurt you come and ask me for a > BOM. Oh well, even less sleep then. Hope you're happy ;-) > > BOM attached. > > JD 'sleepless in ... well ... Amstelveen' B. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Name: LART_bom.txt > LART_bom.txt Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: 8bit > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -- > "... I've seen Sun monitors on fire off the side of the multimedia lab. > I've seen NTU lights glitter in the dark near the Mail Gate. > All these things will be lost in time, like the root partition last week. > Time... to die...". - Peter Gutmann in the scary devil monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 01:33:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02490 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:33:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02486 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:33:09 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600FOBPF6FG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:33:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA10005 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:29:24 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA21805 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:30:43 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:30:43 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Is the KSB a automonous board with processor, ram, flash, ide controller, serial, USB, ps/2, ethernet (10baseT, rj-45 connector), audio and video (what are the capabilities of the video "card") on it ? If it is, then I would be willing to get one (pre-assembled if possible). Would depend on the price (I'll monitor the list to make sure that I can afford it...being a poor student sucks). David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Kira Brown wrote: > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Dana Basken wrote: > > > Dana Basken 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built > > > > Brian Kraack , 1 ? > > > > Jurgen Kramer , 1 ? > > > > David Poisson , 1 ? > > > > Anita Yu , 3 ? > > > > James , 1 ? > > > > Earl Baugh,, 5 ? > > > > Michael Vanecek 1 no > > > > Christopher Seline 1 ? > > > > Rob Leslie 1 ? > > > > Donald Vukovic 1 yes > > > > Chris Curtis 1 ? > > > > Behan Webster 6 ? > > > > Adam Haberlach 1 ? > > > > Nick Gully 1 ? > > > > Simon Labrecque Agarwal 1 ? > > > > Michael Pollina Ephibian 1 yes > > > Add > > > Kevin Brown 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built > Kira Brown (no relation) 1 off LART+KSB+Ether built > please :-) > > > k. > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 02:06:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA02643 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:06:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA02639 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:06:51 +0200 Received: from vasquez.zip.com.au (vasquez.zip.com.au [203.12.97.41]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600GMIQZ9EC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:06:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zip.com.au (MAx@starvin-marvin14.zip.com.au [210.23.142.14]) by vasquez.zip.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA17482 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:06:37 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:06:23 +1000 From: MaxAttack Subject: Will lart be for me>? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FBA6FF.B93EE9C6@zip.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> <38FB470B.4EE7B8BF@axysdesign.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello I was looking at a few different systems around similar to lart. And i was woundering if it was system or gonna be the system for me. ? All i was hoping was for a handheld system similar to lart for just small coding while on the run or even, diary entry's atm i can see its very early but will it be heading into features similar to that ? . Mabe even a mp3 player :) but thats not necessary. Anyway. thats all i was woundering. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 03:19:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA03028 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:19:53 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA03022; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:19:49 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FAF2F2.536EF28B@cgocable.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:13:01 +0200 To: Hugues Belanger From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: BOOOOOM Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 13:18 +0200 17-04-2000, Hugues Belanger wrote: >I'm sending the main board gerber to a board manufacturer for pricing info. >I'd also like to get $$$ for the KSB and Ether board, but I can't seem to be >able to located the gerber and the bill of material for those board ...! That's most likely because neither has been released yet. I prefer not to release hardware distributions for items that I haven't finished testing yet. Expect the KSB one to appear befor Easter. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 03:19:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA03032 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:19:56 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA03024; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:19:51 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:16:34 +0200 To: David Poisson From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 01:30 +0200 18-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: >Is the KSB a automonous board with processor, ram, flash, ide controller, >serial, USB, ps/2, ethernet (10baseT, rj-45 connector), audio and video No, the KSB is an I/O board that plugs into the LART (see l'Art gallery). Ethernet is yet another board that plugs into the KSB. >(what are the capabilities of the video "card") on it ? It's merely a passthrough connector of the digital video lines of the LART to a convenient .1in connector. See the schematics for details. JD 'think PCB sandwitch' B. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 03:36:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA03150 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:36:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA03146 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:36:06 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600I9CV3W1W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:36:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id VAA10312 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:32:53 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id VAA22065 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:34:04 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:34:04 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ohhh, I see. The thing is (and I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one which is like that) I want to play and learn about that stuff. I really do (planning on going in electrical engineering). But for now, I don't know anything, so just wanna make sure I know what I get so I know what I can do with it. I still have 2-3 unanswered questions. 1) What are the video options. I mean, I've seen the L'Art gallery and I know you can have a vt220 or an LCD screen. But can you switch display whenever you want or do you have to re-do an entire board ? 2) Is the plug for the audio output a "normal" plug which you can put speakers in ? 3) Does the ethernet card have a rj-45 connector ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 01:30 +0200 18-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: > >Is the KSB a automonous board with processor, ram, flash, ide controller, > >serial, USB, ps/2, ethernet (10baseT, rj-45 connector), audio and video > > No, the KSB is an I/O board that plugs into the LART (see l'Art gallery). > Ethernet is yet another board that plugs into the KSB. > > >(what are the capabilities of the video "card") on it ? > > It's merely a passthrough connector of the digital video lines of the LART > to a convenient .1in connector. See the schematics for details. > > JD 'think PCB sandwitch' B. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 04:26:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA03415 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 04:26:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA03411 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 04:26:58 +0200 Received: from vrlgateway.roadshow.com.au (vrlgateway.roadshow.com.au [203.61.137.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600IB7XGFTR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 04:26:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by vrlgateway.roadshow.com.au; id MAA15627; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:21:36 +1000 (EST) Received: from aumelvrlms1.roadshow.com.au(203.15.16.16) by vrlgateway.roadshow.com.au via smap (V5.0) id xma015602; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:21:25 +1000 Received: from mel-ho-lx-19361.froosh.net (mel-ho-lx-19361.roadshow.com.au) by aumelvrlms1.roadshow.com.au (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:21:23 +1000 Received: from froosh.net (mel-ho-nt-19191.roadshow.com.au [203.15.16.20]) by mel-ho-lx-19361.froosh.net (8.10.0/8.10.0/Debian 8.10.0-1) with ESMTP id e3I2LOJ02601; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:21:24 +1000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:21:23 +1000 From: Robin Frousheger Subject: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FBC6A3.9043BE22@froosh.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> X-Authentication-warning: mel-ho-lx-19361.froosh.net: Host mel-ho-nt-19191.roadshow.com.au [203.15.16.20] claimed to be froosh.net Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are the people who > have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. > please correct this list if incorrect. > add your name if missing, remove in not interested. > Also, let me know what your preferences are for > 1.) finished vs. bare boards. > 2.) quantity wanted > 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? > > so far we have 27 boards requested > It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it > worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. I'd love to be able to whack my hand up and say '5 please' but I'm finding it a little difficult to commit to such a venture without some rough pricing. It's also a little awkward here in Australia - delivery from around the world normally costs more limbs than I prefer, and the currency conversion seriously bites. Does anyone have rough estimates for a stuffed kit of LART+KSB+Eth ? (Naturally, I've been lurking long enough to see vague numbers but nothing more...) Thanks, Robin Frousheger -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 05:09:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA03577 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:09:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA03573 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:09:38 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600JOBZG03O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:09:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.113) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:53:33 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:53:36 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Feature Request X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000417195158.00b853b0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I know this is late, but is it possible to include a battery charger on the KSB? Maybe based on the MAX1647? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 05:21:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA03648 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:21:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA03644 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:21:37 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT600K1YZZZ2J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:21:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.61]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:24:05 -0600 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:59:19 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: potential orders To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041721182402.01206@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Attention people who want LARTS here is the list so far today apr 17,2000 9pm, US Mountain Standard time. A couple of points, nobody has commited yet to actual parts, this is just a list to dicker with the fabrication and parts sales people. The Lart group has not released the schematics and Gerber files for the KSB and Ethernet cards, so these won't be shippable until this comes out.. It looks to me that just about everybody prefers to have the parts assembled onto the motherboards, so unless you have a STRONG bare board preferece, then I feel we should see what the additional fabrication cost is to have the parts put onto the card. Over the next few days I'm going to see what the costs for making the boards are here in the US vs. buying the bare boards from the lart group in NL. I then should be able to quote some prices for the actual boards + parts assembled onto the boards. If the spelling of your name, or anything else in the form is wrong, then please do email me with a correction. If anybody wishes to add, or remove their name from this list then please tell me. Thank you very much Doug Moreen first last email address quant STUFFED 1=lart card 2=lart+KSB 3=Lart+KSB+Eth Robert Barnes rab@nulec.com 2 y 3 Dana Basken dana@basken.com 1 y 3 Earl Baugh baugh@revenuetech.com 5 ? ? Kevin Brown kevin_brown@uswest.net 1 y 3 Kira Brown kira@linuxgrrls.org 1 y 3 Mark Crichton mcrichto@ecs.umass.edu 1 y 3 Christopher Curtis chris@satel.com 2 y Leslie Davis ld@stayhealthy.com 5 y 3 Nicholas FitzRoy-Dale wzdd@lardcave.net 2 y 3 Gav Reid Gav@silmaril.co.uk 1 y 3 Nick Gully gully@colorado.edu 1 ? ? Adam Haberlach adam@newsnipple.com 5 y 3 James Heilman jamie@wcug.wwu.edu 2 y 1, 3 James james000@jps.net 1 ? ? Brian Kraack bkraack@siscom.net 1 ? ? Jurgen Kramer GTM.Kramer@inter.nl.net 1 y 3 Simon Labrecque agarwal_@hotmail.com 1 y 2 Derek Lassen kn6td@clubnet.net 2 y 3 Rob Leslie rob@mars.org 2 y 3 Sean Michell seanml@arawak.on.ca 1 y 3 John Murphy john@wyosip.com 1 y 3 Filip Onkelinx filip.okelinx@sl.com 2 y 3 David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org 1 ? ? Michael Pollina ephibian@ufies.org 1 y 1 Chris Price chris.price@montage.ca 2 y 3 Christopher Seline seline@bayarea.net 1 ? ? Sam Stinson sstinson@uswest.net 1 y 3 Jim Studt jim@federated.com 4 y 3 Leo Johan Susanto leosusanto@aol.com 10 y 1 Michael Vanecek mike@mjv.com 1 y ? Varek Varek varek@saltspring.com 1 y 2 Donald Vukovic dvukovic@cdrgts.dsl.frii.com 1 y Behan Webster behan@pobox.com 6 y 3 Anita Yu akyu@hewitt.com 3 ? ? Kris rilliam@hotmail.com 2 y,n ? Nick Randall gibbo@planetquake.com 1 y 2 total 76 -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 05:33:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA03725 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:33:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA03721 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:33:57 +0200 Received: from mail.hotkey.net.au (mail.hotkey.net.au [202.138.0.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700K830KI2J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 05:33:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from tigger (unknown [202.138.37.7]) by mail.hotkey.net.au (Postfix) with SMTP id 80AD153F9; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:31:15 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:31:48 +1000 From: Phillip Crumpler Subject: RE: a small proposal In-reply-to: <38FBC6A3.9043BE22@froosh.net> To: Robin Frousheger Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'd say a big 'Me too!' to that. Three would be nice. I couldn't commit until a firm price was going, but I would be keen to have a few LART+KSB+ETH sent to Australia. Ta, Phillip Crumpler -----Original Message----- From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On Behalf Of Robin Frousheger Sent: Tuesday, 18 April 2000 12:21 PM To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: a small proposal Doug Moreen wrote: > to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are the people who > have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. > please correct this list if incorrect. > add your name if missing, remove in not interested. > Also, let me know what your preferences are for > 1.) finished vs. bare boards. > 2.) quantity wanted > 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? > > so far we have 27 boards requested > It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it > worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. I'd love to be able to whack my hand up and say '5 please' but I'm finding it a little difficult to commit to such a venture without some rough pricing. It's also a little awkward here in Australia - delivery from around the world normally costs more limbs than I prefer, and the currency conversion seriously bites. Does anyone have rough estimates for a stuffed kit of LART+KSB+Eth ? (Naturally, I've been lurking long enough to see vague numbers but nothing more...) Thanks, Robin Frousheger -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 06:05:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA03866 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 06:05:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA03862 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 06:05:02 +0200 Received: from willow.compsys.com.au ([203.3.166.65]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700JIN2091N@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 06:05:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nickr ([203.3.166.10]) by willow.compsys.com.au (Netscape Mail Server v2.0) with SMTP id AAA173 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:01:53 +1000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:58:46 +1000 From: nick Subject: can it handle mp3s? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004c01bfa8ea$6558df40$5b641fac@compsys.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Just thought I'd better sort this out before I get too excited about lart: the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) Sorry if its been asked, but I need to make completely sure. I've heard the FPU on it isn't too great, and I assume decoding mpeg is mostly fp right? So has anyone actually done this on the same processor the lart has, and if so, how much cpu time does it take? (for an average 192kbps/16bit/stereo etc stream). While I'm on the topic, what kind of quality is the sound "card" on the ksb? I guess no-one can really answer this yet except the lart guys themselves... Basically the grand plan (which I know is not original) is to stick a lart/ksb/cdrom combo in my car, powered off the car battery (or even an external battery, seeing the low consumption of the board). Can anyone see any fatal flaws with this plan, esp regarding the power supply... I was going to just get a cut-down pc, but the lart seems perfect for the job because of its size and efficiency (and hopefully price! :) If anyone has any comments / suggestions they would be much appreciated... thanks, nick -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 09:29:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04507 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:29:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA04503 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:29:15 +0200 Received: from server-4.tower-1.london-2.starlabs.net (mail.london-2.starlabs.net [212.125.75.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT7003GIBGQE4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:29:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 21851 invoked from network); Tue, 18 Apr 2000 07:25:30 +0000 Received: from mail.napp.co.uk (HELO uk1fsfwl01.napp.co.uk) (194.128.159.34) by server-4.tower-1.london-2.starlabs.net with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 07:25:30 +0000 Received: from [172.16.11.13] by uk1fsfwl01.napp.co.uk via smtpd (for mail.london-2.starlabs.net [212.125.75.4]) with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 07:28:02 +0000 (UT) Received: from 127.0.0.1 by mailhost.napp.co.uk (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT) ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:28:01 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) Received: by mailhost.napp.co.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <20LXQF75>; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:28:00 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:27:58 +0100 From: "Lawson, Rick" Subject: RE: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-VirusChecked: Checked Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I would also be looking for assembled boards - would anybody in the UK be interested in building some up for those of us that have very little hardware experience? Rick Lawson | BSD | Napp Pharmaceutical Group -----Original Message----- From: Varek [mailto:varek@saltspring.com] Sent: 17 April 2000 20:59 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: a small proposal Hugues Belanger wrote: > > I'm interested, but is there anyone interested in buy assembled boards ? > > I'm working on getting a friend of the family to built some for me, but he > won't do it unless I get can buy a couple of hundreds... > > I'm getting the bill of material and I'll be shopping soon, I was wondering > if someone had done this before and is willing to help me ....? That would > seed up the process... I'd prefer to buy assembled boards myself. I was an electronics technologist in a previous life but have been a SW guy for the last 10 years or so. Last time I was soldering parts they still had pins coming out the other side of the board (remember SIPs and DIPs ladies and gentlemen?). I doubt I'd have much luck trying to do SMC. I know this has been asked but I'm looking for clarification. What is the price estimate for FULLY ASSEMBLED LART and KSB boards? I've seen many numbers fly around for the last few days but I suspect they were for bare boards only. This question is within the context of being able to get enough people interested to qualify for a bulk price. Varek (in the Victoria, BC area since someone was asking) varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 ___________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by UUNET delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.uk.uu.net/products/security/virus/ _______________________________________________________________________ CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE The information contained in this e-mail is intended only for the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. It may contain confidential and privileged information and if you are not an intended recipient, you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender and destroy and delete the message from your computer. ___________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by UUNET delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit http://www.uk.uu.net/products/security/virus/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 11:32:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05015 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05011 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:58 +0200 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700CMVH6X4K@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hUIW-00079j-0A for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:27:57 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:25:11 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-reply-to: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk As has been mentioned by someone else on the list, messages from the list server have... Reply to: Original Author Cc: The_Lart_List_Server On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to list but instead get the original author Is there any way of changing this 'cos it doesn't seem to work that way around on other lists or am I mistaken. Kind Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 11:32:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05009 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05005 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:56 +0200 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700CQRH6V6O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hUIU-00079i-0A for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:27:54 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:13:06 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: UK request for assembled was... a small proposal In-reply-to: <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk >, Lawson, Rick writes >I would also be looking for assembled boards - would anybody in the UK be >interested in building some up for those of us that have very little >hardware experience? > Its possible I might get involved in it depending on interest levels although I would prefer to pass it through one of the assembly houses I know if I can interest them in some ongoing work. If anyone else is interested either reply to the list or to steve.personal@p2cl.demon.co.uk Also depending on quantities it might be worth tagging onto the American board build or doing our own. Also, I havne't followed the .nl build situation so I don't know whats going on there that might be of interest. Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 11:41:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05098 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:41:02 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05093; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:40:52 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:40:44 +0200 To: Steve Goodwin From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 11:25 +0200 18-04-2000, Steve Goodwin wrote: >As has been mentioned by someone else on the list, messages from the >list server have... > > Reply to: Original Author > Cc: The_Lart_List_Server > >On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to >list but instead get the original author > >Is there any way of changing this 'cos it doesn't seem to work that way >around on other lists or am I mistaken. Technically it's possible. See http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html why we don't. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 11:47:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05115 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:47:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05111 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:47:29 +0200 Received: from joanna.william.org (joanna.william.org [195.153.6.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700E81HV2CS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:47:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjo by joanna.william.org with local (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12hUNP-0001z2-00 (Debian); Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:32:59 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:32:59 +0100 (BST) From: Martin Oldfield Subject: potential orders In-reply-to: <00041721182402.01206@localhost.localdomain> To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <14588.11145.283002.300042@joanna.william.org> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <00041721182402.01206@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Please could you add my name to the list of interested parties ? I'm in Cambridge UK, and have a preference for stuffed rather than bare boards. Cheers, -- Martin Oldfield. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:00:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05163 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:12 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05159 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:11 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA00291; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:08 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:08 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004181000.MAA00291@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: david@fish.ecks.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: a small proposal In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:34:04 +0000 (GMT), David Poisson wrote: > Ohhh, I see. The thing is (and I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one which > is like that) I want to play and learn about that stuff. I really do > (planning on going in electrical engineering). But for now, I don't know > anything, so just wanna make sure I know what I get so I know what I can > do with it. Electrical Engineering at university level is a very theoretical study. Don't expect to start playing with soldering irons from the first day on; you'll get stuffed with mathematics, physics, network theory, digital logic, programming, etc. to give you a sound theoretical basis. The first year can be very boring, but it will get better later on. Been there, done that (got an M.Sc. in EE). > I still have 2-3 unanswered questions. > 1) What are the video options. I mean, I've seen the L'Art gallery and I > know you can have a vt220 or an LCD screen. But can you switch display > whenever you want or do you have to re-do an entire board ? The vt220 is connected to the serial port, the picture in l'Art gallery is just a nice demo because we normally connect a LART to a PC serial port and run minicom to get things done. The LCD is optional: it behaves like a "normal" Linux console, so you can even use virtual console switching and the like, although you'll need a keyboard for that. > 2) Is the plug for the audio output a "normal" plug which you can put > speakers in ? No, you'll have to make a small make your own "audio output board". It just needs to hold two capacitors and your choice of audio connector(s). It was just a matter of space: the main problem when designing the KSB board layout was where to leave all those large connectors (10x7cm is small). > 3) Does the ethernet card have a rj-45 connector ? Not on the ethernet card itself, the RJ45 connector is on a small board which also holds the ethernet transformer. Again, this is just a matter of space. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:05:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05203 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:05:23 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05199 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:05:22 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA00324; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:04:06 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:04:06 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004181004.MAA00324@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: steve.lart@p2cl.demon.co.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:25:11 +0100, Steve Goodwin wrote: > On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to > list but instead get the original author Use "group reply" instead of simple "reply". That's how it works in ELM. Erik -- Yes, it works sometimes. If you need something that "works sometimes" use Windows! -- Victor Khimenko on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:08:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05228 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:08:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05224 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:08:10 +0200 Received: from mrq1.static.cx (N701P025.dipool.highway.telekom.at [212.183.97.153]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT700FMNIT2ON@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:08:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 15649 invoked from network); Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:04:21 +0000 Received: from loopback (HELO gmx.net) (127.0.0.1) by loopback with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:04:21 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:04:17 +0200 From: "Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer" Subject: a new suggestion To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FC3321.E3F31152@gmx.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk just another suggestion: a blue tooth chip on the ethernet-board, for a mp3-player in a car. after parking at home, the daily napster-progress is automatically ftp'ed to a big, shock resistant harddisk. but there is one problem, i should emulate the interface of a blaupunkt cd-changer, for controlling the lart over the car radio :-) mfg mrq1 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:11:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05259 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:11:02 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05252; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:10:59 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <004c01bfa8ea$6558df40$5b641fac@compsys.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:47 +0200 To: nick From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 05:58 +0200 18-04-2000, nick wrote: >Just thought I'd better sort this out before I get too excited about lart: > >the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) Yes. See the archive for a comparison of CPU time per player (there are around four players that will work , IIRC). It's arund 20-25% CPU now, and I believe that with some clever coding to the cache we can bring it down to 10%. >While I'm on the topic, what kind of quality is the sound "card" on the ksb? >I guess no-one can really answer this yet except the lart guys themselves... I'd say it's pretty good. We use the same audio DAC as http://www.audioimports.com/reviews/rev_dec_98_1.html . The output opamps have a noise figure that's about two times better than the famous NE5534s, and their unity gain bandwidth is 160MHz. The filter impedance is pretty low (1k) to reduce external pickup, and the decoupling is downright paranoid. I designed the audio output with mp3 in mind myself. That means that it's maybe $15 more expensive than a minimal solution would be, but IMHO that's money well spent. >Basically the grand plan (which I know is not original) is to stick a >lart/ksb/cdrom combo in my car, powered off the car battery (or even an >external battery, seeing the low consumption of the board). Can anyone see >any fatal flaws with this plan, esp regarding the power supply... >I was going to just get a cut-down pc, but the lart seems perfect for the >job because of its size and efficiency (and hopefully price! :) It should work OK. I'd personally insert a cheap linear regulator (a 7805 will do) to filter out the worst spikes in the 12V car power system. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:11:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05262 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:11:04 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05254; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:11:00 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <00041721182402.01206@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:09:59 +0200 To: dogman@bitterroot.net From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: potential orders Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 05:59 +0200 18-04-2000, Doug Moreen wrote: >Attention people who want LARTS here is the list so far today apr 17,2000 9pm, >US Mountain Standard time. > > > >A couple of points, nobody has commited yet to actual parts, this is just a >list to dicker with the fabrication and parts sales people. >The Lart group has not released the schematics and Gerber files for the KSB >and Ethernet cards, so these won't be shippable until this comes out.. The schematics are available; expect the Gerbers soon. May I once again urge people not to build PCBs until they have the major parts ? You're pretty much guaranteed to get the PCBs either from me or from a board fab of your choice; the parts are quite another matter. And that's not just for LART, but for any project that needs parts that aren't sold by Digi-Key or the like. Oh and *please wait* for Lart Rev 4, which will use the Linear LTC1266 converters in stad of the Maxim MAX162[67]. Sure this will up the price of a LART by $4, but the Linear parts are available *now* and not in 16 weeks. As I found out the hard way Maxim has more problems supplying parts than Linear. A nice added bonus is that the overall power conversion efficiency should go up one or two percent. JDB. [who got halfway finishing rev 4 last night] -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 12:54:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05421 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:54:09 +0200 Received: from [130.161.40.82] (tvs082.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.40.82]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05416; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:54:04 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.20000417195158.00b853b0@mail.clubnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:52:43 +0200 To: Derek Lassen From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Feature Request Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 04:53 +0200 18-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: >I know this is late, but is it possible to include a battery charger on the >KSB? >Maybe based on the MAX1647? The KSB is completely packed (esp. wrt. connector space). OTOH it should be easy to add an external charger yourself. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 13:00:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA05477 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:00:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA05473 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:00:07 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700K1JL812T@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:00:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FCFA74812; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:48:15 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:48:15 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <004c01bfa8ea$6558df40$5b641fac@compsys.com.au> To: nick Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, nick wrote: > Sorry if its been asked, but I need to make completely sure. I've heard the > FPU on it isn't too great, It doesn't *have* an FPU. I guess that counts as 'not great'. > and I assume decoding mpeg is mostly fp right? Only if you code it that way. > So has anyone actually done this on the same processor the lart has, > and if so, how much cpu time does it take? (for an average > 192kbps/16bit/stereo etc stream). Depends on how good you want to make your mpeg decoder. I've done it in about 10% of CPU time on a 202MHz SA-110. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 14:08:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05675 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:08:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05671 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:08:28 +0200 Received: from imsp073.netvigator.com (imsp073.netvigator.com [205.252.144.130]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700249OE06S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:08:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ctcdesktop (bbig038119.netvigator.com [203.198.117.119]) by imsp073.netvigator.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA23284 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:55:12 +0800 (HKT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:57:00 +0800 From: ctc Subject: RE: a small proposal In-reply-to: To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl id OAA05672 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I want 1 Lart+KSB+Eth built provided that I can afford the price. Cheng Tak Cheung > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl > [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On Behalf Of Phillip Crumpler > Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 11:32 AM > To: Robin Frousheger > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: RE: a small proposal > > > I'd say a big 'Me too!' to that. Three would be nice. I couldn't commit > until a firm price was going, but I would be keen to have a few > LART+KSB+ETH > sent to Australia. > > Ta, > Phillip Crumpler > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of Robin Frousheger > Sent: Tuesday, 18 April 2000 12:21 PM > To: dogman@bitterroot.net > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: a small proposal > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > to everybody who is interested in getting a LART board here are > the people > who > > have signed up so far and the count that I have on the quantity desired. > > please correct this list if incorrect. > > add your name if missing, remove in not interested. > > Also, let me know what your preferences are for > > 1.) finished vs. bare boards. > > 2.) quantity wanted > > 3.) just the LART board or also the KSB and Ethernet boards? > > > > so far we have 27 boards requested > > It looks like we are actually getting close to having enough to make it > > worthwhile, though greater than 100 cards per run would be preferable. > > I'd love to be able to whack my hand up and say '5 please' but I'm finding > it a > little difficult to commit to such a venture without some rough pricing. > > It's also a little awkward here in Australia - delivery from around the > world > normally costs more limbs than I prefer, and the currency conversion > seriously > bites. > > Does anyone have rough estimates for a stuffed kit of LART+KSB+Eth ? > (Naturally, > I've been lurking long enough to see vague numbers but nothing more...) > > Thanks, > Robin Frousheger > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 14:44:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05844 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:44:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05840 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:44:21 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT70057TQ1U6W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:44:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail3.magma.ca (mail3.magma.ca [206.191.0.221]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA21166 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:29:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail3.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA21789 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:29:19 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:31:36 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: LART Packaging... To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk As the wheels start turning to build LART + KSB + Ethernet boards has anyone given any thought about packaging ? A slick set of skins would certainly mark LART as unique... any industrial / graphics designers lurking who are up for the challenge ? Terry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 15:39:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA06111 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:39:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA06107 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:39:27 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT7008VZSLK3X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:39:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id JAA22640 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:35:13 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:35:12 -0400 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: "Your message of Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:47 +0200." To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004181335.JAA22640@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk nick wrote: >> the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) "J.D. Bakker" replied: > Yes. See the archive for a comparison of CPU time per player (there are > around four players that will work , IIRC). It's arund 20-25% CPU now, and > I believe that with some clever coding to the cache we can bring it down to > 10%. The best number I found for MP3 decoding on the SA-1100 was 24% (Xaudio) with the next best being in the 32-41% CPU range. For the complete list, see: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/list-one.php3?mid=200004150136.VAA31093%40deimos.mars.org The smaller CPU numbers are only currently for the other audio layers, "MP1" and "MP2" (21-25% among the best) which generally require a much higher bitrate than MP3 to achieve the same quality. I am doing active development on MAD. If anyone would like to help, I invite you to join the mad-dev mailing list: http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ Cheers, -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 15:57:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA06196 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:57:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA06192 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:57:16 +0200 Received: from deimos.mars.org (deimos.ne.mediaone.net [24.147.209.78]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700BBVTFE75@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:57:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from deimos.mars.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by deimos.mars.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id JAA22726 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:57:13 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:57:12 -0400 From: Rob Leslie Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: "Your message of Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:48:15 BST." To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004181357.JAA22726@deimos.mars.org> MIME-version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 7.106) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk nick wrote: >> So has anyone actually done this on the same processor the lart has, >> and if so, how much cpu time does it take? (for an average >> 192kbps/16bit/stereo etc stream). Kira Brown replied: > Depends on how good you want to make your mpeg decoder. I've done it in > about 10% of CPU time on a 202MHz SA-110. Nick: see the timings I posted earlier, in the archive. Kira: very interesting. Care to elaborate? Erik Mouw mentioned that Nicolas Pitre's fixed-point version of `splay' can decode MP3s with as little as 4% CPU on the 280MHz SA-110, but it performs much worse (41%) according to my own tests on the 220MHz SA-1100. The hypothesis is this is primarily due to different sizes of the data cache, and some clever optimization may improve decoding performance significantly on the SA-1100 for the LART. I'm eager to see if this is true. Cheers, -- Rob Leslie rob@mars.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 16:14:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06294 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:14:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06290 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:14:06 +0200 Received: from www.media-net.de ([213.155.13.97]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700C9XU7GUC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:14:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mbox.bfk.loc (e1.gw.mdhs.bbone.dacotec.net [213.155.1.11]) by www.media-net.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA01356 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:13:59 +0200 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:54:24 +0200 From: Roland Kaercher Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <200004181335.JAA22640@deimos.mars.org> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <00041814124104.06678@mbox.bfk.loc> Organization: Bauhaus fuer Kommunikation GmbH MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.29.1] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <200004181335.JAA22640@deimos.mars.org> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Maybe I don't get the point here, but why would you want to waste processing time for decoding MP3? A while ago I had found a Hardware mp3 decoder project at mp3.com, but unfortunately I can't find it anymore, but anyway, I am lucky that I had ordered the two chips, one for the decoding (the MP3 decoder was something with a 34xx in it - I can look that up tomorrow if somebody is interested) and a small dsp wich should do the tone controls etc. - all it needs is a parallel port to get the stream over, a requirement the LART pretty well fulfills. Now you can think of what to do with all the processing power left :-) Roland On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, you wrote: > nick wrote: > >> the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) > > "J.D. Bakker" replied: > > Yes. See the archive for a comparison of CPU time per player (there are > > around four players that will work , IIRC). It's arund 20-25% CPU now, and > > I believe that with some clever coding to the cache we can bring it down to > > 10%. > > The best number I found for MP3 decoding on the SA-1100 was 24% (Xaudio) with > the next best being in the 32-41% CPU range. > > For the complete list, see: > > http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/list-one.php3?mid=200004150136.VAA31093%40deimos.mars.org > > The smaller CPU numbers are only currently for the other audio layers, "MP1" > and "MP2" (21-25% among the best) which generally require a much higher > bitrate than MP3 to achieve the same quality. > > I am doing active development on MAD. If anyone would like to help, I invite > you to join the mad-dev mailing list: > > http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ > > Cheers, > > -- > Rob Leslie > rob@mars.org > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 16:25:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06392 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:25:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06388 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:25:46 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700E16UQU5O@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:25:45 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:17:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <200004181357.JAA22726@deimos.mars.org> To: Rob Leslie Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Rob Leslie wrote: > Erik Mouw mentioned that Nicolas Pitre's fixed-point version of `splay' can > decode MP3s with as little as 4% CPU on the 280MHz SA-110, but it performs > much worse (41%) according to my own tests on the 220MHz SA-1100. > > The hypothesis is this is primarily due to different sizes of the data cache, > and some clever optimization may improve decoding performance significantly on > the SA-1100 for the LART. I'm eager to see if this is true. I'll certainly give it a try when time will permit. However I suspect that reducing the memory footprint of splay will affect its performances on the SA110 a bit. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 16:37:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06441 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:37:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06437 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:37:13 +0200 Received: from crisp.com (crisp.com [192.41.58.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700F1IV9W82@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:37:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from crisp.com (159.encentris.com [204.0.61.159]) by crisp.com (8.8.5) id IAA19925; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:31:30 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:31:11 -0500 From: Kent Perrier Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? To: nick Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: kent.perrier@oneco.net Message-id: <38FC71AF.A3D01BC5@crisp.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <004c01bfa8ea$6558df40$5b641fac@compsys.com.au> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk nick wrote: > > Just thought I'd better sort this out before I get too excited about > lart: > > the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) Sure it does. Look at www.empeg.com Its a StrongARM powered, Linux running MP3 player for the car. Kent -- "I've won at every level, except college and pro." --Shaquille O'Neal -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 16:48:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06535 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:48:27 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06531 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:48:27 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700F8ZVSPWV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:48:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.77] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A4ED799025A; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:45:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:46:50 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FC755A.A698C5D9@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk IHMO - I always figured the LART as being the guts to whatever skin the application required. The core developers did all the tedious work (which is way much appreciated), leaving us free to do the creative application work - be it a hip mounted mp3 player or an appliance controler or a gateway/router. Hence, the look will depend on the project. I'm sure everyone who wants one or more of these babies have daydreamed about how it would look after they've finished their project. I really look forward to seeing the results of those daydreams... I thought open source software was a blast - but open source software and open source hardware - whooeee... :) Mike T Sullivan wrote: > > As the wheels start turning to build LART + KSB + Ethernet boards has > anyone given any thought about packaging ? > > A slick set of skins would certainly mark LART as unique... any > industrial / graphics designers lurking who are up for the challenge ? > > Terry > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 16:52:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06570 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:52:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06566 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:52:02 +0200 Received: from crisp.com (crisp.com [192.41.58.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700G56VYO6M@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:52:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from crisp.com (159.encentris.com [204.0.61.159]) by crisp.com (8.8.5) id IAA21286; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:46:51 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:46:29 -0500 From: Kent Perrier Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: kent.perrier@oneco.net Message-id: <38FC7545.A821EE23@crisp.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004181335.JAA22640@deimos.mars.org> <00041814124104.06678@mbox.bfk.loc> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Roland Kaercher wrote: > > Maybe I don't get the point here, but why would you want to waste > processing time for decoding MP3? A while ago I had found a Hardware > mp3 decoder project at mp3.com, but unfortunately I can't find it > anymore, but anyway, I am Was this what your saw? http://www.interlog.com/~miclee/mp3.html Kent -- "I've won at every level, except college and pro." --Shaquille O'Neal -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 17:26:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06700 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:26:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA06696 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:26:06 +0200 Received: from mail.eink.com (mail.eink.com [140.239.80.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT700HP5XJGMB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:26:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.eink.com by mail.eink.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:33:23 +0000 (UT) Received: from eink.com (CAD2 [192.168.29.67]) by mail_server.eink.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id GTS0MM1B; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:23:17 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:22:48 -0400 From: Holly Gates Subject: Re: Bay Area (Si Valley Bay Area) LART grouping? To: Adam Haberlach Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FC7DC8.B0160EE9@eink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000414170341.A760@ricochet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have some code around which renders a gerber file in an X window that a friend wrote for a tabletop NC circuit board mill that we built. Do you want the source? Gerber is very much like G code (used to control CNC machine tools), for which there are multiple books and references. -Holly Gates Hardware Engineer E Ink Corp. www.eink.com MIT BSEE '99 Adam Haberlach wrote: > > I just joined this list after it was posted to Slashdot. > I'm a Computer Engineering major who ended up working in software > and I would like to do some real hardware hacking. > > Is there anyone in the bay area putting together a group > purchase of boards? I have not specced anything out yet, but I > assume that higher quantities bring the price down a bit. I'd > like to build one just for kicks, possibly to make a router or > two. > > Also--does anyone know where I can get information on the > Gerber file format? I was thinking of writing a Viewer (or > CAD program, if I get really motivated and have 30 hour days all > of the sudden) for BeOS. > > -- > Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the > adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with > http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 17:52:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06805 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:52:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA06801 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:52:52 +0200 Received: from socket.house ([208.243.144.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700JBCYS3Y0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:52:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by newsnipple.com via sendmail from stdin id (Debian Smail3.2.0.102) for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:01:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:01:41 -0700 From: Adam Haberlach Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <200004181000.MAA00291@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl>; from Erik Mouw on Tue, Apr 18, 2000 at 12:00:08PM +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000418090140.C21062@ricochet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <200004181000.MAA00291@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, Apr 18, 2000 at 12:00:08PM +0200, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:34:04 +0000 (GMT), David Poisson wrote: > > Ohhh, I see. The thing is (and I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one which > > is like that) I want to play and learn about that stuff. I really do > > (planning on going in electrical engineering). But for now, I don't know > > anything, so just wanna make sure I know what I get so I know what I can > > do with it. > > > Electrical Engineering at university level is a very theoretical study. > Don't expect to start playing with soldering irons from the first day on; > you'll get stuffed with mathematics, physics, network theory, digital > logic, programming, etc. to give you a sound theoretical basis. The first > year can be very boring, but it will get better later on. Been there, done > that (got an M.Sc. in EE). > Many Universities are trying to fix this, however. I know that Oregon State now has a good freshman program involving building kit robots in order to make sure people know what they are going to be doing and keep them interested. You still have to learn a surprising amount of physics, math, and other fun things to get through the Computer Engineering Program, though. (And it is surprising how useful things like real number theory is when you start dealing with AC circuits) -- Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:00:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06846 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:00:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06842 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:00:05 +0200 From: chris@satel.com Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700JOAZ44OF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:00:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from www by mail.xmission.com with local (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12haDs-0005Ev-00; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:47:32 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:00:04 +0200 (MET DST) Date-warning: Date header was inserted by mailhost1.tudelft.nl To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <0FT700JOBZ44OF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> User-Agent: IMHO/0.97.1 (Webmail for Roxen) Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:47:32 -700 To: kent.perrier@oneco.net X-Originating-IP: [209.210.211.17] From: Chris Curtis In-Reply-To: <38FC7545.A821EE23@crisp.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Content-Length: 1294 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: can it handle =?iso-8859-1?q?mp3s=3F?= Message-Id: > > Maybe I don't get the point here, but why would you want to waste > > processing time for decoding MP3? A while ago I had found a Hardware > > mp3 decoder project at mp3.com, but unfortunately I can't find it > > anymore, but anyway, I am > Or maybe a nice little KSB-II with a MAS3507D decoder.... http://www.intermetall.com/pages/product_documentation/consumer/mas.ht ml ------------------------------ Chris Curtis Systems Engineer Satel Corporation "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:13:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06912 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:13:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06908 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:13:58 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT700L8DZR78P@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:13:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.129]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA22019 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:37:14 +0530 (IST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:41:33 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <003901bfa950$c5eec2a0$811e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Roland Kaercher wrote: >> >> Maybe I don't get the point here, but why would you want to waste >> processing time for decoding MP3? A while ago I had found a Hardware >> mp3 decoder project at mp3.com, but unfortunately I can't find it >> anymore, but anyway, I am > >Was this what your saw? > >http://www.interlog.com/~miclee/mp3.html > i thought hardware implementation of an MP3 decoder was COSTLY!!!! LICENCE FEES TO THOMSON? go over to fraunhofer IIS and check out! read the LICENSE! unlike software decoders, for ANY hardware implementation of MP3, EVEN FOR A FREE HARDWARE CORE, you have to pay LICENCE costs. - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:24:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07033 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:24:39 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07029 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:24:38 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA21794; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:24:35 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004181624.SAA21794@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: Feature Request To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (J.D. Bakker) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:24:35 +0200 (MEST) Cc: kn6td@clubnet.net (Derek Lassen), lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: from "J.D. Bakker" at Apr 18, 2000 12:52:43 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > At 04:53 +0200 18-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > >I know this is late, but is it possible to include a battery charger on the > >KSB? > >Maybe based on the MAX1647? > > The KSB is completely packed (esp. wrt. connector space). OTOH it should be > easy to add an external charger yourself. ...and besides that, what type of battery would you like to charge? There's nickel-cadmium (NiCd), nickel-metallic-hydride (NiMH), lithium-ion (LiIon), and of course the good old (sealed) lead-acid battery. Then there are several charging schemes, some suitable for all types, while others are very specific. There's constant voltage, constant current (with discharge), delta peak with or without temperature detection or topoff... In fact, one of my ideas for a LART application would be a near-perfect battery charger. It depends on the AD/DA card that hasn't materialized yet, and of course some booster stage. Anyone want to add a fuel cell to the available plug-ins? :) -- Marc e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:50:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07137 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:50:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07133 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:50:17 +0200 Received: from listserv.tudelft.nl (listserv.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT80002O1FS6B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:50:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from its.tudelft.nl (IDENT:pouwelse@mobile.ubicom.tudelft.nl [130.161.43.247]) by listserv.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA03877; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:50:14 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:50:33 +0200 From: Johan Pouwelse Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? To: chris@satel.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FCAE79.82AB5BC8@its.tudelft.nl> Organization: Technical University Delft MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <0FT700JOBZ44OF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk chris@satel.com wrote: > > > Maybe I don't get the point here, but why would you want to waste > > > > processing time for decoding MP3? A while ago I had found a Hardware > > > mp3 decoder project at mp3.com, but unfortunately I can't find it > > > anymore, but anyway, I am > Or maybe a nice little KSB-II with a MAS3507D decoder.... Yes it is possible. About 1 1/2 year ago I talked to the developers of this chip at Fraunhofer/Intermetal and it looked nice, but using software is much better. Why do we stay with MP3 when we can have Advanced Audio Coding. Instead of the MP3 frequency/time resolution of 41.66 Hz/4 ms, we can go to 23 Hz/2.7 ms. Compression factors of 1 : 18! Such an upgrade is simpeler in software then hardware... Johan, the audio guy of LART at .nl with motto: more means better... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:54:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07165 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:54:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07160 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:54:35 +0200 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800MF81MYZB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:54:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hbCO-000Egw-0Y for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:50:05 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:36:58 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: UK request for assembled was... a small proposal In-reply-to: <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <8C4D1F0AFE3DD311A9A700A0C9A295650274D29D@mailhost.napp.co.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk OK, I have a few people from UK and beyond interested. I will continue to collect names over the next 10 days or so and then e-mail the list with a list of interested parties so anyone can make sure I have received their e-mails. Then I'll look at quantities and start looking at PCB's and UK parts. At the same time I'll try to track the US effort in case it makes more sense to import. If anyone else fancies moving faster or in a different direction, that is fine by me, I'll help as I can. By the way, sorry, can't work faster than that, I'm getting married and moving house over the next few months and its pretty busy around here (quite apart from normal work issues ) Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:55:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07179 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07171 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:06 +0200 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800MGA1NTZB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hbCO-000Egu-0Y; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:50:04 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:16:13 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message , J.D. Bakker writes >At 11:25 +0200 18-04-2000, Steve Goodwin wrote: >>As has been mentioned by someone else on the list, messages from the >>list server have... >> >> Reply to: Original Author >> Cc: The_Lart_List_Server >> >>On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to >>list but instead get the original author >> >>Is there any way of changing this 'cos it doesn't seem to work that way >>around on other lists or am I mistaken. > >Technically it's possible. See >http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html why we don't. > Thanks, will do Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 18:55:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07180 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07172 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:06 +0200 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800MG91NTZB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:55:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12hbCO-000Egv-0Y; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:50:05 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:17:35 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-reply-to: <200004181004.MAA00324@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <200004181004.MAA00324@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <200004181004.MAA00324@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl>, Erik Mouw writes >On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:25:11 +0100, Steve Goodwin wrote: >> On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to >> list but instead get the original author > >Use "group reply" instead of simple "reply". That's how it works in ELM. > Yes, Thanks. I can do that but was concerned that sending a personal e- mail to the author plus a reply to the list was inappropriate Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 19:16:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA07330 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:16:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA07326 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:16:56 +0200 Received: from www.media-net.de ([213.155.13.97]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8000HS2O73W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:16:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mbox.bfk.loc (e1.gw.mdhs.bbone.dacotec.net [213.155.1.11]) by www.media-net.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA03120 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:13:09 +0200 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:05:33 +0200 From: Roland Kaercher Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <003901bfa950$c5eec2a0$811e36ca@muks> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <00041817115105.06678@mbox.bfk.loc> Organization: Bauhaus fuer Kommunikation GmbH MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.29.1] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <003901bfa950$c5eec2a0$811e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hmm, I paid about $35 for the 2 chips, AFAIK the manufacturer of the chip has to pay the license fee not the one who is actually using it or am I wrong? I mean the only thing you can to with this chip (yes and you only need *this* chip and some analogue parts around - schematics are on the vendor site ) is to decode MP3. BTW, there is a new compression/reduction format released under the GPL at sourceforge. Maybe that would be nice to support :) Roland On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, you wrote: > > i thought hardware implementation of an MP3 decoder was COSTLY!!!! > LICENCE FEES TO THOMSON? go over to fraunhofer IIS and check out! > read the LICENSE! > > unlike software decoders, for ANY hardware implementation of MP3, > EVEN FOR A FREE HARDWARE CORE, you have to pay LICENCE costs. > > - muks > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 19:20:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA07361 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:20:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA07357 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:20:35 +0200 From: chris@satel.com Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8000D72U9SG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:20:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from www by mail.xmission.com with local (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12hbft-0001rM-00; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:20:33 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:20:34 +0200 (MET DST) Date-warning: Date header was inserted by mailhost1.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <0FT8000D92UASG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:20:33 -700 In-Reply-To: <38FCAE79.82AB5BC8@its.tudelft.nl> To: Johan Pouwelse From: Chris Curtis X-Originating-IP: [209.210.211.17] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Length: 2158 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: can it handle =?iso-8859-1?q?mp3s=3F?= User-Agent: IMHO/0.97.1 (Webmail for Roxen) Message-Id: >> Or maybe a nice little KSB-II with a MAS3507D decoder.... >Yes it is possible. About 1 1/2 year ago I talked to the developers of >this chip at Fraunhofer/Intermetal and it looked nice, but using >software is much better. > > Why do we stay with MP3 when we can have Advanced Audio Coding. > Instead of the MP3 frequency/time resolution of 41.66 Hz/4 ms, we can go > to 23 Hz/2.7 ms. > Compression factors of 1 : 18! Such an upgrade is simpeler in software > then hardware... > I do like the ability to change algorithms in software. The original concern seemed to be how much load MP3 or AAC put on the SA-1100, so hardware seemed an obvious answer. So without sacrificing upgradeability and without loading the SA-1100 down, how about driving that PCM1710 with a TMS320C54x DSP? Relatively inexpensive (~ USD 7) and really fast for that kind of work. Not to mention 0.54mW/MIPS. ------------------------------ Chris Curtis Systems Engineer Satel Corporation "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 20:06:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA07603 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:06:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA07599 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:06:02 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT80029C4TGFL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:06:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA01134; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:03:13 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:03:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Steve Goodwin , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk shouldn't it then be reply to the reply to address and cc the author? but of course how do you know who / where to send the reply if the author is not the sender or the reply to address. also, can ANYONE from anywhere POST to this list, EVEN THOSE NOT SUBSCRIBED. This would be BAD as well as it invites SPAMMING the list. so if only those subscribed can post, and all subscribers (by definition) receive list traffic will the sender/author not then receive the reply? the current setup only serves to fill the mailboxes of the author and others with twice the necessary volume. please consilder the above. as a user of this list I would like to see it setup where replies go to the list. maybe this is an issue that could/should pe put to a vote of the users of this list. I do however respect the list owner and his final authoritative judgement in this and other matters pretaining to how this list is run. it is, after all his list. Eric Fort On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 11:25 +0200 18-04-2000, Steve Goodwin wrote: > >As has been mentioned by someone else on the list, messages from the > >list server have... > > > > Reply to: Original Author > > Cc: The_Lart_List_Server > > > >On my system, if I just click reply, I feel I should simply reply to > >list but instead get the original author > > > >Is there any way of changing this 'cos it doesn't seem to work that way > >around on other lists or am I mistaken. > > Technically it's possible. See > http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html why we don't. > > JDB. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 20:33:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA07743 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:33:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA07739 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:33:23 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8002KK67MFL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:33:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail6.magma.ca (mail6 [206.191.0.248]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA29431; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:18:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail6.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA10306; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:18:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:20:36 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Roland Kaercher , Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FCA774.C7A0B58F@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> <00041813324802.06678@mbox.bfk.loc> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Roland Kaercher wrote: > Hmm, > as I want to use the LART as a wearable device I have just thought of an > aluminum case as it should be easy to get them in a shape suitable to put the > LART + the other boards in. I certainly agree that there is likely to be a whole range of opinions on the issue of packaging. Everything from keep-it-simple and practical to - hmmm - more exotic or unusual ideas. OTOH, so far there has been a fairly wide set of application ideas for LART hence a need for more than one type of packaging. Consequently, my only article-of-faith in all of this is that packaging tends to as important as any piece of hardware or software functionality. Hence while a primary goal here should be to help make functional packaging available to people along with the hardware and software I agree with Mike Vanecek's previous post on this thread - I too am really curious with what people will dream up and how this will evolve over time... > If mine will get some sort of > display or controls I would try to design it like the silver Minidisc players > by SHARP. (Although I have never done anything like this before ;-) > Roland > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, you wrote: > > As the wheels start turning to build LART + KSB + Ethernet boards has > > anyone given any thought about packaging ? > > > > A slick set of skins would certainly mark LART as unique... any > > industrial / graphics designers lurking who are up for the challenge ? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 20:47:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA07813 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:47:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA07809 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:47:01 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8002QA6UBFL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:47:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA01284; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:47:25 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:47:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> To: Doug Moreen Cc: Scott Ritchie , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'd already been thinking of this. i'm in florida and would like a few asembled (and tested) units). take orders - set a cutoff date and make all orders prepaid by that date. then order and ship. -eric On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few percentage > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a 30% > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from the > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to get. > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and cost > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message archive, > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to > handle this? > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > http://www.paypal.com ) > regards > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > > > > > > On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Scott Ritchie wrote: > > Hugues > > I haven't sourced anything yet, I think I'll start with finding a company > > to produce the boards. > > As for my own plans. I've been drooling over the prospect of a wareable for > > sometime. The MIT wareable page has been really helpful, but they tend to > > use the PC104 with Intel chips. Until I saw LART on /. , I was waiting for > > someone to product a board with a Crusoe chip. > > Scott > > > > > > At 06:07 AM 4/16/00 -0400, you wrote: > > >Hi I'm in Ontario and I'm also looking for someone to built a bunch of > > >these puppies, let me know if you find anyone... > > > > > >I'm curious what are you planning to use these for ? > > >I'm trying to assemble a group of people for a little project of my > > >own.... > > > > > > > > >Scott Ritchie wrote: > > > > > >> Hi all > > >> I was wondering if there was anybody in the Victoria/Vancouver, BC or > > >> Seattle area building Larts or would like to? > > >> Scott > > >> > > >> -- > > >> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > >> the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > >> Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 20:57:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA07865 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:57:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA07861 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:57:07 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT80045I7B3T9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:57:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA01321; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:56:30 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:56:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <38FB3728.C8721235@inter.nl.net> To: Jurgen Kramer Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk bare boards or assembled units? -eric On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > >combo. > > Where can we sign up for one board or more? > > Greetings, > > Jurgen > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 21:04:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07907 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07903 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:52 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8004I37NZ8W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.63] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A15A11BF01D8; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:02:50 -0500 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:05:24 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FCB1F4.6B9961E0@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I belong to about 15 listserv's and this is the only one where hitting the reply-to-all button is required to communicate with the group. However, it's a matter of clicking another button, or entering another command through pine or elm. This issue is definately not a critical one and once people are educated on how to use this it requires no more effort than the other way. As for avoiding spam, I believe majordomo can be configured as an exclusive listserv whereby only members can post to it and all others get a postmaster error. Of course if you're at a friend's computer or are traveling, this can present a hassle, but for the most part I'd prefer exclusivity simply to avoid spam issues. Personally, it's not my listserv. So it's six one way or half a dozen the other... I simply appreciate the graciousness of the list owner and the unrewarded labor the owner expends on maintaining the list and if he has a preference on how the list is maintained, then it's not my possition to demand otherwise... Cheers, Mike efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > shouldn't it then be reply to the reply to address and cc the author? but > of course how do you know who / where to send the reply if the author is > not the sender or the reply to address. also, can ANYONE from anywhere > POST to this list, EVEN THOSE NOT SUBSCRIBED. This would be BAD as well > as it invites SPAMMING the list. so if only those subscribed can post, > and all subscribers (by definition) receive list traffic will the > sender/author not then receive the reply? the current setup only serves > to fill the mailboxes of the author and others with twice the necessary > volume. please consilder the above. as a user of this list I would like > to see it setup where replies go to the list. maybe this is an issue > that could/should pe put to a vote of the users of this list. I do > however respect the list owner and his final authoritative judgement in > this and other matters pretaining to how this list is run. it is, after > all his list. > > Eric Fort -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 21:23:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07948 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:23:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07944 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:23:49 +0200 Received: from smtpe.casema.net (smtpe.casema.net [195.96.96.172]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT8004NY8JOT9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:23:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 25518 invoked from network); Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:22:34 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gatekeeper2.slim) (212.64.36.208) by smtpe.casema.net with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:22:34 +0000 Received: from inter.nl.net (paragon.slim [192.168.100.26]) by gatekeeper2.slim (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA05809; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:21:42 +0200 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:29:29 +0200 From: Jurgen Kramer Subject: Re: a small proposal To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FCB799.BF265291@inter.nl.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Fully assembled efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > bare boards or assembled units? > > -eric > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > > > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > > >combo. > > > > Where can we sign up for one board or more? > > > > Greetings, > > > > Jurgen > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 21:53:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA08063 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:53:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA08059 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:53:31 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8005KW9X5XZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:53:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA12263 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:46:15 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:47:23 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: RE: Feature Request In-reply-to: <200004181624.SAA21794@historia.et.tudelft.nl> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000101bfa96e$ec01c960$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk If you and/or the list can agree on some rought specs on a charger I will try and do a design for it. Marc is right about all the different battery types and charging schemes but in real life they narrow down to a few if you want many cycles and fast charging. Even though Li-Ion are difficult to get (because of the mandatory protection circuit) I recomend using them for their light weight, high capacity, low self-discharge, easy charger (just need a current limited, very accurate voltage) and the fact that you only need two cells to do the job. What recharge input did you have in mind? Mains, wall-adapter, car, solar panel, another battery? Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of Marc Joosen > Sent: 18 April, 2000 18:25 > To: J.D. Bakker > Cc: Derek Lassen; lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: Feature Request > > > > > > At 04:53 +0200 18-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > >I know this is late, but is it possible to include a > battery charger on the > > >KSB? > > >Maybe based on the MAX1647? > > > > The KSB is completely packed (esp. wrt. connector space). > OTOH it should be > > easy to add an external charger yourself. > > ...and besides that, what type of battery would you like to charge? > There's nickel-cadmium (NiCd), nickel-metallic-hydride > (NiMH), lithium-ion > (LiIon), and of course the good old (sealed) lead-acid > battery. Then there > are several charging schemes, some suitable for all types, > while others are > very specific. There's constant voltage, constant current > (with discharge), > delta peak with or without temperature detection or topoff... > In fact, one > of my ideas for a LART application would be a near-perfect > battery charger. > It depends on the AD/DA card that hasn't materialized yet, > and of course > some booster stage. > > Anyone want to add a fuel cell to the available plug-ins? :) > > -- > Marc > e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's > marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:05:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08114 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:05:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08110 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:05:17 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8006S2AGQ58@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:05:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.77]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:07:47 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:00:46 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> To: T Sullivan , Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00041814020508.01204@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk It would be need it it had some sort of logo, stating that this was an open hardware project item. A "LART inside" logo? On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, T Sullivan wrote: > As the wheels start turning to build LART + KSB + Ethernet boards has > anyone given any thought about packaging ? > > A slick set of skins would certainly mark LART as unique... any > industrial / graphics designers lurking who are up for the challenge ? > > Terry > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:15:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08197 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:15:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08193 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:15:42 +0200 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (smtp.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.32]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT80084QAY531@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:15:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from 98aacd55.ipt.aol.com (HELO phoenix) (152.170.205.85) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:11:41 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:14 +0100 From: Rodney Arne Karlsen Subject: Re: potential orders To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <015b01bfa971$d3b1b2a0$9664a8c0@phoenix> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Apparently-From: References: <00041721182402.01206@localhost.localdomain> <14588.11145.283002.300042@joanna.william.org> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi I would be interested in 1 or 2 prebuilt lart/KSB/ETH boards IF somone can provide a decent price. I am hoping for less than £200 per set. How many orders would be required for this? One other question. Is there VGA support or anyone working on it and is it possable to conect standard PCI or ISA devices too the lart via an expantion board of sum sort? Rodney Arne Karlsen __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:18:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08215 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:18:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08211 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:17:59 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8006VDB1XXJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:17:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N1HD5Y; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:08:36 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:15:30 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: PayPal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FCC262.49D0D60E@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > I'd already been thinking of this. i'm in florida and would like a few > asembled (and tested) units). take orders - set a cutoff date and make > all orders prepaid by that date. then order and ship. > > -eric > > On Sun, 16 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > > > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > > > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort of org to > > handle this? > > > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > > http://www.paypal.com ) > > regards > > Doug Moreen Sorry, I didn't notice this suggestion from Doug Moreen until he was quoted here or I would have commented sooner. PayPal is only available to United States residents. While that's not an issue for people overseas (I assume you'll be doing your own run of boards), I'm just next door in Canada (eh?). I'd rather not be locked out of buying boards made in the US because I can't use your payment method. I don't know if there will ever be a Canadian run of boards but I'll bet it won't be as soon if there is. I'd rather take advantage of the discount by ordering in larger numbers with you guys. Would you be able to offer other ways to pay? Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:18:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08231 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:18:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08227 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:18:30 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8007KUB2S2M@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:18:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.44] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A21924DD01EC; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:14:17 -0500 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:16:24 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: Feature Request Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FCC298.366CAB38@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <000101bfa96e$ec01c960$351a10ac@reipur.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Have a 9 volt plug connect to your circuitry for the recharger/power supply to which you can plug a standard 9 volt transformer, or regulated solar panel or car adapter, etc... Then have it recharge while plugged in and run off the input power, or if not plugged in run off the batteries... Then build the circuitry as an optional module which can be attached to the LART. Mike Nicolai Mahncke wrote: > > If you and/or the list can agree on some rought specs on a charger I will try > and do a design for it. > > Marc is right about all the different battery types and charging schemes but > in real life they narrow down to a few if you want many cycles and fast > charging. > > Even though Li-Ion are difficult to get (because of the mandatory protection > circuit) I recomend using them for their light weight, high capacity, low > self-discharge, easy charger (just need a current limited, very accurate > voltage) and the fact that you only need two cells to do the job. > > What recharge input did you have in mind? Mains, wall-adapter, car, solar > panel, another battery? > > Best regards > > Nicolai Mahncke > mailto:nicolai@reipur.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:27:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08279 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:27:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08275 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:27:11 +0200 Received: from socket.house ([208.243.144.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT8008CXBHABQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:27:11 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by newsnipple.com via sendmail from stdin id (Debian Smail3.2.0.102) for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:33:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:33:47 -0700 From: Adam Haberlach Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: <00041814020508.01204@localhost.localdomain>; from Doug Moreen on Tue, Apr 18, 2000 at 02:00:46PM -0700 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000418133347.A22186@ricochet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> <00041814020508.01204@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, Apr 18, 2000 at 02:00:46PM -0700, Doug Moreen wrote: > It would be need it it had some sort of logo, stating that this was an open > hardware project item. > A "LART inside" logo? No "open source" project would be complete without: o. a Logo o. a Logo contest o. a Mascot o. an About Box o. competing fan/news sites (many open source projects choose to forgo coding entirely and make due with only the above items. Some merely add a CVS server) -- Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 22:28:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08294 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:28:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08290 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:28:16 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800802BJ2SW@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:28:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N1HD06; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:18:53 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:25:47 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FCC4CB.D597E24C@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: <38FC55A8.C1DC0B7F@envmtl.com> <00041814020508.01204@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > > It would be need it it had some sort of logo, stating that this was an open > hardware project item. > A "LART inside" logo? > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, T Sullivan wrote: > > As the wheels start turning to build LART + KSB + Ethernet boards has > > anyone given any thought about packaging ? > > > > A slick set of skins would certainly mark LART as unique... any > > industrial / graphics designers lurking who are up for the challenge ? > > > > Terry Wonderful idea! I think the actual packaging should be left up to the individual designer. The LART is so versatile that packaging requirements could vary widely depending on the application. The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be based on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - like carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next to something) for the small footprint. I have a graphic artist friend I could throw this at. I don't know if he has the time but I could ask him. We could also use something based on the logo on the LART homepage. Just my 2 cents... Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 23:02:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08464 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:02:02 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08460 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:02:01 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA04199; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:01:53 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:01:53 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004182101.XAA04199@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl, steve.lart@p2cl.demon.co.uk, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: List admin, request to change Reply to / Cc order In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:03:13 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > shouldn't it then be reply to the reply to address and cc the author? but > of course how do you know who / where to send the reply if the author is > not the sender or the reply to address. also, can ANYONE from anywhere > POST to this list, EVEN THOSE NOT SUBSCRIBED. This would be BAD as well > as it invites SPAMMING the list. so if only those subscribed can post, > and all subscribers (by definition) receive list traffic will the > sender/author not then receive the reply? the current setup only serves > to fill the mailboxes of the author and others with twice the necessary > volume. please consilder the above. as a user of this list I would like > to see it setup where replies go to the list. maybe this is an issue > that could/should pe put to a vote of the users of this list. I do > however respect the list owner and his final authoritative judgement in > this and other matters pretaining to how this list is run. it is, after > all his list. The list is currently open because that's the easiest way for a list to work. Have a look at the linux-kernel mailing list (and all other lists at vger.rutgers.edu): open list, thousands of subscriptions, very well known, but only a single piece of spam a week (the latest is Korean/Japanese spam without proper Content-Type headers: unreadable). Email harvesters won't get a chance on the LART site, because we use the Apache rewrite features for email harvesters. If we get spam on the list, we close it and LART the spammers (remember: LART is an overloaded acronym ;-). There are lots of ways to filter out your inbox, but the best way on Unix machines is still procmail. Here is my .procmailrc to put LART messages in its own mailbox: # LART mailing list :0: * ^Sender:\ owner-lart@lart\.tudelft\.nl $HOME/Mail/lart I am subscribed to over 30 mailing lists and procmail never failed for me. If you don't want the same message in your inbox: there is an example of weeding out duplicate messages based on message IDs in the procmail manpages. Erik [not the mailing list manager] -- Real Programmers consider "what you see is what you get" to be just as bad a concept in Text Editors as it is in women. No, the Real Programmer wants a "you asked for it, you got it" text editor -- complicated, cryptic, powerful, unforgiving, dangerous. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 23:16:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08558 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:16:35 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08554 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:16:35 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA04266; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:16:26 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:16:26 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004182116.XAA04266@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: rodney.karlsen@yahoo.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: potential orders In-Reply-To: <015b01bfa971$d3b1b2a0$9664a8c0@phoenix> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:14 +0100, Rodney Arne Karlsen wrote: > One other question. Is there VGA support or anyone working on it and is it > possable to conect standard PCI or ISA devices too the lart via an expantion > board of sum sort? There is a (documented?) hack to get VGA-ish video from the SA1100 LCD output. JDB designed a board for it, but it contains errors: it's a perfect 0 ohm resistor. (See? That's why we first *test* boards before we release them). The SA1100 doesn't have PCI support (thank god), so that leaves you with ISA. We currently have wild plans (but no time) to design a board around a C&T 65550, a VLB (do you remember?) SVGA chip. Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 23:23:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08606 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:23:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08602 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:23:08 +0200 Received: from marzipan.nougat.org (9.194.6.64.reflexcom.com [64.6.194.9]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800ADKE2ILK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:23:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by marzipan.nougat.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA12682; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:23:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:23:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Secret Asian Man Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: <38FCC4CB.D597E24C@saltspring.com> To: Varek Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be > based on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - > like carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next > to something) for the small footprint. I think the Penguin thing might not be such a great idea. I mean, this is a great flexible platform that can run anything. Personally, I'd love to see NetBSD on the little things. That's the coolest thing about the machine... It's so flexible in how you can implement it (with software AND hardware)... Just my humble opinion... cc -- Christopher Kyin-hwa Chen "I'm in love with the world, through the eyes of a girl, who's still around, the morning after." -- Elliott Smith, "Say Yes" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 18 23:45:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08716 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:45:19 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08712 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:45:18 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA04355; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:45:04 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:45:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004182145.XAA04355@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: adam@newsnipple.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-Reply-To: <20000418133347.A22186@ricochet.net> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:33:47 -0700, Adam Haberlach wrote: > No "open source" project would be complete without: > > o. a Logo > o. a Logo contest > o. a Mascot > o. an About Box > o. competing fan/news sites > > (many open source projects choose to forgo coding entirely and > make due with only the above items. Some merely add a CVS server) Some other open source projects leave the logo design to contest.gimp.org and ignore the contest winner (Debian, IIRC). Our logo contest was quite simple: we didn't have one and still got one contender. We asked Marc to design the LART website. He said "Cool, I'll start at once!", but didn't tell that he meant "I'll start designing a logo first". After a couple of days he came back without website but with the request for accounts on our four quad PPro machines so he could use PVM-povray and speed up the logo design. The result of his hand-coded povray image is still visible at each LART page. After he finished the logo, the first LART site prototype was finished in a single day and it just needed some minor cleanups before it went on line. So we have had a logo contest, we have a logo, and we have a competing news/fan site (Slashdot). An about box is not applicable for a piece of hardware, so that leaves us with the mascot. Oh dear. Erik -- "...which gives the server a futuristic, serverish, 'Don't touch me, or I will put a printer up your ass!', kind of look." (Nir Soffer in ASR) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 00:01:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA08819 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:01:14 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA08815 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:01:13 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA23156; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:01:10 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004182201.AAA23156@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: varek@saltspring.com (Varek) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:01:09 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl (Linux Advanced Radio Terminal) In-Reply-To: <38FCC4CB.D597E24C@saltspring.com> from "Varek" at Apr 18, 2000 01:25:47 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > > It would be need it it had some sort of logo, stating that this was an open > > hardware project item. > > A "LART inside" logo? [snip] > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be based > on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - like > carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next to > something) for the small footprint. > > I have a graphic artist friend I could throw this at. I don't know if > he has the time but I could ask him. That would be nice! If he (or anyone else, for that matter) can come up with a rough sketch, I can probably Gimp/POVRay/whatever it into a decent form. > We could also use something based on the logo on the LART homepage. Implied appreciation noted :) If anyone wants the POVRay source to those images, please let me know. It is a bit awkward because I didn't have or even knew about the powerful features of POVRay 3.1 then, but still... And it should be a nice way to benchmark your clusterLART 8) The idea of the logo, by the way, was to indicate the massive impact the LART would have on the computing industry, and well, the world in general. You can just imagine Redmont, WA being crushed... no offense to anyone living there, of course. I think any logo should at least contain a subliminal reference to the well-known, but now overloaded meaning of the acronym LART. The LART logo contest is now officially open, even though there's no page for it (yet)! -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 00:15:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA09026 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:15:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA09022 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:15:44 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800CADGI6UF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:15:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.123) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:59:18 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:57:53 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: RE:Power supply thoughts (was RE: Feature Request) In-reply-to: <000101bfa96e$ec01c960$351a10ac@reipur.com> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000418140402.00c07c70@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed References: <200004181624.SAA21794@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here is what I've pondered out so far: The Lower limit is a Wall wart with a long cord. A good battery should weigh nothing, take up no space, be free, and power the LART until the sun goes Nova. Well, that's the upper design limit. In between, I figure a reasonable battery pack should power the LART and its add ons as long as I can stay awake, and recharge faster than I can. The LCD I have will take between 3 and 5 Watts. Well put LART down for 2 Watts. KSB? I think a total power budget of 10 Watts (maximum) is reasonable. My LCD panel is 10.25 by 7.05. I am thinking that a plane of cells would be easy to package. A quick look at DigiKey's catalog gets the specs for some Panasonic NmH cells. I don't have any specs of Li Ion cells yet. It seems that the densest format is the 4/3 A, which is listed as 3.7 Ahr, .67 by 2.64, 6 Oz, $4.60 in hundreds qty. Two series strings in parallell of these cells yields 7.4 Ahr @ 16.8 volts (125 Whr), weighing ~3.25 pounds, and occupying a 10.56 by 4.69 by .67 space. The cost (from Digikey) would be ~$129. This would leave a 2.3 by 10.56 space behind the panel that the charger could fit into. Bigger panels would leave more space, but smaller panels would need the cells stacked somehow (or less cells :<). 125 Whr @ 10W is "only" 12 hours. Probably long enough. Especially if I get near a power source while I am snacking.... The laptop computers which I have had feature two kinds of power inputs: DC from a wall supply or DC bulk supply (car adapter) or AC from the wall supply directly in. I have grown annoyed at having to carry around and pack / unpack the wall supply to DC converter and the bulk DC adapter. I advocate a small AC input jack as well as a bulk DC input jack. So I think that there should be a boost converter that can take in Bulk DC at 12V nominal, and produce the required (guess is 18) Volts to power the charger input. And a buck converter to take in 100V to 250V AC. I figure that these converters will need to handle about 70 Watts to fast charge the battery pack (in about 2 Hours). BTW, the Maxim 1647 has a serial port to tell the LART what is going on. (s) Derek At 09:47 PM 4/18/00 +0200, you wrote: >If you and/or the list can agree on some rought specs on a charger I will try >and do a design for it. > >Marc is right about all the different battery types and charging schemes but >in real life they narrow down to a few if you want many cycles and fast >charging. > >Even though Li-Ion are difficult to get (because of the mandatory protection >circuit) I recomend using them for their light weight, high capacity, low >self-discharge, easy charger (just need a current limited, very accurate >voltage) and the fact that you only need two cells to do the job. > >What recharge input did you have in mind? Mains, wall-adapter, car, solar >panel, another battery? > > >Best regards > >Nicolai Mahncke >mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > > Behalf Of Marc Joosen > > Sent: 18 April, 2000 18:25 > > To: J.D. Bakker > > Cc: Derek Lassen; lart@lart.tudelft.nl > > Subject: Re: Feature Request > > > > > > > > > > At 04:53 +0200 18-04-2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > > >I know this is late, but is it possible to include a > > battery charger on the > > > >KSB? > > > >Maybe based on the MAX1647? > > > > > > The KSB is completely packed (esp. wrt. connector space). > > OTOH it should be > > > easy to add an external charger yourself. > > > > ...and besides that, what type of battery would you like to charge? > > There's nickel-cadmium (NiCd), nickel-metallic-hydride > > (NiMH), lithium-ion > > (LiIon), and of course the good old (sealed) lead-acid > > battery. Then there > > are several charging schemes, some suitable for all types, > > while others are > > very specific. There's constant voltage, constant current > > (with discharge), > > delta peak with or without temperature detection or topoff... > > In fact, one > > of my ideas for a LART application would be a near-perfect > > battery charger. > > It depends on the AD/DA card that hasn't materialized yet, > > and of course > > some booster stage. > > > > Anyone want to add a fuel cell to the available plug-ins? :) > > > > -- > > Marc > > e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's > > marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 00:59:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA09269 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:59:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA09265 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:59:37 +0200 Received: from wzdd.lardcave.net (wzdd.lardcave.net [203.27.67.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800E37IJ88Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:59:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (wzdd@localhost) by wzdd.lardcave.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA00854 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:59:26 +1000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:59:26 +1000 (EST) From: Nicholas FitzRoy-Dale Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: <38FCC4CB.D597E24C@saltspring.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: wzdd.lardcave.net: wzdd owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be based > on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - like > carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next to > something) for the small footprint. Tux carrying a large baseball bat? Perhaps this is a too heavy-handed approach to acronym overloading. :) -- Nicholas (NEW: wzdd@lardcave.net, DEFUNCT: wzdd@tig.com.au) http://www.lardcave.net Same age I see? Mail me no later than Friday. - Friendsnoop -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:04:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09483 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:04:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09479 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:04:51 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800E75IS18Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:04:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail6.magma.ca (mail6 [206.191.0.248]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA17591; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:49:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail6.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA26595; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:49:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:52:07 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Secret Asian Man Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FCE717.8183CC46@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Secret Asian Man wrote: > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > > > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be > > based on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - > > like carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next > > to something) for the small footprint. > > I think the Penguin thing might not be such a great idea. I mean, this is > a great flexible platform that can run anything. Personally, I'd love to > see NetBSD on the little things. That's the coolest thing about the > machine... It's so flexible in how you can implement it (with software AND > hardware)... Ok, a branding logo is certainly one aspect of packaging - wasn't quite all that I had in mind but I'll go with the flow :-) Consequently, I'll stick my neck out to start the ball rolling - I threw this to JD a little while ago to possibly depict a LARTcluster project and I'll given it another wack here, doesn't quite capture all that is LART but what the hell.. [Image] -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:08:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09509 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:08:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09505 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:08:56 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800E1GIYUL1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:08:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail6.magma.ca (mail6 [206.191.0.248]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA18255; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:53:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail6.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA27029; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:53:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:56:07 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Secret Asian Man , Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FCE807.57B8F930@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------B968A1C6908CCE27E38727BE" X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38FCE717.8183CC46@envmtl.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B968A1C6908CCE27E38727BE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OK let me try enclosing the jpeg this time... mea culpa T Sullivan wrote: > Secret Asian Man wrote: > > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > > > > > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be > > > based on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - > > > like carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next > > > to something) for the small footprint. > > > > I think the Penguin thing might not be such a great idea. I mean, this is > > a great flexible platform that can run anything. Personally, I'd love to > > see NetBSD on the little things. That's the coolest thing about the > > machine... It's so flexible in how you can implement it (with software AND > > hardware)... > > Ok, a branding logo is certainly one aspect of packaging - wasn't quite all > that I had in mind but I'll go with the flow :-) Consequently, I'll stick my > neck out to start the ball rolling - I threw this to JD a little while ago to > possibly depict a LARTcluster project and I'll given it another wack here, > doesn't quite capture all that is LART but what the hell.. > > [Image] --------------B968A1C6908CCE27E38727BE Content-Type: image/jpeg; name="Reaktor.jpg" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="Reaktor.jpg" /9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQAAAQABAAD/2wBDAAMCAgMCAgMDAwMEAwMEBQgFBQQEBQoHBwYIDAoM DAsKCwsNDhIQDQ4RDgsLEBYQERMUFRUVDA8XGBYUGBIUFRT/2wBDAQMEBAUEBQkFBQkUDQsN FBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBQUFBT/wAAR CAETAUADASIAAhEBAxEB/8QAHwAAAQUBAQEBAQEAAAAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtRAA AgEDAwIEAwUFBAQAAAF9AQIDAAQRBRIhMUEGE1FhByJxFDKBkaEII0KxwRVS0fAkM2JyggkK FhcYGRolJicoKSo0NTY3ODk6Q0RFRkdISUpTVFVWV1hZWmNkZWZnaGlqc3R1dnd4eXqDhIWG h4iJipKTlJWWl5iZmqKjpKWmp6ipqrKztLW2t7i5usLDxMXGx8jJytLT1NXW19jZ2uHi4+Tl 5ufo6erx8vP09fb3+Pn6/8QAHwEAAwEBAQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtREA AgECBAQDBAcFBAQAAQJ3AAECAxEEBSExBhJBUQdhcRMiMoEIFEKRobHBCSMzUvAVYnLRChYk NOEl8RcYGRomJygpKjU2Nzg5OkNERUZHSElKU1RVVldYWVpjZGVmZ2hpanN0dXZ3eHl6goOE hYaHiImKkpOUlZaXmJmaoqOkpaanqKmqsrO0tba3uLm6wsPExcbHyMnK0tPU1dbX2Nna4uPk 5ebn6Onq8vP09fb3+Pn6/9oADAMBAAIRAxEAPwD8sAPenD6UmcdaUGvdhZGDA80jDinAc0rR 5rb2Upp2FexCcUoGKRoxmlAAH+FeelK+qNGwOe1IPenY3UoWtFTcndCvYdGuSavW8ByrMpKe 3f8AyaqxrgV0jWqk20agZ8tTj0OM5PvX2WV4eKV35HHWny/MuaZAVljYZBI5I4554H4/0rsz ar+6VUBzwGYBT268fpg1iaDaF7+FR913PB9ccDB/lXYtaqHDM20Ak/Mc54P/AOvv0r9Zy+je N7HzmIrWkrDtOh2xDAwedwQc5wcjFaCWZQqCBuXHX68dPr+pqex0/lF3KEIztI6jA/z+FasN gVk2lUTbkhDzg7QR2/3v096+ijQTjrFHmzrNPc8y+JOlgQRSsgyCRuBxgDGe3XrWd8MbQnVJ jkruj4dfTPP9K7H4pWKx6RGibgAy5AU854xgDp/nNY3wn0txqs+7ax8o7SRkfw//AF/85x4U aCeMSsj1fbN4WTZq/FC2SPwySQd+8Yz6cf4+39K8HcfN0r6P+MVs1t4WAyUYSf8AfQ4A9P1/ n0+c2HzV8HxXSX1iNj0ctnz0rktmcTKeOPXpXvVnau3giPy0LyfZxgMMK2ABkdM/56YrwazO JhkZHIx+FfScWnuvw4TzExvtU2lw3IJHzc/h69utezwlSVVSi0cmaz5OT1M7RLRTo9uxBZfL 3bVAORwcHHfJ71498Rio8TXYHRSFAPYBRX0jb6JIukoceWzRgjnO45xt/PH6V8z+OZPM167I +75rYHTAzxXVxRTVKhZIjLZ882zmRU8aD0qNFzV60iZWVzkDPA6Zr8ty7DOpO9rn0U5WRraF ov8AaN/HHHHvQkAjPJHOfyr2e10kW0XlpGQwGMAA4wSP6/r3rk/hxpb3RSQqCAOHGM5IyRg4 HryT2xXp1zZjGX/eFRy/8LH5sAhegPGOvQDg9f3TKsHGlhl7up8hjsS/aclzjb23MkRIXfgE 7AQNx7Vj3unhg5CbTgncvA7dc49/88V2l9ZYfIUoBwwK/hgA/h6Vh6hbMsbBiQQcBgRkHjuP 5exrorUVbYypVpI8/wBXthHGCyNswMxrgYznHt2NYBjO+QBCYzx82eR65/z1rstctVZwq5+b sFHYcE8f7R7dq5yWLaC2PUZH5f4/nXx+MotN6Ht0Zvl1OXuACSQMD0NVintWhNb7ACcFT0Iq q6Y6V+WZhhJc7m0e1CV1oQlcDrTCuD1qQmmkZr5yrCL0SN0yMAg04bhTiue5pVX3rKNJp6Db AHmlA9qUDFOC5r0IU2zNsbgDtUUh56fjU+2opRxWOIg1C5UXqPK470AYp2OKcBXaqV3oQ2Io OfSn4oBx2pwOa9SjSVrXIbK7rQowKkkHI4pgFeTUpqNRl30ALgUqnmgmmMxFE5KlqhpXLCtg 10WnSm6vbYZJ3KFJA4HBB4+gNcqjEHrXR+EVEurwIVL7iRtxnOVIx+tfU5HiPbVlTt1OTER5 YOXY9C8O2Trf2xZQTu+ZQcgE84+mQCee/TnFd/Fp4NwG2OxPQNnnB9cfhXP+G7bzdXtTtOCw A25DEkjHGAM5zx1/OvQF05nuFzkE84bJwMjqAOnfPPX0r95wdC0UrHw9erdley0wKcEGQMQR vOcEKMZ9+K0YdMjj6kqB1BOW24JPBOeg7+laun2DEq+xvNfOScneNx9sf0+X8tWCx2j5Npc9 WAJBHTOfUEn8uO9e86cUtTznU1tbc8S+M8Qs7a2XDM0ZPUEZHHXHTr71V+BxF1qMsKhWMiNg Kc54PXjtjOfb89v9oXTH+y25Azuc5bjnjPYdvfP15qL9nLw06XtzfOpwqGMMT0yR09s+3418 nCjV+vcyXuo9+SUsE03qyx+0JGtpodoi7lJcdQMMAB+XXtivmlhlq+k/2os20GjQgEFwZAWX nOAMY9Mc/X8a+bG61+dcWPmxZ7WWRcaCuXdJg8+5jAOG3DH+NfXd7pBt/B+k2bhAGeJDzyec kgYxjGOvbH0r5k+HGmNqXirT4NhO+QYAGc//AF6+zNR0wSX+mW6qMQ7fvAYGAMHnk8f0r7Xh HDqjh/aS63/A8XOpylUjCPTUy7vTRZ6NIzIAgi+YZxuwMjgj6elfGXiVxPqE0gB+aV+Cfevu zWbNbfw/fykA+XbucMAO3tn/ACa+C9XbfcM2DkkjBPpXHxZKM6SudGURabbKEaZNb+k2XmSB gN4Xhc+v/wCs1j2hVpRuAI56n2rqtHgI05XbKM5YCRmwB0xz+f618fk1CLl7p7mIm4o9b+GW nk6c07qNrsMuUJHf8egz3Ndvc2mxgf8AVkMc8cezDpkHP86h+GenCLwray/IDIGfcoIbB+h+ UAEdPfpxW3c2YUbDGNxGSAozzzxgcc/jxX7fhqMY0kvI+CrT5qrv3ORu7fy027dqLnGF5Ax2 GPWsLVLUOu8YdSOPfuP8OtdjdxhuVO6UnczfxDPc1ganbkqxZQCpblOMk9/x5/zxXNWpq2qO mk31aPPtdtWVsDaGJAyADk9ex56cYrmr+2RLRm3HGAAeuenT0rt9TgMx+Yh92SSRncR7Ht/n rzXO69beTalztUnccnpnA5P6/livk8ZQsme3Qnqonn8kQePzGY5OaoyAAGtJ13B4yTuJzg54 55GKzZunWvzLMociloe/SZXYCm0rDmmsSBX59OVnsdqQtOA4pikntUgq6dpaiegDg0uM96VQ PWnEj1r0IU9NSLjCRUUpzUrEE1DKMVxYt+67Fx3LCnA6U5VBPSgDinKcV7lKnqkzJsULinFc 0qjJpzR7jwMk9AK9uNJKOhm2VZQAaYoGKdIMNTQRnpXylVJ1mbLYcwxTCualABPSnqgrdYV1 3ZBzWIFjJNdX4BtWm8RWiBdwLFscdlJrDhttxHoTiu28B2Jj8Y2a7sh0fJPf5CMfn6V9pkOV cleM+zRw4mr+7l6M9W8OaeI9TiJUGRmxkD5m+U8443HPYV6VFa8rmNR0ARe/Y/zPPTrXNaDb I1yjgZTOSXXB24+7+ZPX3rtIIShTCbmzkDIww/LnODX7/Rh7OCbPgKklJt3sTWtmS6kA5PzY KAY/zj/9XfRgt2HAUuAeABkAdOwx/wDqqO2t1V1UAszcHKk56+mT6/5FadrZKEyV3A5wxXGB xzyOv19awq1Dmc1e1zx/4+6epsdOchdpkKKGXJB2nnP/AAH+XBrofgNp6r4auApQlbggFWGW GMZPsc+vrU3xvsA/hyCQYY+cMlsY5HBOR2OPy6+uj8AbHfod5uYqEnypXq3yjOMjGRx+ftXO 3y0pVL9vzPQqO9JRueRftdYi1HQo1ztaB267ujAZz+NfOaoWYADk9hX0r+2PEYPE/h+P5mP2 R8MSfm+Yd+ec5+lfNi9RmvyLPkqmMu+yPscDph4nrf7PGlrqHxEswANqKXBOMrjqR78H/OK+ zm0oS3Akdd2flBAJXOefUc9/Tv7/ACj+yNZ/aPiS8m0kw2kkgbZuxggcY5yc4455r7MNgRJl wqguE8wkEHHPHGO/r6Yr7rByVDC04R00/r8j47Nm3i173Y8++Izrp3gPVJmYqpt24I4wQDkf nx7rXwFqjiQjvyeSMd+lfe/7QjfY/hvdMzAb8ruU9eMfU/n+NfA9+hDDI5PO0dq+e4ivVw0W vM+iypXi3cr22VlGM59q9F0yx8vTLb5VDkZGMt3I4Gec5x36jPXjhtKt2kk+UHqOfxx+fP61 6vpVg0ltYLjEoJChSDknseOBgjv2/LHhfCt7o6Mwqcqsj3TwRYmLwnYxsSAYmI+XjByfy6dM c5/DRuIWRCWXGOdnALHA7ce3Aq/otj5Oh2afMoSNVGF7EYH16de/FRzxZO5SUBxlh0B6AYxx 2Gfr+P6xCST5T4dycpN3OU1CAEZJJ25GFGSQN2O3TC9c8VzuoosILMNqN0AOQCOc57D/AArs 7y3yjf8ALIN8wxuxjPb+efaua1C3JmkT7hDYGWA6kHrj2/WnWpuSudFOyepyE9m8hc4Py4Ck /Xk+/ODiuW8X7LOGMM5YHOS7YOMDn6V6ZJp5BBIEisTgKD/n/wDVXknxHvme+8hOMYUEnIPP X8hXymZR9nTfc9vCe9OyOOuYsBX6Ek8HB5J/P1rAnO5jmusltgUgDHYdvRsHGfbPHWuZvjun Ynvz2r8szWk3B3Po6DsyiyZpnl4PpVpUyaVlx2r4t5dzLnZ3c9tCsBgUoBJqVjimbhXNKjGm 0mx3uKq4pSM0oxijFdygkrIkaUz3qCZcVYIzUEwwK8zGQSptpFxepaApVHNLjNKor6qFOzWh g2T2yxhxuIqzNAGAcBigyTgE8dP6VFbwJKOZCG5wuOv41JdDaAgztXkruxjpz09/1/CvT0jE xteRkzDDUxetErZNIvSvhalRSrNo7ErImAxT0JxUS/Wp4lLkAck9hXtYT35aGctC7Y4IYcls rgevNejfDeH7R46gQKX227gheP4STj171wGnW5W6iQ4O9x0bB4Nes/B+ya48fzDkBbR85IGQ RjAHf734/rX6dkNPmqxXmeTipJQl6HtOk23ksMqGKtkED7/OR79ePw9q347cs+CD3ycH5jng /p9ffpUFlakmTJZT93kDB/MVqwRCSTGAxOT1Ayc4zz/nj8K/Vak0tj4xRgncms4Dw3ljGDxx yD7+uK2bWLEgzGSgzu98D1PfoPxFQ2tqXAOwhiMggZ54HX9K39PsicfINy5GMEEAnCnKj5u/ /wBavFr1UilCPY8/+L1pu0KNGAbL5IVCCCFwDjAPY8fWrv7P+n+XoV8CrZa44wu3J2jIAYZ7 D8hV34rWpk0pY2R8eZlQo3DjJyPyHT8+a3fgVpuzQbyR2GfPVsqMqQASMdPX26457OtUUctc vP8AU15Foj5j/bUmJ+IekQgr5cdkCCvXJY5PtxjjtXzUDtNfTH7bADfFiGJG3mC0RGOTkHGR nPPTt7V82zQEzBByT0IGARjrX5bnEW60ZLsvyR9lhElQifQX7I2ox6Z4xv5WY7TalRnow3Dj njuTj2J7V9Yy+NrdIXclz8u394QAQe3fjPPTr6V8g/sy2edW1OZUT/UBd2TlcsPzHB/LtXvr 24MWWUgso3ADoMdAPxr9Cy3CKphabq72PjczwkK+Lbcmjlv2l/FsOoeCbeygf5pZMhF5GOST jg8ggYJ6mvky+tjJI4CgkkAK34Dr+n4V798V42n01Nw5TPK/MrcjJPp0zgcdfSvA9awLlVXI Vl6Y+bAycf59K8HNoxg+Sa0R9RgKcaNLli7j9CtWkuYV2kBnwTjO0dcc+pNeyaLp266sIFUk bVyo5znoCDnrjmvMfBFpPqOoWihGmzIPlB689+Mnr2/xr6D07SQviC1wm/YwAI47j256fp71 72QYZKPtErI48fOPwt6nrMNm8dnArxsihduMYA4A2/y9uOazbyEorHLEbAuFHUY4GMdfauuf TtttApYAuuMvwep/D+vFYV/agqxUbe4O0DAxx9P/AK9erRrKUj5xU6a2OWvoHUAHaxbjhOw4 /r/L0rDksjNcsQCxYkNnOc9eDjnqOv8ASumv4VKcqcK3BPOe2B/Pt296pWsXnSNxwBjGB/n8 q9mLUo6mkVFbnPXVnmBpBG29QfnQjjrx0r568RQNd+IJAx3APv3Ag8Zx7H06e1fTet4g0O6n y2BHt+RcZOR0+v3a+fryAG+nkfIYuTsBGQMk9cZ7Dt29a+czWEWrHt4SSS0OWvh5Jdh82F5B bggVyV2QZmwQQMDI78V12s5W2kwxOVIDHn2Irj5m3yEnrxX5VmnRI+gpLqJEBnnj6Uj8t1/G lQ7eQSCOhB6UwnmvDk+Wmom63In6U1WxSyHOKYDivl6s+WpobIlBzQeaEOacSM16MVzQvckY 1V5TxVhgDVeXgV4uOuoM0huXs5qzBDkbiQMHv0NV0GCK0BJsC7cAnv0GP88/jX3eHjz6s45t rRDBbpGSSwI5GCKlMQcDEW/Gc8cn29vrSRwlZAsg2jowYc47mpoIlVBvII6sD0HH+fyNehUo KMG2KCe7OflADUifepZs76avWvzuo0q7t3OtbEoHNWYIHlyV6Dqx6Cqw61dtgFUnj6d6+iwN PnmZTdkamlKkmq2yhWJ3jAI5zjgce+K9o+B1kX8e6xtZQiWW1ztOCNyDOP8AHP49K8c0GItq lmu4IHkG0kdxkemD1r3r4DwFvGuvEqfMNsoLkZIIdCOf8846cGv1bI6fJJN/1ozxMa0qb9D2 aOArakqAGwDhTn2449RWlYwADcwOTnj169cj/wDXTzbhomXAHdVPQf55/OrttblYEKqMgZH+ z+Qr6+pVuj5dQ59irp2rQPKoUqSG2jPy8d/boCO1dHa6xDGBulQtkZ45J9/69q+brO5uluJz HclA0jtjcSWGSen0HX37V0drreqxDLXUnlqRlUAUDnJGe/FZSwzqys1Yxlg8QtVNWPSPiDep fLGsKqQAXAAA7kk4HTjP6+tdP8JtSt9J8N7jIVcsDjAJYds+uSeBn868k81tUTzC6uirwBno DnPt/wDqrctL+5t4WVWAC5wq8gZ4Pv7/AI1viMGpYb6vcv6vVk/iPBv2s9QXVPidPKAioyKm 8qACQFycAdsH8CPWvCHOX7N257GvV/j0ks/iuGWSUAvD99ScH5sYzjnpn8PavMZUzLI42kfd IIJ2np6fzr88x9JSxHK1psfa4VclBRPe/wBm6LbbavIwL7PKXbz1+b/AjjmvZLqcJb7GxjnI wWz068j2ry39nG0B0LWpRjb5kZDgjP3Tk9Oma3PFXjWKzuJoFKGVM5O7jHy5z+HX6/XP3tGv Sw2Hi5vRI+SxT5sS7bmF8TpP9CAG0uchjn7o4GOfX+nrXz/4jKi5GAVbJ4GORxz9eleneKfE y6qoRCHGSPlHA57/ANPT8a891SETXQwNxAO5QCeOhwAOf8+xHymPnHFyvA+hwcpRj7x0Pw0i B1axlERIUnDHI6n0B6Yz/X3+itPlWPVrWYKSoIKM5OBg8K3fPIGBnqe1eH/DvTHa/iySASAS R329Rx1wM/8A6q9zitEjG8rkEkhtoAY8npj/AD/L6zKqc4UOU8fH01Vn8Vj0nQdfi1TUhbRN hkTaQmAGwpOAAOf846ZqbU7BwpIEj4G3eFOF6Y65z1rmfhhAT4jkIzho2GT1Ax/+v8/y9E1u 0wrMEVSOMg4O3H/2Oa5cTy4fEckdrHk0oOGjZ51qNuyFiBu3HOAe/PtVKytdhdjjJb754z7f yre1a1CmQJhdhO4dOnbp/nAqvZWpFtJgM2SQQepH+c16cKtqZq4yOQ8XRkeHLhCCCdqFumMH p06Zx+v4/PGrOY9WNsyBdw3/ADAEjIx1J6/1r6U8d2/l6ISELLuw6ccjHQcc9RwevTvz89+I IPN8RSzKuA0IUFhhV5wev0/zxXmZilOCZ7WCSjE4fXypiKbyS+OBjnv/AJ/CuPZiTXY+L8xs oDZBdmyATkdjz7H+VctPHtlYE5r8szKm3UsnY+jpSViOIAhsg4API/T9cVE3C1eO0QnAxkdB 6Z71VmYGNRk8Z4PQfSvHrQtDfobRdyqxwKZuNPbA7Uw18hWb5tzoRInPWnkehpkQyKlIxXrY ePNTuyHoyMj1qvMBjirJ6VXnHNeVmEbU2zSG5eVdxq8F8qJcBTnrnvUEMSkHLjjpnvU8ihYg Ad49euB7V91QjaSOKTu7IuW0ZkKlslgCAGKgE56Dvj5qsTKWRCFK8MQ+OrHnOCOnzfyqpakx KshJIddud2MHJOM/8BH51rJGHiBIfIIABIIHI6jv0z1r1pwcoML2OImHz01QSasal/x+Tf77 fzqFOtfl9WKeIkvM7E9B68VpWihoeh4PX3+v9Kz1BBrStwAkJYlVB5IGcDPNfVZbTakYydmj X0pTFqNtkKd+EBI6nr/gMjt3r6C+ANuB448QKxB2wxLkjliT1rwHSkMdxb5XJDjDMMjqeQfS vov4BW7p468QOUUCWKPBY8KRu/rt68c1+tZRStTlPtc8HHzbi7f1qe7C3JtQ2zMe4dDwCR6Z zU0sJgsZnBy6An0wBnnkcf59K0orIG2QAnDsCDwCBtXjp0+Uce3XmpprDdo8u7coO4AkdPXH y8d67HVva/c8KldvU+XbaZFdyCQRKw244B3Hj6//AF/rWvbzxNaOgbOcYXn/AAOMViyWphup kJAZJHXDZyMEknn8e9Xrez8ve21eOvB4OOvT8a+iSqKeh3Ti2k4s67QVgktxg9QQcrgk8Z4H T8+/0rc8wBc7w2RwONzdP8a5LToElUsGAA4wSenXkY6//WrVhimkYrvZ1HBHQgHIyfzP55ro nCTd5M5lGbd7ninx0hH/AAk9oVUrmFiGA/U4+vv+GMV5XPHutnKxjJ/HI68Y681678Zrd31m zYj5jEyqTySAc8H1+b9K8p1QPFE4Cthgx4z0yOuP6+nvivgMdTarts+loN+z1Pc/hVd/2N8I /Fl+CuY8kDJUv+742jr/APXP0z87a94ivdSvpJZH2M5BKKBgcD/9X4V9G/CDRn1rwFren+cs C3ETKzFAMkoRnHU49Pfr2PzZqukzWN7NBKu2WNirAnPIOK8biHC4iVGDg3YWGpxU5Nq7L+g6 pNc3EcM2HUsBknHc12L6OWuhmPABwNvUZ+vPp71y3grRH1LVolQZVGBYg8DJwD+HNetXmmbQ /AkY5+bYQQMDnBGfUf5NduR4Ot9XUqv4irTjTloafw40kSXzP5SnGR07EZPt3FemSyiGM9Bu UHbjOePzHeuL8EWU8MjCPOTjAUEYOcnHp3/DNdbIpkBYDYwzgIOv0/TtX6JhITjGzR4FdynJ ux3vwjthPfx3GArEv8yAkYOep49v/rdK9Q1a2ZnJyCepAX6c/wCfSuL+DFklzZebho0WRlK4 2gDjsRgjqf8APPoerRK0ZUbdx6Ankn1/+v8An7fJZjVbxrXbQ87mb2R5vrNuo3LtbByQMHA4 XnrnuPy/KpDb+XYRny85kIBJwWJwT3/X/I2NXtDKzTbQxGTjaR3J6kY7H/JqN7TZEFZCTn5l Cn26EDH9Oa74VLRSLTPPfiMqnQ1GwZEhO4jofy56Ecdq8P1LS2ku5pewTBIGf4jkcjjBB/8A rV7n8RvlgiiUAlcfKQPmOTjHHPB/zmvKtUttto44HOCQMbe/frnj+nau+rT5qEX6nqYao0rH i/jaMSX5YhiI1yWOMZO3+n+ea5KeD5gyMSuOjDB4/wA9a6vxfJ5+p3TEZBbam0g7mx16+vpz XMOZFVQmRnPXk/jX5XmUUqh9DCb5EiCdhJKdoPJ4pupYE+FOQAAB6f5/rU6Rv5se7GAOPWqt 8H+0PvILZ5I6V8/iFemzeDV7Ipt0poXJqQimV8nUh72p1IkQYpxGaalPJr16KXsyHuMI4qvO OtWTk1XnBwa8jMI/u2XDc0oYxkZYc/jVxY8yDGSxHCr1x9Pb+lVID84ym72q2gJMicOX6Y6j 0PHt296+7w8VdHG3aRYtosopDIxPKrnGT/j/ACz71rQ7jNvAGCBkHt+Hc8fqPqM63UN85QNt POMAZHQ4/P8AM1p2qCE7eIwWPyt19+vXv6/4e/Rip6PUzdRXbKc3ho3Tu/ytk4y2cgdqx9Z0 U6VIqhg6sMhh9a7eCVlBBI5BG4jvj6f5zWb4zs1NhHOm8AMQQwx1xjj06d81yZlgMO6LnGCT NIVZSdmcSgwa1bSNpY1UYYcsB245yc9eM1lAYNaVqQojOFB9TjHWvn8u92VrGz3NqxiMVzbu WULC4IDLyR7mvpP9nKQ3PjjXRHkqsEbAg/dO7knOOoyD9e9fNNl5gkhjbcBuCjg8Hn2/zivo T9ky587xhratkSPGMAjjALjoM8gf561+lZZWahKFujPncwj+7cl0/wAz6tW13WowwRR6L93t 0x9fyFXn07Oj3QCltqHJUA7iOnY+p/DHqKdY2oeBWO/kj7316E4z1/z2ret7BZdPmR1Zsrn5 u/Iz82Dg4Lc44yMEAGuepX5H8zwaUu58d6vYrb69coQwEbEbc9j9OT+HtViCNZosKCSR64z/ AC56/wD1q1PE+jf8VBPhEUOwBAUqBzn+vX/DNFro8gCoR2+bA4GT1wf89a/RoRTtNvc9KUW4 6MXREZUYjGA2OcnJ3eu3jn19q2IYtkYCopHPysRyMHrx196rWmkMibxuUAkEleMY5+vJ/Wrq 2FwSx2uQ3zZAOOeAf6Dn+VTUnFvRmHLUi00eQ/Gqyxc6VKAJN6yfKx6gEDhcDvjOMc15Fe6e l1NhQ4HIVcc7v/rf54JFfQfxf0fYmjgxkk20pz0Ay6nr3PA/Anrjnym20gyXS7VYqeAwXrnP J9v8Pwr57EUI1qiktj26VT93qz179nzT3t9Kuyw+UlcEYA+6CP5n/PT5x8fW8SeKtaRVCqt5 Kis/GSGzxwAOAB+Hbv8ATPgGz/szRlkUNC8jNLtTgHGFJz6/z/Dj5c8Vr5/iPUXkD/NPIwIB wcse+B+fOawzWMowS6E4dyc229D0j4OeHo77SLq7RD5hkManGcNgE8jj/I9OO3uNDdHyBnH8 OMk5xkfjx+YrM+B9k8PhZtu1w8xOCCxB4A7ei55/CvRZbJihBUM4yCACePy9v1Fe5gqUI4eK a1scNeq3Nox/C+mC0HlKgAx1bcFyOAP5c1v3NuQNzKMYIJbj/POfz/GsaWZ9PnVlLFn/AIee e/4nilnvruPcMqpORwuPzz19ceo6V2KbTSSOGbqdEe8/AO2Evhy9kVQQt2wypzngcj368c/1 rtNYUq7qxOVbJ3A9efQHvXHfsxOJvC2s27ALJHciRy2V428Z45OcfkK7/X7Z0YLu+YcAden4 ei1+b46f/ChVjLuedza2PObu2RpANm/73B+bGD93gcjtjn7vAzTLlAqjIDIuWckKc4H4du9a zRb5HZsgbudpOe3t7ev5dKy78CGBnRN+OdwA+UY3ZG4ew/SvUhLmaRWrkeWeO3JuiiksRGqD +7nt2z0HXvxXkvjHUotLsgVcIzEsAQQOmT/Lv/WvUvE5eS5mIBwrEK2MjH+eM8fmOfnf4sal KbmOCMDYPlAGCd3Jz0z7fn6CvYzGo6OGil2PXw1Jzdjz3Wrprhmd8hpGaQHjBzj9eO39c1no 5aNtwCKO4qe8fEgH3tigblOc8dvTkn/OarzqWhCxgkDrX5Xipcz1R9PyNRSZBI6yyFiMDHQV WkO407O2o2NeJWleNjeKsM2ZqSO3Z/ugn6UiDcelaKwmJCq9Dnp35wAaww2EjWd7DlLlKJga M4IIxSEYq66eZECw59QPeqkg5rqlRVJNImMubchOMVWuKssKrXB5r5TM9KbTOmG5ukMzjIZg Rjrgn14p6sBMCWG3oSSfT2qGJ5JWBfOw5GSOOntTwQ8gOdoA4wcenXtX3dBe9c4bJPU07GLE KMgBcJ97g9cjGe/0rUtvlkwPmAOAxXBB/wAKy7UOuCzMzbmJUYAGPXitSFwAfvbT82epI+g6 /wD66+goNPYiVldIvRK0q8ZLjA2gc9+lU/FgD6CrKRtRwAfU56jPb+X48342CRH5hkc4+vfp mo/FUYbQXJcLuwy84GNwwMden16DBrfHq9B27GcHaR55FF5kgXgZ7muz0Lw+bmwScoCsh4D8 DIJ7D2rjYvvivdfAmhi+8HWTKoaQowxjKnLtztxyQDgn6e1cPDuEjXnJtXNq1X2Su3Y5GbSU s445s4MLhgegzkY56/8A6wK9r/ZF0ya18X+IJY42IRo4yTkDOXJ5/D8cj2rmdU8MNB4au72W Mn7O6NvyWIGR+HQfqK9N/Zes44bnxZcZ+9eiJcEBcAck4H+0vGf5Zr7f6tGhCcra/wBI8fF1 uam0fS9hEy2gGxFK9PXHtxXUaVAZLR8IQdhIVlPzHPPUHj8Olc5pcZaAYwQMYUjgc4B6cjjr 7V2elQl7UsGwdj4UDjofb0z+Rr4/Fztp5nzUJJPc+a9b06STXLwEMoaU/fUbQQcdenof/r1P p2jHazbGZzzjqUweefyH8utdDNp0lzqE79AZiACcZXJ79P1rodN0UIkbENswD90qxGOO3B/z 719lPGclNR8j0PaXWjOY0vwsHQ/IArFlJPU+30/pWxF4NDP80bB2JwM/Mei9cDuMY9iO1d1o vhzy042oy/KrbMnIP93HsMeldHa6EUXcGJOeAy5wSTzyOoz/APrxXz9fNnGT5WL2ttj5R+P2 hra3vh6OORTm0k8wEj5QZDjnt69j83TPXyuHQ9svRVJ3EAnbznHfjqB+f1r3z49af5ni+NI0 KpFbIiL3XAY4Bx14A/H8K84TRS2AU43HjPHB47dOfevt8u5amFp1J7vX73c6ozly6mho0X2X SdMLbUEtrI52/wDXRgCc/U/06V8nalamW9kaTa5ZsuzdznIOMdwcH0H419feIdIki8N6Vw0b x2TrlQRnMkhPb0+vFfL9/pztfvvY53/MMfhjr/nmuLFxWIt6v82dWHajFnr/AMIrM23hCzQq FaRmOG6HnuMeuf1564794NyHdsXJGSQCOvTp9ax/CemNB4O03yw6gQjJOAST24HYfkMVcFtO IyAwjIPBUA55zjp0/wDr/h68VaKSex5dWE5TbRk6lEF1BOrIQAD6YGfT6dPWpbq2R15c8dMP 26Dkfy9qsRaOfOYytl/fBz7nvUd/ZsUUAD5V4I4/Pj/ODXSmr6DlCVtz2r9lUpjX7YLuUMkg G08fLjn8M9a9U8T2IAkBVTjuAOenqOuDz6e1eY/sjWLpf64Np2FVALdM/wD1yD/nNezeJLU+ Ur+WSSpHyjBIPPp05PT1r8pzioo5vUSfb8keO2oyszzG6t1hhkYrhjuYnt+A+prlvEJxA+Uy NxKjJ44HPT69a7TUYwiM5LAtyM55+lcJ4rBSEjBA3cEHA6dDxgHn9K9fBPnmjojZM8o1tfNR 8LvxnDMpwDkDuOn+I69K+e/iFpbT3zKMsoyxPOOwzya+idVgyjKSMRno2Ofu8Yxgf56ZrzTx lp7SKZUVix+QKV4BPcn86+rx2HVekj3sHVVOx4fPpjyBA7u0sjbiSflA6ngD3/U1BcaHLHA0 yjcE5wByBxnPp1ruV0Z7rUTkIdik/e4x09fp+nrU9xaQ21qQ/CAfcfHHXv8Aj7nj8K+Jq4GE YPm0PdjiWnvc8cuUWOQhSSPeoTVm+l8xz1AySAeeDz171UBwa/McU1CrynXHYtWqMuXGPl9f erTqGjHXgYUA5IPHX2pLOMMibjnqQM9OaJW3HvkDkEYwa+gwkFGloYN3kKo8+Mg4z2yOaoyL tbpirysJlMfKk1RcbTiuLEKz2HDdkTjJqrMMCrLkdqrTdOtfE5lZxkdsNzct4SCGyec9G/wp 0b4mbDKgPJPX8vU0sSyBCHAYf7VCbY344IPHOOeOa/QcOk5HnpXd2aNsEeNXIBbAG4AqAfyx 0rTt5MYOSQvJOcE8e/OT/T8s+1i3KoGAo7KB+ef8K0433cFevRsdOvHT2/nXvUY6GUk77F+A 7WJyBnjJ7HqDSa6n2jSJDuXkl2dRjLenr7+mSKbD8wPoMDnqf1q9cQOdKuV3fIVOQASCPoR0 +Und3rrrw56LRnFNS1PLomCSDOce1fQPwk1uC38MW8Fw6I6OwC5PQscHjnrnp618/TR7HI5G D3q9pWqXOnSDypWReeAxXB+vavmMqzGpltVuMbovF0JYinaDsz6b8Ta1bTeB9bgVleZ4hIpL YyOOBjjIBzj/ACO0/ZSIk8Pa7dfMfM1I5fGCSEAz27ueD059ePkQ+IL5rdladircFVORjqB+ v619O/sb6wJ9I1DTULNcGdpAi5wNyqMfXCk/gPSvucLmjzDnTVtP+CeDiaMqOHcpa6n11pEY kiEaxsy8gEjIJ6MM4/ziu60yMvZSnaTG0XQ9MDIBx9Vri/D0MVwiBSroM/JgHHtkDk8Dnpx7 V6BZQj+zpGGD+6bgA8Dn/J+gr5nHTs7eZ4cH1PJtLsv3zsu9RvY5A5B3Ent7fqfWuv0/Tvkf CYXCsWHY56/ngVV0zTQ7g7UKljhv4fTPP9cV2enWXlwBhgMNvKqBjgY7YPB/P16jbF4mxpJy 6E2jaMi26ExIVOW+Vc8Yzj0z1/Ot+PSVUBQ+OABnhRyF9vUn8Pbm3pll5UUTMhAHyknqehOe 5Ax/PscVqG1aGIklRnILA9vevkK2IlKWjON1JX3Plb4uaKbrxtejZtT7PCckDaCC2RzwPXFc fF4Y3KzBUIOPmGOgPBHy4x/nmvZPiBpqXfi27d0VWRVTaQCqHrwOuOenH6VkW+gbmVRGuTzh +e+OmPX+vSv0jCY908NCN+i/I9SNSTjZHFeKvDmPB8JMZRUtihDD+HuORz1/n6V8l3eis+ql lBBV8HPJXOOScHkHPtX3z400ZY/Cdz+7VXFscbiMAH369e3t2r4+Oig6nu2lFYgnJ+hAPAHP t69a+jySqsZTk30Z2QqPk1PZ/D/hkL4V0UFDzCp9R06gevIpZvDfl/KbdWBGckYJGMZ/Ln8q 9Q0Xw/5eg2UBVf3duFK4+Y5H0HX/AB54xTbnQWEjZiPPXag56+o+v6e1eKsz99q/V/mc/O77 nkQ0BRKwMTbFGTuzgZPGScfT/OapX2hMg/dqcN0yD7d/89a9Si0UGdmkiAYjhh0APbr09vX2 rJ1LRWSUHyxg88pkHofQe/616NPH3luEpt6tna/sz6KLGz1mfA2ySKuzbgkcA555H8vxFeje KLclMsGBGCR6Z25wcdQcVX+DWjDSPCny7QGc7g3Uc9x+AP4+9a/iSFSjEAAlSAduMds8DsD+ XXFfm2NxPt8yqVPP8jx5u8jyXXFaBTnAIJ54GPbgc9fyWvNfFzBY87UZgey8bcY574z/ACNe oa6oJbAxljnkjHpx/ntXlni5kRyNoyATk9M9c9OvH+cV9rlmskdUE+h5zqb5bgrhuA4bjGRk Yx2IrzLx5q8OmR7ZSvJyU7kAfT6dfQ8Zr0vWH8uN3KleDjH8WSODx9T/AIV8zfFPWDf3xRC4 WBmXOOOo6jtwB719DmuKeGoe6exhaLqtWNXT9dgLTSOwaWU/3sYH5DqcVk+IfEMMcDpkYZev Jyf89jmvOWnuIBt37R0wMVBLM8py7lj7mvzGvnNWcHGx7dPCOMk+bQbPL5khbGM02IZbpSEZ arFnETMCBkA4+lfKU4zq1k/M9XRKxrRr5NqQBtcDJ44zk4Iz/PNU51UDoAwPzL3J9RxgCtSe RRCiFFAOOB/yzBHU/n3xWZLLIWcsSwbILDoT3xX2DhyQSscybuSI4cnBzj8Kz5yWbJq8U2x7 BknB4B/OqE/Dn6/nXg1bWdgprUrsearTHIqwxJ6Cq8xJFfDZhJODO+G5vuA0Q24+qjimxsoQ gsAQQRk8flg5qOKXexLDKqMnHGO39adINsx6n6mv0fDT1scCTWjNe1YD5VxtU5VcH1z/AJHt +FasYw+ABkLlgo6CsSGRlcNnzFVsLkcpyARx7Ht6Vq2zLHGc4GOck9cc5/Tmvfou/QiStqjQ txub5flIyenbvn/PrWpCgNpOAql5FIyDjHC5/HqR/u1m24ITC8r13N3/AM/yrVifZbMCSmzG VGAw5Htkc4H4e2K9KetN3Mb3aseVTxFZSMHIJB4xyOtLbgCcZXPt1q2ZijMrR85OSVwOvp9a 6Hwp4Ok8RRSGKNiEwCVGevrx9Pz96+Ow+Bq4ys4UldnanfRuxzTXBdcfqBX07+xrprSalqd4 VykC+WQQOM5J/RT+lebRfBa/eMMPlTGRuYAHjtx/nIr2j9kzTH0jR9SlbaonudgUMcqEyDnj +83H4V9xl+V4jAxm6y6M8vMOX2LjF3PqvQLxoCN7blQ42kFgMAEDJ6D0HNei6deL/ZkquScR 8cYIJGP5mvJtMXy5EPyj72CoznhuTx9OpFei6RceTaznfzsKAHnPTr+p+orw8wpJ6nx7hy63 I9CgLugwecEYGS3T2x/+r8K7zToNwAUEMq4DKMkA9OnTkfr+NcfoI3FGKup3jDAcAADPTv0H 413OnRq1su7dhty7V7jjPb26+mfSvn8bPUib01N/TrdQmcbVC4AwPUdPWr8kahSGXK9fm5z+ VV9PRZIgxyzAEYz+mf8APWr0pIjGcKOmPTivm5PU4k7M8U8Tab5mt3b42pvxsxwSAM9jntx7 +1Gm6Uski/uiyE85wBtyvtnsf8iug1GyH9qXD/OrGTcpChgCAAD0P94//X61Ys9PXCjbtJYp yPu9O+fXHHsPavp/rLjTivL9DrhKytc5bxtY7PCN2WVUVbN3YnIycEZ9+R1/+vXyZY6TjUYB x5iuvBOckNnJ45z2/Cvsn4lQpH4Q1PcSjG2ZRwMj5O+0cY9/UdcmvmXSNI+0a7bJsaNTIrbm Dd26/T/69fZcOYhww9WT/rQ64Sbje59H6Royf2XYAbliNvGAecjCjgD6f0qG60p2ctznttBO 48nHTpjP+c47KzsEjtIxldpiXIzkcAZyfTJ5wOuO4NVr3TsEjYsg6EkAYPBPGOn+HtXw8cU3 N6mKqe9qzz2LTVjhkBGOmDn5jznqB1/TisXUtLByBjByoLdCOMnpz0H5V6G2n77d1CBG6nB6 /L93P+9XNalbFpdoOSCQuwfN19ea9mhiW5bmkpJ7M9E8FoLbwzZqOCyhmHGVOMgD0/8Ar1je Lb4RqyhGw3JYKSOPTjGeM/h+NdBp8TQaPaoQygRq2CWzyOe/p+tcR4slDhipUgbgdoXIOO3f pxj6dunhYaKqYiUn3PPspT3OC1W/lV1CtlOSMZGeemMc9evuB715f4wdUuXXfgEADGeu48D8 eP8AOK9B1BC8jgj1XGOR6cZ9fbt9K828XP510dpDfdxnGSMdR/8AWr9NyyCU1Y9GEUupwupE bGxkbwSQMZb6fh/P3r5w+KuktaSzSbB5e/g56ZPX68f5zX0PqpyjMAFU8DJHt7+h/pXm3j/R jrFj5aLvlQk5GNvTkEnpwPbtXvZphvrFDljufQYGfK+VnzpdGQt84x9OlVzXcXnge4jL4Q4X qGxweO4rndS0R7KUqy7DjOB0/XpX5Bi8qxNC7ktD6KKVtGZSqTV/TI/9Jh3Ehck+3+c1VYNb vggH36g1paYkckrkqAyqSFbOO358fzrlwkF7RdzOTsT3mQBGoBCkZUL1/Lp2/MfjnSpukyrb 93PPX8fetS8feCU2k5CqpGMkkH+g/OsiQDccZ2juRXvVndaMiLuiQHyoSyhST39KpTSM7Enr V2WT7OFYFnz6ms93BPSvl8VUSTuy6avqRkkmoJ+RU5PtUM+SOlfG43WlI7I7m+XjQ44GePlF MLYcrkHnj6/5/wA96ZbsJARtCADJNPkj2yjCnr2Ir9Botc2p5ySTsXLeUAouQSxDcdc56jI/ rWtZvvcM2QVJHI6/5/GsO1kMbJwVUfeww5554/IYrZtpGTAbKuAOSP8AIr3aMk9SWr3SNi1C hwoJAA5UD/PFalszSQyOAVV9xzggeu7IGOMY/wA84kBLkAgjHUKOP89q04JXSNgFKSAfN82Q w55IxjGOPqfevVm707s51G0jzmYbJXTOVDHrXrXwWciG5jUE5O4j26due1eTSowuXXktvIzn JJz616h8H5Wt1vcD72MDdgHDZ/EjBP61OStQxFx4uPPScT3K1uNkbEbSpUn5uOvOScHvVn4B XZk0CYhDtN1P8xbB4JYbj69MDPqPSuWmvPK0u/2chImxtfac46D+ftzUv7N1zKmj3iyBiWud wY85DD/65GPfvX3FSs6rlTt0Z4UqThTZ9I6bq/mTbWbOT1JHU4x29z+VegaXqBWyMbMQwTbn PTgHIH4f45ryLT5JI51KMMN/CVz36dPX0ru9GvHSPDOUyMbM7sE8kDsO/wCtfK47Dq2h5U6c dz0fRpzlWxuYYxg5PAx/d9D/AJNdvp8yoOgXaDliMZ9icf5xXm2iX4cRlVDEEZABXcAR90gc dPbrXa6ddgxJsUICThU7euD3x/OvhsbSbepyT5eh3tmyyRqiEAAgYI5zVtiz9RjPJHcc1jWF 0hiU4UqMn5SD14bt7n8q0jKhjLZBGOw4z+FfMSWpys46aBGvZ3K53OTlEHHA4HHoK0YodhAI DPnoowe/YDjvj6kZqpGVlnPyKFLNkjcGPzd/z/Tt204GYlSF27iDhWx1Kkj7vsff6ZrtqSdk jRWscr8T2ZPCV4FTcGAXIQ/Mc5xkjB4z614d4Q0gSeJ7NURgDKPmA7gkH1zjv0+tey/FyYf2 IkewbpHAIwcHIJ/ujHPcZz+FcP8ADKxEniKNiQQp3BWBzjcB2x0z/wDX5r6vLajoZfOXe51Q soo9zSNVjK4IVdwHy4xgnjp7e3FUrxAgZmUbeGwV6+v6cc+orS2hQO/bA/Ttz2rPv3KxMq5V sZz3A9fyOeo6V8bDWRxrVmJLaqLVVbkE4UMM7sEeo/z9a53UoiWY7AxZmxuA5IPIJweDj/Jr p7lz5WwnbuyMjHGOnG36flzXLanJvuANoI8z+Efd5PHT8c+v517uGbbLVnpc6i5uWitlTIVl VQ5QZO7bgjGP8ivPvEmp7RII+A/UA5bJJHpx9ffvjnpdWu1FvGof5QMnvzx1A4I6/l1rzrxD ceeGRCVRRhWz3474H+TXdl9BOV2XTgr6nJarqitcMPUjI6gcnnnJz3//AF1wvimRjeOCCXyR k9M9Py7fh9a6DUG2yyHIPlggEL93J+UdOPz/APr8f4luMzfNg4PGfunrx7/p0r9LwNJRkrHo RhFanK6nKQxXgqvQBieR26dO3frXIalMGUksHJJAHqc5Pb14roNSnZVL7iFwcSEDacHkdOen 41ymp3GC20556E47j9cY9Pwr1sRK+iZ6FKCfUwNQlw7MpDkDIYHkA+hxz/8AXrznxHKrXk7O FA4Rsnnsf6mu81OUoGDScruO4DngE4wfTivJdQ1KSa7nLnIZgMnnBHcd/X8z618Rmday5T2s PB7oosqhEDgjOcHuP8/1rR02IyLKWBwOM+/GPr34/nVFisBxjPP9f8/lWlpiKbcKyjJJKngg 4wcH8a+Rw0eapzW0O3RrUhupFaPIJkUndjPT3I7ms9cgMzAnb2I4/Gr9228u7M4wANo4xz68 /wCcVmXDjygF79Qe1Xi58sW0XCKtoVJ52dsn9KgaQkUkhINMDGvy/E4uc5tNs7oxstB4ckUy T7tAU5pJRxXnVZylTfMWlqasU3lsCUz9asMTMN64IHVT/nmq6SAEEAZHrzU8jb4U2/dTg44r 9Oov3lqefJK9yxbOAykANnoScANx19ulallIrhW2lup2qOvsO36+tY1t+8JjOSpB4BA54z1+ lalu5libdxuYglRyy45OPf8Az619BRdjKSSZsQMUQcHd64/z/kVdhYYP7zYQp9eeDwOOnQfj WPbzBMEYOBgsQefqcYx1/wA9dWKT5W9u+a9JyvEhWucTOm26myvyhjkAgcZ7V6D8M5xFFchC yAsGznOCPw57fnXAvHuu89S7FuAT3PI9RXbeAVCwTfvAxUgDbwMnt09x+vpU5e3GtoGIXNCx 6vbXAuLKRWyN6uDz1X/9X0rb+BJW28MW2GG1ppGbBxg5ABPbpxj/ACOVglZ7VmwVUI2enpkH p6fyrc+C0ph0W2jIXY+91ZuoG48Z6dD09x7ivucM+aTT7Hh101Dc9ijv1a4GCQCCMV1ukasC io25Sin5VGMEMehx/M9q8/KbcY6NglgOnb/P0rb0q4eGEF+h55GRjHHbj/OKnE0IygeW4Ret z1zQdQRWyAHUsAeMgEZ4PNdrY6tHH5ZLqfmx0OCOOufpXi+janKArk7ycBWOORj3Az/Fn6Gu x0/WSoRw5DZGNuO3Tivi8Zg7yucdSkn1PatI1MqiNy+RwQOewx+n6Ct171kQkuwAznjGOeTX kml60yIGU7QE6EAZ+nA9+PpW+uuZtJBu3jawZl6H8Mc/5/H46vgXzXRxOEk9Wb9jIQqFnAJA 4PpzxyPXHathHbOW3HjPHT+Qrl7DUg0QHCPwNoUgHpgY+nH4+9X2ulkI5BXPAPdcjjp7e/8A jy1aLbBwSejOS+K16ZpraNAGjUHPt2yOOOR1561X+FVkUu5H2suMgFQdpGQRjJ6Y+mccg1ke P7/7Rq87ZzsYqF68ZyQT/vbsfQ/StrwABHY5JYFuSCo7Z7Y96+glB08vUV1N2lGG56ezyLGq nYrMSoG7PbP48/1+lZF5ciSP5h97+6Qf1z9Bx/8AWEVzfb0cHCggqxGOnBz0x1yfxNc/qOq7 wg+6S3O/rxjr/nt718/Qw8mzktzaI0Lu7EMLbsAAEnnbxx37da5XULxfMRkOIwSTggehA+7j 09P6EvNTDxnaSrZOcLn36gc9P1Fcve6wrygBg5+8cc9R6/rX0OGwzR006a6sv65rErHcmASS MA5OccE/Lzgkn/Jrh/EWpPHaN/GXJzt4bqc4GM5561JrWtRFmLAsFBBBGR24P44rkdT1Frhn Z3AQEoFQ9CO/Tivq8FhOWzsdcKce5k3uoyhv7+SRlTggg9AMYxXO+JJuSejYIDnscjPGOvT8 6vz3cTysRwCcHIwB8uO/07VheKJQ9qxUmRwpOzbk4znJwMn/AD0r7KlBQadrG8YwbsjkNUuD LMzDbExJIJ6AfiPbqa5q/do4iQChJ54JI69q0L6XdGcKVCcgjOMdP5Y/z1wr24eQ9wSMD5Rn sMnHGfbvXm1531R61KMFpcydUugYJWUk7Vbc/OAMHk9q8svoUjiRgpDP84wMDB/yPavQNemB spucBlIUKMHHToRwef8APbgtWfMoVQVUKAqgcYz/APW/Svjcwlfc9mgrFFzl+pJHBJ+lbEIM MKKAAcDIyMEnj6H/APV+OPEhdwpO0dyR0HrWvcPiMAHZg85GeAf09fWvJoq0dGbytoihdSAu C0ahsDPzZ/P3qrJhYmJUfN90/jUj/upGUEHB64qK5bEUYHoetcOMqWgaRSVkjPmAqGp3ORUd fmOKjzVGzuTsCjJpkxxUyH5ajnOVrOvBRoNpjjuX0YYqza5Xcx4UfrVEEg9atQTMSAxyO+Rm vuqU+bRnHNaEsD7CSOc8bfX9K1IXxON5GFwWZex9Mfn+VZjjygODknn3q1byb5cqrEEg7WPU 898fX9a+joyUldGUoKaujWteYgSVDNlyBxtyMjgds/55rS8zcrlcKFAGcDcc9APx4/L1rIjm J2lASwcDKDbgZ5J+uG960IwGEmAAQuQuc56n+X5V6bk3HRmfLZ6nORgpMHEnypkb8/X6+hrt fAo2xzADgdRkEdPXp/nmuKRQ10S4KsxLBfTn/wCsa7XwhG6WEjxgqCQCSvU8ZA/n7ZFdGBal Mzr25bI7lb4Rwtj5VwWbPOMD9MY9a2/hPL9ns9OTeNxQtwoBHJJzx0x6emeK5W+m26dMGGUZ TlOg5HPauk+HTExaYj4URpkhx8qnGV/9C719ZhWvaaHlVklDU9IutUa3mZCV4BbBJJHPIBx7 GtjSdSdpFj4Yk5IBIAOcEnnpyK5fUAjyLKFwwJIbaM8t16D3rT04xpCLhQCw42gd8H29f596 95xjKLR5XJT3udlHqy20jRqDgHBA5HXkZx/+v0rf0jWzKQpYv5h+/k+vJ4Htj8vrXCyTCNYn bJbBYqcDHP5c8VoWF4sabtxDEbcnj0GT6Dj8a8mrhoyjsYShBN6s9Mtde/0nIlSNuQPUnA// AF//AFuD0Vl4kcxtyMgEsDkDnB6446f4njnyZL9o+Q2N/PXqMdP8+lbtjrWUBYncxZeAScfg PSvAr4BNXSMnTTPVrDxAAo+98uQFYAcYx6H/AD+t6LWw04IK45AUHt1449fp1ryaPWkhRvuo RlTwpGcE9c/4ZrRtNbxOyecykZJGPpxjHWvIqZdu0ifYpGjrmoLPfvI27JYYXb6jpwMdc+ld T4f1NbWyjGVIxuBCj1yCPy6+n6+U3mpCTUGVVJYkEqTtJ+UcDAz37/3a6Sz1bfbopKgDG5s5 z1z+GTz/ACror4S9KMehTp3R6Lda0CuGIdh69DzgE/r+f1Nc/fa2DLjA27hlmHRd3QcZPBP/ ANeuam1dGAJUqzDjvx+Xbjnnr2rIn1fEmAxKgD5kUkHPHp0zgYH5VzUcBboZ+zSWhuX2uEw7 WYM5IyGGQDwOB0zxn2y3WuZvNVyd0SjHzLvck8beBVG91LzmOcbScEIVzgZ2/wCe3PHSsma6 YTb9yonJIweSMnH5fyr6ChhFHobRpx6jNTvZIpMlvm5O7GBnlgPzrHvLjfaKNxV9uVBPJ6jp jPbpTLq7h89h8wUEcAdfbjp2/wD1mqF5egb5GPyAZIwAOvIPHHX6dPWvoqVLlS0Nk1F3Rk3l 1LHckqD8uSPl54zhQPoAaqarNJJYOF3EqhO3qOoPT61Vudbgec5Hy8jAA6d+2COP1qHVdTS9 sH2sHIA5IHHX264GK6qk4OOjNlG+yONvJHCMeQ5bA54BGMfgCeaxL24JkP7wHGScDOD7cZ6f 1q/qU5NxIzcjaOFH07j/AD1rA1CQeXsYk4J4zuwe3OOtfL4iVpM9SnBWTRia/O0tvGoIG5sl gATxj8Mc9Pr1xXFXP7y4ZfugYGOvQfzrqdcljVvlGFyMHjg9epHGSPTvXIzuWlLFsnOdw718 ljpuV7HrUYpLQdAgLKcj5jgbhxn3q5cMhCqXAwBgkHkep9aqWrZl+YnkEYJPPtxzT5ZVcuQ3 y8HYScn/ADk150OaMNWauN2RAAS7HB64weD+NVbsESsNwbHUgVbUbQzLksMZHv0rNlYk14OY 1rRZrTV5DGbFM69KCfakBx2r4idTmeux2WJAc1DOeKmA9RUM+OxqcZf2LCO5c79KntpDGw+X d7VVDY7U9W9hX1lKrG5hKN0XXkjlGSdjVJG3lsDjcCcblOPw4qmnzkDgZ7k9KtWx8vvhicdO n+f89q9enWlC1jnlGyNKCaQMF3MGAxgkEj2PGTwe1aYLFZOByOCwJzxj+R5H/wBesOxk8o4+ UqcMWJ6f5yPrxWhE+Y3DbZHCMSqk/MO2PX0//XXtqs3GxDjK/kZ8MLLtIBAZdwG7B64B/I12 fhkpDAy8kYxggcEE4P0/PqOK4lZFFy21vmLYySCCB745zXXaHPut1xjA3fKXOCeO/pjvxxmu vCTUZGNa6N28YCzBAGWO0leSTk8dOOmPxrtfAMhS7gAUnCZCngZ7fTHv7ehrzi+uc24UNuDt hSwGc88AY4+vr+Vd34OnCXEny8CM5yMEH15+g7f419Lh6t5vU8+rZr3kbmra07XD4KYHKlsH gDsO3sK3PCOo/bblUY5TBbaAWGMcYx26VxuojN0cqNzNkg5yckHHv6fhXR+FmSxMc1wfKJG0 MVOFOR78cGvaoVGpanBONOKsjp7/AFN47po0K7F4VQMY9uf94flWpoN2ZJMsCdgy3HfjHbrX O3ls4w4x8xG4nOBkfTHTA/HvWnpAS1tw8wYLIMr5mcY9Rxxx37k+1emnzpo5WoKxuTagTcMR 8wHAY/w4BOOa1dIv98rszxlFG4EgNx0PbFczdCZcYjJ3N2BBB9P/AK/5VpWMiwogYjDfKvJI Ix7+w6f/AKqipSi4GUlBbGzPfsz7znyzjap9T+HXAH6VesNTkCM6EgAcAnqc/rznj61zdyxh IUYKj72eCPX/AD7VJJqGyJYwVD9cLx/T6/5zXJKgpKyRDkk7I1p7wNMduMdOQeeg/Pp+daUO teVabQ56ZYlsBSCcgYH0z+Ncab8ibYWUsMDKnGP8tU8N0ZDEThVOCGONwHJ4/wA//XJ4ZSWp Ld9Wbx1djuBaQZ+8pHBPXJGMc4/xpLnVGktGdG3bQQxbjdxjn0PQfhWG8y+dtdiASASD6kHA yPrSS3glHlOp2Dg5XqcD9fahUFo0im0+hLLfyNyHJGOQBkHjsPy/yaq3+oMLRcNtXIGMEHvn g47e9VGaNLr5nRioyTt5zkAD69enf0wKpX9zsdYSAsYXBbJAB5HUnp9a7FCEdSoxi5GZdals c5JWNhnb68+g+tU9Svnazww2lsjBYkAA9PpnHBz0qnfTxvNIfO3Ix53Z2nPQ4xz2qjfXnnMI 1O1QMBsEFuMgAj6+/WsKtW+h1xpppMxLu5dZcn7xyDlev/1+CTVm3Z0tsKSPlAB5H6d+v61l 6hLb+eAjAAkttXGBkdTx/nAq1HfQJZnDkgLg7Vxxgcf5968qU1F6M6FyvZMwL26CGQbsbCcA D0PXpn/P54N1cMJSQwycnDcZPXjgdP8AGrWqzoJZAoDsSdxXg9fpxzx69OaxbqfCMR0JBHU8 fnXjV6yvqejTSS0M3WJQUCqxAB2luOM+ue1c5JgyNhSoycL1xWtqk6lirKAQpAOfvZP59qz4 n3pggkZwM/59K+UxVV301O+F4oZBwwztwOfmGR+NDHzHDNt5A6cD8fy/WneaikEDoR69B/n9 aWMERueW44x171zTqWhc0b0Ibl1jjCoRg9ffpVBzk1PPIZHJPWqrk54FfJY+s9jppxshMACh OTTc4pVY189GonJaGxJVebgVODmoZ+hoxtnRbQ47lgHApynJquLgep/KnC4Tvn8q7aeNop/G iXF9i1GeavWrAoQTn2OayBdKPWnreoPX8q9almWFtZzX3mM6UpGvEm3GRtIPQA5z1HIHr/n0 tLJGqfOdikEY24JHqB0HUjr68VkLrEWQWUlhnkKPwpw1qEIw2tyMDAxx6V6sc3wnWovvJUJr eJMEEbgkMAGHaum0iXbbiJsEgcbfxH9K4+TU4GHAccd1FXrTxDa24XIlBwQcKDx6df1rqw2c 4KDu6sfvInCbWkTsXmzNaxliVLgFW6Acn646ehrrfCeoFLm43vxjhicY5715avjC1E0bMJmR QQRtHqff6flW1pHxK03TnuGeK4O9TtVEH3u3O7j9f0r2aWe5end14p+pwVMPVkvhZ3GpeKHe 7AC5APGTgrzyOfeug8M60uouIZS4WPcQ2BnI46fX27/hXi8vjewknaQJcJls42g8c8cn3rZ8 P/E/SdIkZpIrttykEKinJx7txzXbS4hwCfvYiP3oxngajWkWeu6l4vbzhFEgZI+AW/hHHfHP +fpXReFtY/tiSVZiE8qIuWIHHTkY6Y+nevnx/idp3nl0S7ALbiSi5PXP8XvW/wCH/jP4e00T G5gv3MilcJDGwGevVvrXo0OJcvUrvExS9TmeArfynsF74se8nEseFXqoI3A8nqMeg/8Ar810 PhjWUvEllnAk8lC43c847YH1+vPpXzs/xj0V5nfyr85IOTGnpj+99a6DQP2gPDOlW1wktvqj vNwdsEZHQ9SXz3rthxPlmvNiofejnll9beMGer3mvyyznBypZscnIHHI6jBGPzNa2i6m9zDL KQF8odT6Ejg/kR65rwB/jjoO8NHb6gvcgohz7fe/zk1u6V+0X4X062ZDbaqXI6rbxjnPc+Zk /wD162hxRlN3fEw/8CHPA17aQZ6bc6oys2HPzE5HXJAJz9eK09JvTPbXMgJYMCGJydx9vf8A H/GvCT8d/D5nZ/I1HBPQQR5x/wB91vWX7SnhW2tTG1rq24qBuWCLg495Oe/+TVrifKG3fFQ+ 8j6hXt8LO+utWdbx9smSpKsir8pGTnpkY6cc+lX4tWkm0acsXLIoAdSACvQHvnvx/XJHitx8 ePD01y0og1L5sna0SHkkE87/AGq3B+0F4ahtWi+zamWbOSYUI9v+Wg/z61iuJcqu74qH/gSK eX139l/cdtcawXYkKVDZIxngenPT9f8ADQutdc6KZSc3EZ4+Q5CgdOnr/LtXjsvxl0FpSyRa gAc8GJBnP/A6ur8cfDg0yS0a21H5u6xoAOf9/wBK5nxFljv/ALVD70dCwFVNPkNifVWVh+8O CcjkgA57HsOpq2+ok6NJKciQcA5+bPJ6Y/w79a8zuviTpE05KJeeXnjdGm4/Ug1eb4qaE2l/ ZvKvt2Bz5SYBznP3q4XxBlzuvrMPvR0vBT6RZLd6k8lzngK5Jwp7/geuP6Vp6XeMLUkFgoUq MJnBK47defX+tcJP4206RmKpcAE9Ci/0P0q3B8QtLt4Aiw3L8gsCqgE/geP89K83+3Muvd4i P3mrwlS1lE0r11V3wwG48YAXGf8AJ/8Ar5rPmlIXfwjPhQVwAfTOR9PXr+FZNz4wtJsbRcLj ABwOnfv/AJxVN/Els+3KSHk8/wB3P48/pXnVc8wLb5a0fvOmNCoug+7Uy3JZcBTxkduKa7iJ MsTzjjPNUJNYjL7lBz6Ef596hXUlQ8Zwe3PNeDWzbCzl/FR0eyqS3ReKMnG3nPBNOu8BVzyx 7jiqi6uij+PPrx/hUEl9G7E/P+NRUzTCyX8RfeCpTb1RJMhU4Iwfeqz8GlN0h9ajaZG9a+ex mLw9XWE1951RjJbjuKenSoPMQetOE6gd682liKcXeUkW4skfgVBKaUzA+tRs+41x4vEQqL3W VGLTP3PrO1/xHpXhXTJdR1nUbXSrCIZe5vJlijX6kkCtGvzy+MHhfxP45+L/AIjvPiGLn7HY 3rwaRpbMy2wtgf3cqgEg7lKkkH7xYHGNo+cxeLp4Kk61XZdj6jh/IcXxJmEMuwVueV3duySW 7e7+5Nn01rf7avwj0a6e2TxI+qTr/DptlNOp9gwXafz71QX9uD4eOoZbLxKynkEaPJg/rXiP w78M+FJ9ct7PXtfsfA2gAFrjU5LVnSNR2CoOp7ZwPUivboNR/ZS06IRDx5f6qwxmefXILfPA zhFiOBnPBJPvXi4XM8Vjk54eiuVaXcv+Afped8EZFwtUhh84zGftZK/LClfS9r3crPZ+fkL/ AMNvfD3/AJ8fE3/gnk/xqew/bQ8Capf21nbad4mkubiRYYk/sh13OxAAySAOSOTXzp4v8beH PFXxU1iz+H6PJ4J05FiS8u5nmmnn6MVfCqyZBwQo4K9etdJ8N/B2qfEHx5ofhzRjImo6ldJb xyxhj5QJ+eQ7edqLuZiOgUmuKvnmIw1f6vOknLTZ9/kfSZV4X5PnOV/2th8dONK0nedNLSN7 v4tlZ6+R9vQyGaGOQo0ZdQ2x8blyOhx3rz/4t/Hjwn8FU0z/AISO4uftGpSFLa1s4DNLJjqQ o7AkD6sPWvXPF17YQTw6dpv7nRNIgWztN7s2I0GN7M3JJxkk89zX5rePfGMnxk+OOs+JPNd9 E0UnTdLjO9VJH+sfa2RknIJXGdq+lfS4zFLB4eVea26efY/FuHsiqcRZvSyzDSdpPWVtorVy av26X30ufR//AA298Pf+fHxN/wCCeT/Gj/ht74e/8+Pib/wTyf418/2t5pthdRXGsRajNpcb hrmPSIUlu3jzyIldlUse2TgdecYPUv8AEz4Eh22+BvjQVzwSdOBI+myvncNnOJxUXKFOKt3l Y/Ys68N8myKrCjicXWk5K/uUXNWvbVp2Xoer/wDDb3w9/wCfHxN/4J5P8a9i8D+MbXx94atN csbS9tLO6G6Fb+HyZGXs23JwD2zXzr8Kl+DPxa8VDQ7Dwr8VtLdYHuJLvVLnT4oURSB1ERJJ LKAACec9Aa+q/DmjaH8PvBcnhjw6mqm3muzdXFxrFxHNM2FCrGCsabUG3IHqT617eFxGKrS/ eQio91K5+ZZ9lOR5dRtgsTVlWuvdqUnDTvdv9NRtct8Rfid4b+FPh6TWfE2pR6dZrkIG5klb +6ijlj7CuP8Aj5+0X4f+BOiBrof2n4guRiw0aFsSTt0BY4O1R3P5AnAr4svY/EnxW8St4s+I V213eM5az0dT/o1kmcqoTpkZ9z3JJ6a43HUcBT56r16Lqzh4Z4WzHirF/VsDH3V8U38MV5vv 2S1fpdr6oi/bj+HU8ayR2niSRGGQy6RIQR7HNejfCr41eHvjDDfyaHHqEH2JlWRNRtTbs24H lQTkgY5PuK+Tte8I6r4U0Lw5q2rWb6dY+IWnXSmnGw3QhVC7Ip5K4kXB6HBx0rq/gH4yg8Ef FTQ72/vJbLR5pfsuotEhctbP8rrgAnkegz6V8zDiGoqsI1qXKpW69H12P2zE+EGElgq9fLsf 7WpSUlZRTTnFXcdG2n0tq1daH2JRUt3aTWF3NbXEZinhdo5I26qwOCPzrnvG/i2x8CeE9V1/ UpfKstPt3uJGAycKCeB3PsK+2P5jPOviJ+1V4E+GfjGfwvqUuo3ms28KTTwabZNceSGGQGx0 OCp+jL61Z+G/7Svhf4qeJV0TQ9P177V5TTPLd6c0MUSLjLMzH1KgYycsK+JfA02o+JLrWvGW tOz6v4iumu5AzMwijydiLu5CgcAZI2hB2rvfDvxUuvhHr1jrlhoD+J9ThkV7PTWnaK3MykMj z7esakZKnAY4BIzXydTPeXGfVoRTina97ev3H9AYTws9pw6s5xNeUarhzqChzN3+FLVNuStp 3dj7xnnitYXmmkSKJAWeSRgqqB1JJ6CvEPEX7Z/ww0DXJNKh1S7125iGZG0W0a6jU56bxwfw zXyv401j4hfGu7ubz4ieLrmeC6l859G0s+Ragk5IIHXn1z9a90+EX7FPijVNNt7mbTrXwD4a cBzqGsAxPKucZSL/AFkjHqMgAj+KumrnMJS9lg4OpLy2+/8ApeZ4uB8NsRQoLHcR4iODo/3m nN+Sjffyvzf3T0Pwn+1H4c8dXv2XQvDvizUZR94po7qif7zsQq/iat/Ev9prwd8JtesdE19N UXV7y1F4tnZ2TTukZZlBJU7c5RuATjHPUZ9J8C/DHwH8J4s6ZBeeMNUUYW9144tIzjkx2oO0 5POZNxFUfFfwy8FfEbWNQ1TxPo4GqXcKQtqmkwwW92qqylUDmNgFwuMY6V60J4l0XKcEp9Ff 9bf5nwGKw2S08xjRw+JnLD3Sc3CzS6tR5rv5pPy7+Of8NvfD3/nx8Tf+CeT/ABo/4be+Hv8A z4+Jv/BPJ/jXO/tUeDPhv8DvhdNq2hnxLdeJ7u5itNLtdQu4JYZZGYF96xwK2BGshGCPmCjv Xi9mZzaQ/ahGLnYvmiHOzfjnbnnGema+exmb4vA8vtqS1297/gH67w54fcP8Uur/AGbj6j9n a96SS1vbr5M+iv8Aht74e/8APj4m/wDBPJ/jR/w298Pf+fHxN/4J5P8AGrnwV/Zo0LxN8PB4 r8bTa1aR6hc+TpVppjJA8sSLmWZmkicMmWRV245D9ccdqv7MXwqRgyzeMgQcgjUbTj/yWrso YzMMRTjVjRVn3l/wD57M+HOEMpxlTA18yqOdN2dqSav1V79Nn5naaPqQ1jS7a9FvPaC4QSCG 5ULIgPQMASAfxrmPGvxm8DfDpzH4j8U6ZpVwBu+zTXAMxHtGMsfyr51/aS/aL1KeWx+C3wiu b3RtE0KNhq3iG7uRPdSSudzBZFCjPzYyvPIA2hTXj3gn4N22p67bWWn6ZP4l8Q38oVXuV+0T zyHuM9PXPYck1rjM3pYK0Jq9R/ZWtvn/AF6HBw94fY/iR1MThpqGFi2lVmuXmS6qN3031stu a6PpG+/bv+HYD/2PZeIfERU4B0/TGCt+Llf1FVI/259Fdlz4A8Yqpxkm1h4H/f2vUvCP7Ivh nwTaw/8ACc63e6hraqvmaL4ddYILfqTHLOVJc8gHYBggjJ4NdJN8GvhNKm0eBJcnrM+t3RkP Pru2+33aca2ZVY80aUY+Um7/AIIivlnBmAqOhVx1as1o5U6cVH5c8rteaun0PMNH/bG+HuoT JFfnWfD7N/HqmlypGv1dQyj6k4r2PRNd07xJpkGo6VfW+pWE6horm1kEkbj1DDivjf45aToH gf4uyeF9CivYrd9Lj1NVvJVlMe6WRCgYKuQNikZGeTnpk7HwA8a/8Id46s7OQSnS9UlW2uIo Bkh2OEkVSwUkMRkntkV58c7nQxH1bGU+V907rX9D62p4Y4fM8o/tnhzFurGzfJOPLJ23V7/E uzVn3Pr6vM/ix+0P4P8Ag1qWnadr895JqN+hlhtLC2M8hQEjcQOxII/A16drEZ0Ga9jvWSI2 bOkxLDapUkNz07V+bc/i+4+MXxU8UePbiV30952sNHibeFS1QgBgjZ2lgEJ2kDcZOOa93HYu OCoSrS1tsu7Py7hXh+rxPm1LLab5VK7lK1+WK1b/AEXm0fUP/Db3w9/58fE3/gnk/wAaP+G3 vh7/AM+Pib/wTyf414/8OLfwtd+NtKi8aeJrTwn4ZMwa+v7uby8xL8zxocE+YyqQvB5I4r03 xH4+/ZN0CzMsuuavqG44WHT9Y+0ux+i25x+OK8fB5ljcdTdSlSVttX/wD9G4i4N4a4YxUcHj sfUc2ua0aadk3ZX95b2On0v9sf4XahNHFcave6Q8nT+09NuIVH1cptH5167oXiDTPFGlwalp F/banp86horm0lWSNx7EHFfn1pniay8V3Go3ulaXqOl6KbllsE1V1a4eH+FnKqq56jgY4r6I /Y50jWNS8b6pZafahfDotJbvVrojEdsVjbynB3Ab3kCR45JUnj5crnQzyUsUsLWp2d7XTv8A 0vyOnNfC+jQySWfZfjeamoc9qkORtere/ZW1dknqj0n4p/H7wP8AB22LeI9bhhvCMx6fb/vb mT6RjkD3OB718l/Ej9onxf8AHOe3g0jwxY+G/DcEheK81iLzb2QHGSuCNgOBlRwcDLHAr61u P2Z/hbrmr6nq9/owsNZvZmnfUbW1S5maRiS7fvX2qcnsD17YqKL9lP4aeejTeIfFbx7gXWO2 tVJGeQDkgH8D9K78y+uVYujh6aae7bX5HyfBj4cwVeOY5vjalOpB3jGnGSfq5ro9rKz8z5N0 TQ9S8R38GnaXYXOq6hNxHa2UDSySHHO1FBJrsPjN+z8nwD+FF14v8eXGlaXrck0cGn+F4kS4 vLqRmwRI6nZFhcvyWOAeARivtvQbnSfh/o50fwNo8XhjT2BEs8TeZeXPOcyzn5j9AQB0HFcX 4t+GXhX4kXmnv4rsDqMdnL5sRYs/lP8A3xHvVWb3PqfWvKwfD0KUeavLmfZNpffv+R99xD4v 4nH1FQyqkqVNP45RU527qLvFadPefmj4S0uJY7GFhaJYvIqvJboB8jEDIJHBI6Z9q+vP2RvA cXhzwlq/xDuxE9/eiTR9HRhG5jzj7TMARuRggMYYdpj61Zb9lL4bsxJ8R+KMk54tLYD/ANCr 13Vbuwj0/SNG0WCa00HR7VbSygmfcwUdWbk/MT157CufK8mrUsT7fEqyWq1vr/wD1uOvEjLc fkn9l5LUcpVLKbcXG0Vv0SvJ6aK1r7aHzj+2Z8V3+HvwtOj6bI3/AAkfieT+zbGONlDhTjzH wwIK4Kof+uoNfMPhjQIfDOhWmnQcrCgDNjG9u7EZ6k8193+KPg/4N+Ies2t/4lspJbu1hkit r2MGV7XcCC0cbOE3ZxyR2Gc4Arnv+GUPhv8A9DH4p/8AAW2/+KrvzvB4vG8kKCvFavW2v9fm fK+GHEXD3DKxGKzSo41p2jH3W7Q3dmk93vfsrdTwP4e+Ov2f/DGh3ifErU9WuvFButsem2EN ykVvbhFKu0iQsGZix4BIAUZwSRXR/wDC5f2Rf+eOv/8Af29/+Rq9Z/4ZQ+G//Qx+Kf8AwFtv /iqP+GUPhv8A9DH4p/8AAW2/+KrloYGrSpxhLBxk11clr+B7uZ8UYHH42riqXEdalGTbUI0Z 2iuiXvK9lu7K71saPwZ0j4M6w2j+OvCHhfV7lbK7W5sJ9RvriJDNEwZJNjxIzqGAP90lSORk V5b+0j+19H4L1Ofwz4PC+JPH1y5EpfLw2RbJLyN0Z++3PHVjjAP0FoHgrw14K+Hl/wCFtLvN X1ZL+ZWlutUCRyQwgf6qFozujUnBO0jPPrXCJ+yr8Jls2Fnb33h+6mbzLiXTbSOR5D6GSWUk jPPQV78KcsPh28PRUZv7N1a/qfkuJxlDOM4hDOMxnVw8Xb2jjJy5d9Iu7Tb06231PhjQfCdz /as3iDxHfS654nuiXmvbhy4Qn+FM9AP84r0cfDzx2v2a50vw7fxTo6yxy3eiy3UJA5GYyNrg 8cHII6gg19lfDX4P/D34S6tJrunRal4k1yMD7C2tRRrBaNzmQIjHe3Ixnpiu1uPGev3Mzyya 1fl3OTtuXUZ+gOB+FfPU8lxOKn9YxlS077WT/wCB8j9hxfiZkmR4ZZRw7g+bD8tnLmlTbbWr TS5795Np320SZ8B/FGz+MXxB1fQvEHxH1O+1G00HzRaq/h82MUIkTYVBVVUDhePauejkaGRX Q7XUhgfQiv0F8TTXHjLQrvRtavLzUNLu1Cz20t1JtkAYMAcN6gH8K82n/Zb+HN9M9w+r+IbB pTuNraW8LxRE/wAKln3EfWozPJ8ZiJxqRnzu1ukbfodPBPiPw5lOHq4OrhnhYOXMrOdVSbST ve7Tsl5fPfv9F18eMPC3h/xH58l4+rafDcXF1JHs867C7LogYHAuFmHAxxxxivkX9tzx3/wl Gu6H8LtPnJDuuoawEKkLEuGRGBGRztYEHvX2BoXh3R/BngvS/D2lalquqRWEkvkyalFFH5MT tv8ALUR9f3jSNlufnx0AA4jVP2ffh/4q1LU9T1OG907V751aXUrJBcTyAZ+XMr4RRngKPpjF fUSWJ+p2iv3vL3627n4VSeTf6x89WT+pe1buk7+zu2laye1k7LTW3Q+MIIEtoI4YlCRxqEVR 0AAwBX0vqX7GV1oPg3z9S8TRReMZIEmTQYrXfHCTyY5Z9+A2P7oIBHUg5HoXgf8AZ6+G/gfx dpPiEah4i1mXS51u4bG6hgjillT5ow7KxO0OFJGDkDHeu51LUJtV1C4vLhzJPO5d2Pcmvl8u yD4pY5a9Ff8AHQ/cuMPFmzoUuGKlorWbcN7PSCUlotHe3dJNanwQj614C8SxSo1zo2t6dMsk cikpJE6nIIP+QR6g19T/AA4+P6/FGZYdcuWTxGwwxlcsJ8d0J6f7vbtXQ+Mfhh4a+IscceuQ SwyphU1GywLiJc5IAPyuDzw3TOQRznnrX9lr4eWVzHPB4n8VxTRMHR1tbYFSOh+9WuFwGPyy u/q/v030ul/T/B/lw55xZwrxxlUHmzeHxkFpJRckn6pO8G+js09u79Hoq1fQ6fAlulhcXNwF jCyNcwiMlhxnh2znvz1/SjcQJdW8sMm7y5FKNtYqcEYOCMEH3FfZp3R/NckoyaTv59/v1PgD 43+M0+M/x/mlgl+0eHfCKG1tcFWR7okGRwcBhyE4OcGP3rpfhj4GufiV4/0Lw1aBvM1G5WN2 VlUpGMtI4LED5UVm59K+l2/Zd+GN1aoI21Tw/IXeSWPS4I5BK7HJZnlcsx/Lr3rtfhX8NvB/ wUuNY1Pw7ea3qOt39obGKe/WKJLeNmDOQEJyx2oOemD618XjssxWPxynUX7tWW/T/Nn9L8Mc cZDwrwtLDYSTeMkpSacXrN6LXa0Vbrqk9mzqPEhsLa6t9K0iCO30fSYFsLSOJFVSiZy2F4yz FmyPWsmiivtIxUUktkfzVUqTrTlUqO8m7tvq3uz4N8TfCPUvhZ4l177db7odT1Ke8hv0j2pO rtvAzk8ruIxnPGcc16L+zV8T9D+Enj2+1zXN8aNpc9taXKW3nm3uGZNsm3BI+UONwBI3ema+ pdR06y1nT59P1Oyg1HT7gYltblSUf0OQQVIzwykMOxFefal+zD8OtVaSS3u/EGgSuOEikivI UOOysEfHsXY+9fF4vKcTDG/XMPaWt7P+tux/SuQeIGSYjhv/AFczjmo+44c8FdNd9LtS7qzT 1d9bJj/tOfCtkeV/H2iAgncHuwHznnKn5s/hXmnxE/bp8G6RBNY+CYrnxrrzZSKO0gdbZGxw zSMBkf7ufqK6u4/Yj8HX7mSbx4zkkkCfwyrMPqftBrd0f9kX4eaXCseoeK9Z1BAQdmk6Rb2P rxuZ3Pp2/wDre19ax8lZYaz85K34an5qsh4Upz5qmdc0O0aFRSa+eif3nxPotnrmseJNW8X+ K7pbrxJqxHmCLhII+MRqOmBgD8OpJJr63/Zc+AE93qFp8QfGVk1n4TscT2EFyMPqk38AjTqU BwS3A6YJ5x694S+HHw3+Hj28+h+Dk1LU4eV1LxJObxw2chhEAsQI7HZniug1jXb/AMQXZudR upLqbGAXPCj0A6AewrzaGT1a2I+t46Sb3stvL7u34n2maeI2By3J/wCweFaMoU7NOpP4tfia SvrL+ZtW6RWlvmb9vD4s3Fn4OfwxYyhfEXjG4aJo4doK27MTMdrAgqRuTrkZFfO2haPBoGkW mn24Ait0CAgYyepP4nJ/GvubxF8F/BPjzW21TxDaTDURAYYdQhBmlgBxxGjuEXp1x17GsrTf 2WPhhaajaz3Ws+J762ilR5bVoIEEyAgshZXyARkZHIzxTzvBYzHShCilyLz6/wDAI8M+JeHe F6GIxOYzarzdlaLfuLWya01e97bL1OI8Mfsb6d4i8C6BrfiTxeml3Gr24vYdOh0lb3y4WGY3 ZvPTBZTnG3jkV4V4y+Gcvw71+SyvLCBGUkwXUUICzLn7ynH5jqPyz+gnifX5PEusz3zqY0bC xRZyI0HCqPYVyXirwfo/jbSn07WrT7TbnJR0bZJC2CA6N2YZ75B7gjijEZBSeH5KDtNdbuz9 V0v5BlHi1j4Zu6+bRVTDyb91RjzQV9HGSScuVfzN37pnzh8BNZ+Hp1YWHjzw7/bNw8i/YLu6 1GWG3jx0idEIBBPOScc4PFfXMmtmDRk0XTLCx0DRUbf/AGbpNusELN/eYDlj7sTXkK/so/Dg qM+IvFIPcC1tj/7NXplhoek+HfD9jp+n6nqWpvbDy/O1GCNGZB93JVzkjp0HGO4JO+T4WvhY uFekl2krX9H1PL8Rc8yrPqscVlWOqTT3pS51FP8AmhfRea76rsFFFFfSn4mFFFFABRRRQAUU UUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFA BRRRQAUUUUAFFFFAH//Z --------------B968A1C6908CCE27E38727BE-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:13:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09531 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:13:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09527 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:13:30 +0200 Received: from sand6.global.net.uk (sand6.global.net.uk [195.147.246.105]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800E1LJ6HLG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:13:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p1ds03a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.227.30] helo=rentbert) by sand6.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12hhC0-0006di-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:14:04 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:09:21 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: stupid idea..maybe=) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002901bfa98b$80ee1c60$87bdfea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001D_01BFA993.82F76040" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BFA993.82F76040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I could be being very stupid but here goes anyway=3D) Would it not be possible to make a hardware FPU/FP Emulator and then = modify the FP Emulator(software) which exists already so that it can use this FP EMU hardware if it is = available. this might help or it may just be a silly idea i dont know, tell me what u think! Perhapes it could be an hardware add-on that u only use when u need = better FP calc times etc. maybe even hot swapable=3D) -Raphael P.S. has any one in wales, uk. built one of these because i would love to = take alook at one=3D) and have not got the parts i need to build it yet myself=3D( ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BFA993.82F76040 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I could be being very stupid but here goes=20 anyway=3D)
 
Would it not be possible to make a hardware FPU/FP = Emulator=20 and then modify the FP Emulator(software)
which exists already so that it can use this FP EMU = hardware=20 if it is available. this might help or it may just
be a silly idea i dont know, tell me what u=20 think!
 
Perhapes it could be an hardware add-on that u only = use when u=20 need better FP calc times etc. maybe even hot
swapable=3D)
 
-Raphael
 
P.S.
 
has any one in wales, uk. built one of these because = i would=20 love to take alook at one=3D) and have not got the
parts i need to build it yet=20 myself=3D(
------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BFA993.82F76040-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:16:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09562 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:16:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09558 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:16:49 +0200 Received: from falcon.ugwarehouse.org (falcon.ugwarehouse.org [216.254.59.186]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800E2FJBYLG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:16:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from proteus (helo=localhost) by falcon.ugwarehouse.org with local-smtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12hhDy-0005ME-00; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:16:06 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:16:06 -0700 (PDT) From: The Proteus Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: To: Nicholas FitzRoy-Dale Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Tux carrying a large baseball bat? Like the Brute! KMFMS logo? :-) That would be a good logo, if we could license it from the guy that runs that site.... www.kmfms.com The Proteus - - - T h e U n d e r g r o u n d W a r e h o u s e - - - - - - Subversive - Tools - For - A - Chaotic - Planet - - - - h t t p : / / w w w . u g w a r e h o u s e . o r g / - ------- On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Nicholas FitzRoy-Dale wrote: > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > > > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be based > > on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - like > > carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next to > > something) for the small footprint. > > Tux carrying a large baseball bat? Perhaps this is a too heavy-handed > approach to acronym overloading. :) > > -- > > Nicholas (NEW: wzdd@lardcave.net, DEFUNCT: wzdd@tig.com.au) > http://www.lardcave.net > > Same age I see? Mail me no later than Friday. > - Friendsnoop > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:28:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09598 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:28:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09594 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:28:34 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT800E64JVHLG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:28:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:23:36 +1000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:23:35 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Embedded Processor Watch: Issue #95 (fwd) X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, "utility account for group.pleb " , sa1100-linux@dec.pa.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk An interesting note on an ARM clone (compatible) processor. They were offering free samples/docs and support for developing boards using their chip a while ago but never got back to me. Enjoy, Adam ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:01:31 -0500 From: halfhill@mdr.cahners.com To: Embedded Processor Watch Subject: Embedded Processor Watch: Issue #95 Embedded Processor Watch ----------------------------------------------------------------- Issue #95 Embedded Processor Watch April 18, 2000 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Senior Editor: Tom R. Halfhill, mailto:halfhill@mdr.cahners.com To unsubscribe, mailto:remove-embedded@list.MDRonline.com To subscribe, mailto:join-embedded@list.MDRonline.com In This Issue: *** ARM Wrestles picoTurbo in Court *** QED's RM7000A Gets Faster, Cooler *** Tidbits: Motorola Licenses M-Core to Japanese *** Tidbits: Patriot Scientific Design Win -- Caliper Pig *** Search Microprocessor Report Online! *** Industry Resources: Embedded Processor Forum June 12-16 *** Industry Resources: Microprocessor Forum Call for Proposals *** About Embedded Processor Watch and Microprocessor Watch *** ARM Wrestles picoTurbo in Court By Tom R. Halfhill PicoTurbo, a two-year-old startup based in Milpitas, Calif., has a new twist on ARM: a family of embedded-processor cores that's compatible with the ARM architecture. Indeed, the cores are apparently too compatible for ARM, which has filed a patent-infringement lawsuit against picoTurbo in U.S. District Court in San Jose. ARM alleges that picoTurbo infringes three of ARM's U.S. patents. One patent describes shadow registers that temporarily store the contents of data registers during exception processing. The other two patents are related to ARM's Thumb instructions -- a subset of the normal 32-bit instruction set that uses 16-bit instruction words for greater code density. PicoTurbo maintains that its cores do not infringe on ARM's patents, because they either don't perform the patented functions or perform similar functions in different ways, with an independently designed "clean room" microarchitecture. PicoTurbo's pT-100, pT-110, and pT-120 cores are based on a similar design with several variations. Like the ARM9, they are 32-bit uniscalar RISC processors with five-stage pipelines and fully static cores. To address different segments of the market, picoTurbo removed some elements from the pT-110 to produce the lower-end pT-100, and it added some features to produce the higher-end pT-120. But even the pT-100 retains a 32-bit Wallace-tree multiplier, a separate Thumb decoder, a 32-bit barrel shifter, and power-management logic. It's easy to see why ARM is giving picoTurbo the cold shoulder. Millions of dollars are at stake for both companies. ARM feels compelled to defend its hard-won market share against an invader that is undercutting its license fees and royalties. PicoTurbo stands to gain a lucrative chunk of the market by riding the coattails of the popular ARM architecture. We don't expect this case to be settled anytime soon. (The full version of this article is available online to Microprocessor Report subscribers at http://www.MDRonline.com/mpr/h/2000/0417/141601.html). -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 01:38:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09665 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:38:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09661 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:38:42 +0200 Received: from dgesmtp01.wcom.com (dgesmtp01.wcom.com [199.249.16.16]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800EMBKCH8Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:38:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from pmismtp03.wcomnet.com ([166.38.62.38]) by firewall.mcit.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #42260) with ESMTP id <0FT8007J0JQ0WD@firewall.mcit.com> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:25:12 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pmismtp03.wcomnet.com by pmismtp03.wcomnet.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #42258) with ESMTP id <0FT800M01JPH1K@pmismtp03.wcomnet.com>; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:24:53 +0000 (GMT) Received: from omzmta02.mcit.com ([166.37.214.8]) by pmismtp03.wcomnet.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #42258) with ESMTP id <0FT800IDRJPGET@pmismtp03.wcomnet.com>; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:24:52 +0000 (GMT) Received: from rccz741 ([166.35.150.207]) by omzmta02.mcit.com (InterMail v03.02.05 118 120) with SMTP id <20000418232511.CGPH22622@[166.35.150.207]>; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:25:11 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:23:00 -0500 From: "Ralph Green, Jr." Subject: Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] In-reply-to: <00041712122201.11476@localhost.localdomain> X-Sender: Ralph.Green@pop.mcit.com To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3.0.5.32.20000418182300.00a8b7e0@pop.mcit.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> <000701bfa884$1a476820$0100007f@localdomain> <38FB3B98.81A52E5F@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Howdy, I am quite interested, and I look forward to programming on one, but I am not capable of putting one together. If you are taking names for assembled boards, put me down for one. Good day, Ralph Green, Jr. At 11:14 AM 4/17/00 -0700, Doug Moreen wrote: >Michael and other people in the US (and Canada) who want inexpensive LART parts; >so far I count eight people who are interested -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 02:35:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA09883 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:35:46 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA09879 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:35:45 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA24054; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:35:44 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004190035.CAA24054@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: Feature Request To: nicolai@reipur.com (Nicolai Mahncke) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:35:43 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: <000101bfa96e$ec01c960$351a10ac@reipur.com> from "Nicolai Mahncke" at Apr 18, 2000 09:47:23 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > If you and/or the list can agree on some rought specs on a charger I will try > and do a design for it. Ok, here are my thoughts on this: a module with the same footprint as the other boards, i.e. 10x7cm, containing the battery and the charger (both are linked by the battery requirements, so it doesn't make much sense to keep them apart). Currently, the mainboard isn't designed to have a power module stacked on it, and it will likely be between the KSB and a memory expansion board. This means that the connection to the mainboard has to be in the form of wires outside the stack of pcb's (beware of stack overflows :) On the software side: it would be nice to have at least an indication of the battery status, if not complete control over the charging process. I think we can do without APM/ACPI, which is a disaster in itself -- I've got a ThinkPad 600X, that should say enough. > Marc is right about all the different battery types and charging schemes but > in real life they narrow down to a few if you want many cycles and fast > charging. ...and it also depends on the type of application. I can imagine situations where the self-discharge of a NiCd cell would be more than the current drain by the LART: a datalogger/controller in a hot location for example. > Even though Li-Ion are difficult to get (because of the mandatory protection > circuit) I recomend using them for their light weight, high capacity, low > self-discharge, easy charger (just need a current limited, very accurate > voltage) and the fact that you only need two cells to do the job. Agreed. I haven't found anything for sale but cellphone and laptop batteries, and the pages http://www.sanyobatteries.net/Lithium-ion.html http://www.gpbatteries.com/lithium.htm look a bit sad... Any other links? There are enough charge controllers and protection chips available, but without actual cells they're not much use. > What recharge input did you have in mind? Mains, wall-adapter, car, solar > panel, another battery? Well, ideally it should work on the same range of supply voltages the mainboard accepts, but it may be too much to have step-up convertor on the module. Using a linear regulator could defeat the advantage of low-power LART altogether, so it should most likely be a switching charger. Let's say anything over 5V, ac as well as dc, should be acceptable? Maybe you need a current limiter if you also want to be able to use solar cells, to get them to operate at max power. North Pole, here we come! (during the 6-month day, at least :) -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 02:50:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA09946 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:50:08 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA09942 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:50:07 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA24123; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:50:03 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004190050.CAA24123@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: t.sullivan@envmtl.com (T Sullivan) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:50:03 +0200 (MEST) Cc: cchen@nougat.org (Secret Asian Man), lart@lart.tudelft.nl (Linux Advanced Radio Terminal) In-Reply-To: <38FCE717.8183CC46@envmtl.com> from "T Sullivan" at Apr 18, 2000 06:52:07 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Ok, a branding logo is certainly one aspect of packaging - wasn't quite all > that I had in mind but I'll go with the flow :-) Consequently, I'll stick my > neck out to start the ball rolling - I threw this to JD a little while ago to > possibly depict a LARTcluster project and I'll given it another wack here, > doesn't quite capture all that is LART but what the hell.. Ummm... nice picture of a nuclear reactor, but we are planning to generate as little heat as possible -- in the processor that is, the person being LARTed should experience a considerable increase in temperature :) Suggestions are welcome though. -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 03:06:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA10006 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 03:06:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA10002 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 03:06:17 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800GL4OEF25@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 03:06:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA02646; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:05:52 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:05:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <38FCB799.BF265291@inter.nl.net> To: Jurgen Kramer Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk please put me down for at least 1 lart+ksb+ethernet(4 port would be nice) price pending. lower cost = more units. I also have a few interested friends. any one interested in a group purchase of lcd displays? Eric On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > Fully assembled > > efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > > bare boards or assembled units? > > > > -eric > > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > > > >combo. > > > > > > Where can we sign up for one board or more? > > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > > Jurgen > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 04:12:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA10217 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:12:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA10213 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:12:40 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800H52RH2N8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:12:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail6.magma.ca (mail6 [206.191.0.248]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA08318; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail6.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA15674; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:00:00 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Marc Joosen , Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FD1320.B20465FB@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <200004190050.CAA24123@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Marc Joosen wrote: > > Ok, a branding logo is certainly one aspect of packaging - wasn't quite all > > that I had in mind but I'll go with the flow :-) Consequently, I'll stick my > > neck out to start the ball rolling - I threw this to JD a little while ago to > > possibly depict a LARTcluster project and I'll given it another wack here, > > doesn't quite capture all that is LART but what the hell.. > > Ummm... nice picture of a nuclear reactor, but we are planning to generate > as little heat as possible -- in the processor that is, the person being > LARTed should experience a considerable increase in temperature :) Hey that's why it was blue !! :-) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 04:57:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA10324 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:57:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA10320 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:57:37 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800HJ4TK0N8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 04:57:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.60] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AFD1502024E; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:54:09 -0500 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:56:21 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FD2055.B39AB8D2@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm interested, though I have found only some surplus sites for lcd boards and we'd probably need to have a bunch of interested parties to purchase one directly from the manufacturer... Doug is keeping a list - get your friends to log their requests to so we can keep a decently close approximation of the number of boards requested. Be aware that this is a gathering of interested parties - I doubt the boards will be ready soon - Lart has yet another revision coming out, the KSB is still under evaluation and debuging and I don't think the eth has been put together yet. But it looks like things are coming along relatively quickly - I optimistically hope to have a few finished, revised and proven boards in the next few months - maybe a Christmas present to myself... :) I'd like to have a few of the current or soon to be current boards to play with and develop my project - but I really look forward to the "stable" version. Certainly by then we'll easily have enough commitments to order 100+ boards - maybe more... I wonder if this project is open enough to have additional help in the development of the boards. Perhaps a to-do list with invitations to help would be appropriate? Mike efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > please put me down for at least 1 lart+ksb+ethernet(4 port would be nice) > price pending. lower cost = more units. I also have a few interested > friends. any one interested in a group purchase of lcd displays? > > Eric > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 05:39:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA10461 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:39:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA10457 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:39:19 +0200 From: marcus.giles@deltagold.com.au Received: from phoenix.deltagold.com.au ([203.47.0.66]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800I6MVHFP1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:39:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au (localmail.kbgm.deltagold.com.au [203.38.127.2]) by phoenix.deltagold.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA25673 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:58:45 +0800 Received: by kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.4 (830.2 3-23-1999)) id 482568C6.001385A3 ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:13 +0800 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:08 +0800 Subject: KSB? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <482568C6.001383F7.00@kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: DELTAGOLD Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was wondering, the IDE port on the KSB board does that support LARGE H/D's? or CDROM's? I get a big smile on my face when I think of a 20 odd gig h/d playing mp3's in my car.. :-) "Geek for life" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 05:45:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA10488 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:45:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA10484 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:45:52 +0200 Received: from elysium.uwa.edu.au (elysium.uwa.edu.au [130.95.128.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT800I8CVSBP1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:45:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mermaid.ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au (mermaid.ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au [130.95.13.17]) by elysium.uwa.edu.au (8.8.7/8.8.0) with ESMTP id LAA04516 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:40:41 +0800 (WST) Received: (from nick@localhost) by mermaid.ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id LAA00901 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:39:29 +0800 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:39:24 +0800 From: Nick Bannon Subject: Re: stupid idea..maybe=) In-reply-to: <002901bfa98b$80ee1c60$87bdfea9@rentbert>; from rgray@cubicle2.freeserve.co.uk on Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 12:09:21AM +0100 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000419113923.A649@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i References: <002901bfa98b$80ee1c60$87bdfea9@rentbert> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 12:09:21AM +0100, Raphael Gray wrote: > I could be being very stupid but here goes anyway=) > > Would it not be possible to make a hardware FPU/FP Emulator and then > modify the FP Emulator(software) which exists already so that it can > use this FP EMU hardware if it is available. this might help or it > may just be a silly idea i dont know, tell me what u think! [...] Not at all - you have a nice RISC CPU where you can write software rather than silicon-consuming microcode to do complicated procedures. Why not have a nice RISC FP unit which implements the basic load/store/add/multiply/divide/overflow stuff and uses software to do complex trigonometry functions, etc, built on those? It's such a good idea that this is exactly what the FPA10 and FPA11 are - Floating Point Accelerators for ARM chips. You still use FP Emulation software to do the more complex stuff. What's the downside? Well, the FPA10 runs at 25MHz and the FPA11 runs at 33MHz - they're for ARM3's and ARM7's more than StrongARMs. They speed up FP intensive code by 10-50 times (eg raytracing), but the whole exception catching, emulator calling, co-processor utilising system is considerably slower than doing everything in one package - FP performance is still much worse than a PentiumII or Alpha. It's easier, most of the time, to simply avoid FP. It can be emulated if required, but most of what you want to do on an embedded system simply doesn't need it. If you just need fractional numbers, fixed point arithmetic works perfectly well and very quickly in most situations. (the ARM barrel shifter helps) Nick. -- Nick Bannon | "I made this letter longer than usual because nick@it.net.au | I lack the time to make it shorter." - Pascal -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 08:19:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10865 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:19:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10861 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:19:16 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900KI32W2VQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:19:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (ss124.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.145]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N1H3BR; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:09:52 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:22:39 -0700 From: varek Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Secret Asian Man Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FD50AF.3E6F231D@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14-15mdk i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Secret Asian Man wrote: > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Varek wrote: > > > The logo, however, is a great idea! I personally think should be > > based on the penguin somehow but with something to distinguish it - > > like carrying a suitcase for portability or make him very small (next > > to something) for the small footprint. > > I think the Penguin thing might not be such a great idea. I mean, this is > a great flexible platform that can run anything. Personally, I'd love to > see NetBSD on the little things. That's the coolest thing about the > machine... It's so flexible in how you can implement it (with software AND > hardware)... It is definately a flexible product. I just thought of the penguin because of the "Linux" part of LART. Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 08:33:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10905 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:33:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10901 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:33:03 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900M213J15C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:33:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (ss124.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.145]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N1H3GD; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:23:40 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:36:27 -0700 From: varek Subject: Logos To: LART list Message-id: <38FD53EB.E4E80A37@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14-15mdk i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi guys and gals, just some thoughts before I go to bed... Regarding the "REAKTOR": Wow! 'Cool' idea. I like what your doing with the colour. My only criticism would be that logos are typically not quite so nebulous in shape - meaning most have a more discernable shape. I like it though... Regarding Penguin with a bat: Funny! And good, from our perspective. But are we looking for something that will be able to generate some public recognition. The Penguin, cute as he is, is still a fairly obscure symbol to the rest of the world. Then again maybe it doesn't matter if people get it or not... (Then again maybe I'm just getting too tired to know) I have an idea too but I don't have time to draw it right now: Blue square, "LART" in red letters with a yellow (white?) lightning bolt behind the letters. As I picture it I suspect that I'm stealing something from somewhere... Oh well, I'll try to draw it in the next couple of days. G'night folks Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 08:42:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA10945 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:42:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA10941 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:42:32 +0200 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (smtp.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.32]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT900M2P3YVI3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:42:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ac87577c.ipt.aol.com (HELO phoenix) (172.135.87.124) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:37:50 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:21:36 +0100 From: Rodney Arne Karlsen Subject: Modual Development To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <006901bfa9c9$4b6082c0$9664a8c0@phoenix> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Apparently-From: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all What sort of add on moduals are being worked on at the moment and what are ppl planing on working on in the future? I have some ideas from a wearable computing point of view, but I don't want to try and reinvent the wheel if somone else has allready started on a similar project. Thanks Rodney Arne Karlsen __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 09:38:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA11036 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:38:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA11032 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:38:51 +0200 Received: from relay.ccs.muc.debis.de (relay.ccs.muc.debis.de [53.140.125.65]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9002GL6KP89@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:38:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by relay.ccs.muc.debis.de (8.9.3/8.6.9) id JAA20344 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:31:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: from unknown(53.144.41.237) by relay.ccs.muc.debis.de via smap (V2.1+anti-relay+anti-spam) id xma020264; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:31:08 +0200 Received: from relay.otn.eurocopter.de (iapetus.otn.eurocopter.de [53.144.12.4]) by ec4007.don.eurocopter.de with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id JFL4Q7CD; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:30:07 +0200 Received: from egypt.otn.eurocopter.de (egypt.otn.eurocopter.de [53.144.30.1]) by relay.otn.eurocopter.de (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA01095 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:30:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from Eurocopter.De (chad [53.144.30.12]) by egypt.otn.eurocopter.de (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA18754 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:31:02 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:30:54 +0200 From: "Ralf D. Werner" Subject: Re: Logos To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Ralf.Werner@Eurocopter.De Message-id: <38FD60AE.A4BB01E9@Eurocopter.De> Organization: Eurocopter Deutschland MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FD53EB.E4E80A37@saltspring.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi there, I just happened to trash the latest mailing list entries in my local box, so don't flame me for this ideas if they came to someone else's mind some minutes before: If you advertise the LART as sort of powerful LINUX engine with low power consumption, why not make a "green" or "energy saver" logo? Maybe an animated logo of the Tux penguin turning around ... with a battery mounted to his back (like the Energizer bunny ad). Or how about the slight askew slogan: "SOLARIS runs on AC powered SUNs - LINUX runs on solar powered LARTs" (or many other variations of this pun). Cheers, Ralf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 09:48:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA11074 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:48:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA11070 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:48:04 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9002BU701QL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:48:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12hp91-000Nik-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:43:31 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:44:29 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: EMC issues / liability To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, all. Has anyone given any thought to the EMC / CE side of this work- is the plan to try to declare the LART as a component of any larger system, and to have the user certify the finished system? I'd hate to see anyone get in trouble for this... (and don't have a good enough knowledge of the CE regs to know the answers) - it's unlikely to be enough to ship the product with the gnu "no warranty" Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 10:38:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA11230 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:38:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA11226 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:38:17 +0200 Received: from orange.csi.cam.ac.uk (orange.csi.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.77]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT90064E9BSRD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:38:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from dac33 (helo=localhost) by orange.csi.cam.ac.uk with local-esmtp (Exim 3.13 #1) id 12hplq-0003Ht-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:23:38 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:23:38 +0100 (BST) From: "" Subject: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) X-Sender: dac33@orange.csi.cam.ac.uk To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > [cc-ed to the LART list] > > >you say the itsy boys had doom running... > >i have read little about the itsy, but one of the things i read > >was that if there was no input activity, the rest of the itsy > >would actually shutdown and keep only the display unit alive. > >how would a game which needs a constant refresh run something like > >doom? > > Hmm, I find it hard to imagine that you'd play a game of Doom with no input > activity :) Seriously, I expect the shutdown behaviour is switchable. > The SA1100 has autoshutdown built in to extend battery life. The Itsy had an additional chip to keep the screen alive even when auto shutdown on the SA1100 screen driver commenced. If the SA1100 continually received commands to write to screen (as in a good game of doom) then there would be no shutdown and no problem. I guess with the LART if you waited in a corner with no cyber-demons chasing you and you didn't move then your screen would go blank eventually, this would not need to occur with the Itsy. David Crawley ====================================================================== Yes I am a physicist, so I suppose that makes me mad! Magdalene College Cambridge University CB3 0AG England -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 11:10:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA11292 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:10:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA11288 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:10:21 +0200 Received: from mail2.netcologne.de (mail2.netcologne.de [194.8.194.103]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9008EDAT8OA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:10:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from colin.anarcho.net (dial-ra-nc1-28.netcologne.de [195.14.244.28]) by mail2.netcologne.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA16012; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:58:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from baer@localhost) by colin.anarcho.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA03057; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:58:42 +0200 X-URL: Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:58:41 +0200 From: Thomas Renard X-Face: 43Gd&$n()k_953x*S*S$KvhoZ5HRR+\?HpR1~dG@&6B[/EKmoE.5mYc3v#`Ahf[{ekw}SL9 g|pT#VQ8a.~3xURG\j?G@roW>lq*V323P[~3fZu6.~DxATbN&IGSABZ*aQ*:1XPF-i[m"h.z&S[k3J a[.Rfdjk9(?uQ$CQ=-& Subject: Re: Feature Request In-reply-to: Marc Joosen's message of "Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:35:43 +0200 (MEST)" To: Marc Joosen Cc: nicolai@reipur.com (Nicolai Mahncke), lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: Organization: The Anarcho Net MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Gnus/5.070099 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.99) XEmacs/21.1 (Canyonlands) Lines: 29 References: <200004190035.CAA24054@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk * Marc Joosen writes: > Ok, here are my thoughts on this: a module with the same footprint > as the > other boards, i.e. 10x7cm, containing the battery and the charger > (both are linked by the battery requirements, so it doesn't make > much sense to keep them apart). Currently, the mainboard isn't > designed to have a power module stacked on it, and it will likely be > between the KSB and a memory expansion board. This means that the > connection to the mainboard has to be in the form of wires outside > the stack of pcb's (beware of stack overflows :) > On the software side: it would be nice to have at least an > indication of > the battery status, if not complete control over the charging > process. I think we can do without APM/ACPI, which is a disaster in > itself -- I've got a ThinkPad 600X, that should say enough. > [...] How much space will be left on the 10x7 board for other stuff? Maybe the single Ethernet can be put on it? Maybe some LCD2VGA-Converter?? I ask for this because IMHO it would be nice to have a machine with all needed features (what is really needed) on three boards and about 35mm. Thomas -- Thomas Renard Ich glaub, Atomstrom Thomas.Renard@smail.uni-koeln.de ist gelb -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 11:30:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA11380 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:30:27 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA11376 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:30:26 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9009PXBQPVN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:30:25 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12hqoT-000Ntw-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:30:25 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:31:23 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FD7CEB.13D39A24@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > The SA1100 has autoshutdown built in to extend battery life. Not quite- the SA1100 has some power down modes that the OS can invoke. The SA1100 certainly won't just shut down because it's bored... Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 11:33:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA11435 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA11431 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:46 +0200 Received: from marzipan.nougat.org (9.194.6.64.reflexcom.com [64.6.194.9]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9009LOBW87X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by marzipan.nougat.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA13935; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:34:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:34:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Secret Asian Man Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-reply-to: <38FD50AF.3E6F231D@saltspring.com> To: varek Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, varek wrote: > It is definately a flexible product. I just thought of the penguin > because of the "Linux" part of LART. Yes, not to get into a flame war, but, oh whatever :) I just think the whole penguin thing is a bit overblown. However, the designer of the penguin really hit it big by including a large white space in the middle so you could but all sorts of corporate logos on it... :) -- Christopher Kyin-hwa Chen To envision the joy, at 6am, of pulling thousands of spam emails out of a clogged mail queue, imagine pulling a cat out of a toilet. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 12:02:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11667 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:02:25 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11663 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:02:24 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA07292; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:02:15 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:02:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191002.MAA07292@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: marcus.giles@deltagold.com.au Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: KSB? In-Reply-To: <482568C6.001383F7.00@kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:33:08 +0800, marcus.giles@deltagold.com.au wrote: > I was wondering, the IDE port on the KSB board does that support LARGE H/D's? > or CDROM's? Yes. I currently have a 2.5 inch 4GB hard disk lying on my desk, but bigger should be no problem. The only difficulty you might get is that the 30+ GB harddisks are not yet in 2.5 inch form factor, so you should buy/make a 2.5 --> 3.5 converter. Note that the IDE controller will only do PIO, not DMA. > I get a big smile on my face when I think of a 20 odd gig h/d playing mp3's in > my car.. :-) You did have a look at http://www.empeg.com/ ? Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 12:07:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11705 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:07:12 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11701 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:07:11 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id MAA07328; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:07:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:07:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191007.MAA07328@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nick-lart@rcpt.to Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: stupid idea..maybe=) In-Reply-To: <20000419113923.A649@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:39:24 +0800, Nick Bannon wrote: > On Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 12:09:21AM +0100, Raphael Gray wrote: >> Would it not be possible to make a hardware FPU/FP Emulator and then >> modify the FP Emulator(software) which exists already so that it can >> use this FP EMU hardware if it is available. this might help or it >> may just be a silly idea i dont know, tell me what u think! > [...] [...] > It's such a good idea that this is exactly what the FPA10 and FPA11 are > - Floating Point Accelerators for ARM chips. You still use FP Emulation > software to do the more complex stuff. > > What's the downside? Well, the FPA10 runs at 25MHz and the FPA11 runs at > 33MHz - they're for ARM3's and ARM7's more than StrongARMs. They speed up > FP intensive code by 10-50 times (eg raytracing), but the whole exception > catching, emulator calling, co-processor utilising system is considerably > slower than doing everything in one package - FP performance is still > much worse than a PentiumII or Alpha. The other downside is that the SA1100 doesn't have a co-processor bus, so you can't connect an ARM FPU. However, the original idea is not impossible, although you have to be careful that it shouldn't be slower than emulating the FPU instruction. Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 12:20:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11782 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:20:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11778 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:20:32 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900D0DE26SX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:20:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20E9474816; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:20:13 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:20:13 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <200004181357.JAA22726@deimos.mars.org> To: Rob Leslie Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Rob Leslie wrote: > Kira Brown replied: > > Depends on how good you want to make your mpeg decoder. I've done it in > > about 10% of CPU time on a 202MHz SA-110. > > Kira: very interesting. Care to elaborate? Basically: fixed point, order instructions for maximum cache utilisation, interleave writes to avoid choking the write buffer. (On RiscPC, where I did this, there's a 16MHz memory bus [I know, it sucked] so there was major gain to be made by putting writes every 25-odd instructions :-) Oh, and write the whole core in assembler. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 12:41:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11855 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:41:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11851 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:41:15 +0200 Received: from smtp2.chello.se (smtp2.chello.se [193.150.195.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900FMSF0QUL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:41:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chello.se ([193.150.216.55]) by smtp2.chello.se (InterMail vK.4.02.00.00 201-232-116 license 70acae3d5ac8b27d1dfb8564bfbfa8a7) with ESMTP id <20000419102748.VTOU27496.smtp2@chello.se> for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:27:48 +0200 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:26:28 +0200 From: David Belius Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FD89D4.131060E7@chello.se> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> <38FB827E.D7F02F7E@uswest.net> <38FC2E0D.E9554F14@chello.se> <38FC5019.9AA2012F@uswest.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I, David Belius would probolay want 1 Lart+KSB+Eth pre-soldered and built. Althought i would like a price statement first. You upload software to a lart by burning a flash, right? Does anyone know what a flash burner costs and how easy and cheap it is to build one yourself? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 12:46:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA11886 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:46:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA11882 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:46:17 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900G82F93Q0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:46:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ABEC748D8; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:29:45 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:29:45 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: stupid idea..maybe=) In-reply-to: <002901bfa98b$80ee1c60$87bdfea9@rentbert> To: Raphael Gray Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Raphael Gray wrote: > I could be being very stupid but here goes anyway=) > > Would it not be possible to make a hardware FPU/FP Emulator and then > modify the FP Emulator(software) which exists already so that it can > use this FP EMU hardware if it is available. this might help or it may > just be a silly idea i dont know, tell me what u think! It is possible and has been done on RiscPC. However, it does not yield significant performance increases. The major reason the FPE's performance is so slow is because it has to go through the undefined instruction trap (and dump a load of cache...) in the process. You can't avoid that on SA1100- the second 1 means there's no coprocessor interface available, so you can't tightly couple hardware. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 13:40:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA12033 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:40:53 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA12029 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:40:52 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA07841; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:40:50 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:40:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191140.NAA07841@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: dac33@hermes.cam.ac.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:23:38 +0100 (BST), wrote: > The SA1100 has autoshutdown built in to extend battery life. The Itsy had No, there is no such thing as auto shutdown on the SA1100. There are power saving modes, but the OS is in control. > an additional chip to keep the screen alive even when auto shutdown on the > SA1100 screen driver commenced. If the SA1100 continually received > commands to write to screen (as in a good game of doom) then there would > be no shutdown and no problem. I guess with the LART if you waited in a The SA1100 LCD controller continuously uses DMA to put the contents of the frame buffer RAM to the LCD. If a program like Doom happens to change the frame buffer, it will be visible; if it doesn't change the frame buffer, the LCD controller will still move the contents to the LCD. > corner with no cyber-demons chasing you and you didn't move then your > screen would go blank eventually, this would not need to occur with the > Itsy. I consider this a bug rather than a feature: the first thing you want to switch off is the part that consumes the most energy: the LCD. Erik -- "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 14:23:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12216 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:23:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA12211 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:23:38 +0200 Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9000VNJRDEO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:23:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12htRE-000Gm8-0C for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:18:37 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:58:49 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability In-reply-to: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk>, Steve Wiseman writes >Hi, all. > Has anyone given any thought to the EMC / CE side of this work- is >the plan to try to declare the LART as a component of any larger >system, and to have the user certify the finished system? >I'd hate to see anyone get in trouble for this... (and don't have a >good enough knowledge of the CE regs to know the answers) - it's >unlikely to be enough to ship the product with the gnu "no warranty" I don't see an alternative to being a component in the UK (EU?) although maybe "test equipment" would be appropriate for prototypes. I guess I'll have a look at this sometime and review sci.engr.electrical.compliance archives I have which should give some ideas. The working basis for me shipping complete boards would be no case or PSU I reckon. I do have some interest in producing a boxed version but its not at all clear whether that would always have the right mix of features for everyone else and as soon as someone adds another board, CE rears its ugly head again. Good fun eh! Rest assured I will try to avoid getting into trouble here :) Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 14:41:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12341 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:41:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA12337 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:41:16 +0200 Received: from mrq1.static.cx (N699P006.dipool.highway.telekom.at [212.183.97.70]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT900ME9KKMKX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:41:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 18615 invoked from network); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:35:48 +0000 Received: from loopback (HELO gmx.net) (127.0.0.1) by loopback with SMTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:35:48 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200 From: "Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer" Subject: strongarm smp To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FDA822.BDBEB862@gmx.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk is the strong-arm smp capable ? if yes, we could put 16 strong-arms on a full-length pci card and a desktop-beowolf is online :-) mfg mrq1 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 14:47:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA12467 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:47:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA12463 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:47:53 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT90031XKVR40@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:47:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12httX-000ODH-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:47:51 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:48:50 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FDAB32.9D337F0C@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004191140.NAA07841@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > I consider this a bug rather than a feature: the first thing you want to > switch off is the part that consumes the most energy: the LCD. Have you found http://www.kentdisplays.com/ -they only take power to make a change, otherwise, they're stable (for months...) Not sure about availablity in mass market yet, but I've seen them in proto products, and they look good. Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 15:02:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA12570 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:02:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA12566 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:02:24 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900312LJY40@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:02:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12hu7a-000OEc-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:02:22 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:03:21 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FDAE99.48324692@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Steve Goodwin wrote: > The working basis for me shipping complete boards would be no case or > PSU I reckon. Yes- it was the discussion about packaging that prodded my mind in this direction. > Rest assured I will try to avoid getting into trouble here :) Being a test case for open-source hardware Vs CE legislation strikes me as a lot of no-fun :( Out of interest, does anyone on this list have easy access to an EMC test chamber? - I see a lot more softies than hardware people... Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 15:30:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA12718 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:30:52 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA12714 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:30:51 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id PAA08590; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:30:47 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:30:47 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191330.PAA08590@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mrq1@gmx.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-Reply-To: <38FDA822.BDBEB862@gmx.net> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > is the strong-arm smp capable ? No. > if yes, we could put 16 strong-arms on a full-length pci card > and a desktop-beowolf is online :-) The nice thing about a beowolf cluster is that is doesn't need SMP, just some kind of interconnect. Silly plan n+1 is to design such an interconnect board. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 16:12:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13923 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:12:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA13919 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:12:55 +0200 Received: from ice.ar51.net (ice.ar51.net [208.225.80.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9008LMOTHX5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:12:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from server01.asi (akron-80-172.ar51.net [208.225.80.172]) by ice.ar51.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA20746; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:56:52 -0400 Received: by SERVER01 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:56:32 -0400 Content-return: allowed Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:56:30 -0400 From: Jeff Sutherland Subject: RE: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: "'Steve Wiseman'" , "'lart@lart.tudelft.nl'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Erik Mouw wrote: > > > I consider this a bug rather than a feature: the first > thing you want to > > switch off is the part that consumes the most energy: the LCD. > > Have you found http://www.kentdisplays.com/ > > -they only take power to make a change, otherwise, they're stable (for > months...) > Not sure about availablity in mass market yet, but I've seen them in > proto products, and they look good. > > Steve The technology of these displays is improving but it's not quite suitable for a hand-held product. LCD displays based on Polymer stabilized cholesteric liquid crystal (referred to as PSC) materials exhibit a bi-stable characteristic, where the display can be updated and power removed, leaving the image intact. (I have one at home which has retained its image for over 3 years). Since there's no polarizer film, and the tolerance of the glass spacing is considerably looser than conventional TN materials, theoretically they should be significantly less expensive to manufacture. Also, there's ongoing research at the Liquid Crystal Institute at Kent State University (http://www.lci.kent.edu) on making flexible plastic displays based on PSC materials. Fundamental issues facing widespread deployment of these kinds of displays (last time I checked anyway, YMMV) are: 1. Power. Switching states requires voltages significantly higher than conventional TN or STN materials. 2. Speed (although this has improved considerably over the last few years). Update rates per row are in the millisecond range; vga screen size frame rates are much lower than conventional materials. 3. Custom driver electronics with high voltage outputs required. 4. The usual problems with getting research turned into practical applications. Kent Displays has had some success in niche markets where power is not as much of a concern as viewability or the bi-stable characteristic. BTW since these displays employ Bragg reflection instead of 1/4 wave rotation/polarization their contrast and viewing angle characteristics are much better than conventional LCD displays. I still have hope for creating a plastic display that's only 0.015" (0.38mm) thick and requires essentially no power, but we're not quite there yet. I have no affiliation with LCI or Kent Displays (although I am a KSU alum -shameless plug), just an interest in small low-power devices. //Jeff -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 16:22:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14016 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:22:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14012 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:22:20 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT9009ORP8W0I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:22:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.127]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA15584; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:45:18 +0530 (IST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:49:31 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: "" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004501bfaa0a$48616300$7f1e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >The SA1100 has autoshutdown built in to extend battery life. The Itsy had >an additional chip to keep the screen alive even when auto shutdown on the >SA1100 screen driver commenced. If the SA1100 continually received >commands to write to screen (as in a good game of doom) then there would >be no shutdown and no problem. I guess with the LART if you waited in a >corner with no cyber-demons chasing you and you didn't move then your >screen would go blank eventually, this would not need to occur with the >Itsy. well, even with no cyber-demons chasing (and no updates), we still can call an update to keep the lart alive (if it is necessary). besides, we're doing quake :-) - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 16:35:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14108 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:35:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14104 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:35:45 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900B57PST3L@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:35:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.127]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA29767; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:58:40 +0530 (IST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:02:49 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: Erik Mouw , dac33@hermes.cam.ac.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <009201bfaa0c$265b2460$7f1e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> an additional chip to keep the screen alive even when auto shutdown on the >> SA1100 screen driver commenced. If the SA1100 continually received >> commands to write to screen (as in a good game of doom) then there would >> be no shutdown and no problem. I guess with the LART if you waited in a a good game of doom will not write to the screen buffer unless an update is needed. > >The SA1100 LCD controller continuously uses DMA to put the contents of the >frame buffer RAM to the LCD. If a program like Doom happens to change the >frame buffer, it will be visible; if it doesn't change the frame buffer, >the LCD controller will still move the contents to the LCD. > what bothers me is that if the CPU is switched off when there is no updates to the frame buffer, the game engine won't run. so the simulation stops. consider a situation where a demo runs. this is time critical. simulation can't stop. if for example, during making the demo, the player stops moving and there is no change in the buffer and hence no update to the output buffer. the engine will hang as the game engine is shut off (cpu is off).. and cannot generate any more updates. >> corner with no cyber-demons chasing you and you didn't move then your >> screen would go blank eventually, this would not need to occur with the >> Itsy. > >I consider this a bug rather than a feature: the first thing you want to >switch off is the part that consumes the most energy: the LCD. > i would rather have all sub system shutdown controlled by software than automatically done. - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 16:49:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14615 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:49:18 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14611 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:49:17 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id QAA09182; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:48:37 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:48:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191448.QAA09182@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: muks@hd2.dot.net.in Cc: dac33@hermes.cam.ac.uk, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) In-Reply-To: <009201bfaa0c$265b2460$7f1e36ca@muks> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:02:49 +0530, Mukund Iyer wrote: > what bothers me is that if the CPU is switched off when there is no > updates to the frame buffer, the game engine won't run. so the simulation > stops. As I already said before: it is up to the OS to decide if the CPU is switched off at all[1], The SA1100 has no automatic switch off logic. Erik [1] Or better: it is up to a userland tool to decide to switch off the CPU, because policy belongs in userland, not in the kernel. -- Yes, it works sometimes. If you need something that "works sometimes" use Windows! -- Victor Khimenko on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 17:02:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14705 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:02:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14701 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:02:24 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900CDIR3YU9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:02:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N1HSMA; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:53:00 -0700 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:59:54 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Secret Asian Man Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FDC9EA.EE9E0A45@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Secret Asian Man wrote: > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, varek wrote: > > > It is definately a flexible product. I just thought of the penguin > > because of the "Linux" part of LART. > > Yes, not to get into a flame war, but, oh whatever :) No no no no! I'm sorry if I was misunderstood - I'm nowhere near a flame war. I wasn't trying to pull an attitude with you. I was just telling you why the penguin popped into whats left of my brain. That's all... > I just think the whole penguin thing is a bit overblown. However, the > designer of the penguin really hit it big by including a large white space > in the middle so you could but all sorts of corporate logos on it... :) I totally understand your sentiment here. I have no particular attachment to the penguin, not for the LART anyway. He is cute though... ;) I really liked Ralph D. Werner's ideas actually. Something green I think fits the LART very well and the tag line had me giggling at my desk this morning (my co-workers have long stopped wondering about my odd behaviour). EXCERPT: "Ralf D. Werner" wrote: > If you advertise the LART as sort of powerful LINUX engine with low power > consumption, why not make a "green" or "energy saver" logo? Maybe an animated > logo of the Tux penguin turning around ... with a battery mounted to his back > (like the Energizer bunny ad). > > Or how about the slight askew slogan: "SOLARIS runs on AC powered SUNs - LINUX > runs on solar powered LARTs" (or many other variations of this pun). I would really hate to think you didn't bring some criticism or idea to the group because I can't pay more attention when I proof my emails. Please, this group should promote the free flow of ideas and you should feel free to post them. Again, my apologies for the misunderstanding. (I really shouldn't post when I've been up 18 of the last 24 hours should I?) Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 17:11:44 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14741 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:11:44 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14737 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:11:44 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900D5PRJFVA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:11:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12hw8g-000ORZ-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:11:38 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:12:37 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FDCCE5.CF839819@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <009201bfaa0c$265b2460$7f1e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mukund Iyer wrote: > i would rather have all sub system shutdown controlled by software > than automatically done It is. This is all a misunderstanding. The SA1100 does _NOT_ shut down unless explicitly asked to by the software. The fact that Itsy was able to keep the LCD refreshing while the CPU was sleeping is true but irrelevant to this thread. The LART does not (as far as I can see) have the extra hardware to refresh the LCD- it relies on the SA1100 to perform the task- when the SA1100 sleeps, the LCD will stop. Please let this thread die now. Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 17:23:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14806 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:23:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14802 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:22:59 +0200 Received: from chrs.com (mail.chrs.com [216.38.7.230]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900DLAS29VA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:22:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by gateway.chrs.com id <26883>; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:11:15 -0400 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:11:13 -0400 From: Arawak Subject: Re: Logos To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Reply-to: Arawak Message-id: <00Apr19.111115edt.26883@gateway.chrs.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Standard (2.10.2010) For Windows NT (4.0.1381;5) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I dunno... to me, a Lart sounds like sound kind of small animal... maybe a cross between a koala and a mink. If I had an ounce of artistic talent I'd draw one, but.... Sean -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 17:40:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14857 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:40:20 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14853 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:40:19 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FT900BLPSV3T2@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:40:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.68.210]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA07665; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:01:37 +0530 (IST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:05:43 +0530 From: Mukund Iyer Subject: Re: The Lart, The Doom and Itsy (aka screen shutdown) To: Erik Mouw Cc: dac33@hermes.cam.ac.uk, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002e01bfaa15$04add700$d24436ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > >As I already said before: it is up to the OS to decide if the CPU is >switched off at all[1], The SA1100 has no automatic switch off logic. > > >Erik > >[1] Or better: it is up to a userland tool to decide to switch off the > CPU, because policy belongs in userland, not in the kernel. > yup, definitely. whether to keep CPU alive or not depends on the current contexts and cannot be a direct OS decision. i guess all the OS can do is to see whether any processes are in the running state.. and shut off if there are none. this would be the only real decision it can take. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 18:00:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14933 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:00:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14929 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:00:01 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900G60TRZO5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:00:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail3.magma.ca (mail3.magma.ca [206.191.0.221]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA00475 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:45:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail3.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA22927 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:45:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:47:20 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FDD508.C8A9CCAE@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> <38FDAE99.48324692@steves-house.org.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Steve Wiseman wrote: > Steve Goodwin wrote: > > > The working basis for me shipping complete boards would be no case or > > PSU I reckon. > > Yes- it was the discussion about packaging that prodded my mind in this > direction. Exactly, it was for these very reasons that I initially raised the question of packaging in the first place - this stuff takes a serious amount of effort and can easily slip in relation to the more fun side of developing hardware & software. Logo goofiness aside simply having individual designers resolve the problem, while pragmatic, misses what I would contend is a critical component in the engineering of any number of LART solutions. I would hope we would be able to pool resources here and produce a collective small set of baseline packaging solutions while allowing individuals to innovate if they want. > > Rest assured I will try to avoid getting into trouble here :) > > Being a test case for open-source hardware Vs CE legislation strikes me > as a lot of no-fun :( > > Out of interest, does anyone on this list have easy access to an EMC > test chamber? - I see a lot more softies than hardware people... > > Steve Well, Steve, funny you should ask - since this is getting to the nub of the thing for those with possible commercial interests and given what I'm sure there are fairly wide ranging homologation issues between UK (EU ?), DoC (Canada), FCC (US), Japan, Australia, etc. Maybe we should take this momentarily offline and discuss what exactly is needed and what is available... Terry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 18:24:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15088 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:24:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15084 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:24:07 +0200 From: LeoSusanto@aol.com Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.67]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900GOSUW5VI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:24:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LeoSusanto@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id 3.67.3213aef (15544); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:18:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:18:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com, gtm.kramer@inter.nl.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <67.3213aef.262f3656@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk sure. please provide the size you are thinking, eric. what kind of specs? i am interested in buying couples too leo In a message dated Tue, 18 Apr 2000 9:23:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com writes: > please put me down for at least 1 lart+ksb+ethernet(4 port would be nice) > price pending. lower cost = more units. I also have a few interested > friends. any one interested in a group purchase of lcd displays? > > Eric > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > Fully assembled > > > > efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > > > > bare boards or assembled units? > > > > > > -eric > > > > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > > > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > > > > >combo. > > > > > > > > Where can we sign up for one board or more? > > > > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > > > > Jurgen > > > > > > > > -- > > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 18:39:34 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15169 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:39:34 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15165 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:39:33 +0200 From: xcalbet@inm.es Received: from poseidon (poseidon.inm.es [193.144.152.10]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT900I0QVLWSA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:39:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by poseidon (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA24593; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:24:57 +0200 Received: from eolo.inm.es(193.144.158.111) by poseidon via smap (V1.3) id sma024511; Wed Apr 19 18:24:17 2000 Received: from teide.inm.es by eolo (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA14642; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:26:15 +0200 Received: from inm.es (askatu [193.144.131.172]) by teide.inm.es (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA28754 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:24:57 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:45:41 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004191624.QAA28754@teide.inm.es> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I want one if they are not too expensive :=) Add me to the list with a complete finished board with KSB and ethernet Thanks Xavier Calbet xcalbet@inm.es -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 18:46:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15207 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:46:25 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15203 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:46:24 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA26788; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:45:38 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004191645.SAA26788@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: Feature Request To: Thomas.Renard@smail.uni-koeln.de (Thomas Renard) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:45:38 +0200 (MEST) Cc: nicolai@reipur.com (Nicolai Mahncke), lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: from "Thomas Renard" at Apr 19, 2000 10:58:41 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > * Marc Joosen writes: > > Ok, here are my thoughts on this: a module with the same footprint > > as the > > other boards, i.e. 10x7cm, containing the battery and the charger > > (both are linked by the battery requirements, so it doesn't make > > much sense to keep them apart). Currently, the mainboard isn't [snip myself] > How much space will be left on the 10x7 board for other stuff? Maybe > the single Ethernet can be put on it? Maybe some LCD2VGA-Converter?? > > I ask for this because IMHO it would be nice to have a machine with > all needed features (what is really needed) on three boards and about > 35mm. Of course it would be nice to have a fully functional unit as small as possible, and no one is stopping anyone else from combining several functions on one board. But you may have noticed that the existing LART boards were designed with the Unix strategy in mind: every part has one function and is very good at that (I noticed that Pontiac has `borrowed' this expression now in their TV commercials) - well, except for the KSB, unless you define its function as `turn the LART into a PC' or something. By putting the ethernet on the battery module, you limit the space the batteries can use, and someone else might not need ethernet connectivity at all. And to get an impressive battery lifetime, you need all the space you can get (Li-Ion cells are good, but they're certainly not matter/antimatter reactors yet). In other words: if you really need to, please go ahead and design a battery/eth/lcd board. I think we should try to focus on a battery/charger module, though. Other suggestions? -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 18:56:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15266 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:56:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15262 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:56:17 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900IDQWDSSA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:56:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail3.magma.ca (mail3.magma.ca [206.191.0.221]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA28277 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:41:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail3.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA05850 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:41:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:43:33 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: eCos for LART Cc: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FDE235.A9442400@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38F62B44.67F2C743@ix.netcom.com> <38F64F71.BC84C77D@terus.envmtl.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk T Sullivan wrote: > Hi Greg, > As I mentioned to you in our previous email awhile ago now, we've been > working with eCos using 1.2.1 and some locally hacked cross-platform tools, > but as your no doubt aware Cygnus has recently released (end of March) eCos > 1.3.1 which now has explicit support for Intel's EBSA285 eval brd. which is > based on the SA-110 so the HAL is basically in place now. > > The high degree of configurability throughout the OS makes it really > flexible and a good fit for what we're working on anyway and in addition to > Cygnus's efforts with EL/IX in the embedded Linux community and the fact > that they have already integrated the ARMulator into GDB as a simulator - > virtually instanteous GDB downloads (while you wait for your LARTs to come > off the production line... :-) > > Certainly, a LART bsp would seem a very good idea. > > However I should point out that while there are two versions of eCos 1.3.1 > toolset (Linux & NT), Cygnus appears to have placed more initial emphasis on > the NT platform with a GUI based config tool not available under Linux. Also > the NT version is leveraged off of their Cygwin product for development > tools. Anyway, as we speak Cygnus is apparently only hours away from > releasing the latest tools needed by the NT version of eCos 1.3.1. Ok I never said how many 'hours' it would take but Cygnus has now released their Cygwin tools environment for NT which combined with eCos 1.3.1 provides a cross-platform development environment with direct support for StrongArm. See http://sourceware.cygnus.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 19:10:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA15369 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:10:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15365 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:10:52 +0200 Received: from bechtel.Colorado.EDU (bechtel.Colorado.EDU [128.138.228.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900ILWX23RK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:10:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gully@localhost) by bechtel.Colorado.EDU (8.9.1a/8.9.3/UnixOps+Hesiod (PDH)) with ESMTP id KAA06842 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:55:49 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:55:49 -0600 (MDT) From: Nick Gully Subject: Re: Logos In-reply-to: <38FD60AE.A4BB01E9@Eurocopter.De> X-Sender: gully@bechtel.Colorado.EDU To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello all, How about a picture of a pocket, with LART embroidered on it, and then we can stick whatever respective penguin, daemon, or mink in the pocket that we care to run. This would convey the small size and great computer power available in a lart, and allow for several different characters. And it's easy to draw, always a plus in my book. Best Regards, Nick Gully Nick Gully [gully@colorado.edu] Architectural Engineering senior w/CS minor Have GNU... ...will travel. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 19:45:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA15507 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:45:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15503 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:45:17 +0200 Received: from wcug.wwu.edu (sloth.wcug.wwu.edu [140.160.164.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT900KESYNFES@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:45:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 29235 invoked by uid 1002); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:43:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:43:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamie Heilman Subject: Re: Feature Request In-reply-to: <200004191645.SAA26788@historia.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: jamie@sloth To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Marc Joosen wrote: > In other words: if you really need to, please go ahead and design a >battery/eth/lcd board. I think we should try to focus on a battery/charger >module, though. Other suggestions? If you want other suggestions for modules I personally have a hankering to see a fast IO module. To use a lart in in the server space I'd like to have SCSI (maybe firewire?) as well as 2 100Mbit ethernet ports. I feel that would make an ideal firewall configuration, which is what I had planned on doing after I built/procured my lart. Now I'm not saying we should put the NICs on the same module as the scsi controller though. I seem to recall hearing that when Rebel added (adds?) scsi to the Netwinder that they were going to switch to a different NIC because the scsi controller they were going to use came with a ethernet controller as well. (and it was probably cheaper than the Tulip they were using) Anyone thought about added a Footbridge PCI controller similar to the Netwinder? -jamie -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 19:52:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA15536 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:52:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15532 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:52:53 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900L0GZ03H9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:52:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA00685; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:51:35 -0400 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:51:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <38FD2055.B39AB8D2@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > I'm interested, though I have found only some surplus sites for lcd > boards and we'd probably need to have a bunch of interested parties to > purchase one directly from the manufacturer... www.flat-panel.com seems to be a good source. we might check them out. they seem to have good prices. > Doug is keeping a list - get your friends to log their requests to so we > can keep a decently close approximation of the number of boards > requested. Be aware that this is a gathering of interested parties - I > doubt the boards will be ready soon - Lart has yet another revision > coming out, the KSB is still under evaluation and debuging and I don't > think the eth has been put together yet. But it looks like things are > coming along relatively quickly - I optimistically hope to have a few > finished, revised and proven boards in the next few months - maybe a > Christmas present to myself... :) I'd like to have a few of the current > or soon to be current boards to play with and develop my project - but I > really look forward to the "stable" version. Certainly by then we'll > easily have enough commitments to order 100+ boards - maybe more... > > I wonder if this project is open enough to have additional help in the > development of the boards. Perhaps a to-do list with invitations to help > would be appropriate? this would be a good idea. there should propably always be one authoritarian project leader having the final say though (similar to linus) less we end up with 50 things, all distinctly differn't that people call a lart. there should be a standard that is kept to but I'd like to see the contributions of others as it tends to add synergy to the project. eric > > Mike > > efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > > > please put me down for at least 1 lart+ksb+ethernet(4 port would be nice) > > price pending. lower cost = more units. I also have a few interested > > friends. any one interested in a group purchase of lcd displays? > > > > Eric > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 19:59:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA15593 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:59:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15587 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:59:23 +0200 Received: from boispop1.bois.uswest.net (boispop1.bois.uswest.net [207.108.224.1]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FT900L06ZAXOX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:59:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 21505 invoked by alias); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:55:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 21442 invoked by uid 0); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:55:07 +0000 Received: from dialuph244.bois.uswest.net (HELO xenon) (63.227.128.244) by boispop1.bois.uswest.net with SMTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:55:07 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:54:50 -0600 From: Aaron Lambers Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <38FD89D4.131060E7@chello.se> X-Sender: alambers@pop.bois.uswest.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.1.20000419115214.00b1a6b0@pop.bois.uswest.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Delivered-to: fixup-lart@lart.tudelft.nl@fixme References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> <38FB827E.D7F02F7E@uswest.net> <38FC2E0D.E9554F14@chello.se> <38FC5019.9AA2012F@uswest.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Please add Aaron Lambers for 2 Lart+KSB+Eth built. As always quantities are a function of price. At 12:26 PM 4/19/00 +0200, David Belius wrote: >I, David Belius would probolay want 1 Lart+KSB+Eth >pre-soldered >and built. Althought i would like a price statement first. You upload >software to a lart >by burning a flash, right? Does anyone know what a flash burner costs and >how easy and >cheap it is to build one yourself? > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:08:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15637 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:08:46 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15633 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:08:45 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id UAA10284; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:08:37 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:08:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191808.UAA10284@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: jamie@wcug.wwu.edu Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Feature Request In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:43:19 -0700 (PDT), Jamie Heilman wrote: > If you want other suggestions for modules I personally have a hankering to > see a fast IO module. To use a lart in in the server space I'd like to > have SCSI (maybe firewire?) as well as 2 100Mbit ethernet ports. I feel > that would make an ideal firewall configuration, which is what I had > planned on doing after I built/procured my lart. Now I'm not saying we > should put the NICs on the same module as the scsi controller though. Please tell us where we can get non-PCI ethernet chips in quantities less than 10000. Even big players as Sun use PCI for 100 Mbit ethernet: they use a PCI ethernet chip and put an SBUS to PCI bridge to hook it to the system bus (SBUS). > Anyone thought about added a Footbridge PCI controller similar to the > Netwinder? No, because the Footbridge only fits to the SA110, not to the SA1100. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:14:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15662 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:14:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15658 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:14:30 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FT900LF3ZZWOX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:14:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA20770; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:04:09 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:04:18 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: RE: BOOOOOM In-reply-to: To: "'J.D. Bakker'" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000201bfaa29$b00100a0$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Just some questions that popped up during BOM conversion: 1. You specify resistors as 0805 but the Farnell ordernumber refers to 0603. Which one do you want? On the pictures it looks like you have soldered 0603 on 0805 footprints. 2. What speedgrade is nescessary on the Flash, 120ns or 95ns? 3. Have you considered all the negative effects of using the cheap Y5V type ceramic capacitors? 4. You specify U8 as a "74LVC157D 3V3 Quad 2-in Mux in SO package". The Farnell number refers to a 74LCX157M from Fairchild. Which one is it? Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of J.D. Bakker > Sent: 17 April, 2000 04:26 > To: rob > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: BOOOOOM > > > At 02:03 +0200 17-04-2000, rob wrote: > >J.D., > > do you all have the list of parts you ordered? > > Just when I get out of bed to eat some yoghurt you come and > ask me for a > BOM. Oh well, even less sleep then. Hope you're happy ;-) > > BOM attached. > > JD 'sleepless in ... well ... Amstelveen' B. > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:31:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15755 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:31:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15751 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:31:25 +0200 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (smtp.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.32]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTA00MG00SAAF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:31:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from abd0c4af.ipt.aol.com (HELO phoenix) (171.208.196.175) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:27:05 -0700 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:52:04 +0100 From: Rodney Arne Karlsen Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <000301bfaa2c$5f95d0c0$9664a8c0@phoenix> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Apparently-From: References: <200004182201.AAA23156@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Is it posable to cluster the Lart? Rodney Arne Karlsen > it should be a nice way to benchmark your clusterLART 8) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:34:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15783 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:34:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15779 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:34:00 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00M2D0RKSN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:33:59 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:24:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Feature Request In-reply-to: <200004191808.UAA10284@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > Please tell us where we can get non-PCI ethernet chips in quantities less > than 10000. Even big players as Sun use PCI for 100 Mbit ethernet: they > use a PCI ethernet chip and put an SBUS to PCI bridge to hook it to the > system bus (SBUS). The solution is maybe to design one. There are open VHDL projects out there wishing just for that. See http://www.opencores.org. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:39:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15815 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:39:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15811 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:39:39 +0200 Received: from calvino.alaska.net (calvino.alaska.net [209.112.129.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00MAU161M8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:39:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rus@localhost) by calvino.alaska.net (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA29468 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:24:37 -0800 (AKDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:24:37 -0800 (AKDT) From: ":-)" Subject: Re: Logos In-reply-to: <00Apr19.111115edt.26883@gateway.chrs.com> X-Sender: rus@calvino To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: calvino.alaska.net: rus owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Arawak wrote: > I dunno... to me, a Lart sounds like sound kind of small animal... maybe a > cross between a koala and a mink. If I had an ounce of artistic talent I'd > draw one, but.... I was standing in the shower this morning and my idea along these lines just poped into my head. I'm no artist, nor do I write expressively, but let me try. LADIES AND GENTLEMEN! Your attention please! I'd like to introduce ... LART! the mighty mouse! Standing boldly before you, balled paws on hips, arms and chest abulging, the LART logo clearly emblazoned on his/her chest, cape flying behind. Protector of great and mighty ideas, (large and most importantly small;), doer of great deeds, able to solve huge problems, and savior of the masses who yearn for something less but more. And all without breaking a sweat. Kinda screwy ain't it? (My apologies to WB :) Russ Pagenkopf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 20:52:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15875 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:52:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA15871 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:52:14 +0200 Received: from kachifo.cc.columbia.edu (kachifo.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.59.172]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00MNH1R0AF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:52:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from shadow (vbranzoi.ec.rhno.columbia.edu [128.59.119.100]) by kachifo.cc.columbia.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA18623 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:37:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:38:48 -0400 From: Vlad Branzoi Subject: Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <019801bfaa2e$80a0c2a0$64773b80@ec.rhno.columbia.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.3825.400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.3825.400 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <00041714082200.11652@localhost.localdomain> <38FB827E.D7F02F7E@uswest.net> <38FC2E0D.E9554F14@chello.se> <38FC5019.9AA2012F@uswest.net> <4.1.20000419115214.00b1a6b0@pop.bois.uswest.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Put me down for 2 of the full combos (LART+KSB+Eth) all assembled (preferrably but parts and boards are fine too). I'll take 2 if the individual price is around $250 otherwise I'll take 1 for now. Thanks, Vlad Branzoi -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 21:22:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16043 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:22:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16039 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:22:57 +0200 Received: from wcug.wwu.edu (sloth.wcug.wwu.edu [140.160.164.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTA00128367G3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:22:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 22812 invoked by uid 1002); Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:20:54 +0000 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:20:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamie Heilman Subject: Re: Feature Request In-reply-to: <200004191808.UAA10284@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: jamie@sloth To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >Please tell us where we can get non-PCI ethernet chips in quantities less >than 10000. Even big players as Sun use PCI for 100 Mbit ethernet: they >use a PCI ethernet chip and put an SBUS to PCI bridge to hook it to the >system bus (SBUS). I have no idea - I don't usually base my goals in reality, so I'm not saying that it can be done, I'm just saying "this is what I want," if I can get close to that I'll be happy. >No, because the Footbridge only fits to the SA110, not to the SA1100. ah, well that shoots that out of the sky, oh well -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 21:59:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16226 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:59:05 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16222 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:59:04 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id VAA10726; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:59:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:59:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004191959.VAA10726@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just want to let you know that I have linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 running on the LART. I'm going to test the frame buffer devices tomorrow, but I first have to find the correct bits and pieces of the LCD (I moved to another office: great fun). Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 22:40:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16391 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:40:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16387 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:40:59 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA003DS6S9Q6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:40:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.44] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A8DC33D501F4; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:36:44 -0500 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:39:54 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FE199A.E03CDB@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004191959.VAA10726@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Whooee! almost 2.4 on the lart. Gotta love Linux - it seems it'll run on anything with a cpu... BTW - what is the recommended flash programmer to use and cost/source? One that works with Linux is preferable. Mike Erik Mouw wrote: > > Hi all, > > I just want to let you know that I have linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 running > on the LART. I'm going to test the frame buffer devices tomorrow, but I > first have to find the correct bits and pieces of the LCD (I moved to > another office: great fun). > > Erik > > -- > "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in > "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 22:45:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16459 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:45:58 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16455 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:45:57 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA10890; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:45:44 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:45:44 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004192045.WAA10890@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: rodney.karlsen@yahoo.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: LART Packaging... In-Reply-To: <000301bfaa2c$5f95d0c0$9664a8c0@phoenix> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:52:04 +0100, Rodney Arne Karlsen wrote: > Is it posable to cluster the Lart? Not yet, we're working on it. Erik -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 22:58:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16537 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:58:16 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16533 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:58:15 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA10938; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:58:06 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:58:06 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004192058.WAA10938@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mike@mjv.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 In-Reply-To: <38FE199A.E03CDB@mjv.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:39:54 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > BTW - what is the recommended flash programmer to use and cost/source? > One that works with Linux is preferable. Jan-Derk and Adam are working on a parallel port JTAG interface so you can program the Flash in system using the JTAG interface (don't laugh, it's a documented Intel hack). Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:08:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16629 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:08:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16625 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:08:42 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA004BS82HJ0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:08:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.58] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AF8A213E0214; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:05:14 -0500 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:08:25 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Flash Programmer [was Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FE2049.5D82A838@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004192058.WAA10938@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hee hee, you've got to be some of the most inventive people I've come across. Please announce it when they're done - I'd like to get one... Mike Erik Mouw wrote: > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:39:54 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > BTW - what is the recommended flash programmer to use and cost/source? > > One that works with Linux is preferable. > > Jan-Derk and Adam are working on a parallel port JTAG interface so you can > program the Flash in system using the JTAG interface (don't laugh, it's a > documented Intel hack). > > Erik > > -- > There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the > croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:26:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16769 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:26:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16765 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:26:58 +0200 Received: from smtp1.chello.se (smtp1.chello.se [193.150.195.10]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA0056D8WXQA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:26:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chello.se ([193.150.216.55]) by smtp1.chello.se (InterMail vK.4.02.00.00 201-232-116 license 70acae3d5ac8b27d1dfb8564bfbfa8a7) with ESMTP id <20000419211308.IUDS26352.smtp1@chello.se> for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:13:08 +0200 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:12:10 +0200 From: David Belius Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FE212A.1C4276C7@chello.se> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <200004192045.WAA10890@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Shouldnt Beowulf run out of the box if gcc and Linux are already ported(provided you have some sort of network connecting the nodes)? Erik Mouw wrote: > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:52:04 +0100, Rodney Arne Karlsen wrote: > > Is it posable to cluster the Lart? > > Not yet, we're working on it. > > Erik > > -- > J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department > of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, > Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands > Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl > WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:30:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16814 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:30:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16810 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:30:30 +0200 Received: from homer.ueic.com ([209.118.28.10]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA005FS92SKD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:30:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ueic.com (lisa [209.118.28.2]) by homer.ueic.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) id H182YMGG; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:27:38 -0700 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:34:20 -0700 From: Bob Campbell Subject: Re: a small proposal To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Bob-C@writeme.com Message-id: <38FE265C.C2B12E40@ueic.com> Organization: Universal Electronics Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk  
Please put me down for up to 3 of the full combos (LART+KSB+Eth)
depending on price / availability / turn around.
(preferably all assembled and tested but boards are fine too).

Thanks,
Bob Campbell
 

On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote:

>We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra
>blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet
>combo.
 
  -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:32:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16835 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:32:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16831 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:32:16 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA0059290PQA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:32:15 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:23:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 In-reply-to: <200004192058.WAA10938@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:39:54 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > BTW - what is the recommended flash programmer to use and cost/source? > > One that works with Linux is preferable. > > Jan-Derk and Adam are working on a parallel port JTAG interface so you can > program the Flash in system using the JTAG interface (don't laugh, it's a > documented Intel hack). If it can be of any help, I ported the Intel's SA1110 utility for parallel port / JTAG flash programming to Linux. It's available from ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico. This can certainly be easily adapted for the SA1100. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:36:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16862 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:36:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16858 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:36:56 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA0057O9DIY2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:36:56 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:27:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Flash Programmer [was Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2] In-reply-to: <38FE2049.5D82A838@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Like I said, I ported the Intel stuff to Linux. I reflashed my SA1110 board with it no problem. It's slow but it works great. On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Hee hee, you've got to be some of the most inventive people I've come > across. Please announce it when they're done - I'd like to get one... > > Mike > > Erik Mouw wrote: > > > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:39:54 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > > BTW - what is the recommended flash programmer to use and cost/source? > > > One that works with Linux is preferable. > > > > Jan-Derk and Adam are working on a parallel port JTAG interface so you can > > program the Flash in system using the JTAG interface (don't laugh, it's a > > documented Intel hack). > > > > Erik > > > > -- > > There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the > > croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:38:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16878 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:38:38 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16874 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:38:37 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA11161; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:38:34 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:38:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004192138.XAA11161@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: nico@cam.org Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:23:20 -0400 (EDT), Nicolas Pitre wrote: > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> Jan-Derk and Adam are working on a parallel port JTAG interface so you can >> program the Flash in system using the JTAG interface (don't laugh, it's a >> documented Intel hack). > > If it can be of any help, I ported the Intel's SA1110 utility for parallel > port / JTAG flash programming to Linux. It's available from > ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico. This can certainly be easily adapted for > the SA1100. That's exactly what Jan-Derk wanted to do. JDB, if you're "sleepless in Gemert": please go ahead! ;-) Erik [it's so nice to know that your co-worker is reading his email 150km away from you] -- "God. Root. What is difference?" -- Pitr in "User Friendly" by Illiad -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 19 23:43:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA16896 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:43:07 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA16892 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:43:06 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA28010; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:43:03 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004192143.XAA28010@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: LART Packaging... To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl (Erik Mouw) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:43:03 +0200 (MEST) Cc: rodney.karlsen@yahoo.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: <200004192045.WAA10890@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> from "Erik Mouw" at Apr 19, 2000 10:45:44 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:52:04 +0100, Rodney Arne Karlsen wrote: > > Is it posable to cluster the Lart? > > Not yet, we're working on it. That means: you can expect the logo Real Soon Now(tm), the actual code and hardware will take a while longer :) -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 00:15:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA17061 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:15:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA17057 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:15:47 +0200 Received: from smtp1.chello.se (smtp1.chello.se [193.150.195.10]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA006IWB6AZ3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:15:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chello.se ([193.150.216.55]) by smtp1.chello.se (InterMail vK.4.02.00.00 201-232-116 license 70acae3d5ac8b27d1dfb8564bfbfa8a7) with ESMTP id <20000419220157.IVKD26352.smtp1@chello.se> for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:01:57 +0200 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:00:46 +0200 From: David Belius Subject: Re: linux-2.3.99-pre3-rmk2-np2 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FE2C8E.1E915990@chello.se> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <200004192138.XAA11161@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > -- > "God. Root. What is difference?" > -- Pitr in "User Friendly" by Illiad Man, I want one of those "Evil Genius in training" t-shirts att ufstore.org =) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 00:23:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA17107 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:23:59 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA17103 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:23:58 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA0074PBJRWG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:23:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id AAA22403; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:20:18 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:20:32 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: LART Power Pack [was RE: Feature Request] In-reply-to: <200004190035.CAA24054@historia.et.tudelft.nl> To: "'Marc Joosen'" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000301bfaa4d$7aba59e0$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Right now my suggestion would be: 1a. 2 LiIon cells, 5mm thick (still haven't found them) for a battery voltage of 5.2 - 8.2V. 1b. 4 NiMH cells, 5 mm thick for a battery voltage of 4.0 - 6.4V. 2. A protection circuit from Unitrode or other. 3. A SEPIC charger based on the LT1513-2 from Linear Technology. 4. A small microcontroller with at least 10bit ADC, preferably the PIC from Microchip. 5. Some glue analog stuff to interface the PIC with the charger and be able to measure cell voltage, charge/discharge current, cell temperature. 6. Optional coulomb counter for more precise charge indication. 7. Optional software controlled input current limiting. 8. Any GPIO, PWM, ADC pins not used on the board routed to a pin header for generic use (this is what many have been screaming for is it not?) This would give the following spec.: Vin: 2.7 - 30V. Icharge: 0.6 - 2.0A based on input voltage and battery type. Efficiency: mid eighties (can't do better with a SEPIC). Interface: As much/little intelligence as you want depending on where you want the charging algorithm, 10 to 12bit ADC, 25mA source/sink GPIO. I had a look at the pictures and if the LART powerconnector is moved to the low speed side and made straight it seems possible to sandwich the LPP (my acronym for LART Power Pack) between the LART and the KSB with some stack-through headers to continue the low speed bus and a 1x4 header for the power. What I/O is available for the interface? Some simple SPI would be nice but are there any left? I don't know how Linux feels about a bit-banged SPI port on some GPIO's. Memory mapping will probably require too much of the (hopefully) simple charger, especially with regards to access time. This is a question for the original designers how they feel it should be. Being able to charge from input voltages both higher and lower than the battery voltage has its drawbacks in a more complex circuit, more parts and usually ends up with a lower charging current. But, no matter what battery chemistry and voltage we end up with it's going to be higher than LART minimum input and (most likely) lower than max input. Therefore the SEPIC configuration. Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of Marc Joosen > Sent: 19 April, 2000 02:36 > To: Nicolai Mahncke > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: Feature Request > > > > > > If you and/or the list can agree on some rought specs on a > charger I will try > > and do a design for it. > > Ok, here are my thoughts on this: a module with the same > footprint as the > other boards, i.e. 10x7cm, containing the battery and the > charger (both are > linked by the battery requirements, so it doesn't make much > sense to keep > them apart). Currently, the mainboard isn't designed to have > a power module > stacked on it, and it will likely be between the KSB and a > memory expansion > board. This means that the connection to the mainboard has to > be in the form > of wires outside the stack of pcb's (beware of stack overflows :) > On the software side: it would be nice to have at least an > indication of > the battery status, if not complete control over the charging > process. I > think we can do without APM/ACPI, which is a disaster in > itself -- I've got > a ThinkPad 600X, that should say enough. > > > Marc is right about all the different battery types and > charging schemes but > > in real life they narrow down to a few if you want many > cycles and fast > > charging. > > ...and it also depends on the type of application. I can imagine > situations where the self-discharge of a NiCd cell would be > more than the > current drain by the LART: a datalogger/controller in a hot > location for > example. > > > Even though Li-Ion are difficult to get (because of the > mandatory protection > > circuit) I recomend using them for their light weight, high > capacity, low > > self-discharge, easy charger (just need a current limited, > very accurate > > voltage) and the fact that you only need two cells to do the job. > > Agreed. I haven't found anything for sale but cellphone and laptop > batteries, and the pages > http://www.sanyobatteries.net/Lithium-ion.html http://www.gpbatteries.com/lithium.htm look a bit sad... Any other links? There are enough charge controllers and protection chips available, but without actual cells they're not much use. > What recharge input did you have in mind? Mains, wall-adapter, car, solar > panel, another battery? Well, ideally it should work on the same range of supply voltages the mainboard accepts, but it may be too much to have step-up convertor on the module. Using a linear regulator could defeat the advantage of low-power LART altogether, so it should most likely be a switching charger. Let's say anything over 5V, ac as well as dc, should be acceptable? Maybe you need a current limiter if you also want to be able to use solar cells, to get them to operate at max power. North Pole, here we come! (during the 6-month day, at least :) -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 01:50:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA17522 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:50:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17518 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:50:22 +0200 From: marcus.giles@deltagold.com.au Received: from phoenix.deltagold.com.au ([203.47.0.66]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA0094WFJVV1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:50:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au (localmail.kbgm.deltagold.com.au [203.38.127.2]) by phoenix.deltagold.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA27101 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:09:35 +0800 Received: by kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.4 (830.2 3-23-1999)) id 482568C6.008266BA ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:44:19 +0800 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:44:17 +0800 Subject: I'll have a few To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <482568C6.0082667A.00@kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: DELTAGOLD Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I can say that If the ksb is looking at $60.00 (yankee money) I'll have about 4-6 of em in australia. I don't mind if they are pre-made or a bag full o bits (and some minor instructions), I'm not afraid of a challenge.. :-) My e-mail is senectus@emerge.net.au Mobile phone 041 919 5505 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 01:58:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA17548 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:58:26 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17544 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:58:25 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00998FXBV1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:58:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA14894; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:54:28 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA01443; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:54:37 -0400 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:54:37 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: <200004181335.JAA22640@deimos.mars.org> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: Rob Leslie Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk There's something I don't really understand. What's the difference if the mp3 softtware uses 10% or 40% of the CPU. As long as it does leave a little for the OS (which probably doesn't need that much), everything should be ok no or am-I forgetting something important here ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Rob Leslie wrote: > nick wrote: > >> the strongarm can play mp3s right? :) > > "J.D. Bakker" replied: > > Yes. See the archive for a comparison of CPU time per player (there are > > around four players that will work , IIRC). It's arund 20-25% CPU now, and > > I believe that with some clever coding to the cache we can bring it down to > > 10%. > > The best number I found for MP3 decoding on the SA-1100 was 24% (Xaudio) with > the next best being in the 32-41% CPU range. > > For the complete list, see: > > http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/list/list-one.php3?mid=200004150136.VAA31093%40deimos.mars.org > > The smaller CPU numbers are only currently for the other audio layers, "MP1" > and "MP2" (21-25% among the best) which generally require a much higher > bitrate than MP3 to achieve the same quality. > > I am doing active development on MAD. If anyone would like to help, I invite > you to join the mad-dev mailing list: > > http://www.mars.org/home/rob/proj/mpeg/ > > Cheers, > > -- > Rob Leslie > rob@mars.org > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 02:21:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA17645 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:21:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA17641 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:21:30 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00AA4GZT58@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:21:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA14933 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:21:26 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA01477 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:21:36 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:21:36 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-reply-to: <38FDA822.BDBEB862@gmx.net> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Oh man, that does actually sound very cool (don't think it could be done, but it sounds so cool!) David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > is the strong-arm smp capable ? > > if yes, we could put 16 strong-arms on a full-length pci card > and a desktop-beowolf is online :-) > > mfg mrq1 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 02:23:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA17664 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:23:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA17660 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:23:50 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA009H0H3OV1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:23:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA14940 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:23:46 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA01481 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:23:56 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:23:56 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-reply-to: <200004191330.PAA08590@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Couldn't you do on board ethernet and have everything on a PCI board ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > > is the strong-arm smp capable ? > > No. > > > if yes, we could put 16 strong-arms on a full-length pci card > > and a desktop-beowolf is online :-) > > The nice thing about a beowolf cluster is that is doesn't need SMP, just > some kind of interconnect. Silly plan n+1 is to design such an > interconnect board. > > > Erik > > -- > J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department > of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, > Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands > Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl > WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 02:40:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA17704 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:40:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA17700 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:40:20 +0200 Received: from marzipan.nougat.org (9.194.6.64.reflexcom.com [64.6.194.9]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00AGCHV658@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:40:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by marzipan.nougat.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA15876; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:40:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:40:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Secret Asian Man Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? In-reply-to: To: David Poisson Cc: Rob Leslie , lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, David Poisson wrote: > As long as it does leave a little for the OS (which probably doesn't > need that much), everything should be ok no or am-I forgetting > something important here ? Because code must be clean and efficient! Because it /can/ be done! And because the lart is way too cool to be delegated to being a single-job piece of hardware. I want it to filter packets, generate graphs /and/ play mp3s :) chris who can't wait to get NetBSD running on them... -- Christopher Kyin-hwa Chen You can tune a file system, but you can't tune a fish. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 03:54:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA17894 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:54:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA17890 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:54:09 +0200 From: chris@satel.com Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00B1DLA8X1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:54:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from www by mail.xmission.com with local (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12i695-0006zT-00; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:52:43 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:54:08 +0200 (MET DST) Date-warning: Date header was inserted by mailhost1.tudelft.nl To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <0FTA00B1ELA8X1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:52:43 -700 To: Nicolai Mahncke X-Originating-IP: [166.70.9.10] From: Chris Curtis MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <000301bfaa4d$7aba59e0$351a10ac@reipur.com> Content-Length: 502 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LART Power Pack [was RE: Feature Request] User-Agent: IMHO/0.97.1 (Webmail for Roxen) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-Id: No PIC. AVR. Otherwise good. :-) ------------------------------ Chris Curtis Systems Engineer Satel Corporation "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:39:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18063 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:03 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18055; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:00 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200004191808.UAA10284@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:25:22 +0200 To: Nicolas Pitre From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Feature Request Cc: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 20:24 +0200 19-04-2000, Nicolas Pitre wrote: >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > >> Please tell us where we can get non-PCI ethernet chips in quantities less >> than 10000. Even big players as Sun use PCI for 100 Mbit ethernet: they >> use a PCI ethernet chip and put an SBUS to PCI bridge to hook it to the >> system bus (SBUS). > >The solution is maybe to design one. There are open VHDL projects out >there wishing just for that. See http://www.opencores.org. 'wishing' being the operative word. Designing a properly working 100BT-core is nontrivial; probably even more so than a CPU core. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:39:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18099 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:09 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18067; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:05 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200004191330.PAA08590@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:33:37 +0200 To: David Poisson From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: strongarm smp Cc: lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 02:23 +0200 20-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: >> On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: >> > is the strong-arm smp capable ? >> >> No. To be a tad more verbose: ARM offers no cache coherency. That kind of blows SMP out of the water. >Couldn't you do on board ethernet and have everything on a PCI board ? PCI sucks for high speed low latency interconnects. Ethernet even more so. JDB [think 400MByte/sec communication instead] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:38:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18035 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:38:55 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18012; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:38:49 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:11:20 +0200 To: Secret Asian Man From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: can it handle mp3s? Cc: Rob Leslie , lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, David Poisson wrote: > >> As long as it does leave a little for the OS (which probably doesn't >> need that much), everything should be ok no or am-I forgetting >> something important here ? > >Because code must be clean and efficient! Because it /can/ be done! And >because the lart is way too cool to be delegated to being a single-job >piece of hardware. I want it to filter packets, generate graphs /and/ play >mp3s :) Oh and don't forget power usage. Less instructions executed == more battery time. JDB [from the middle of nowhere] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:39:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18058 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:01 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18049; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:38:58 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FDAE99.48324692@steves-house.org.uk> References: <38FD63DD.5C46F64C@steves-house.org.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:22:13 +0200 To: Steve Wiseman From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 15:03 +0200 19-04-2000, Steve Wiseman wrote: >Steve Goodwin wrote: > >> The working basis for me shipping complete boards would be no case or >> PSU I reckon. > >Yes- it was the discussion about packaging that prodded my mind in this >direction. > >> Rest assured I will try to avoid getting into trouble here :) > >Being a test case for open-source hardware Vs CE legislation strikes me >as a lot of no-fun :( As I recall CE is autocertification; maybe Erik can provide more insight. >Out of interest, does anyone on this list have easy access to an EMC >test chamber? - I see a lot more softies than hardware people... I have -- for varying values of 'easy'. ATM i'm on holidays (until May 4); will try afterwards. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:38:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18053 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:38:59 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18036; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:38:55 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000201bfaa29$b00100a0$351a10ac@reipur.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:19:18 +0200 To: Nicolai Mahncke From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: RE: BOOOOOM Cc: "'J.D. Bakker'" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 20:04 +0200 19-04-2000, Nicolai Mahncke wrote: >Just some questions that popped up during BOM conversion: > >1. You specify resistors as 0805 but the Farnell ordernumber refers to 0603. >Which one do you want? On the pictures it looks like you have soldered 0603 on >0805 footprints. That should be 0805. I'm officially on holidays, and I didn't bring my Farnell telephone book, so I can't correct the item #s right now. >2. What speedgrade is nescessary on the Flash, 120ns or 95ns? Either is fine; we work with 120ns. Basically whatever you can lay your hands on. >3. Have you considered all the negative effects of using the cheap Y5V type >ceramic capacitors? Yes; I've built an X7R (sp?) and an Y5V version and cannot measure a difference in power supply noise on the chip pins or EMC at room temperature. >4. You specify U8 as a "74LVC157D 3V3 Quad 2-in Mux in SO package". The >Farnell number refers to a 74LCX157M from Fairchild. Which one is it? Either. Anything that runs off 3v3 and is reasonably fast. IIRC TI 74LVC157D == Fairchild 74LCX157M . JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:39:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18068 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:05 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18060; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:39:03 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <38FE212A.1C4276C7@chello.se> References: <200004192045.WAA10890@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:28:54 +0200 To: David Belius From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART Packaging... Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 23:12 +0200 19-04-2000, David Belius wrote: >Shouldnt Beowulf run out of the box if gcc and Linux are already >ported(provided >you have some sort of network connecting the nodes)? Yes. The exact implementation of 'some sort of network' kind of determines the problem set a clusterLART can be applied to. Many LARTs with Ethernet would for example build a nice password cracker ;-), but for the clusterLART interconnect our goals are a tad higher. #insert "scalability_speech.h" JDB -- Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 04:53:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA18217 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:53:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA18210 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:53:18 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTA00CB6O0PHP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:53:17 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From bell10 With LocalMail ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:49:06 +1000 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:48:39 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@bell10.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: David Poisson , lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 02:23 +0200 20-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: > >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > >> On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > >> > is the strong-arm smp capable ? > >> > >> No. > > To be a tad more verbose: ARM offers no cache coherency. That kind of blows > SMP out of the water. On this note I'm wondering how this will effect the usage of FPGA's and DSP's as coprocessors handing off the SA11X0 bus and bus mastering. They have the speed to do some nice crunching but will the caching coherency become a problem? Maybe this is something worth looking into with the microkernel work I'm supposed to be doing ;) What do you think? Cheers Adam > > >Couldn't you do on board ethernet and have everything on a PCI board ? > > PCI sucks for high speed low latency interconnects. Ethernet even more so. > > JDB > [think 400MByte/sec communication instead] > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 05:00:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA18248 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:00:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA18244 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:00:32 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00C6QOCSO9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:00:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id WAA15168 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:56:25 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id WAA01769 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:56:36 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:56:36 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Actually, I don't have any idea what you just said to me means ;-) David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > > At 02:23 +0200 20-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: > > >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > >> On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > > >> > is the strong-arm smp capable ? > > >> > > >> No. > > > > To be a tad more verbose: ARM offers no cache coherency. That kind of blows > > SMP out of the water. > > On this note I'm wondering how this will effect the usage of > FPGA's and DSP's as coprocessors handing off the SA11X0 bus and bus > mastering. They have the speed to do some nice crunching but will the > caching coherency become a problem? Maybe this is something worth looking > into with the microkernel work I'm supposed to be doing ;) > What do you think? > > Cheers Adam > > > > >Couldn't you do on board ethernet and have everything on a PCI board ? > > > > PCI sucks for high speed low latency interconnects. Ethernet even more so. > > > > JDB > > [think 400MByte/sec communication instead] > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 05:07:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA18288 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:07:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA18284 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:07:05 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTA00D1UONP1L@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:07:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From bell10 With LocalMail ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:06:50 +1000 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:06:50 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: strongarm smp In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@bell10.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: David Poisson Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Sorry it was mainly aimmed at JDB, and handling should be hanging. Happy Holidays, Adam On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, David Poisson wrote: > Actually, I don't have any idea what you just said to me means ;-) > > David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org > > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > > > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > > > > At 02:23 +0200 20-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: > > > >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > > >> On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:35:46 +0200, Hermann 'mrq1' Gausterer wrote: > > > >> > is the strong-arm smp capable ? > > > >> > > > >> No. > > > > > > To be a tad more verbose: ARM offers no cache coherency. That kind of blows > > > SMP out of the water. > > > > On this note I'm wondering how this will effect the usage of > > FPGA's and DSP's as coprocessors handing off the SA11X0 bus and bus > > mastering. They have the speed to do some nice crunching but will the > > caching coherency become a problem? Maybe this is something worth looking > > into with the microkernel work I'm supposed to be doing ;) > > What do you think? > > > > Cheers Adam > > > > > > >Couldn't you do on board ethernet and have everything on a PCI board ? > > > > > > PCI sucks for high speed low latency interconnects. Ethernet even more so. > > > > > > JDB > > > [think 400MByte/sec communication instead] > > > > > > -- > > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 05:11:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA18304 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:11:57 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA18300 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:11:56 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FTA00EDQOVUJ9@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:11:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.52] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A4E1C8B301D2; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:09:21 -0500 Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:12:04 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Linux CAE? Cc: lart Message-id: <38FE7584.D50D1636@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Has anyone tried the Eagle CAE application for Linux? http://www.cadsoftusa.com/ is the URL. I'm downloading the freeware version, but their commercial version doesn't seem that expensive. Maybe that will be a cheap enough alternative for those non-rich CAE whizzes to contribute to the project without spending a ton of money? Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 08:07:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA18631 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 08:07:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA18627 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 08:07:23 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTA00FNVX0931@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 08:07:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id CAA15408; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:03:20 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id CAA02398; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:03:33 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 06:03:33 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: Linux CAE? In-reply-to: <38FE7584.D50D1636@mjv.com> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk There don't seem to be any screnshots, mind posting one to the list after you've installed it ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Has anyone tried the Eagle CAE application for Linux? > http://www.cadsoftusa.com/ is the URL. I'm downloading the freeware > version, but their commercial version doesn't seem that expensive. Maybe > that will be a cheap enough alternative for those non-rich CAE whizzes > to contribute to the project without spending a ton of money? > > Mike > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 09:21:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18787 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:21:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18783 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:21:24 +0200 Received: from knatte.tninet.se (knatte.tninet.se [195.100.94.10]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTB00J2D0FB3I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:21:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 5252 invoked from network); Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:17:03 +0200 Received: from garibaldi.tninet.se (HELO algonet.se) (195.100.94.103) by knatte.tninet.se with SMTP; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:17:03 +0200 Received: from aristotle.algonet.se (aristotle.algonet.se [194.213.74.200]) by algonet.se (BLUETAIL Mail Robustifier 2.0.2) with ESMTP id garibaldi-s1-956.215023.46650 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:17:03 +0200 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:17:03 +0200 (MET DST) From: Yann Vernier Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <67.3213aef.262f3656@aol.com> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 LeoSusanto@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated Tue, 18 Apr 2000 9:23:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com writes: > > please put me down for at least 1 lart+ksb+ethernet(4 port would be nice) > > price pending. lower cost = more units. I also have a few interested > > friends. any one interested in a group purchase of lcd displays? I'm interested too. Preferably fully assembled, if the price is good probably three or four units. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 09:58:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18878 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:58:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18874 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:58:44 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00KC125VVT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:58:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.135) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:42:35 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:42:43 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: re: Battery Charger X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000420003843.00b375c0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The central point of my musings about a battery charger is that the LART is only going to need (at most) 2 Watts, while the LCD is going to need a lot more. What kind of I/O do people envision for their LART? (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 12:57:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA19474 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:57:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA19470 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:57:19 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00AY3AFH0S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:57:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA15841 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 06:53:00 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA03250 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 06:53:18 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 10:53:18 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Some clarity on if this could be done X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was reflecting on what I wanted to do exactly with a LART (After all, I have to find an excuse to buy one hehe) and the following is pretty much what I had in mind. I want to do a small portable computer that runs linux. Don't mind if it's not the best processor, as long as it doesn't consume too much power. Would be nice to have some audio for those long boring classes, ethernet to connect to wherever I go (school network or home network) and an LCD screen (color capable) to see wtf I'm doing ;-) I would probably have to do my own case, create a keyboard (no need for a mouse) and put a thing to connect to 120W wall plug (not to mention what everyone was talking about a couple of days ago as to which battery should be used). I also wanted to ask something: can the IDE controller on the KSB board support more than 1 device ? (IDE floppy + IDE hard disk for example) Question is: could this be done with lart ? Being monitoring the mailing-list for about a week now and it seems that a LART would be perfect for what I wanna do. Keep in mind that I also wanna learn how all that electrical stuff works, so I don't mind doing some of the stuff myself (so don't say I should get a laptop instead hehe) David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 14:32:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA19663 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:32:24 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA19659 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:32:23 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id OAA15357; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:32:20 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:32:20 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004201232.OAA15357@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Cc: steve@steves-house.org.uk, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:22:13 +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 15:03 +0200 19-04-2000, Steve Wiseman wrote: >>Being a test case for open-source hardware Vs CE legislation strikes me >>as a lot of no-fun :( > > As I recall CE is autocertification; maybe Erik can provide more insight. Yes, you can buy sheets with nice CE marks which you can stick on everything. Of course, you can still be held liable for reckless CE marking. I'll ask my brother and/or father for more details when I see them this weekend, they both are in the certification bussiness. Erik -- "software industry, the: unique industry where selling substandard goods is legal and you can charge extra for fixing the problems." -- Duncan Simpson on BugTraq -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 15:10:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA19847 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:10:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA19843 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:10:14 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00LYMGL19E@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:10:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12iGeM-0000Nz-00; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:05:42 +0100 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:06:40 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: EMC issues / liability To: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FF00E0.3EBB6FE1@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004201232.OAA15357@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > Yes, you can buy sheets with nice CE marks which you can stick on > everything. Of course, you can still be held liable for reckless CE > marking. I'll ask my brother and/or father for more details when I see > them this weekend, they both are in the certification bussiness. That would be very handy- this (CE) has been the main reason I've been reluctant to release designs into the wider world... There's quite a lot I would like to share, but I can't handle the legal implications if some dullard was to sue me. Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 19:03:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA20858 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:03:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA20854 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:03:29 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00A5ARDS3I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:03:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.40] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A75DB40601F4; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:59:09 -0500 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:02:07 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Screenshots [was Re: Linux CAE?] Cc: lart Message-id: <38FF380F.F4398B88@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here's a link to four screenshots I made. It's a pretty nifty application... http://www.mjv.com/eagle.html All png files, and the thumbnails are still a little big (to keep detail) so be ready for a little wait if you've a slow connection... BTW - what software is the core team using? I'd love to get in and play with the hardware design too... Perhaps the Eagle can open their schematics files? Cheers, Mike David Poisson wrote: > > There don't seem to be any screenshots, mind posting one to the list after > you've installed it ? > > David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > > Has anyone tried the Eagle CAE application for Linux? > > http://www.cadsoftusa.com/ is the URL. I'm downloading the freeware > > version, but their commercial version doesn't seem that expensive. Maybe > > that will be a cheap enough alternative for those non-rich CAE whizzes > > to contribute to the project without spending a ton of money? > > > > Mike > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 19:38:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA20966 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:38:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA20962 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:38:05 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00BSKSZF2A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:38:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.65]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:40:39 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:32:57 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: Screenshots [was Re: Linux CAE?] In-reply-to: <38FF380F.F4398B88@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00042011345401.02325@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <38FF380F.F4398B88@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here is a funny or stupid name I came up with for the LART mini-bewolf cluster; BOB, BewOlf in a Box On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Here's a link to four screenshots I made. It's a pretty nifty > application... > > http://www.mjv.com/eagle.html > > All png files, and the thumbnails are still a little big (to keep > detail) so be ready for a little wait if you've a slow connection... > > BTW - what software is the core team using? I'd love to get in and play > with the hardware design too... Perhaps the Eagle can open their > schematics files? > > Cheers, > Mike > > David Poisson wrote: > > > > There don't seem to be any screenshots, mind posting one to the list after > > you've installed it ? > > > > David Poisson > > david@fish.ecks.org > > > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > > > > Has anyone tried the Eagle CAE application for Linux? > > > http://www.cadsoftusa.com/ is the URL. I'm downloading the freeware > > > version, but their commercial version doesn't seem that expensive. Maybe > > > that will be a cheap enough alternative for those non-rich CAE whizzes > > > to contribute to the project without spending a ton of money? > > > > > > Mike > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 20:11:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA21075 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:11:53 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA21071 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:11:53 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00DPPUJRCK@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:11:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail4.magma.ca (mail4.magma.ca [206.191.0.222]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA26537; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:56:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail4.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA02869; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:56:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:59:11 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: Screenshots [was Re: Linux CAE?] To: dogman@bitterroot.net, Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <38FF456F.D41C79F9@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <38FF380F.F4398B88@mjv.com> <00042011345401.02325@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > Here is a funny or stupid name I came up with for the LART > mini-bewolf cluster; BOB, BewOlf in a Box Hey, this is not bad - slap together a stylized image of some guy in a white lab coat, pocket protector & busted glasses and you got you're Tux equivalent... BOB :-) Eat your heart out Netpliance (OK - for those not exposed to North American media - they're presently running ads featuring a wide selection of "everyday" people all wearing busted "geek" glasses - including a very young infant) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 20:18:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA21090 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:18:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA21086 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:18:32 +0200 Received: from falcon.ugwarehouse.org (falcon.ugwarehouse.org [216.254.59.186]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00EM1UUU30@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:18:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from proteus (helo=localhost) by falcon.ugwarehouse.org with local-smtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12iLK5-0000Gw-00; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:05:05 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:05:05 -0700 (PDT) From: The Proteus Subject: Re: Screenshots [was Re: Linux CAE?] In-reply-to: <00042011345401.02325@localhost.localdomain> To: Doug Moreen Cc: Michael Vanecek , lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Why not further the overloading of the acronym? LART - LART Advanced Routing Topology :-) The Proteus - - - T h e U n d e r g r o u n d W a r e h o u s e - - - - - - Subversive - Tools - For - A - Chaotic - Planet - - - - h t t p : / / w w w . u g w a r e h o u s e . o r g / - ------- On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > Here is a funny or stupid name I came up with for the LART > mini-bewolf cluster; BOB, BewOlf in a Box > > > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > Here's a link to four screenshots I made. It's a pretty nifty > > application... > > > > http://www.mjv.com/eagle.html > > > > All png files, and the thumbnails are still a little big (to keep > > detail) so be ready for a little wait if you've a slow connection... > > > > BTW - what software is the core team using? I'd love to get in and play > > with the hardware design too... Perhaps the Eagle can open their > > schematics files? > > > > Cheers, > > Mike > > > > David Poisson wrote: > > > > > > There don't seem to be any screenshots, mind posting one to the list after > > > you've installed it ? > > > > > > David Poisson > > > david@fish.ecks.org > > > > > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > > > > > > Has anyone tried the Eagle CAE application for Linux? > > > > http://www.cadsoftusa.com/ is the URL. I'm downloading the freeware > > > > version, but their commercial version doesn't seem that expensive. Maybe > > > > that will be a cheap enough alternative for those non-rich CAE whizzes > > > > to contribute to the project without spending a ton of money? > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > -- > > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 20:20:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA21105 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:20:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA21101 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:20:18 +0200 Received: from praseodumium.btinternet.com (praseodumium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.82]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00EMZUXT30@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:20:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [213.1.142.187] (helo=mirkwood) by praseodumium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12iLNj-0004uT-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:08:51 +0100 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:13:05 +0100 From: Gav Reid Subject: Other StrongArm boards To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <008801bfaaf4$15fb0de0$0102a8c0@mirkwood> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <4.2.0.58.20000420003843.00b375c0@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Just in Case anyone can't wait for a lart http://www.simtec.co.uk/ - Sell a StrongArm ATX board for £350+vat http://www.chaltech.co.uk - Make the Boards and Also have a 16xSA1100 on a pci card thingy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 20:44:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA21153 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:44:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA21149 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:44:31 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00FC4W262M@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:44:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA05847; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:42:38 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:42:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: re: Battery Charger In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000420003843.00b375c0@mail.clubnet.net> To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'd envision a lcd touch panel, for most user i/o though most of the other stuff on the ksb would be quite usefull. Eric On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > The central point of my musings about a battery charger is that the LART is > only going to need (at most) 2 Watts, while the LCD is going to need a lot > more. > > What kind of I/O do people envision for their LART? > > (s) Derek > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 21:25:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21332 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:25:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21328 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:25:45 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00GIJXYU8Z@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:25:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA06011; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:25:56 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:25:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: lart.org domain etc... was - Re: I think this was meant to go here - [Fwd: Re: a small proposal] In-reply-to: <38FB2E75.3FE2283E@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > I know when I hit reply I get the poster's email rather than the > listserv. Any way to fix that? > > Additionally, is anyone volunteering to gather a list of names together > to help facilitate a bulk order? That and maybe put together a buyer's > club of sorts (Here in TX we call them Cooperatives) where we can send > funds to bankroll this? Doug mentioned that he may have inadvertently > volunteered by suggesting this, but a willing volunteer (even Doug if > he's willing) would be a _good_ thing. :) co-op would be a good thing. money in rebate back based upon profits. you end up paying only what things REALLY cost and helping a worthwile project at the same time. > I figure maybe lart.org if > it's available... Ideas? We're little people here, but together we can > be big (waxing profound - sorry) :) > I checked into lart.org and it is currently REGISTERED to jp@midcoast.com: Jason Philbrook of midcoast internet solutions (let's not fill his mailbox on this. I volunteered to be a point of contact and include this address only because it is a matter of public record.) I spoke to Jason (I hope I didn't step on any toes in doing this) and he seemed amiable to the idea of giving it up or at least pointing the dns somewhere that could host lart pages. he did state that he, "needed to discuss this with his staff", however. I will keep the list posted. would one or more of the principals of this project contact me on this. it would be much appreciated. Eric Fort > Mike > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: a small proposal > Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:41:09 EDT > From: LeoSusanto@aol.com > To: mike@mjv.com > > let me in too. but where is your location? i am at southern CA > > leo > In a message dated 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > mike@mjv.com > writes: > > << Subj: Re: a small proposal > Date: 4/16/00 8:07:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time > From: mike@mjv.com (Michael Vanecek) > Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl > To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl > > Put me down as a participant. Quantity will depend on price... > > Mike > > Doug Moreen wrote: > > > > For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle > the > > production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > > already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards > made > up. > > I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > percentage > > points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless > I'm > > mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single > card > > from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. I think therefore a > 30% > > profit per item for the poor guy schleeping the boards to and from > the > > board shop and to the post office is NOT too much for this person to > get. > > (Profit if it facilates everybody getting product in a timely and > cost > > effective manner is GOOD!). There are some numbers in the message > archive, > > regarding the cost of producing a raw pcb, that do back this up. > > > > So how many people in the US would be interested if we go some sort > of org > to > > handle this? > > > > Moneys could easily be handled with something like PayPal. ( > > http://www.paypal.com ) > > regards > > Doug Moreen > > dogman@bitterroot.net > > AllBoot.Com > > http://www.allboot.com > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- > Return-Path: > Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com > [172.18.147.1]) > by air-yg01.mail.aol.com (v70.20) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:07:20 > 2000 > Received: from thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (thorgal.et.tudelft.nl > [130.161.40.91]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v71.10) with ESMTP; Sun, 16 Apr > 2000 > 23:07:00 -0400 > Received: (from majordomo@localhost) > by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26884 > for lart-outgoing; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:17 +0200 > Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) > by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26880 > for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:16 +0200 > Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) > by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) > with ESMTP id <0FT500KJO3XEEH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for > lart@lart.tudelft.nl; > Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:51:15 +0200 (MET DST) > Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.18] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP > (SMTPD32-6.00) id AB504203DE; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:47:44 -0500 > Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:49:19 -0500 > From: Michael Vanecek > Subject: Re: a small proposal > To: dogman@bitterroot.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Message-id: <38FA7BAF.DD1E8845@mjv.com> > MIME-version: 1.0 > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) > Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit > X-Accept-Language: en > References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> > <00041617195201.08671@localhost.localdomain> > Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Precedence: bulk > > >> > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 21:34:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA21381 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:34:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21377 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:34:17 +0200 Received: from crisp.com (crisp.com [192.41.58.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00GBJYCZU4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:34:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from crisp.com (159.encentris.com [204.0.61.159]) by crisp.com (8.8.5) id NAA15012; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:29:03 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:28:43 -0500 From: Kent Perrier Subject: Re: Other StrongArm boards To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: kent.perrier@oneco.net Message-id: <38FF5A6B.153D8700@crisp.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000420003843.00b375c0@mail.clubnet.net> <008801bfaaf4$15fb0de0$0102a8c0@mirkwood> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Gav Reid wrote: > > http://www.chaltech.co.uk - Make the Boards and Also have a 16xSA1100 on > a pci card thingy I this site up? I cannot get to it... Kent -- "A simple man believes anything, but a prudent man gives thought to his steps." (Proverbs 14:15) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 22:03:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA21454 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:03:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA21450 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:03:09 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTB00H7AZP7YQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:03:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.52]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:05:44 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:44:03 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. So far there are requests for ~145 board assemblies. I've begun to send some info requests to board fabrication plants, but haven't yet got any hard numbers. Can't do much more then that, we don't have the Gerber files for the KSB or Ethernet cards yet. my poll is; 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before committing to getting the LART boards made. I'm going to have some cost numbers for manufacturing the LART boards by Monday they will be in two parts assembled and not assembled, which brings us to question 3.)which shouldn't be answered yet, until I actually have some hard numbers. 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it pre-assembled. I'm using a count of 200 boards as a starting point with the vendors. I also am going to have a couple of boards made before I commit to having 200 assembled. 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading of ROM code and testing) Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 22:11:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA21482 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:11:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA21478 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:11:02 +0200 Received: from protactinium ([194.73.73.176]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00HPE02DQN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:11:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [213.1.142.187] (helo=mirkwood) by protactinium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12iN1H-0001mj-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:53:47 +0100 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:57:09 +0100 From: Gav Reid Subject: Re: Other StrongArm boards To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004401bfab02$9ca8b690$0102a8c0@mirkwood> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <4.2.0.58.20000420003843.00b375c0@mail.clubnet.net> <008801bfaaf4$15fb0de0$0102a8c0@mirkwood> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Opps , www.chaltech.com not .co.uk ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gav Reid" To: Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:13 PM Subject: Other StrongArm boards > Just in Case anyone can't wait for a lart > > http://www.simtec.co.uk/ - Sell a StrongArm ATX board for £350+vat > > http://www.chaltech.co.uk - Make the Boards and Also have a 16xSA1100 on a > pci card thingy > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 22:48:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA21648 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:48:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA21644 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:48:38 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00JG71T00G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:48:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20] ident=root) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12iNnH-0001Ht-00; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:43:23 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12iNnG-0003Dd-00; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:43:22 -0600 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:43:22 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> To: Doug Moreen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Speaking for myself only, and that only barely: > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon Probably, assuming r4 has no major design changes. Also assuming that "soon" is in the < months range. > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. IMO, no. I recognize that I am biased because I don't need a full-up system for what I want to do (right now). New firmware is plenty complex with just one board. :-) > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. Not really much of an answer, just commentary: on the one hand, it's worth a LOT to me to not have to deal with SMT parts. At the same time, the whole point of SMT is that it doesn't cost a lot to do, in theory. My opinions may change depending on how the numbers come in. > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) It would be nice, but it's not essential to me, especially if the JTAG programmer is working and/or available. I plan to trash the firmware many times, so ease of (re)loading is more important that boot-out-of-the-box. Speaking of JTAG... something that might be REALLY nice for LARTv2 would be a real JTAG chain and BSDL file. (Maybe even an open-source JTAG tester!) That would make it much easier to test the boards for correct assembly, even w/o firmware. Actually, it might be cost-effective to have the assembly shop do the test themselves. Anyway, stuff to consider for the future. --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 22:52:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA21683 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:52:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA21679 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:52:29 +0200 Received: from neptune.imagen.net (neptune.imagenisp.com [204.244.138.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00JIJ1ZG0G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:52:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from saltspring.com (th-641810.th.gov.bc.ca [142.36.211.161]) by neptune.imagen.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id J1N12P1W; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:43:05 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:50:00 -0700 From: Varek Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FF6D78.3D578BA1@saltspring.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Doug Moreen wrote: > > to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. > my poll is; > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon Yes, willing to wait for debugged board. > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. Yes, LART doesn't do me much good without the peripherals. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. I really want assembled boards so I guess that means I'm quite motivated to pay an assembly fee. What is this normally as a percentage of overall manufacturing costs? > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) What would these services cost? Wasn't someone talking about being able to flash the ROM via a parallel port (didn't fully understand it) or do we need special hardware for this ourselves? What kind of testing are you talking about? Board testing (continuity, signals) or system testing, which would require the ROM to be loaded anyway? Getting a tested, ready to run board sounds wonderful - if I can afford it... I would like to take another opportunity to thank you Doug for taking the time to spearhead this for the rest of us. Varek varek@saltspring.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 23:10:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21718 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:10:06 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21714 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:10:05 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA17872; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:09:59 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:09:59 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004202109.XAA17872@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Cc: kn6td@clubnet.net, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: re: Battery Charger In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:42:37 -0400 (EDT), efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > I'd envision a lcd touch panel, for most user i/o though most of the other > stuff on the ksb would be quite usefull. The UCB 1200 on the KSB has touch screen support (which we're going to use, of course ;-). Johan is looking for a nice touch screen. Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 23:14:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21739 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:14:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21735 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:14:14 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00K102ZOPR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:14:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA06412; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:14:33 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:14:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> To: Doug Moreen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > my poll is; > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon yes. > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. yes > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. if it's not assembled it's not worth getting. there seems to be a much greater intrest in built units. I'd expect this to drop significantly if only kits were available due to assembly skill required. eric > I'm using a count of 200 boards as a starting point with the vendors. I also am > going to have a couple of boards made before I commit to having 200 assembled. > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) > > > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 23:24:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21772 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:24:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21768 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:24:21 +0200 Received: from smtpe.casema.net (smtpe.casema.net [195.96.96.172]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTC00K533GLVF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:24:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 23726 invoked from network); Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:23:04 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gatekeeper2.slim) (212.64.37.111) by smtpe.casema.net with SMTP; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:23:04 +0000 Received: from inter.nl.net (paragon.slim [192.168.100.26]) by gatekeeper2.slim (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA07958; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:22:17 +0200 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:30:09 +0200 From: Jurgen Kramer Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FF76E1.CFC07962@inter.nl.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon > I think that's a good idea because the MAX IC on rev3 is harder to get > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. Only a LART board isn't very usable to me so I prefer to wait. > > 3.)which shouldn't be answered yet, until I actually have some hard > numbers. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. > I can only comment on this when I see a price. But pre-assembled is a must for me, I do not want to fiddle with SMD stuff (lack of equipment etc). > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) > Not really necessary for me as long there is a way to do it yourself. Regards, Jurgen -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 20 23:35:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21812 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:35:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21808 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:35:53 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00KC63ZRVF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:35:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.49] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A7C2983E0218; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:33:54 -0500 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:37:39 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <38FF78A3.7F127119@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon If Rev 4 is relatively close to release, then it would be good to wait. It's kinda like spending all night configuring and compiling kernel 3.3.99 only to have kernel 3.4 come out in the morning... :) > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. I'd prefer to wait for the KSB and Eth boards to be tested and released and get the whole shabang. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. I would really prefer to have at least one of my boards put together by the fab house so at least I have something to measure against if later I decide to break out the soldering iron and give it a go myself. For the sake of my projects, having that part taken care of will free me up to concentrate on other portions of the project. But then, after viewing the costs side by side - unassembled vs assembled will be a determining factor. If the boards are inexpensive enough (below $400 bucks) then I can spring an extra 10% or so to have them pre-assembled. If they're over $400 bucks, then I may opt to do my own assembly work with crossed fingers... :) > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) I'd like to have at least one pre-loaded and tested board to measure my other boards against. Getting a good and reliable control will help enormously in my experimentation. Except for the first board, I plan on flashing my own rom and if I get proficient at it I'd certainly volunteer to flash boards for others too... Cheers, Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 00:32:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA22041 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA22037 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:44 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00MDX6MHHD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id AAA31400; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:13 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: RE: Battery Charger In-reply-to: <200004202109.XAA17872@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: "'Erik Mouw'" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000b01bfab18$4733b8c0$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Try Densitron http://europe.densitron.net/ they're really good at it and do a lot of custom design. My company currently use a custom version with polycarbonate instead of glass. They also have nice LCD's. Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of Erik Mouw > Sent: 20 April, 2000 23:10 > To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com > Cc: kn6td@clubnet.net; lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: re: Battery Charger > > > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:42:37 -0400 (EDT), > efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > I'd envision a lcd touch panel, for most user i/o though > most of the other > > stuff on the ksb would be quite usefull. > > The UCB 1200 on the KSB has touch screen support (which we're going to > use, of course ;-). Johan is looking for a nice touch screen. > > > Erik > > -- > There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the > croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to > the Galaxy > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 00:40:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA22070 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:40:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA22066 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:39:59 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00ML86XYHD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:39:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id AAA31400; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:13 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: RE: Battery Charger In-reply-to: <200004202109.XAA17872@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: "'Erik Mouw'" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000b01bfab18$4733b8c0$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Try Densitron http://europe.densitron.net/ they're really good at it and do a lot of custom design. My company currently use a custom version with polycarbonate instead of glass. They also have nice LCD's. Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of Erik Mouw > Sent: 20 April, 2000 23:10 > To: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com > Cc: kn6td@clubnet.net; lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: re: Battery Charger > > > On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:42:37 -0400 (EDT), > efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > I'd envision a lcd touch panel, for most user i/o though > most of the other > > stuff on the ksb would be quite usefull. > > The UCB 1200 on the KSB has touch screen support (which we're going to > use, of course ;-). Johan is looking for a nice touch screen. > > > Erik > > -- > There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the > croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to > the Galaxy > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 00:44:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA22085 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:44:27 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA22081 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:44:26 +0200 Received: from calvino.alaska.net (calvino.alaska.net [209.112.129.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00MPR760HD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:44:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rus@localhost) by calvino.alaska.net (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA21050 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:29:25 -0800 (AKDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:29:24 -0800 (AKDT) From: ":-)" Subject: Is CF a viable alternative? In-reply-to: <38FF76E1.CFC07962@inter.nl.net> X-Sender: rus@calvino To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: calvino.alaska.net: rus owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Pardon what might a be stupid design question (I'm a hacker, not an engineer). On the main board could you replace the four RAM chips with a CompactFlash adapter? The CompactFlash cards are more expensive than the RAM chips, but it would give one the flexibility to have as much ram (up to 128MB right now, larger to come) as one needs. It would also free up space on one side of the board. Another place that a CompactFlash adapter might come in handy would be on the KSB (or even a second on on the MB, memory on one side, hard-drive on the other). You could eliminate the IDE connector and associated parts and have an IBM CF hard-drive on board. Russ Pagenkopf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 00:47:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA22108 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:47:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA22104 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:47:21 +0200 Received: from calvino.alaska.net (calvino.alaska.net [209.112.129.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00N5W7AV1F@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:47:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rus@localhost) by calvino.alaska.net (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA21250; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:34:02 -0800 (AKDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:34:02 -0800 (AKDT) From: ":-)" Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> X-Sender: rus@calvino To: Doug Moreen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: calvino.alaska.net: rus owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. Add me to the list. > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon Yes, stable is good. > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. Yes. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. SM is a little outside my range of hacking (so far ;) starting preassembled would be good. Cost then becomes a non-issue for me. > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. I don't have the equipment to do the flash, so preloaded is necessary. Russ Pagenkopf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 01:02:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA22329 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:02:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA22311 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:02:05 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC0005W7ZF29@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:02:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA16734 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:59:06 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA03883 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:59:32 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:59:32 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Well, you should make sure the boards are 99.99% bug free and that they are in perfect working condition by doing some testing before hand. So I don't mind waiting a while before getting mine (I'd rather wait and have a working board). I'm pretty sure everyone agrees on this one. David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. > > So far there are requests for ~145 board assemblies. I've begun to send some > info requests to board fabrication plants, but haven't yet got any hard > numbers. Can't do much more then that, we don't have the Gerber files for the > KSB or Ethernet cards yet. > my poll is; > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. > I'm going to have some cost numbers for manufacturing the LART boards by Monday > they will be in two parts assembled and not assembled, which brings us to > question 3.)which shouldn't be answered yet, until I actually have some hard > numbers. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. > I'm using a count of 200 boards as a starting point with the vendors. I also am > going to have a couple of boards made before I commit to having 200 assembled. > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) > > > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 01:11:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA22416 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:11:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA22412 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:11:41 +0200 Received: from fermi.eeel.nist.gov (fermi.eeel.nist.gov [129.6.185.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00MIU8FGMD@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:11:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from mclay@localhost) by fermi.eeel.nist.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA03432; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:10:45 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:10:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael McLay Subject: Is CF a viable alternative? In-reply-to: To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <14591.36468.961625.611127@fermi.eeel.nist.gov> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: VM 6.71 under 21.1 (patch 3) "Acadia" XEmacs Lucid Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <38FF76E1.CFC07962@inter.nl.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk :-) writes: > Pardon what might a be stupid design question (I'm a hacker, not an > engineer). On the main board could you replace the four RAM chips with a > CompactFlash adapter? The CompactFlash cards are more expensive than the > RAM chips, but it would give one the flexibility to have as much ram (up > to 128MB right now, larger to come) as one needs. Flash is slower than RAM and also can only be written to a limited number of times before it burns out. Usually less than a millions writes. It would also free up > space on one side of the board. Another place that a CompactFlash adapter > might come in handy would be on the KSB (or even a second on on the MB, > memory on one side, hard-drive on the other). You could eliminate the IDE > connector and associated parts and have an IBM CF hard-drive on board. Flash prices are very high per Meg compared to harddrives. If you need > 100Mb of storage, like for mp3 files then flash is not practical. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 01:51:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA22501 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:51:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA22497 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:51:30 +0200 Received: from field.videotron.net (field.videotron.net [205.151.222.108]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC000H4A9TNB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:51:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net ([24.201.43.186]) by field.videotron.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8) with SMTP id <0FTC00I629JCNK@field.videotron.net> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:35:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:44:09 -0400 From: Jean Ricard Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: jean.ricard@videotron.ca Message-id: <00042019551700.06475@modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. Add me to the list please. > > So far there are requests for ~145 board assemblies. I've begun to send some > info requests to board fabrication plants, but haven't yet got any hard > numbers. Can't do much more then that, we don't have the Gerber files for the > KSB or Ethernet cards yet. > my poll is; > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon Better. Anyway, the time you receive your quotation the rev should be out, I guess ;-). > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > committing to getting the LART boards made. For me, I would like to get these two, they have a lot of cool features to have fun with... > I'm going to have some cost numbers for manufacturing the LART boards by Monday > they will be in two parts assembled and not assembled, which brings us to > question 3.)which shouldn't be answered yet, until I actually have some hard > numbers. > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > pre-assembled. > I'm using a count of 200 boards as a starting point with the vendors. I also am > going to have a couple of boards made before I commit to having 200 assembled. I think that for the assle of getting the surface mount parts soldered.... Well, it surely worth a 30$ bucks additionnal ! > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > of ROM code and testing) > If we can get Jtag working, it may be unecessary to get these flash pre-programmed... You will pay something like 4-5$ each for prog and checking, is it worth it? Hum... I didn't saw the schematics, but all we need is a connector on the parallel port and a header plus (maybe not necessary) a buffer depending on the length of the cable from PC to header... And naturally a stable and working soft. The sa1110jtag.h from the sa1110 dev board shouldn't be too hard to adapt, just some boundary scan (BSDL) tweaking probably... Jean -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 02:24:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA22557 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:24:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA22553 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:24:52 +0200 Received: from field.videotron.net (field.videotron.net [205.151.222.108]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00169BTFEA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:24:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net ([24.201.43.186]) by field.videotron.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8) with SMTP id <0FTC00M78B66NF@field.videotron.net> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:10:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:29:04 -0400 From: Jean Ricard Subject: Re: poll for LART PARTS people: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <00042019551700.06475@modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: jean.ricard@videotron.ca Message-id: <00042020303601.06475@modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <00042013595701.02661@localhost.localdomain> <00042019551700.06475@modemcable179.120-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, you wrote: > > to anybody who has gotten on my LART PART request list. > > Add me to the list please. > > > > > So far there are requests for ~145 board assemblies. I've begun to send some > > info requests to board fabrication plants, but haven't yet got any hard > > numbers. Can't do much more then that, we don't have the Gerber files for the > > KSB or Ethernet cards yet. > > my poll is; > > 1.)should we wait for Rev 4 of the LART board, it supposedly is coming soon > > Better. Anyway, the time you receive your quotation the rev should be out, I > guess ;-). > > > > 2.)should we wait for the GERBER files for the KSB & Ethernet cards before > > committing to getting the LART boards made. > > For me, I would like to get these two, they have a lot of cool features to have > fun with... > > > > I'm going to have some cost numbers for manufacturing the LART boards by > Monday > they will be in two parts assembled and not assembled, which brings us > to > question 3.)which shouldn't be answered yet, until I actually have some > hard > numbers. > > 3.) what additional cost per board would you be willing to pay to have it > > pre-assembled. > > I'm using a count of 200 boards as a starting point with the vendors. I also am > > going to have a couple of boards made before I commit to having 200 assembled. > > I think that for the assle of getting the surface mount parts soldered.... > Well, it surely worth a 30$ bucks additionnal ! Off course, it's just the assembly cost, not the part cost ! Anyway, I think nobody out there wants to run after the parts! > > > 4.)Another cost plus question? How many of you need to have the board loaded > > with ROM code and fully tested before it is shipped out. We could have the > > vendor do this or we (my company, or volunteers from LART PART do the loading > > of ROM code and testing) > > > > If we can get Jtag working, it may be unecessary to get these flash > pre-programmed... You will pay something like 4-5$ each for prog and checking, > is it worth it? Hum... I didn't saw the schematics, but all we need is a > connector on the parallel port and a header plus (maybe not necessary) a buffer > depending on the length of the cable from PC to header... And naturally a > stable and working soft. The sa1110jtag.h from the sa1110 dev board shouldn't > be too hard to adapt, just some boundary scan (BSDL) tweaking probably... > > > Jean > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 02:45:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA22597 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:45:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA22593 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:45:53 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC001FJCSDEA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:45:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DAB2748DB; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:45:16 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:45:16 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: Is CF a viable alternative? In-reply-to: To: ":-)" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, :-) wrote: > Pardon what might a be stupid design question (I'm a hacker, not an > engineer). On the main board could you replace the four RAM chips with a > CompactFlash adapter? No. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 02:49:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA22620 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:49:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA22616 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:49:41 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC001AHCYQGQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:49:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEC5B748E3; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:48:58 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:48:58 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: Is CF a viable alternative? In-reply-to: <14591.36468.961625.611127@fermi.eeel.nist.gov> To: Michael McLay Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Michael McLay wrote: > Flash is slower than RAM and also can only be written to a limited > number of times before it burns out. Usually less than a millions > writes. CompactFlash also isn't directly addressible, it's block addressible, like a hard drive. You can attach CompactFlash devices to any IDE bus with a trivial adaptor. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 03:13:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22710 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 03:13:16 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22706 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 03:13:14 +0200 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 03:09:44 +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: KSB Gerbers time path Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 22:25 +0200 19-04-2000, Doug Moreen wrote: >Do you have an ETA for the KSB and ethernet design finalization with Gerber >files? No hard dates yet, but here's the plan: - I delivered the Ethernet boards for assembly just before I left (last Tuesday). I'll be back around May 4 and expect to have verification done in a week (people around here really want to see it working). - I'm doing the LART Rev 4 and KSB Rev 2 right now (in between photographing an orchestra on tour -- my idea of a holiday). The plan is to submit them to the PCB people over the Easter weekend and to have them ready for assembly and testing around May 8. - *Real soon* after that (like mid-May) I want to start my own board run, and I obviously need the designs to be tested by then. Once I feel confident that the prototype PCBs are bugfree I'll release a hardware distro like the LART one for each. If you need preliminary placeholder Gerber files for KSB and Ether (for example to show the board complexity to a PCB mfgr) I can send you my current snapshots. Did I mention those might still be buggy ? ;-) JDB [getting used to 3 hours of sleep a night ... hope LART Rev 4 doesn't reflect that ;-)] -- "... I've seen Sun monitors on fire off the side of the multimedia lab. I've seen NTU lights glitter in the dark near the Mail Gate. All these things will be lost in time, like the root partition last week. Time... to die...". - Peter Gutmann in the scary devil monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 06:15:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA23010 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 06:15:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA23006 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 06:15:01 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC0045BMH0P6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 06:15:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.126) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:59:00 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:58:55 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: SA1100 discontinued X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000420205734.00ae1770@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I think Intel's site says this chip is gone in June. If so, then we had better get stocked up on SA1100's. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 07:22:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA23092 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:22:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA23088 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:22:22 +0200 Received: from falcon.ugwarehouse.org (falcon.ugwarehouse.org [216.254.59.186]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC005JFPL84S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 07:22:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from proteus (helo=localhost) by falcon.ugwarehouse.org with local-smtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12iVhK-00030L-00; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:09:46 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:09:46 -0700 (PDT) From: The Proteus Subject: Re: SA1100 discontinued In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000420205734.00ae1770@mail.clubnet.net> To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Either that, or redesign with the SA-1110 if the architecture isn't that much different. The Proteus - - - T h e U n d e r g r o u n d W a r e h o u s e - - - - - - Subversive - Tools - For - A - Chaotic - Planet - - - - h t t p : / / w w w . u g w a r e h o u s e . o r g / - ------- On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > I think Intel's site says this chip is gone in June. > If so, then we had better get stocked up on SA1100's. > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 09:02:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA23236 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:02:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA23232 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:02:08 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC007BRU7J3J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:02:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA20706; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:44:20 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:44:20 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: Re: SA1100 discontinued In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000420205734.00ae1770@mail.clubnet.net> To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > I think Intel's site says this chip is gone in June. > If so, then we had better get stocked up on SA1100's. > only the mBGA packages are being discontinued as far as i can tell. http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/linecard/sa-1100/ the CF/DF/AF/EF versions (208 LQFP) will still be sold. ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 09:18:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA23275 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:18:37 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA23271 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:18:37 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC00724UYZS7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:18:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.114) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:02:31 -0700 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:02:33 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: SA1100 discontinued In-reply-to: X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: rob Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000421000029.00b1cc00@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed References: <4.2.0.58.20000420205734.00ae1770@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Opps. I must have been too tired when I read that. I missed the miniBGA reference. In the words of SNL's Emily Latella, "Never Mind". :) Sorry for the false alarm. At 02:44 AM 4/21/00 -0400, you wrote: >On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > > I think Intel's site says this chip is gone in June. > > If so, then we had better get stocked up on SA1100's. > > > >only the mBGA packages are being discontinued as far as i can tell. >http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/linecard/sa-1100/ > >the CF/DF/AF/EF versions (208 LQFP) will still be sold. > > >---- >Rob Melby >Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 >uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a >Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 10:32:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA23382 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:32:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA23378 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:32:31 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTC008LYYE6NE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:32:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA21517 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 04:17:05 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 04:17:04 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: farnell To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk anyone know if farnell takes international orders ? newark doesn't seem to have alot of stuff. how are the rest of you doing trying to order parts ? rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 11:42:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA23619 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:42:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA23615 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:42:14 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD00BD21MCZQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:42:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA22193; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 05:24:23 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 05:24:22 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: Re: ISSI DRAM Parts In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > > That should work as far as I can tell, yes. > > > Also > >Micron MT4LC4M16R6 same specs. > does the lart use the self-refresh stuff which was on the nec part ? ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 11:57:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA23667 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:57:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA23663 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:57:08 +0200 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk (mail4.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.211]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD00CF72B746@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:57:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-145.delaware.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.59.145] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12ia8f-0004ox-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:54:18 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:57:37 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: a small proposal To: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39002611.1966AC09@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk J.D. Bakker wrote: > I don't want to sink anyone's enterprising dreams, but... > > >For people here in the US it would be nice to set up an org to handle the > >production of finished and unstuffed motherboards. There > >already are some people that are trying to get a few prototype boards made up. > >I think considering the cost, it would be good for them to get a few > >percentage > >points in profit to cover their misc. expenses, and effort. Unless I'm > >mistaken, production in hundreds could reduce the cost of a single card > >from ~$300 to $400 each to probobly $100 to $200. > > Not nearly. Checking 4pcb (from the hardware distro README), LART qty 3 > costs around US$400 each; where qty100 goes for $30-$50 (with 1-5 weeks > lead time). > > We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > combo. Can I send you $60 for one, to be held in trusty until the run is produced, then you send one to me? Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 12:45:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA23885 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:26 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA23877; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:23 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:35:26 +0200 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: ISSI DRAM Parts Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >does the lart use the self-refresh stuff which was on the nec part The board supports it, BLOB doesn't yet. All DRAM devices that I have lying are self refresh capable too. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 12:45:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA23889 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:27 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA23872; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:18 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <4.2.0.58.20000420205734.00ae1770@mail.clubnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:30:44 +0200 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: SA1100 discontinued Cc: Derek Lassen , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 08:44 +0200 21-04-2000, rob wrote: >On Thu, 20 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > >> I think Intel's site says this chip is gone in June. >> If so, then we had better get stocked up on SA1100's. >> > >only the mBGA packages are being discontinued as far as i can tell. >http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/linecard/sa-1100/ > >the CF/DF/AF/EF versions (208 LQFP) will still be sold. ...and probably will be for some time. Remember these are embedded devices, used in machines which must be serviceable over a period of years. Intel could drop the uBGAs as the SA-1110 is (almost) pin compatible. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 12:45:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA23881 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:24 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA23875; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:21 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:33:44 +0200 To: rob From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: farnell Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 10:17 +0200 21-04-2000, rob wrote: >anyone know if farnell takes international orders ? newark doesn't seem >to have alot of stuff. I know that it's possible to order Newark stuff through Farnell (albeit with 7-10 day lead times); have you tried to ask Newark if they can sell Farnell stuff ? JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 12:45:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA23893 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:30 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA23882; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:45:25 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <39002611.1966AC09@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:40:11 +0200 To: Jeff Davies From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl, dogman@bitterroot.net Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra >> blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet >> combo. > >Can I send you $60 for one, to be held in trusty until the run is >produced, then >you send one to me? I'm afraid you'll have to go through the entire purchase order hassle (the Uni is quite strict on this). Anyways it may be best still to join Doug Moreen's efforts in getting boards *and* components. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 14:01:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA24066 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:01:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA24062 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:01:21 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD00GAQ81SMC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:01:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.86]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA29003 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:24:22 +0530 (IST) Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:28:30 +0530 From: Mukund Subject: for the last time! To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002101bfab88$e9f4cde0$561e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk for the last time :-) how much approx is a lart going to cost me (with KSB, CPU, mem, flash, the works, EVERYTHING) if i order for one here? i know this cost figure is very much dependent on the quantity of orders we get. but can somebody give a rough estimate of the whole cost of the lart (everything) considering an estimated number of orders on this list? i live in india, and $->rupee turns out to be very costly for me. so i cannot COMMIT for buying a lart, unless i am certain of the final cost figure. if i know the figure, and it's reasonably affordable for us, many of my friends would be interested too in ordering for larts. - muks -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 15:24:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA24217 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:24:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA24213 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:24:40 +0200 Received: from server1.siscom.net (server1.siscom.net [209.251.2.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD00JCLBX27Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:24:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 7818 invoked from network); Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:20:36 +0000 Received: from ppp253.c5300-3.day-oh.siscom.net (HELO siscom.net) ([209.251.11.253]) (envelope-sender ) by server1.siscom.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:20:36 +0000 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:19:27 -0700 From: Brian Kraack Subject: Re: for the last time! To: Mukund Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: bkraack@siscom.net Message-id: <39007F8F.E12F7E36@siscom.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <002101bfab88$e9f4cde0$561e36ca@muks> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Here is something JDB sent me before this list got so big ... it might be usefull now for all of the new people. Remember, it is just an estimate, YMMV: The main components are (with qty 100 price estimate): - (1) SA-1100 in LQFP-package. The board supports all speed grades and core voltages. (US$60) - (4) 4Mx16 EDO DRAM chips in TSOP-II package. Micron, ISSI and others make these. (4xUS$10) - (2) Intel DT28F160F3B120 Fast Boot Block Flash devices (2xUS$10) - (1) Maxim MAX1626ESA step-down converter for the I/O voltage (US$2) - (1) Maxim MAX1627ESA step-down converter for the core voltage (US$2) - (1) Maxim MAX3223ECAP RS232 transceiver (US$3) - (1) Maxim MAX811SEUS Microprocessor supervisor (US$2) ...and about US$30 worth of decoupling capacitors, connectors and odds and ends; all available from Farnell (http://www.farnell.com). If you want an estimate on the PCB cost, try http://www.4pcb.com When I was estimating, I figured about $30 per PCB (qty 100, 1 week turnaround), and another $30 for board stuffing (this is just a guess ...) so that puts final estimated cost at: $210 (US) at quantities less than 100, prices will increase significantly (ex: 1 week PCBs, qty 25 go up to $65) hope that helps, /Brian PS: Remember, the above is just an estimate. Nobody but you are responsible for your descisions based on this 'information'. Mukund wrote: > for the last time :-) > > how much approx is a lart going to cost me (with KSB, > CPU, mem, flash, the works, EVERYTHING) if i order for one here? > > i know this cost figure is very much dependent on the > quantity of orders we get. but can somebody give a rough > estimate of the whole cost of the lart (everything) considering > an estimated number of orders on this list? > > i live in india, and $->rupee turns out to be very costly > for me. so i cannot COMMIT for buying a lart, unless > i am certain of the final cost figure. > > if i know the figure, and it's reasonably affordable for us, > many of my friends would be interested too in ordering for > larts. > > - muks > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 15:37:34 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA24264 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:37:34 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA24260 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:37:33 +0200 Received: from server1.siscom.net (server1.siscom.net [209.251.2.89]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD00K0MCIJ04@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:37:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 15620 invoked from network); Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:34:00 +0000 Received: from ppp253.c5300-3.day-oh.siscom.net (HELO siscom.net) ([209.251.11.253]) (envelope-sender ) by server1.siscom.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:34:00 +0000 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:32:52 -0700 From: Brian Kraack Subject: Re: for the last time! To: Mukund , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: bkraack@siscom.net Message-id: <390082B4.8586F12C@siscom.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <002101bfab88$e9f4cde0$561e36ca@muks> <39007F8F.E12F7E36@siscom.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk OOPS ... forgot to mention, that is for just the LART. I figure the KSB would be less, maybe 2/3 of a LART? Brian Kraack wrote: > Here is something JDB sent me before this list got so big ... it might > be usefull now for all of the new people. > Remember, it is just an estimate, YMMV: > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 17:15:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA24484 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:15:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA24480 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:15:03 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD0000QH1104@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:15:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from bia.rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA14158; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:57:20 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:56:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Barry Callahan Subject: lart testing To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Barry Callahan Message-id: <"200004211457.KAA14158"@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 CDE Version 1.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Content-type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: 0JU7OI9+eV1hgWYLQBrHaA== Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was wondering what kinds of tests were performed on the lart before this latest revision of the board was pronounced stable. Barry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 18:23:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24676 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:23:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24672 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:22:59 +0200 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD001APK6AGQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:22:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-27.connecticut.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.58.27] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12igCE-00028w-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:22:23 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:40:41 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? To: Ghazan Haider Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39003028.EACC7C92@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <20000417162347.25439.qmail@web3205.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ghazan Haider wrote: > Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the > excitement about lart and i dont know why. Ive been > aiming to produce the absolutely cheapest machines > with LCD screens that can run win95 and linux.... LART > doesnt even seem x86 compatible (is it?). OR maybe its > very cheap to produce... is it cheaper than iopener > and with better benchmarks??? Can it run DOOM? :) > And if its not x86 compatible what compatible is it > beside a linux kernel? > -Ghazan Haider a typical pc104 x86 board takes 700mA and cost $300. (same spec in terms of RAM,i/o etc as lart. A powerpc credit card size board costs $600 but takes about 250mA. Lart takes 43mA and looks like it will cost $60.... Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 18:23:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24686 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:23:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24682 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:23:15 +0200 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD001B8K6QGQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:23:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-27.connecticut.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.58.27] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12igC9-00028N-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:22:18 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:36:01 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:ff To: Joshua Matthew Mayo Cc: Ken Chiu Kun Wu , Lart Mail Server , pleb@cse.unsw.edu.au Message-id: <39002F10.1BA27672@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Joshua Matthew Mayo wrote: > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ken Chiu Kun Wu wrote: > > Hi all, > > Help! I've got this error after I loaded both Kernel and Ramdisk > > and "boot kernel". The kernel image is based on 2.3.35 and the boot > > loader is blob-1.0.5 Also the ramdisk is "ramdisk-lart-videolink" > > from LART. I've no idea what's going :( well the only difference can only > > be my kernel... so i must've done something wrong there.. > > I believe the Linux kernel interprets device 00:ff as being for > an NFS mounted root filesystem. You don't have any network drivers > compiled in, so it has no way to try to mount an NFS directory. > > You need to set the root filesystem to whatever device contains your > ramdisk image, using `rdev` after the kernel is compiled. > For more background info you ought to go to www.linuxdoc.org and look for the book on making your own linux boot loader, kernel and compressed image. It goes into depth on rdev. Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 18:24:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24711 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:24:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24707 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:24:16 +0200 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD001D8K8F54@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:24:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-27.connecticut.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.58.27] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12igCO-00029i-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:22:33 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:53:55 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: a small proposal To: Pablo Bleyer Kocik Cc: LART Message-id: <39003342.6E18DE4F@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <2.2.32.20000416223117.0088d358@netmail.home.com> <38FB617A.E4EB4F0@embedded.cl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Pablo Bleyer Kocik wrote: > "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > > Are those six-layer PCBs with 0.15mm (six mil) trace width/clearance and > > 0.3 mm (12 mil) smallest hole diameter ? If yes then I want the address of > > your PCB fab house :) > > > > JDB. > > > > Nope, three layers only. But the track width and interspacing is very much the > same (actually, the same -- don't know how much spacing there is, for example, > between the StrongARM pins but I think it has to be near the same as the SH TQFP > pins -- 0.1mm pin width and 0.5mm interspacing, so our tracks are 0.15mm width). > > When I went to quote the PCB I was almost convinced that we were going to end > buying the boards in the USA -- I thought, what the hell, let's try it here. When > the lady that attended me told me the price for 4 the prototype boards ($37.500 > chilean pesos, like 80 US dollars), I asked her if that was the price of _one_ > board because I was really surprised. But I was wrong, the price was really for > the 4 boards. She showed me a sample of their work and, as I told you, the quality > was excellent. As I looked amazed, she told me that, yes, buying them outside the > country was much more expensive. They bought a CNC for them last year (they build > UPSs) and this year they started outsourcing. > > By the way, they have the PCBs ready in three days. If someone from this list > lives in Chile (grrr... I really doubt that ;^/ ), the name of the company is > "Buron & Buron", they have an entry in the yellow pages. They have a web page > (http://www.buron.cl) and an email address, but they don't seem to check it often > (I had to go personally there to quote my board because they didn't answer the > email I sent them). > Are you volunteering to get the 100 boards made there? Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 18:25:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24770 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24762 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:45 +0200 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD001EBKAWGQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-27.connecticut.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.58.27] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12igCr-0002DU-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:23:01 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:16:15 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: Is CF a viable alternative? To: Michael McLay Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39007ECF.4DBBBEF4@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <38FF76E1.CFC07962@inter.nl.net> <14591.36468.961625.611127@fermi.eeel.nist.gov> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Flash prices are very high per Meg compared to harddrives. If you > need > 100Mb of storage, like for mp3 files then flash is not > practical. > -- I think that Compact Flash is rather excellent. Is it more expensive than just having a daughter board with flash chips on? I've seen 320meg Compact Flash card for $600. (totally silent, and lower current, but higher cost per meg). Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 18:25:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA24771 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA24765 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:45 +0200 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD0014GKAWG1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:25:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-27.connecticut.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.58.27] helo=llandre.freeserve.co.uk) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12igCJ-00029K-00; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:22:27 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:50:01 +0100 From: Jeff Davies Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? To: Erik Mouw Cc: jamie@wcug.wwu.edu, ghazanhaider@yahoo.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39003259.FA05FD6@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <200004171745.TAA25231@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:26:42 -0700 (PDT), Jamie Heilman wrote: > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ghazan Haider wrote: > >>Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the excitement about lart and > >>i dont know why. > > > > There are a lot of reasons, I'll tell you one of them, then let you go > > research the rest. 1W power consumption. Think about that. That > > fancy-pants graphics card in your PC you're using probalby eats about 50W > > all by itself. Anyone want to hazzard a guess as to how long you could > > keep a LART alive on a 1400VA UPS in the event of a power failure? > > I can do, bu I'll have to assume you meant 1400 VAh: > > A LART in idle mode draws 42mA at 9V, so: > > 1400VAh / ( 9V * 42 mA ) = 3703.7 hours = 154.3 days > How about the Sony NPF-950 camcorder battery - can supply 1 amp for 8 hours. so 43mA => 8 days. not bad for 300 grammes. Nice wearable. Jeff Davies jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 19:36:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25035 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:36:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25031 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:36:04 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD002KXNK2Q4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:36:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.97] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A0844CB4006A; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:31:48 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:35:33 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Farnell To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39009165.F77362F2@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm having trouble locating the strongarm chip in Newark's search engine - do they even carry ARM cpu's? If the price is < $250, then I'll go with at least three. Additionally, we may consider a gratuity added on as an expression of thanks and support for the core developers... they are, after all, under a tremendous pressure not only from the goals of their project but the added stress of so many people looking over their shoulders and asking when this and when that... Mike > Here is something JDB sent me before this list got so big ... it might > be usefull now for all of the new people. > Remember, it is just an estimate, YMMV: > > > The main components are (with qty 100 price estimate): > > - (1) SA-1100 in LQFP-package. The board supports all speed grades and > core voltages. (US$60) > - (4) 4Mx16 EDO DRAM chips in TSOP-II package. Micron, ISSI and others > make these. (4xUS$10) > - (2) Intel DT28F160F3B120 Fast Boot Block Flash devices (2xUS$10) > - (1) Maxim MAX1626ESA step-down converter for the I/O voltage (US$2) > - (1) Maxim MAX1627ESA step-down converter for the core voltage (US$2) > - (1) Maxim MAX3223ECAP RS232 transceiver (US$3) > - (1) Maxim MAX811SEUS Microprocessor supervisor (US$2) > > ...and about US$30 worth of decoupling capacitors, connectors and odds > and > ends; all available from Farnell (http://www.farnell.com). > > If you want an estimate on the PCB cost, try http://www.4pcb.com > > > When I was estimating, I figured about $30 per PCB (qty 100, 1 week > turnaround), and another $30 for board stuffing (this is just a guess > ...) > > so that puts final estimated cost at: $210 (US) > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 19:50:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA25069 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:50:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA25065 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:50:48 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTD0035MO8NOI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:50:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.52]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:53:25 -0600 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:45:42 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: Re: Whats so special about LART? In-reply-to: <39003259.FA05FD6@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> To: Jeff Davies , Erik Mouw Cc: jamie@wcug.wwu.edu, ghazanhaider@yahoo.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00042111473803.02098@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <200004171745.TAA25231@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> <39003259.FA05FD6@llandre.freeserve.co.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk so really, if you had this as a wearable, and had it on all the time, eight hours run time, with a single battery. still this is a usable amount of time. On Fri, 21 Apr 2000, Jeff Davies wrote: > Erik Mouw wrote: > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:26:42 -0700 (PDT), Jamie Heilman wrote: > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Ghazan Haider wrote: > > >>Hi, sorry if i'm being naiive but Ive seen the excitement about lart and > > >>i dont know why. > > > > > > There are a lot of reasons, I'll tell you one of them, then let you go > > > research the rest. 1W power consumption. Think about that. That > > > fancy-pants graphics card in your PC you're using probalby eats about 50W > > > all by itself. Anyone want to hazzard a guess as to how long you could > > > keep a LART alive on a 1400VA UPS in the event of a power failure? > > > > I can do, bu I'll have to assume you meant 1400 VAh: > > > > A LART in idle mode draws 42mA at 9V, so: > > > > 1400VAh / ( 9V * 42 mA ) = 3703.7 hours = 154.3 days > > > > How about the Sony NPF-950 camcorder battery - can supply 1 amp for 8 hours. > so 43mA => 8 days. > > not bad for 300 grammes. Nice wearable. > > Jeff Davies > jeff@llandre.freeserve.co.uk > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 20:31:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA25216 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:31:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA25212 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:31:20 +0200 Received: from wcug.wwu.edu (sloth.wcug.wwu.edu [140.160.164.200]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD0049LQ47LF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:31:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 23790 invoked by uid 1002); Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:29:59 +0000 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:29:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamie Heilman Subject: Re: Farnell In-reply-to: <39009165.F77362F2@mjv.com> X-Sender: jamie@sloth To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 21 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: >I'm having trouble locating the strongarm chip in Newark's search engine >- do they even carry ARM cpu's? It took me a while to clue into what one should be searching for in many of these online parts vendor's databases to locate a SA-1100 but once I read the linecard for Intel's SA-1100 it dawned on me that their part number is "FADES1100DF". Try that when you're looking for a StrongARM, btw, it doesn't look like Newark has them try wyle.com. -jamie -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 20:46:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA25274 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:46:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA25270 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:46:21 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD004KFQT8CT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:46:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from bia.rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA14951; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:28:36 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:28:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: Farnell To: mike@mjv.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Barry Callahan Message-id: <"200004211828.OAA14951"@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 CDE Version 1.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Content-type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: um8iCDjawJsVst+oBBfHeQ== Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Dunno about Newark's stock, but I found it listed on Pioneer Standard Electronics' website. (http://www.ied.pios.com/onestop/ gets you their search engine) They're an "Authorized Intel Distributor" if you particularly care. part# speed price gds1110AB 133Mhz $60.55 gds1110BB 206Mhz $77.25 Barry >I'm having trouble locating the strongarm chip in Newark's search engine >- do they even carry ARM cpu's? > >If the price is < $250, then I'll go with at least three. Additionally, >we may consider a gratuity added on as an expression of thanks and >support for the core developers... they are, after all, under a >tremendous pressure not only from the goals of their project but the >added stress of so many people looking over their shoulders and asking >when this and when that... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 21 20:54:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA25297 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:54:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA25293 for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:54:56 +0200 Received: from bluefin.bluefinrobotics.com (bluefin.static.shore.net [198.115.176.238]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTD004JDR7ILF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:54:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 15671 invoked from network); Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:54:10 +0000 Received: from steelhead.bluefinrobotics.com (HELO steelhead) (192.168.0.139) by bluefin.bluefinrobotics.com with SMTP; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:54:10 +0000 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:45:53 -0400 From: Aaron Marsh Subject: RE: Farnell In-reply-to: To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: amarsh2@mit.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Perhaps http://www.findchips.com/ would be helpful? Nice bit of meta-search engine there. A search for "1100" reveals Wyle does carry the SA-1100, and even has some parts in stock (many variants have a 30-wk lead time), though I'm not sure which variant we want. > It took me a while to clue into what one should be searching for in many > of these online parts vendor's databases to locate a SA-1100 but once I > read the linecard for Intel's SA-1100 it dawned on me that > their part number is "FADES1100DF". Try that when you're looking for a > StrongARM, btw, it doesn't look like Newark has them try wyle.com. > > -jamie -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 00:52:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA26050 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:52:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA26046 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:52:33 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00CGV27J28@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:52:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.15] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AAB323580298; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:48:19 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:52:38 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Bitdepth and resolution? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3900DBB6.4E92B05C@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk What is the bitdepth and resolution capabilities for video/LCD of the KSB? Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:11:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26665 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:40 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26654; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:33 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <390082B4.8586F12C@siscom.net> References: <002101bfab88$e9f4cde0$561e36ca@muks> <39007F8F.E12F7E36@siscom.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 03:52:43 +0200 To: bkraack@siscom.net From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: for the last time! Cc: Mukund , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 18:32 +0200 21-04-2000, Brian Kraack wrote: >OOPS ... forgot to mention, that is for just the LART. I figure the KSB >would be less, maybe 2/3 of a LART? Way less. KSB is around $80-$100 in parts; Ethernet is mainly a $15 chip, a $2 transformer and some small fry. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:12:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26680 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:12:31 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26671; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:43 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <"200004211457.KAA14158"@rjlsystems.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:03:31 +0200 To: Barry Callahan From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: lart testing Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 16:56 +0200 21-04-2000, Barry Callahan wrote: >I was wondering what kinds of tests were performed on the lart before this >latest revision of the board was pronounced stable. Linux booting, Linux memory bound app (lmbench), Linux CPU bound app (while(1);), Linux max impact (video decoder). Also the subsystem that was revised is tested; in the case of Rev3->Rev4 that's the power supply. JDB. -- I may be obsessive-compulsive, but it's NOT a disorder ! -- Paul S. Sawyer in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:11:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26662 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:39 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26656; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:36 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <39009165.F77362F2@mjv.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 03:55:52 +0200 To: Michael Vanecek From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Farnell Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 19:35 +0200 21-04-2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: >I'm having trouble locating the strongarm chip in Newark's search engine >- do they even carry ARM cpu's? Maybe I wasn't too clear. Farnell carries the odds and ends, the other parts (SA, DRAM, Flash etc) have to be found elsewhere. >If the price is < $250, then I'll go with at least three. Additionally, >we may consider a gratuity added on as an expression of thanks and >support for the core developers... they are, after all, under a >tremendous pressure not only from the goals of their project but the >added stress of so many people looking over their shoulders and asking >when this and when that... Not to mention answering list mail at 4 in the AM while on vacation ;-) JDB [who can still smell the bonfire in his clothes] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:12:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26677 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:12:30 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26666; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:40 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <"200004211828.OAA14951"@rjlsystems.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:00:55 +0200 To: Barry Callahan From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Farnell Cc: mike@mjv.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 20:28 +0200 21-04-2000, Barry Callahan wrote: >Dunno about Newark's stock, but I found it listed on Pioneer Standard >Electronics' website. >(http://www.ied.pios.com/onestop/ gets you their search engine) > >They're an "Authorized Intel Distributor" if you particularly care. >part# speed price >gds1110AB 133Mhz $60.55 >gds1110BB 206Mhz $77.25 ...except those are SA-1110s in BGA package while you'd want SA-1100s in LQFP-package. Try searches starting with "FADES1100" (or "DE-S1100 for earlier mask revisions). JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:11:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26669 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:41 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26658; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:11:38 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3900DBB6.4E92B05C@mjv.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 03:59:18 +0200 To: Michael Vanecek From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Bitdepth and resolution? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 00:52 +0200 22-04-2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: >What is the bitdepth and resolution capabilities for video/LCD of the >KSB? It's in the SA Tech Ref Man. In theory it can do up to 1024x1024 @ 16bpp; in practice you'll saturate the bus long before that. There's an appnote at http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/applnots/ . JDB -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:50:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26808 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26804 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:06 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00EMKD7GLA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.65] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A28D15D80226; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:46:37 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:51:02 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: sa-1111 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39011396.5B35E810@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb on one chip... Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:50:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26827 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26823 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:39 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTE00EN8D8ELA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:50:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA16480; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 22:32:52 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 22:40:19 -0400 From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: Farnell To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: mike@mjv.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39011113.E23E994C@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > At 20:28 +0200 21-04-2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > >Dunno about Newark's stock, but I found it listed on Pioneer Standard > >Electronics' website. > >(http://www.ied.pios.com/onestop/ gets you their search engine) > ...except those are SA-1110s in BGA package while you'd want SA-1100s in > LQFP-package. Try searches starting with "FADES1100" (or "DE-S1100 for > earlier mask revisions). Sorry, my bad. They also list: part price FADES1100AF 65.42 FADES1100DF 77.72 FADES1100EF 79.67 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 04:54:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA26861 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:54:40 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA26857 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:54:39 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FTE0011KDF1KN@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:54:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.65] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A3F998E006A; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:52:41 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:57:07 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: DevKits and Overpricing? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39011503.470C2A01@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I priced out Intel's SA111XDEVKIT - which is basically like a Lart at $3,923.0769 - now I feel much better about spending mere hundreds for the Lart! Why the overpricing? Is Intel trying to make all it's money back on the development kits? You'd think if they were trying to promote their chip and increase sales they would almost be giving these things away... Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 06:03:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA27031 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 06:03:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA27027 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 06:03:44 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00G50GM0QX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 06:03:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.164]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA15277; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:21 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:30:18 +0530 From: Mukund Subject: Re: Bitdepth and resolution? To: Michael Vanecek , "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <003a01bfac0f$535aa6c0$a41e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > >It's in the SA Tech Ref Man. In theory it can do up to 1024x1024 @ 16bpp; >in practice you'll saturate the bus long before that. There's an appnote at >http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/applnots/ . > psssst: for about 25 fps at 8bpp, what resolution would be fine with the lart? will 320x240 work? omt, what pdma do i use for calculating the timing... what ns is the RAM? sheesh.. you've made me cautious now.. i thought we'd come a long way from the old vga era.. where we had to worry about vga memory update efficiency issues. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 07:26:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA27227 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 07:26:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA27223 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 07:26:21 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00GMWKFWQX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 07:26:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA30698; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 01:19:51 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 01:19:51 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: Re: Farnell In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Barry Callahan , mike@mjv.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 22 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 20:28 +0200 21-04-2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > >Dunno about Newark's stock, but I found it listed on Pioneer Standard > >Electronics' website. > >(http://www.ied.pios.com/onestop/ gets you their search engine) > > > >They're an "Authorized Intel Distributor" if you particularly care. > >part# speed price > >gds1110AB 133Mhz $60.55 > >gds1110BB 206Mhz $77.25 arrow.com has em ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 08:01:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA27376 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:01:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA27372 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:01:13 +0200 Received: from vasquez.zip.com.au (vasquez.zip.com.au [203.12.97.41]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00I0YM1X2A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:01:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zip.com.au (MAx@starvin-marvin212.zip.com.au [210.23.142.212]) by vasquez.zip.com.au (8.9.2/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA12944 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 16:00:10 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:59:57 +1000 From: MaxAttack Subject: Lart Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39013FDD.E5DCB8C2@zip.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was woundering im new to electronics and what level of knowlage would u guys recommend before attempting to build a lart main board and extra ? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 09:26:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA27670 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27665 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:17 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00IG6PZR2A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.135) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:10:58 -0700 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:11:19 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: DevKits and Overpricing? X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000422001103.00b3d5d0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk You are talking about a company nicknamed chipzilla.... At 09:57 PM 4/21/00 -0500, you wrote: >I priced out Intel's SA111XDEVKIT - which is basically like a Lart at >$3,923.0769 - now I feel much better about spending mere hundreds for >the Lart! Why the overpricing? Is Intel trying to make all it's money >back on the development kits? You'd think if they were trying to promote >their chip and increase sales they would almost be giving these things >away... > >Mike >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 09:26:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA27667 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27660 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:16 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00IG6PZR2A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:26:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.135) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:09:53 -0700 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:10:13 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: Bitdepth and resolution? X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000422000951.00b365a0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The limitation comes from the SA1100. The LCD control signals pass thru unmdified. But be aware that if you talk to a LCD with more than 8 bits per pixel, you lose some GPIO bits (up to 8) (#2 thru #9). Here is the section of the manual: ========= Begin Quote ============= The SA-1100's LCD controller has three types of displays: Passive Color Mode Supports a total of 3375 possible colors, allowing any 256 colors to be displayed each frame. Active Color Mode Supports up to 65536 colors (16-bit). Passive Monochrome ModeSupports 15 gray-scale levels. Display sizes up to 1024 x 1024 pixels are supported. However, the size of encoded pixel data within the frame buffer limits the maximum size screen the LCD can drive due to memory bus bandwidth. The LCD controller also supports single- or dual-panel displays. Encoded pixel data is stored in external memory in a frame buffer in 4-, 8-, 12-, or 16-bit increments and is loaded into a 5-entry FIFO (32 bits per entry) on a demand basis using the LCD's own dedicated dual-channel DMA controller. One channel is used for single-panel displays and two are used for dual-panel displays. Frame buffer data contains encoded pixel values that are used by the LCD controller as pointers to index into a 256-entry x 12-bit wide palette. Monochrome palette entries are 4 bits wide; color palette entries are 12 bits wide. Encoded pixel data from the frame buffer, which is 4 bits wide, addresses the top 16 locations of the palette; 8-bit pixel data accesses any of the 256 entries within the palette. When passive color 12-bit pixel mode is enabled, the color pixel values bypass the palette and are fed directly to the LCD's dither logic. When active color 16-bit pixel mode is enabled, the pixel value not only bypasses the palette, but also bypasses the dither logic and is sent directly to the LCD's data pins. Once the 4- or 8-bit encoded pixel value is used to select a palette entry, the value programmed within the entry is transferred to the dither logic, which uses a patented space- and time-based dithering algorithm to produce the pixel data that is output to the screen. Dithering causes individual pixels to be turned off on each frame at varying rates to produce the 15 levels of gray for monochrome screens and 15 levels each for the red, green, and blue pixel components for color screens, providing a total of 3375 colors (256 colors are available on each frame). The data output from the dither logic is placed in a 19-entry pin data FIFO before it is placed out on the LCD's pins and driven to the display using pixel clock. Depending on the type of panel used, the LCD controller is programmed to use either 4-, 8-, or 16-pixel data output pins. Single-panel monochrome displays use either four or eight data pins to output 4 or 8 pixels for each pixel clock; single-panel color displays use eight pins to output 2-2/3 pixels each pixel clock (8 pins / 3 colors/pixel = 2-2/3 pixels per clock). The LCD controller also supports dual-panel mode, which causes the LCD controller's data lines to be split into two groups, one to drive the top half and one to drive the bottom half of the screen. For dual-panel displays, the number of pixel data output pins is doubled, allowing twice as many pixels to be output each pixel clock to the two halves of the screen. In active color display mode, the LCD controller can drive TFT displays. The LCD's line clock pin functions as a horizontal sync (HSYNC) signal, the frame clock pin functions as a vertical sync (VSYNC) signal, and the ac bias pin functions as an output enable (OE) signal. In TFT mode, the LCD's dither logic is bypassed, sending selected palette entries (12 bits each) directly to the LCD's data output pins. Additionally, 16-bit pixels can be used that bypass both the palette and the dither logic. The LCD controller can be configured in active color display mode and used with an external DAC (and optionally an external palette) to drive a video monitor. Note that only monitors that implement the RGB data format can be used; the LCD controller does not support the NTSC standard. ======== End Quote ============= by 12 pallatte. Display sizes cann be up to 768 by 1024At 05:52 PM 4/21/00 -0500, you wrote: >What is the bitdepth and resolution capabilities for video/LCD of the >KSB? > >Mike >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 22 09:50:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA27727 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:50:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27723 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:50:27 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTE00IO2R42BT@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:50:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.135) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:34:03 -0700 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:34:24 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: SA11x0 Multiprocessor X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000422001345.00a216c0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is very non LART. By using a signal named MBREQ one could build a multiprocessor systems, but as I understand it, there are two major issues: First is memory refresh. If DRAM is in-system, you must insure that the processor doing the refresh never looses the bus for so long as to miss out on a refresh cycle. Maybe you could rotate refresh duty among many processors. The second problem is cache coherency. There is none. So, any memory change that happens behind the cache will be invisible to other processors. That means that any data structure which is visible to more than one task must be protected by a semaphore which is in a non cached area of memory. This is one of the tradeoffs of CISC vs RISC. (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 04:04:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA30056 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:04:42 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA30051; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:04:38 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <39011396.5B35E810@mjv.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:01:32 +0200 To: Michael Vanecek From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: sa-1111 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb >on one chip... Same story as with the SA-1110: it's BGA and I have no samples yet. Once the latter is resolved I may use it in a design. JD "don't hold your breath" B. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 04:11:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA30078 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:11:26 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA30073; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:11:18 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <003a01bfac0f$535aa6c0$a41e36ca@muks> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:09:16 +0200 To: Mukund From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Bitdepth and resolution? Cc: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 06:00 +0200 22-04-2000, Mukund wrote: >psssst: for about 25 fps at 8bpp, what resolution would be fine with the >lart? will 320x240 work? Definitely; we have this working for our video decoder. As it eats 25x320x240=1.9MByte/sec (out of about 100MB/sec DRAM bandwidth) you don't have to worry much. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 04:26:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA30136 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:26:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA30132 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:26:57 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTG00AK96SVPV@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:26:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.24] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AE74C65F004A; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:22:44 -0500 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:27:41 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: sa-1111 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39025F9D.829C52D1@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or not in the package that you need? If it's available and you'd be willing to evaluate it, for around $70 or $80 bucks for the sa-1110 and 1111 each, I'd happily order one of each for you - I just need the exact part number so I don't get you the wrong package... Mike "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > >What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb > >on one chip... > > Same story as with the SA-1110: it's BGA and I have no samples yet. Once > the latter is resolved I may use it in a design. > > JD "don't hold your breath" B. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 04:47:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA30165 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:47:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA30161 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:47:15 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTG00B5U7QPIA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:47:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.24] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A36384A30124; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:43:47 -0500 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:48:45 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: sa-1111 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3902648D.9D6420B3@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39025F9D.829C52D1@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Er, that kinda looked like I was going to sell you one, didn't it? I meant that if the price range is within the $70 - $80 range, I'd buy one and send it to you as a contribution to the project. If it's another one of those $3,000 test kit type things, I think I'd have to pass... Mike Michael Vanecek wrote: > > Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use > either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with > terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or > not in the package that you need? If it's available and you'd be willing > to evaluate it, for around $70 or $80 bucks for the sa-1110 and 1111 > each, I'd happily order one of each for you - I just need the exact part > number so I don't get you the wrong package... > > Mike > > "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > > > >What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb > > >on one chip... > > > > Same story as with the SA-1110: it's BGA and I have no samples yet. Once > > the latter is resolved I may use it in a design. > > > > JD "don't hold your breath" B. > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 05:05:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA30222 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 05:05:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA30218 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 05:05:23 +0200 Received: from zion.italcomputations.com (net-216-93-124-048.hcv.com [216.93.124.48]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTG00BNQ8KY03@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 05:05:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (hndrcksn@localhost) by zion.italcomputations.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA13843 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:04:42 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:04:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Kevin Hendrickson Subject: Re: a small proposal In-reply-to: <4.1.20000419115214.00b1a6b0@pop.bois.uswest.net> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Aaron Lambers wrote: > Please add Aaron Lambers for 2 Lart+KSB+Eth built. > As always quantities are a function of price. What he said. :-) I would also like 2 LART+KSB+ETH board combos, preferabably built and tested. Kevin *--------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+-* Kevin Hendrickson "On the internet, no one knows you're a dog." hndrcksn@italcomputations.com _DreaD_ "Why, oh why, didn't I take http://www.italcomputations.com the BLUE pill?" -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 06:00:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA30294 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:00:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA30290 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:00:55 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTG00C3KB5H4F@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:00:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id XAA20899; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:43:01 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:50:35 -0400 From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: sa-1111 To: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3902730B.96C79DF5@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39025F9D.829C52D1@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Don't feel so bad, Mike. I'm not too sure of what bga packaging is, myself. I'm a software man. Intel has a page on their site titled "Why you should upgrade from the SA-1100 to the SA-1110" or some such that I'm planning on reading. A 206 Mhz sa-1110 will run ~$80 ($77 on the site I posteed earlier in the week.) The SA-1111 is a meager $39.68. (part #GDS1111-BA) Together with shipping, that's ~$120. A small donation for something that'll benefit us all. Heck, Mike... I'll help you pay for 'em. Barry Michael Vanecek wrote: > Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use > either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with > terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or > not in the package that you need? If it's available and you'd be willing > to evaluate it, for around $70 or $80 bucks for the sa-1110 and 1111 > each, I'd happily order one of each for you - I just need the exact part > number so I don't get you the wrong package... > > Mike > > "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > > > >What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb > > >on one chip... > > > > Same story as with the SA-1110: it's BGA and I have no samples yet. Once > > the latter is resolved I may use it in a design. > > > > JD "don't hold your breath" B. > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 06:07:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA30335 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:07:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA30323 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:07:14 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTG00BOMBG0IA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:07:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id XAA20919; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:49:20 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:56:55 -0400 From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: a small proposal To: Kevin Hendrickson , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39027487.9C0D93A7@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk What's this? I just subscribed to the list friday.. (Was it only yesterday???) Barry Kevin Hendrickson wrote: > Please add Aaron Lambers for 2 Lart+KSB+Eth built. > What he said. :-) I would also like 2 LART+KSB+ETH board combos, > preferabably built and tested. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 06:10:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA30356 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:10:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA30352 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:10:53 +0200 Received: from wpg-06.escape.ca (wpg-06.escape.ca [198.163.232.249]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTG00C64BM44F@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 06:10:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wpg-14.escape.ca (droopy@wpg-14.escape.ca [198.163.232.242]) by wpg-06.escape.ca (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA27943 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:10:11 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:07:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Steven Nikkel Subject: Re: sa-1111 (fwd) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Just in case you wanted to know BGA = Ball Grid Array instead of pins there are little ball like things Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:50:35 -0400 From: Barry Callahan To: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: sa-1111 Don't feel so bad, Mike. I'm not too sure of what bga packaging is, myself. I'm a software man. Intel has a page on their site titled "Why you should upgrade from the SA-1100 to the SA-1110" or some such that I'm planning on reading. A 206 Mhz sa-1110 will run ~$80 ($77 on the site I posteed earlier in the week.) The SA-1111 is a meager $39.68. (part #GDS1111-BA) Together with shipping, that's ~$120. A small donation for something that'll benefit us all. Heck, Mike... I'll help you pay for 'em. Barry Michael Vanecek wrote: > Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use > either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with > terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or > not in the package that you need? If it's available and you'd be willing > to evaluate it, for around $70 or $80 bucks for the sa-1110 and 1111 > each, I'd happily order one of each for you - I just need the exact part > number so I don't get you the wrong package... > > Mike > > "J.D. Bakker" wrote: > > > > >What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb > > >on one chip... > > > > Same story as with the SA-1110: it's BGA and I have no samples yet. Once > > the latter is resolved I may use it in a design. > > > > JD "don't hold your breath" B. > > > > -- > > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > > > The lazy man's proverb: > > 'There's no business like slow business !' > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 19:22:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA31358 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:22:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA31353 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:22:24 +0200 Received: from l98uppx1.hewitt.com (l98uppx1.hewitt.com [4.17.250.5]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTH00KLTC9BKA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:22:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from noaccess@localhost) by l98uppx1.hewitt.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id MAA10754; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 12:20:17 -0500 (CDT) Received: from lintng1.hewitt.com(10.20.68.64) by l98upfw32 via smap (V2.1+anti-relay+anti-spam) id xma010751; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 12:20:11 -0500 Received: by lintng1.hewitt.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.6 (890.1 7-16-1999)) id 862568CA.005F3CEE ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 12:20:15 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:19:01 +0900 From: Anita Yu Subject: Trip to the Netherlands To: bakker@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <862568CA.005F3C3B.00@lintng1.hewitt.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: HEWITT ASSOCIATES NA X-Authentication-warning: l98upfw32.hewitt.com: noaccess set sender to using -f Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Jan-Derk! We are planning to be in the Netherlands from April 29th to May 3rd. We would love to take this opportunity to visit your laboratory and look at the LART in person. Do you take visitors? If so, what would be the best time to visit? Thanks, Anita -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 20:30:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA31541 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:26 +0200 Received: from zaphod.home (root@erik.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.48.56]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA31537 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:25 +0200 Received: from zaphod (erik@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zaphod.home (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA15982; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:21 +0200 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:21 +0200 Message-Id: <200004231830.UAA15982@zaphod.home> From: Erik Mouw To: mike@mjv.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: sa-1111 In-Reply-To: <39025F9D.829C52D1@mjv.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@zaphod.home MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:27:41 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use > either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with > terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or > not in the package that you need? ... BGA = Ball Grid Array Instead of the usual pins (like the SA1100 in LQFP package), BGA has tiny balls at the bottom of the package. The package is soldered (with hot air IIRC) to the PCB. The main advantage is the dense "pin" grid, the main disadvantage is that it is close to impossible to handle manually: you can't see if there's a short between to balls, and even if you could see it, you wouldn't be able to repair it. To see BGA "in action", have a look at a modern PC mother board: the chips that look like they are glued to the main board are BGA. Erik PS: If you thought BGA was bad to handle, then have a look at uBGA. (yes u == micro) -- Erik Mouw email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW : http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in alt.sysadmin.recovery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 23 20:30:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA31547 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:32 +0200 Received: from zaphod.home (root@erik.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.48.56]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA31543 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:30 +0200 Received: from zaphod (erik@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zaphod.home (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA15968; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:20 +0200 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:30:20 +0200 Message-Id: <200004231830.UAA15968@zaphod.home> From: Erik Mouw To: maxmpd@zip.com.au Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Lart In-Reply-To: <39013FDD.E5DCB8C2@zip.com.au> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@zaphod.home MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:59:57 +1000, MaxAttack wrote: > I was woundering im new to electronics and what level of knowlage would u > guys recommend before attempting to build a lart main board and extra ? Quite advanced, building a LART is not for the faint at hart. You really should have soldered some PCBs yourself, and even then it is difficult. I can handle a chip with 1.27mm (1/20 inch) pin distance, but I can't solder a SA1100 with 0.5 mm pin distance (although I never tried). If you're new to electronics, don't build a LART yourself unless you want to make yourself a very expensive 0 ohm resistor. Erik -- Erik Mouw email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW : http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in alt.sysadmin.recovery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 00:06:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32137 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 00:06:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32133 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 00:06:35 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTH004PBPEX0X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 00:06:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.91] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A2E5C3B001EC; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 17:02:13 -0500 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 17:07:14 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: sa-1111 Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39037412.5B84EC6F@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004231830.UAA15982@zaphod.home> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Oh fart. Well, if we have the units assembled by a fab house, maybe it wouldn't be so bad - but the board _should_ be able to be assembled by a hobbyist too. Is the BGA the only format they're going to release this chip in? If you guys are interested in one, when Pioneer gets them in, I'll order one and have it sent to you along with an sa-1110. I consider it $170 well spent... :) If there are other odds and ends you guys wish you had but are lacking funds, put up a wish-list on your website (with exact part numbers so you don't get the wrong package) for anyone who would be willing to help the project out... Heck, if we're not all hardware engineers or software experts, surely sending a component or two would be a way to help, right? Mike Erik Mouw wrote: > > On Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:27:41 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > > Oh, I think I missed something. I was thinking the board could use > > either sa-1100 _or_ sa-1110. And I'm still mucking around with > > terminology - bga? Is this a way to say it's not on the market yet? Or > > not in the package that you need? ... > > BGA = Ball Grid Array > > Instead of the usual pins (like the SA1100 in LQFP package), BGA has tiny > balls at the bottom of the package. The package is soldered (with hot air > IIRC) to the PCB. The main advantage is the dense "pin" grid, the main > disadvantage is that it is close to impossible to handle manually: you > can't see if there's a short between to balls, and even if you could see > it, you wouldn't be able to repair it. > > To see BGA "in action", have a look at a modern PC mother board: the chips > that look like they are glued to the main board are BGA. > > Erik > > PS: If you thought BGA was bad to handle, then have a look at uBGA. > (yes u == micro) > > -- > Erik Mouw > email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl > WWW : http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ > -- > They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll > eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in alt.sysadmin.recovery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 08:59:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA00578 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:59:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA00574 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:59:11 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00GJBE2M64@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:59:10 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.121) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:43:11 -0700 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:43:07 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: BGA X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have shied away from many real cool parts because they only come in BGA. I think this is fear of the unknown. I suspect that chip makers would not use this package if board makers didn't use them, and board makers wouldn't use them if yields were not high. How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed (presumeably by robotics) and the time it gets heated to reflow? Is this gravity only? If so, were do I buy neutronium foil? :> (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 11:00:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00777 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:00:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00773 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:00:08 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00I1WJO7ST@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:00:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.111) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:44:01 -0700 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:44:01 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: StrongARM vs PCI X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000424013028.00b26890@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I seem to recall that somebody asked about hooking a PCI thingie too the LART. While that will be a real pain in the portal to do, if you need to wean yourself from PCI while you are developing a low power version for the LART stack, Intel has a motherboard which will fit in a PC box and hold some PCI cards (4). It also has a Strong ARM on board. See ftp://download.intel.com/design/strong/Guides/27814901.pdf Caveat Intellis. :> (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 11:03:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00795 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:03:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00791 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:03:07 +0200 Received: from mail.chilesat.net (mail2.chilesat.net [200.31.43.52]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00HG1JT4J7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:03:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from embedded.cl (200.31.59.19) by mail.chilesat.net (NPlex 4.0.068) id 38F792860002A352 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 04:49:42 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 05:08:44 -0400 From: Pablo Bleyer Kocik Subject: Re: BGA Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39040F1C.9D2ECA5D@embedded.cl> Organization: embedded^cl - http://www.embedded.cl MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Derek Lassen wrote: > I have shied away from many real cool parts because they only come in BGA. > > I think this is fear of the unknown. > > I suspect that chip makers would not use this package if board makers > didn't use them, and board makers wouldn't use them if yields were not high. > > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > (presumeably by robotics) and the time it gets heated to reflow? > > Is this gravity only? If so, were do I buy neutronium foil? > > :> > (s) Derek > Well, for small projects there are good socket adapters out there, but they are generally too expensive to use in mass production. I don't know why manufacturers don't offer pin versions of some chips as a fallback from BGA (specially CPUs) that you can insert in a cheap socket.. and remove easily, too. Check out: http://www.bgasockets.com/ ( http://www.advintcorp.com/ ) http://www.adapters.com/catalog/index.html http://www.emulation.com/catalog/ -- Pablo Bleyer Kocik | pbleyer |"Rintrah roars & shakes his fires in the burdend air; @embedded.cl | Hungry clouds swag on the deep" — William Blake -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 12:33:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA00934 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:33:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA00930 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:33:49 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00K6LO0C8B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:33:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F55E7480E; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:28:04 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:28:04 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: BGA In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > (presumeably by robotics) ..you can do it by hand without too much difficulty... > and the time it gets heated to reflow? Glue. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 13:21:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA00997 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:21:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA00993 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:21:38 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00L7WQ8036@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:21:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12jgrS-0007nS-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:17:06 +0100 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:18:02 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: BGA To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39042D6A.E1B5C375@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Kira Brown wrote: > > On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > > (presumeably by robotics) > > ..you can do it by hand without too much difficulty... Er. I can't. And I regularly solder .5mm pin pitch QFPs. (About 3 minutes for a 240 pin part, including washing.) There are machines to let you set up the placement, and rumour has it they're good, but I've not seen one. They're hardly hobbyist-priced. I'd be more tempted by a fuzz-button socket, assuming they're still available, plus carefully crafted mounting features on the PCB. I also saw something similar at http://www.adapers.com that I think I'll investigate further. > > and the time it gets heated to reflow? > > Glue. Glue used in most SMD processes assumes that the component is very close to the board. For BGAs, this isn't the case. I know that the assembly house doing BGA reflow for my current employer don't glue the BGAs down- that would lose the lovely self-centering action of 200-odd solder joints' surface tension, and BGAs are no more prone to wandering over the board before reflow than any other component- you've got to be careful moving the panel whatever's on it (unless it's all pin-mount, in which case, feel free to kick it around the shop, as long as it's all clinched...) Steve. Look, people. SA1100 qfp is a _nice_ chip for development for LART-style devices, where size isn't a critical driver. BGA is a pain in the butt. Assembly, inspection and rework are all essentially impossible for home users. QFP on the other hand, is just a bit fiddly. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 13:31:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA01021 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:31:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA01017 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:31:35 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00LFPQOL36@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:31:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.96) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 24 Apr 2000 04:15:27 -0700 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 04:15:33 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: BGA In-reply-to: X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: Kira Brown Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000424040328.00b3b500@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed References: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I just looked at the data sheet for a 32MB DRAM and its package has a clear spot in the middle - glue OK. But I looked again at the SA1110 data sheet - no clear area - just an array of balls. Where do you put the glue? I can see the surface tension of the balls pulling the package to exact centering. Is this how it goes? How do we heat the device we just put down only - or do we oven the whole board? Maybe some kind of heat gun with a servo controlled heat source - sounds expensive. I think I'll start looking for a used dental x ray machine. :> Thanks.... (s) Derek At 11:28 AM 4/24/00 +0100, you wrote: >On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > > (presumeably by robotics) > >..you can do it by hand without too much difficulty... > > > and the time it gets heated to reflow? > >Glue. > >kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 15:35:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA01342 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:35:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA01338 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:35:07 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI00NN7WEH00@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:35:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4C077480E; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:34:21 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:34:21 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: BGA In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000424040328.00b3b500@mail.clubnet.net> To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 24 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > I just looked at the data sheet for a 32MB DRAM and its package has a clear > spot in the middle - glue OK. Yep. Ditto the 5x86en we hack. > But I looked again at the SA1110 data sheet - no clear area - just an array > of balls. Where do you put the glue? I don't know. > I can see the surface tension of the balls pulling the package to exact > centering. Is this how it goes? Yes, as long as it's close enough. > How do we heat the device we just put down only - or do we oven the whole > board? Maybe some kind of heat gun with a servo controlled heat source - > sounds expensive. We've done it with a hot air gun; it's better with an oven. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 15:45:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA01387 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:45:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA01383 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:45:09 +0200 Received: from mail.eink.com (mail.eink.com [140.239.80.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTI000GXWV7ET@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:45:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.eink.com by mail.eink.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:52:25 +0000 (UT) Received: from eink.com (CAD2 [192.168.29.67]) by mail_server.eink.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id JGQ1MTXG; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:42:41 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:41:12 -0400 From: Holly Gates Subject: Re: DevKits and Overpricing? To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39044EF8.3E01FB2E@eink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39011503.470C2A01@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was able to get one from Avnet for ~$1500. -Holly Gates Michael Vanecek wrote: > > I priced out Intel's SA111XDEVKIT - which is basically like a Lart at > $3,923.0769 - now I feel much better about spending mere hundreds for > the Lart! Why the overpricing? Is Intel trying to make all it's money > back on the development kits? You'd think if they were trying to promote > their chip and increase sales they would almost be giving these things > away... > > Mike > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 16:17:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01455 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:17:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01451 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:17:44 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTI000JBYDJPL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:17:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.7] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A682319201EE; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:13:22 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:19:15 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: sa-1101? [was Re: sa-1111] To: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390457E3.18BBD1B9@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004231830.UAA15982@zaphod.home> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Okay - assuming for practicalities sake we avoid bga (unless someone developes an easy technique for hobbyists to solder them to their bords), the sa-1100 also has a helper chip called the sa-1101. http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/sa1101.htm describes it. I couldn't find package specifications in the datasheet, but perhaps it's in the same configuration as the sa-1100? Of couse, the ksb may have all these solutions licked, but if it's available and cheap enough, it could lower production costs and reduce space requirements so that even more chips can be stuffed on these little boards (like more rom/ram? or an actual modem?). Otherwise, maybe some soldering expert could get a cheap bga package and experiment with it with easy to get tools? Or maybe I should keep my mouth shut and be happy with what I have? :) (Sorry - I love exploring the possibilities...) Cheers, Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 16:26:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01476 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:26:40 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01472 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:26:39 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FTI009DIYSD2U@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:26:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.49] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A9229E8301EA; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:24:34 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:29:55 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: BGA Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39045A63.22E0D704@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Kira Brown wrote: > > But I looked again at the SA1110 data sheet - no clear area - just an array > > of balls. Where do you put the glue? > > I don't know. > > > I can see the surface tension of the balls pulling the package to exact > > centering. Is this how it goes? > > Yes, as long as it's close enough. Perhaps setting weights beside the chip to keep it stationary would work? I have some trashed mainboards that have these chips - I'll desolder them and experiment... > > How do we heat the device we just put down only - or do we oven the whole > > board? Maybe some kind of heat gun with a servo controlled heat source - > > sounds expensive. > > We've done it with a hot air gun; it's better with an oven. With an oven, we'd want to have everything in place, right? With a heat-gun, it's more selective and leaves us free to hand-solder the rest of the stuff. I frett over moving the board once I've placed everything exactly where they're supposed to go - one little bump and it's back to re-arranging them again (not everything can be glued down). If the oven is the opted way for hobbyists - will a standard convection or kitchen oven do? I assume that 500 degrees is the target temperature - for how long? I hesitate to cook my boards, but them I guess sm chips and components were designed to be cooked, right? What's the safest way to use the heat-gun? Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 16:44:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01531 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:44:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01527 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:44:10 +0200 Received: from mail.eink.com (mail.eink.com [140.239.80.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTI001ASZLKW9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:44:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.eink.com by mail.eink.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:51:25 +0000 (UT) Received: from eink.com (CAD2 [192.168.29.67]) by mail_server.eink.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id JGQ1MT58; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:41:43 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:39:55 -0400 From: Holly Gates Subject: Re: BGA To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39045CBB.AC0EB73C@eink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39045A63.22E0D704@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > Perhaps setting weights beside the chip to keep it stationary would > work? I have some trashed mainboards that have these chips - I'll > desolder them and experiment... > > > > How do we heat the device we just put down only - or do we oven the whole > > > board? Maybe some kind of heat gun with a servo controlled heat source - > > > sounds expensive. > > > > We've done it with a hot air gun; it's better with an oven. > > With an oven, we'd want to have everything in place, right? With a > heat-gun, it's more selective and leaves us free to hand-solder the rest > of the stuff. I frett over moving the board once I've placed everything > exactly where they're supposed to go - one little bump and it's back to > re-arranging them again (not everything can be glued down). If the oven > is the opted way for hobbyists - will a standard convection or kitchen > oven do? I assume that 500 degrees is the target temperature - for how > long? I hesitate to cook my boards, but them I guess sm chips and > components were designed to be cooked, right? What's the safest way to > use the heat-gun? > Components don't move around much if you put them down with paste. For SMT soldering with paste, you really want a heat profile which looks like this: /-\ / \ / \ /------------/ \ / \ -------/ \-------- Which might be hard to get in a kitchen oven. You also might not want flux fumes condensing inside the same oven you use to cook food. I would be curious to see whether anyone could pull off soldering in their kitchen oven though. As far as a heat gun goes, you want high temperature and low volume flow. I have tried to solder using regular heat guns, but they just blow the components all over the place. I have a Pace Thermoflo for soldering which works really well. Maybe you could take a regular heat gun and put some kind of diffuser/nozzle on it to reduce the velocity of the air. If you had an oven that worked, the way to go would be to paste and place all the components you wanted to solder in the oven, reflow the board, then hand solder the components which needed it. -Holly Gates > Mike > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:02:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01596 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:02:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01592 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:02:24 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ002JD0FY32@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:02:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.60] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A0FA6F64020C; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:58:02 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:03:57 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: BGA To: Holly Gates Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3904625D.45B3256A@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39045A63.22E0D704@mjv.com> <39045CBB.AC0EB73C@eink.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Holly Gates wrote: > As far as a heat gun goes, you want high temperature and low volume > flow. I have tried to solder using regular heat guns, but they just blow > the components all over the place. I have a Pace Thermoflo for soldering > which works really well. Maybe you could take a regular heat gun and put > some kind of diffuser/nozzle on it to reduce the velocity of the air. Cool - I'll hunt around for a Thermaflo and try my hand at some of these burned out mainboards I have laying around... If I can do it, then any one can. :) > If you had an oven that worked, the way to go would be to paste and > place all the components you wanted to solder in the oven, reflow the > board, then hand solder the components which needed it. My only concern as far as the paste goes is the bga chips that have contact covering the bottom with no clear spot to put the paste (unless the paste disolves and clears out of the way under heat?) If that's the case, what's a good source of this paste? Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:08:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01630 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:08:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01626 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:08:19 +0200 Received: from dexter.bitterroot.net (ns.bitterroot.net [206.26.92.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ002MZ0PT32@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:08:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([206.26.92.50]) by dexter.bitterroot.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0-59196U1000L100S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:11:01 -0600 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:56:38 -0700 From: Doug Moreen Subject: re: BGA To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dogman@bitterroot.net Message-id: <00042409050502.16215@localhost.localdomain> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The bga adaptors I saw at http://www.adaptors.com seemed to me to be only for prototyping. they were designed the bga chip sitting upside down with a cable running off the chip to whatever you needed to to connect to. I'm going to continue to look at different mounting technologies. I'd hate to not be able to use the SA1110 due it being a BGA chip. For future performance of the LART I think the SA1110 is required. I for one feel that 600mhz would greatly increase the number of applications that this platform could be used for. Doug Moreen dogman@bitterroot.net AllBoot.Com http://www.allboot.com 814 Priscilla Way Hamilton, MT 59840 406-375-0566 Kira Brown wrote: > > On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > > > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > > (presumeably by robotics) > > ..you can do it by hand without too much difficulty... Er. I can't. And I regularly solder .5mm pin pitch QFPs. (About 3 minutes for a 240 pin part, including washing.) There are machines to let you set up the placement, and rumour has it they're good, but I've not seen one. They're hardly hobbyist-priced. I'd be more tempted by a fuzz-button socket, assuming they're still available, plus carefully crafted mounting features on the PCB. I also saw something similar at http://www.adapers.com that I think I'll investigate further. > > and the time it gets heated to reflow? > > Glue. Glue used in most SMD processes assumes that the component is very close to the board. For BGAs, this isn't the case. I know that the assembly house doing BGA reflow for my current employer don't glue the BGAs down- that would lose the lovely self-centering action of 200-odd solder joints' surface tension, and BGAs are no more prone to wandering over the board before reflow than any other component- you've got to be careful moving the panel whatever's on it (unless it's all pin-mount, in which case, feel free to kick it around the shop, as long as it's all clinched...) Steve. Look, people. SA1100 qfp is a _nice_ chip for development for LART-style devices, where size isn't a critical driver. BGA is a pain in the butt. Assembly, inspection and rework are all essentially impossible for home users. QFP on the other hand, is just a bit fiddly. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:25:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01704 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:25:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01700 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:25:47 +0200 Received: from mail.eink.com (mail.eink.com [140.239.80.180]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTJ003691IYI4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:25:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail.eink.com by mail.eink.com via smtpd (for ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) with SMTP; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:33:03 +0000 (UT) Received: from eink.com (CAD2 [192.168.29.67]) by mail_server.eink.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id JGQ1MT9J; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:23:20 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:22:35 -0400 From: Holly Gates Subject: Re: BGA To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390466BB.6E4AF20C@eink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39045A63.22E0D704@mjv.com> <39045CBB.AC0EB73C@eink.com> <3904625D.45B3256A@mjv.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > My only concern as far as the paste goes is the bga chips that have > contact covering the bottom with no clear spot to put the paste (unless > the paste disolves and clears out of the way under heat?) If that's the > case, what's a good source of this paste? > The paste should be dispensed onto the PCB, not the component. You should dispense a little dot of paste onto each BGA pad. Don't worry too much about paste from adjacent pads touching; during reflow the paste will melt and suck onto the nearest metal surface. Many different manufacturers make solder paste, but most pastes need to be refrigerated to remain rheometrically stable (to prevent separation of the solder balls from the flux), and have different viscosities depending on how warm they are after take them out of the fridge. I have found one paste designed specifically for bench rework which uses a no clean flux which does not require refrigeration. The balls are pretty big and probably not designed for use in fine pitch applications, but I use it to put down SMT components with .6mm pitch all the time. The paste is also not the most homogenous that I have seen, but all in all it does alright: http://www.prbline.com/soldac_h.cfm The 12 gram syringe is #S290. The best way to dispense is with a pneumatic dispenser, but they cost ~$500 so you might not be able to afford one. The other option is to get a plunger and dispense by hand, which works OK. PRB line sells Luer lock tips and plungers; alternatively you can get them from someplace like Techni-Tool. Also, many times when you desolder a BGA you will screw up some of the balls. The balls are made from a non-eutectic solder alloy which has a higher melting point than the normal eutectic electronics solder. Under closely controlled oven reflow these balls do not melt, but the desoldering process often subjects an assembly to temperatures way higher than those seen during assembly so the possibility exists of melting the balls. Ideally, you could also clean off the old eutectic solder from the balls before attempting to reassemble, but maybe it is best to just leave it on and hope for the best. Another really useful tool for both soldering and desoldering SMT components using paste and a heat gun is an underboard heater. This tool blows air at the bottom of the board in the area you are going to work on and pre-heats the board to around 130F, which makes soldering and desoldering go much easier. These things are on the order of $1000, but I think you could probably hack one together using some sheet metal, a hair dryer heating element, a muffin fan, and a thermal switch. -Holly Gates > Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:37:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01758 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:37:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01754 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:37:22 +0200 Received: from ms21.tisnet.net.tw (ms21.tisnet.net.tw [139.223.200.179]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ0038921ZG8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:37:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p400 (tp192041.ts.tisnet.net.tw [139.223.192.41]) by ms21.tisnet.net.tw (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA19548; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:23:28 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:40:39 +0800 From: "Li, Yi-Shin" Subject: Is it possible for LART+KSB+Ethernet combo for just $60 ? To: Jurgen Kramer Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <00f201bfae03$d233ac80$b8c7df8b@p400> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="big5" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > Fully assembled > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell extra > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a LART-KSB-Ethernet > > >combo. The total price of 100 LART PCB(6 layer, 10x7(cm)) in Taiwan is about : Setup Fee ($666.6) + Film Fee ($19.89) + PCB fee($3.99) * qty (100) ~=$1084.39 ==> The price of bare PCB of Lart is about $10.84 here in Taiwan. (100 qty) The board stuffing fee is about $10 here. This doesn't include any component used in LART yet. If you could supply the LART+KSB+Ethernet combo for $60, please put me down for one. I will pay you $120 for it, because that's the price for LART only by my estimating. Regards, yslee -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:38:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01780 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:38:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01776 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:38:56 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ003HG24VI4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:38:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12jkwo-00089T-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:38:54 +0100 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:39:50 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: BGA To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39046AC6.45E4D292@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39045A63.22E0D704@mjv.com> <39045CBB.AC0EB73C@eink.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Holly Gates wrote: > Components don't move around much if you put them down with paste. For > SMT soldering with paste, you really want a heat profile which looks > like this: > > /-\ > / \ > / \ > /------------/ \ > / \ > -------/ \-------- > I suspect that, unless you're a lot quicker than me (or there are very few passives on the board), the first phase of that profile, which is meant to evaporate the solvent in the flux in the solder paste, may well be approaching zero, leaving you with a straight ramp-up and down? > Which might be hard to get in a kitchen oven. You also might not want > flux fumes condensing inside the same oven you use to cook food. I would > be curious to see whether anyone could pull off soldering in their > kitchen oven though. When I really have to reflow stuff at home, my hob of choice is a flat halogen jobbie, with the extractor fan running on go-double-plus. I get a decent control of the temperature without having to wave the board around. It's not ideal, but I've not needed to find anything better (yet...). I suspect that a small box with a few halogen elements and a thick layer of insulation would be better. Don't forget to tape a few thermocouples to your board and bigger components. > As far as a heat gun goes, you want high temperature and low volume > flow. I have tried to solder using regular heat guns, but they just blow > the components all over the place. I have a Pace Thermoflo for soldering > which works really well. Maybe you could take a regular heat gun and put > some kind of diffuser/nozzle on it to reduce the velocity of the air. I've never come to terms with air- too easy to blow components around / encourage tombstoning / set light to my fingers / throw the board across the room, screaming :) It's also difficult to get even distribution. Give me IR any day. > If you had an oven that worked, the way to go would be to paste and > place all the components you wanted to solder in the oven, reflow the > board, then hand solder the components which needed it. I find placing components onto paste soul destroying. After about 100 0603s, I'd lose concentration, my little finger would sag onto the board and I'd smear paste + components around. Now I just solder the little buggers down one at a time (or find someone else to do it, or put it out to fab). Come to think of it, I find pasting the pads soul destroying and hard on the fingers. (and hobbyists with powered pasting machines are rare, I reckon. Stencilling gear, too. Sryinge-pasting a BGA or uBGA will get _very_ dull...) One of my post-lottery-winning projects is a baby, desk-mounted PnP machine that only does passives, is PC-based and vision driven, and solders as it goes. Slow is fine, accurate is essential). Of course, not doing the lottery isn't helping :) Steve. (The 'scope I've had for the last 15 years is no more- time for a replacement analogue 'scope, preferably with cursors. Anyone got experience with Tek 2236 or 2245A as 100Meg analogue scopes, or recommendations for something better? (I'm fine for fast DSOs, this is just for analogue work)) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:39:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01795 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:39:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01791 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:39:18 +0200 Received: from fermi.eeel.nist.gov (fermi.eeel.nist.gov [129.6.185.13]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ003HW25GI4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:39:17 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from mclay@localhost) by fermi.eeel.nist.gov (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA24568; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:37:24 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:37:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael McLay Subject: BGA In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <14596.27187.202590.745317@fermi.eeel.nist.gov> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: VM 6.71 under 21.1 (patch 3) "Acadia" XEmacs Lucid Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <4.2.0.58.20000423233051.00bc1100@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Derek Lassen writes: > I have shied away from many real cool parts because they only come in BGA. > > I think this is fear of the unknown. > > I suspect that chip makers would not use this package if board makers > didn't use them, and board makers wouldn't use them if yields were not high. The main attraction is the high pin count and the small area required for attaching the part. With chip scale packaging the size of the part is almost exactly the size of the die. For printed circuit boards that have packaging constraints, such as in a compact video camera, the parts placement is very dense. > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed > (presumeably by robotics) and the time it gets heated to reflow? A solder mask is placed over the board and a squeegee is used to apply solder paste to all the pad locations of the surface mount devices (kind of like silkscreening teeshirts). A pick and place machine then places all the surface mount parts on top of the solder on the board. For some types of parts a glue dot is applied to the board prior to placing the parts on the solder paste. The glue dots are needed for some types of parts when the parts are on the bottom side of the board. Otherwise the parts would fall off when the board goes into the reflow oven. > Is this gravity only? If so, were do I buy neutronium foil? The solder paste that is applied to the board prior to placing the part is sticky. It holds the part in place until it is reflowed. The surface tension of the solder during the reflow process will cause the parts to self align. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 17:59:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01864 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:59:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01860 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:59:35 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ0041B339F4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:59:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.28] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AEE65C2101EC; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:57:26 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:02:53 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: BGA To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3904702D.2A270805@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <00042409050502.16215@localhost.localdomain> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I see a couple of camps forming - one to figure an easier technique for hobbyists to solder bga chips and the other to locate an adapter. Hopefully we both will come to a successful resolution to give people a choice. Perhaps an adapter could be designed and manufactured specifically for this application? Then again, if a majority of the Lart users are going to have their boards pre-fabbed and assembled, perhaps this isn't much of an issue after all - as long as the core Lart team can get their prototyping done to develop for these chips. Surely the fab houses can handle bga and ubga. Doug Moreen wrote: > > The bga adaptors I saw at http://www.adaptors.com seemed to me to be only for > prototyping. they were designed the bga chip sitting upside down with a cable > running off the chip to whatever you needed to to connect to. I'm going to > continue to look at different mounting technologies. I'd hate to not be able to > use the SA1110 due it being a BGA chip. For future performance of the LART I > think the SA1110 is required. I for one feel that 600mhz would greatly increase > the number of applications that this platform could be used for. > > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 18:02:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA01882 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:02:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA01878 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:02:51 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ0040X38PIG@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:02:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20]) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12jlG4-0000Kv-00; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:58:48 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12jlG3-0001hy-00; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:58:47 -0600 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:58:47 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: re: BGA In-reply-to: <00042409050502.16215@localhost.localdomain> X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: Doug Moreen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Another possible BGA adapter is available from http://www.advintcorp.com. Never used em and don't have pricing, but they look to be much more useful as prototype or small-run production tools than debugging. I'm not planning on pursuing it at the moment ... too anxious to play with the SA-1100 first :-) BGAs are great for a system designer who is fighting for real estate. However they are really awful for home builders (or even small builders). As the discussion has been showing, the reflow is not exactly trivial. But even if you have a profile-controlled non-food oven you can use to do reflow correctly, the bigger problem (IMO) is testing. With BGA's you can't see the solder to know if you accidentally installed any 0-ohm resistors. (As I recall, that was one of the drivers for the increased popularity of JTAG.) Unfortunately, there seem to be a lot of cool parts that only come in BGA. --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 18:24:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA01970 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:24:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA01966 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:24:56 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ0051B49I3D@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:24:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.37] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A4548158020C; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:20:36 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:25:58 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: Is it possible for LART+KSB+Ethernet combo for just $60 ? Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39047596.F1577BA@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <00f201bfae03$d233ac80$b8c7df8b@p400> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Re-price that with 100 Lart, 100 KSB (both same dimensions) and eth (dimensions unknown, but smaller) and see what you get. Additionally, I think we've reached or are about to reach 200 on the requests, so recalculate for 200 (if there is any difference in price each from 100 count)... I suspect that assembled and tested the boards may be approx $250 each if not just a little more - but then I consider that money well spent since if I tried to do it all myself I'd end up spending over $600+ each for a small run for my personal use... I think the $60 estimation was for bare-board and Lart only. Mike "Li, Yi-Shin" wrote: > > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > Fully assembled > > > > On Mon, 17 Apr 2000, Jurgen Kramer wrote: > > > >We're planning to do a 100+ run soonish; it's probably doable to sell > extra > > > >blanks to interested parties. Expect around $60 for a > LART-KSB-Ethernet > > > >combo. > > The total price of 100 LART PCB(6 layer, 10x7(cm)) in Taiwan is about : > Setup Fee ($666.6) + Film Fee ($19.89) + PCB fee($3.99) * qty (100) > ~=$1084.39 > ==> > The price of bare PCB of Lart is about $10.84 here in Taiwan. (100 qty) > The board stuffing fee is about $10 here. > This doesn't include any component used in LART yet. > > If you could supply the LART+KSB+Ethernet combo for $60, > please put me down for one. I will pay you $120 for it, because > that's the price for LART only by my estimating. > > Regards, > yslee -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 18:46:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA02052 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:46:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA02048 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:46:02 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTJ005C158O3D@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:46:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from bia.rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA27533; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:28:09 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:27:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Barry Callahan Subject: BGA & the 1101 To: dogman@bitterroot.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Barry Callahan Message-id: <"200004241628.MAA27533"@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 CDE Version 1.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Content-type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: pnhDaOpCq9EaSJkmUyANXw== Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Seems like everything I've posted to the list over the weekend hasn't made it here. :( Maybe I only replied to a person and forgot to cc the list. Anyway, I hope this propogates. On Pioneer, the 1101 chip costs ~$50, but it looks like they don't normally stock them. Advanced Interconnects (www.bgasockets.com) has 3 types of sockets. They also have a program where you can ask them to send you samples. I asked for a sample of their "True BGA Socket" and the "BGA Socket Adapter System" Also, I'm waiting for price quotes from the two of their distributors who service Michigan. Barry >The bga adaptors I saw at http://www.adaptors.com seemed to me to be only for >prototyping. they were designed the bga chip sitting upside down with a cable >running off the chip to whatever you needed to to connect to. I'm going to >continue to look at different mounting technologies. I'd hate to not be able to >use the SA1110 due it being a BGA chip. For future performance of the LART I >think the SA1110 is required. I for one feel that 600mhz would greatly increase >the number of applications that this platform could be used for. > >Doug Moreen >dogman@bitterroot.net >AllBoot.Com >http://www.allboot.com >814 Priscilla Way >Hamilton, MT 59840 >406-375-0566 > >Kira Brown wrote: >> >> On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: >> >> > How does one hold the part in place between the time it is placed >> > (presumeably by robotics) >> >> ..you can do it by hand without too much difficulty... > >Er. I can't. And I regularly solder .5mm pin pitch QFPs. (About 3 >minutes for a 240 pin part, including washing.) >There are machines to let you set up the placement, and rumour has it >they're good, but I've not seen one. They're hardly hobbyist-priced. >I'd be more tempted by a fuzz-button socket, assuming they're still >available, plus carefully crafted mounting features on the PCB. I also >saw something similar at http://www.adapers.com that I think I'll >investigate further. > >> > and the time it gets heated to reflow? >> >> Glue. > >Glue used in most SMD processes assumes that the component is very >close to the board. For BGAs, this isn't the case. I know that the >assembly house doing BGA reflow for my current employer don't glue the >BGAs down- that would lose the lovely self-centering action of 200-odd >solder joints' surface tension, and BGAs are no more prone to wandering >over the board before reflow than any other component- you've got to be >careful moving the panel whatever's on it (unless it's all pin-mount, >in which case, feel free to kick it around the shop, as long as it's >all clinched...) > >Steve. > >Look, people. SA1100 qfp is a _nice_ chip for development for >LART-style devices, where size isn't a critical driver. BGA is a pain >in the butt. Assembly, inspection and rework are all essentially >impossible for home users. QFP on the other hand, is just a bit fiddly. >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > >-- > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 19:04:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA02109 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:04:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA02105 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:04:51 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ005MF6412R@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:04:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.21] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id ADDDBAD10218; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:01:17 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:07:14 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39047F42.2CAEDBB2@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Of course - we're forgetting about the people who created the Lart - if we got them the chips (sa-1110 and sa-1111), and/or the adapter if they needed it, would they _want_ to use them in the design? We're sitting here running around batting ideas about without thinking about what these guys are wanting to do. So, Lart developers - would you be willing to explore the sa-1110/1111 option and the bga package? If you had bga adapters for prototyping, would that make a difference? If you checked your mail and found all this, would you use it? Mike Chris Curtis wrote: > > Another possible BGA adapter is available from http://www.advintcorp.com. > Never used em and don't have pricing, but they look to be much more useful > as prototype or small-run production tools than debugging. I'm not > planning on pursuing it at the moment ... too anxious to play with the > SA-1100 first :-) > > BGAs are great for a system designer who is fighting for real estate. > However they are really awful for home builders (or even small builders). > As the discussion has been showing, the reflow is not exactly trivial. But > even if you have a profile-controlled non-food oven you can use to do > reflow correctly, the bigger problem (IMO) is testing. With BGA's you > can't see the solder to know if you accidentally installed any 0-ohm > resistors. (As I recall, that was one of the drivers for the increased > popularity of JTAG.) > > Unfortunately, there seem to be a lot of cool parts that only come in BGA. > > --Chris > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 23:18:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA02983 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:18:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA02979 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:18:34 +0200 From: efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com Received: from cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com [24.8.41.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00D7XHUSCW@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:18:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (efort@localhost) by cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA26078 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:18:50 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:18:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: lcd displays - was Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I did some checking on lcd displays. I've found the following as lart candidates: 640*480 color TFT VGA 7 INCH DIAGNAL: $400 US 320*240 MONOCROME 7 inch diagnal W/ TOUCH: $40-60 US there ARE other choices but this gives a rough idea of the range we're talking about. given these 2 choices what would you guys be prone to pick. I'd vote for the mono w/ touch. eric On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > Please do see what kind of displays are buyable. > So DO start checking prices please, using the 200 count as a starting point > with the suppliers. Tell them that this is an open source hardware project, and > that this might be a way of selling very large numbers of displays in the > future, if they treat us right. > thanks > > > > > did you say lcd displays? > > > > > the above points need to be openly discussed and hopefully enough of us > > can come to a group consensus on a display to standardize upon. I > > volunteer to do the necessary research on cost and availability for > > various options, negotiate for best price, and order/distribute the > > lcd panels when they come to be needed. > > > > Doug Moreen > dogman@bitterroot.net > AllBoot.Com > http://www.allboot.com > 814 Priscilla Way > Hamilton, MT 59840 > 406-375-0566 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon Apr 24 23:50:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA03187 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:50:07 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA03183 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:50:07 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00AIDJBHNZ@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:50:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.46] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A112118902A4; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:48:02 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:54:07 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: lcd displays - was Re: a small proposal Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3904C27F.807F96B9@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Depends on application. Personally, I'd go with the color on some applications and mono on others so I'd have to vote both... And that's both for myself because I do have a few different areas I wish to explore with the Lart... Mike BTW - For you game programmers - Sam confirmed that he did get SDL to compile on the StrongArm architecture... efort@cc400672-a.srst1.fl.home.com wrote: > > I did some checking on lcd displays. I've found the following as lart > candidates: > > 640*480 color TFT VGA 7 INCH DIAGNAL: $400 US > 320*240 MONOCROME 7 inch diagnal W/ TOUCH: $40-60 US > > there ARE other choices but this gives a rough idea of the range we're > talking about. given these 2 choices what would you guys be prone to > pick. > > I'd vote for the mono w/ touch. > > eric -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 00:42:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA03361 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:42:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA03357 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:42:14 +0200 Received: from dotplanet.com ([209.144.132.197]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00FF9LQDCB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:42:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LsustanoD2.SMSCORP.NET [209.211.240.254] by dotplanet.com (SMTPD32-6.00) id ADAC27E0070; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:41:48 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:41:12 -0700 From: Leo Johan Susanto Subject: Re: lcd displays - was Re: a small proposal To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <009d01bfae3e$318701c0$6a0918ac@SMSCORP.NET> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk eric, what quantity you have requested them? 100? thanks for the troubles leo ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 2:18 PM Subject: lcd displays - was Re: a small proposal > I did some checking on lcd displays. I've found the following as lart > candidates: > > 640*480 color TFT VGA 7 INCH DIAGNAL: $400 US > 320*240 MONOCROME 7 inch diagnal W/ TOUCH: $40-60 US > > > there ARE other choices but this gives a rough idea of the range we're > talking about. given these 2 choices what would you guys be prone to > pick. > > I'd vote for the mono w/ touch. > > eric > > > On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Doug Moreen wrote: > > > Please do see what kind of displays are buyable. > > > > > So DO start checking prices please, using the 200 count as a starting point > > with the suppliers. Tell them that this is an open source hardware project, and > > that this might be a way of selling very large numbers of displays in the > > future, if they treat us right. > > thanks > > > > > > > > did you say lcd displays? > > > > > > > > the above points need to be openly discussed and hopefully enough of us > > > can come to a group consensus on a display to standardize upon. I > > > volunteer to do the necessary research on cost and availability for > > > various options, negotiate for best price, and order/distribute the > > > lcd panels when they come to be needed. > > > > > > > Doug Moreen > > dogman@bitterroot.net > > AllBoot.Com > > http://www.allboot.com > > 814 Priscilla Way > > Hamilton, MT 59840 > > 406-375-0566 > > > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 01:24:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA03601 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:24:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA03597 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:24:30 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00G5GNORRR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:24:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id QAA2833093 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:19:23 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:19:23 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: LART PCBs now available To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <3904D67B.9703FD73@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------4A15A4E52205929CEE6E8D68" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------4A15A4E52205929CEE6E8D68 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello everyone, I just picked up a stack of LART PC Boards from the fabricator this afternoon. Taking a quick look at them under my inspection microscope they look pretty good all-in-all. I'll try and post additional details on how to submit order requests later today after I've checked them more carefully. Theses are the bare PC boards not the assembled version. Greg Fountain Menlo Park, California --------------4A15A4E52205929CEE6E8D68 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------4A15A4E52205929CEE6E8D68-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 02:15:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA03712 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 02:15:37 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA03708; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 02:15:20 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <39047F42.2CAEDBB2@mjv.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:07:39 +0200 To: Michael Vanecek From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > So, Lart developers - would you be willing >to explore the sa-1110/1111 option and the bga package? If you had bga >adapters for prototyping, would that make a difference? If you checked >your mail and found all this, would you use it? Maybe. There's another issue besides the BGA one: time. Redoing LART for SA-1100 may take weeks; I don't have that amount of schedulable time ATM. Honestly I don't see the big deal in going for the SA-1110: you don't gain much in functionality or processing power. The advantages of the SA-1110 over the SA-1100 mainly show in very high volume applications. Personally I'd rather wait for the SA-2 (or pester Intel to get samples), or invest my design time in ClusterLART / FPGA boards. Of course it would be nice to have a '1110 (+'1111) board anyway; I'm investigating some low-effort ways to get there from here. Having actual SA-1110 chips on my desk would speed up the proto testing *if/when I find an easy way to get a PCB design*. In this stage I'd keep my money in my pocket if I were you. JDB. -- "Windows is the one true OS. MS invented the GUI. MS invented the 32 bit OS. MS is open and standard. MS loves you. We have always been at war with Oceania." -- Tracy Reed -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 03:17:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA03833 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:17:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA03829 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:17:29 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00I2DSX3NX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:17:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.7] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A124227502A2; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:13:08 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:19:17 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3904F295.7A1B22FB@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk That settles that - back-burner that idea for later. sa-2 huh? I wonder how far Intel will take the StrongArm. Please, still post a wishlist on the net for those of us who would like to help... Mike BTW - are you guys keeping development "in house" or can others get involved? > Maybe. > > There's another issue besides the BGA one: time. Redoing LART for SA-1100 > may take weeks; I don't have that amount of schedulable time ATM. Honestly > I don't see the big deal in going for the SA-1110: you don't gain much in > functionality or processing power. The advantages of the SA-1110 over the > SA-1100 mainly show in very high volume applications. Personally I'd rather > wait for the SA-2 (or pester Intel to get samples), or invest my design > time in ClusterLART / FPGA boards. > > Of course it would be nice to have a '1110 (+'1111) board anyway; I'm > investigating some low-effort ways to get there from here. Having actual > SA-1110 chips on my desk would speed up the proto testing *if/when I find > an easy way to get a PCB design*. In this stage I'd keep my money in my > pocket if I were you. > > JDB. > > -- > "Windows is the one true OS. MS invented the GUI. MS invented the 32 > bit OS. MS is open and standard. MS loves you. We have always been > at war with Oceania." -- Tracy Reed -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 03:46:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA03916 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:46:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA03912 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:46:15 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg ([192.122.139.253]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00IEWU90NX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:46:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailbox.krdl.org.sg [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA10962; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:32:59 +0800 (SGT) Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA11862; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:31:54 +0800 (SGT) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:32:48 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: parallel port low level driver for StrongARM SA1100 To: lart , arm , parport Message-id: <3904F5C0.E9D517B@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_/N8t5n2VSZo3oXQdo5wDTQ)" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_/N8t5n2VSZo3oXQdo5wDTQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Hi all, I have got the low level driver working in some degree (no irq, no dma, etc.) I posted here for anyone interested in it. It is closely tighted to my board's implementation, if you want to use it, you have to change those IO assignment. By the way, I am using kernel 2.3.99-pre3-rmk1-np2. have fun. -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com --Boundary_(ID_/N8t5n2VSZo3oXQdo5wDTQ) Content-type: application/x-unknown-content-type-cfile; name=parport_arm.c Content-disposition: inline; filename=parport_arm.c Content-transfer-encoding: base64 LyogTG93LWxldmVsIHBhcmFsbGVsIHBvcnQgcm91dGluZXMgZm9yIFN0cm9uZ0FSTSBTQTEx MDANCiAqIA0KICogQXV0aG9yOiBaaHUgUXVuIFlpbmcgPHF5emh1QGtyZGwub3JnLnNnPg0K ICoNCiAqIENvcHlyaWdodCAoQykgMjAwMA0KICoNCiAqIGRpc3RyaWJ1dGVkIHVuZGVyIHRl cm1zIG9mIEdQTA0KICogdXNlIEdQSU8gcGlucyBmb3IgcGFyYWxsZWwgaW50ZXJmYWNlIA0K ICovDQoNCi8qIEZvciBteSBib2FyZCwgdGhlIHBpbiBsYXlvdXQgaXMgYXMgZm9sbG93cw0K ICoNCiAqIEdQSU8zOgljb250cm9sIGJ1ZmZlciBkaXJlY3Rpb24gY29udHJvbCAoMSBmb3J3 YXJkIGFsd2F5cykNCiAqIEdQSU8yOglkYXRhIGJ1ZmZlciBkaXJlY3Rpb24gY29udHJvbCAo MSBmb3J3YXJkLCAwIHJldmVyc2UpDQogKiBHUElPMToJT3V0cHV0IEVuYWJsZQ0KICoNCiAq IERhdGEgcGluczoJCQlJbnB1dC9PdXB1dA0KICoNCiAqIEdQSU83LTQ6CUQwLUQ0CQlJL08N CiAqIEdQSU8xMS04OglENS1EOAkJSS9PDQogKg0KICogQ29udHJvbCBwaW5zOg0KICoNCiAq IEdQSU8xNToJbkFjawkJSQ0KICogR1BJTzE0OglCdXN5CQlJDQogKiBHUElPMTM6CVBFcnJv cgkJSQ0KICogR1BJTzEyOglTZWxlY3QJCUkNCiAqIEdQSU8xODoJbkZhdWx0CQlJDQogKg0K ICogR1BJTzA6CW5TdHJvYmUJCU8NCiAqIEdQSU8xOToJbkF1dG9GZAkJTw0KICogR1BJTzE3 OglGUF9pbml0CQlPDQogKiBHUElPMTY6CW5TZWxlY3RuCU8NCiAqDQogKi8NCg0KI2luY2x1 ZGUgPGxpbnV4L21vZHVsZS5oPg0KI2luY2x1ZGUgPGxpbnV4L2luaXQuaD4NCiNpbmNsdWRl IDxsaW51eC9wYXJwb3J0Lmg+DQojaW5jbHVkZSA8bGludXgvZGVsYXkuaD4NCiNpbmNsdWRl IDxsaW51eC90eXBlcy5oPg0KDQojaW5jbHVkZSA8YXNtL3NldHVwLmg+DQojaW5jbHVkZSA8 YXNtL2lycS5oPg0KDQojaW5jbHVkZSA8YXNtL2FyY2gvaGFyZHdhcmUuaD4JLy8gSU8gYWRk cmVzcyBmb3IgQVJNDQoNCiNkZWZpbmUgREVCVUcNCiNpZmRlZiBERUJVRw0KICAgICNkZWZp bmUgZHByaW50awlwcmludGsNCiNlbHNlDQogICAgI2RlZmluZSBkcHJpbnRrKHN0dWZmLi4u KQkvLyBnY2MgZXh0ZW50aW9uDQojZW5kaWYNCg0KLy8gZm9yIGNvbnRyb2wgIA0KI2RlZmlu ZSBBUk1fU1RST0JFCUdQSU9fR1BJTzANCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0FVVE9GRAlHUElPX0dQSU8x OQ0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fSU5JVAlHUElPX0dQSU8xNw0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fU0VMRUNUTglH UElPX0dQSU8xNg0KDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9TVFJPQkVfTgkwDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9BVVRP RkRfTgkxOQ0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fSU5JVF9OCTE3DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1ROX04J MTYNCg0KLy8gZm9yIHN0YXR1cw0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fUEFQRVJPVVQJR1BJT19HUElPMTMN CiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX1NFTEVDVAlHUElPX0dQSU8xMg0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fQUNLCQlHUElP X0dQSU8xNQ0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fQlVTWQlHUElPX0dQSU8xNA0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fRVJS T1IJR1BJT19HUElPMTgNCg0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fUEFQRVJPVVRfTgkxMw0KI2RlZmluZSBB Uk1fU0VMRUNUX04JMTINCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0FDS19OCTE1DQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9CVVNZ X04JMTQNCiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0VSUk9SX04JMTgNCg0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fREFUQV9MSU5F UwkweEZGMA0KLy8gZGlyZWN0aW9uIGFuZCBvZSBjb250cm9sDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9ESVJF Q1RJT04JR1BJT19HUElPMg0KI2RlZmluZSBBUk1fUEFSUE9SVF9PRQlHUElPX0dQSU8xDQoN CiNkZWZpbmUgQVJNX0RJUkVDVElPTl9OCQkyDQojZGVmaW5lIEFSTV9QQVJQT1JUX09FX04J MQ0KDQojZGVmaW5lIFNVQ0NFU1MJCTANCg0Kc3RhdGljIHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICp0aGlz X3BvcnQgPSBOVUxMOw0KDQovLyBjaGFuZ2UgZGlyZWN0aW9uLCBidXQgaG93IGFib3V0IHRo ZSBzaWduYWxpbmc/Pw0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2RhdGFfZm9yd2FyZChz dHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCiAgICBkcHJpbnRrKF9fRlVOQ1RJT05fXyAiKClcbiIp Ow0KICAgIC8vIGRpc2FibGUgT0UNCiAgICBHUENSID0gQVJNX1BBUlBPUlRfT0U7DQogICAg Ly8gc3dpdGNoIGRhdGEgcGluIHRvIG91dHB1dA0KICAgIEdQRFIgPSAoR1BEUiAmIH5BUk1f REFUQV9MSU5FUykgfCBBUk1fREFUQV9MSU5FUzsJLy8gc2V0IGRhdGEgcGlucyB0byAxDQog ICAgR1BTUiA9IEFSTV9ESVJFQ1RJT047DQogICAgLy8gZW5hYmxlIG91dHB1dA0KICAgIEdQ U1IgPSBBUk1fUEFSUE9SVF9PRTsNCn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2Rh dGFfcmV2ZXJzZShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCiAgICBkcHJpbnRrKF9fRlVOQ1RJ T05fXyAiKClcbiIpOw0KICAgIEdQQ1IgPSBBUk1fUEFSUE9SVF9PRTsNCiAgICAvLyBzd2l0 Y2ggZGF0YSBwaW5zIHRvIGlucHV0DQogICAgR1BEUiA9IEdQRFIgJiB+QVJNX0RBVEFfTElO RVM7IC8vIHNldCBkYXRhIHBpbnMgdG8gemVybw0KICAgIC8vIGVuYWJsZSBpbnB1dA0KICAg IEdQQ1IgPSBBUk1fRElSRUNUSU9OOw0KICAgIC8vIGVuYWJsZSBidWZmZXINCiAgICBHUFNS ID0gQVJNX1BBUlBPUlRfT0U7DQp9DQoNCg0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3dy aXRlX2RhdGEoc3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnQgKnAsIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXIgZGF0YSkNCnsNCiAg ICBpbnQgaTsNCi8vICAgIGRwcmludGsoX19GVU5DVElPTl9fICIoKVxuIik7DQoNCiAgICAv LyBsb3dlciA0IGJpdHMNCiAgICBmb3IgKGkgPSAwOyBpIDwgNDsgKytpKSB7DQogICAgCWlm ICgoZGF0YSA+PiBpKSAmIDB4MSkJCS8vIGEgMQ0KCSAgICBHUFNSID0gMHgxIDw8ICg3IC0g aSk7CS8vIGltcGxlbWVudGF0aW9uIGRlcGVuZGVudCwgdGFrZSBjYXJlDQoJZWxzZQkJCQkv LyBhIDANCgkgICAgR1BDUiA9IDB4MSA8PCAoNyAtIGkpOw0KICAgIH0NCg0KICAgIC8vIHVw cGVyIDQgYml0cw0KICAgIGZvciAoaSA9IDQ7IGkgPCA4OyArK2kpIHsNCiAgICAJaWYgKChk YXRhID4+IGkpICYgMHgxKQkJLy8gYSAxDQoJICAgIEdQU1IgPSAweDEgPDwgKDE1IC0gaSk7 DQoJZWxzZQkJCQkvLyBhIDANCgkgICAgR1BDUiA9IDB4MSA8PCAoMTUgLSBpKTsNCiAgICB9 DQp9DQoNCnN0YXRpYyB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyDQpwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9yZWFkX2RhdGEoc3Ry dWN0IHBhcnBvcnQgKnApDQp7DQogICAgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBkYXRhID0gMDsNCiAgICB1 X2ludDMyX3QgcmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YTsNCg0KICAgIGRwcmludGsoX19GVU5DVElPTl9fICIo KVxuIik7DQogICAgDQogICAgLy8gcmVhZCBiYWNrIGRhdGENCiAgICByZWdpc3Rlcl9kYXRh ID0gR1BMUjsNCiAgICANCiAgICAvLyBsb3dlciA0IGJpdHMNCiAgICBkYXRhIHw9ICh1X2No YXIpICgocmVnaXN0ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQSU9fR1BJTzcpID4+IDcpOwkvLyBiaXQgMA0KICAg IGRhdGEgfD0gKHVfY2hhcikgKChyZWdpc3Rlcl9kYXRhICYgR1BJT19HUElPNikgPj4gNSk7 CS8vIGJpdCAxDQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodV9jaGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGEgJiBHUElP X0dQSU81KSA+PiAzKTsJLy8gYml0IDINCiAgICBkYXRhIHw9ICh1X2NoYXIpICgocmVnaXN0 ZXJfZGF0YSAmIEdQSU9fR1BJTzQpID4+IDEpOwkvLyBiaXQgMw0KDQogICAgLy8gdXBwZXIg NCBiaXRzDQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodV9jaGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQ SU8xMSkgPj4gNyk7CS8vIGJpdCA0DQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodV9jaGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVy X2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQSU8xMCkgPj4gNSk7CS8vIGJpdCA1DQogICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodV9j aGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQSU85KSAgPj4gMyk7CS8vIGJpdCA2DQog ICAgZGF0YSB8PSAodV9jaGFyKSAoKHJlZ2lzdGVyX2RhdGEgJiBHUElPX0dQSU84KSAgPj4g MSk7CS8vIGJpdCA3DQoNCg0KICAgIHJldHVybiBkYXRhOw0KfQ0KDQovLyB3cml0ZSBjb250 cm9sIHNpZ25hbCwgaWYgd2hhdCBJIHVuZGVyc3RhbmQgaXMgY29ycmVjdA0KLy8gZG8gaSBu ZWVkIHRvIHRha2UgY2FyZSBvZiB0aW1pbmcgaGVyZT8/DQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9y dF9hcm1fd3JpdGVfY29udHJvbChzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBj b250cm9sKQ0Kew0KLy8gICAgZHByaW50ayhfX0ZVTkNUSU9OX18gIigpIDB4JTAyeFxuIiwg Y29udHJvbCk7DQogICANCg0KICAgIGlmIChjb250cm9sICYgUEFSUE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX1NU Uk9CRSkNCiAgICAJR1BTUiA9IDB4MSA8PCBBUk1fU1RST0JFX047DQogICAgZWxzZQ0KICAg IAlHUENSID0gMHgxIDw8IEFSTV9TVFJPQkVfTjsNCg0KICAgIGlmIChjb250cm9sICYgUEFS UE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX0FVVE9GRCkNCiAgICAJR1BTUiA9IDB4MSA8PCBBUk1fQVVUT0ZEX047 DQogICAgZWxzZQ0KICAgIAlHUENSID0gMHgxIDw8IEFSTV9BVVRPRkRfTjsNCg0KICAgIGlm IChjb250cm9sICYgUEFSUE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX0lOSVQpDQogICAgICAgIEdQU1IgPSAweDEg PDwgQVJNX0lOSVRfTjsNCiAgICBlbHNlDQogICAgCUdQQ1IgPSAweDEgPDwgQVJNX0lOSVRf TjsNCg0KICAgIGlmIChjb250cm9sICYgUEFSUE9SVF9DT05UUk9MX1NFTEVDVCkNCiAgICAJ R1BTUiA9IDB4MSA8PCBBUk1fU0VMRUNUTl9OOw0KICAgIGVsc2UNCiAgICAJR1BDUiA9IDB4 MSA8PCBBUk1fU0VMRUNUTl9OOw0KCQ0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcg0KcGFy cG9ydF9hcm1fcmVhZF9jb250cm9sKHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwKQ0Kew0KICAgIHVfaW50 MzJfdCByZWdfZGF0YSA9IEdQTFI7DQogICAgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBjdHJsX2RhdGEgPSAw Ow0KDQovLyAgICBkcHJpbnRrKF9fRlVOQ1RJT05fXyAiKClcbiIpOw0KICAgIGN0cmxfZGF0 YSB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikNCiAgICAJCSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9TVFJPQkUp ID4+IEFSTV9TVFJPQkVfTikgPDwgMCk7DQogICAgY3RybF9kYXRhIHw9ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBj aGFyKQ0KICAgIAkJICgoKHJlZ19kYXRhICYgQVJNX0FVVE9GRCkgPj4gQVJNX0FVVE9GRF9O KSA8PCAxKTsNCiAgICBjdHJsX2RhdGEgfD0gKHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXIpDQogICAgCQkgKCgo cmVnX2RhdGEgJiBBUk1fSU5JVCkgPj4gQVJNX0lOSVRfTikgPDwgMik7DQogICAgY3RybF9k YXRhIHw9ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyKQ0KICAgIAkJICgoKHJlZ19kYXRhICYgQVJNX1NFTEVD VE4pID4+IEFSTV9TRUxFQ1ROX04pIDw8IDMpOw0KDQogICAgcmV0dXJuIGN0cmxfZGF0YTsN Cn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXINCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2Zyb2JfY29udHJvbChz dHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgdW5zaWduZWQgY2hhciBtYXNrLCB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyIHZh bCkNCnsNCiAgICB1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyIG9sZCA9IHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfY29udHJv bChwKTsNCg0KLy8gICAgZHByaW50ayhfX0ZVTkNUSU9OX18gIigpXG4iKTsNCiAgICBwYXJw b3J0X2FybV93cml0ZV9jb250cm9sKHAsIChvbGQgfCBtYXNrKSAmICh+dmFsKSk7DQogICAg cmV0dXJuIG9sZDsNCn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXINCnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3Jl YWRfc3RhdHVzKHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwKQ0Kew0KICAgIHVuc2lnbmVkIGNoYXIgc3Rh dHVzID0gMDsNCiAgICB1X2ludDMyX3QJcmVnX2RhdGEgPSBHUExSOw0KICAgIA0KLy8gICAg ZHByaW50ayhfX0ZVTkNUSU9OX18gIigpXG4iKTsNCiAgICBzdGF0dXMgfD0gKHVuc2lnbmVk IGNoYXIpICgoKHJlZ19kYXRhICYgQVJNX0VSUk9SKSA+PiBBUk1fRVJST1JfTikgPDwgMyk7 DQoJCQkgICAgICAgDQogICAgc3RhdHVzIHw9ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyKSAoKChyZWdfZGF0 YSAmIEFSTV9TRUxFQ1QpID4+IEFSTV9TRUxFQ1RfTikgPDwgNCk7DQogICAgDQogICAgc3Rh dHVzIHw9ICh1bnNpZ25lZCBjaGFyKSAoKChyZWdfZGF0YSAmIEFSTV9QQVBFUk9VVCkgPj4g QVJNX1BBUEVST1VUX04pIDw8IDUpOw0KICAgIA0KICAgIHN0YXR1cyB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQg Y2hhcikgKCgocmVnX2RhdGEgJiBBUk1fQUNLKSA+PiBBUk1fQUNLX04pIDw8IDYpOw0KCQkJ ICAgICAgIA0KICAgIHN0YXR1cyB8PSAodW5zaWduZWQgY2hhcikgKCgocmVnX2RhdGEgJiBB Uk1fQlVTWSkgPj4gQVJNX0JVU1lfTikgPDwgNyk7DQogICAgDQogICAgLy9kcHJpbnRrKF9f RlVOQ1RJT05fXyAiKCk6IDB4JTAyeFxuIiwgc3RhdHVzKTsNCiAgICByZXR1cm4gc3RhdHVz Ow0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZW5hYmxlX2lycShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFy cG9ydCAqcCkNCnsNCgkvLyBub3QgaW1wbGVtZW50ZWQsIG5vIGlycQ0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMg dm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZGlzYWJsZV9pcnEoc3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnQgKnApDQp7DQoJ Ly8gbm90IGltcGxlbWVudGVkLCBubyBpcnENCn0NCg0Kc3RhdGljIHZvaWQNCnBhcnBvcnRf YXJtX2luaXRfc3RhdGUoc3RydWN0IHBhcmRldmljZSAqZGV2LCBzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydF9z dGF0ZSAqcykNCnsNCi8vICAgIGRwcmludGsoX19GVU5DVElPTl9fICIoKVxuIik7DQogICAg cy0+dS5zdHJvbmdhcm0uZGF0YSA9IDA7DQogICAgcy0+dS5zdHJvbmdhcm0uZGF0YV9kaXIg PSAxOwkvLyBvdXRwdXQNCiAgICBzLT51LnN0cm9uZ2FybS5jdHJsID0gMHgzOw0KfQ0KDQpz dGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fc2F2ZV9zdGF0ZShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwg c3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnRfc3RhdGUgKnMpDQp7DQovLyAgICBkcHJpbnRrKF9fRlVOQ1RJT05f XyAiKClcbiIpOw0KICAgIHMtPnUuc3Ryb25nYXJtLmRhdGEgPSAwOw0KICAgIHMtPnUuc3Ry b25nYXJtLmRhdGFfZGlyID0gKHVfY2hhcikgKChHUERSICYgQVJNX0RJUkVDVElPTikgPj4g QVJNX0RJUkVDVElPTl9OKTsNCiAgICBzLT51LnN0cm9uZ2FybS5jdHJsID0gcGFycG9ydF9h cm1fcmVhZF9jb250cm9sKHApOw0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fcmVz dG9yZV9zdGF0ZShzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydCAqcCwgc3RydWN0IHBhcnBvcnRfc3RhdGUgKnMp DQp7DQovLyAgICBkcHJpbnRrKF9fRlVOQ1RJT05fXyAiKClcbiIpOw0KICAgIEdQRFIgPSAo R1BEUiAmIH5BUk1fRElSRUNUSU9OKSB8IChzLT51LnN0cm9uZ2FybS5kYXRhX2RpciA8PCBB Uk1fRElSRUNUSU9OX04pOw0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3dyaXRlX2RhdGEocCwgcy0+dS5z dHJvbmdhcm0uZGF0YSk7DQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fd3JpdGVfY29udHJvbChwLCBzLT51 LnN0cm9uZ2FybS5jdHJsKTsNCn0NCg0KDQpzdGF0aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1faW5j X3VzZV9jb3VudCh2b2lkKQ0Kew0KICAgIE1PRF9JTkNfVVNFX0NPVU5UOw0KfQ0KDQpzdGF0 aWMgdm9pZA0KcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZGVjX3VzZV9jb3VudCh2b2lkKQ0Kew0KICAgIE1PRF9E RUNfVVNFX0NPVU5UOw0KfQ0KDQpzdHJ1Y3QgcGFycG9ydF9vcGVyYXRpb25zIHBhcnBvcnRf YXJtX29wcyA9DQp7DQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fd3JpdGVfZGF0YSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0 X2FybV9yZWFkX2RhdGEsDQoNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3dyaXRlX2NvbnRyb2wsDQog ICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fcmVhZF9jb250cm9sLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2Zyb2JfY29u dHJvbCwNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3JlYWRfc3RhdHVzLA0KDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9h cm1fZW5hYmxlX2lycSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9kaXNhYmxlX2lycSwNCiAgICANCiAg ICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9kYXRhX2ZvcndhcmQsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1fZGF0YV9yZXZl cnNlLA0KDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9hcm1faW5pdF9zdGF0ZSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2FybV9z YXZlX3N0YXRlLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX3Jlc3RvcmVfc3RhdGUsDQoNCiAgICBwYXJw b3J0X2FybV9pbmNfdXNlX2NvdW50LA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX2RlY191c2VfY291bnQs DQoNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2llZWUxMjg0X2VwcF93cml0ZV9kYXRhLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRf aWVlZTEyODRfZXBwX3JlYWRfZGF0YSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2llZWUxMjg0X2VwcF93cml0 ZV9hZGRyLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfaWVlZTEyODRfZXBwX3JlYWRfYWRkciwNCg0KICAgIHBh cnBvcnRfaWVlZTEyODRfZWNwX3dyaXRlX2RhdGEsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9pZWVlMTI4NF9l Y3BfcmVhZF9kYXRhLA0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfaWVlZTEyODRfZWNwX3dyaXRlX2FkZHIsDQog ICAgDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9pZWVlMTI4NF93cml0ZV9jb21wYXQsDQogICAgcGFycG9ydF9p ZWVlMTI4NF9yZWFkX25pYmJsZSwNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2llZWUxMjg0X3JlYWRfYnl0ZQ0K fTsNCg0KTU9EVUxFX0FVVEhPUigiWmh1IFF1biBZaW5nICBxeXpodUBrcmRsLm9yZy5zZyIp Ow0KTU9EVUxFX0RFU0NSSVBUSU9OKCJwYXJhbGxlbCBwb3J0IGZvciBTcm9uZ0FSTSBTQTEx MDBcbiIpOw0KDQovLyBtb2R1bGUgY29kZQ0KaW50DQppbml0X21vZHVsZSh2b2lkKQ0Kew0K ICAgIHN0cnVjdCBwYXJwb3J0ICpwOw0KICAgIHVuc2lnbmVkIGxvbmcgYmFzZV9hZGRyZXNz ID0gMHgzNzg7IC8vIHBjIHN0eWxlIGFkZHJlc3MuDQogICAgLy8gc2V0IElPIHBpbnMgZGly ZWN0aW9uDQogICAgR1BEUiA9IEFSTV9TVFJPQkUgfCBBUk1fQVVUT0ZEIHwgQVJNX0lOSVQg fCBBUk1fU0VMRUNUTiB8IEFSTV9EQVRBX0xJTkVTIHwNCiAgICAgCSAgIEFSTV9QQVJQT1JU X09FIHwgQVJNX0RJUkVDVElPTjsNCiAgICANCiAgICAvLyBzZXQgZm9yd2FyZCBkaXJlY3Rp b24gYW5kIE9FDQogICAgR1BTUiA9IEFSTV9ESVJFQ1RJT04gfCBBUk1fUEFSUE9SVF9PRTsN CiAgICANCiAgICBwID0gcGFycG9ydF9yZWdpc3Rlcl9wb3J0KGJhc2VfYWRkcmVzcywJLy8g d2hhdCBhZGRyZXNzPw0KICAgIAkJCSAgICAgIFBBUlBPUlRfSVJRX05PTkUsCS8vIG5vIGly cT8NCgkJCSAgICAgIFBBUlBPUlRfRE1BX05PTkUsCS8vIE5PIERNQSwgY291bGQgSSB1c2Ug RE1BPw0KCQkJICAgICAgJnBhcnBvcnRfYXJtX29wcyk7DQoNCiAgICBpZiAoIXApDQogICAg CXJldHVybiAxOw0KDQogICAgdGhpc19wb3J0ID0gcDsNCg0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfcHJvY19y ZWdpc3RlcihwKTsNCiAgICBwYXJwb3J0X2Fubm91bmNlX3BvcnQocCk7DQogICAgIA0KICAg IGRwcmludGsoInBhcnBvcnRfYXJtIG1vZHVsZSBsb2FkZWRcbiIpOw0KICAgIHJldHVybiBT VUNDRVNTOw0KDQp9DQoNCnZvaWQNCmNsZWFudXBfbW9kdWxlKHZvaWQpDQp7DQogICAgZHBy aW50aygicGFycG9ydF9hcm0gbW9kdWxlIHJlbW92ZWRcbiIpOw0KICAgIHBhcnBvcnRfcHJv Y191bnJlZ2lzdGVyKHRoaXNfcG9ydCk7DQogICAgcGFycG9ydF91bnJlZ2lzdGVyX3BvcnQo dGhpc19wb3J0KTsNCn0NCg0K --Boundary_(ID_/N8t5n2VSZo3oXQdo5wDTQ)-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 04:27:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA04027 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:27:25 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA04023 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:27:24 +0200 Received: from manhattan.insomnia.org (manhattan.insomnia.org [216.254.63.164]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00JJ4W5L1C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:27:23 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from insomnia.org (trust.insomnia.org [216.254.63.169]) by manhattan.insomnia.org (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id e3P2Npt04946 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:23:51 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:23:42 -0400 From: Patrick Cantwell Subject: Interesting idea for a LART module. To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: seamus@insomnia.org Message-id: <390501AE.C7A8385A@insomnia.org> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello, I'm new to the list, so I'll start with the introduction.. :) I'm Pat (and I'm a geek!) ;^) anyway.. I was just sitting around, and I thought of a neat idea for a LART module.. (this works in tune with those who want to use their LARTs as routers) -- a DSL line module.. Motorola as well as others make the decoding chips, and IIRC many of the chips handled the different line standards in use by the different ILECs and CLECs providing DSL around the US today (I don't know much about international DSL unfortunately).. at any rate, you could have a DSL module and an ethernet module and boom, no more need for that expensive flowpoint 2200 =) Pat -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 05:05:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA04138 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:05:46 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA04133; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:05:42 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3904F295.7A1B22FB@mjv.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:03:39 +0200 To: Michael Vanecek From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 03:19 +0200 25-04-2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: >That settles that - back-burner that idea for later. sa-2 huh? I wonder >how far Intel will take the StrongArm. Please, still post a wishlist on >the net for those of us who would like to help... Will do once I find the time. >BTW - are you guys keeping development "in house" or can others get >involved? I would really really REALLY like others to get involved, but for that we need a common data format (like C is for software) and possibly free tools (think GNU, gcc). JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 05:15:40 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA04164 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:15:40 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA04160 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:15:40 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTJ00K7MYE22G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:15:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20] ident=root) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12jvnZ-0008NS-00; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:14:05 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12jvnY-0000o7-00; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:14:04 -0600 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:14:04 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Testability thought... In-reply-to: X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In looking at the KSB schematics I noticed that the 74LVC16245 and '16373 are listed as "obsolete" by TI. While they obviously will be kicking around for a while, and I'm *not* suggesting the KSB be reworked just yet (!) I did have a thought ... If those bus drivers were replaced with 74LVTH18502's (works for both) we'd get both extremely low power and (drum roll) more JTAG parts! Since they're on a lot of lines going to/from the SA-1100, it's an ideal spot to test the PCB's and interconnect. Yes, I realize that at the moment there isn't much other than the SA to talk JTAG to, but I'm looking ahead to what happens when you wan to hook 20 or so LARTs to an FPGA crossbar switch. Then I think I'd want internal test points EVERYwhere. Plus I want open source[1] JTAG software. :-) Thoughts? --Chris [1] OSS != GPL -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 06:04:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04308 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:04:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04295 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:04:53 +0200 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK00KK40O42G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:04:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from pe6s03a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.227.231] helo=rentbert) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12jwZg-0002lQ-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:03:50 +0100 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:03:32 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: Modem... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <002501bfae6b$410d7d40$0f52fea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Has any one found a good(cheap in small quantities) modem chip/board for the lart, because i would really like to have an on board one because it would be easier(IMO) than puting PCMCIA capabilities and would use less power(?) so i think this is the best way of getting a modem onto the lart/KSB board. also the bus on the lart is 100Mb/s right? so is there away to get it to go faster or would u need to change the chip? i sayn this because i plan to use it quite intensivly for graphics /=) and would like to get the most out of the graphics adapter and leave plenty of space on the bus for other things.... btw i dont know if you can get them, i have not found one anyway...but i would like to have an onboard GPS reciever, preferably a chip/board add-on but i dont mind if i have to buy a whole handset and take it apart...my lart has to have GPS=) -Raphael -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 06:05:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04324 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:05:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04320 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:05:47 +0200 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (smtp.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.32]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTK00KPS0PL3H@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:05:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cogeco-80-25.cgocable.net (HELO co484059a) (24.141.80.25) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:02:29 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:02:24 -0400 From: Randy Glenn Subject: RE: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] In-reply-to: To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: picxpert@yahoo.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Apparently-From: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk What about gEDA? Open-source electronic design tools. http://www.geda.seul.org/ They've got schematic capture, PCB design, Verilog, SPICE, etc. - all free! Plus, links to other free Electronics software. -Randy Glenn PICxpert@techie.com - http://i.am/PICxpert "Is this a wretched demi-bee, half asleep upon my knee, Some freak, from a menagerie? NO! It's Eric, the half a bee!" - Monty Python -----Original Message----- From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On Behalf Of J.D. Bakker Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 11:04 PM To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] At 03:19 +0200 25-04-2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: >That settles that - back-burner that idea for later. sa-2 huh? I wonder >how far Intel will take the StrongArm. Please, still post a wishlist on >the net for those of us who would like to help... Will do once I find the time. >BTW - are you guys keeping development "in house" or can others get >involved? I would really really REALLY like others to get involved, but for that we need a common data format (like C is for software) and possibly free tools (think GNU, gcc). JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 06:08:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA04371 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:08:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA04367 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:08:49 +0200 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK00KLN0UP2G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:08:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from pe6s03a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.227.231] helo=rentbert) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12jweS-0002nJ-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:08:45 +0100 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:08:33 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: Re: LART PCBs now available To: greg.fountain@telvex.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <004a01bfae6b$f1154560$0f52fea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <3904D67B.9703FD73@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk ok cool..but how much? and how much is the shipping to wales,UK? thanks. -Raphael ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Fountain To: Lart Mail Server Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 12:19 AM Subject: LART PCBs now available > Hello everyone, > > I just picked up a stack of LART PC Boards from the fabricator this > afternoon. Taking a quick look at them under my inspection microscope > they look pretty good all-in-all. > > I'll try and post additional details on how to submit order requests > later today after I've checked them more carefully. > > Theses are the bare PC boards not the assembled version. > > Greg Fountain > Menlo Park, California > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 08:05:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA04598 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:05:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA04594 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:05:29 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK00MAU693FH@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:05:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id XAA2966643 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:00:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:00:23 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: How to request a LART PC Board To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <39053477.193F9C79@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------1B75123DCC858084E0F80D43" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------1B75123DCC858084E0F80D43 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the info on how to request a LART PC Board (Remember theses are just the bare PC boards not assembled units) PRICE PER BOARD: $45 US Right now I have about 40 boards I can spare. I would like to limit the maximum number for any one individual to 5. That way a larger number of people can get their hands on one if they want to try assembling a LART themselves. PC Board description: COPPER LAYERS: 6 (1/2 Ounce copper) MATERIAL: FR-4 BOARD SIZE: 3.94"(100mm) x 2.95"(75mm) x 0.062 thick AREA: 11.62 sq.in. SILKSCREEN: Top & Bottom Color: White PLATING FINISH: Horizontal Hot Air Solder Level SOLDER MASK: Type: SMOBC (LPI) Top & Botttom Color: Green I'll try and take a few 35 mm close-up photos with a Macro Lens tomorrow and have them placed directly on a Photo CD-ROM. If you send me an e-mail, I'll reply with a few JPEG attachments so you can see what the board(s) actually look like. If your interested here is what I NEED FROM YOU: 1.) Your NAME, PHONE NUMBER and E-mail address 2.) QUANTITY REQUIRED 3.) A COMPLETE ADDRESS (Spelled out on a line by line basis) 4.) Check or Money Order made Payable to TELVEX (# of PC Boards x $45 + Shipping) SHIPPING: Assume Priority Mail (for US shipments) or Global Priority Mail For US Domestic Shipping add $3.20 for US Postal Service Priority Mail For International Shipping Check the US Postal Service Global Priority Mail Website http://ircalc.usps.gov/ Use Package (No correspondence enclosed) Here is my INFO Greg Fountain Post Office Box 913 Palo Alto, CA 94302 USA FAX: 650-854-2465 Voice: 650-854-6626 E-mail: greg@telvex.com Please don't call and leave a verbal order. I think there will be fewer mistakes and everyone will be happier in the long run if we have a written record. Regarding International orders. The processing of US orders should be a snap for me but I have to admit the International currency conversion issue sounds like a potential pain. Anyone have any suggestions to address this subject? WARRANTY: NONE. Boards were fabricated from the gerber files posted on the LART website (http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/) They look good under an inspection microscope and do not have any power to ground plane shorts to the best of my knowledge. Since I have yet to assembled and tested a complete LART so your risk is about the same as mine. (actually less since you will not have to eat the cost associated with any unused boards) I will not cash any checks or ship any PC boards until I've completed a check against the schematics. I would however like to get started on a list of potential co-developers ASAP. Cheers Greg --------------1B75123DCC858084E0F80D43 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------1B75123DCC858084E0F80D43-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 10:00:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04866 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:00:10 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04858; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:00:00 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:55:03 +0200 To: picxpert@yahoo.com From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: RE: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 06:02 +0200 25-04-2000, Randy Glenn wrote: >What about gEDA? Open-source electronic design tools. >http://www.geda.seul.org/ > >They've got schematic capture, PCB design, Verilog, SPICE, etc. - all free! >Plus, links to other free Electronics software. I know; see my message to the list entitled "Open Source CAD tools" dated April 15. Trouble is it isn't quite ready yet; it needs software developers (hint, hint ;-)). JDB [down to 2.5 hours of sleep] -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 10:39:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05067 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:39:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05063 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:39:51 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK006RJDEE9R@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:39:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.128) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:23:39 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:23:43 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: re: GPS wanted on LART In-reply-to: <002501bfae6b$410d7d40$0f52fea9@rentbert> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000425012204.00b2de60@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk There is a SIMM sized GPS receiver board available for < $100 At 05:03 AM 4/25/00 +0100, you wrote: >Has any one found a good(cheap in small quantities) modem chip/board for the >lart, because i would really like to have an on board one >because it would be easier(IMO) than puting PCMCIA capabilities and would >use less power(?) so i think this is the best way of getting a modem onto >the lart/KSB board. > >also the bus on the lart is 100Mb/s right? >so is there away to get it to go faster or would u need to change the chip? >i sayn this because >i plan to use it quite intensivly for graphics /=) and would like to get the >most out of the graphics adapter and leave >plenty of space on the bus for other things.... > >btw i dont know if you can get them, i have not found one anyway...but i >would like to have an onboard GPS reciever, preferably a chip/board add-on >but i dont mind if i have to buy a whole handset and take it apart...my lart >has to have GPS=) > >-Raphael > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 11:47:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05288 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:47:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05284 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:47:54 +0200 Received: from legolas.reipur.com ([194.255.24.11]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK00CE9GIUH5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:47:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from nmahncke ([172.16.26.53]) by legolas.reipur.com (8.9.2/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA05355; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:42:48 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:42:51 +0200 From: Nicolai Mahncke Subject: RE: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] In-reply-to: To: "'J.D. Bakker'" , "'Michael Vanecek'" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000601bfae9a$a07e6da0$351a10ac@reipur.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk As I have posted earlier I have a connection to a company willing to do low volume (10-30) mounting and X-ray verification of BGA packages. Right now I'm setting up production of LARTs etc. myself to sell at low prices and high volume to all of you :) Surely I can inlude delivering almost-bare boards with only the BGA's mounted. Especially to you JDB, even for free. Best regards Nicolai Mahncke mailto:nicolai@reipur.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of J.D. Bakker > Sent: 24 April, 2000 23:08 > To: Michael Vanecek > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] > > > > So, Lart developers - would you be willing > >to explore the sa-1110/1111 option and the bga package? If > you had bga > >adapters for prototyping, would that make a difference? If > you checked > >your mail and found all this, would you use it? > > Maybe. > > There's another issue besides the BGA one: time. Redoing LART > for SA-1100 > may take weeks; I don't have that amount of schedulable time > ATM. Honestly > I don't see the big deal in going for the SA-1110: you don't > gain much in > functionality or processing power. The advantages of the > SA-1110 over the > SA-1100 mainly show in very high volume applications. > Personally I'd rather > wait for the SA-2 (or pester Intel to get samples), or invest > my design > time in ClusterLART / FPGA boards. > > Of course it would be nice to have a '1110 (+'1111) board anyway; I'm > investigating some low-effort ways to get there from here. > Having actual > SA-1110 chips on my desk would speed up the proto testing > *if/when I find > an easy way to get a PCB design*. In this stage I'd keep my > money in my > pocket if I were you. > > JDB. > > -- > "Windows is the one true OS. MS invented the GUI. MS invented the 32 > bit OS. MS is open and standard. MS loves you. We have always been > at war with Oceania." -- Tracy Reed > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 11:54:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05314 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:54:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05310 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:54:28 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK00DFIGUR63@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:54:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.128) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Tue, 25 Apr 2000 02:38:21 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 02:38:27 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: re GPS module X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000425023706.00b23690@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Sorry - I forgot to post the URL to see the module. Its at http://www.sigem.com/datasheets/SGM5608PM.pdf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 15:36:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA05939 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:36:04 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA05935; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:35:55 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:21:50 +0200 To: Chris Curtis From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Testability thought... Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 05:14 +0200 25-04-2000, Chris Curtis wrote: >In looking at the KSB schematics I noticed that the 74LVC16245 and '16373 >are listed as "obsolete" by TI. That's just me being sloppy with the part specifications. I meant the '16245A (and '16373A); those are active. The same footprints support the newer ALV devices BTW. For the LART protos I actually use the Philips 74LVT162245BDL as those were easily obtainable (and have built in series termination resistors, which is a Good Thing for driving IDE cables). >If those bus drivers were replaced with 74LVTH18502's (works for both) >we'd get both extremely low power and (drum roll) more JTAG parts! Since >they're on a lot of lines going to/from the SA-1100, it's an ideal spot to >test the PCB's and interconnect. Erm yes, but those are US$15 each in qty 1000, versus $1 for the regular ones. Three of those devices amount to over half the KSB component cost. An alternative may be to use CPLDs for address/data buffering; most newer devices support JTAG. The Xilinx (formerly Philips) CoolRunners sound attractive in that respect. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 16:04:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA06027 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:04:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA06023 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:04:09 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTK0092ZSERM3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:04:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20]) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12k5ra-0004gf-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 07:58:54 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12k5rZ-0005NP-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 07:58:53 -0600 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 07:58:53 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Re: Testability thought... In-reply-to: X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: Chris Curtis , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 05:14 +0200 25-04-2000, Chris Curtis wrote: > That's just me being sloppy with the part specifications. I meant the > '16245A (and '16373A); those are active. The same footprints support the > newer ALV devices BTW. For the LART protos I actually use the Philips > 74LVT162245BDL as those were easily obtainable (and have built in series > termination resistors, which is a Good Thing for driving IDE cables). Hehe ... and that's just me being sloppy and not looking for the 'A' parts. Ooops. (IIRC the '18502s also have series termination resistors). > Erm yes, but those are US$15 each in qty 1000, versus $1 for the regular > ones. Three of those devices amount to over half the KSB component cost. An > alternative may be to use CPLDs for address/data buffering; most newer > devices support JTAG. The Xilinx (formerly Philips) CoolRunners sound > attractive in that respect. Oh, THAT. I'll confess to not paying too much attention to the component cost there. The CPLD idea is an interesting one, though. You'll never catch me badmouthing Xilinx, even if the part is a Philips one. There must be something we can use the CPLD to do (other than buffering) on that board. The XPLA3's are incredibly low-power, too. Plus they even come in chip-scale BGA! :-) [never fear, they come in QP as well] --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 19:30:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA06573 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:30:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA06569 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:30:45 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00K6T1Z6MC@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:30:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.7] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A5C9320902A4; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:28:41 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:35:11 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Assembly for StrongARM Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3905D74F.8B372D11@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'd like to try my hand at some lowlevel programming in assembly for the StrongArm architecture. I've never really done much assembly though I've gone through a fair share of tutorials (all for the x86 platform) and am familiar with using nasm and gasm. Do you guys have a recommendation for a good resource of information for a non-expert assembly programmer wannabe? I program currently in c, c++, php, perl, etc... (I wonder if ada compiles on the StrongArm architecture?) and would like to get under the hood a little more... Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 20:13:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06749 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:13:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06745 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:13:39 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00LH03YPUJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:13:38 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id NAA01578; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:10:16 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:10:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM In-reply-to: <3905D74F.8B372D11@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004251810.NAA01578@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mike wrote... > I'd like to try my hand at some lowlevel programming in assembly for the > StrongArm architecture.... You will need the instruction set documents, go to the LART docs page and look down for the ARM7 Data sheet and quick reference card. Ignore the `thumb' instructions. StrongARM does not have them. Next you will need an assembler and a test platform. gas works fine although its a thin assembler intended for compiler back ends. Back when `real men' used assemblers, assemblers were much better. For a test platform, gdb can be built with an ARM simulator in it as a backend. Read the gdb manual for that one (not man page, manual). I also provide accounts on a StrongARM machine for any developer that asks. You could do that as well. > (I wonder if > ada compiles on the StrongArm architecture?)... I cross compiled gnat onto the m88k many years ago. It could be done for ARM. I thought about it as part of my Debian porting efforts but then decided it would be wasted effort since the odds were no one would ever use it. A large contingent of Ada programmers eager to use the ARM could persuade me otherwise, or I might just ROFL. :-) -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 21:22:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA06981 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:22:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA06977 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:22:53 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL0020T7633D@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:22:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20] ident=root) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12kAv4-0000QB-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:22:50 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12kAv3-0002Xy-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:22:49 -0600 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:22:49 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM In-reply-to: <200004251810.NAA01578@core.federated.com> X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: Jim Studt Cc: Michael Vanecek , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > You will need the instruction set documents, go to the LART docs > page and look down for the ARM7 Data sheet and quick reference card. > Ignore the `thumb' instructions. StrongARM does not have them. > There is rather a good intro to ARM assembly (including some more advanced corners) in the "Programming Techniques" manual included in the ARM SDT. The current, commercial version is expensive, but if you can get the university edition the docs alone are worth it, I think. I'm learning it myself, and they help a lot. I'm beginning to see why so many people like the ARM instruction set. > Next you will need an assembler and a test platform. > > gas works fine although its a thin assembler intended for compiler > back ends. Back when `real men' used assemblers, assemblers were much > better. The university SDT includes the ARM compiler and assembler, but under a university license. I'm not sure how the license applies to the documentation, or I'd share the PDF files I have. > For a test platform, gdb can be built with an ARM simulator in it as > a backend. Read the gdb manual for that one (not man page, manual). > I also provide accounts on a StrongARM machine for any developer that > asks. You could do that as well. > I cross compiled gnat onto the m88k many years ago. It could be done > for ARM. I thought about it as part of my Debian porting efforts but > then decided it would be wasted effort since the odds were no one would > ever use it. A large contingent of Ada programmers eager to use the > ARM could persuade me otherwise, or I might just ROFL. :-) Oddly enough, my near-term intentions for my LART when I get it are to port GNAT/RTEMS to it. So that sounds to me like at least 3 who'd like to see AdaLART. I make no apologies for liking Ada. :-) --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 21:30:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07027 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:30:14 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07023 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:30:13 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL001LA7IB71@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:30:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.88] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A141AE2006E; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:25:53 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:32:27 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3905F2CB.10F72A46@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004251810.NAA01578@core.federated.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I've always been "familiar" with assembly, but only recently did I discover it - there is just a tremendous amount of power and speed that can be had with assembly that would otherwise not be as available from higher level languages. I've started mulling over the hello-world program again to reaquaint myself with it. I think for imbedded applications, even though we have a whole 4 megs of Rom and 32 megs of Ram, assembly would probably be the way to go not just for drivers but for application coding as well... Of course, I'm still exploring Ada95 which seems to be another embedded optimized language. Perhaps Lart can put up a code page that we can post our apps too? Mike Jim Studt wrote: > > Mike wrote... > > I'd like to try my hand at some lowlevel programming in assembly for the > > StrongArm architecture.... > > You will need the instruction set documents, go to the LART docs > page and look down for the ARM7 Data sheet and quick reference card. > Ignore the `thumb' instructions. StrongARM does not have them. > > Next you will need an assembler and a test platform. > > gas works fine although its a thin assembler intended for compiler > back ends. Back when `real men' used assemblers, assemblers were much > better. > > For a test platform, gdb can be built with an ARM simulator in it as > a backend. Read the gdb manual for that one (not man page, manual). > I also provide accounts on a StrongARM machine for any developer that > asks. You could do that as well. > > > (I wonder if > > ada compiles on the StrongArm architecture?)... > > I cross compiled gnat onto the m88k many years ago. It could be done > for ARM. I thought about it as part of my Debian porting efforts but > then decided it would be wasted effort since the odds were no one would > ever use it. A large contingent of Ada programmers eager to use the > ARM could persuade me otherwise, or I might just ROFL. :-) > > -- > Jim Studt, President > The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 21:45:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07185 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:45:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07181 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:44:59 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL0022Y86YUF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:44:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.88] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A4E31CB0006E; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:41:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:47:55 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Make Way for the Palm... Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3905F66B.35856369@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Apparently SA is making an impact - now Palm is moving over to the Arm/StrongArm architecture. I wonder what future developments in the SA are being planned now that demand is in the increase? And I wonder when some creative person with a Rom programmer is going to stick Linux on the new Palms? Story from Slashdot... Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 22:20:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07358 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:20:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07354 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:20:21 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL002PC9TWUF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:20:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CFED74811; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:11:57 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:11:57 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM In-reply-to: <3905D74F.8B372D11@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > I'd like to try my hand at some lowlevel programming in assembly for the > StrongArm architecture. ARM assembly is utterly beautiful. (RISC OS veteran) kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 22:33:59 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07408 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:33:59 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07404 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:33:59 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA06490; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:33:54 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200004252033.WAA06490@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM To: mike@mjv.com (Michael Vanecek) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:33:53 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl In-Reply-To: <3905F2CB.10F72A46@mjv.com> from "Michael Vanecek" at Apr 25, 2000 02:32:27 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi Mike, > for application coding as well... Of course, I'm still exploring Ada95 > which seems to be another embedded optimized language. Perhaps Lart can > put up a code page that we can post our apps too? Maybe you didn't notice it, but we do have a place for that. We call it the LART Application Repository (we managed to restrain ourselves just in time before it became a recursive acronym). I intend to make a clearer distinction between ideas and actual code/hardware, and there should be enough room to indicate whether a project is software or hardware only. Please have look at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/LAR/ and feel free to comment on it. You'll see that there are enough ideas already to kep someone busy for several years. Currently I don't cross-post LAR submissions to the mailing list, so anyone interested should check that page once in a while. -- Marc M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 22:54:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07488 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:54:51 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07484 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:54:50 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id WAA09678; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:54:39 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:54:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004252054.WAA09678@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: mike@mjv.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM In-Reply-To: <3905F2CB.10F72A46@mjv.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:32:27 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote: > I've always been "familiar" with assembly, but only recently did I > discover it - there is just a tremendous amount of power and speed that > can be had with assembly that would otherwise not be as available from > higher level languages. I've started mulling over the hello-world Watch out for the big optimization trap over here: don't write a single line of assembly unless you're 100% sure that you're actually optimizing the correct part. The golden rule is to use a profiler before you start. > program again to reaquaint myself with it. I think for imbedded > applications, even though we have a whole 4 megs of Rom and 32 megs of > Ram, assembly would probably be the way to go not just for drivers but > for application coding as well... Of course, I'm still exploring Ada95 I don't think so. Have a look at the Linux kernel: only the very low level parts are written in assembly, the rest is plain C. Why? Because of portability and maintainability. Besides, gcc-2.95.2 generates excellent ARM code in most cases, so why bother with assembly? I agree with Kira that ARM assembly is utterly beautiful (especially when coming from i386), but that doesn't mean that it should be used for everything. > which seems to be another embedded optimized language. Perhaps Lart can > put up a code page that we can post our apps too? What about the LAR? (Oh, I see Marc just explained it) Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 23:52:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07696 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07692 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:48 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL0080NE3Z86@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12kDEF-000As0-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:50:47 +0100 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:51:42 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3906136E.4A3ABE3A@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004252054.WAA09678@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > Watch out for the big optimization trap over here: don't write a single > line of assembly unless you're 100% sure that you're actually optimizing > the correct part. The golden rule is to use a profiler before you start. Nah- to hell with it- play! Writing ARM assembler is therapeutic, especially after a hard day beating on compilers with a mind of their own :) > I don't think so. Have a look at the Linux kernel: only the very low level > parts are written in assembly, the rest is plain C. Why? Because of > portability and maintainability. Besides, gcc-2.95.2 generates excellent > ARM code in most cases, so why bother with assembly? I agree with Kira > that ARM assembly is utterly beautiful (especially when coming from i386), > but that doesn't mean that it should be used for everything. In the real world(tm) of multi-person projects, deadlines and customer-driven lunacy, yes. In an evening of hacky spodding, bringing up a new lump of hardware or whatever, treat assembly language programming as you would a crossword- very rarely useful to someone else when you've done it... It's also fun to see just how outrageously fast an instruction every 5nS really is... When I were a lad, etc etc. Steve. Back to schematics. Bah. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue Apr 25 23:52:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07702 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07698 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:53 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL0080WE4486@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12kDGG-000AsD-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:52:52 +0100 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:53:47 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390613EB.45A7E5D0@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004252054.WAA09678@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I forgot to mention that the assembler syntax differs between gas(p) and SDT, and porting macros from one to the other is not always trivial... Steve. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 00:03:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA07777 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:03:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA07773 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:03:19 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL007MFELI1N@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:03:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.111) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:54:55 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:55:15 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: C Compiler and stuff X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000425145318.00c14350@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This university kit - what where (I know why) and how? Anybody know of an NT hosted C compiler / Assembler / Linker? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 00:18:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA07924 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:18:25 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA07920 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:18:24 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id AAA10080; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:18:23 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:18:23 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004252218.AAA10080@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM In-Reply-To: <3906136E.4A3ABE3A@steves-house.org.uk> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:51:42 +0100, Steve Wiseman wrote: > In the real world(tm) of multi-person projects, deadlines and > customer-driven lunacy, yes. In an evening of hacky spodding, bringing > up a new lump of hardware or whatever, treat assembly language > programming as you would a crossword- very rarely useful to someone > else when you've done it... In the real world(tm) of Linux kernel hacking one really avoids writing assembly unless absolutely necessary. And even then the gcc can be tricked into writing the wanted assembly. Assembly just has the tendency of being a WORN[1] language. > It's also fun to see just how outrageously fast an instruction every > 5nS really is... When I were a lad, etc etc. I agree, hand coded assembly can be very fast. Say JDB, how fast is the FFT code currently, or didn't you got time to work on it? Erik [1] Write Once, Read Never -- Real Programmers consider "what you see is what you get" to be just as bad a concept in Text Editors as it is in women. No, the Real Programmer wants a "you asked for it, you got it" text editor -- complicated, cryptic, powerful, unforgiving, dangerous. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 00:28:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA07958 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:28:54 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA07954 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:28:53 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id AAA10135; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:28:49 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:28:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004252228.AAA10135@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: kn6td@clubnet.net Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: C Compiler and stuff In-Reply-To: <4.2.0.58.20000425145318.00c14350@mail.clubnet.net> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:55:15 -0700, Derek Lassen wrote: > Anybody know of an NT hosted C compiler / Assembler / Linker? Get yourself Cygwin32 from http://sourceware.cygnus.com/cygwin/ or http://www.xraylith.wisc.edu/~khan/software/gnu-win32/ . Get the necessary parts to generate a cross compiler (links are on the LART pages) and use Cygwin32 to build the i386-nt --> arm-linux cross compiler. Adam Wiggins told me it's possible, but he didn't tell me how hard it is. Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 00:51:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA08062 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:51:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA08058 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:51:10 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL009F0GT9EI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:51:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12kEAe-000Axl-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:51:08 +0100 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:52:04 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: C Compiler and stuff To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <39062194.FA87C42B@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000425145318.00c14350@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Derek Lassen wrote: > > This university kit - what where (I know why) and how? > > Anybody know of an NT hosted C compiler / Assembler / Linker? Cygwin's my favourite - gets you a bashbox + gcc. Couldn't survive without it... http://sourceware.cygnus.com/cygwin/ Steve. Aargh. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 01:11:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08322 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:11:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08318 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:11:42 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL009LTHRHIY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:11:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12kEUW-000Azo-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:11:40 +0100 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:12:36 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39062664.4C2B9DC1@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004252218.AAA10080@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > In the real world(tm) of Linux kernel hacking one really avoids writing > assembly unless absolutely necessary. And even then the gcc can be tricked > into writing the wanted assembly. Assembly just has the tendency of being > a WORN[1] language. > [1] Write Once, Read Never I dunno- sometimes, it's write once, read hundreds of times until someone points out the bleeding obvious *8-) And no, the Linux kernel is a place I wouldn't infect with lumps of ArmAsm. The x86 boys might return the favour... Steve. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 01:13:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08343 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:13:05 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08339 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:13:04 +0200 Received: from reflect.newenterprises.com (newenterprises.com [207.155.90.15]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00A5RHTQP0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:13:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gduncan@localhost) by reflect.newenterprises.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id e3PMMTn00982 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:22:29 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:22:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Glen Duncan Subject: Palm gets new body part, ARM To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Palm Computing announced today that the ARM will replace the Dragonball in future Palm devices. Here's the article: http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-202-1752075.html There goes my idea for a Palm compatible LART handheld! I swear they can hear my thoughts. I certainly hope this won't cause shortages for those of us who are trying to build these things. -Glen -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 01:30:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08491 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:30:13 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08487 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:30:12 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00A6RIMBXO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:30:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id SAA19026; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:27:16 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:27:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: Assembly for StrongARM - ada status (not good) In-reply-to: <3905F2CB.10F72A46@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <200004252327.SAA19026@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mike wrote... > Of course, I'm still exploring Ada95 > which seems to be another embedded optimized language. The most recent (Oct99) release of gnat is written for gcc 2.8.1. As near as I can tell there is no ELF support for ARM in that version of gcc so it will not integrate well with the current gcc 2.95 tool chain and all the ELF libraries. Someday when a gnat based on a newer gcc is released I would have a go at ARM porting it, but until then its probably best to wait. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 01:56:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA08568 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:56:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08564 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:56:09 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00AJKJTJZ1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:56:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20] ident=root) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12kFBU-0005n5-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:56:04 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12kFBT-00044S-00; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:56:03 -0600 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:56:02 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Re: C Compiler and stuff In-reply-to: <39062194.FA87C42B@steves-house.org.uk> X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: Derek Lassen Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Derek Lassen wrote: > > > > This university kit - what where (I know why) and how? > > http://www.arm.com/DevSupp/UniProg/download.html For Academic Use Only. --chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 02:27:12 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA08649 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:27:12 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA08641 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:27:08 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00BHCL96UB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:27:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA31672; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:23:50 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA21614; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:25:43 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:25:42 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: RE: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: Randy Glenn Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I did a search on freshmeat the other for CAE applications and I came across an application called yaEDA which looks pretty well done (can't try it out yet though). Here is the url: http://u2pi.dk/ David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, Randy Glenn wrote: > What about gEDA? Open-source electronic design tools. > http://www.geda.seul.org/ > > They've got schematic capture, PCB design, Verilog, SPICE, etc. - all free! > Plus, links to other free Electronics software. > > -Randy Glenn > PICxpert@techie.com - http://i.am/PICxpert > > "Is this a wretched demi-bee, > half asleep upon my knee, > Some freak, from a menagerie? > NO! It's Eric, the half a bee!" - Monty Python > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl [mailto:owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl]On > Behalf Of J.D. Bakker > Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 11:04 PM > To: Michael Vanecek > Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl > Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] > > > At 03:19 +0200 25-04-2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > >That settles that - back-burner that idea for later. sa-2 huh? I wonder > >how far Intel will take the StrongArm. Please, still post a wishlist on > >the net for those of us who would like to help... > > Will do once I find the time. > > >BTW - are you guys keeping development "in house" or can others get > >involved? > > I would really really REALLY like others to get involved, but for that we > need a common data format (like C is for software) and possibly free tools > (think GNU, gcc). > > JDB. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > > http://im.yahoo.com > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 03:17:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA08831 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:17:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA08827 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:17:49 +0200 Received: from setter.infosquare.com (setter.infosquare.com [206.80.28.62]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00D2NNLN8L@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:17:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from sales01.info2 (contractor1 [206.80.28.23]) by setter.infosquare.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA17315 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:58:04 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:03:38 -0700 From: Dave Parisie Subject: openshare content management software To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: dave.parisie@infosquare.com Message-id: <013601bfaf1c$4d6e90e0$171c50ce@info2> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Dear Internet User, Very Nice Site! I am with a company called infosquare.com and would like to invite you to take a look at our product. It is a content management system that allows non-technical end users to create, share, and publish information to their organizations intranet or extranet. This in theory frees the web master from converting large amounts of word and exel documents to html and allows him to attend to higher- level duties. Thanks, David Parisie Infosquare.com (408)615-6773 Dave.parisie@infosquare.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 04:27:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA08967 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:27:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA08963 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:27:54 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTL00DH6QUG8L@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:27:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA04572; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:09:44 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:17:38 -0400 From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] To: David Poisson Cc: "J.D. Bakker" , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390651C2.B2EDA8AE@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk We use Pcb in-house for working on the boards for our meters. (also on freshmeat) As yet, we don't have anything approximating a complaint about it. Barry David Poisson wrote: > I did a search on freshmeat the other for CAE applications and I came > across an application called yaEDA which looks pretty well done (can't > try it out yet though). -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 06:51:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA09223 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 06:51:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA09219 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 06:51:45 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTL00FMXXI7DO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 06:51:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.38] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.03) id A5334EAF022A; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:48:51 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:55:44 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: openshare content management software Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390676D0.C9DD1689@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <013601bfaf1c$4d6e90e0$171c50ce@info2> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Is it me, or does this form-email (can't even take the time to put in a proper name - Dear Internet User - shuh) smack of, uhm, SPAM? Mike Dave Parisie wrote: > > Dear Internet User, > > Very Nice Site! > I am with a company called infosquare.com and would like to invite you to > take a look at our product. It is a content management system that allows > non-technical end users to create, share, and publish information to their > organizations intranet or extranet. This in theory frees the web master > from converting large amounts of word and exel documents to html and allows > him to attend to higher- level duties. > > Thanks, > > David Parisie > Infosquare.com > (408)615-6773 > Dave.parisie@infosquare.com > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 07:50:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA09361 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:50:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA09357 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:50:20 +0200 From: marcus.giles@deltagold.com.au Received: from phoenix.deltagold.com.au ([203.47.0.66]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00GLW07Q8W@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:50:19 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au (localmail.kbgm.deltagold.com.au [203.38.127.2]) by phoenix.deltagold.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA01666 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:09:28 +0800 Received: by kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.4 (830.2 3-23-1999)) id 482568CD.001FA8F3 ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:45:48 +0800 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:45:45 +0800 Subject: Re: openshare content management software To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <482568CD.001FA80F.00@kbgkal02.kbgm.deltagold.com.au> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: DELTAGOLD Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Who's up for a game of "sue the spammer" ?? Or maybe I'll just mail bomb em? :-) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 07:55:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA09379 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:55:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA09375 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:55:48 +0200 Received: from reflect.newenterprises.com (newenterprises.com [207.155.90.15]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00G7D0GYUR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:55:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gduncan@localhost) by reflect.newenterprises.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id e3Q5CkC02178; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:12:46 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:12:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Glen Duncan Subject: Re: openshare content management software In-reply-to: <390676D0.C9DD1689@mjv.com> To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I just pray the address doesn't end up on one of those '30 million email addresses for $39.35" spam disks. On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Is it me, or does this form-email (can't even take the time to put in a > proper name - Dear Internet User - shuh) smack of, uhm, SPAM? > > Mike > > Dave Parisie wrote: > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 10:27:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA09744 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:27:13 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA09740 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:27:13 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA12511; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:27:12 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:27:12 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004260827.KAA12511@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: openshare content management software In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:12:46 -0700 (PDT), Glen Duncan wrote: > I just pray the address doesn't end up on one of those '30 million email > addresses for $39.35" spam disks. I just complained at abuse@infosquare.com. Erik -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in alt.sysadmin.recovery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 12:43:05 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10183 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:43:05 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10178; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:42:38 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:31:06 +0200 To: David Poisson From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: RE: Lart Developers Wishes? [was Re: BGA] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 02:25 +0200 26-04-2000, David Poisson wrote: >I did a search on freshmeat the other for CAE applications and I came >across an application called yaEDA which looks pretty well done (can't >try it out yet though). > >Here is the url: http://u2pi.dk/ At first glance it looks like a lot of plans, more flashy graphics and even more vapourware. Not that I think they won't get anywhere -- they're just not anywhere near yet. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 14:06:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10502 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:06:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10498 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:06:49 +0200 Received: from server.isodaq.sys (dialup7.ednet.co.uk [212.20.228.70]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00HMEHNBBF@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:06:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (tc@localhost) by server.isodaq.sys (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA10439 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:02:24 +0100 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:02:24 +0100 (BST) From: Tim Campbell Subject: Blob and writing to on-board flash X-Sender: tc@server.isodaq.sys To: lart mailing list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: server.isodaq.sys: tc owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk First of all, congratulations to the team on a great idea, system design and social conscience! We design and supply telemetry outstations for rainfall, water level, and sewage flow (nice!). We have used Linux for telemetry master stations for a few years, and the thought of using it in certain remote sites has great appeal. A few questions: With the LART, we would need to be able to update the on-board flash via modem. The 1.0.6 version of BLOB can't write to the onboard flash. Will this always be the case? Can other application write to the onboard flash for non-volatile storage? Most of our systems are battery powered, and do very little for most of the time except (for example) monitoring a serial port and briefly powering a few sensors every 15m. What, approximately, is the quiescent power consumption of a rev 3 LART board? Will the clock-scaling project reduce this by much, or is the DRAM refresh drain the main issue? Finally, and not wishing to be a pain, is the rev 4 LART PCB nearly done? Regards Tim Campbell Informetric Ltd (Isodaq Division) Unit 115 Stirling Enterprise Park Stirling FK7 7RP Scotland tel +44 1786 449 577 fax +44 1786 449 588 http://www.isodaq.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 14:50:25 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10611 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:50:25 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10607 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:50:24 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id OAA14679; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:50:22 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:50:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004261250.OAA14679@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: tc@isodaq.co.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Blob and writing to on-board flash In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:02:24 +0100 (BST), Tim Campbell wrote: > A few questions: > > With the LART, we would need to be able to update the on-board > flash via modem. The 1.0.6 version of BLOB can't write > to the onboard flash. Will this always be the case? > Can other application write to the onboard flash for > non-volatile storage? The current problem with blob is that it should be relocated to RAM before it writes to the on board flash. There are two ways to solve it: - modify blob - modify the linux flash driver so it will work with the LART flash chips I'm currently hacking on the Linux source, so I think I'll go for that last one. > Most of our systems are battery powered, and do very little > for most of the time except (for example) monitoring a serial port > and briefly powering a few sensors every 15m. What, approximately, > is the quiescent power consumption of a rev 3 LART board? Will > the clock-scaling project reduce this by much, or is the DRAM > refresh drain the main issue? IIRC, it can at least double the battery life. In combination with CPU core voltage scaling the savings can be even more. Maybe Johan can elaborate on it. (Johan?) > Finally, and not wishing to be a pain, > is the rev 4 LART PCB nearly done? JDB told me it's done, but... he is on holiday and will return next week. Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 17:05:21 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA11125 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:05:21 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA11121 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:05:19 +0200 Received: from burns.conectiva (brutus.conectiva.com.br [200.250.58.146]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTM007HPPWJII@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:05:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 2792 invoked from network); Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:04:56 +0000 Received: from cartman.conectiva (HELO conectiva.com.br) (10.0.2.27) by burns.conectiva with SMTP; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:04:56 +0000 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:04:08 -0300 From: "Adilson G. Oliveira" Subject: LART boards ready to sell? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <39070568.165F06E8@conectiva.com.br> Organization: Conectiva MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [pt_BR] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-14cl i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi! Has someone made all the LART boards and want to sell? I need PCBs and components. []s Adilson. -- It may be that your whole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 17:33:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA11213 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:33:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA11209 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:33:08 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00917R75SL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:33:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20]) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12kToD-0006CT-00; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:33:01 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12kToC-00029H-00; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:33:00 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:33:00 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Memory Map? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I suppose this is probably relatively easily determined by rooting through the BLOB source, but I want to make sure I get it right: what does the memory map on the LART look like (currently)? Is it just strictly linear with flash starting at 0x0 and RAM following 4MB later? Thanks. --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 17:41:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA11270 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:41:36 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA11266 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:41:16 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id RAA16059; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:41:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:41:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004261541.RAA16059@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: cmcurtis@xmission.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Memory Map? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:33:00 -0600 (MDT), Chris Curtis wrote: > I suppose this is probably relatively easily determined by rooting through > the BLOB source, but I want to make sure I get it right: what does the > memory map on the LART look like (currently)? Is it just strictly linear > with flash starting at 0x0 and RAM following 4MB later? The Flash is from 0 to 4 MB. The main memory is a bit funny because we don't use line A23 on the DRAM: - 8MB at 0xc0000000 - 8MB at 0xc1000000 - 8MB at 0xc8000000 - 8MB at 0xc9000000 Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 18:06:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11360 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:06:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11356 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:06:38 +0200 Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM009POSR0S5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:06:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from xmission.xmission.com ([198.60.22.20] ident=root) by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #3) id 12kUKi-00050f-00; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:06:36 -0600 Received: from cmcurtis (helo=localhost) by xmission.xmission.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12kUKh-0003cq-00; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:06:35 -0600 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:06:35 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Curtis Subject: Re: Memory Map? In-reply-to: <200004261541.RAA16059@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: cmcurtis@xmission.xmission.com To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > The Flash is from 0 to 4 MB. The main memory is a bit funny because we > don't use line A23 on the DRAM: > > - 8MB at 0xc0000000 > - 8MB at 0xc1000000 > - 8MB at 0xc8000000 > - 8MB at 0xc9000000 > Okay, thanks! Now how about the KSB/ETH/whatever expansion space? Is there a standard map and/or way of dealing with those? --Chris -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 18:23:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11402 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:23:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11398 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:23:52 +0200 Received: from htmhell.com (mail2.halfpricehosting.com [12.30.178.247]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00BP9TJK7F@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:23:51 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:23:25 -0400 From: Jon Steiner Subject: Re: LART boards ready to sell? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: jon@htmhell.com Message-id: <200004261223.AA74383524@htmhell.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm in the market for one of these too. --Jon -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 18:44:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA11477 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:44:42 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA11473 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:44:42 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id SAA16516; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:44:36 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:44:36 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004261644.SAA16516@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: chris@satel.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Memory Map? In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.0 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:06:35 -0600 (MDT), Chris Curtis wrote: > Okay, thanks! Now how about the KSB/ETH/whatever expansion space? Is > there a standard map and/or way of dealing with those? Parts of the KSB will be used with the various serial ports (UCB1200, DAC, USB, IrDA), other parts will be mapped in PCMCIA space 0 (IIRC, JDB?). The standard way is described in the SA1100 manual. Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 19:12:09 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11564 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:12:09 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11560 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:12:08 +0200 Received: from dotplanet.com ([209.144.132.195]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTM00CKSVS7T7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:12:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LsustanoD2.SMSCORP.NET [209.211.240.254] by dotplanet.com (SMTPD32-6.00) id A2E85FA00B8; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:10:00 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:10:17 -0700 From: Leo Johan Susanto Subject: Re: LART boards ready to sell? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <017801bfafa2$4bf874c0$6a0918ac@SMSCORP.NET> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <200004261223.AA74383524@htmhell.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk how about the assembled LART, KSB+ETH ? when they are going to be released? After monitoring these emails I got the feeling that I WILL create a zero ohm resistor ( I am not a EE but CS) . leo ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Steiner To: Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 9:23 AM Subject: Re: LART boards ready to sell? > I'm in the market for one of these too. > > --Jon > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 19:53:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11652 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:53:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11648 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:53:45 +0200 Received: from smtp.pandora.be (hercules.telenet-ops.be [195.130.132.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTM00EF1XPKWU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:53:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 1316 invoked from network); Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:51:43 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pandora.be) ([213.224.21.58]) (envelope-sender ) by hercules.telenet-ops.be (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:51:43 +0000 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:48:01 +0200 From: PELGRIMS P Subject: Lart PCB's To: lart Reply-to: patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be Message-id: <39072BD1.73AFE032@pandora.be> Organization: A MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm in the market for 2 of these Lart PCB's too. Patrick Pelgrims -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 20:28:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA11795 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:28:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA11791 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:28:37 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f142.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.142]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTM00G9AZBNU3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:28:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 18961 invoked by uid 0); Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:28:25 +0000 Received: from 161.69.248.229 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:28:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:28:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Erik Chow Subject: Need advise for assembling LART To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000426182825.18960.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [161.69.248.229] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have been reading the mails regarding how to assemble LART. I just got my sample ICs from Maxim, and some of the ICs are very small, especially the MAX811. Can anyone give me pointers/help/advise/know-how to tackle this? Thanks. Erik ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 20:56:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA11962 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:56:26 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA11958 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:56:25 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTN00GKQ0M0YU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:56:25 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail4.magma.ca (mail4.magma.ca [206.191.0.222]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA17562 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:48:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail4.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA04341 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:48:54 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:51:03 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: StrongArm & Compaq To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <39073A97.E8B70BF1@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I just tripped across the iPaq H3650 Pocket PC (http://www.compaq.com/products/handhelds/pocketpc/) This thing has some very interesting specs (as described on their website): - 206 MHz StrongArm - 32 MB SDRAM - 16 MB ROM (Flash) - 1 x Serial port - 1 x USB port - 1 x IR port - 1 x Stereo I/O port - Lithium Polymer battery with upto 12 hrs life - 240 x 320 reflective, touch sensitive TFT LCD with 4K colors - Audio record with MP3 compatible playback Expansion Capabilities: - CF or PC card (mutually exclusive) Expansion Peripherals: - 32 & 64 MB memory modules (CF) - 56K v.90 modem (CF) In contacting the Compaq product center they're saying it will be available in June and as yet have no suggested retail price. Also I gather it runs WinCE 3.0 (with Microsoft's Pocket PC extensions) straight out of the box but wow this things is just screaming for a Linux port and maybe even some LART peripherals !!! Does anyone know anything more about this product ?? -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 22:12:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA12123 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:12:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA12119 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:12:00 +0200 Received: from mx1.magmacom.com (mx1.magmacom.com [206.191.0.217]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTN00JN143ZGZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:11:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mail4.magma.ca (mail4.magma.ca [206.191.0.222]) by mx1.magmacom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA25119; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:04:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from envmtl.com ([206.191.19.2]) by mail4.magma.ca (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA20840; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:04:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:06:34 -0400 From: T Sullivan Subject: Re: StrongArm & Compaq To: Mike Ingle , Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: <39074C4A.CA49AB07@envmtl.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en,ja References: <4.2.0.58.20000426122046.00bb9830@email.ancore.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Mike Ingle wrote: > I wonder how close it is to the ITSY, Compaqs strongarm linux based pda? I understood ITSY was a carry over from when Compaq bought DEC and that it was strictly a DEC research project ( i.e. never intended to be a commercial product) that they also tried making available to the academic community via a limited distribution. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't ITSY have accelerometers in it so that as you leaned it forward, backward & sideways it acted like a mouse control on the screen (interesting idea but IMHO a little edgy for a machine intended for the retail market) and certainly no sign of any of that in the iPAQ. In addition, wasn't ITSY also wafer thin - i.e. no expansion capability or audio (any ITSY gurus who can set the story straight ?) Otherwise I was under the impression that this iPAQ thingy was a completely new design... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 22:36:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA12197 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:36:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA12193 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:36:07 +0200 Received: from crisp.com (crisp.com [192.41.58.20]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTN00LF658583@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:36:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from crisp.com (159.encentris.com [204.0.61.159]) by crisp.com (8.8.5) id OAA07054; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:33:28 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:02:52 -0500 From: Kent Perrier Subject: Re: StrongArm & Compaq To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Reply-to: kent.perrier@oneco.net Message-id: <39074B6C.B6327474@crisp.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <39073A97.E8B70BF1@envmtl.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk T Sullivan wrote: > > I just tripped across the iPaq H3650 Pocket PC > (http://www.compaq.com/products/handhelds/pocketpc/) > > This thing has some very interesting specs (as described on their > website): > > - 206 MHz StrongArm > - 32 MB SDRAM > - 16 MB ROM (Flash) > - 1 x Serial port > - 1 x USB port > - 1 x IR port > - 1 x Stereo I/O port > - Lithium Polymer battery with upto 12 hrs life > - 240 x 320 reflective, touch sensitive TFT LCD with 4K colors > - Audio record with MP3 compatible playback > > Expansion Capabilities: > - CF or PC card (mutually exclusive) > > Expansion Peripherals: > - 32 & 64 MB memory modules (CF) > - 56K v.90 modem (CF) > > In contacting the Compaq product center they're saying it will be > available in June and as yet have no suggested retail price. Also I > gather it runs WinCE 3.0 (with Microsoft's Pocket PC extensions) > straight out of the box but wow this things is just screaming for a > Linux port and maybe even some LART peripherals !!! > > Does anyone know anything more about this product ?? According the rules for giveaway: 5. PRIZE AVAILABLE: One (1) Compaq iPAQ 3650 Pocket PC will be awarded. The Approximate Retail Value (AVR) of each iPAQ 3650 Pocket PC is $499.00. So I guess it will sell for ~$500 Kent -- "A simple man believes anything, but a prudent man gives thought to his steps." (Proverbs 14:15) -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed Apr 26 23:55:41 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA12427 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:55:41 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA12423 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:55:40 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id XAA18077; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:55:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004262155.XAA18077@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: t.sullivan@envmtl.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: StrongArm & Compaq In-Reply-To: <39073A97.E8B70BF1@envmtl.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Wed Apr 26 23:55:26 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:51:03 -0400, T Sullivan wrote: [snip] > In contacting the Compaq product center they're saying it will be > available in June and as yet have no suggested retail price. Also I > gather it runs WinCE 3.0 (with Microsoft's Pocket PC extensions) > straight out of the box but wow this things is just screaming for a > Linux port and maybe even some LART peripherals !!! > > Does anyone know anything more about this product ?? I don't know much, but be assured: there are enough Linux people within Compaq/DEC that will port Linux to it. Erik -- "I'm just this guy you know?" -- Zaphod Beeblebrox in "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" by Douglas Adams -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 27 00:12:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12538 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:12:30 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12534 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:12:29 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id AAA18148; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:12:20 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004262212.AAA18148@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: t.sullivan@envmtl.com Cc: mikei@ancore.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: StrongArm & Compaq In-Reply-To: <39074C4A.CA49AB07@envmtl.com> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Thu Apr 27 00:12:11 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:06:34 -0400, T Sullivan wrote: > Mike Ingle wrote: > >> I wonder how close it is to the ITSY, Compaqs strongarm linux based pda? > > I understood ITSY was a carry over from when Compaq bought DEC and that it > was strictly a DEC research project ( i.e. never intended to be a commercial > product) that they also tried making available to the academic community via > a limited distribution. Jup, the Itsy was a research project in which DEC investigated mobile computing. I think the iPAQ is the result of the result. > Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't ITSY have accelerometers in it so > that as you leaned it forward, backward & sideways it acted like a mouse > control on the screen (interesting idea but IMHO a little edgy for a machine > intended for the retail market) and certainly no sign of any of that in the > iPAQ. In addition, wasn't ITSY also wafer thin - i.e. no expansion capability > or audio (any ITSY gurus who can set the story straight ?) Otherwise I was > under the impression that this iPAQ thingy was a completely new design... Yes, the later Itsy variants had the "rock&scroll" interface. Interesting idea indeed, but I wonder how useful it is when playing Doom ;-). I don't know how much your "wafer thin" is, but from pictures I get the impression that it is about 1cm thick (Johan?). As far as I can see the iPAQ is a SA1100/SA1110 design that puts all chips on a single PCB. Erik -- Computers run on faith, not electrons. -- T.N. Thompson -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 27 02:43:33 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA13289 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:43:33 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA13285 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:43:32 +0200 Received: from localhost.localdomain (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTN0053NGOIF7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:43:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (IDENT:hbelange@webster [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA10259 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:45:34 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:45:33 -0400 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: SA-1110/SA-1111 DEV KIT To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3906E4ED.F0AA00D2@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi All, I've been following the LART development with interest over the last couple of months and I must admit that I'm impressed with the work being done, BRAVO to the LART team... These guys have peaked my interest so much that I've been doing a lot of research in the embedded Linux world....WOW the possibilities are endless...! During my reading I came across the Intel site and read the features of the SA-1110/SA-1111 the list is impressive .! So is there plans to design LART around this chip set instead of the SA-1100 ? if not is there a group of people out there interested in joining force and doing so ? I'm not a Systems Engineer, cause I'd be all over this one...! but I'm a network engineer so I can offer some insight on what are some of the potential markets that we could target ... I also have some valuable contacts in the PCB manufacturer area.... Drop me a direct e-mail if you are interested in discussing this proposition further... Hugues Belanger -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 27 03:23:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA13437 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:23:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA13433 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:23:37 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTN00617IJC3J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:23:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.79] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.03) id A6157190274; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:21:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:28:44 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: SA-1110/SA-1111 DEV KIT To: Hugues Belanger Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390797CC.69982463@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <3906E4ED.F0AA00D2@cgocable.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Heh heh - this was actually a hot topic of recent discussion. However, a general consensus and the desires of the core team was - in short - one thing at a time. Currently, all the work is centered around the sa-1100. To start work on the sa-1110 would mean to create an entirely different layout, overcome the BGA package limitations (not exactly a hobbyist friendly package), a new BOM, more design and debugging, etc... something that will surely happen, but not right away. I figure by the time the core team has hashed out the sa-1100 for all it can do, we'll be looking at even the next generation of sa chips so we could leap-frog over the sa-1110 into the Next Generation Lart... Remember - the core team is doing what most companies shell out countless thousands of dollars to do - in their spare time. This is much like how Linux and accompanying applications are developed. In the end, we'll all have a better product (no hidden cut corners), and a lot of geek fun... Mike Hugues Belanger wrote: > > Hi All, > > I've been following the LART development with interest over the last > couple of months and I must admit that I'm impressed with the work being > done, BRAVO to the LART team... > > These guys have peaked my interest so much that I've been doing a lot of > research in the embedded Linux world....WOW the possibilities are > endless...! > During my reading I came across the Intel site and read the features of > the SA-1110/SA-1111 the list is impressive .! So is there plans to > design LART around this chip set instead of the SA-1100 ? if not is > there a group of people out there interested in joining force and doing > so ? > > I'm not a Systems Engineer, cause I'd be all over this one...! but I'm a > network engineer so I can offer some insight on what are some of the > potential markets that we could target ... I also have some valuable > contacts in the PCB manufacturer area.... > > Drop me a direct e-mail if you are interested in discussing this > proposition further... > > Hugues Belanger > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 27 03:37:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA13500 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:37:08 +0200 Received: from [145.94.108.138] (etbakkerj.its-m.tudelft.nl [145.94.108.138]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA13494; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:37:05 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200004261250.OAA14679@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:55:47 +0200 To: Erik Mouw From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: Blob and writing to on-board flash Cc: tc@isodaq.co.uk, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >> Finally, and not wishing to be a pain, >> is the rev 4 LART PCB nearly done? > >JDB told me it's done, but... he is on holiday and will return next week. It is. I expect to have protos in the week of May 8. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu Apr 27 11:04:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA14447 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:04:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA14443 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:04:58 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTO00KP83W9L5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:04:57 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.118) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 27 Apr 2000 01:56:52 -0700 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 01:56:45 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: Modem... In-reply-to: <002501bfae6b$410d7d40$0f52fea9@rentbert> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: Raphael Gray Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000427015242.00ba5ea0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk The LART has the analog stuff for a modem. Its the UCB1200. This part will also control a touch screen. (s) Derek At 05:03 AM 4/25/00 +0100, you wrote: >Has any one found a good(cheap in small quantities) modem chip/board for the >lart, because i would really like to have an on board one >because it would be easier(IMO) than puting PCMCIA capabilities and would >use less power(?) so i think this is the best way of getting a modem onto >the lart/KSB board. > >also the bus on the lart is 100Mb/s right? >so is there away to get it to go faster or would u need to change the chip? >i sayn this because >i plan to use it quite intensivly for graphics /=) and would like to get the >most out of the graphics adapter and leave >plenty of space on the bus for other things.... > >btw i dont know if you can get them, i have not found one anyway...but i >would like to have an onboard GPS reciever, preferably a chip/board add-on >but i dont mind if i have to buy a whole handset and take it apart...my lart >has to have GPS=) > >-Raphael -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 09:26:03 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18200 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:26:03 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18196 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:26:02 +0200 Received: from lund.commentor.se (lund.commentor.se [194.71.160.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTP009BHTZC3Z@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:26:01 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from gbg.commentor.se (gbg.commentor.se [194.71.186.133]) by lund.commentor.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA25758 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:24:53 +0200 Received: from D307.commentor.se (d307.commentor.se [194.71.186.157]) by gbg.commentor.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA26115 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:27:44 +0200 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:24:53 +0200 From: Fredrik Rothamel Subject: LART availability? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Fredrik Rothamel Message-id: <001601bfb0e2$d8b066c0$9dba47c2@commentor.se> Organization: Commentor System AB MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl id JAA18197 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello, could someone post a status report on the progress in making assembled LARTs available? Is there an European initiative? (assembled LART = complete LART + KSB + ETH, preferably with programmed ROM) /Fredrik -- Slowly and surely the unix crept up on the Nintendo user ... -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 09:51:28 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18293 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:51:28 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18289 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:51:27 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTP00AIOV5QNI@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:51:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.135) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:43:26 -0700 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:43:18 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: LART availability? In-reply-to: <001601bfb0e2$d8b066c0$9dba47c2@commentor.se> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000428004053.00a1a660@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk So, you want an aLART Alert? :> Sorry. I tried to resist. Really I did. Well, for a few minutes... :> (s) Derek At 09:24 AM 4/28/00 +0200, you wrote: >Hello, > >could someone post a status report on the progress in making assembled >LARTs available? >Is there an European initiative? > >(assembled LART = complete LART + KSB + ETH, preferably with programmed ROM) > >/Fredrik >-- >Slowly and surely the unix crept up on the Nintendo user ... > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 12:40:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA18650 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:40:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA18646 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:40:22 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ00MAI2YPJ0@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:40:03 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA09658 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:31:22 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA01490 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:22:52 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:23:43 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: max clock rate for SA1100 To: lart Message-id: <390966AF.E4F5AB83@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I understand that SA1100 can clock at 220MHz and blob set it to the rate as default. But when Linux booted, its BogoMips reports around 206/7 MHz. Is the kernel reseting the clock or BogoMips is not the same as clock rate? I canot found where is the related code in kernel. -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:21:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18734 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:21:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18730 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:21:53 +0200 Received: from nottingham.ac.uk (pat.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk [128.243.40.194]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ002024W9QY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:21:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from granby.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk ([128.243.40.43] helo=unix.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk) by nottingham.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #2) id 12l8id-0001oD-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:13:59 +0100 Received: from psystrj by unix.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.11 #2) id 12l8iG-0000Sg-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:13:36 +0100 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:13:36 +0100 From: Toby Jaffey Subject: Re: LART availability? In-reply-to: <001601bfb0e2$d8b066c0$9dba47c2@commentor.se>; from Fredrik Rothamel on Fri, Apr 28, 2000 at 09:24:53AM +0200 To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Toby Jaffey Mail-followup-to: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000428121335.A1174@granby.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1us Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <001601bfb0e2$d8b066c0$9dba47c2@commentor.se> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, Apr 28, 2000 at 09:24:53AM +0200, Fredrik Rothamel wrote: > could someone post a status report on the progress in making assembled LARTs > available? Is there an European initiative? > > (assembled LART = complete LART + KSB + ETH, preferably with programmed ROM) Does anyone have a rough estimate of what it would cost for all of the parts to the main board? Would anyone be willing to build me one or sell one to me? -- (o_ | Toby Jaffey : www.nott.ac.uk/~psystrj/ //\ | Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time! V_/_ | -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:23:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18750 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:23:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18746 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:23:57 +0200 Received: from server.isodaq.sys (dialup83.ednet.co.uk [212.20.227.146]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ002444ZDQY@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:23:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (tc@localhost) by server.isodaq.sys (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA09586; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:20:10 +0100 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:20:10 +0100 (BST) From: Tim Campbell Subject: Re: Blob and writing to on-board flash In-reply-to: <200004261250.OAA14679@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: tc@server.isodaq.sys To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: server.isodaq.sys: tc owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 26 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > Most of our systems are battery powered, and do very little > > for most of the time except (for example) monitoring a serial port > > and briefly powering a few sensors every 15m. What, approximately, > > is the quiescent power consumption of a rev 3 LART board? Will > > the clock-scaling project reduce this by much, or is the DRAM > > refresh drain the main issue? > > IIRC, it can at least double the battery life. In combination with CPU > core voltage scaling the savings can be even more. Maybe Johan can > elaborate on it. (Johan?) Thanks for your quick repy - but what is IIRC? Tim Campbell Informetric Ltd (Isodaq Division) Unit 115 Stirling Enterprise Park Stirling FK7 7RP Scotland tel +44 1786 449 577 fax +44 1786 449 588 http://www.isodaq.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:34:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18789 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:34:49 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18785 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:34:48 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA11222; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:34:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004281134.NAA11222@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: tc@isodaq.co.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Blob and writing to on-board flash In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Fri Apr 28 13:34:44 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:20:10 +0100 (BST), Tim Campbell wrote: > Thanks for your quick repy - but what is IIRC? If I Remember Correctly Erik -- There was a point to this story, but it has temporarily escaped the croniclers mind. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:42:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18818 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:42:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18814 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:41:59 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ003Q55TF5Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:41:39 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.128) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Fri, 28 Apr 2000 04:33:40 -0700 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 04:33:31 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: Blob and writing to on-board flash In-reply-to: X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000428043214.00b9edd0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed References: <200004261250.OAA14679@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk IIRC = if I recall correctly. At 12:20 PM 4/28/00 +0100, you wrote: >On Wed, 26 Apr 2000, Erik Mouw wrote: > > > > Most of our systems are battery powered, and do very little > > > for most of the time except (for example) monitoring a serial port > > > and briefly powering a few sensors every 15m. What, approximately, > > > is the quiescent power consumption of a rev 3 LART board? Will > > > the clock-scaling project reduce this by much, or is the DRAM > > > refresh drain the main issue? > > > > IIRC, it can at least double the battery life. In combination with CPU > > core voltage scaling the savings can be even more. Maybe Johan can > > elaborate on it. (Johan?) > >Thanks for your quick repy - but what is IIRC? > > >Tim Campbell > >Informetric Ltd (Isodaq Division) >Unit 115 Stirling Enterprise Park >Stirling FK7 7RP >Scotland > >tel +44 1786 449 577 >fax +44 1786 449 588 >http://www.isodaq.co.uk > > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:43:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18835 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:43:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18831 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:43:47 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ003765VQVZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:43:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA11865 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:49:08 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA05538 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:40:40 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:41:30 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 To: lart Message-id: <390978EA.2E1F657D@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <390966AF.E4F5AB83@krdl.org.sg> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I found out why the clock rate is one rating behind the spec. It is because the spec is wrong, the clock rate of 221.2 MHz uses CCF<4:0> value of 01100, that is 0xC. (that value is stated "not supported" in the manual). Change the line in blob to assign 0xC to PPCR fix that, BogoMIPS returns 221.18. Anyway I try to change the value to 0xD (overclock StrongARM :), the kernel boots but failed at loading ramdisk. It is not for overclocking! Have fun! -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 13:57:14 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18880 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:57:14 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18876 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:57:13 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id NAA11364; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:57:08 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004281157.NAA11364@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-Reply-To: <390966AF.E4F5AB83@krdl.org.sg> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Fri Apr 28 13:57:07 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:23:43 +0800, zhu qun ying wrote: > I understand that SA1100 can clock at 220MHz and blob set it to the rate as > default. But when Linux booted, its BogoMips reports around 206/7 MHz. Is the > kernel reseting the clock or BogoMips is not the same as clock rate? I canot > found where is the related code in kernel. BogoMips == Bogus MIPS. They don't mean anything. Really. The BogoMips value is NOT the same as the clock speed! Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 14:07:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA18911 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:07:51 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA18907 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:07:50 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id OAA11436; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:07:46 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004281207.OAA11436@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-Reply-To: <390978EA.2E1F657D@krdl.org.sg> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Fri Apr 28 14:07:45 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:41:30 +0800, zhu qun ying wrote: > I found out why the clock rate is one rating behind the spec. It is because > the spec is wrong, the clock rate of 221.2 MHz uses CCF<4:0> value of 01100, > that is 0xC. (that value is stated "not supported" in the manual). Change the > line in blob to assign 0xC to PPCR fix that, BogoMIPS returns 221.18. Anyway > I try to change the value to 0xD (overclock StrongARM :), the kernel boots but > failed at loading ramdisk. > > It is not for overclocking! Congratulations, you succesfully overclocked the CPU. We were able to run a 1.5V SA1100 specced at 190MHz at 220MHz, and even at 265 MHz. The reason your system crashed is that you didn't change the DRAM timings which are closely related to the core clock. I'm currently working on Johan's clock scaling for Linux (making the voltage scaling optional) which actually does take DRAM timings into account. Erik PS: UCB 1200 audio works, I can play MP3 files on the LART ;-). -- Yes, it works sometimes. If you need something that "works sometimes" use Windows! -- Victor Khimenko on linux-kernel -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 14:43:34 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA19004 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:43:34 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA19000 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:43:33 +0200 Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ007GT8NV0A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:43:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12lA4S-000CrC-0W for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:40:37 +0100 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:37:26 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: Re: LART availability? In-reply-to: <20000428121335.A1174@granby.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3tZzkeAGYYC5EwIH@p2cl.demon.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> References: <001601bfb0e2$d8b066c0$9dba47c2@commentor.se> <20000428121335.A1174@granby.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <20000428121335.A1174@granby.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk>, Toby Jaffey writes > >On Fri, Apr 28, 2000 at 09:24:53AM +0200, Fredrik Rothamel wrote: >> could someone post a status report on the progress in making assembled LARTs >> available? Is there an European initiative? >> >> (assembled LART = complete LART + KSB + ETH, preferably with programmed ROM) > >Does anyone have a rough estimate of what it would cost for all of the parts to >the main board? > >Would anyone be willing to build me one or sell one to me? I was going to try and act as a UK source. I'm not sure whether that will be possible because of increasing time pressures at the moment. Doug Moreen has contacted me (sorry Doug, not got back to you on your last e-mail yet) with a view to working with him and that's a definite possibility. All I can say at the moment is that I want to be involved in some kind of supply situation and will keep the list updated. I will try to get back to Doug this weekend and update the list early next week. Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 14:46:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA19024 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:46:52 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA19020 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:46:51 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ006JS8TEY3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:46:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12lA7g-000HEA-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:43:56 +0100 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:44:50 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <390987C2.3E1B5F06@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004281207.OAA11436@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > PS: UCB 1200 audio works, I can play MP3 files on the LART ;-). Yay! Out of interest, where did you get the UCB1200s from? (Or are you using 1300s instead?) Cheers, STeve -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 14:49:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA19040 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:49:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA19036 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:49:24 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ007NO8Y420@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:49:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA13281; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:49:43 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07715; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:41:14 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:42:03 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 To: Erik Mouw , lart Message-id: <3909871B.62487EAD@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004281157.NAA11364@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Erik Mouw wrote: > > BogoMips == Bogus MIPS. They don't mean anything. Really. The BogoMips > value is NOT the same as the clock speed! > > Erik > But most of the machines that I used, their BogoMIPS are cosely related to their core clock speed. and the code in the kernel does say that it is used caculate loops_per_second? and udelay() is using this value. Anyway, is their anyway to know the cpu is running at which clock rate? The board I have does not have the GPIO26 pin connected out, cannot measure at that pin. :( -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 15:38:27 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA19156 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:38:27 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA19152 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:38:26 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id PAA12030; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:38:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004281338.PAA12030@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-Reply-To: <3909871B.62487EAD@krdl.org.sg> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Fri Apr 28 15:38:21 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:42:03 +0800, zhu qun ying wrote: > But most of the machines that I used, their BogoMIPS are cosely related to > their core clock speed. and the code in the kernel does say that it is used > caculate loops_per_second? and udelay() is using this value. Anyway, is their The BogoMips value differ wildly between machines. For example: on an i386 it is core speed divided by 5, on an i486 it is core speed divided by 2, on a Pentium it is core speed divided by 2.5, on a Pentium II it is the same as the core speed, and a Sun Sparc Classis does core speed divided by 1.2. So yes: the bogo mips value is related to, but certainly not the same as the core speed. The BogoMips value is dependent on three things: the core implementation, the core clock speed, and the compiler efficiency. This is all very well documented in the BogoMips mini-HOWTO, available at every sunsite/metalab mirror. > anyway to know the cpu is running at which clock rate? The board I have does > not have the GPIO26 pin connected out, cannot measure at that pin. :( Directly measure on the GPIO pin itself using a probe with a fine tip. Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 15:43:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA19180 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:43:42 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA19176 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:43:41 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id PAA12066; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:43:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004281343.PAA12066@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: steve@steves-house.org.uk Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-Reply-To: <390987C2.3E1B5F06@steves-house.org.uk> Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Fri Apr 28 15:43:38 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:44:50 +0100, Steve Wiseman wrote: > Erik Mouw wrote: >> PS: UCB 1200 audio works, I can play MP3 files on the LART ;-). > > Yay! > Out of interest, where did you get the UCB1200s from? (Or are you > using 1300s instead?) I don't know. I remember JDB had problems getting them, but somehow he managed to find a small quantity. I think JDB can tell when he's back from holiday. I use a real UCB1200. Erik -- unix soit qui mal y pense -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri Apr 28 15:49:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA19199 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:49:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA19195 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:49:20 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTQ00BIXBQ5CS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:49:18 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:43:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-reply-to: <390966AF.E4F5AB83@krdl.org.sg> To: zhu qun ying Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, zhu qun ying wrote: > I understand that SA1100 can clock at 220MHz and blob set it to the rate as > default. But when Linux booted, its BogoMips reports around 206/7 MHz. Is the > kernel reseting the clock or BogoMips is not the same as clock rate? I canot > found where is the related code in kernel. Never assume Bogomips and clock speed are related. In practice on a StrongARM, bogomips are approx clock_speed - 10 but remember that bogomips are bogus. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 05:21:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA20961 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 05:21:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA20957 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 05:21:13 +0200 Received: from sttlpop5.sttl.uswest.net (sttlpop5.sttl.uswest.net [206.81.192.5]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTR00BFVDBC06@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 05:21:13 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 3796 invoked by alias); Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:18:48 +0000 Received: (qmail 3778 invoked by uid 0); Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:18:47 +0000 Received: from ddslppp153.sttl.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.99.153) by pop.sttl.uswest.net with SMTP; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:18:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:18:05 -0700 From: Sam Stinson Subject: Battery-backed RAM drive? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390A546D.F2BBABFF@uswest.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Delivered-to: fixup-lart@lart.tudelft.nl@fixme X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk How difficult would it be to design a battery backed hard-drive-alike using some sort of RAM? RAM being cheaper than flash memory, and all. I'm looking at using the LART as a portable MP3 player, and of course want the cheapest solution in the smallest package. Of course, I don't know much about the power requirements for memory refresh, etc. so this might just be a battery eater. But hey, I've got lots of old 72 pin EDO lying around (and I bet some of you do, too) so maybe it's worth a shot? Thoughts? Sam Stinson Seattle, WA sstinson@uswest.net -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 06:11:24 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21023 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:11:24 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21019 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:11:23 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTR00C4CFMV6Z@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:11:22 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:08:36 +1000 Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:08:36 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: sa-1111 In-reply-to: <39011396.5B35E810@mjv.com> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Michael Vanecek Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Can people please remove me from the CC lists when posting to lart. I'm on the mailling list and its stuffing up my filtering. Cheers Adam On Fri, 21 Apr 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > What's the story on the sa-1111 helper chip? It almost looks like a ksb > on one chip... > > Mike > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 06:17:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21043 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:17:11 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21039 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:17:10 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTR00C2FFWKBL@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:17:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.83]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA10692; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:42:48 +0530 (IST) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:46:35 +0530 From: Mukund Subject: Re: Battery-backed RAM drive? To: Sam Stinson , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <000901bfb191$b5e4aca0$531e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >How difficult would it be to design a battery backed hard-drive-alike >using some sort of RAM? yes, i would like to know this too... the hard disk eats a lot of battery anyway i guess. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 06:39:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21082 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:39:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21078 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:39:18 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTR00C93GXF8S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:39:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:39:08 +1000 Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:39:07 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: SA11x0 Multiprocessor In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000422001345.00a216c0@mail.clubnet.net> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Derek Lassen Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 22 Apr 2000, Derek Lassen wrote: > This is very non LART. > > By using a signal named MBREQ one could build a multiprocessor systems, > but as I understand it, there are two major issues: > > First is memory refresh. If DRAM is in-system, you must insure that the > processor doing the refresh never looses the bus for so long as to miss out > on a refresh cycle. Maybe you could rotate refresh duty among many processors. > > The second problem is cache coherency. There is none. So, any memory change > that happens behind the cache will be invisible to other processors. That > means that any data structure which is visible to more than one task must > be protected by a semaphore which is in a non cached area of memory. > > This is one of the tradeoffs of CISC vs RISC. This has nothing to do with CISC vs RISC. It has to do with the simplicity that this particular cache design has. Nothing stoping anyone from designing an ARM with SMPable caches but its not what ARM core designers are aimming for. All ARM caches to date have been fully virtual. The ARM9 cores provide means to physically tag caches which makes them a little nicer for multiple address space OS's but thats another story all together. Cheers Adam P.S. For an example of mass cache coherency for SMP have a look at the Alpha range of processors. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 10:11:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA21285 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:11:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA21281 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:11:01 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTR00EESQQCGO@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:11:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BB5E748D8; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:11:21 +0100 (BST) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:11:21 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-reply-to: <200004281157.NAA11364@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: kira@carrot.linuxgrrls.org To: Erik Mouw Cc: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > BogoMips == Bogus MIPS. They don't mean anything. Really. The BogoMips > value is NOT the same as the clock speed! On StrongARM, it's pretty damn close... we used to get 222 BogoMIPS out of a 233 MHz StrongARM. kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 10:13:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA21298 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:13:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA21294 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:13:53 +0200 Received: from mail.linuxgrrls.org ([62.6.164.226]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTR00EEGQV4I1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:13:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.linuxgrrls.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 318EA748D8; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:13:38 +0100 (BST) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:13:38 +0100 (BST) From: Kira Brown Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 In-reply-to: <3909871B.62487EAD@krdl.org.sg> X-Sender: kira@carrot.linuxgrrls.org To: zhu qun ying Cc: Erik Mouw , lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, zhu qun ying wrote: > But most of the machines that I used, their BogoMIPS are cosely related to > their core clock speed. It's not fixed, and is different for every processor. My SC410s score roughly half their clock rate in BogoMIPS, StrongARMs score about equal (though usually slightly less, for some reason) and the K6-2 I'm sat typing this on scores about double. It's a Bogus Meaningless Indicator of Processor Specification... kira. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sat Apr 29 21:25:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA22277 for lart-outgoing; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:25:43 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA22273 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:25:42 +0200 Received: from kalman by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id VAA17017; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:25:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200004291925.VAA17017@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: SA11x0 Multiprocessor In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Sat Apr 29 19:25:31 +0000 (GMT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (Linux) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:39:07 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > P.S. For an example of mass cache coherency for SMP have a look at the > Alpha range of processors. JDB and I had a quick look at the latest Alpha CPUs: very nice, extremely fast, 8GB/s data throughput (IIRC), but... it wants 60W of power for its 2V core (yes, that's a 30A current). Not a real problem if it needs a continuous current, but the current fluctuates with the processor utilization. We really don't want to design a power supply for that beast. ;-) Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 30 04:19:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA23172 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 04:19:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA23168 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 04:19:45 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTT006JE54U98@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 04:19:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA21582; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:17:05 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA14561; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:08:34 +0800 (SGT) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:09:24 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 To: Erik Mouw , lart Message-id: <390B95D4.5F830C44@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <200004281207.OAA11436@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I am sorry for ignoring the BogoMIPS howto, ;P. Anyway, for my case, If I can overclock my board without recalculating my DRAM setting, does that mean my orginal DRAM setting is too safe (I'm using the MICRON MT4LC4M16R6 DRAM, 50 ns)? What kind of effect on performance? What kind of information to look for from the DRAM specs? The terms used are a little different from StrongARM's manual. like the longest burst access time, I did not see any simlimar terms from the DRAM spec. Currently I am using the following value for my DRAM. mov r1, #0xA0000000 mov r2, #0xC7000000 add r2, r2, #0x001C0000 add r2, r2, #0x00007000 add r2, r2, #0x0000003F str r2, [r1, #0x04] mov r2, #0xFF000000 add r2, r2, #0x00C70000 add r2, r2, #0x00001C00 add r2, r2, #0x00000071 str r2, [r1, #0x08] mov r2, #0xFF000000 add r2, r2, #0x00FF0000 add r2, r2, #0x0000FF00 add r2, r2, #0x000000FF str r2, [r1, #0x0C] mov r2, #0x01000000 add r2, r2, #0x00840000 add r2, r2, #0x00006600 add r2, r2, #0x000000F3 str r2, [r1, #0x00] Erik Mouw wrote: > Congratulations, you succesfully overclocked the CPU. We were able to run > a 1.5V SA1100 specced at 190MHz at 220MHz, and even at 265 MHz. The reason > your system crashed is that you didn't change the DRAM timings which are > closely related to the core clock. > > I'm currently working on Johan's clock scaling for Linux (making the > voltage scaling optional) which actually does take DRAM timings into > account. > > Erik > > PS: UCB 1200 audio works, I can play MP3 files on the LART ;-). -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 30 06:58:26 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA23299 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:58:26 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA23295 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:58:25 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTT0075XCH9ZJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:58:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id VAA3735734; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:55:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:55:48 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Free Samples Parts for LART Construction To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <390BBCD4.18ABD215@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------6A0FCCB129CCF288B7F5211E" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------6A0FCCB129CCF288B7F5211E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I've just finished the latest update to the LART (Rev 3) PC Board small quantity order site and added a couple of items of possible interest: 1.) A Complete Priced Bill Of Materials (BOM) with Part Numbers, Footprints / Package details and prototype qty unit cost estimates ( http://pweb.netcom.com/~sv_calif/BOM.htm ) 2.) A page containing Links to LART related Part Manufactures, Electronic Component Distributors and Sources for FREE engineering samples required for LART mainboard construction: ( http://pweb.netcom.com/~sv_calif/Components.htm ) Feedback, corrections and suggested additions are welcome Cheers, Greg Fountain Menlo Park, CA --------------6A0FCCB129CCF288B7F5211E Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------6A0FCCB129CCF288B7F5211E-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 30 11:09:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA23564 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:09:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA23560 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:09:15 +0200 Received: from smtp.pandora.be (hercules.telenet-ops.be [195.130.132.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTT00A5TO3EB6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:09:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 2354 invoked from network); Sun, 30 Apr 2000 09:07:14 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pandora.be) ([212.123.14.101]) (envelope-sender ) by hercules.telenet-ops.be (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 09:07:14 +0000 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:03:39 +0200 From: PELGRIMS P Subject: Is it possible to run PERL MRTG on LART ? To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be Message-id: <390BF6EA.95AA94C2@pandora.be> Organization: A MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hello, Would it be possibel to run MRTG and Perl on LART. In that way can store and handle local data (graphical) and use it with HTTPD. Hoping to receive some reactions, I meanwhile remain, P. Pelgrims -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 30 12:58:31 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA23674 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:58:31 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA23670 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:58:30 +0200 Received: from listserv.tudelft.nl (listserv.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTT00BGFT5IW5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:58:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from its.tudelft.nl (IDENT:pouwelse@mp3.twi.tudelft.nl [130.161.98.56]) by listserv.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA22485; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:58:28 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:58:59 +0200 From: Johan Pouwelse Subject: Re: Is it possible to run PERL MRTG on LART ? To: patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be Cc: Lart Mail Server Message-id: <390C11F3.98C92054@its.tudelft.nl> Organization: Technical University Delft MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <390BF6EA.95AA94C2@pandora.be> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk PELGRIMS P wrote: > Would it be possibel to run MRTG and Perl on LART. You mean running the programs of http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html to make graphs of the Ethernet traffic on the LART ethernet interface... Yep, that would be a very nice application of the LART. If you want to investigate network problems in general the LART would be an ideal instrument. Johan. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Sun Apr 30 19:38:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA24209 for lart-outgoing; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:38:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA24204 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:38:53 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTU00IE0BORXR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:38:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id KAA3807042; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:36:16 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:36:16 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: Free Samples Parts for LART Construction To: David Poisson Cc: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <390C6F10.3095BDA3@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------7F1C1830C3BE6DC9BDF3C96A" X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------7F1C1830C3BE6DC9BDF3C96A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave, Manufactures hand out free samples on a routine basis (especially for low cost parts) as a means to get their components into new designs. In marketing lingo a "Design Win". For the most part (using MAXIM as an example) it's done by simply filling out a form on their website (hundred of sample requests are processed every day). Here in Silicon Valley I have never had a vendor require to make any kind of promise that I will buy them in large volume. After all from the marketing department's perspective, half the battle is getting you to ring their phones and not their competitors (especially for engineers working on new design prototypes) and in the process getting you on their potential customer list. Greg David Poisson wrote: > I'm terribly sorry, but I am very new at this, and I was wondering what > "free sample" means exactly ? Is it something like if you promise to buy a > large quantity if the chip meets your demands, then they let you get a > sample of a certain chip (or component) for free to try it out ? > > Thanks > > David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org --------------7F1C1830C3BE6DC9BDF3C96A Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------7F1C1830C3BE6DC9BDF3C96A-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 01:56:06 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA24922 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 01:56:06 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA24918 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 01:56:05 +0200 Received: from localhost.localdomain (cogeco-29-65.cgocable.net [24.141.29.65]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTU002BWT5FYP@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 01:56:04 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from cgocable.net (IDENT:hbelange@webster [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA09827 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 07:58:00 -0400 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 07:58:00 -0400 From: Hugues Belanger Subject: Re: ANNOUNCE: Gerber RS-247D/X viewer in Java Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <390C1FC8.5C8D9681@cgocable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0 i586) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------CA1919CD5DD3AEE57DF50932" X-Accept-Language: en References: <3946359D.9444E37D@linux.de> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk --------------CA1919CD5DD3AEE57DF50932 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Gents, I've sent this e-mail to J.D but I haven't had a reply yet so I'm asking anyone, willing to help ..! I'm getting a quote from a local manufacturing shop and they have concern with the gerber's here's what they had to say "We have viewed the Gerber files for the Pcb layout, but I'm not convinced that all layers are correct. I would like to fax you copies of the layers for you to look at and confirm if all layers arecorrect or not. Layer 3 is particularly of concern to me. Two layer 3 files are provided (13pos.gbr and 13neg.gbr). 13neg.gbr is simply a complete unbroken copper sheet and would shortcircuit the entire Pcb if used as such. I therefore assume that because it is called 13neg.gbr it should be reversed so that no copper exists. Please look at layer three and confirm if it is correct." Can someone tell me if this is a mistake and if it is can someon send me the correct gerbers... thanks Hugues Belanger --------------CA1919CD5DD3AEE57DF50932 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Gents,
I've sent this e-mail to J.D but I haven't had a reply yet so I'm asking anyone, willing to help ..!

I'm getting a quote from a local manufacturing shop and they have concern with the gerber's here's what they had to say

"We have viewed the Gerber files for the Pcb layout, but I'm not convinced that all layers are correct. I would like to fax you copies
of the layers for you to look at and confirm if all layers arecorrect or not.
 
Layer 3 is particularly of concern to me. Two layer 3 files are provided (13pos.gbr  and  13neg.gbr).
13neg.gbr is simply a complete unbroken copper sheet and would shortcircuit the entire Pcb if used as such. I therefore assume that
because it is called 13neg.gbr it should be reversed so that no copper exists. Please look at layer three and confirm if it is correct."

Can  someone tell me if this is a mistake and if it is can someon send me the correct gerbers... thanks
 

Hugues Belanger
  --------------CA1919CD5DD3AEE57DF50932-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 02:06:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25008 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 02:06:57 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25004; Mon, 1 May 2000 02:06:55 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <390987C2.3E1B5F06@steves-house.org.uk> References: <200004281207.OAA11436@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:05:40 +0200 To: Steve Wiseman From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: max clock rate for SA1100 Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 14:44 +0200 28-04-2000, Steve Wiseman wrote: >Erik Mouw wrote: > >> PS: UCB 1200 audio works, I can play MP3 files on the LART ;-). > >Yay! > Out of interest, where did you get the UCB1200s from? (Or are you >using 1300s instead?) http://www.avnetmarshall.com/ JDB. -- "We're standing there pounding a dead parrot on the counter, and the management response is to frantically swap in new counters to see if that fixes the problem." --Peter Gutmann in the Monastery -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 02:19:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25042 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 02:19:46 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25037; Mon, 1 May 2000 02:19:42 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <390C1FC8.5C8D9681@cgocable.net> References: <3946359D.9444E37D@linux.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:18:16 +0200 To: Hugues Belanger From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: ANNOUNCE: Gerber RS-247D/X viewer in Java Cc: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk [Sorry if I appear grumpy, but I've been on a short supply of sleep lately. Also someone appears to be in write-only mode] At 13:58 +0200 30-04-2000, Hugues Belanger wrote: > Hi Gents, >I've sent this e-mail to J.D but I haven't had a reply yet so I'm asking >anyone, willing to help ..! May have something to do with me being on vacation and you apparently not willing to wait more than 48 hours for a reply. >I'm getting a quote from a local manufacturing shop and they have concern >with the gerber's here's what they had to say > >"We have viewed the Gerber files for the Pcb layout, but I'm not convinced >that all layers are correct. I would like to fax you copies >of the layers for you to look at and confirm if all layers arecorrect or not. > >Layer 3 is particularly of concern to me. Two layer 3 files are provided >(13pos.gbr and 13neg.gbr). >13neg.gbr is simply a complete unbroken copper sheet and would >shortcircuit the entire Pcb if used as such. I therefore assume that >because it is called 13neg.gbr it should be reversed so that no copper >exists. Please look at layer three and confirm if it is correct." Read the mailing list archive; Greg Fountain and I discussed this earlier. Oh and it might be helpful to read the file called 'README' from the hardware distro before posting to the list. >Can someone tell me if this is a mistake and if it is can someon send me >the correct gerbers... thanks Both Greg and I have had PCBs manufactured from these Gerbers. JDB. -- They're all fools. Don't worry. Darwin may be slow, but he'll eventually get them. -- Matthew Lammers in ASR -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 11:39:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25760 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 11:39:19 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25756 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 11:39:19 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id LAA22699; Mon, 1 May 2000 11:39:18 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200005010939.LAA22699@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: diff-2.3.99-pre3-rmk3-np2-em1.gz Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Mon May 01 11:39:17 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just put my patch against Nicolas Pitre's patch on the LART website. What's new: - SA1100 optimizations in the main Makefile. - LART LED support. - UCB 1200 driver ported from linux-2.2.12. I only tested it on LART, but it should also work on Brutus and Tifon. I made some minor cleanups (removed quite some dead code), but IMHO it needs a real big cleanup. - Some minor cleanups in the header files. Get it from http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/port/ . Erik -- A towel has immense psychological value. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 15:50:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA26267 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 15:50:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA26263 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 15:50:03 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTV00C78VMB5B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 15:50:03 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 09:41:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: diff-2.3.99-pre3-rmk3-np2-em1.gz In-reply-to: <200005010939.LAA22699@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 1 May -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > Hi all, > > I just put my patch against Nicolas Pitre's patch on the LART website. I'm coming with a patch against 2.3.99-pre6-rmk1 shortly. There is still some issues to resolve though, but I hope to fix that by tomorrow. It will include the above mentionned patch. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 16:19:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA26333 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 16:19:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA26329 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 16:19:31 +0200 Received: from hd2.dot.net.in (hd2.vsnl.net.in [202.54.30.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTV00E0BX47GZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 16:19:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from muks ([202.54.30.118]) by hd2.dot.net.in (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA08972 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 19:45:02 +0530 (IST) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 19:48:42 +0530 From: Mukund Subject: request for test... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <007101bfb378$27c60700$5c1e36ca@muks> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk folks.. a request... if any of you are lart owners, would you be interested in testing a quake port on your lart? right now, it has no graphics and no sound :-) but it does the rendering to a buffer and does the game simulation properly. i have tested it on my x86 and have an ARM binary ready.. since that PAK file is huge (PIG, HOG, FAT) i wonder if i might be able to work up a modified PAK so that it can be written into the flash.. any takers? hey, atleast say no :) - muks ps: yes the source is there too.. don't worry :) only thing is that i want to tidy it and add the fbdev code before i release it. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 19:14:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26874 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:14:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26870 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:14:37 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00MC658CHB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:14:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA15492 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 13:12:23 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA13402 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 13:15:50 -0400 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 17:15:49 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I posted this message two weeks ago, but it appears it never made it to the list cause I never recieved a copy. I was reflecting on what I wanted to do exactly with a LART (After all, I have to find an excuse to buy one hehe) and the following is pretty much what I had in mind. I want to do a small portable computer that runs linux. Don't mind if it's not the best processor, as long as it doesn't consume too much power. Would be nice to have some audio for those long boring classes, ethernet to connect to wherever I go (school network or home network) and an LCD screen (color capable) to see wtf I'm doing ;-) I would probably have to do my own case, create a keyboard (no need for a mouse) and put a thing to connect to 120W wall plug (not to mention what everyone was talking about a couple of days ago as to which battery should be used). I also wanted to ask something: can the IDE controller on the KSB board support more than 1 device ? (IDE floppy + IDE hard disk for example) Question is: could this be done with lart ? Been monitoring the mailing-list for about a week now and it seems that a LART would be perfect for what I wanna do. Keep in mind that I also wanna learn how all that electrical stuff works, so I don't mind doing some of the stuff myself (so don't say I should get a laptop instead hehe) Thanks a lot for any input. David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 19:54:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA26991 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:54:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA26987 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:54:16 +0200 From: anders.wallin@helsinki.fi Received: from post.it.helsinki.fi (post.it.helsinki.fi [128.214.205.24]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW000F772FYE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:54:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from rock.helsinki.fi (rock.helsinki.fi [128.214.3.50]) by post.it.helsinki.fi (8.10.1/8.10.1-SPAMmers-sod-off) with ESMTP id e41Hpin20452 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 20:51:44 +0300 (EET DST) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 20:51:44 +0300 (EET DST) Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: X-Sender: awallin@rock.helsinki.fi To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Wallin Anders Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > Question is: could this be done with lart ? Been monitoring the > mailing-list for about a week now and it seems that a LART would be > perfect for what I wanna do. Keep in mind that I also wanna learn how all > that electrical stuff works, so I don't mind doing some of the stuff > myself (so don't say I should get a laptop instead hehe) If you think about it, you would need: Lart KSB Ethernet Keyboard Screen Battery Power Supply I don't know what laptop would be equal to a lart in performance, but the price for the above will surely be similar to a low end laptop. I'm sure it would be possible to build a portable linux pc around the lart, but personally I think I'll go for a Psion... OTOH building a completely "Open Hardware " desktop pc running linux would maybe be nice in the future... A Wallin -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 20:06:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27047 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:06:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27043 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:06:21 +0200 Received: from reflect.newenterprises.com (newenterprises.com [207.155.90.15]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW001747MJDS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:06:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gduncan@localhost) by reflect.newenterprises.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id e41HOxp32435 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 10:24:59 -0700 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:24:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Glen Duncan Subject: Other embeded Linux To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Wow!, now this is small! http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS4033319254.html -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 20:37:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA27098 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:37:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA27094 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:37:35 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW0025P92MG7@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:37:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA15671; Mon, 01 May 2000 14:35:20 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA13534; Mon, 01 May 2000 14:38:52 -0400 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 18:38:52 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: anders.wallin@helsinki.fi Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Well, thanks for your input. But like I said, it's more of a project to learn how these things work. I don't really mind if it's not cost efficient. At worst, you cut down a little on certain things (like a very basic LCD screen which doesn't do colors). David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Mon, 1 May 2000 anders.wallin@helsinki.fi wrote: > > Question is: could this be done with lart ? Been monitoring the > > mailing-list for about a week now and it seems that a LART would be > > perfect for what I wanna do. Keep in mind that I also wanna learn how all > > that electrical stuff works, so I don't mind doing some of the stuff > > myself (so don't say I should get a laptop instead hehe) > > If you think about it, you would need: > > Lart > KSB > Ethernet > Keyboard > Screen > Battery > Power Supply > > I don't know what laptop would be equal to a lart in performance, but the > price for the above will surely be similar to a low end laptop. > > I'm sure it would be possible to build a portable linux pc around the > lart, but personally I think I'll go for a Psion... > > OTOH building a completely "Open Hardware " desktop pc running linux would > maybe be nice in the future... > > A Wallin > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 21:34:00 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA27228 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 21:34:00 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA27224 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 21:33:59 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTW003PNBOMN6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 21:33:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from bia.rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA00946; Mon, 01 May 2000 15:23:23 -0400 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 15:22:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Barry Callahan Message-id: <"200005011923.PAA00946"@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 CDE Version 1.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Content-type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: aXQrVRxX4pcvZiE8SvXKTg== Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >I don't know what laptop would be equal to a lart in performance, but the >price for the above will surely be similar to a low end laptop. > Not that a processor's Dhrystone is a particularly accurate comparison, but a Pentium 133 is rated at 200 MIPS. The 190MHz portable SA-1100 is rated at 220 MIPS. So, by using this comparison, you'd be building a (roughly) Pentum 150 class machine. Assuming you didn't overclock the system. :) And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in development are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. Numbers quoted were obtained from: Intel SA-1100 Linecard (http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/linecard/sa-1100/) The ARM Website (www.arm.com) and various Processor Whitepapers from Intel's website Barry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 23:28:39 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA27431 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:28:39 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA27427 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:28:38 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW0080QGZOZE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:28:37 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id RAA16048 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 17:26:00 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id RAA13716 for ; Mon, 01 May 2000 17:29:35 -0400 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 21:29:35 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: LART power situation X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a wall jack) David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Mon May 1 23:51:42 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA27495 for lart-outgoing; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:51:42 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA27491 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:51:41 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW008BCI23ZE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 1 May 2000 23:51:40 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.124) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 01 May 2000 14:43:39 -0700 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 14:43:33 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: GPS SA Gone X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Cc: Eric Fort Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000501144201.00c43450@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk For those who want their LART to know exactly where it is via GPS, the US has turned off Selective Availability. See http://www.igeb.gov/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 00:02:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA27544 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:02:20 +0200 Received: from historia.et.tudelft.nl (root@historia.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.33.102]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA27540 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:02:19 +0200 Received: (from marcj@localhost) by historia.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA00524; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:02:15 +0200 From: Marc Joosen Message-Id: <200005012202.AAA00524@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Subject: Re: LART power situation To: david@fish.ecks.org (David Poisson) Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 00:02:15 +0200 (MEST) Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl (lart) In-Reply-To: from "David Poisson" at May 01, 2000 09:29:35 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL0pre8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something > other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a > wall jack) Well, plugging it directly in a 120/230V wall jack won't make it run harder... (I've seen someone do this with a transistor radio -- it didn't work, and this guy was wondering why the wires got so short :) If you look at the mainboard page http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/plint/ you'll see that it accepts a relatively wide range of voltages. You should be able to find a combination of batteries / mains adapter that works. The other boards are all powered off the mainboard supply. Most displays have a (separate) step-up converter for their high voltage that works off the same low voltage supply. So, unless you want to do something really special, one supply between 3.5 and 16 V should be sufficient. -- Marc e-mail: M.A.H.G.Joosen@et.tudelft.nl (actually, that's marcj@duteela.et.tudelft.nl or marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl) ------------------------------------------------------------------- In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates? __ __^__ __________ | \ +---/ \---+ (==========) |____\___________ +---\_____/---+ // >____)| | \__ \ \______//___ >/ |________| \ [ _____\ |____________________\ \_______/ Roger, go at throttle up CHR$(32), the final frontier ------------------------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 00:46:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA27658 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:46:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA27654 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:46:07 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (www.clubnet.net [206.126.128.4]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00AIXKKUKB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 00:46:06 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.124) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Mon, 01 May 2000 15:38:06 -0700 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 15:37:59 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: Re: LART power situation In-reply-to: X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000501151232.00bb1aa0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk There are a few parts needed. Marlin P Jones, and assoc. In Florida sell some nice laptop supplies, with built in Batt charger and regulators (for $14.95). See http://www.mpja.com/product.asp?product=4786+PS. Halted Specilities in Santa Clara sell a 12 Volt 5 Amp/Hour (60 Watt/Hour) D Cell pack of NiCDs (#17181) (for $17.50 ) that would work with this power supply. See page 12 of ftp://ftp.halted.com/catpdf/cats1-s12.pdf. Both companies sell suitable AC tto DC wall warts (you want 16 to 18 Volts @ 2.5 Amps). Hope this helps... (s) Derek At 09:29 PM 5/1/00 +0000, you wrote: >I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something >other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a >wall jack) > >David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 02:01:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA27976 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:01:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA27972 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:01:42 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00CKGO2S2Z@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:01:41 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id QAA3625209; Mon, 01 May 2000 16:59:00 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 16:58:59 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: Re: LART power situation To: David Poisson , Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <390E1A43.CCF25DF5@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------9C12C20CBD4CC3822E6B8E7D" X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------9C12C20CBD4CC3822E6B8E7D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello again, This brings up a little idea I've been thinking about to eliminate the normal wire and cable clutter associated with prototype hardware. I was contemplating laying out a simple (5" x 8" or so) double sided PC board that mates with the LART mainboard. This "Eval" board might include: 1.) Standard DB-9 connector for connecting the serial port to your PC 2.) Reset pushbutton 3.) 0.1" grid breadboard area 4.) Mating 2mm J2, J3, J4 through hole connectors (Fanned out to a std. 0.1" pin spacing) 5.) AC to DC power supply (UL approved wall former or DC-DC converter) & PCB jack 6.) Spring steel battery clips (so you could try the battery powered option) Any preferred battery size? Maybe four 1.5 volt cells? 7.) Kit in a box. ( all parts and connectors ) 8.) Other Ideas anyone??? This would be a (KISS) though hole design to eliminate the current problems a lot of people are having with SMT assembly. An easy solder by hand type of project. The goal would be to provide a clean low cost mainboard evaluation PCB that users could get started with to test code and make a few power measurement on. I know this is no KSB ... but it's simple, cheap, and easy to put together Anyone Interested? Have any additional comments? Greg David Poisson wrote: > I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something > other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a > wall jack) > > David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org --------------9C12C20CBD4CC3822E6B8E7D Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------9C12C20CBD4CC3822E6B8E7D-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 02:12:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA28005 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:12:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA28001 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:12:54 +0200 Received: from cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.176]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00D0EOLHE8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 02:12:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modem-240.alabama.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.52.240] helo=epic.world) by cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12mQHV-00012L-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 02 May 2000 01:11:17 +0100 Received: from trj by epic.world with local (Exim 2.05 #1 (Debian)) id 12mQBL-00054G-00; Tue, 02 May 2000 01:04:55 +0100 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 01:04:55 +0100 From: Toby Jaffey Subject: Re: LART power situation In-reply-to: <200005012202.AAA00524@historia.et.tudelft.nl>; from marcj@historia.et.tudelft.nl on Tue, May 02, 2000 at 12:02:15AM +0200 To: lart Reply-to: toby@earth.li Mail-followup-to: lart Message-id: <20000502010454.A19471@epic.world> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <200005012202.AAA00524@historia.et.tudelft.nl> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, May 02, 2000 at 12:02:15AM +0200, Marc Joosen wrote: > > I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something > > other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a > > wall jack) [snip] > So, unless you want to do something really special, one supply between > 3.5 and 16 V should be sufficient. Could you power it from a serial port? That would be cool. -- (o_ | Toby Jaffey : www.nott.ac.uk/~psystrj/ //\ | "... it is important to realize that any lock can be picked with a V_/_ | big enough hammer." -- Sun System & Network Admin manual -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 04:46:18 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA28378 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 04:46:18 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA28374 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 04:46:18 +0200 Received: from socket.house ([208.243.144.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00FB2VP4ER@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 04:46:17 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by newsnipple.com via sendmail from stdin id (Debian Smail3.2.0.102) for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Mon, 01 May 2000 20:00:09 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 20:00:09 -0700 From: Adam Haberlach Subject: Re: LART power situation In-reply-to: <20000502010454.A19471@epic.world>; from Toby Jaffey on Tue, May 02, 2000 at 01:04:55AM +0100 To: lart Message-id: <20000501200009.A16933@ricochet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.3i Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <200005012202.AAA00524@historia.et.tudelft.nl> <20000502010454.A19471@epic.world> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, May 02, 2000 at 01:04:55AM +0100, Toby Jaffey wrote: > On Tue, May 02, 2000 at 12:02:15AM +0200, Marc Joosen wrote: > > > > I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use something > > > other than batteries if it's available (like plug your LART directly in a > > > wall jack) > > [snip] > > > So, unless you want to do something really special, one supply between > > 3.5 and 16 V should be sufficient. > > Could you power it from a serial port? > That would be cool. You usually can't draw enough power from a serial port. -- Adam Haberlach |"You have to understand that the adam@newsnipple.com | entire 'Net is based on people with http://www.newsnipple.com/ | too much free time on their hands." -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 05:39:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA28500 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:39:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA28496 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:39:34 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00G4BY5W7I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:39:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.83] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.03) id AD3F87EC023E; Mon, 01 May 2000 22:36:31 -0500 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:38:14 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: GPS SA Gone Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390E4DA6.2BE5496@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <4.2.0.58.20000501144201.00c43450@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Too cool - now accuracy will be much greater! Want to know your exact position and elevation at a given moment to within a few meters? No problem - just consult your handy GPSLart... :) I'd always thought SA was a pile of dung - imagine introducing a new technology and then crippling it for "national security". Sheesh, keep the gov boys away from the cluster-Larts and the Crypto-Larts then... What, we can do 512 bit encryption but the gov limits us to 24 bit encryption. Oh, and our Larts are clustered, but you can only use one at a time... :) Mike Derek Lassen wrote: > > For those who want their LART to know exactly where it is via GPS, the US > has turned off Selective Availability. > > See http://www.igeb.gov/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 05:45:19 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA28533 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:45:19 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA28529 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:45:19 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTW00G6OYFH7I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 05:45:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id WAA25250; Mon, 01 May 2000 22:42:39 -0500 Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:42:39 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: LART power situation In-reply-to: <20000501200009.A16933@ricochet.net> To: Adam Haberlach Cc: lart Message-id: <200005020342.WAA25250@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Adam Haberlach wrote > On Tue, May 02, 2000 at 01:04:55AM +0100, Toby Jaffey wrote: > > Could you power it from a serial port? > > That would be cool. > > You usually can't draw enough power from a serial port. You can draw 500mA from a USB port. I think that VOM in the gallery is show ~240mA. You have to configure as a USB client and request the current, you have to stay under 100mA until you are cleared for the current you request by the hub or host. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 06:42:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA28583 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 06:42:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA28579 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 06:42:49 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTX00H0T13B4J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 06:42:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id AAA17635 for ; Tue, 02 May 2000 00:41:51 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id AAA15032 for ; Tue, 02 May 2000 00:45:31 -0400 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 04:45:30 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: LART Bus ? X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Everyone is talking about a lot of products that would be nice to have in a LART (mp3, ethernet, KSB, GPS,...). I was thinking, shouldn't someone do a bus for LART ? Even if it's an ISA bus, it would leave some room if someone want's to do their own GPS card, sound card or whatever. Not everyone needs everything. And for those that want everything, you could always put a couple of cards in your LART. Any feedback ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 07:29:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA28664 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:29:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA28660 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:29:29 +0200 Received: from sand6.global.net.uk (sand6.global.net.uk [195.147.246.105]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTX00HB13941I@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:29:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p7bs06a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.230.124] helo=rentbert) by sand6.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12mVGT-0002jv-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 02 May 2000 06:30:33 +0100 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 08:28:34 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: GPS Simm.... To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <003d01bfb408$06d7b080$3d7afea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk You can get from MAPLIN - www.maplin.co.uk PART CODE: VY57M GPS SIMM Module £99.99 Features · No External Components · Low Noise Figure (4dB) · Shielded for RFI · Direct Interface Two serial ports are provided on the SIMM module for communication. One (Port 0) is used to output position, velocity and receiver status information. This serial port also accepts messages on its input to allow initialization of the ST20-GP1. A second serial port (Port 1) is provided which is usd to show debugging information. This port does not accept any input messages. Information messages are passed to and from the SGM5600S in NMEA 0183 format. A full definition of this format can be found in the National Marine Electronics Association NMEA 0183 Standard for Interfacing Marine Electronic Devices, version 2.00. i'm still looking for a cheaper option, but it is a start, i am not shaw how many pins it has so it might be difficult to get a slot for it(better than soldering onto the pincs=). Also after seeing the specs for the Yopy posted on Slashdot, i think i need a tv tuner chip now *GRIN* Regards. -Raphael -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 07:58:10 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA28752 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:58:10 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA28748 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:58:09 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTX00HK94KT15@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 07:58:09 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From rothaus With LocalMail ; Tue, 02 May 2000 10:51:42 +1000 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:51:41 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: request for test... In-reply-to: <007101bfb378$27c60700$5c1e36ca@muks> X-Sender: awiggins@rothaus.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Mukund Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'll try it on an assabet or a brutus Cheers Adam On Mon, 1 May 2000, Mukund wrote: > folks.. a request... > > if any of you are lart owners, would you be interested > in testing a quake port on your lart? > > right now, it has no graphics and no sound :-) > but it does the rendering to a buffer and does the > game simulation properly. > > i have tested it on my x86 and have an ARM binary > ready.. since that PAK file is huge (PIG, HOG, FAT) > i wonder if i might be able to work up a > modified PAK so that it can be written into the flash.. > > any takers? hey, atleast say no :) > > - muks > > ps: > yes the source is there too.. don't worry :) > only thing is that i want to tidy it and add the > fbdev code before i release it. > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 09:52:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA29008 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 09:52:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA29004 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 09:52:29 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTX00MPE9VC1N@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 09:52:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:18 +1000 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:14 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: <"200005011923.PAA00946"@rjlsystems.com> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Barry Callahan Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Mon, 1 May 2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > > >I don't know what laptop would be equal to a lart in performance, but the > >price for the above will surely be similar to a low end laptop. > > > Not that a processor's Dhrystone is a particularly accurate comparison, but a > Pentium 133 is rated at 200 MIPS. > The 190MHz portable SA-1100 is rated at 220 MIPS. > > So, by using this comparison, you'd be building a (roughly) Pentum 150 class > machine. Assuming you didn't overclock the system. :) > > And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in development > are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. Don't forget CISC MIPS are more significant then RISC MIPS that is a RISC vs CISC issue. Mind you I'm not sure how dhrystones are qualified. Also there is the issue that SA's have very pore address space context switch times. Cheers ADam > > Numbers quoted were obtained from: > Intel SA-1100 Linecard > (http://developer.intel.com/design/strong/linecard/sa-1100/) > The ARM Website (www.arm.com) > and various Processor Whitepapers from Intel's website > > Barry > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 10:46:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA29139 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 10:46:36 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA29135 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 10:46:35 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id KAA29176; Tue, 2 May 2000 10:46:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200005020846.KAA29176@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Tue May 02 10:46:32 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:14 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > On Mon, 1 May 2000, Barry Callahan wrote: >> And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in > development >> are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. > > Don't forget CISC MIPS are more significant then RISC MIPS that is > a RISC vs CISC issue. Mind you I'm not sure how dhrystones are qualified. > Also there is the issue that SA's have very pore address space context > switch times. Did you ever implement your fast context switch paper for Linux? Erik -- In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they are different -- Larry McVoy -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 11:25:07 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA29237 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:25:07 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA29233 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:25:06 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTX0073EE5Q4B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:25:05 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From rothaus With LocalMail ; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:22:25 +1000 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 19:22:25 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: <200005020846.KAA29176@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: awiggins@rothaus.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hehehe, no I haven't. It actually part of a new thesis topic we are offering. I'd love to get back to working on my kernel but I haven't had the time. I'm more then happy to assist anyone interested in implimenting it though. One person was doing it but then changed jobs :( Alternatively I might get it done sometime real soon now (TM). Cheers Adam On Tue, 2 May -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > On Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:14 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > > On Mon, 1 May 2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > >> And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in > > development > >> are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. > > > > Don't forget CISC MIPS are more significant then RISC MIPS that is > > a RISC vs CISC issue. Mind you I'm not sure how dhrystones are qualified. > > Also there is the issue that SA's have very pore address space context > > switch times. > > Did you ever implement your fast context switch paper for Linux? > > > Erik > > -- > In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they > are different -- Larry McVoy > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 11:38:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA29262 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:38:37 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA29258 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:38:37 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id LAA29463; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:38:29 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200005020938.LAA29463@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: awiggins@cse.unsw.edu.au Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-Reply-To: Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Tue May 02 11:38:27 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 02 May 2000 19:22:25 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > Hehehe, no I haven't. It actually part of a new thesis topic we > are offering. I'd love to get back to working on my kernel but I haven't > had the time. I'm more then happy to assist anyone interested in > implimenting it though. One person was doing it but then changed jobs :( > Alternatively I might get it done sometime real soon now (TM). How far did he get? JDB and I have been talking about doing fancy clone() things to get the same memory mapping for all processes and so bring down the context switch time, but IMHO this is not The Right Thing [tm]. Do you have an estimate on the implementation time of your hack^H^H^H^Hidea? Erik PS: Could you post the URL of you paper on this list? I think lots of people don't know what we're talking about... -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Tue May 2 16:51:48 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA30399 for lart-outgoing; Tue, 2 May 2000 16:51:48 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA30395 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 16:51:48 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTX0078ET57DB@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Tue, 2 May 2000 16:51:47 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:43:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Cc: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I looked at doing that some time ago, however I found it less suited to the Linux architecture. In some cases it would even be a loss because of Linux's wide address space for user processes, shared libraries, etc. I wrote some notes to Adam at the time but I don't remember most of them ATM. On Tue, 2 May 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > Hehehe, no I haven't. It actually part of a new thesis topic we > are offering. I'd love to get back to working on my kernel but I haven't > had the time. I'm more then happy to assist anyone interested in > implimenting it though. One person was doing it but then changed jobs :( > Alternatively I might get it done sometime real soon now (TM). > > Cheers Adam > > On Tue, 2 May -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > > > On Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:14 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > > > On Mon, 1 May 2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > > >> And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in > > > development > > >> are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. > > > > > > Don't forget CISC MIPS are more significant then RISC MIPS that is > > > a RISC vs CISC issue. Mind you I'm not sure how dhrystones are qualified. > > > Also there is the issue that SA's have very pore address space context > > > switch times. > > > > Did you ever implement your fast context switch paper for Linux? > > > > > > Erik > > > > -- > > In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they > > are different -- Larry McVoy > > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 00:21:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA31702 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 00:21:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA31698 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 00:21:19 +0200 Received: from nwcst286.netaddress.usa.net (nwcst286.netaddress.usa.net [204.68.23.31]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTY003EBE3F5C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 00:21:16 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 128 invoked by uid 60001); Tue, 02 May 2000 22:19:14 +0000 Received: from 204.68.23.31 by nwcst286 for [209.76.100.150] via web-mailer(M3.4.0.33) on Tue May 2 22:19:14 GMT 2000 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 16:19:14 -0600 (MDT) From: Jamie Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000502221914.127.qmail@nwcst286.netaddress.usa.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: USANET web-mailer (M3.4.0.33) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl id AAA31699 Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >You can get from MAPLIN - www.maplin.co.uk > PART CODE: VY57M > GPS SIMM Module £99.99 >i'm still looking for a cheaper option, but it is a start How about the Garmin 25LP. I recall seeing this for about US$130 somewhere on the web, so its a bit cheaper. They have a copule of other models too, like one in a black case with a long DB9 serial cable and a power cable to plug into a car cigarette lighter (US$195 I think). Here's my idea (maybe it should go into the ideas page): A LART based Lojack device using - A LART - GPS - one of those really cheap CCD cameras with a pinhole lens - a celular phone - some means of determining the car has been broken into The idea being that when the car is stolen the LART calls you with its location, and a picture of the person driving. Or you can ring it at any time to see where your car is. Not a cheap idea, but if you did it right it could be relatively inexpensive (for what you get). Jamie -- Jamie "Life is a game. He who dies with the most money wins." - Danny DeVito in 'Other Peoples Money' ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:00:53 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32228 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:00:53 +0200 Received: from ns1.tudelft.nl (ns1.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32224 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:00:52 +0200 Received: from comanchetx.com (mail.comanchetx.com [63.64.122.61]) by mailhost2.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42431) with ESMTP id <0FTY00209LHESF@mailhost2.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:00:51 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mjv.com [63.64.123.62] by comanchetx.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.03) id A9BBF3300236; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:58:35 -0500 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 20:00:27 -0500 From: Michael Vanecek Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <390F7A2B.8FB4F6DF@mjv.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <20000502221914.127.qmail@nwcst286.netaddress.usa.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hmm, if it's effective enough and passes tests by insurance companies, discounts on insurance would definately make the $500 or so deluxe security device worth it. Now let's come out with three or four competing versions to push the level of quality and functionality and then get together on a set of standards for device communications like the big boys supposedly do... :) Or perhaps one with modules that will allow for disabling electronics (dangerous unless the device can determine that the wheels are no longer rotating indicating that the car had stopped), one that will trigger the horn and flash the lights (Look, I'm a stolen car!), maybe one that will allow voice communication with the thief (makem mess their pants). Yeah, we could run with this and come up with a lot of neat things (KSSD - Kitchen Sink Security Device)... Mike Jamie wrote: > > How about the Garmin > 25LP. I recall seeing this for about US$130 somewhere on the web, so its > a bit cheaper. They have a copule of href="http://www.garmin.com/oem/">other models too, like one in a black > case with a long DB9 serial cable and a power cable to plug into a car > cigarette lighter (US$195 I think). > > Here's my idea (maybe it should go into the ideas page): > A LART based Lojack device using > - A LART > - GPS > - one of those really cheap CCD cameras with a pinhole lens > - a celular phone > - some means of determining the car has been broken into > > The idea being that when the car is stolen the LART calls you with its > location, and a picture of the person driving. Or you can ring it at any time > to see where your car is. > > Not a cheap idea, but if you did it right it could be relatively inexpensive > (for what you get). > > Jamie > > -- > Jamie > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:24:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32279 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:24:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32275 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:24:47 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTY007OCML3U9@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:24:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 03 May 2000 11:20:32 +1000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:20:12 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: <390F7A2B.8FB4F6DF@mjv.com> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: "utility account for group.pleb " Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Question: Does GPS work underwater? And does anyone know how accurate it is in Australia? Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:33:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32305 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:33:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32301 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:33:22 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTY0082ZMZHKR@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:33:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 03 May 2000 11:33:07 +1000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:33:07 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Nicolas Pitre Cc: Erik Mouw , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 2 May 2000, Nicolas Pitre wrote: > > I looked at doing that some time ago, however I found it less suited to > the Linux architecture. In some cases it would even be a loss because of > Linux's wide address space for user processes, shared libraries, etc. > > I wrote some notes to Adam at the time but I don't remember most of them > ATM. Ok to answer all questions here. 1 only the theory and implimentation design have been done and they are for my L4 style kernel. I never looked at linux directly. We were going to do an L4Linux port and try and make it faster then native linux on ARM but using a Position Indipendent Code and using some Single Address Space techniques but we haven't had the man power to do that yet and I've been too busy to finish my kernel. As for directly changing native linux the same thing could be done but it would require a lot of work I imagine to redesign most of the VM internals etc. Since I'm not familiar with them I can't say how practical that is. A few more idea's have floated around on our work (since the work I did has application to some of our SASOS research and we want to apply it to StrongARM and IA-64) but no ones working on it. I'd be happy to share the ideas and get some cooprative work going if anyones interested (it might even get me back onto my kernel). In general peoples misconceptions about microkernels have inhibited people from showing any interest in L4 and L4Linux in general. If we could get L4Linux/ARM running context switches faster then Linux/ARM that might attract attention but it requires a small team which I don't have. I'm fairly convinced it can be done though with the StrongARM's and even better with the ARM9's. Cheers Adam > > > On Tue, 2 May 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > > > Hehehe, no I haven't. It actually part of a new thesis topic we > > are offering. I'd love to get back to working on my kernel but I haven't > > had the time. I'm more then happy to assist anyone interested in > > implimenting it though. One person was doing it but then changed jobs :( > > Alternatively I might get it done sometime real soon now (TM). > > > > Cheers Adam > > > > On Tue, 2 May -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 02 May 2000 16:57:14 +1000 (EST), Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > > > > On Mon, 1 May 2000, Barry Callahan wrote: > > > >> And, in case you're interested, the ARM10 Thumb processors still in > > > > development > > > >> are expected to be 400 MIPS +. A 200MHz Pentium-Pro Dhrystones at ~400 MIPS. > > > > > > > > Don't forget CISC MIPS are more significant then RISC MIPS that is > > > > a RISC vs CISC issue. Mind you I'm not sure how dhrystones are qualified. > > > > Also there is the issue that SA's have very pore address space context > > > > switch times. > > > > > > Did you ever implement your fast context switch paper for Linux? > > > > > > > > > Erik > > > > > > -- > > > In theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they > > > are different -- Larry McVoy > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:46:58 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32348 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:46:58 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32344 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:46:57 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTY00825NM4S1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:46:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 03 May 2000 11:46:49 +1000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:46:49 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: Some clarity on if this could be done (fwd) In-reply-to: <200005020938.LAA29463@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Erik Mouw Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Tue, 2 May -1, Erik Mouw wrote: > How far did he get? JDB and I have been talking about doing fancy clone() > things to get the same memory mapping for all processes and so bring down > the context switch time, but IMHO this is not The Right Thing [tm]. Do you > have an estimate on the implementation time of your hack^H^H^H^Hidea? > 6-9 man months to do the micro-kernel and port linux ontop of it. Thats a big quess. To do the microkernel stuff shouldn't take too long but coding 100% asm isn't fast and people tend not to want to get there hands dirty with it ;) We are toying with the idea of a mixed C/ASM kernel but we don't have the proper tools to interface C/ASM fast (since the C calling standard puts a lot of overhead with stack/register rearrangment of arguments/resutls) I was going to design some but its at the bottom of my TODO list ;) > > Erik > > PS: Could you post the URL of you paper on this list? I think lots of > people don't know what we're talking about... > The best source is my thesis extends the paper and you can focus on the relavent bits (ftp://ftp.cse.unsw.edu.au/users/awiggins/thesis.ps) or you can get the ACAC paper from (http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~disy/papers/index.html) its the one at the top on Fast Address Space Switching on the SA1100. Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:50:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32367 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32363 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:22 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTY0084KNRTS1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:20 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 03 May 2000 11:49:09 +1000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:49:09 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: <200005030143.LAA16149@xevious.dstc.monash.edu.au> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: davida@pobox.com Cc: "utility account for group.pleb " , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 3 May 2000, david wrote: > -->"Adam" == Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins writes: > > Adam> Does GPS work underwater? > > i don't think so. you need to get the satellite signal. Someone mentioned it worked underground so I was wondering if the signal can penetrate water and to what depth. It would be nice for diving navigation ;) Dave wants to use a PLEB for a rebreather computer so why not navigation too... Cheers Adam > > Adam> And does anyone know how accurate it is in Australia? > > since yesterday, it should have become a whole lot better (they are > reported to have turned the scrambling off finally!) > > so it's as accurate here as anywhere. i don't know of any radio > beacons for the differential stuff, but then i don't know much about > it in general ;-) Which is? Cheers Adam -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 03:50:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA32382 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:50 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA32378 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:49 +0200 Received: from xevious.dstc.monash.edu.au (xevious.dstc.monash.edu.au [130.194.228.7]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTY0083KNSKRN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 03:50:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from dstc.monash.edu.au (ladybug.dstc.monash.edu.au [130.194.228.78]) by xevious.dstc.monash.edu.au (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA16149; Wed, 03 May 2000 11:43:13 +1000 (EST) X-URL: Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:43:13 +1000 From: david X-Face: 2#;/avfeVL:b To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Cc: "utility account for group.pleb " , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: davida@pobox.com Message-id: <200005030143.LAA16149@xevious.dstc.monash.edu.au> X-Attribution: davida X-Files: wednesday, 8:30pm Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk -->"Adam" == Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins writes: Adam> Does GPS work underwater? i don't think so. you need to get the satellite signal. Adam> And does anyone know how accurate it is in Australia? since yesterday, it should have become a whole lot better (they are reported to have turned the scrambling off finally!) so it's as accurate here as anywhere. i don't know of any radio beacons for the differential stuff, but then i don't know much about it in general ;-) d -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 04:13:23 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA32473 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:13:23 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA32469 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:13:22 +0200 Received: from reflect.newenterprises.com (newenterprises.com [207.155.90.15]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTY0095POU71C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:13:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (gduncan@localhost) by reflect.newenterprises.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id e431VaD30410; Tue, 02 May 2000 18:31:36 -0700 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:31:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Glen Duncan Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Cc: "utility account for group.pleb " , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 3 May 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > Question: Does GPS work underwater? Not at all. Radio at these wavelengths are absorbed by water. > And does anyone know how accurate it is in Australia? For a device, GPS should have about the same accuracy world wide. Glen -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 04:29:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA32525 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:29:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA32521 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:29:19 +0200 Received: from neptune.simtax.ca (edtn004343.hs.telusplanet.net [161.184.153.25]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTY0098LPKQ1C@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 04:29:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (dsimader@localhost) by neptune.simtax.ca (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA01829 for ; Tue, 02 May 2000 20:28:32 -0600 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 20:28:31 -0600 (MDT) From: D Simader Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: <390F7A2B.8FB4F6DF@mjv.com> X-Sender: dsimader@neptune.simtax.ca To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk A company in Quebec, Canada (Ralph's Auto ???) builds a car tracker which works with a cell phone. Insurance companies I believe give a 15% discount in Quebec if you have a tracker installed. One problem with GPS, I have been told, is that you cannot detect a signal if you park in a tunnel or parkgarage. The company had their first unit based on GPS technology as well. However, they switch to cell phones when they found out that a block of concrete is pretty safe to hide under. kind regards, Dieter Simader DWS Systems Inc. kind regards, Dieter Simader DWS Systems Inc. On Tue, 2 May 2000, Michael Vanecek wrote: > Hmm, if it's effective enough and passes tests by insurance companies, > discounts on insurance would definately make the $500 or so deluxe > security device worth it. Now let's come out with three or four > competing versions to push the level of quality and functionality and > then get together on a set of standards for device communications like > the big boys supposedly do... :) Or perhaps one with modules that will > allow for disabling electronics (dangerous unless the device can > determine that the wheels are no longer rotating indicating that the car > had stopped), one that will trigger the horn and flash the lights (Look, > I'm a stolen car!), maybe one that will allow voice communication with > the thief (makem mess their pants). Yeah, we could run with this and > come up with a lot of neat things (KSSD - Kitchen Sink Security > Device)... > > Mike -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 06:00:04 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA32659 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 06:00:04 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA32655 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 06:00:04 +0200 Received: from calvino.alaska.net (calvino.alaska.net [209.112.129.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTY00A1ATS1N1@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 06:00:02 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rus@localhost) by calvino.alaska.net (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA26760; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:52:09 -0800 (AKDT) Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 19:52:09 -0800 (AKDT) From: ":-)" Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: X-Sender: rus@calvino To: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: calvino.alaska.net: rus owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 3 May 2000, Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins wrote: > Question: Does GPS work underwater? And does anyone know how > accurate it is in Australia? Nope. Just as accurate as anywhere else and now it's even better because they turned off selective availability. Russ Pagenkopf -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 07:23:32 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA00045 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 07:23:32 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA00041 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 07:23:31 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTY00B8EXN4V5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 07:23:30 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.131) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Tue, 02 May 2000 22:13:54 -0700 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 22:13:50 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: re GPS X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000502220253.00b963c0@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Sorry for the size, but I think you will find it interesting if you are >interested in GPS. (s) Derek >All, > >I wrote a special version of Tac32Plus yesterday specifically to capture >this event. The receiver used in this test was a Motorola >M12 Version 1.3. > >The following data is extracted from a log that stores every significant >change in satellite status (NOT Azimuth, Elevation, SNR). >Because of this most of the entries show the events during signal >acquisition and loss of signal. Once the satellite is being >tracked only the occasional parity error is logged. EXCEPT for the change >in SA state around 08:00 UTC! > >The following data is from a two hour period from 07:00 UTC to 09:00 >UTC. At 07:59:50 things begin to happen all at once. > >Rick WB2TNL >============= >36648.291285 (Tue May 02, 2000 06:59:27 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.292373 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:01:01 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 0, Available >36648.292419 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:01:05 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.292593 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:01:20 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 0, Available >36648.292616 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:01:22 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.292628 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:01:23 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 71, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.294237 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:03:42 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 69, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.294260 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:03:44 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 69, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.294341 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:03:51 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 69, >SNR 21, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.294399 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:03:56 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 69, >SNR 19, AS, SA >36648.296829 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:07:26 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 10, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.296841 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:07:27 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Available >36648.296852 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:07:28 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.296875 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:07:30 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.297373 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:13 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 18, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.297419 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:17 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 18, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.297454 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:20 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.297466 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:21 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.297477 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:22 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 19, Azm 127, >SNR 22, AS, SA >36648.297709 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:42 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 10, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.297744 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:45 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 9, AS, SA >36648.297767 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:47 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.297813 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:08:51 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 11, AS, SA >36648.298033 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:10 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 10, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.298044 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:11 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 0, Available >36648.298102 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:16 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.298149 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:20 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.298207 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:25 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 0, Available >36648.298218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:26 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.298241 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:09:28 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 67, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.298785 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:10:15 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 66, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.298820 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:10:18 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 66, >SNR 15, AS, SA >36648.299028 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:10:36 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 66, >SNR 0, Available >36648.299040 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:10:37 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 66, >SNR 11, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.299075 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:10:40 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 66, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.300753 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:13:05 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 9, Azm 43, >SNR 14, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.300788 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:13:08 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 9, Azm 43, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.306586 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:21:29 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.306609 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:21:31 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 0, Available >36648.306644 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:21:34 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 61, >SNR 11, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.306644 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:21:34 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.306679 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:21:37 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 61, >SNR 13, AS, SA >36648.306980 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:22:03 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.307385 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:22:38 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.307431 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:22:42 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.307477 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:22:46 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.307489 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:22:47 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 13, Azm 131, >SNR 13, AS, SA >36648.308102 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:23:40 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 5, Azm 43, >SNR 14, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.308137 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:23:43 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 5, Azm 44, >SNR 13, AS, SA >36648.308183 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:23:47 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 5, Azm 44, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.308218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:23:50 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 5, Azm 44, >SNR 0, Available >36648.308264 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:23:54 UTC) Sat PRN 30, El 5, Azm 44, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.308345 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:24:01 UTC) Sat PRN 30 no longer in use >36648.309630 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:25:52 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 59, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.309711 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:25:59 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 20, Azm 59, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.310406 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:26:59 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 11, Azm 132, >SNR 0, Available >36648.310440 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:27:02 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 11, Azm 132, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.313855 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:31:57 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 9, Azm 133, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.313901 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:32:01 UTC) Sat PRN 29, El 9, Azm 133, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.315521 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:34:21 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.315568 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:34:25 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.315602 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:34:28 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.315649 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:34:32 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Ephemeris Acquire >36648.315950 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:34:58 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.315984 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:35:01 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 9, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.317605 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:21 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.317651 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:25 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.317744 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:33 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.317790 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:37 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.318010 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:56 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.318021 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:37:57 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.318079 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:38:02 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 10, Azm 169, >SNR 0, Ephemeris Acquire >36648.318426 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:38:32 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 11, Azm 169, >SNR 19, AS, SA >36648.318982 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:39:20 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 19, Azm 54, >SNR 0, Available >36648.318994 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:39:21 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 19, Azm 54, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.319028 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:39:24 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 19, Azm 54, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.319503 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:40:05 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 19, Azm 53, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.319514 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:40:06 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 19, Azm 53, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.322547 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:44:28 UTC) Sat PRN 29 no longer in use >36648.323276 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:45:31 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 13, Azm 167, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.323311 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:45:34 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 13, Azm 167, >SNR 13, AS, SA >36648.323658 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:46:04 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 13, Azm 167, >SNR 0, Available >36648.323785 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:46:15 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 14, Azm 167, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.325625 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:48:54 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.325811 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:49:10 UTC) Sat PRN 19 no longer in use >36648.325973 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:49:24 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.326100 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:49:35 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 15, Azm 167, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.326146 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:49:39 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 15, Azm 167, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.326713 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:50:28 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 49, >SNR 14, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.326783 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:50:34 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 49, >SNR 15, AS, SA >36648.327686 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:51:52 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.327732 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:51:56 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.327767 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:51:59 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.327813 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:52:03 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.328079 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:52:26 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 0, Available >36648.328149 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:52:32 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.328160 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:52:33 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.328739 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:23 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.328762 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:25 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.328774 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:26 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.328785 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:27 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.328797 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:28 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 20, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.328843 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:32 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Available >36648.328843 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:32 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 17, Azm 48, >SNR 19, AS, SA >36648.328855 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:53:33 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 16, Azm 166, >SNR 17, AS, SA >36648.330718 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:56:14 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 17, Azm 166, >SNR 11, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.330741 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:56:16 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 17, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Available >36648.330764 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:56:18 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 17, Azm 166, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.330788 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:56:20 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 17, Azm 166, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.331540 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:57:25 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 47, >SNR 11, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.331563 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:57:27 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 47, >SNR 0, Available >36648.331575 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:57:28 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 47, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.331598 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:57:30 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 47, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.332153 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:18 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 46, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.332200 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:22 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 16, Azm 46, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.332281 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:29 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 13, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.332315 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:32 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 12, AS, SA >36648.332338 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:34 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 11, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.332373 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:37 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 10, AS, SA >36648.332385 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:38 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.332454 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:44 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 10, AS, SA >36648.332500 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:48 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 12, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.332535 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:58:51 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 18, Azm 165, >SNR 14, AS, SA >36648.332906 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:23 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >*** >*** THIS IS IT!! - Sats 1,3,16,22,25 switch all at once. >*** >36648.333218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 1, El 41, Azm 312, >SNR 25, AS >36648.333218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 19, Azm 165, >SNR 20, AS >36648.333218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 28, Azm 294, >SNR 22, AS >36648.333218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 22, El 79, Azm 223, >SNR 29, AS >36648.333218 (Tue May 02, 2000 07:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 25, El 46, Azm 72, >SNR 30, AS >*** Acqusition of Sat 6 - NO SA! >36648.333750 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:36 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 46, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.333774 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:38 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.333797 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:40 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.333832 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:43 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 11, AS, SA >36648.333855 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:45 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 18, AS, SA, Parity Error >36648.333913 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:00:50 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 18, AS >36648.334364 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:01:29 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 13, AS, Parity Error >36648.334422 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:01:34 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 45, >SNR 14, AS >*** >*** Acqusition of Sats 18 and 19 - takes a while before we get a good signal >*** (see 08:05:08 and 08:06:08) but when we do there is NO SA! >*** >36648.334723 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:00 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.334769 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:04 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.334792 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:06 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.334838 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:10 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.335047 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:28 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.335093 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:32 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 8, Azm 281, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.335301 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:50 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 315, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.335348 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:02:54 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.335533 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:03:10 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.335579 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:03:14 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.335625 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:03:18 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.335672 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:03:22 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 315, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.336169 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:05 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.336216 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:09 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.336239 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:11 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 11, AS, Parity Error >36648.336239 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:11 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.336274 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:14 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 14, AS >36648.336285 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:15 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 6, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.336343 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:20 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 10, AS, Parity Error >36648.336355 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:21 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 12, AS, Parity Error >36648.336366 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:22 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 11, AS >36648.336389 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:24 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 10, AS >36648.336401 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:25 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 11, AS, Parity Error >36648.336424 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:27 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Available >36648.336436 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:28 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.336459 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:30 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 13, AS, Parity Error >36648.336470 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:31 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.336470 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:31 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.336505 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:34 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 15, Azm 44, >SNR 17, AS >36648.336517 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:35 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 7, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.336517 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:35 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.336551 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:38 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 7, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.336621 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:04:44 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 7, Azm 316, >SNR 0, Ephemeris Acquire >36648.336899 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:08 UTC) Sat PRN 18, El 7, Azm 316, >SNR 19, AS >36648.337234 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:37 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.337281 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:41 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.337292 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:42 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.337338 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:46 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.337385 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:50 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 0, Ephemeris Acquire >36648.337419 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:53 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.337431 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:05:54 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 16, AS >36648.337593 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:06:08 UTC) Sat PRN 19, El 9, Azm 282, >SNR 19, AS >36648.337628 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:06:11 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 11, AS, Parity Error >36648.337663 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:06:14 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 13, AS >36648.337755 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:06:22 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 13, AS, Parity Error >36648.337790 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:06:25 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 21, Azm 164, >SNR 14, AS >36648.339491 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:08:52 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 22, Azm 163, >SNR 9, AS, Parity Error >36648.339538 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:08:56 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 164, >SNR 11, AS >36648.339549 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:08:57 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 164, >SNR 10, AS, Parity Error >36648.339561 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:08:58 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 164, >SNR 11, AS >36648.339584 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:00 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 164, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.339607 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:02 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 164, >SNR 12, AS >36648.339908 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:28 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 10, AS, Parity Error >36648.339989 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:35 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 14, AS >36648.340128 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:47 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 11, AS, Parity Error >36648.340163 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:50 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 0, Available >36648.340186 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:52 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.340197 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:09:53 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 23, Azm 163, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.341841 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:12:15 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 24, Azm 163, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.341852 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:12:16 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 24, Azm 163, >SNR 17, AS >36648.343669 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:14:53 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 13, AS, Parity Error >36648.343704 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:14:56 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 16, AS >36648.343785 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:15:03 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 0, Available >36648.343808 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:15:05 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.344457 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:16:01 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.344503 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:16:05 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 25, Azm 162, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.344549 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:16:09 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 26, Azm 162, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.344584 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:16:12 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 26, Azm 162, >SNR 19, AS >36648.352836 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:28:05 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 9, Azm 37, SNR >0, Available >36648.352859 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:28:07 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 9, Azm 37, SNR >11, AS, Parity Error >36648.352871 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:28:08 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 9, Azm 37, SNR >13, AS >36648.353392 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:28:53 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.354318 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:30:13 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 5, Azm 186, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.354364 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:30:17 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 5, Azm 186, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.360394 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:38:58 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.360417 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:39:00 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.360440 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:39:02 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 0, Ephemeris Acquire >36648.360788 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:39:32 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 20, AS >36648.361737 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:40:54 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 11, AS, Parity Error >36648.361760 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:40:56 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 9, AS >36648.361771 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:40:57 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 9, AS, Parity Error >36648.361783 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:40:58 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.361864 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:41:05 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 9, Azm 185, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.362119 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:41:27 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >12, AS, Parity Error >36648.362142 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:41:29 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Available >36648.362176 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:41:32 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.362489 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:41:59 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.362535 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:03 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.362582 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:07 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.362628 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:11 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.362732 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:20 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.362778 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:24 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.362859 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:31 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.362906 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:35 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.363033 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:46 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.363079 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:50 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.363149 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:42:56 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.363195 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:00 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.363241 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:04 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Freq Acquire >36648.363288 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:08 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 5, Azm 34, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.363345 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:13 UTC) Sat PRN 6 no longer in use >36648.363507 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:27 UTC) Sat PRN 6, El 0, Azm 0, SNR >0, Code Search >36648.363693 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:43:43 UTC) Sat PRN 6 no longer in use >36648.365556 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:46:24 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.365602 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:46:28 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.365845 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:46:49 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.365892 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:46:53 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.365996 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:02 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.366054 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:07 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.366193 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:19 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.366250 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:24 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.366297 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:28 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.366343 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:47:32 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 12, Azm 184, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.367720 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:31 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 0, Available >36648.367732 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:32 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.367744 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:33 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.367790 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:37 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.367801 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:38 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 23, AS >36648.367813 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:39 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 23, AS, Parity Error >36648.367836 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:41 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 269, >SNR 23, AS >36648.367952 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:51 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 0, Available >36648.367998 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:55 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 14, AS, Parity Error >36648.368033 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:49:58 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 16, AS >36648.368207 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:50:13 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 10, AS, Parity Error >36648.368230 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:50:15 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.368264 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:50:18 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.368334 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:50:24 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.368380 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:50:28 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 40, Azm 155, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.368982 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:20 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.369028 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:24 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.369086 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:29 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.369121 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:32 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 12, AS >36648.369156 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:35 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 21, AS, Parity Error >36648.369202 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:51:39 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 41, Azm 154, >SNR 23, AS >36648.370707 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:49 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Available >36648.370718 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:50 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.370730 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:51 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.370776 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:55 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.370788 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:56 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 25, AS, Parity Error >36648.370811 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:53:58 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 25, Azm 267, >SNR 26, AS >36648.371748 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:19 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Available >36648.371760 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:20 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.371771 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:21 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.371818 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:25 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 267, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.371829 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:26 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 266, >SNR 25, AS, Parity Error >36648.371852 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:55:28 UTC) Sat PRN 16, El 24, Azm 266, >SNR 24, AS >36648.374144 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:58:46 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 10, AS, Parity Error >36648.374156 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:58:47 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 10, AS >36648.374179 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:58:49 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.374190 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:58:50 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 0, Available >36648.374202 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:58:51 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 14, AS >36648.374746 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:38 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 17, Azm 183, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.374757 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:39 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 12, AS, Parity Error >36648.374757 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:39 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 17, Azm 183, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.374769 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:40 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 0, Message Sync Detect >36648.374792 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:42 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 44, Azm 152, >SNR 0, Code Search >36648.374885 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:50 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 17, Azm 183, >SNR 0, Available >36648.374896 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:51 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 17, Azm 183, >SNR 19, AS, Parity Error >36648.374908 (Tue May 02, 2000 08:59:52 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 17, Azm 183, >SNR 18, AS >36648.375105 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:00:09 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 45, Azm 152, >SNR 0, Freq Acquire >36648.375116 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:00:10 UTC) Sat PRN 3, El 45, Azm 152, >SNR 17, AS >36648.376447 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:02:05 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 18, Azm 183, >SNR 14, AS, Parity Error >36648.376505 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:02:10 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 18, Azm 183, >SNR 14, AS >36648.376517 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:02:11 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 18, Azm 183, >SNR 12, AS, Parity Error >36648.376551 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:02:14 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 18, Azm 183, >SNR 14, AS >36648.376725 (Tue May 02, 2000 09:02:29 UTC) Sat PRN 31, El 18, Azm 183, >SNR 0, Available >==================== -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 09:02:46 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00369 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:02:46 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00365 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:02:46 +0200 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTZ00EFN28KK8@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:02:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p2cl.demon.co.uk ([158.152.36.58]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12mt8n-000OPn-0A for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 03 May 2000 07:00:14 +0000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 07:34:05 +0100 From: Steve Goodwin Subject: UK request for assembled was... a small proposal, status (sadly) To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 4.01 <+V8CyJFTKg8YY90U9L23ssZ5tx> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk To all... It's become impossible to promise any activity on this from me for the foreseeable future, despite the fact that that I'm still personally interested. Sorry... As promised, here are all the names I could find who expressed interest in the European situation. I believe I have all the Reply To addresses correct. Please excuse me if I have made a mistake I am sorry I haven't listed all the desires. If anyone wants to look at the whole, I'll e-mail all the relevant messages directly. At least one may be duplicates of messages sent "across the pond" please e-mail steve.lart@p2cl.demon.co.uk on this subject. Raphael Gray Toby Jaffey Fredrik Rothamel patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be Tim Morley Rodney Arne Karlsen Steve Wiseman Jurgen Kramer David Belius gary.sims@barco.com Martin Oldfield **** not sure about this address *** Richard H Cole Regards -- Steve Goodwin ******************************************************************** Any opinions, express or implied, presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of P2 Controllers Ltd. ******************************************************************** -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 09:17:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00434 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:17:51 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00430 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:17:51 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTZ00FFQ2XN6D@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:17:50 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:14:16 +1000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 17:14:15 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Photon kits In-reply-to: X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Cc: "utility account for group.pleb " Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Ok this is just a non-commital question. Since I'm having problems making and distributing PLEB Photon board how many people would be interested in buying Photons as kits (PCB + Part, maybe just the hard to get parts at that. The rest to get through farnell, etc.) or buying parts from us? I will probably do a stock take soon to see what parts we actually have and how much they are worth. I'll still be making a few Photons assembled for those who've already put down for them and making the boards isn't for the fait at heart. Cheers Adam P.S. as this is just a query of interest please just mail me personally don't cc to either list. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 09:25:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00468 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:25:13 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00464 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:25:12 +0200 Received: from musse.tninet.se (musse.tninet.se [195.100.94.12]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTZ00G4139U7S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:25:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 22526 invoked from network); Wed, 03 May 2000 09:22:06 +0200 Received: from sheridan.tninet.se (HELO algonet.se) (195.100.94.102) by musse.tninet.se with SMTP; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:22:06 +0200 Received: from aristotle.algonet.se (aristotle.algonet.se [194.213.74.200]) by algonet.se (BLUETAIL Mail Robustifier 2.0.2) with ESMTP id sheridan-s1-957.338526.215792 ; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:22:06 +0200 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:22:06 +0200 (MET DST) From: Yann Vernier Subject: Re: UK request for assembled was... a small proposal, status (sadly) In-reply-to: To: Linux Advanced Radio Terminal Cc: steve.lart@p2cl.demon.co.uk Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I'm also interested in LARTs here in europe. On Wed, 3 May 2000, Steve Goodwin wrote: > As promised, here are all the names I could find who expressed interest > in the European situation. > > please e-mail steve.lart@p2cl.demon.co.uk on this subject. > Yann Vernier > Raphael Gray > Toby Jaffey > Fredrik Rothamel > patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be > Tim Morley > Rodney Arne Karlsen > Steve Wiseman > Jurgen Kramer > David Belius > gary.sims@barco.com > Martin Oldfield **** not sure about this address *** > Richard H Cole -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 09:31:16 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00502 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:31:16 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00498 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:31:15 +0200 Received: from jhcloos.com (austin.jhcloos.com [206.224.83.202]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTZ00GBG3K17S@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:31:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from cloos@localhost) by jhcloos.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA18146; Wed, 03 May 2000 02:30:55 -0500 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 02:30:55 -0500 From: "James H. Cloos Jr." Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] In-reply-to: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins"'s message of "Wed, 3 May 2000 11:49:09 +1000 (EST)" To: "utility account for group.pleb " Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Lines: 25 References: X-Authentication-warning: austin.jhcloos.com: cloos set sender to cloos@jhcloos.com using -f Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Adam" == Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins writes: Adam> Someone mentioned it worked underground so I was wondering if Adam> the signal can penetrate water and to what depth. It would be Adam> nice for diving navigation ;) Dave wants to use a PLEB for a Adam> rebreather computer so why not navigation too... IIRC, the signals are such that they penetrate a few feet of sea water. (The band is OTOO 1.5 GHz.) Usual suspect is a towed buoy w/ an antenna. But see . They have some interesting ideas. (And patents, ....) Also give: a look. -JimC -- James H. Cloos, Jr. 1024D/ED7DAEA6 E9E9 F828 61A4 6EA9 0F2B 63E7 997A 9F17 ED7D AEA6 Check out TGC: -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 11:14:54 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00724 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 11:14:54 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00720 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 11:14:53 +0200 Received: from meer.meer.net (meer.meer.net [140.174.164.2]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FTZ00LJ08CRZ3@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 11:14:52 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ix.netcom.com ([209.157.143.131]) by meer.meer.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/meer) with ESMTP id CAA4258734 for ; Wed, 03 May 2000 02:12:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 02:12:19 -0700 From: Greg Fountain Subject: LART PC Boards (International Orders via Credit Card) To: Lart Mail Server Reply-to: greg.fountain@telvex.com Message-id: <390FED73.FF389F70@ix.netcom.com> Organization: Telvex MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------08A42E0F116ECF015AF4E909" X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------08A42E0F116ECF015AF4E909 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, To make it a little easier to order LART PC Boards I've modified my order site (http://pweb.netcom.com/~sv_calif/ ) to accept credit cards from anywhere in the world and established a flat rate shipping fee. There were some problems for people in Europe with currency conversion and checks in US Dollars. I hope this solves the problem. Some of the feedback that I have received indicates that Parts Kits and assembled LARTs are also desired. I'll try and get to each of theses stages as time permits. Cheers, Greg Menlo Park, California USA --------------08A42E0F116ECF015AF4E909 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="sv_calif.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Greg Fountain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sv_calif.vcf" begin:vcard n:Fountain;Greg tel;fax:650-854-2465 tel;work:650-854-6626 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:www.telvex.com org:Telvex adr:;;;Menlo Park;California;94025;USA version:2.1 email;internet:greg.fountain@telvex.com end:vcard --------------08A42E0F116ECF015AF4E909-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 17:33:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01619 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:33:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01615 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:33:01 +0200 Received: from web801.mail.yahoo.com (web801.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.61]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTZ000QJPUZ5A@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:33:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 14751 invoked by uid 60001); Wed, 03 May 2000 15:30:39 +0000 Received: from [129.37.96.160] by web801.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 03 May 2000 08:30:39 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 08:30:39 -0700 (PDT) From: "John van V." Subject: Re: [GPS Simm....] To: Glen Duncan , "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Cc: "utility account for group.pleb " , lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: john@thinman.com Message-id: <20000503153039.14750.qmail@web801.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > > Question: Does GPS work underwater? > But does TCP/IP work underwater ?? No. You have to use UDP - under-water datagram protocol ===== John van Vlaanderen ############################################# # CXN, Inc. Contact: john@thinman.com # # # Proud Sponsor of Perl/Unix of NY # # http://puny.vm.com # ############################################# __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 17:31:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA01612 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:31:29 +0200 Received: from duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (duteinh.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.42.1]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA01608 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:31:27 +0200 Received: from dutein71 by duteinh.et.tudelft.nl (8.9.3/BB-2.0) id RAA08459; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:30:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <200005031530.RAA08459@duteinh.et.tudelft.nl> From: Erik Mouw To: sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Subject: Clock scaling patch Organization: Eric conspiracy secret labs Date: Wed May 03 17:30:08 +0200 (MDT) 2000 X-Face: "!Z|1XjFg!3Iw)BwM^M\k)J5KHiPddz}#/Zw%?$&Q!xqob"OA|})3_@&BTTiQERo?/^g[Z<9P4R8:5C:aqq.cw!hotLc=+u-"+1rq@9$V^8PbOUlodyi_sejt+D`iqkLpx$>.aXl%vnfPIt"LK|/%>94_Zrm8jy?`_[RKt'TuoxUxfk(gMhY(n|DBBl~c$dhO>G%6}R4+DGX3|idBm4oU&UM/XUP4I9aoN{]`ax%B?rgD(I3OJ<62Y6L X-Mailer: XCmail 1.0.1 - with PGP support, PGP engine version 0.5 (IRIX) X-Mailerorigin: http://www.fsai.fh-trier.de/~schmitzj/Xclasses/XCmail/ X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy! X-Loop: erik@it.et.tudelft.nl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I just released the clock scaling patch for the SA-1100 CPU. It works perfectly well on the LART, but it should work on any SA-1100 platform that uses 50ns EDO DRAM. I'm going to make it more generic, so it will run on other SA-1100 platforms as well. Have a look at: http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/lartware/port/ The C file contains lots of documentation about how it works. Enjoy, Erik PS: I take a couple of days of, I'll be back in the office at monday. Maybe I read my email, maybe not. -- J.A.K. (Erik) Mouw, Information and Communication Theory Group, Department of Electrical Engineering, Faculty of Information Technology and Systems, Delft University of Technology, PO BOX 5031, 2600 GA Delft, The Netherlands Phone: +31-15-2783635 Fax: +31-15-2781843 Email: J.A.K.Mouw@its.tudelft.nl WWW: http://www-ict.its.tudelft.nl/~erik/ -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 20:16:22 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA02298 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 20:16:22 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA02294 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 20:16:21 +0200 Received: from smtp.pandora.be (hercules.telenet-ops.be [195.130.132.33]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FTZ009GZXF8LE@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 20:16:21 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 16009 invoked from network); Wed, 03 May 2000 18:14:20 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pandora.be) ([213.224.21.16]) (envelope-sender ) by hercules.telenet-ops.be (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; Wed, 03 May 2000 18:14:20 +0000 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 20:10:48 +0200 From: PELGRIMS P Subject: JTAG interface with PC LPT-port or add in board? To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: patrick.pelgrims@pandora.be Message-id: <39106BA8.C84AD1A2@pandora.be> Organization: A MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Dear Sir, Is there anyone who has build a (GPL) PC-JTAG interface to program the LART flash memory or take control over the StrongArm. On the PLEB-site there is an ANVIL etc.. anouncement but is not yet available ! Since we have to use it only a few times (we hope) a prof. device is to expensive. Hoping to receive some positive reaction, I meanwhile remain, P. Pelgrims -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Wed May 3 21:36:11 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02539 for lart-outgoing; Wed, 3 May 2000 21:36:11 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02535 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 21:36:11 +0200 Received: from xanadu.vipswitch.com (generic199.197.205.205.in-addr.arpa [205.205.197.199]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU000CNR148G6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Wed, 3 May 2000 21:36:10 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 15:27:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: JTAG interface with PC LPT-port or add in board? In-reply-to: <39106BA8.C84AD1A2@pandora.be> To: PELGRIMS P Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Wed, 3 May 2000, PELGRIMS P wrote: > Dear Sir, > > Is there anyone who has build a (GPL) PC-JTAG interface to program the > LART flash memory or take control over the StrongArm. > On the PLEB-site there is an ANVIL etc.. anouncement but is not yet > available ! > Since we have to use it only a few times (we hope) a prof. device is to > expensive. > Hoping to receive some positive reaction, I meanwhile remain, Look at ftp://ftp.netwinder.org/users/n/nico/SA1110Jflash.tgz. This uses the SA1110 bindings though. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 04:40:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA03889 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 04:40:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA03885 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 04:40:44 +0200 Received: from note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU (note.orchestra.cse.unsw.EDU.AU [129.94.242.29]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FU0000JGKRSR2@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 04:40:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: From paulaner With LocalMail ; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:38:02 +1000 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 12:38:01 +1000 (EST) From: "Adam 'WeirdArms' Wiggins" Subject: Re: JTAG interface with PC LPT-port or add in board? In-reply-to: <39106BA8.C84AD1A2@pandora.be> X-Sender: awiggins@paulaner.disy.cse.unsw.EDU.AU To: PELGRIMS P Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have some starting code but not much. Also I believe someone ported the windows JTAG program for the assabet to linux. It may have been posted here I'll check. Cheers Adam P.S. the code I have is untested, if your interested in working on it I'm happy to give it to you to work on. On Wed, 3 May 2000, PELGRIMS P wrote: > Dear Sir, > > Is there anyone who has build a (GPL) PC-JTAG interface to program the > LART flash memory or take control over the StrongArm. > On the PLEB-site there is an ANVIL etc.. anouncement but is not yet > available ! > Since we have to use it only a few times (we hope) a prof. device is to > expensive. > Hoping to receive some positive reaction, I meanwhile remain, > > P. Pelgrims > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 10:49:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04739 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 10:49:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04735 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 10:49:27 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100D581UCN6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 10:49:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA11478; Thu, 04 May 2000 16:50:43 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA12604; Thu, 04 May 2000 16:42:07 +0800 (SGT) Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:42:56 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access To: arm , sa1100 , lart Message-id: <39113810.C4AA5C46@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, While trying to figure out how StrongARM behave on cross boundary access, I encounter the following error ( I have the kernel-mode alignment trap handler on and off with the same result). For comparisom, I have the same program compile at x86 platform. The arm result is very strange. The behavior is realy unacceptable. It should either return run time error or some software emulation should return the correct result? I am using kernel 2.3.99-pre6-rmk1-np1. The kernel-mode alignment trap handler suppose to be able to catch this and return the correct result, but it has no effect for this case. A kernel problem? A GCC problem? Any hints? ==== x86 kk's starting address: 0x0xbffff86c i's address for kk + 0: 0x0xbffff86c 3 5 6 t i's address for kk + 1: 0x0xbffff86d 5 6 t g i's address for kk + 2: 0x0xbffff86e 6 t g h i's address for kk + 3: 0x0xbffff86f t g h n i's address for kk + 4: 0x0xbffff870 g h n o i's address for kk + 5: 0x0xbffff871 h n o r i's address for kk + 6: 0x0xbffff872 n o r q i's address for kk + 7: 0x0xbffff873 o r q i i's address for kk + 8: 0x0xbffff874 r q i p === SA1100 kk's starting address: 0x0xbffffd8c i's address for kk + 0: 0x0xbffffd8c 3 5 6 t i's address for kk + 1: 0x0xbffffd8d 5 6 t 3 i's address for kk + 2: 0x0xbffffd8e 6 t 3 5 i's address for kk + 3: 0x0xbffffd8f t 3 5 6 i's address for kk + 4: 0x0xbffffd90 g h n o i's address for kk + 5: 0x0xbffffd91 h n o g i's address for kk + 6: 0x0xbffffd92 n o g h i's address for kk + 7: 0x0xbffffd93 o g h n i's address for kk + 8: 0x0xbffffd94 r q i p The source code for this program: ======================== #include int main(void) { char kk[12] = {'3', '5', '6', 't', 'g', 'h', 'n', 'o', 'r', 'q', 'i', 'p'}; int *i; int y, j; printf("kk's starting address: 0x%p\n", kk); for (j = 0; j < 9; ++j) { i = (int *)(kk + j); printf("i's address for kk + %d: 0x%p %c %c %c %c\n", j, i, (*i) & 0xFF, ((*i) >> 8) & 0xff, ((*i)>>16)&0xff, ((*i)>>24) & 0xff); } return 0; } -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 11:03:30 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA04806 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:03:30 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA04802 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:03:29 +0200 Received: from mail2.netcologne.de (mail2.netcologne.de [194.8.194.103]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100DNP2HTN6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:03:29 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from colin.anarcho.net (dial-194-8-209-198.netcologne.de [194.8.209.198]) by mail2.netcologne.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA10004; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:56:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from baer@localhost) by colin.anarcho.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA03047; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:57:30 +0200 X-URL: Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 10:57:29 +0200 From: Thomas Renard X-Face: 43Gd&$n()k_953x*S*S$KvhoZ5HRR+\?HpR1~dG@&6B[/EKmoE.5mYc3v#`Ahf[{ekw}SL9 g|pT#VQ8a.~3xURG\j?G@roW>lq*V323P[~3fZu6.~DxATbN&IGSABZ*aQ*:1XPF-i[m"h.z&S[k3J a[.Rfdjk9(?uQ$CQ=-& Subject: Re: LART power situation In-reply-to: David Poisson's message of "Mon, 01 May 2000 21:29:35 +0000 (GMT)" To: David Poisson Cc: lart Message-id: Organization: The Anarcho Net MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Gnus/5.070099 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.99) XEmacs/21.1 (Canyonlands) Lines: 25 References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk * David Poisson writes: > I was wondering what is the LART power situation ? Can you use > something other than batteries if it's available (like plug your > LART directly in a wall jack) > David Poisson > david@fish.ecks.org Hi there, I remember that on wear-hard@haven.org some link to ncr (or nec???) pointed to a page where special LiIon accumulators were shown. These things had the size of a credit card and 5mm thick and made about 1.5A/h-3A/h at 3V (??). These accus where made in a foil technique. I cannot find it in my archive of 1999/1998. Maybe some other can find it? These things are very good for the LART project. Thomas -- Thomas Renard Ich glaub, Atomstrom Thomas.Renard@smail.uni-koeln.de ist gelb -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 11:41:56 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA04933 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:41:56 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA04929 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:41:55 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100H7B49U1Y@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 11:41:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.110) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 04 May 2000 02:33:54 -0700 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 02:33:49 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: re: CDROM X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: jamilkhatib75@yahoo.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000504022939.00bc9100@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I am in southern California, USA. Zip code is 92551. I would be willing to reship, provided it doesn't cost me anything except time. That might work out well, sort of a GPL Amway? (just kidding!) Can you do Pay Pal or eGold? Or something else? Thanks... (s) Derek -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 12:33:15 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05071 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 12:33:15 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA05067 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 12:33:15 +0200 Received: from mail.clubnet.net (mail.on-location.net [206.126.129.120]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100L386ND91@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 12:33:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from djl_rfa_server (206.126.141.113) by mail.clubnet.net with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2.1); Thu, 04 May 2000 03:25:14 -0700 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 03:25:09 -0700 From: Derek Lassen Subject: RE: re: CDROM In-reply-to: <4.2.0.58.20000504022939.00bc9100@mail.clubnet.net> X-Sender: kn6td@mail.clubnet.net To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <4.2.0.58.20000504032431.00bedb30@mail.clubnet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Opps. Sorry. Wrong address. At 02:33 AM 5/4/00 -0700, you wrote: >I am in southern California, USA. Zip code is 92551. > >I would be willing to reship, provided it doesn't cost me anything except >time. >That might work out well, sort of a GPL Amway? (just kidding!) > >Can you do Pay Pal or eGold? Or something else? > >Thanks... >(s) Derek > > >-- >To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in >the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl >Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 14:53:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05502 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 14:53:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05498 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 14:53:19 +0200 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FU100B9YD4U9J@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 14:53:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 9463 invoked from network); Thu, 04 May 2000 12:49:17 +0000 Received: from useray09.uk.uudial.com (HELO opticalflowsrv1.ofs.co.uk) (62.188.139.99) by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:49:17 +0000 Received: by OPTICALFLOWSRV1 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2XBWLWJY>; Thu, 04 May 2000 13:41:23 +0100 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:41:23 +0100 From: Callum Gray Subject: LART for image acquisition To: "'lart@lart.tudelft.nl'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-type: text/plain Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have an application I am working on where I need a very low power consumption image processing system that will also have the capability of interfaceing to a frame grabber device. Searching yesterday I found a number of commercial PCI frame grabbers that have Linux drivers but it is not clear to me whether the LART could be used as the host for acquisition as well as processing. Please excuse me if this is a naive question I guess I am asking a broad question about how I might interface a pretty standard CCD camera to a LART I need enought band width to acquire at least 3 successive interlaced images. On my PC here its a doddle to buy a frame grabber and it is PC based systems I usually build but the system I am looking to build must work in remote locations and would need to be powered from a car battery with perhaps recharge from solar or wind power generator. Hope you can help me understand if this is possible or likely to be possible in the near - middle future. Thanks in anticipation. Callum Dr. Callum Gray Optical Flow Systems Ltd. The Bush Research Park Technopole Centre Bush Loan Edinburgh EH26 0PJ Tel +44 (0)131 475 7551 mob 07939178558 Fax +44 (0) 131 475 7566 http://www.ofs.co.uk http://www.ofs.co.uk/software -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 15:07:45 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA05573 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:07:45 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA05569 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:07:44 +0200 Received: from ns.kaybee.org (r70h102.res.gatech.edu [128.61.70.102]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100C39DSUUJ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:07:43 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (rob@localhost) by ns.kaybee.org (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06566; Thu, 04 May 2000 09:00:21 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:00:20 -0400 (EDT) From: rob Subject: Re: LART for image acquisition In-reply-to: To: Callum Gray Cc: "'lart@lart.tudelft.nl'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Thu, 4 May 2000, Callum Gray wrote: > I guess I am asking a broad question about how I might interface a pretty > standard CCD camera to a LART I need enought band width to acquire at least > 3 successive interlaced images. On my PC here its a doddle to buy a frame > grabber and it is PC based systems I usually build but the system I am > looking to build must work in remote locations and would need to be powered > from a car battery with perhaps recharge from solar or wind power generator. i've seen the winnov videum pcmcia framegrabber+camera card working on something called a skiff (which is a strong arm from CRL or WRL). once the lart has a pcmcia connector this shouldn't be hard to make work. rob ---- Rob Melby Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332 uucp: ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt4255a Internet: rob@kaybee.org, gt4255a@prism.gatech.edu -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 15:57:55 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA05733 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:57:55 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA05729 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:57:54 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (f47.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.241.47]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FU100GO5G4G9G@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:57:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 71181 invoked by uid 0); Thu, 04 May 2000 13:57:42 +0000 Received: from 206.167.109.2 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 04 May 2000 06:57:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 06:57:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Simon Labrecque Subject: FFTW library performance on the LART To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000504135742.71180.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed X-Originating-IP: [206.167.109.2] Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hey guys, I think the subject is self-explanatory :) Do any of you ever tested the FFTW (fftw.org) library with an ARM processor? How good it performs on it? Thanks. Simon ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 17:25:51 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA05971 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 17:25:51 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA05961; Thu, 4 May 2000 17:25:44 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000504135742.71180.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:14:14 +0200 To: Simon Labrecque From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: FFTW library performance on the LART Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 15:57 +0200 04-05-2000, Simon Labrecque wrote: >Hey guys, > > I think the subject is self-explanatory :) Do any of you ever tested the >FFTW (fftw.org) library with an ARM processor? How good it performs on it? >Thanks. FFTW is quite pointless on StrongARM, as it really wants an FPU. What do you want to do FFTs for; can't you work with fixed point ? JD "I'm baaaaaack" B. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 17:25:50 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA05968 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 17:25:50 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA05963; Thu, 4 May 2000 17:25:46 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:18:39 +0200 To: David Poisson From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: LART Bus ? Cc: lart Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 06:45 +0200 02-05-2000, David Poisson wrote: >Everyone is talking about a lot of products that would be nice to have in >a LART (mp3, ethernet, KSB, GPS,...). I was thinking, shouldn't someone do >a bus for LART ? Even if it's an ISA bus, it would leave some room if >someone want's to do their own GPS card, sound card or whatever. IMNSHO that's overkill for an embedded platform like LART. That kind of expandability is bad because it calls for compromises in terms of size, cost and power consumption. Having said that, the SA-1100 offers a PCMCIA bus which is quite close to ISA. In other words: you've got the source; if you want a bus go for it. JDB. -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 18:00:20 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06178 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:00:20 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06174 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:00:19 +0200 Received: from dotplanet.com ([209.144.132.197]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100369LSHHN@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:00:18 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LsustanoD2.SMSCORP.NET [209.211.240.254] by dotplanet.com (SMTPD32-6.00) id AE45B6A01BC; Thu, 04 May 2000 11:59:01 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 08:58:34 -0700 From: Leo Johan Susanto Subject: Re: CDROM To: Derek Lassen , jamilkhatib75@yahoo.com Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <005c01bfb5e1$9abb52e0$6a0918ac@SMSCORP.NET> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <4.2.0.58.20000504022939.00bc9100@mail.clubnet.net> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk something about CD ROM, the mailing list miss? ----- Original Message ----- From: Derek Lassen To: Cc: Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2000 2:33 AM Subject: re: CDROM > I am in southern California, USA. Zip code is 92551. > > I would be willing to reship, provided it doesn't cost me anything except time. > That might work out well, sort of a GPL Amway? (just kidding!) > > Can you do Pay Pal or eGold? Or something else? > > Thanks... > (s) Derek > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 18:03:01 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06201 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:03:01 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06196 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:03:00 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU1003BFLWYNZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:02:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id LAA24092; Thu, 04 May 2000 11:59:57 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA18730; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:04:19 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:04:19 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: LART Bus ? In-reply-to: X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Could you fit a GPS or a sound card on a PCMCIA card ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Thu, 4 May 2000, J.D. Bakker wrote: > At 06:45 +0200 02-05-2000, David Poisson wrote: > >Everyone is talking about a lot of products that would be nice to have in > >a LART (mp3, ethernet, KSB, GPS,...). I was thinking, shouldn't someone do > >a bus for LART ? Even if it's an ISA bus, it would leave some room if > >someone want's to do their own GPS card, sound card or whatever. > > IMNSHO that's overkill for an embedded platform like LART. That kind of > expandability is bad because it calls for compromises in terms of size, > cost and power consumption. > > Having said that, the SA-1100 offers a PCMCIA bus which is quite close to > ISA. In other words: you've got the source; if you want a bus go for it. > > JDB. > > -- > Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl > > The lazy man's proverb: > 'There's no business like slow business !' > > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 18:35:38 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06340 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:35:38 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06336 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:35:37 +0200 Received: from dotplanet.com ([209.144.132.197]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU1004NDNFBLU@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:35:36 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from LsustanoD2.SMSCORP.NET [209.211.240.254] by dotplanet.com (SMTPD32-6.00) id A66A32020104; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:33:46 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:33:20 -0700 From: Leo Johan Susanto To: David Poisson Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <017701bfb5e6$7581a740$6a0918ac@SMSCORP.NET> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0174_01BFB5AB.C8BE1A00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BFB5AB.C8BE1A00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable David, u could check the PCMCIA sound card on ebay. they have couples of choices. and i dont know about the GPS PCMCIA yet. but i am a ebay browser. ill post you if i've seen one do you know how many PCMCIA card we could attached together? what is the limitation? leo ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BFB5AB.C8BE1A00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

David, u could check the PCMCIA sound = card on=20 ebay.
they have couples of = choices.
 
and i dont know about the GPS PCMCIA=20 yet.
but i am a ebay browser. ill post you = if i've seen=20 one
 
do you know how many PCMCIA card we = could attached=20 together?
what is the limitation?
leo
------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BFB5AB.C8BE1A00-- -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 18:38:35 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06361 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:38:35 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06357 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:38:34 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU1005GENK6BQ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:38:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA24148; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:35:50 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA18969; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:40:11 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:40:11 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: your mail In-reply-to: <017701bfb5e6$7581a740$6a0918ac@SMSCORP.NET> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: Leo Johan Susanto Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I have no idea what the limitation of the PCMCIA bus is, never played with it. Anyone could answer that ? David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Thu, 4 May 2000, Leo Johan Susanto wrote: > David, u could check the PCMCIA sound card on ebay. > they have couples of choices. > > and i dont know about the GPS PCMCIA yet. > but i am a ebay browser. ill post you if i've seen one > > do you know how many PCMCIA card we could attached together? > what is the limitation? > leo > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 18:50:08 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06423 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:50:08 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06419 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:50:07 +0200 Received: from rjlsystems.com. (rjlsystems.com [209.125.213.150]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FU1006ETO3IJ5@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 18:50:07 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from bia.rjlsystems.com by rjlsystems.com. (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA14190; Thu, 04 May 2000 12:39:21 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 12:38:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Barry Callahan Subject: Re: LART Bus ? To: david@fish.ecks.org, lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: Barry Callahan Message-id: <"200005041639.MAA14190"@rjlsystems.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 CDE Version 1.3 SunOS 5.7 sun4u sparc Content-type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: wjIE6hCokBGt4xarjdz3/Q== Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk >Could you fit a GPS or a sound card on a PCMCIA card ? Yup, and they're not that expensive either. ~$60 for a pcmcia sound card ~160 for a pcmcia-interface gps go to www.shopper.com and search for 'pcmcia sound' and 'pcmcia gps' Barry -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 19:06:49 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA06485 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:06:49 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA06481 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:06:48 +0200 Received: from salisbury.labs.futuretv.com (salisbury.futuretv.com [194.216.164.17]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU10075EOV6C4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:06:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zebra.labs.futuretv.com ([192.168.32.2] ident=mail) by salisbury.labs.futuretv.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12nQ9E-0005Ap-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 04 May 2000 18:14:52 +0000 Received: from [192.168.33.3] (helo=fountain.labs.futuretv.com ident=mail) by zebra.labs.futuretv.com with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12nP4Z-0000Aq-00; Thu, 04 May 2000 18:05:59 +0100 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=fountain.labs.futuretv.com ident=pb) by fountain.labs.futuretv.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12nP4Y-0004N5-00; Thu, 04 May 2000 18:05:58 +0100 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 18:05:58 +0100 From: Philip Blundell Subject: Re: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access In-reply-to: Message from zhu qun ying "of Thu, 04 May 2000 16:42:56 +0800." <39113810.C4AA5C46@krdl.org.sg> To: zhu qun ying Cc: arm , sa1100 , lart Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 (debian) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: <39113810.C4AA5C46@krdl.org.sg> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk In message <39113810.C4AA5C46@krdl.org.sg>, zhu qun ying writes: >The arm result is very strange. The behavior is realy unacceptable. >It should either return run time error or some software emulation should >return the correct result? No, your program is in error. You can't cast a pointer of arbitrary alignment to some other type and expect it to work. If you play these sorts of games you need to know the limitations of the machine. >The kernel-mode alignment trap handler suppose to be able to catch this >and return the correct result, Only for code inside the kernel. If your program is in user context the trap handler will have no effect. p. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 19:43:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA06597 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:43:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA06593 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:43:35 +0200 Received: from hotmail.com (oe24.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.81]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with SMTP id <0FU10092TQKL3Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 19:43:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (qmail 83303 invoked by uid 65534); Thu, 04 May 2000 17:43:23 +0000 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:47:52 -0400 From: Agarwal Subject: Re: FFTW library performance on the LART To: "J.D. Bakker" Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <20000504174323.83302.qmail@hotmail.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Originating-IP: [24.200.14.94] References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk > At 15:57 +0200 04-05-2000, Simon Labrecque wrote: > >Hey guys, > > > > I think the subject is self-explanatory :) Do any of you ever tested the > >FFTW (fftw.org) library with an ARM processor? How good it performs on it? > >Thanks. > > FFTW is quite pointless on StrongARM, as it really wants an FPU. What do > you want to do FFTs for; can't you work with fixed point ? I sure *can* :) I want to do some animated eye candy visuals based on the sound being played. I've already done such a thing for x86, but the code need a major cleanup, and if I'd compile it for the LART just like it is right now I'd certainly get like 2-3 fps :) What I'd really need is a good FFT library that works with fixed point. It would not need to be *very* accurate as it's not for calculating very scientific stuff... > JD "I'm baaaaaack" B. And we're all happy about it :) Simon -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 20:14:17 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06685 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:14:17 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06681 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:14:16 +0200 Received: from core.federated.com (core.federated.com [199.217.175.51]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU1009KWRZQ3Q@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:14:15 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from jim@localhost) by core.federated.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) id NAA26296; Thu, 04 May 2000 13:09:49 -0500 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:09:49 -0500 (CDT) From: Jim Studt Subject: Re: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access In-reply-to: <39113810.C4AA5C46@krdl.org.sg> To: zhu qun ying Cc: arm , sa1100 , lart Message-id: <200005041809.NAA26296@core.federated.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL66 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Qun Ying wrote: > While trying to figure out how StrongARM behave on cross boundary access, I > encounter the following error ( I have the kernel-mode alignment trap handler on > and off with the same result). For comparisom, I have the same program compile > at x86 platform. > > The arm result is very strange. The behavior is realy unacceptable. It should > either return run time error or some software emulation should return the > correct result? I am using kernel 2.3.99-pre6-rmk1-np1. The kernel-mode > alignment trap handler suppose to be able to catch this and return the correct > result, but it has no effect for this case. > > A kernel problem? A GCC problem? Any hints? This is just the way ARMs work. Consult the documentation of the LDR instruction on page 36 (paper) 40 (PDF) of http://www.arm.com/Documentation/UserMans/PDF/ARM7vC.pdf It has a pretty diagram on the next couple of pages. In short you aren't allowed to read misaligned words, but if you do it has some useful quirks that might be helpful for unscrambling data. -- Jim Studt, President The Federated Software Group, Inc. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 20:28:13 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06792 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:28:13 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06788 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:28:12 +0200 Received: from sand4.global.net.uk (sand4.global.net.uk [195.147.246.106]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100A8SSMYE6@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:28:12 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from p52s04a02.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.148.83] helo=rentbert) by sand4.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12nQNV-0003DW-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:29:37 +0100 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:28:17 +0100 From: Raphael Gray Subject: PCMCIA Bus To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <007a01bfb607$4840dd20$5808fea9@rentbert> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Alot of people seem to think(i could be wrong though) that you have to use PCMCIA Devices with a PCMCIA Bus, the BUS can be used by any hardware you make, you simply need to design it with the Limitations of the PCMCIA Bus in mind. This means if you want GPS, you dont have to buy a great big PCMCIA GPS Card, you can simply buy an OEM GPS Reciever and connect it upto the PCMCIA Bus, although you will have to write your own driver for it, this will decrease size and also allow you to get the most out of the PCMCIA Bus. Offcourse you dont even have to put GPS on the PCMCIA Bus because their are OEM GPS Devices that only require a serial port, and the Lart has two IIRC. I hope this clears things up abit=) Another nice thing about designing your own hardware is that you can in most cases get it to run on less power than its "off-the-shelf" counter-part. Because manufacturers in most cases do not have this as their first concern. IMNSHO This is far better than simply buying an existing PCMCIA Device...but again i could be wrong. -Raphael -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 20:55:34 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06848 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:55:34 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06844 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:55:34 +0200 Received: from Argok.fish (modemcable049.49-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.49.49]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100C4FTWK1X@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 20:55:33 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from krynux.fish (krynux.fish [192.168.0.4]) by Argok.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA24401; Thu, 04 May 2000 14:54:13 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by krynux.fish (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA19178; Thu, 04 May 2000 14:58:37 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 18:58:37 +0000 (GMT) From: David Poisson Subject: Re: PCMCIA Bus In-reply-to: <007a01bfb607$4840dd20$5808fea9@rentbert> X-Sender: david@krynux.fish To: Raphael Gray Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk But having a PCMCIA slot would allow anyone to use any PCMCIA devices, which is pretty neat. I guess it all depends what you wanna do with your LART though. David Poisson david@fish.ecks.org On Thu, 4 May 2000, Raphael Gray wrote: > Alot of people seem to think(i could be wrong though) that you have to use > PCMCIA Devices with a PCMCIA Bus, the BUS can be used by any hardware you > make, you simply need to design it with the Limitations of the PCMCIA Bus in > mind. This means if you want GPS, you dont have to buy a great big PCMCIA > GPS Card, you can simply buy an OEM GPS Reciever and connect it upto the > PCMCIA Bus, although you will have to write your own driver for it, this > will decrease size and also allow you to get the most out of the PCMCIA Bus. > Offcourse you dont even have to put GPS on the PCMCIA Bus because their are > OEM GPS Devices that only require a serial port, and the Lart has two IIRC. > > I hope this clears things up abit=) > > Another nice thing about designing your own hardware is that you can in most > cases get it to run on less power than its "off-the-shelf" counter-part. > Because manufacturers in most cases do not have this as their first concern. > > IMNSHO This is far better than simply buying an existing PCMCIA Device...but > again i could be wrong. > > -Raphael > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 22:31:43 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07111 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 22:31:43 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07107 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 22:31:42 +0200 Received: from oracle.clara.net (oracle.clara.net [195.8.69.94]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU100FCWYCU6B@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 22:31:42 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from [195.8.76.145] (helo=clara.co.uk) by oracle.clara.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12nSGQ-0000UD-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:30:26 +0100 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:31:37 +0100 From: Andrew Ebling Subject: hand soldering LARTs To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3911DE29.3861D40A@clara.co.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14-15mdk i586) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi all, I note that Greg Fountain is now selling LART PCBs and was thinking about getting one to use in my final year university project. (I'm studying electronic engineering) Has anyone had any success hand soldering a LART together? I'd also be interested to know how long it takes people (in terms of hours on the job) to get from starting out with a bare PCB to a fully working and tested LART. I think LART is a supperb project, keep up the good work! BR, Andrew -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Thu May 4 23:16:36 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA07212 for lart-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 23:16:36 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA07208 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 23:16:35 +0200 Received: from ramone.wwonline.com (ramone.wwonline.com [209.82.60.3]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200GDM0FMOZ@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 4 May 2000 23:16:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from wwonline.com (dave@wrench.wwonline.com [209.82.62.59]) by ramone.wwonline.com (8.8.5/8.7.2) with ESMTP id RAA25444 for ; Thu, 04 May 2000 17:10:43 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 17:09:56 -0400 From: David Emmerson Subject: Re: LART hardware distribution version 0.95 (March 20, 2000) To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Message-id: <3911E724.3519A6EF@wwonline.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.5-15 i686) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Hi, I'm thinking about building an internet appliance, and LART looks like a great way to go. I've taken a look at the site and the mailing list archives, and it seems like there's a quad ethernet board for the KSB in the works, but I was unable to find the schematics for it. Are they available? Will they be in the (near) future? I'm actually only looking for two ethernet ports - am I correct in my assumption that it's a simple matter of only assembling the quad board with two chips, leaving the other two open? Thanks for the great work! Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 00:20:37 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA07418 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 00:20:37 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA07414 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 00:20:36 +0200 Received: from avalon.whirlygig.co.uk (avalon.whirlygig.co.uk [195.152.5.19]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200J6H3EBB4@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 00:20:35 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ankh-morpork.sj.co.uk ([195.152.5.194] helo=steves-house.org.uk) by avalon.whirlygig.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #2) id 12nTwb-0004cT-00 for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 04 May 2000 23:18:05 +0100 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:18:55 +0100 From: Steve Wiseman Subject: Re: hand soldering LARTs To: "lart@lart.tudelft.nl" Message-id: <3911F74F.F8DE60C5@steves-house.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en References: <3911DE29.3861D40A@clara.co.uk> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Andrew Ebling wrote: > > Hi all, > > I note that Greg Fountain is now selling LART PCBs and was thinking > about getting one to use in my final year university project. (I'm > studying electronic engineering) Yup- I've ordered a bunch. I could sell up to a couple in the UK- no profit, just 1/5 of the number that appears on my credit card bill + a stamp- save someone the postage. > Has anyone had any success hand soldering a LART together? I don't see any problems. I've soldered much more complex - I reckon that, including all the passives, which are what take the time, it'll be about 6 hours. Unless one of the other guys completes an LPT jtag burner, I may have to dig out my fpga-based one and rig it to use the flash used on Lart- shouldn't be too much work. > I think LART is a supperb project, keep up the good work! Oh yes. I've been looking at the rest of the project going on there- it all looks rather good, & LART's just a small part. Most impressive. Bah. SDRAM. Pain in the arse. Steve. -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 01:52:57 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA07784 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 01:52:57 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA07780 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 01:52:57 +0200 Received: from field.videotron.net (field.videotron.net [205.151.222.108]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200KM17O7QX@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 01:52:56 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from modemcable186.43-201-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net ([24.201.43.186]) by field.videotron.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8) with SMTP id <0FU2004EH7CPFD@field.videotron.net> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:46:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:00:08 -0400 From: Jean Ricard Subject: Re: PCMCIA Bus In-reply-to: <007a01bfb607$4840dd20$5808fea9@rentbert> To: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Reply-to: jean.ricard@videotron.ca Message-id: <00050420055400.21481@modemcable186.43-201-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit References: <007a01bfb607$4840dd20$5808fea9@rentbert> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk Maybe I missed a bit, but why do you want to stick with the PCMCIA bus for a GPS card, just buy a oem card with output on a serial port. It's quick and dirty and cheaper. You can even watch the output on minicom. There are two uarts on the SA1100, I guess one is for debugging, the other might be used as the listening port for the GPS card... Jean > Alot of people seem to think(i could be wrong though) that you have to use > PCMCIA Devices with a PCMCIA Bus, the BUS can be used by any hardware you > make, you simply need to design it with the Limitations of the PCMCIA Bus in > mind. This means if you want GPS, you dont have to buy a great big PCMCIA > GPS Card, you can simply buy an OEM GPS Reciever and connect it upto the > PCMCIA Bus, although you will have to write your own driver for it, this > will decrease size and also allow you to get the most out of the PCMCIA Bus. > Offcourse you dont even have to put GPS on the PCMCIA Bus because their are > OEM GPS Devices that only require a serial port, and the Lart has two IIRC. > > I hope this clears things up abit=) > > Another nice thing about designing your own hardware is that you can in most > cases get it to run on less power than its "off-the-shelf" counter-part. > Because manufacturers in most cases do not have this as their first concern. > > IMNSHO This is far better than simply buying an existing PCMCIA Device...but > again i could be wrong. > > -Raphael > > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in > the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl > Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 02:22:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA07843 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 02:22:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA07838 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 02:22:28 +0200 Received: from krdl.org.sg (rodin.krdl.org.sg [192.122.139.27]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200M5J91DGM@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 02:22:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from mailhost.krdl.org.sg (mailhost [192.122.134.30]) by krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA05020; Fri, 05 May 2000 08:24:46 +0800 Received: from krdl.org.sg (QUNYING.krdl.org.sg [192.168.136.36]) by mailhost.krdl.org.sg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA01941; Fri, 05 May 2000 08:16:11 +0800 (SGT) Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:17:04 +0800 From: zhu qun ying Subject: Re: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access To: Jim Studt Cc: arm , sa1100 , lart , Philip Blundell Message-id: <39121300.90E714EC@krdl.org.sg> Organization: KRDL MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: <200005041809.NAA26296@core.federated.com> Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk I know the limit of ARM, and I know that I can't cast arbitrary alignment to some other type. I want to know why the kernel allow this operation instead of issuing run time error, like illeagl operation/access, or emulating the behaviour using software. I used to port some program over to WINCE, and that is a horrible experience, that kind of operation causes runtime error. Any advantage that allow this kind of operation? -- (~._.~) Öì Ⱥ Ó¢ (Qun Ying) (65) 874-6743 ( O ) Kent Ridge Digital Labs (KRDL) ()~*~() 21 Heng Mui Keng Terrace, Singapore 119613 (_)-(_) qyzhu@krdl.org.sg * zhuqy@hotmail.com -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 03:11:47 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA07939 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 03:11:47 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA07935 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 03:11:46 +0200 Received: from xanadu.gn.com (modemcable248.137-200-24.mtl.mc.videotron.net [24.200.137.248]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU20004NBBJAA@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 03:11:45 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost (nico@localhost) by xanadu.gn.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA00382; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:10:05 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:10:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Pitre Subject: Re: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access In-reply-to: <39121300.90E714EC@krdl.org.sg> X-Sender: nico@xanadu.gn.com To: zhu qun ying Cc: Jim Studt , arm , sa1100 , lart , Philip Blundell Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Authentication-warning: xanadu.gn.com: nico owned process doing -bs Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk On Fri, 5 May 2000, zhu qun ying wrote: > I know the limit of ARM, and I know that I can't cast arbitrary alignment to > some other type. I want to know why the kernel allow this operation instead of > issuing run time error, like illeagl operation/access, or emulating the > behaviour using software. I used to port some program over to WINCE, and that is > a horrible experience, that kind of operation causes runtime error. Any > advantage that allow this kind of operation? If you look at linux/arch/arm/mm/fault-armv.c, line 134, you'll see the do_alignment() function. Few lines further you'll see: if (user_mode(regs)) { set_cr(cr_no_alignment); ai_user += 1; return 0; } This disables the alignment trap for user space code. See the documentation for the expected results... If you want the alignment trap handler to work on user space code as well as kernel code, just modify the above so it looks like: if (user_mode(regs)) { ai_user += 1; } Alternately, if you want to fix broken user space programs and kill them whenever a misaligned access occur, just use: if (user_mode(regs)) { ai_user += 1; return 1; } The above is based on linux-2.3.99-pre6-rmk1. Nicolas -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 09:47:52 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08784 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:47:52 +0200 Received: from [130.161.115.44] (jdbakker.et.tudelft.nl [130.161.115.44]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08779; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:47:48 +0200 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20000504174323.83302.qmail@hotmail.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 09:44:30 +0200 To: Agarwal From: "J.D. Bakker" Subject: Re: FFTW library performance on the LART Cc: lart@lart.tudelft.nl Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk At 19:47 +0200 04-05-2000, Agarwal wrote: > What I'd really need is a good >FFT library that works with fixed point. It would not need to be *very* >accurate as it's not for calculating very scientific stuff... I've written some FFT code in ARM assembly tuned for the SA-1 core. I intend to clean it up, slap a [L]GPL on it and post it on the website. Just wait a week or so and start yelling if nothing has happened by then ;-) JDB [imagining himself as a mother bird feeding a nest full of screaming chicks, representing my Things To Do-list] -- Jan-Derk Bakker, bakker@mmc.et.tudelft.nl The lazy man's proverb: 'There's no business like slow business !' -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 09:52:29 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08800 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:52:29 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08796 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:52:28 +0200 Received: from caramon.arm.linux.org.uk (p45-magpie-gui.tch.enablis.net [194.168.180.45]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200769TVDGS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:52:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from flint.arm.linux.org.uk (root@flint [192.168.0.4]) by caramon.arm.linux.org.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA31436; Fri, 05 May 2000 08:34:59 +0100 Received: (from linux@localhost) by flint.arm.linux.org.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA24826; Fri, 05 May 2000 08:28:42 +0100 Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:28:41 +0100 (BST) From: Russell King - ARM Linux Admin Subject: Re: char array, int pointer and cross boundary access In-reply-to: <39121300.90E714EC@krdl.org.sg> To: qyzhu@krdl.org.sg (zhu qun ying) Cc: jim@federated.com (Jim Studt), linux-arm-kernel@lists.arm.linux.org.uk (arm), sa1100-linux@pa.dec.com (sa1100), lart@lart.tudelft.nl (lart), pb@labs.futuretv.com (Philip Blundell) Message-id: <200005050728.IAA24826@flint.arm.linux.org.uk> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL1] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-lart@lart.tudelft.nl Precedence: bulk zhu qun ying writes: > I know the limit of ARM, and I know that I can't cast arbitrary alignment to > some other type. I want to know why the kernel allow this operation instead of > issuing run time error, like illeagl operation/access, or emulating the > behaviour using software. I used to port some program over to WINCE, and that is > a horrible experience, that kind of operation causes runtime error. Any > advantage that allow this kind of operation? For the past 13 years that the ARM architecture has been around, the behaviour of unaligned loads is something that was 100% defined to happen, and that the compiler can rely on to optimise its code. If you start causing user-mode runtime errors for these cases, then you will effectively prevent any program which has not been compiled with the appropriate flags to fail in perhaps undetectable ways (eg, if you compile up a program with a compiler that does not generate half-word instructions). There are a fair number of machines out there that use the StrongARM, but are not able to use the half-word instructions, or don't use the StrongARM at all that would be adversely affected by this. Basically to maintain consistent behaviour across all current machines, we ignore user-mode unaligned accesses. It's just not worth the hastle. Make sure your programs follow the appropriate C standards, and you won't have a problem. _____ |_____| ------------------------------------------------- ---+---+- | | Russell King linux@arm.linux.org.uk --- --- | | | | http://www.arm.linux.org.uk/ / / | | +-+-+ --- -+- / | THE developer of ARM Linux |+| /|\ / | | | --- | +-+-+ ------------------------------------------------- /\\\ | -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe lart" in the body of a message to majordomo@lart.tudelft.nl Please read the LART FAQ at http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/faq.php3 From owner-lart@thorgal.et.tudelft.nl Fri May 5 09:53:02 2000 Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08806 for lart-outgoing; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:53:02 +0200 Received: from ns2.tudelft.nl (ns2.tudelft.nl [130.161.180.65]) by thorgal.et.tudelft.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08802 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:53:01 +0200 Received: from caramon.arm.linux.org.uk (p45-magpie-gui.tch.enablis.net [194.168.180.45]) by mailhost1.tudelft.nl (PMDF V5.2-32 #42432) with ESMTP id <0FU200774TWAGS@mailhost1.tudelft.nl> for lart@lart.tudelft.nl; Fri, 5 May 2000 09:53:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from flint.arm.linux.org.uk (root@flint [192.168.0.4]) by caramon.arm.linux.org.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA31450; Fri, 05 May 2000 08:37:11 +0100 Received: (from linux@localhost) by flint.arm.linux.org.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3)